We used to visit a couple who bought a Toll brother’s house in 1998. Everytime we visited they had no furniture in this mcmansion and said they were having furniture custom made in Italy. They didn’t add one piece of furniture to their house in 3 years. Yet they told the same Italian furniture line every visit.
I finally asked what happened, did someone plant the seedlings in Italy yet?
Last week I was driving through Basking Ridge. I saw someone dressed up as a Weichert icon jumping around at the intersection of Valley rd and the side street the mcmansion was on. Wish I had had my camera with me.
It was definitely more creative then some balloons or a sign spinner. A lot funnier to me too.
#9 Chase is offering incentives for Bear employees to stay through the transition? Why? Where could they go with Citi, GS, and others breaking out the hatchets?
Chase is offering incentives for Bear employees to stay through the transition? Why?
I haven’t lived through more than a handful of mergers or acquisitions, but stay bonuses were relatively common for those above the rank and file, especially when it was obvious that those positions were to be cut. Point isn’t to keep them as employees, but to keep them only as long as the transition will take.
Employees who are not offered jobs will receive at least a cash bonus of about 30 percent of their 2007 compensation if they stay through the completion of the deal, the source said.
Woes in Condo Market Build
As New Supply Floods Cities
By JENNIFER S. FORSYTH and JONATHAN KARP
March 22, 2008; Page A1
The condominium market is about to get worse as many cities brace for a flood of new supply this year — the result of construction started at the height of the housing boom.
More than 4,000 new units will be completed in both Atlanta and Phoenix by the end of the year. Developers in Miami and Fort Lauderdale, Fla., are readying nearly 10,000 total new units in a market already struggling with canyons of unsold condos. San Diego, another hard-hit region, will add 2,500 units, according to estimates provided by Reis Inc., a New York-based real-estate-research firm.
The new building comes on top of unprecedented supply. The U.S. finished 2007 with a supply of condos large enough to absorb 10 months of demand, the highest level since the National Association of Realtors began the tally in 1999.
The deluge means bad news for developers and potentially lower prices, including in cities such as Atlanta and Dallas that have avoided the worst of the housing bust. If defaults and foreclosures rise, lenders will feel the pain too.
…
The news isn’t bad for everyone. Vulture buyers have started to circle, hoping to take advantage of foreclosed properties that banks may start dumping at fire-sale prices. Also, some condos are being converted to rental units, increasing supply for renters and putting downward pressure on prices.
Whoa, Then in December, she finally accepted her parents’ invitation to move into their home — at age 52. “I’m back living in the bedroom that I grew up in,” she said.
Yes I was talking about this last night, however… I am thinking if I give my sons a good start, - schooling, oppurtunity to save for a home,etc- I’m thinking when my son’s 52 I’ll be moving in with him!
I know it’s very common in NJ to live with parents well into their 30’s if not married. I have a very good friend (professional with a very good job) unmarried, in her early 40’s living with her parents on the top level of the home in their active adult community home. Don’t ask me why - LOL
I lived at home til I got married at 29. I don’t regret anything about it. By that time, I owned a property and when my wife & I got married we built our first home and moved in.
Saved a ton of $ in rent, utilities, food, etc. No shame, just the way that our parents wanted to raise us.
A couple of years ago I was at a happy hour, and a friend of a coworker’s husband was going off about how pathetic it was to see “these Jersey people” living at home at age 30. The loudmouth was from Kansas, my coworker was from Ohio, and her husband was from western PA. All three had to leave their home states to pursue careers. I pointed out that the reason why people don’t leave Jersey is that there are jobs here, and the price you pay for the opportunities is that you might have to spend more of your 20s and 30s in the nest than you like. I told the loudmouth that if NJ were Kansas and you could rent an apartment for $350 a month, sure, most of us Jersey people would have left home at 18, however our career aspirations would be limited to Applebee’s manager or some factory job which was about to get sent to China.
I think that a daughter can more easily stay home til 30….but a guy….especially one like ‘me’ would find it difficult….college allows a lot of freedom and it would be hard to settle back into a parental environment after that. People here are very materialistic as well….drive expensive cars…want to own big houses….etc…etc…being young often means not having that stuff, and thats…OK.
you blokes don’t think people in 20s & 30s living at home with parents really inhibits financial responsibility and social growth. Don’t you think they tend to have an “unrealisitic” point of view as to what it takes to get buy??
I do, for the most… there is always exceptions.
But nothing makes me shake my head more than to see a 30 year old in a BMW, $200 jeans, but still nursing the breast of the parents.
26. I charged my son rent after his Bachelors Degree (paid by me), until he agreed to go for his Masters Degree (paid by ADP). When he got married, he got the Rent back plus. Was just a little game to get him to continue school. He hated giving me money, so it worked.
i agree with it being hard to settle back into the nest after college -( i did it for a year, and i didn’t like it. ) but not the son/daughter thing - it could actually be harder for a daughter because parents may be more protective…
my brothers moved back in for several years and saved a ton of money, boosted their ability to buy a house after marriage, and pretty much changed the course of their financial life. I, on the other hand, moved out after being home a year -
In many cultures you don’t leave home until you’re married, whether that’s age 19 or 40 and it’s hard for old-school parents to digest sometimes. NJ is a place where ethnic identification is alive and well.
The “you’re 18, now get out” philosophy is very difficult to practice here. NJ 2008 is not like Berkeley, CA in the 1970s…. you can’t just hitch a ride from Fresno, show up with your backpack, enroll at UC, and spend seven years bouncing between philosophy and Sanskrit courses. NJ 2008 is a far less forgiving place - if you want to survive, and you don’t have an entrepreneur spirit, you need to get on the corporate treadmill and hope you don’t get canned.
Amen! I have seen so many Jersey people, men and women, living at home to “save for a house” when they routinely spend $300 on shoes, go to Broadway shows twice a month, drive the Beemers, etc.
The corollary to that observation is that there are plenty of Jersey people who have completely given up on the possibility of home ownership, so they might as well spend the money they earn on nice stuff.
Tax Breaks for Home Buyers
Attract Support in the Senate
By GREG HITT
March 22, 2008; Page A8
WASHINGTON — Efforts to create new tax breaks to encourage home purchases are gaining attention on Capitol Hill, as lawmakers gird for a major debate this spring on how best to shore up the nation’s troubled mortgage markets.
The Bush administration has looked at the pros and cons of a tax credit but remains opposed to the idea, saying it prefers lawmakers act quickly on administration proposals that are languishing in Congress. However, pressure may soon grow on the administration to look again at the idea. Some Democrats, among them Michigan Sen. Debbie Stabenow, have signaled support for expanded tax benefits. And the idea is proving especially popular among Senate Republicans, who are hoping to carve a distinct role as Congress takes up housing issues and often find tax cuts an appealing option. The discussions reflect a growing sense that the housing, mortgage and credit mess may require more expansive federal government action.
“The momentum on this thing has been good,” said Sen. Johnny Isakson, a Georgia Republican. Sen. Isakson, a former realtor, is pushing a proposal that would provide a temporary tax credit to any individual purchasing a newly constructed house or a foreclosed home. The tax break would come at a five-year, $14.5 billion cost to taxpayers, an aide said.
Democratic leaders in the House and Senate hope to turn to legislation aimed at easing the turmoil in the housing market when lawmakers return in early April. Striking a more aggressive posture than the White House, Democratic leaders have signaled support for legislation to create special taxpayer-backed programs to help troubled borrowers refinance into more affordable, low-cost mortgages, among other things.
While interest is growing in the housing tax breaks, it is by no means certain that they will ultimately make it into the legislative package. Critics complain the federal tax code already provides ample support for homeownership, offering a deduction for mortgage interest and allowing certain capital gains on home sales to be excluded from taxation.
[snip]
Sen. Stabenow is pushing a measure that would create a one-time tax credit of $3,000 for first-time home buyers. Mr. Isakson’s proposal is broader, providing a $5,000 tax credit for the purchase of a single-family home. That credit could be claimed for three years, raising the total tax benefit to $15,000.
We will have reached the bottom of this bust when “Flip this house” is replaced with “Salvage this sub-division.”
I can see it now. Clot, Grim, BC Bob, Gary, myself, 3b and others will go into abandoned developments all around the US and strip the houses for copper, sinks, lumber, anything of value.
While making rude, sarcastic comments about flippers, the Fed, and other miscreants.
#39 Yeah, but I think those are all break ins. Mine would be legal and on TV!!
We could then take the goods and load them onto those empty cargo boxes and ship them to China so the Chinese can live the American dream with genuine housing parts from the US.
why not live at home? All my friends did it till 30, if you have a summer share, a ski house share, go away on vacation two weeks a year and a girlfirend with her own place what is the point of a $2000 a month apt you sleep in 3-4 nights a week? Plus you can still do all these things give mom and dad a few hundred a month and still save more than having an apt.
My life fades. The vision dims. All that remains are memories. I remember a time of chaos. Ruined dreams. This wasted land. But most of all, I remember The Road Warrior. The man we called “Max”. To understand who he was, you have to go back to another time. When the world was powered by the black fuel. And the desert sprouted great cities of pipe and steel. Gone now, swept away. For reasons long forgotten, two mighty warrior tribes went to war and touched off a blaze which engulfed them all. Without fuel, they were nothing. They built a house of straw. The thundering machines sputtered and stopped. Their leaders talked and talked and talked. But nothing could stem the avalanche. Their world crumbled. The cities exploded. A whirlwind of looting, a firestorm of fear. Men began to feed on men. On the roads it was a white line nightmare. Only those mobile enough to scavenge, brutal enough to pillage would survive. The gangs took over the highways, ready to wage war for a tank of juice. And in this maelstrom of decay, ordinary men were battered and smashed. Men like Max. The warrior Max. In the roar of an engine, he lost everything. And became a shell of a man, a burnt out, desolate man, a man haunted by the demons of his past, a man who wandered out into the wasteland. And it was here, in this blighted place, that he learned to live again.
Jersey youth can always aspire to servicing Client No. 9…..launching a myspace page with iTunes download….cashing in a a pair of bad fake b**bs…..and making bank on their back. What a country.
NEW YORK (MarketWatch) — The U.S. Federal Reserve and its European counterparts are talking about the practicality of using public money to buy large quantities of mortgage-backed assets to clean up the credit mess jeopardizing global economic growth, the Financial Times reported Saturday.
#48 Why does the fed say it is not their duty to pop financial bubbles when it always wants to lead the charge to cleanup the aftermath?
Wouldn’t it be easier and cheaper to pop them?
It’s like dropping a carton of milk. If you pick it up right away you can save most of the milk and use a paper towel to clean up the mess. Wait till it empties and you are out of milk, need a mop, and a lot more time to clean up the mess.
That NJ freakshow is pretty normal to me. I went to cancun years ago on a chartered jet out of newark that we got cheap out of liberty travel in brooklyn and that pretty much looks like the whole plane did.
Pastels, summers, china club, belmar, cancun, Kinos, club g are pretty much home to these types of people and can be viewed on a regular basis.
I went short ribs once and afterwards to Pastels with my friends from brooklyn many years ago and had an old S class convert with well over 100K miles, (but fresh paint) was told to park the god damm thing on the sidewalk with top down cause no one not even the cops mess with the S Class in Brooklyn, he was right. The gravy fries and the egg creams at the victory dinner made for a perfect night.
That and when we were at Turquise (I stepped on a made man’s foot by accident) but at the time I was dating a distant relative of John Gotti and my friend had bragged about it. The made man apolized for his foot being in my way. Much to the delight of my “friends” pasquele, marco and vinnie. For one night they were my crew!! I broke up with the girl a few weeks later and my days of a brooklyn Irish mini capo were over.
Visa listed as V under the NYSE and the NYSE is downtown near the Vault, no concidence. If the recessions hits hard the S&M area of the Vault will be utilized to punish deliquent card holders.
Debt-Gorged British Start to Worry That the Party Is Ending
The sheeple in the states have some competition in UK - “many Americans are being overwhelmed by personal debt, but Britons are even more profligate. For most of the last decade, consumers here went on a debt-financed spending spree that made them the most indebted rich nation in the world”
52….my cousin worked in the DAs office during the Gotti trial….according to some of the evidence he was forced to archive (and would not elaborate on) the man was wise to apologize. Gotti apparently was a man who was not to be messed with.
jmacdaddio Says:
March 22nd, 2008 at 11:02 am
In many cultures you don’t leave home until you’re married,
————————————
In some cultures not even after marriage :-) it is called joint-family system ! Of course even in India this has been changing with children taking jobs in cities other than where parents live, and these days even if they live in the same city they live separately. But some people still prefer the ‘joint family system’, it mainly helps where both husband and wife work. Kids get taken care of, house work is taken care of, there is fresh food on the table when one comes back from work……… Hey if I had live-in parents or live-in-inlaws I might have also worked when my children were growing. I was adamant about ‘no day-care’ and ‘no-nannies’. BTW, in joint-families everyone contributes.
61…as romantic and old school as that sounds…my own personal situation would make it very hard to endure my parents under the same roof…I have never been happier than when I finally found my own space. Our relationship is excellent, but might suffer greatly from a joint arrangement. Too close for comfort?
#60 I think we should have a fat tax. It would help balance the budget and may cause Americans to lose weight and eat healthier. That would help slow down our health insurance costs.
jmacdaddio Says:
March 22nd, 2008 at 11:06 am
sas 27 -
Amen! I have seen so many Jersey people, men and women, living at home to “save for a house” when they routinely spend $300 on shoes, go to Broadway shows twice a month, drive the Beemers, etc.
—————————–
I have a friend here living with husband and in-laws. No kids yet. All the four work. They live in a fairly big house. They hire help to clean every week, they hire someone to come in and cook twice a week, and they buy nice things, and all four drive a beem each. Economy of scale !
Hey, once it is a long term decision to live together, rules are put in place usually, so people get their own space to the extent possible, expenses shared and inconviniences equitably distributed.
A lot of ‘Bimmer’ (not Beamer folks) bashing here…..I drive one….love it…and guarantee it was not more costly than most other machines….and it handles like mad.
You bring up a valid point. There are two aspects to American culture which make such an arrangement hard. Number one, Americans do not talk about money and finance with their children, or anyone else for that matter. A multigeneration household would require frank, open discussions about finance which most Americans are incapable of. To this day I have no idea what assets my parents have other than their home because they have not shared that info. I’ll be 35 in May. If I will need to take care of them later on, I would like to know about it now.
Second, Americans value self-reliance to a fault. The thought of sharing a home with parents or in-laws is unthinkable to most Americans unless there’s a compelling reason. Somehow it’s better to pay a day care center to watch the young ones than to consider having a grandparent under the same roof. And I doubt many baby boomer grandparents have any intention of changing diapers while their Gen X and Y children work.
62, “Our relationship is excellent, but might suffer greatly from a joint arrangement. Too close for comfort?”
Nothing works for everyone all the time :-) My mother wanted her independence and that is why she and dad never moved in with me even for the 7-8 years that I needed them. She did want to help me, but she wanted her independence more ! I guess life is all about making choices based on what we want more and what we want less, may be we should call the process prioritization ?
Every choice has a cost attached, nothing comes free, so perhaps when we prioritise we estimate the cost on each choice and tend to avoid the costliest. Again each of us would estimate these costs differently, afterall each of us will value the same things differently.
67….I like the idea…just know my own situation…that being said, I would welcome the inlaws or my parents in if the economic situation dictated it….and we could help that way….it would have to be an ‘inlaw suite’ though with it’s own entrance….
I think a lot of us here practice this. I have no illusions about retiring at 45; rather I’m focused on putting myself into a situation where at 45 the inevitable pink slip will be an opportunity to do something interesting instead of an absolute disaster. The only way to get there is to live beneath my means.
Thanks for explaining how it works with Americans. I guess it helps because my children are wholly Americans in outlook although not born here.
” If I will need to take care of them later on, I would like to know about it now.” Now I will certainly talk to my sons about as early as possible.
“And I doubt many baby boomer grandparents have any intention of changing diapers while their Gen X and Y children work.”
Hey, my pre-boomer Indian mother did not want to get stuck like that, she clearly told me no joint living arrangements, and no commitment to taking care of my brats.
But I myself am available to babysit my grand-brats, whichever way my sons want it - they can move in with me, or I with them, or I can live someplace close by.
I dont think I will have any money to leave them, so I want to help in any other way I can.
Essex 70, if ever my family decided to be a ‘joint family’ it will certainly be a separate apartment and entrance for every family ! Hey, there hopefully will be three incomes to support the required renovation and restructuring :-)
I just saw a few commercials while watching CNN’s Your Money. Ad #1: a couple is using Remax to buy their first house. The husband is a soldier oveseas and the wife and baby are working with a realtor. He comes home (in one piece) and moves into their first house. How moving - does anyone have a tissue?
Ad #2: The Michigan Economic Development Corp pitches MI as a center of high-tech innovation. Good luck to anyone who wants to get laid-off UAW line workers to learn something new.
Ad #3: A waitress treks to work after getting into an accident. DividedWeFail.org urges us to write our politicians urging a health care solution because millions upon millions are an accident or illness away from oblivion.
Ad #4: Reverse mortgages for homeowners over 62…. where do I sign up?
Just a poll, but what type of home are most of you looking to purchase.
I live in a 2BR in the city now w/ 2 kids. Need space, so I’m buying the biggest house possible (prob 4BR and plan to live there for until I’m ready to downsize). I just don’t want too much change even if I can afford it. I don’t want to get just a starter home or townhouse and than upsize when needed. I’m a bit below my means now and putting up w/ a little discomfort in terms of space so I can get a decent size home for the next 25-30 years. If I can afford it I may also buy a 1BR rental in the city and keep it for the likelihood of moving to a simpler life in the city after I retire. If life becomes real grand considering the possibility of a country home for the weekends too. Let’s see if that will work out financially.
We hope to be able to buy a 3BR 1.5-2 bath house in the range of $300,000-325,000. I really think that isn’t too much to ask for. We plan to live there for quite some time and we’re hoping to be able to find all this in Union County.
Anyone concerned about this talk about congestion pricing? I hate the idea. If I move to NJ it would suck for me. I have a good number of friends living in the city, Queens and Long Island and we would probably see each other much less because of it.
Anyone care to comment on the most reliable train line to get into NYC? I hear the NE Corridor line is horrible. Any other stories. I hear the Morristown/Gladstone line is fairly reliable.
75, Hardplace: I don’t know. :*) We have 1.9 kids (#2 son due Any Minute Now), and our 2 bdrm apt is big enough we could stay here for 5 to 10 years if we had to (yea, bunkbeds!) But my mom has no savings, no retirement fund, and my kid sis works two jobs just to pay her rent. I think we might be looking at a joint family living arrangement, so ideally I want a 4 or 5 bdrm place, with a big enough yard i could grow tomatoes.
we could do the bunk bed thing, but i sort of want my boys to be able to play in a yard or field. Not enough parks in Manhattan. Little kids are deprived of space because all the older kids use their space too. Last fall I almost got into a fight w/ a bunch junior high kids because they almost ran over my at the time 1 1/2 year old on his bike.
88, I hear you! We live across the street from a huge park, and folks say “You must spend the whole summer there!” Um, no. Way too stressful. Once a week playing spotter for my fear-free toddler is enough. ;) Teenagers have been fine, but the 3-6 yr old crowd doesn’t know their own strength. *sigh* I’d love to move sooner than 5-10 years; that’s the “OMG property taxes just trippled and we’re in a depression and yet house prices have not dropped yet, damn them” scenario. Plus, I love the community we live in (shame about the tiny yards and huge re prices), and it’s hard to accept we’ll have to leave it to get a mortgage. *insert pity party here*
Joeycasz I don’t know Union county that well
but I would surely think that 3-325 might be a tall order in a decent town,but you never know.I hope you are right that would mean they are going for 150 by me if the pricing holds true across the state.By the way you can buy that now in Sussex county some nice ones too.
Friend bought a house in Vernon about a year ago. 4 bedroom 2.5 bath, completley finished basement on 3 acres for $360,000. I’ve been looking and have found my asking house in that range in Union. If it’s not total sh*t is another story.
Joey I’m in Vernon your friend did well dependent on age of home, everything septic up here they can pass but old ones go at any time so you really want something 10-15 yr. max.Good luck on the search I had thought Union was higher.
My point about the Starbucks coffee is that its a marketing game. Maken you call something that is small a tall is taken right out of the text book of Edward Bernays.
Edward Bernays tactics are being employed is full swing by the NAR.
Do google search of the buisness of propaganda, and read up…. its pretty amazing.
ok, now let me get back up on that turnip truck, since it seems I just fell off.
Hard Place Says:
March 22nd, 2008 at 3:01 pm
Anyone care to comment on the most reliable train line to get into NYC? I hear the NE Corridor line is horrible. Any other stories. I hear the Morristown/Gladstone line is fairly reliable.
Mike, yeah he did pretty good. Seller wanted out of NJ. Also the house i’m guessing is maybe 15 years at the most, it pretty much looks new.
Sections of Union are pretty high. I’m looking in Clark, Scotch Plains, Garwood, Fanwood etc… I’ve seen houses in those areas and in that range just recently too. We’ll be trying to look sometime in June/July. We’ll see.
#61 - More than a few of my South Asian neighbours have that set up. Nuclear family + brother and wife + aging parent who acts as housekeeper/nanny, all in one McMansion. 4 adults contributing to the mortgage, family caring for the kids and fresh food on the table. It does make financial sense.
And at least THOSE McMansions are actually lived in by an appropriate number of people for the square footage.
This quote on another forum which shall remain nameless cracked me up:
“One in Cranford was listed for $710K but on a mere .17 acre of space. And we didn’t even get to see that home ‘cus the homeowner apparently didn’t know there were ppl coming to see his home. He had the gall to
pull my realtor aside and ask her about our credentials ‘cus he didn’t want to bother making the home available for just anybody! Hello?! We were more than qualified and but felt so insulted we left w/o seeing the overpriced piece of poo on the pitiful lot.”
I visited several houses in Indian Forest section of East Brunswick in the past three months. The sellers are still dreaming to sell their houses with 2005 -2006’s peak price even though several comaprable houses sold below or close to $500,000.
Two houses currently on the market in this section all want to reap the profits:
1. 9 pawnee rd(MLS#:813565, tax $10,585, built 1978) is asking $569,900. Owner bought the house $395,000 in 07/27/2001. The owner did no upgrade work.
2. 11 Pawnee rd(MLS#:811865, tax $10,764, built 1978) lowers to $565,000 from original asking price of $598,000.The owner bought the house $322,000 in 12/01/2001. The owner did some upgrade work, at least the kitchen is upgraded and roof is new.
Comparable Sold houses in the same neighborhood:
1. 21 Deer Run Ct(MLS#: 809504, tax $12,115, built 1984) is a foreclosure house with last asking price of $475,000. It was out of market this month and I guess it was sold below $475,000.
2. 17 Huron Ct(MLS#:8076626, tax $10,650, 1982 built) sold $500,000 on 01/28/08.
3. 7 Lenape Ln( tax:$ 10,360, built 1978) sold $485,000 on 05/22/07
Do you know why they are expecting more? My agent just told me a stupid buyer bought a house in this section at 54 Buffalo Run (MLS#:811087, asking price $569,900, tax $10,569, built in 1978) with $545,000 last month. Buyer, do your homework! You paid at least $45,000 more for this house with original kitchen original windows! You are encouraging the other sellers to sell high! Wake Up!
“Last fall I almost got into a fight w/ a bunch junior high kids because they almost ran over my at the time 1 1/2 year old on his bike.”
sounds like you definitely need your own space - you can’t expect 12 year olds to worry about your toddler - i understand your sentiment, but you have to remember, they’re only kids too -
regarding the train lines, i’m on the morris/essex line (dover, mid-town direct), and i find it sort of unreliable - years ago i was on the pascack valley line, and it ran like clockwork - i think it has something to do with which lines share tracks with amtrak.
Time to up the game here. Easter open houses, commodities on the rebound- hard- next week, hemmorrhaging banks trying to zonk jumbo borrowers…and the usual financial skulduggery and mayhem. Nobody cares about Pascack Valley or how bad the stench is on some piddling Shore Line train.
In about 7-10 days, my industry will be out of reasons for people to buy a house, and all the flowers will be in full bloom. And if I see that f-ing NAR commercial interrupting my basketball one more f-ing time, I’m gonna squeeze myself thru the coax, find the mf who made it, and snap his neck.
Year number three of no Spring market beckons, and everybody’s pissed off and tapped out. I haven’t dealt with a seller who has one penny of equity in a month of Sundays, and you know what? I’m pissed off, too. You want to “try it at $XXX and see what happens”? Here’s what happens: you’re gonna lose your ass. Hire some embalmed yenta to smear the neighborhood with balloons and sleep on your couch for four hours every Sunday…I’m going to live my life.
The only saving grace about all of this is that my competitors are getting wiped out daily, and I don’t have to spend a penny to help it happen. However, that shallow victory is tempered by the constant, low bleat from the voices of the 20-25 people- lives ruined- whose needs I’m constantly attending.
I moved out, under extreme stress, at the age of 18. My mother and older brother were toxic to my mental health :)
I’m at once amazed at the ability for a family to get along, like the Cleavers; and then at the same moment shaking my head in revulsion at the very same idea; it’s just un-American.
Ahhh…. a profanity-laced tirade. Right up my alley and so fitting to drive a point home. I’m starting to see hints of capitulation. My heart sinks for those who were sucked in through no fault of their own. For all others…. I’ll bite my tongue.
I had a moving company client: I would talk to many people in the company and was always hearing stories of lawn furniture in the huge houses, boxes for tables, no furniture whatsoever, etc.
The moving company employees could tell you some real crazy stories.
A huge SUV in the driveway of a 5 bedroom house with sheets on the windows.
My other half and I would drive around on weekends when we were looking for a house and hated new (and old) developments. New developments would always prompt a “Hey, someone stole your trees!” comment from one of us. It was our little joke.
And how many “bonus rooms” we saw without nary a stick of furniture in them 1 and 2 years after they had been moved into.
Or the houses that opted out of the landscaping packages, PERMANENTLY. Going on 2 years and they still have not a stick of shrubbery, no grass to speak of, not one teeny flower… The mortgage is all they can afford.
Is Blair Academy a nationally recognized elite school?
“Report: Possible new witness in Spitzer case”
“Cecil Suwal, 23, a graduate of the Blair Academy in Warren County, was arrested earlier this month with three others in connection with the suspected Internet prostitution operation and on March 18 was granted bail by a Manhattan federal magistrate-judge. She was charged with conspiracy, transporting women over state lines for sex and money laundering.”
I think the real problem with New Jersey is people make “just enough” money to keep it going even though it’s check to check and they have these huge houses they should have never bought to begin with.
I’m so pissed off here, I can barely see straight. I come to read this board and I see this piece of propanda bullshlt in the first two posts on the damn blog. This is a bunch of crap and your azz needs to be tarred and feathered for posting this shlt. Don’t you ever post this sort of crap on any blog. In any country you’ll find a few losers, but how dare cast about this crap trying to portray a situation where people are homeless because they got foreclosed on. This is not happening and you and BBC are trying to act as if you’re doing some damn investigative report on the homeless.
In can you didn’t know it, this is America, damnit. We don’t have massess of people in tent cities. We don’t have a bunch of damn refugees fleeing this country. You’re either an unpatriotic lout or a foreigner trying to stir something up.
I think the real problem with New Jersey is people make “just enough” money to keep it going even though it’s check to check and they have these huge houses they should have never bought to begin with.
Although the ones I actually feel bad for are the young first time buyers who got a good education, worked hard, got a decent job, but ended up buying some overpriced tiny POS shack in a so-so neighborhood because they believed the “buy now or get priced out forever” BS getting fed to them by friends, family, the media & their realtor.
They stretched, but bought within their means, using a conservative mortgage, which, of course, got them a shack because everyone else only cared about making the teaser payment on an I/O mortgage. They planned to get by in their POS for a few years and trade up to a halfway decent middle class home when they saved enough to do so. They weren’t looking to get rich, only protect themselves from never owning a home.
Now they are underwater. They are stuck in their POS shack making oversized payments, watching as their rising property taxes dash any hopes they had of using their meager raises to pay off their mortgage faster & get out. They won’t go into foreclosure, but rather just keep paying until they can sell without bringing a check to the table.
I have several friends in this situation. I feel almost guilty when I see them, because I tried to talk them out of buying at the time. I know I was right and they know I was right, but I would never bring up the subject.
Truthfully, they would have been better off buying a McMansion with some toxic mortgage. At least they could have lived the good life for a few years, gotten foreclosed on, rebuilt their credit & moved on.
The grande mocha, as it turns out, says a lot about the economy.
A few months ago, even before consumer confidence officially began slipping, Lori Mozenter put an end to her regular visits to the local Starbucks, where she would plunk down nearly $4 for a cup of the rich, chocolatey coffee drink.
“I would drag my kids to Barnes & Noble just so I could go to Starbucks,” said Mozenter, a nurse who lives in West Windsor with her husband and kids.
But that was before gasoline costs started eroding her spending money and Wall Street’s bounces began unnerving anyone investing money into a 401(k). “I’m making coffee at home now,” Mozenter said. “It’s not as good, but it’s not as expensive either.”
The weekly numbers streaming out of Washington tell a story of an economy in trouble. Just last week, jobless claims rose and a key economic forecasting index fell for the fifth straight month, suggesting the nation is headed for a recession. The prices of everything from vegetable oil to spaghetti continue to climb, and the near collapse of the investment firm Bear Stearns was another reminder of a new fragility to the financial markets.
Consumer confidence across the country plummeted to 75 last month from 87.3 in January. First-time claims for unemployment benefits increased 22,000 to 378,000 for the week ending March 15. New Jersey has its own dismal numbers: The state said employers cut jobs again in February, bringing the losses for the first two months of the year to more than 10,000.
Those are the official numbers.
On the ground floor of the state’s economy, the unofficial indicators show that consumers are nervous. They’re making hard choices about expenses that suddenly seem to be beyond budgets taxed by soaring gasoline and food prices. The cleaning woman is going, so is the lawn service. Many women are waiting longer to see their hairstylists. And each of those decisions creates another ripple effect, compounding the woes.
There are signs of the economy’s troubles and consumers’ angst everywhere: There is the Cranbury Township man who lost his job with a financial software firm on Wall Street a month ago. Neighborhoods are dotted with “For Sale” signs. There also is the Summit real estate entrepreneur who is experiencing the credit freeze firsthand. Despite a good credit rating, he said it is tougher to get financing these days.
These are signs, too: A retired Monroe Township couple canceled their annual summer vacation, which has amounted to as much as $7,000 in past years. Middle-class families are reconsidering whether they can afford a $650 swim club membership for the kids this summer.
Folks across the state are cutting back on more than their fancy coffee drinks; they are trading in gas-guzzlers, scaling back summer trips and eating in much more often.
Lisa Evans, a single mom from East Windsor who works as an engineer, said last year she ate out two, and often three, nights a week. Now, she limits herself to one night.
There aren’t enough hours in a day for Jim Coppo to do his job.
A few years ago, Coppo was repossessing two or three cars on an average day. Today, he tows away eight or nine, and would do more if he had time.
As many Americans struggle with mountainous debt and the threat of losing their homes to foreclosure, others are losing their vehicles at the highest rate in a decade.
“We’ve been watching this over the past several years, and auto loan delinquencies have been steadily getting higher,” said Keith Leggett, a senior economist with the American Bankers Association.
If the subprime mortgage mess has taught us anything, it is that we are leverage addicts. Nearly all of us are — from Northern Virginia, where we bought big houses with no money down, to Wall Street, where traders borrowed cash to make bigger bets on the housing market.
Seeing Zero Percent Interest Until Next Year! on envelopes causes us to tear them open, find the Web address, enter some information and send new credit cards hurtling toward our mailboxes. Financing cars for three years is so passe; we finance them for six or seven. And now we buy — or used to buy — houses with pick-your-payment mortgages. We are leveraged from here to China. U.S. consumers spend more than 14 percent of their after-tax income just to stay current on household debt.
The question worth asking now is: Why do we love leverage so much that it hurts?
At least we have a Keurig so we can use K cups to make better coffee at home for 45 cents a cup. I also saw Peet’s coffee at the local grocery for $8.99 a 12 oz bag and bought a bag. Also much better then going to Starbucks and even cheaper then Kcups.
WE get breakfast from Panera’s once a weekend but no longer order drinks.
A little bit of savings here and there adds up to a lot over the course of the year. Of course if everyone does it adds up to a recession
Bank of America Corp. could tally a $6.5 billion provision in the first quarter to cover potential losses in its home equity and mortgage portfolios, Punk Ziegel and Co. analyst Richard Bove was quoted as saying by the Bloomberg news agency.
#114 Reinvestor:
Are you saying Americans moving to Mexico,South America where their Social Security checks can be stretched, because they can not afford living standards,health care here in the US is all a propaganda?The great depression never happened?
I take the news as i see it.I take and learn from what i read.Let’s say it’s a propaganda:Will it hurt to start saving?Keeping some cash at home in case there was a panic withrawals in the banks?
Point is:I do not read to know what is going on.How I can benefit from it.
How many of us comes to this blog just because we are bored?
I have a problem with your depictions. First it’s homeless American refugees invading Canada and now you’re suggesting that they’re are bunches of people immigrating to Mexico. What it amounts to is pushing the notion that there’s some problem here in our great nation that’s creating refugees and I think that’s a bunch of bullshlt.
As I said, there are always a few losers around, but don’t try to act as if these people are representative in any way.
This ain’t the damn 1930’s, no matter how nostalgic you are about hard times (I just can’t figure out why so many people here seem to want the 1930’s to come back). This is 2008, and we have mechanisms to prevent bank runs and the like. Get your head out of the 1930’s and move forward a few decades. Stop posting this damn nonsense.
yome Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 7:37 am
#114 Reinvestor:
Are you saying Americans moving to Mexico,South America where their Social Security checks can be stretched, because they can not afford living standards,health care here in the US is all a propaganda?The great depression never happened?
I take the news as i see it.I take and learn from what i read.Let’s say it’s a propaganda:Will it hurt to start saving?Keeping some cash at home in case there was a panic withrawals in the banks?
Point is:I do not read to know what is going on.How I can benefit from it.
How many of us comes to this blog just because we are bored?
Why the hell is this a good website for me? I don’t need their “service”.
Let me tell you something, Clod, I don’t believe in supporting slacking. If you bought the damn house, I think you should stay right the hell there and pay. This sort of service encourages slacking and non acceptance of responsiblity. Moreover, it’s conspiratorical in the sense that this futher undermines housing prices; something those who are against this country very much desire to do. No one here realizes that, but choose to simply focus on your selfish money grubbing desires to buy a house on the cheap and to see misery befall your fellow Americans.
There’s a day coming where you’ll regret that stance and I’ll be there to remind you.
All Hype Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:07 am
ReTard:
I was just thinking here about the credit crunch many here helped to create with the negativity. Do you realize now that even if house prices drop to your desired money grubbing cheapskate level, you may not be able to get a mortgage to get it given tightening credit? Is it possible that you’re still frozen out of buying a house, now because you can’t get a loan?
It’s the law of unintended consequences. Many of you assumed that you’d be able to buy once you forced prices down with negative talk. Now that they’re down, you still can’t buy due to lack of credit.
bc and clot, my 6-yr. old is an early riser and a big fan of infomercials. Something to do with the tone of the voice and kids who have some sensory-seeking stuff going.
So, we have The Shark and other such gadgets she happily uses about the house. She knows the entire infomercial in some cases, and after hearing them once or twice, repeats with precision. She never liked Barbie, anyway.
A couple of years ago, we were often treated to “Need cash for your dream vacation?! Call us at one eight hundred ….” and other heloc/shark mortgage stuff.
Just a heads-up. This week as I was drinking coffee, I heard her confident voice from the living room, “Gold may be the best decision you make for your family..”
I will not disclose my position, since I’ve made no recommendation.
similar thing happened to me and my friends in late 80″s..maybe not to same degree but after whining for yearws…most of us saved more…spent less..rented our pos condos and bought houses when the prices dropped (1991-1993ish)and eventually sold the condos.
Lesson learned, stay away from real estate in this area!!! We have our primary residence and avoided any visions of granduer during the 2000-2005 run up. ( I did always think how much better everyone else must be doing with all their purchases and houses!!)
If lending standards get so tight that we can’t get a loan for a house we want, who will be able to buy at that price? Not many I would think.
If financially prudent bearish people can’t qualify for a mtg if housing drops 30% peak to trough that will lead to even lower prices don’t you think? Or riots in the streets and mass migrations like the dust bowl. So not qualifying would be a positive thing for me in that scenario.
# 130 reinvestor101 Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 8:18 am
“I was just thinking here about the credit crunch many here helped to create with the negativity.”
So the fact that banks are taking over a hundred billion in charge offs in the last few months due to their lack of oversight in writing and buying loans during this bubble has nothing to do with tightening standards?
Do you really think a few dozen regular posters on this forum could influence the market so much? Why not blame the liberal media? Or the Easter bunny?
I sent you the website and not Clod. You still do not get it so here it is in a nutshell…
There are not enough buyers left who can qualify for loans for houses at these inflated prices. The banks are insolvent and are not giving out loans except for people with stellar credit.
End of story…..Negative feelings by a bunch of smart and well informed bloggers have nothing to do with the facts.
People are smart for walking away from their houses when they are worth less than their mortgage. Comopanies do it all the time and then “rightsize” headcount accordingly. Homeowners got smart and starting playing the same game with the banks…Easy as that.
And as for the banks, they used to be the stewards of the financial system, ensuring that the money they controlled was properly invested. Now all they really care about is making a buck by leveraging themselves 30:1 on Las Vegas type bets. Boo hoo to them if they are suprised that these “slackers” are walking away from their American Dream.
You are just on the losing end of the bet so get used to it.
Reinvestor
“Many of you assumed that you’d be able to buy once you forced prices down with negative talk. Now that they’re down, you still can’t buy due to lack of credit.”
First Happy Easter to all.
Not in any way to agree with RE 101 it would be strange to me to think that the main stream media doesn’t have a liberal bias.I watch in dismay at reporters who are supposed to be reporting the news put their ideological spin on it.The majority of the intellectual elite in the media are very liberal & it shows in the reporting.To
think other wise would be ignoring the bias because you agree with it.Lets not throw liberal media around like it doesn’t exist
because it does.
Ben Stein on CBS this morning says the fed will save us with all the greenbacks infused into the system and we’ll be “back to living like drunken sailors”…Happy Easter!
You either agree with me or you don’t. Don’t try to distance yourself from the proper views I express. No need to qualify the damn truth
Mikeinwaiting Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 9:52 am
First Happy Easter to all.
Not in any way to agree with RE 101 it would be strange to me to think that the main stream media doesn’t have a liberal bias.I watch in dismay at reporters who are supposed to be reporting the news put their ideological spin on it.The majority of the intellectual elite in the media are very liberal & it shows in the reporting.To
think other wise would be ignoring the bias because you agree with it.Lets not throw liberal media around like it doesn’t exist
because it does.
Apparently the FICO score is being tweaked to give more weight to consumers who have used different types of credit. Also a blemish on your record won’t be as bad if you have been current with your accounts in the recent past. It’s a video news story from Yahoo news:
I know that employers routinely check credit on potential new hires. Does anyone here know of lousy credit preventing someone from getting a job? Something to think about before you unload your mansion on http://www.walkawayplan.com and carpet-bomb your credit for the next decade. Assuming that there are any jobs left to apply for.
“Just a heads-up. This week as I was drinking coffee, I heard her confident voice from the living room, “Gold may be the best decision you make for your family..”
Pat,
She’s more polished that most ANAL-ysts on the street. Maybe it was just a hint, no more dollars for allowance, she wants gold. Hell, the dollar is frowned upon by Gisele, why should your daughter accept it?
There are so many things wrong with your arguments that a response is overwhelmingly difficult.
#127-”I have a problem with your depictions. First it’s homeless American refugees invading Canada and now you’re suggesting that they’re are bunches of people immigrating to Mexico. What it amounts to is pushing the notion that there’s some problem here in our great nation that’s creating refugees and I think that’s a bunch of bullshlt.”
There is some problem in our great nation. It is the increase in the separation between the haves and the have nots. Besides our two decades of diminishing wages and ethanol fueled inflation, our gov’t has decided to bail out the wealthy and let those losers who committed to loans they couldn’t afford rot. The bailout of Bear Stearns is just one example of this behavior. There is about 600 billion dollars worth of other bail out the wealthy, but paid for by the masses initiated so far this year and we are not even close to it being over.
“As I said, there are always a few losers around, but don’t try to act as if these people are representative in any way.”
There will be no less than 2 million foreclosed homes in this country by the end of next year. I have a feeling that quite a number of these people will consider emigrating as our government continues to bail out the wealthy.
“This ain’t the damn 1930’s, no matter how nostalgic you are about hard times (I just can’t figure out why so many people here seem to want the 1930’s to come back). This is 2008, and we have mechanisms to prevent bank runs and the like. Get your head out of the 1930’s and move forward a few decades. Stop posting this damn nonsense.”
This damn nonsense is becoming more and more of a reality every day. These so called “mechanisms” to prevent bank runs are the same kind of mechanisms put in place to protect investment banks. Do some research and see what percentage of your deposit is held in safety. Last time I checked the FDIC insurance simply ensures that a bank has from 6-10% capitalization. If all of the banks fail simultaneously, then you’ll get back 6-10% of your deposit unless of course, the money presses are fired up again.
RE 130 - “I was just thinking here about the credit crunch many here helped to create with the negativity. Do you realize now that even if house prices drop to your desired money grubbing cheapskate level, you may not be able to get a mortgage to get it given tightening credit? Is it possible that you’re still frozen out of buying a house, now because you can’t get a loan?”
RE, we do not all suffer like you must. I’m 760, my wife is at 780 and if any of the long term readers of this board followed any of the advice given here, they too probably have good credit.
“It’s the law of unintended consequences. Many of you assumed that you’d be able to buy once you forced prices down with negative talk. Now that they’re down, you still can’t buy due to lack of credit.”
Negative talk does not create a bear economy ya moron. Actually, sentiment usually follows the reporting of negative economic news. It was all of those foolish home buyers who leveraged themselves to the hilt that created this bear economy. When will the sheeple realize that there is no such thing as a free lunch?
RE 145 -”You either agree with me or you don’t. Don’t try to distance yourself from the proper views I express. No need to qualify the damn truth”
Well I unequivocally disagree with you. To call your views ‘proper’ is simply fascist in nature, but not surprising. Through history, many other great fascists were also convinced they were right. Problem is, none of them proved to be.
“It’s the law of unintended consequences. Many of you assumed that you’d be able to buy once you forced prices down with negative talk. Now that they’re down, you still can’t buy due to lack of credit.”
50.5,
This is better than what the Easter Bunny delivered.
If you have 20-50% to put down it’s a free gift. Falling prices and the red carpet rolled out at the lending window. On the flip side, if you don’t have a dp, also consider this a gift. Hopefully you’ll be denied credit since you’ll be presented with lower prices next year.
Come to think of it, the only individuals screwed in your scenario are present sellers and those whose net worth is tied up in a sinking rat hole. Eliminate subprime and Alt-A, approx 40% of the 2005&2006 market, along with a weakening economy, higher inventory and bearish sentiment and you have a recipe for disaster. Seller to Realtor, “I need to sell fast”. Realtor to seller. “Sell”? “Sell to whom”?.
There is a glimmer of hope. Since the fed just opened the window to primary dealers, there is a chance that they will now open it to those stuck with a depreciating 4 walls and a roof. The law of unintended consequences? The law that I abide by; Don’t not fight the tape.
You are not welcomed here. People here share ideas and data!!! You are a joke!!! Who can benefit from your bullshit?? Not the buyers!!! Not the Sellers. You are irrelevant here. GET OUT!!!!
I have a house already and try to buy another one for investing!!!! I know both sides of buyers and sellers. As an owner, I want my house value go up; as a buyer and investor, I want to buy low. However you have to be rational for either roles.
If you want to say something, use fact and data!!! Don’t use your slick mouth!!! Who cares about your useless words??? Sell something else!!! No body want to listen to your (edit)!!!
No problem. Pretty factual stuff in that PDF. And T2 are value minded. Funny to see them think we are less than a third of the way out of the housing debacle. Value investors tend to be too early to the prom.
Last week, George Bush said that we should not stand in the way of the correction in the housing market. He said that taking action to artificially prop up prices would only prolong the problem.
The Timing Indicates That We Are Still in the Early Stages of the Bursting of the Great Mortgage Bubble
• Mortgage lending standards became progressively worse starting in 2000, but really went off a cliff beginning in early 2005
• The worst loans are those with two-year teaser rates. As the subsequent pages show, they are defaulting at unprecedented rates, especially once the
interest rates reset• Such loans made in Q1 2005 started to default in high numbers inQ1 2007,
which not surprisingly was the beginning of the current crises• The crisis has continued to worsen as even lower quality loans made over
the remainder of 2005 reset over the course of 2007, triggering more and more defaults
• It takes an average of 15 months from the date of the first missed payment by a homeowner to a liquidation (generally a sale via auction) of the home
• Thus, the Q1 2005 loans that defaulted in Q1 2007 are leading toforeclosures and auctions in early 2008
• Given that lending standards got much worse in late 2005, through 2006 and into the first half of 2007, there are sobering implicationsfor expected
defaults, foreclosures and auctions in 2008 and 2009, which promise to drive home prices down dramatically
In summary, today we are only seeing the tip of the iceberg: an enormous wave of defaults, foreclosures and auctions is just
beginning to hit the United States. We believe it will get so bad that large-scale federal government intervention is likely.
Credit crunch has been covered for at least three months. We talked about it here. Glad to be sitting it our right now and not soliciting additional credit, Methinks if you have some cash and decent credit you are in the driver’s seat regardless of what trolls here say.
82,
I commuted on the Raritan Valley Line (Fanwood) from 2000 through 2006 into downtown NYC (via Path - WTC). There was maybe one significant delay per year. I remember hearing more complaints from people in other parts of NY state or NJ. The main drawback is that one must switch trains in Newark Penn Station, but I eventually got used to it. For midtown from Scotch Plains/Fanwood, the bus is more convenient and faster.
recently came across a quote that the US needs to take to heart,
“You are too prejudiced. You do not let your eyes see nor your ears hear, and that which is outside your daily life is not of account to you. Do you not think that there are things which you cannot understand, and yet which are? That some people see things that others cannot? … There are always mysteries in life.”
1. “We will not have any more crashes in our time.”
- John Maynard Keynes in 1927
2. “I cannot help but raise a dissenting voice to statements that we are living in a fool’s paradise, and that prosperity in this country must necessarily diminish and recede in the near future.”
- E. H. H. Simmons, President, New York Stock Exchange, January 12, 1928
“There will be no interruption of our permanent prosperity.”
- Myron E. Forbes, .President, Pierce Arrow Motor Car Co., January 12, 1928
3. “No Congress of the United States ever assembled, on surveying the state of the Union, has met with a more pleasing prospect than that which appears at the present time. In the domestic field there is tranquility and contentment…and the highest record of years of prosperity. In the foreign field there is peace, the goodwill which comes from mutual understanding.”
- Calvin Coolidge December 4, 1928
4. “There may be a recession in stock prices, but not anything in the nature of a crash.”
- Irving Fisher, leading U.S. economist , New York Times, Sept. 5, 1929
5. “Stock prices have reached what looks like a permanently high plateau. I do not feel there will be soon if ever a 50 or 60 point break from present levels, such as (bears) have predicted. I expect to see the stock market a good deal higher within a few months.”
- Irving Fisher, Ph.D. in economics, Oct. 17, 1929
“This crash is not going to have much effect on business.”
- Arthur Reynolds, Chairman of Continental Illinois Bank of Chicago, October 24, 1929
“There will be no repetition of the break of yesterday… I have no fear of another comparable decline.”
- Arthur W. Loasby (President of the Equitable Trust Company), quoted in NYT, Friday, October 25, 1929
“We feel that fundamentally Wall Street is sound, and that for people who can afford to pay for them outright, good stocks are cheap at these prices.”
- Goodbody and Company market-letter quoted in The New York Times, Friday, October 25, 1929
6. “This is the time to buy stocks. This is the time to recall the words of the late J. P. Morgan… that any man who is bearish on America will go broke. Within a few days there is likely to be a bear panic rather than a bull panic. Many of the low prices as a result of this hysterical selling are not likely to be reached again in many years.”
- R. W. McNeel, market analyst, as quoted in the New York Herald Tribune, October 30, 1929
“Buying of sound, seasoned issues now will not be regretted”
- E. A. Pearce market letter quoted in the New York Herald Tribune, October 30, 1929
“Some pretty intelligent people are now buying stocks… Unless we are to have a panic — which no one seriously believes, stocks have hit bottom.”
- R. W. McNeal, financial analyst in October 1929
7. “The decline is in paper values, not in tangible goods and services…America is now in the eighth year of prosperity as commercially defined. The former great periods of prosperity in America averaged eleven years. On this basis we now have three more years to go before the tailspin.”
- Stuart Chase (American economist and author), NY Herald Tribune, November 1, 1929
“Hysteria has now disappeared from Wall Street.”
- The Times of London, November 2, 1929
“The Wall Street crash doesn’t mean that there will be any general or serious business depression… For six years American business has been diverting a substantial part of its attention, its energies and its resources on the speculative game… Now that irrelevant, alien and hazardous adventure is over. Business has come home again, back to its job, providentially unscathed, sound in wind and limb, financially stronger than ever before.”
- Business Week, November 2, 1929
“…despite its severity, we believe that the slump in stock prices will prove an intermediate movement and not the precursor of a business depression such as would entail prolonged further liquidation…”
- Harvard Economic Society (HES), November 2, 1929
8. “… a serious depression seems improbable; [we expect] recovery of business next spring, with further improvement in the fall.”
- HES, November 10, 1929
“The end of the decline of the Stock Market will probably not be long, only a few more days at most.”
- Irving Fisher, Professor of Economics at Yale University, November 14, 1929
“In most of the cities and towns of this country, this Wall Street panic will have no effect.”
- Paul Block (President of the Block newspaper chain), editorial, November 15, 1929
“Financial storm definitely passed.”
- Bernard Baruch, cablegram to Winston Churchill, November 15, 1929
9. “I see nothing in the present situation that is either menacing or warrants pessimism… I have every confidence that there will be a revival of activity in the spring, and that during this coming year the country will make steady progress.”
- Andrew W. Mellon, U.S. Secretary of the Treasury December 31, 1929
“I am convinced that through these measures we have reestablished confidence.”
- Herbert Hoover, December 1929
“[1930 will be] a splendid employment year.”
- U.S. Dept. of Labor, New Year’s Forecast, December 1929
10. “For the immediate future, at least, the outlook (stocks) is bright.”
- Irving Fisher, Ph.D. in Economics, in early 1930
11. “…there are indications that the severest phase of the recession is over…”
- Harvard Economic Society (HES) Jan 18, 1930
12. “There is nothing in the situation to be disturbed about.”
- Secretary of the Treasury Andrew Mellon, Feb 1930
13. “The spring of 1930 marks the end of a period of grave concern…American business is steadily coming back to a normal level of prosperity.”
- Julius Barnes, head of Hoover’s National Business Survey Conference, Mar 16, 1930
“… the outlook continues favorable…”
- HES Mar 29, 1930
14. “… the outlook is favorable…”
- HES Apr 19, 1930
15. “While the crash only took place six months ago, I am convinced we have now passed through the worst — and with continued unity of effort we shall rapidly recover. There has been no significant bank or industrial failure. That danger, too, is safely behind us.”
- Herbert Hoover, President of the United States, May 1, 1930
“…by May or June the spring recovery forecast in our letters of last December and November should clearly be apparent…”
- HES May 17, 1930
“Gentleman, you have come sixty days too late. The depression is over.”
- Herbert Hoover, responding to a delegation requesting a public works program to help speed the recovery, June 1930
16. “… irregular and conflicting movements of business should soon give way to a sustained recovery…”
- HES June 28, 1930
17. “… the present depression has about spent its force…”
- HES, Aug 30, 1930
18. “We are now near the end of the declining phase of the depression.”
- HES Nov 15, 1930
19. “Stabilization at [present] levels is clearly possible.”
- HES Oct 31, 1931
20. “All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been sealed… and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the I.R.S.”
- President F.D. Roosevelt, 1933
regarding the debate on whether living with parents as an adult is a good idea, Bru’s post from the prior thread says it all:
“Regarding the financial adviser who mentions how parents should stop subsidizing their kids: I wonder what she thinks about those girls who live fabulous Manhattan lives while working for low-paying jobs like PR and magazines. All my parents provide me with is a a roof over my head (along with theirs).”
Everyone needs to grow up at some point. The longer it takes you to become self-sufficient, the more difficult it will be in the end. Nothing more annoying than someone (man or woman) who has the mentality of a child well into his/her 30s or beyond.
The main problem with the media is they are not grounded in reality. The job requirement for those positions should be changed to require three years in a Turkish Prison on their resumes. Then possibly you could get unbiased reporting.
“You’re either an unpatriotic lout or a foreigner trying to stir something up.”
Stop calling yourself a patriotic American and blame others as unpatriotic or foreigner. WE are Americans too. This country is ruined by such big mouthers like you who are arrogant and stupid.
” Many of you assumed that you’d be able to buy once you forced prices down with negative talk. Now that they’re down, you still can’t buy due to lack of credit.”
Dear Reinvestor 101: Talk with your fellow CNBC and WSJ reports, who are really talking down the prices. Markets force the price down, not you and me!!! A real American is a true captilist and believer of true market force. Stop clainming you are a patriotic American.
Sorry to tell you I have two houses under my name. How many do you own?
“You either agree with me or you don’t. Don’t try to distance yourself from the proper views I express. No need to qualify the damn truth”
Thank you. There is no black or white in this world. I don’t have to agree with you or do not agree with you. I will ignore you because you are not a real American nor a real free market people. All you have are those crazy mnationalism. You better go back to Nazy Gemany to get your citizenship.
“This is 2008, and we have mechanisms to prevent bank runs and the like. Get your head out of the 1930’s and move forward a few decades. Stop posting this damn nonsense.”
Dear Reinvestor 101: Who are “we”? What “machanism” you are talking? You are talking all those things made up by all those Jews who are controlling the government and finanical institutions? You are taking about you as American? You are one of those Jews who are deserted everywhere in this world but USA.
“To my mind, the best thing that could happen would be for the (housing) bubble to deflate more quickly,” said Dean Baker, co-director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research in Washington. “Instead they’re coming up with crazy schemes to get more money to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to expand lending. That will keep (home) prices inflated.”
This guy should be on running the FED instead of Helicopter Bergabe
I told you guys I had to go to celebrate Easter with my family and a number of you chose to skewer me when I wasn’t around to respond. I don’t appreciate that low down underhanded type of crap. There’s too many damn attacks here to respond to each one or I’d be here all damn day. Tell you what, the next damn time you guys decided to attack me, elect one damn spokesman so I can deal with him rather than 15 different damn people.
Alex, you want to jump bad huh? Let me tell you something son, you have no idea who you’re messing with. Pantywaists like you and Stu like to talk a lot of shlt behind a keyboard, I’d like to see what you have to say in person. I’d like to see what you’d have to say when confronted with a good opportunity to buy a house. You’ll punk out crying about it’s “too expensive” or the “market is crashing”. You’d rather run through hell in gasoline underdrawers than to step up to the plate and invest. Punk.
Now as to the comments some of you seem to be moaning about. The credit crunch is an unintended consequence for you housing terrorists. You thought that all you’d have to do is undermine the real estate markets so you’d be able to buy on the cheap. Well guess what, that won’t happen because many of you won’t be able to get a loan now unless you’re willing to part with your first born….and that assumes that the bank is even willing to take only your first born. The bottom line is that many won’t be able to finance a house at all. That’s what you get for wishing ill will on your fellow citizens.
Stu, I’m not going to provide you with a damn bib and diapers while you bitch and moan about the government not wanting to provide your azz some cheese. You’re a dyed in the wool liberal and rather than work for your own damn cheese, you want big government to buy you a damn house. Let me tell you something, it’s time to grow up and realize that that sort of liberalism is dead and stinking. Goverment is supposed to look out for critical interests that benefit us all rather than the little things that your cheapskate azz wants. This means that the primary role of government is to protect us militarily and economically. The latter function was exhibited by the recent actions to address the Bear Sterns problems as well as the liquidity problems of investment banking in general. This is a proper government function that ultimately trickles down to help you. Unfortunately, you don’t want that sort of help.
I’m not done with you Stu. I’ll be back to respond to that rambling diatribe you posted.
“Pantywaists like you and Stu like to talk a lot of shlt behind a keyboard”
“Alex, you want to jump bad huh? Let me tell you something son, you have no idea who you’re messing with.”
“I’d like to see what you have to say in person. I’d like to see what you’d have to say when confronted with a good opportunity to buy a house. You’ll punk out crying about it’s “too expensive” or the “market is crashing”. You’d rather run through hell in gasoline underdrawers than to step up to the plate and invest. Punk.”
It’s gonna be along nite for you my friend. You gotta write a lot of responses to all those people who disrespected you. Better fire up a large pot of coffee.
Dear Reinvestor 101: Who are “we”? What “machanism” you are talking? You are talking all those things made up by all those Jews who are controlling the government and finanical institutions? You are taking about you as American? You are one of those Jews who are deserted everywhere in this world but USA.
What the hell? I’m just reading this crap and son, let me tell you something, I’m having real problems with you. Just where the hell do you get off making a racist remark like this? Call me what you want, but I’ve never ever made a racist remark on this board at any time. It’s time for a damn fact check to deal with this however. This ought to be interesting since you’ve demanded facts from me. On what factual basis are you making the claim above? BTW, I’m not Jewish.
I couldn’t make the last gtg because I had a previous commitment. I’ll be there next time and I’ll be bringing my investor friends as well. I’d like to see all the terrorists who post here so I know who I’m dealing with.
kettle1 Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 6:02 pm
Re101,
maybe you should show up at the next get together and you can and see if all of us real estate terrorists still talk the talk
Liberal Unpatriotic Anti-Housing Terrorist Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 6:01 pm
reinvestor101:
It’s gonna be along nite for you my friend. You gotta write a lot of responses to all those people who disrespected you. Better fire up a large pot of coffee.
All joking aside, I would like to meet your friends as they would have some interesting insight on how to make money. I am always up for hearing for other ways to make some extra money.
Sorry, Hype isn’t me. Spent my day outdoors, pretending I have a life. Now about to watch Chelsea v. Arsenal on the Tivo. Didn’t even bother to check the Carolina game…my guess is, they jumped all over Arkansas. If they didn’t, I lost a ton of money and don’t want to find out ’til tomorrow, anyway.
My black box keeps telling me Mad Max is the likely outcome of this ultimate Monte Carlo sim. I keep changing the inputs and assumptions, but the results come up the same.
Like many homeowners during the housing boom, Lynnette Madden and her husband decided to open a home equity line of credit about a year and a half ago as “padding” for emergency expenses and a cushion for Madden’s commission-based real estate career. The couple, who live in Bakersfield, Calif., never paid the bill late and never drew more than $14,000 in debt from the line’s $100,000 credit limit.
That’s why Madden was surprised when Countrywide sent her a letter in late January stating that the couple’s home equity line was “suspended” and they could no longer use it. The reason? Their home, the letter stated, had declined in value and thus the couple no longer had the amount of equity they did when they opened the line.
“I went ballistic,” Madden says. “I could understand it if we missed a payment or maxed it out, but we’ve been responsible.”
would you mind sharing what your idea of a coming crash would look like? financial only (i.e great depression II), financial and some social breakdown, or do you really go for the all out end of society mad max version? how do you see any crash progressing?
You spew more krap than an elephant suffering from diarrhea.
It must really suck to be on the wrong side of the worst performing sector in the market. Especially when you begin to realize that we are probably less than a third of the way down. If I were you, I would be spending more time figuring out how to bail out of your poorly performing investments rather than trying to change the minds of a few bloggers who have been on the ‘proper’ side of the trade.
Now I must catch the 3rd part of John Adams on HBO. Rest assured RE, I will be hoping the Red Coats kick our ass. My lack of patriotism has me unsure of how this story ends. Perhaps with a large shipment of government cheese to the colonies? I can only hope.
This topped the news in the local Chambersburg paper over the weekend
Welcome to Public Opinion - Chambersburg, PA
Pig lungs clog I-81
By NATALIE WILLIS Staff writer
It took more than six hours to clean up 38,000 pounds of pig lungs after a tractor trailer crashed and spilled the mess on Interstate 81 at 1 a.m. Thursday.
The accident occurred at mile marker 28, between two Shippensburg exits — King Street and Fayette Street — when the driver of a tractor trailer traveling north on I-81, “blacked out” before entering the median strip, according to Pennsylvania State Police, Carlisle.
Police said the truck driven by James Alton Barbour, 32, Four Oaks, N.C., went through the median strip and crossed both southbound lanes before hitting a dirt embankment on the western side of I-81. The trailer flipped onto its side, spilling the load of pig lungs.
Barbour was treated at Chambersburg Hospital for a minor injury to his left arm, police said, and the southbound lanes of the interstate were closed for several hours, reopening at 7:45 a.m.
A front-end loader was used to pick up the mess of lungs, blood and mud, which were hauled away in a different truck, said Public Information Officer, Tpr. Karl Schmidhamer. He was told the pig lungs were going to be used for dog food and not considered hazardous waste.
Nick Moxley at Vigilant Hose Company said the fire department’s engines were dispatched to clean up mud and blood from the spill.
“We stayed there cleaning up until complete,” he said.
It looks like the book I’ve been raving about here for a few weeks: Love in the Ruins, by Walker Percy. I’ve loved it since I read it almost 30 years ago, but I figured the breakdown of society he depicted was more metaphorical than literal.
However, the more current events unfold, the more Percy’s description of the breakdown of everything seems ominously prescient…from the first sentence of the book, to the last.
I don’t necessarily see a Depression-style thing playing out, nor do I believe we’re going to get a Mad Max/Thunderdome denouement to this mess. I think it’s far more likely that the physical breakdown of infrastructure and concurrent spritual/moral/Zeitgeist erosion will be met with equal and separate waves of ennui, apathy and denial.
This might be the first serious recession in history that occurs in an environment in which 75% of all Americans don’t even realize it’s happening.
The fact that I-81 was so smeared with pig lungs that it had to be shut down may strike many as an odd, random event that holds no mirror to the world at large.
To somebody who’s read a lot of Ayn Rand or Walker Percy (or listened to too much Pink Floyd), it’s a harbinger of the complete breakdown of everything.
Alex Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:10 pm
“Dear Reinvestor 101: Who are “we”? What “machanism” you are talking? You are talking all those things made up by all those Jews who are controlling the government and finanical institutions? You are taking about you as American? You are one of those Jews who are deserted everywhere in this world but USA.”
EXCUSE ME!!!! WTF!!??!!
This is just as offensive and racist as it gets. And you are calling a common or garden troll offensive and dirty mouthed? I DARE you to show up anywhere I will ever be.
i would be interested in discussing your comments abit more if are so inclined, get my e-mail from grim if you wouldnt mind, as this may not be the forum.
Will reach out tomorrow. Suffice it to say that when I get wound up on this topic, I can get going. You may be begging me to stop after a while.
Funny, that Gil Scott-Heron song about the revolution not being televised. I think the revolution is being televised, 24/7, and we’re so hypnotized, jaded and stoned by cathode rays, we either don’t care or can’t see it all happening in real time.
Disclaimer: a friend of mine- who is a shrink- also tells me that my kind of thinking is also commonly displayed by paranoid schizophrenics.
Clot(244) - Although I could never put it to words quite as gracefully, you are not at all alone in your thoughts. You, Ket, and some others seem to see things in the same light, for what that seems to be worth these days.
Clot - An Israeli journalist was in Russia once. Met an old babushka and asked her about the Jews. She went on and on with similar BS. He told her “you’re really brave telling me all this”. “Why?” she asked. “Well” he answered, “if they are really so connected and rich and control everything, I’d imagine they are watching you right now, listening to every word you say, and making plans”.
lisoosh Read that post was wondering when someone was going to hammer Alex at first I thought I read it wrong & was going to ask what he/she meant then I read`it again.I should have put it to him right then & there but got called away from keyboard.No place for that here to any group or religion. Bully for you.
I missed that (didn’t read that post as had determined that the poster can’t write) but you’re 100% right (_obviously_). Alex is far worse than reinvestor.
Bigot, plain and tall.
And ’soosh, you get a ten point bonus for fitting the phrase “common or garden” in that post.
‘Soosh
Plenty of each. Still can toss up 200 on the bench a few times despite being a professional desk jockey.
Also love wine and chocolate and pasta.
Our league works with a budget rather than a draft, and you are free to churn your roster each week if you want to. Player values are determined by position (strikers generally cost more than midfield, defense, or GK) and recent performance. If you buy a player, and his value rockets, the purchase price counts against your budget as opposed to the market value so in a lot of cases it might make sense to keep a player through a bye week, suspension, or short injury.
Sure enough, the dude ruling our league bought Torres early on for 12 pounds. Torres now costs 26 on the open market — the salary cap is 100 pounds so you’d blow a quarter of your budget on him. He’s a player worth keeping through a bye week or a short stint on the DL. So far fantasy soccer has been a sobering lesson in economics and information access. Much like real estate…
The belief that a home purchase is like winning the f-ing lottery is what caused this mess. I wish I had a dollar for every homeowner who bragged about how much “money” they “made” in the market. Money isn’t “made” from a home until it’s sold and the gain is realized. In most cases, the realized gain goes right back into the next home purchase.
Your home is a roof over your head. It does not magically produce income. It should not form the cornerstone of a financial portfolio, regardless of the NAR propaganda. I almost feel sorry for the baby boomers who thought that their homes would magically cover their retirements. Almost, because they believed in the fairy tale of ever-increasing prices.
I’ll be toothless, dressed in rags with flies buzzing around me at the next gtg. I ignored everyone’s advice, I didn’t buy a home in 2003-06 and now I’m living under a bridge.
I’ve noticed some generic-looking townhomes being built across the Turnpike from the Secaucus rail station. I’m assuming this is the “transit village” that had been talked about for years.
I’m not getting much via Google… I’d like to know the following:
- Who is the developer?
- Is there an estimated completion and/or sales date?
- Is the project active, or has progress been halted due to the market?
jmacdaddio Says:
March 24th, 2008 at 12:33 am
ReTraitor101,
I’ll be toothless, dressed in rags with flies buzzing around me at the next gtg. I ignored everyone’s advice, I didn’t buy a home in 2003-06 and now I’m living under a bridge.
The joke’s on you. In my present state, I can’t even get into a dive bar so I won’t be at the next gtg. I should have bought a McMansion in Monroe Township using 3% down and a 3/1 ARM in 2005. I could have retired off the appreciation since then.
american economic refugees flooding into canada.
http://www.chycho.com/?q=node/1631
tent cities spring up in la..bbc
http://depression2.tv/d2/node/47
We used to visit a couple who bought a Toll brother’s house in 1998. Everytime we visited they had no furniture in this mcmansion and said they were having furniture custom made in Italy. They didn’t add one piece of furniture to their house in 3 years. Yet they told the same Italian furniture line every visit.
I finally asked what happened, did someone plant the seedlings in Italy yet?
That was also the last time we visited.
I guess I have trouble making friends.
Last week I was driving through Basking Ridge. I saw someone dressed up as a Weichert icon jumping around at the intersection of Valley rd and the side street the mcmansion was on. Wish I had had my camera with me.
It was definitely more creative then some balloons or a sign spinner. A lot funnier to me too.
3. bairen; My neighbor Atillio get’s his custom Italian Furniture from a Bensonhurst Brooklyn Furniture Store. Tell them to try that.
Saw one of those as well.
I want to know how they pick the agent that gets to wear it.
grim (6)-
I think it’s based on low production. Kind of a Glengarry Glen Ross thing.
Anyone have any numbers for last years bonuses?
Looks like the Fed made sure they kept those bonuses.
SAS
JPMorgan offers Bear Stearns staff bonuses: source
http://news.yahoo.com/s/nm/20080320/bs_nm/bearstearns_staff_dc
SAS
#7 Clothing is for closers!!!!
#9 Chase is offering incentives for Bear employees to stay through the transition? Why? Where could they go with Citi, GS, and others breaking out the hatchets?
#10
Self-respect is for closers?
Chase is offering incentives for Bear employees to stay through the transition? Why?
I haven’t lived through more than a handful of mergers or acquisitions, but stay bonuses were relatively common for those above the rank and file, especially when it was obvious that those positions were to be cut. Point isn’t to keep them as employees, but to keep them only as long as the transition will take.
13 Chew ‘em up and spit ‘em out.
Not really a bad deal, I’ve heard of far worse.
Employees who are not offered jobs will receive at least a cash bonus of about 30 percent of their 2007 compensation if they stay through the completion of the deal, the source said.
From the WSJ:
Woes in Condo Market Build
As New Supply Floods Cities
By JENNIFER S. FORSYTH and JONATHAN KARP
March 22, 2008; Page A1
The condominium market is about to get worse as many cities brace for a flood of new supply this year — the result of construction started at the height of the housing boom.
More than 4,000 new units will be completed in both Atlanta and Phoenix by the end of the year. Developers in Miami and Fort Lauderdale, Fla., are readying nearly 10,000 total new units in a market already struggling with canyons of unsold condos. San Diego, another hard-hit region, will add 2,500 units, according to estimates provided by Reis Inc., a New York-based real-estate-research firm.
The new building comes on top of unprecedented supply. The U.S. finished 2007 with a supply of condos large enough to absorb 10 months of demand, the highest level since the National Association of Realtors began the tally in 1999.
The deluge means bad news for developers and potentially lower prices, including in cities such as Atlanta and Dallas that have avoided the worst of the housing bust. If defaults and foreclosures rise, lenders will feel the pain too.
…
The news isn’t bad for everyone. Vulture buyers have started to circle, hoping to take advantage of foreclosed properties that banks may start dumping at fire-sale prices. Also, some condos are being converted to rental units, increasing supply for renters and putting downward pressure on prices.
Grown Children turning to parents to help in a weak economy.
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080321/ap_on_bi_ge/living_with_parents
“Grown Children turning to parents to help in a weak economy”
yes, I read that one this morning too.
I think grown kids turning to parents is very common out in NJ & Wrong (Long) Island, for awhile now.
thought?
SAS
Whoa,
Then in December, she finally accepted her parents’ invitation to move into their home — at age 52. “I’m back living in the bedroom that I grew up in,” she said.
Yes I was talking about this last night, however… I am thinking if I give my sons a good start, - schooling, oppurtunity to save for a home,etc- I’m thinking when my son’s 52 I’ll be moving in with him!
KL
I know it’s very common in NJ to live with parents well into their 30’s if not married. I have a very good friend (professional with a very good job) unmarried, in her early 40’s living with her parents on the top level of the home in their active adult community home. Don’t ask me why - LOL
I lived at home til I got married at 29. I don’t regret anything about it. By that time, I owned a property and when my wife & I got married we built our first home and moved in.
Saved a ton of $ in rent, utilities, food, etc. No shame, just the way that our parents wanted to raise us.
-Richie
We have heard a lot about Wall Street salaries and bonuses.
How much is a typical Wall Street bonus anyway? Say, for someone who got his or her MBA/graduate degree 5 years ago.
Is it something like base salary 150k, and bonus 75k ?
A couple of years ago I was at a happy hour, and a friend of a coworker’s husband was going off about how pathetic it was to see “these Jersey people” living at home at age 30. The loudmouth was from Kansas, my coworker was from Ohio, and her husband was from western PA. All three had to leave their home states to pursue careers. I pointed out that the reason why people don’t leave Jersey is that there are jobs here, and the price you pay for the opportunities is that you might have to spend more of your 20s and 30s in the nest than you like. I told the loudmouth that if NJ were Kansas and you could rent an apartment for $350 a month, sure, most of us Jersey people would have left home at 18, however our career aspirations would be limited to Applebee’s manager or some factory job which was about to get sent to China.
I think that a daughter can more easily stay home til 30….but a guy….especially one like ‘me’ would find it difficult….college allows a lot of freedom and it would be hard to settle back into a parental environment after that. People here are very materialistic as well….drive expensive cars…want to own big houses….etc…etc…being young often means not having that stuff, and thats…OK.
My parents charged rent when my brother moved back home after college. At least I don’t think he had to contribute towards the utility bills.
Unfortunately this is what most people imagine when they think of a young person in NJ….
http://www.barstoolsports.com/article/new_jersey_freakshows/1958/
you blokes don’t think people in 20s & 30s living at home with parents really inhibits financial responsibility and social growth. Don’t you think they tend to have an “unrealisitic” point of view as to what it takes to get buy??
I do, for the most… there is always exceptions.
But nothing makes me shake my head more than to see a 30 year old in a BMW, $200 jeans, but still nursing the breast of the parents.
:)
SAS
26. I charged my son rent after his Bachelors Degree (paid by me), until he agreed to go for his Masters Degree (paid by ADP). When he got married, he got the Rent back plus. Was just a little game to get him to continue school. He hated giving me money, so it worked.
Grim, any sales on winding hill drive in Mount Olive in the past 2 months.
actually….
the total abandonment of the dollar by this stupid Fed has made me shake my head more.
I hope you all like oatmeal, cause thats what you will be eating 2-3x times a day here in about 3-6 months.
I like to add honey to my oatmeal, but the even the damn honey bees are disappearing.
When the honeybees are are gone, its goodnight for all of us. yikes !
SAS
#24 - essex
i agree with it being hard to settle back into the nest after college -( i did it for a year, and i didn’t like it. ) but not the son/daughter thing - it could actually be harder for a daughter because parents may be more protective…
my brothers moved back in for several years and saved a ton of money, boosted their ability to buy a house after marriage, and pretty much changed the course of their financial life. I, on the other hand, moved out after being home a year -
Richie,
That’s my intention. A good start.
KL
In many cultures you don’t leave home until you’re married, whether that’s age 19 or 40 and it’s hard for old-school parents to digest sometimes. NJ is a place where ethnic identification is alive and well.
The “you’re 18, now get out” philosophy is very difficult to practice here. NJ 2008 is not like Berkeley, CA in the 1970s…. you can’t just hitch a ride from Fresno, show up with your backpack, enroll at UC, and spend seven years bouncing between philosophy and Sanskrit courses. NJ 2008 is a far less forgiving place - if you want to survive, and you don’t have an entrepreneur spirit, you need to get on the corporate treadmill and hope you don’t get canned.
sas 27 -
Amen! I have seen so many Jersey people, men and women, living at home to “save for a house” when they routinely spend $300 on shoes, go to Broadway shows twice a month, drive the Beemers, etc.
The corollary to that observation is that there are plenty of Jersey people who have completely given up on the possibility of home ownership, so they might as well spend the money they earn on nice stuff.
From the WSJ:
Tax Breaks for Home Buyers
Attract Support in the Senate
By GREG HITT
March 22, 2008; Page A8
WASHINGTON — Efforts to create new tax breaks to encourage home purchases are gaining attention on Capitol Hill, as lawmakers gird for a major debate this spring on how best to shore up the nation’s troubled mortgage markets.
The Bush administration has looked at the pros and cons of a tax credit but remains opposed to the idea, saying it prefers lawmakers act quickly on administration proposals that are languishing in Congress. However, pressure may soon grow on the administration to look again at the idea. Some Democrats, among them Michigan Sen. Debbie Stabenow, have signaled support for expanded tax benefits. And the idea is proving especially popular among Senate Republicans, who are hoping to carve a distinct role as Congress takes up housing issues and often find tax cuts an appealing option. The discussions reflect a growing sense that the housing, mortgage and credit mess may require more expansive federal government action.
“The momentum on this thing has been good,” said Sen. Johnny Isakson, a Georgia Republican. Sen. Isakson, a former realtor, is pushing a proposal that would provide a temporary tax credit to any individual purchasing a newly constructed house or a foreclosed home. The tax break would come at a five-year, $14.5 billion cost to taxpayers, an aide said.
Democratic leaders in the House and Senate hope to turn to legislation aimed at easing the turmoil in the housing market when lawmakers return in early April. Striking a more aggressive posture than the White House, Democratic leaders have signaled support for legislation to create special taxpayer-backed programs to help troubled borrowers refinance into more affordable, low-cost mortgages, among other things.
While interest is growing in the housing tax breaks, it is by no means certain that they will ultimately make it into the legislative package. Critics complain the federal tax code already provides ample support for homeownership, offering a deduction for mortgage interest and allowing certain capital gains on home sales to be excluded from taxation.
[snip]
Sen. Stabenow is pushing a measure that would create a one-time tax credit of $3,000 for first-time home buyers. Mr. Isakson’s proposal is broader, providing a $5,000 tax credit for the purchase of a single-family home. That credit could be claimed for three years, raising the total tax benefit to $15,000.
http://online.wsj.com/article/SB120614866511156783.html?mod=hps_us_whats_news
Abelson;
“Wal-Mart special this week, free bank with the purchase of a toaster.”
We will have reached the bottom of this bust when “Flip this house” is replaced with “Salvage this sub-division.”
I can see it now. Clot, Grim, BC Bob, Gary, myself, 3b and others will go into abandoned developments all around the US and strip the houses for copper, sinks, lumber, anything of value.
While making rude, sarcastic comments about flippers, the Fed, and other miscreants.
It’s in the bag.
#37 of course we will have obtained salvage rights first.
“will go into abandoned developments all around the US and strip the houses for copper, sinks, lumber, anything of value”
thats already being done in many places.
Hell, I think I will take them cooper pipes myself :).
he he… ; )
SAS
Can anybody provide me info on MLS# 814657, pleeease.
btw-
I went to Starbucks this morning.
Got me a “tall coffee”, but the so called “tall” is the smallest.
ya gotta love that doublespeak…
CHeerio
SAS
#39 Yeah, but I think those are all break ins. Mine would be legal and on TV!!
We could then take the goods and load them onto those empty cargo boxes and ship them to China so the Chinese can live the American dream with genuine housing parts from the US.
why not live at home? All my friends did it till 30, if you have a summer share, a ski house share, go away on vacation two weeks a year and a girlfirend with her own place what is the point of a $2000 a month apt you sleep in 3-4 nights a week? Plus you can still do all these things give mom and dad a few hundred a month and still save more than having an apt.
My life fades. The vision dims. All that remains are memories. I remember a time of chaos. Ruined dreams. This wasted land. But most of all, I remember The Road Warrior. The man we called “Max”. To understand who he was, you have to go back to another time. When the world was powered by the black fuel. And the desert sprouted great cities of pipe and steel. Gone now, swept away. For reasons long forgotten, two mighty warrior tribes went to war and touched off a blaze which engulfed them all. Without fuel, they were nothing. They built a house of straw. The thundering machines sputtered and stopped. Their leaders talked and talked and talked. But nothing could stem the avalanche. Their world crumbled. The cities exploded. A whirlwind of looting, a firestorm of fear. Men began to feed on men. On the roads it was a white line nightmare. Only those mobile enough to scavenge, brutal enough to pillage would survive. The gangs took over the highways, ready to wage war for a tank of juice. And in this maelstrom of decay, ordinary men were battered and smashed. Men like Max. The warrior Max. In the roar of an engine, he lost everything. And became a shell of a man, a burnt out, desolate man, a man haunted by the demons of his past, a man who wandered out into the wasteland. And it was here, in this blighted place, that he learned to live again.
Unfortunately this is what most people imagine when they think of a young person in NJ….
http://www.barstoolsports.com/article/new_jersey_freakshows/1958/
One day in the future they’ll all look back and wish they were wearing MC Hammer pants instead. Sigh, i fear for our youth.
Jersey youth can always aspire to servicing Client No. 9…..launching a myspace page with iTunes download….cashing in a a pair of bad fake b**bs…..and making bank on their back. What a country.
New Jersey Freakshows…. I’m speechless… absolutely speechless.
NEW YORK (MarketWatch) — The U.S. Federal Reserve and its European counterparts are talking about the practicality of using public money to buy large quantities of mortgage-backed assets to clean up the credit mess jeopardizing global economic growth, the Financial Times reported Saturday.
#47 Gary,
Don’t you love the spray on tans?
#48 Why does the fed say it is not their duty to pop financial bubbles when it always wants to lead the charge to cleanup the aftermath?
Wouldn’t it be easier and cheaper to pop them?
It’s like dropping a carton of milk. If you pick it up right away you can save most of the milk and use a paper towel to clean up the mess. Wait till it empties and you are out of milk, need a mop, and a lot more time to clean up the mess.
New Jersey Freakshows….OMG! Speaking of zombies…
That NJ freakshow is pretty normal to me. I went to cancun years ago on a chartered jet out of newark that we got cheap out of liberty travel in brooklyn and that pretty much looks like the whole plane did.
Pastels, summers, china club, belmar, cancun, Kinos, club g are pretty much home to these types of people and can be viewed on a regular basis.
I went short ribs once and afterwards to Pastels with my friends from brooklyn many years ago and had an old S class convert with well over 100K miles, (but fresh paint) was told to park the god damm thing on the sidewalk with top down cause no one not even the cops mess with the S Class in Brooklyn, he was right. The gravy fries and the egg creams at the victory dinner made for a perfect night.
That and when we were at Turquise (I stepped on a made man’s foot by accident) but at the time I was dating a distant relative of John Gotti and my friend had bragged about it. The made man apolized for his foot being in my way. Much to the delight of my “friends” pasquele, marco and vinnie. For one night they were my crew!! I broke up with the girl a few weeks later and my days of a brooklyn Irish mini capo were over.
“sas Says:
March 22nd, 2008 at 11:32 am
btw-
I went to Starbucks this morning.
Got me a “tall coffee”, but the so called “tall” is the smallest.”
Impressive discovery. Thanks for sharing.
HC
Got me a “tall coffee”, but the so called “tall” is the smallest.”
The word smallest contains the letters that spell tall, it is part of the mystery.
Also why we are expected to tip and why the tips are shared with management, it is part of the experience. go to starbucked.com
Visa listed as V under the NYSE and the NYSE is downtown near the Vault, no concidence. If the recessions hits hard the S&M area of the Vault will be utilized to punish deliquent card holders.
There are signs everywhere!
bairen,
We need a good, old-fashioned shakeout.
Debt-Gorged British Start to Worry That the Party Is Ending
The sheeple in the states have some competition in UK - “many Americans are being overwhelmed by personal debt, but Britons are even more profligate. For most of the last decade, consumers here went on a debt-financed spending spree that made them the most indebted rich nation in the world”
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/22/business/worldbusiness/22debt.html
52….my cousin worked in the DAs office during the Gotti trial….according to some of the evidence he was forced to archive (and would not elaborate on) the man was wise to apologize. Gotti apparently was a man who was not to be messed with.
What, no props for http://www.njguido.com?
This article supports Corzines new proposed $10/lb Fat Tax;
YHOO - Obese relative may have crushed toddler
jmacdaddio Says:
March 22nd, 2008 at 11:02 am
In many cultures you don’t leave home until you’re married,
————————————
In some cultures not even after marriage :-) it is called joint-family system ! Of course even in India this has been changing with children taking jobs in cities other than where parents live, and these days even if they live in the same city they live separately. But some people still prefer the ‘joint family system’, it mainly helps where both husband and wife work. Kids get taken care of, house work is taken care of, there is fresh food on the table when one comes back from work……… Hey if I had live-in parents or live-in-inlaws I might have also worked when my children were growing. I was adamant about ‘no day-care’ and ‘no-nannies’. BTW, in joint-families everyone contributes.
61…as romantic and old school as that sounds…my own personal situation would make it very hard to endure my parents under the same roof…I have never been happier than when I finally found my own space. Our relationship is excellent, but might suffer greatly from a joint arrangement. Too close for comfort?
#60 I think we should have a fat tax. It would help balance the budget and may cause Americans to lose weight and eat healthier. That would help slow down our health insurance costs.
It will never happen though.
Now I’m off to Whole Paycheck.
jmacdaddio Says:
March 22nd, 2008 at 11:06 am
sas 27 -
Amen! I have seen so many Jersey people, men and women, living at home to “save for a house” when they routinely spend $300 on shoes, go to Broadway shows twice a month, drive the Beemers, etc.
—————————–
I have a friend here living with husband and in-laws. No kids yet. All the four work. They live in a fairly big house. They hire help to clean every week, they hire someone to come in and cook twice a week, and they buy nice things, and all four drive a beem each. Economy of scale !
Hey, once it is a long term decision to live together, rules are put in place usually, so people get their own space to the extent possible, expenses shared and inconviniences equitably distributed.
A lot of ‘Bimmer’ (not Beamer folks) bashing here…..I drive one….love it…and guarantee it was not more costly than most other machines….and it handles like mad.
Sugee 61 -
You bring up a valid point. There are two aspects to American culture which make such an arrangement hard. Number one, Americans do not talk about money and finance with their children, or anyone else for that matter. A multigeneration household would require frank, open discussions about finance which most Americans are incapable of. To this day I have no idea what assets my parents have other than their home because they have not shared that info. I’ll be 35 in May. If I will need to take care of them later on, I would like to know about it now.
Second, Americans value self-reliance to a fault. The thought of sharing a home with parents or in-laws is unthinkable to most Americans unless there’s a compelling reason. Somehow it’s better to pay a day care center to watch the young ones than to consider having a grandparent under the same roof. And I doubt many baby boomer grandparents have any intention of changing diapers while their Gen X and Y children work.
62, “Our relationship is excellent, but might suffer greatly from a joint arrangement. Too close for comfort?”
Nothing works for everyone all the time :-) My mother wanted her independence and that is why she and dad never moved in with me even for the 7-8 years that I needed them. She did want to help me, but she wanted her independence more ! I guess life is all about making choices based on what we want more and what we want less, may be we should call the process prioritization ?
Every choice has a cost attached, nothing comes free, so perhaps when we prioritise we estimate the cost on each choice and tend to avoid the costliest. Again each of us would estimate these costs differently, afterall each of us will value the same things differently.
Gary,
Clifton continues to crumble..
1285 Van Houten Ave, Clifton NJ
Purchased: 10/3/2006
Purchase Price: $535,000
Current asking: $364,900
(32% under 2006 purchase price)
Wells Fargo Jumbo at 8.00%. OUCH.
https://www.wellsfargo.com/mortgage/rates?ref=patrick.net
67….I like the idea…just know my own situation…that being said, I would welcome the inlaws or my parents in if the economic situation dictated it….and we could help that way….it would have to be an ‘inlaw suite’ though with it’s own entrance….
Philip Brewer at Wise Bread wrote a good piece that most of us can identify with:
http://www.wisebread.com/if-youre-so-smart-why-arent-you-rich
I think a lot of us here practice this. I have no illusions about retiring at 45; rather I’m focused on putting myself into a situation where at 45 the inevitable pink slip will be an opportunity to do something interesting instead of an absolute disaster. The only way to get there is to live beneath my means.
BC HUDSON CITY alot cheaper , but you better be white as snow on credit score.
http://www.hcsbonline.com/site/mortgage_nj_frm.html
jmacdaddio 66,
Thanks for explaining how it works with Americans. I guess it helps because my children are wholly Americans in outlook although not born here.
” If I will need to take care of them later on, I would like to know about it now.” Now I will certainly talk to my sons about as early as possible.
“And I doubt many baby boomer grandparents have any intention of changing diapers while their Gen X and Y children work.”
Hey, my pre-boomer Indian mother did not want to get stuck like that, she clearly told me no joint living arrangements, and no commitment to taking care of my brats.
But I myself am available to babysit my grand-brats, whichever way my sons want it - they can move in with me, or I with them, or I can live someplace close by.
I dont think I will have any money to leave them, so I want to help in any other way I can.
Essex 70, if ever my family decided to be a ‘joint family’ it will certainly be a separate apartment and entrance for every family ! Hey, there hopefully will be three incomes to support the required renovation and restructuring :-)
I just saw a few commercials while watching CNN’s Your Money. Ad #1: a couple is using Remax to buy their first house. The husband is a soldier oveseas and the wife and baby are working with a realtor. He comes home (in one piece) and moves into their first house. How moving - does anyone have a tissue?
Ad #2: The Michigan Economic Development Corp pitches MI as a center of high-tech innovation. Good luck to anyone who wants to get laid-off UAW line workers to learn something new.
Ad #3: A waitress treks to work after getting into an accident. DividedWeFail.org urges us to write our politicians urging a health care solution because millions upon millions are an accident or illness away from oblivion.
Ad #4: Reverse mortgages for homeowners over 62…. where do I sign up?
Just a poll, but what type of home are most of you looking to purchase.
I live in a 2BR in the city now w/ 2 kids. Need space, so I’m buying the biggest house possible (prob 4BR and plan to live there for until I’m ready to downsize). I just don’t want too much change even if I can afford it. I don’t want to get just a starter home or townhouse and than upsize when needed. I’m a bit below my means now and putting up w/ a little discomfort in terms of space so I can get a decent size home for the next 25-30 years. If I can afford it I may also buy a 1BR rental in the city and keep it for the likelihood of moving to a simpler life in the city after I retire. If life becomes real grand considering the possibility of a country home for the weekends too. Let’s see if that will work out financially.
Just tooling around on the njmls site, and I see open houses tomorrow on Easter Sunday.
I do not ever recall open houses on Easter in the past.
We hope to be able to buy a 3BR 1.5-2 bath house in the range of $300,000-325,000. I really think that isn’t too much to ask for. We plan to live there for quite some time and we’re hoping to be able to find all this in Union County.
John Mc Cain hero of France.Let’s give American Jobs to the French.
http://www.marketwatch.com/news/story/john-mccain-derided-hero-france/story.aspx?guid=%7B4A0B8953%2D7114%2D4FFA%2D9CF7%2DFF42B56EDD59%7D
#55 John: Ironic how the VISA IPO went considering Americans will be swipeing a lot less going forward.
They get all the money from the IPO up front, the lenders have all the risk.
Geez though have you seen Mastercards stock…..like a 300% gain. Say what you will but those guys are not dumb, We are.
Anyone concerned about this talk about congestion pricing? I hate the idea. If I move to NJ it would suck for me. I have a good number of friends living in the city, Queens and Long Island and we would probably see each other much less because of it.
Anyone care to comment on the most reliable train line to get into NYC? I hear the NE Corridor line is horrible. Any other stories. I hear the Morristown/Gladstone line is fairly reliable.
NE Corridor line is bad, Coast is the worst. Bergen line is fairly good. Don’t have any info on Morristown line
#80 Essex: Exactly my point.
JP Morgan made over $1 Billion on Visa IPO.
http://money.cnn.com/2008/03/21/news/companies/visabanks/index.htm?postversion=2008032114
Anyone handicapping which train line gets the next Midtown direct and when?
Probably Bergen & Pasack line before Raritan Valley. When I’m not sure whenever they finish those tunnel expansions.
75, Hardplace: I don’t know. :*) We have 1.9 kids (#2 son due Any Minute Now), and our 2 bdrm apt is big enough we could stay here for 5 to 10 years if we had to (yea, bunkbeds!) But my mom has no savings, no retirement fund, and my kid sis works two jobs just to pay her rent. I think we might be looking at a joint family living arrangement, so ideally I want a 4 or 5 bdrm place, with a big enough yard i could grow tomatoes.
we could do the bunk bed thing, but i sort of want my boys to be able to play in a yard or field. Not enough parks in Manhattan. Little kids are deprived of space because all the older kids use their space too. Last fall I almost got into a fight w/ a bunch junior high kids because they almost ran over my at the time 1 1/2 year old on his bike.
88, I hear you! We live across the street from a huge park, and folks say “You must spend the whole summer there!” Um, no. Way too stressful. Once a week playing spotter for my fear-free toddler is enough. ;) Teenagers have been fine, but the 3-6 yr old crowd doesn’t know their own strength. *sigh* I’d love to move sooner than 5-10 years; that’s the “OMG property taxes just trippled and we’re in a depression and yet house prices have not dropped yet, damn them” scenario. Plus, I love the community we live in (shame about the tiny yards and huge re prices), and it’s hard to accept we’ll have to leave it to get a mortgage. *insert pity party here*
Joeycasz I don’t know Union county that well
but I would surely think that 3-325 might be a tall order in a decent town,but you never know.I hope you are right that would mean they are going for 150 by me if the pricing holds true across the state.By the way you can buy that now in Sussex county some nice ones too.
Can someone get an address for MLS 2500077
thanks in advance!
#90
Friend bought a house in Vernon about a year ago. 4 bedroom 2.5 bath, completley finished basement on 3 acres for $360,000. I’ve been looking and have found my asking house in that range in Union. If it’s not total sh*t is another story.
Joey I’m in Vernon your friend did well dependent on age of home, everything septic up here they can pass but old ones go at any time so you really want something 10-15 yr. max.Good luck on the search I had thought Union was higher.
“Impressive discovery. Thanks for sharing”
My point about the Starbucks coffee is that its a marketing game. Maken you call something that is small a tall is taken right out of the text book of Edward Bernays.
Edward Bernays tactics are being employed is full swing by the NAR.
Do google search of the buisness of propaganda, and read up…. its pretty amazing.
ok, now let me get back up on that turnip truck, since it seems I just fell off.
;)
SAS
Hard Place Says:
March 22nd, 2008 at 3:01 pm
Anyone care to comment on the most reliable train line to get into NYC? I hear the NE Corridor line is horrible. Any other stories. I hear the Morristown/Gladstone line is fairly reliable.
HP: The PATH….
#93
Mike, yeah he did pretty good. Seller wanted out of NJ. Also the house i’m guessing is maybe 15 years at the most, it pretty much looks new.
Sections of Union are pretty high. I’m looking in Clark, Scotch Plains, Garwood, Fanwood etc… I’ve seen houses in those areas and in that range just recently too. We’ll be trying to look sometime in June/July. We’ll see.
#61 - More than a few of my South Asian neighbours have that set up. Nuclear family + brother and wife + aging parent who acts as housekeeper/nanny, all in one McMansion. 4 adults contributing to the mortgage, family caring for the kids and fresh food on the table. It does make financial sense.
And at least THOSE McMansions are actually lived in by an appropriate number of people for the square footage.
“We have 1.9 kids (#2 son due Any Minute Now)”
Congratulations, alia!!!!!
(I’m a big fan of the tomato-growing as well).
This quote on another forum which shall remain nameless cracked me up:
“One in Cranford was listed for $710K but on a mere .17 acre of space. And we didn’t even get to see that home ‘cus the homeowner apparently didn’t know there were ppl coming to see his home. He had the gall to
pull my realtor aside and ask her about our credentials ‘cus he didn’t want to bother making the home available for just anybody! Hello?! We were more than qualified and but felt so insulted we left w/o seeing the overpriced piece of poo on the pitiful lot.”
99 Lisoosh
That is fantastic. Meanwhile if you showed up in high end designer clothes, they wouldn’t know authentic from a knock-off.
is this a slow weekeend because of the holiday? the house i’m renting just hit the market and we’ve had no calls for a viewing. it just seems slow
Xavier in the Sweet Sixteen. They may win it all!
I visited several houses in Indian Forest section of East Brunswick in the past three months. The sellers are still dreaming to sell their houses with 2005 -2006’s peak price even though several comaprable houses sold below or close to $500,000.
Two houses currently on the market in this section all want to reap the profits:
1. 9 pawnee rd(MLS#:813565, tax $10,585, built 1978) is asking $569,900. Owner bought the house $395,000 in 07/27/2001. The owner did no upgrade work.
2. 11 Pawnee rd(MLS#:811865, tax $10,764, built 1978) lowers to $565,000 from original asking price of $598,000.The owner bought the house $322,000 in 12/01/2001. The owner did some upgrade work, at least the kitchen is upgraded and roof is new.
Comparable Sold houses in the same neighborhood:
1. 21 Deer Run Ct(MLS#: 809504, tax $12,115, built 1984) is a foreclosure house with last asking price of $475,000. It was out of market this month and I guess it was sold below $475,000.
2. 17 Huron Ct(MLS#:8076626, tax $10,650, 1982 built) sold $500,000 on 01/28/08.
3. 7 Lenape Ln( tax:$ 10,360, built 1978) sold $485,000 on 05/22/07
Do you know why they are expecting more? My agent just told me a stupid buyer bought a house in this section at 54 Buffalo Run (MLS#:811087, asking price $569,900, tax $10,569, built in 1978) with $545,000 last month. Buyer, do your homework! You paid at least $45,000 more for this house with original kitchen original windows! You are encouraging the other sellers to sell high! Wake Up!
#88 - hard place -
“Last fall I almost got into a fight w/ a bunch junior high kids because they almost ran over my at the time 1 1/2 year old on his bike.”
sounds like you definitely need your own space - you can’t expect 12 year olds to worry about your toddler - i understand your sentiment, but you have to remember, they’re only kids too -
regarding the train lines, i’m on the morris/essex line (dover, mid-town direct), and i find it sort of unreliable - years ago i was on the pascack valley line, and it ran like clockwork - i think it has something to do with which lines share tracks with amtrak.
Time to up the game here. Easter open houses, commodities on the rebound- hard- next week, hemmorrhaging banks trying to zonk jumbo borrowers…and the usual financial skulduggery and mayhem. Nobody cares about Pascack Valley or how bad the stench is on some piddling Shore Line train.
In about 7-10 days, my industry will be out of reasons for people to buy a house, and all the flowers will be in full bloom. And if I see that f-ing NAR commercial interrupting my basketball one more f-ing time, I’m gonna squeeze myself thru the coax, find the mf who made it, and snap his neck.
Year number three of no Spring market beckons, and everybody’s pissed off and tapped out. I haven’t dealt with a seller who has one penny of equity in a month of Sundays, and you know what? I’m pissed off, too. You want to “try it at $XXX and see what happens”? Here’s what happens: you’re gonna lose your ass. Hire some embalmed yenta to smear the neighborhood with balloons and sleep on your couch for four hours every Sunday…I’m going to live my life.
The only saving grace about all of this is that my competitors are getting wiped out daily, and I don’t have to spend a penny to help it happen. However, that shallow victory is tempered by the constant, low bleat from the voices of the 20-25 people- lives ruined- whose needs I’m constantly attending.
Oh…almost forgot…go to hell, Dook.
F-ing slow, candy-ass, no-defense losers.
#45 , I LAUGHED MY BUTT OFF!!
Every must be busy w/ March Madness this weekend.
I moved out, under extreme stress, at the age of 18. My mother and older brother were toxic to my mental health :)
I’m at once amazed at the ability for a family to get along, like the Cleavers; and then at the same moment shaking my head in revulsion at the very same idea; it’s just un-American.
Take Xanax. Now THAT’S the American way! :0
Clotpoll [105],
Ahhh…. a profanity-laced tirade. Right up my alley and so fitting to drive a point home. I’m starting to see hints of capitulation. My heart sinks for those who were sucked in through no fault of their own. For all others…. I’ll bite my tongue.
I had a moving company client: I would talk to many people in the company and was always hearing stories of lawn furniture in the huge houses, boxes for tables, no furniture whatsoever, etc.
The moving company employees could tell you some real crazy stories.
A huge SUV in the driveway of a 5 bedroom house with sheets on the windows.
My other half and I would drive around on weekends when we were looking for a house and hated new (and old) developments. New developments would always prompt a “Hey, someone stole your trees!” comment from one of us. It was our little joke.
And how many “bonus rooms” we saw without nary a stick of furniture in them 1 and 2 years after they had been moved into.
Or the houses that opted out of the landscaping packages, PERMANENTLY. Going on 2 years and they still have not a stick of shrubbery, no grass to speak of, not one teeny flower… The mortgage is all they can afford.
Is Blair Academy a nationally recognized elite school?
“Report: Possible new witness in Spitzer case”
“Cecil Suwal, 23, a graduate of the Blair Academy in Warren County, was arrested earlier this month with three others in connection with the suspected Internet prostitution operation and on March 18 was granted bail by a Manhattan federal magistrate-judge. She was charged with conspiracy, transporting women over state lines for sex and money laundering.”
http://njrereport.com/index.php/2008/03/22/weekend-open-discussion-part-ii-15/#comments
I think the real problem with New Jersey is people make “just enough” money to keep it going even though it’s check to check and they have these huge houses they should have never bought to begin with.
I’m so pissed off here, I can barely see straight. I come to read this board and I see this piece of propanda bullshlt in the first two posts on the damn blog. This is a bunch of crap and your azz needs to be tarred and feathered for posting this shlt. Don’t you ever post this sort of crap on any blog. In any country you’ll find a few losers, but how dare cast about this crap trying to portray a situation where people are homeless because they got foreclosed on. This is not happening and you and BBC are trying to act as if you’re doing some damn investigative report on the homeless.
In can you didn’t know it, this is America, damnit. We don’t have massess of people in tent cities. We don’t have a bunch of damn refugees fleeing this country. You’re either an unpatriotic lout or a foreigner trying to stir something up.
yome Says:
March 22nd, 2008 at 7:46 am
american economic refugees flooding into canada.
http://www.chycho.com/?q=node/1631
Happy Easter to all !!
KL
ReTard:
Here is a good website for you.
http://www.walkawayplan.com/
I think the real problem with New Jersey is people make “just enough” money to keep it going even though it’s check to check and they have these huge houses they should have never bought to begin with.
Although the ones I actually feel bad for are the young first time buyers who got a good education, worked hard, got a decent job, but ended up buying some overpriced tiny POS shack in a so-so neighborhood because they believed the “buy now or get priced out forever” BS getting fed to them by friends, family, the media & their realtor.
They stretched, but bought within their means, using a conservative mortgage, which, of course, got them a shack because everyone else only cared about making the teaser payment on an I/O mortgage. They planned to get by in their POS for a few years and trade up to a halfway decent middle class home when they saved enough to do so. They weren’t looking to get rich, only protect themselves from never owning a home.
Now they are underwater. They are stuck in their POS shack making oversized payments, watching as their rising property taxes dash any hopes they had of using their meager raises to pay off their mortgage faster & get out. They won’t go into foreclosure, but rather just keep paying until they can sell without bringing a check to the table.
I have several friends in this situation. I feel almost guilty when I see them, because I tried to talk them out of buying at the time. I know I was right and they know I was right, but I would never bring up the subject.
Truthfully, they would have been better off buying a McMansion with some toxic mortgage. At least they could have lived the good life for a few years, gotten foreclosed on, rebuilt their credit & moved on.
From the Star Ledger:
As indicators point to recession, jittery Jerseyans look for ways to curtail their spending. For many, it means tough choices
The grande mocha, as it turns out, says a lot about the economy.
A few months ago, even before consumer confidence officially began slipping, Lori Mozenter put an end to her regular visits to the local Starbucks, where she would plunk down nearly $4 for a cup of the rich, chocolatey coffee drink.
“I would drag my kids to Barnes & Noble just so I could go to Starbucks,” said Mozenter, a nurse who lives in West Windsor with her husband and kids.
But that was before gasoline costs started eroding her spending money and Wall Street’s bounces began unnerving anyone investing money into a 401(k). “I’m making coffee at home now,” Mozenter said. “It’s not as good, but it’s not as expensive either.”
The weekly numbers streaming out of Washington tell a story of an economy in trouble. Just last week, jobless claims rose and a key economic forecasting index fell for the fifth straight month, suggesting the nation is headed for a recession. The prices of everything from vegetable oil to spaghetti continue to climb, and the near collapse of the investment firm Bear Stearns was another reminder of a new fragility to the financial markets.
Consumer confidence across the country plummeted to 75 last month from 87.3 in January. First-time claims for unemployment benefits increased 22,000 to 378,000 for the week ending March 15. New Jersey has its own dismal numbers: The state said employers cut jobs again in February, bringing the losses for the first two months of the year to more than 10,000.
Those are the official numbers.
On the ground floor of the state’s economy, the unofficial indicators show that consumers are nervous. They’re making hard choices about expenses that suddenly seem to be beyond budgets taxed by soaring gasoline and food prices. The cleaning woman is going, so is the lawn service. Many women are waiting longer to see their hairstylists. And each of those decisions creates another ripple effect, compounding the woes.
There are signs of the economy’s troubles and consumers’ angst everywhere: There is the Cranbury Township man who lost his job with a financial software firm on Wall Street a month ago. Neighborhoods are dotted with “For Sale” signs. There also is the Summit real estate entrepreneur who is experiencing the credit freeze firsthand. Despite a good credit rating, he said it is tougher to get financing these days.
These are signs, too: A retired Monroe Township couple canceled their annual summer vacation, which has amounted to as much as $7,000 in past years. Middle-class families are reconsidering whether they can afford a $650 swim club membership for the kids this summer.
Folks across the state are cutting back on more than their fancy coffee drinks; they are trading in gas-guzzlers, scaling back summer trips and eating in much more often.
Lisa Evans, a single mom from East Windsor who works as an engineer, said last year she ate out two, and often three, nights a week. Now, she limits herself to one night.
From the AP:
Car loan deliquencies on the rise
There aren’t enough hours in a day for Jim Coppo to do his job.
A few years ago, Coppo was repossessing two or three cars on an average day. Today, he tows away eight or nine, and would do more if he had time.
As many Americans struggle with mountainous debt and the threat of losing their homes to foreclosure, others are losing their vehicles at the highest rate in a decade.
“We’ve been watching this over the past several years, and auto loan delinquencies have been steadily getting higher,” said Keith Leggett, a senior economist with the American Bankers Association.
From the Washington Post:
Why We Borrow Until It Hurts
If the subprime mortgage mess has taught us anything, it is that we are leverage addicts. Nearly all of us are — from Northern Virginia, where we bought big houses with no money down, to Wall Street, where traders borrowed cash to make bigger bets on the housing market.
Seeing Zero Percent Interest Until Next Year! on envelopes causes us to tear them open, find the Web address, enter some information and send new credit cards hurtling toward our mailboxes. Financing cars for three years is so passe; we finance them for six or seven. And now we buy — or used to buy — houses with pick-your-payment mortgages. We are leveraged from here to China. U.S. consumers spend more than 14 percent of their after-tax income just to stay current on household debt.
The question worth asking now is: Why do we love leverage so much that it hurts?
#118 We’ve been cutting back too.
At least we have a Keurig so we can use K cups to make better coffee at home for 45 cents a cup. I also saw Peet’s coffee at the local grocery for $8.99 a 12 oz bag and bought a bag. Also much better then going to Starbucks and even cheaper then Kcups.
WE get breakfast from Panera’s once a weekend but no longer order drinks.
A little bit of savings here and there adds up to a lot over the course of the year. Of course if everyone does it adds up to a recession
River Edge Comp Killer
25 Wayne Ave
Purchased: 6/9/2004
Purchase Price: $470,000
MLS# 2500664
Currently Asking: $450,900
Foreclosure - Wachovia
118…..of course she wouldn’t drag her kids to Barnes and Noble so they could buy a book….no that would make too much sense.
…buy a book?
I’m going long libraries.
Interesting that this report comes from Bove. Didn’t he say, just last week, that further writedowns would be “meaningless”?
Damn, I must be really, really poor, because $6,500,000,000 seems like a meaningful number to me.
Bank of America may write down $6.5 billion: analyst
Bank of America Corp. could tally a $6.5 billion provision in the first quarter to cover potential losses in its home equity and mortgage portfolios, Punk Ziegel and Co. analyst Richard Bove was quoted as saying by the Bloomberg news agency.
#114 Reinvestor:
Are you saying Americans moving to Mexico,South America where their Social Security checks can be stretched, because they can not afford living standards,health care here in the US is all a propaganda?The great depression never happened?
I take the news as i see it.I take and learn from what i read.Let’s say it’s a propaganda:Will it hurt to start saving?Keeping some cash at home in case there was a panic withrawals in the banks?
Point is:I do not read to know what is going on.How I can benefit from it.
How many of us comes to this blog just because we are bored?
I have a problem with your depictions. First it’s homeless American refugees invading Canada and now you’re suggesting that they’re are bunches of people immigrating to Mexico. What it amounts to is pushing the notion that there’s some problem here in our great nation that’s creating refugees and I think that’s a bunch of bullshlt.
As I said, there are always a few losers around, but don’t try to act as if these people are representative in any way.
This ain’t the damn 1930’s, no matter how nostalgic you are about hard times (I just can’t figure out why so many people here seem to want the 1930’s to come back). This is 2008, and we have mechanisms to prevent bank runs and the like. Get your head out of the 1930’s and move forward a few decades. Stop posting this damn nonsense.
yome Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 7:37 am
#114 Reinvestor:
Are you saying Americans moving to Mexico,South America where their Social Security checks can be stretched, because they can not afford living standards,health care here in the US is all a propaganda?The great depression never happened?
I take the news as i see it.I take and learn from what i read.Let’s say it’s a propaganda:Will it hurt to start saving?Keeping some cash at home in case there was a panic withrawals in the banks?
Point is:I do not read to know what is going on.How I can benefit from it.
How many of us comes to this blog just because we are bored?
Rich,
What is with the turnover on this place in Glen Rock?
542 Ackerman Ave, Glen Rock NJ
MLS# 2811511
If you trace the history, it shows a very interesting pattern.
Sold: $810,000 on 6/28/2005
Sold: $790,000 on 6/22/2006
Sold: $782,000 on 8/22/2007
Current asking is $789,000. My guess is that it closes below $782k, continuing the trend.
Why the hell is this a good website for me? I don’t need their “service”.
Let me tell you something, Clod, I don’t believe in supporting slacking. If you bought the damn house, I think you should stay right the hell there and pay. This sort of service encourages slacking and non acceptance of responsiblity. Moreover, it’s conspiratorical in the sense that this futher undermines housing prices; something those who are against this country very much desire to do. No one here realizes that, but choose to simply focus on your selfish money grubbing desires to buy a house on the cheap and to see misery befall your fellow Americans.
There’s a day coming where you’ll regret that stance and I’ll be there to remind you.
All Hype Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 12:07 am
ReTard:
Here is a good website for you.
http://www.walkawayplan.com/
I was just thinking here about the credit crunch many here helped to create with the negativity. Do you realize now that even if house prices drop to your desired money grubbing cheapskate level, you may not be able to get a mortgage to get it given tightening credit? Is it possible that you’re still frozen out of buying a house, now because you can’t get a loan?
It’s the law of unintended consequences. Many of you assumed that you’d be able to buy once you forced prices down with negative talk. Now that they’re down, you still can’t buy due to lack of credit.
bc and clot, my 6-yr. old is an early riser and a big fan of infomercials. Something to do with the tone of the voice and kids who have some sensory-seeking stuff going.
So, we have The Shark and other such gadgets she happily uses about the house. She knows the entire infomercial in some cases, and after hearing them once or twice, repeats with precision. She never liked Barbie, anyway.
A couple of years ago, we were often treated to “Need cash for your dream vacation?! Call us at one eight hundred ….” and other heloc/shark mortgage stuff.
Just a heads-up. This week as I was drinking coffee, I heard her confident voice from the living room, “Gold may be the best decision you make for your family..”
I will not disclose my position, since I’ve made no recommendation.
#117…first Happy Easter!!
similar thing happened to me and my friends in late 80″s..maybe not to same degree but after whining for yearws…most of us saved more…spent less..rented our pos condos and bought houses when the prices dropped (1991-1993ish)and eventually sold the condos.
Lesson learned, stay away from real estate in this area!!! We have our primary residence and avoided any visions of granduer during the 2000-2005 run up. ( I did always think how much better everyone else must be doing with all their purchases and houses!!)
#130 reinvestor
If lending standards get so tight that we can’t get a loan for a house we want, who will be able to buy at that price? Not many I would think.
If financially prudent bearish people can’t qualify for a mtg if housing drops 30% peak to trough that will lead to even lower prices don’t you think? Or riots in the streets and mass migrations like the dust bowl. So not qualifying would be a positive thing for me in that scenario.
# 130 reinvestor101 Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 8:18 am
“I was just thinking here about the credit crunch many here helped to create with the negativity.”
So the fact that banks are taking over a hundred billion in charge offs in the last few months due to their lack of oversight in writing and buying loans during this bubble has nothing to do with tightening standards?
Do you really think a few dozen regular posters on this forum could influence the market so much? Why not blame the liberal media? Or the Easter bunny?
Happy Easter, everybody
ReTard (129):
I sent you the website and not Clod. You still do not get it so here it is in a nutshell…
There are not enough buyers left who can qualify for loans for houses at these inflated prices. The banks are insolvent and are not giving out loans except for people with stellar credit.
End of story…..Negative feelings by a bunch of smart and well informed bloggers have nothing to do with the facts.
People are smart for walking away from their houses when they are worth less than their mortgage. Comopanies do it all the time and then “rightsize” headcount accordingly. Homeowners got smart and starting playing the same game with the banks…Easy as that.
And as for the banks, they used to be the stewards of the financial system, ensuring that the money they controlled was properly invested. Now all they really care about is making a buck by leveraging themselves 30:1 on Las Vegas type bets. Boo hoo to them if they are suprised that these “slackers” are walking away from their American Dream.
You are just on the losing end of the bet so get used to it.
And here is another important website for you:
http://www.homefreeme.com/
134 bairen
He does blame the “liberal media”.
Reinvestor
“Many of you assumed that you’d be able to buy once you forced prices down with negative talk. Now that they’re down, you still can’t buy due to lack of credit.”
Speak for yourself.
#137 So the Easter bunny is in the clear?
I try to ignore reinvestor 101 but post #130 was too annoying.
First Happy Easter to all.
Not in any way to agree with RE 101 it would be strange to me to think that the main stream media doesn’t have a liberal bias.I watch in dismay at reporters who are supposed to be reporting the news put their ideological spin on it.The majority of the intellectual elite in the media are very liberal & it shows in the reporting.To
think other wise would be ignoring the bias because you agree with it.Lets not throw liberal media around like it doesn’t exist
because it does.
Reinvestor
129
The law and reality both find you irrelevant. I find you an object of humor.
njp 141 Agreed the entertainment value is great.LOL or shaking my head the reinvestor always delivers.
Ben Stein on CBS this morning says the fed will save us with all the greenbacks infused into the system and we’ll be “back to living like drunken sailors”…Happy Easter!
Mike (142): Agreed, he is entertaining. He really doesn not get it.
I bet he is a die hard Fox news fan, LOL!
You either agree with me or you don’t. Don’t try to distance yourself from the proper views I express. No need to qualify the damn truth
Mikeinwaiting Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 9:52 am
First Happy Easter to all.
Not in any way to agree with RE 101 it would be strange to me to think that the main stream media doesn’t have a liberal bias.I watch in dismay at reporters who are supposed to be reporting the news put their ideological spin on it.The majority of the intellectual elite in the media are very liberal & it shows in the reporting.To
think other wise would be ignoring the bias because you agree with it.Lets not throw liberal media around like it doesn’t exist
because it does.
Clod,
Stop the bobbing, weaving and hiding behind a new handle just because you embarrassed yourself.
All Hype Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 10:29 am
Mike (142): Agreed, he is entertaining. He really doesn not get it.
I bet he is a die hard Fox news fan, LOL!
You annoy me. I gotta run right now, but I’ll be back to deal with you and your attitude. Terrorist.
bairen Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 9:47 am
#137 So the Easter bunny is in the clear?
I try to ignore reinvestor 101 but post #130 was too annoying.
Whitney Tilson : Housing far from over
http://vinvesting.com/whitney-tilson-housing-far-over
Whitney Tilson of T2 partners appeared on CNBC fast money and commented on the housing market.
ReTard,
Seriously, I am not Clod. Have fun spending the day watching Fox news.
Don’t miss this one either.
Here is the T2 article that Alan Abelson mentioned in Barrons:
http://www.valueinvestingcongress.com/pdf/T2Partners_mortgages_bond.pdf
Apparently the FICO score is being tweaked to give more weight to consumers who have used different types of credit. Also a blemish on your record won’t be as bad if you have been current with your accounts in the recent past. It’s a video news story from Yahoo news:
http://www.yahoo.com/s/839612
I know that employers routinely check credit on potential new hires. Does anyone here know of lousy credit preventing someone from getting a job? Something to think about before you unload your mansion on http://www.walkawayplan.com and carpet-bomb your credit for the next decade. Assuming that there are any jobs left to apply for.
Why do you hate Americans so much REInvestor?
Pat 131- Was your offspring a parrot?
#143 Essex
Ben Stein also said we are certainly not heading into a depression so…. I guess that pretty much ensures we are gonna have one.
Ben wrote in January 2007: “So, yes, real estate rules. It’s a good, even great, investment ….”
Ben needs to use some of those eyedrops that he is constantly hawking for it appears his eyes are sealed tightly closed.
“Just a heads-up. This week as I was drinking coffee, I heard her confident voice from the living room, “Gold may be the best decision you make for your family..”
Pat,
She’s more polished that most ANAL-ysts on the street. Maybe it was just a hint, no more dollars for allowance, she wants gold. Hell, the dollar is frowned upon by Gisele, why should your daughter accept it?
Reinvestor 101:
It is so glad to see you (edit) here.
My money is not yours. I will buy on my term, not on yours. Go home to wash your dirty mouth and your ugly (edit )!!
Happy Easter to all.
Stu,
Thank for that T2 link.
Reinvestor 101:
You are not welcomed here.
If you want to say something, use fact and data!!! Don’t use your slick mouth!!! No boday want to listen to your (edit)!!!
You are a joke!!!
RE,
There are so many things wrong with your arguments that a response is overwhelmingly difficult.
#127-”I have a problem with your depictions. First it’s homeless American refugees invading Canada and now you’re suggesting that they’re are bunches of people immigrating to Mexico. What it amounts to is pushing the notion that there’s some problem here in our great nation that’s creating refugees and I think that’s a bunch of bullshlt.”
There is some problem in our great nation. It is the increase in the separation between the haves and the have nots. Besides our two decades of diminishing wages and ethanol fueled inflation, our gov’t has decided to bail out the wealthy and let those losers who committed to loans they couldn’t afford rot. The bailout of Bear Stearns is just one example of this behavior. There is about 600 billion dollars worth of other bail out the wealthy, but paid for by the masses initiated so far this year and we are not even close to it being over.
“As I said, there are always a few losers around, but don’t try to act as if these people are representative in any way.”
There will be no less than 2 million foreclosed homes in this country by the end of next year. I have a feeling that quite a number of these people will consider emigrating as our government continues to bail out the wealthy.
“This ain’t the damn 1930’s, no matter how nostalgic you are about hard times (I just can’t figure out why so many people here seem to want the 1930’s to come back). This is 2008, and we have mechanisms to prevent bank runs and the like. Get your head out of the 1930’s and move forward a few decades. Stop posting this damn nonsense.”
This damn nonsense is becoming more and more of a reality every day. These so called “mechanisms” to prevent bank runs are the same kind of mechanisms put in place to protect investment banks. Do some research and see what percentage of your deposit is held in safety. Last time I checked the FDIC insurance simply ensures that a bank has from 6-10% capitalization. If all of the banks fail simultaneously, then you’ll get back 6-10% of your deposit unless of course, the money presses are fired up again.
RE 130 - “I was just thinking here about the credit crunch many here helped to create with the negativity. Do you realize now that even if house prices drop to your desired money grubbing cheapskate level, you may not be able to get a mortgage to get it given tightening credit? Is it possible that you’re still frozen out of buying a house, now because you can’t get a loan?”
RE, we do not all suffer like you must. I’m 760, my wife is at 780 and if any of the long term readers of this board followed any of the advice given here, they too probably have good credit.
“It’s the law of unintended consequences. Many of you assumed that you’d be able to buy once you forced prices down with negative talk. Now that they’re down, you still can’t buy due to lack of credit.”
Negative talk does not create a bear economy ya moron. Actually, sentiment usually follows the reporting of negative economic news. It was all of those foolish home buyers who leveraged themselves to the hilt that created this bear economy. When will the sheeple realize that there is no such thing as a free lunch?
RE 145 -”You either agree with me or you don’t. Don’t try to distance yourself from the proper views I express. No need to qualify the damn truth”
Well I unequivocally disagree with you. To call your views ‘proper’ is simply fascist in nature, but not surprising. Through history, many other great fascists were also convinced they were right. Problem is, none of them proved to be.
And WE are the terrorists?
“It’s the law of unintended consequences. Many of you assumed that you’d be able to buy once you forced prices down with negative talk. Now that they’re down, you still can’t buy due to lack of credit.”
50.5,
This is better than what the Easter Bunny delivered.
If you have 20-50% to put down it’s a free gift. Falling prices and the red carpet rolled out at the lending window. On the flip side, if you don’t have a dp, also consider this a gift. Hopefully you’ll be denied credit since you’ll be presented with lower prices next year.
Come to think of it, the only individuals screwed in your scenario are present sellers and those whose net worth is tied up in a sinking rat hole. Eliminate subprime and Alt-A, approx 40% of the 2005&2006 market, along with a weakening economy, higher inventory and bearish sentiment and you have a recipe for disaster. Seller to Realtor, “I need to sell fast”. Realtor to seller. “Sell”? “Sell to whom”?.
There is a glimmer of hope. Since the fed just opened the window to primary dealers, there is a chance that they will now open it to those stuck with a depreciating 4 walls and a roof. The law of unintended consequences? The law that I abide by; Don’t not fight the tape.
Back to the Easter Bunny.
Reinvestor 101:
You are not welcomed here. People here share ideas and data!!! You are a joke!!! Who can benefit from your bullshit?? Not the buyers!!! Not the Sellers. You are irrelevant here. GET OUT!!!!
I have a house already and try to buy another one for investing!!!! I know both sides of buyers and sellers. As an owner, I want my house value go up; as a buyer and investor, I want to buy low. However you have to be rational for either roles.
If you want to say something, use fact and data!!! Don’t use your slick mouth!!! Who cares about your useless words??? Sell something else!!! No body want to listen to your (edit)!!!
Now that they’re down, you still can’t buy due to lack of credit.
I have great credit, a respectable DP saved, a stable job & intend to buy within my means. If I can’t get credit, I’m not in trouble; sellers are.
BC Bob,
No problem. Pretty factual stuff in that PDF. And T2 are value minded. Funny to see them think we are less than a third of the way out of the housing debacle. Value investors tend to be too early to the prom.
Reinvestor 101:
Last week, George Bush said that we should not stand in the way of the correction in the housing market. He said that taking action to artificially prop up prices would only prolong the problem.
Is he now a “housing terrorist” too?
Finally something is being done about illegal immigration in NJ. Government at work, what a surprise.
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/23/nyregion/23immig.html
From the T2 PDF:
The Timing Indicates That We Are Still in the Early Stages of the Bursting of the Great Mortgage Bubble
• Mortgage lending standards became progressively worse starting in 2000, but really went off a cliff beginning in early 2005
• The worst loans are those with two-year teaser rates. As the subsequent pages show, they are defaulting at unprecedented rates, especially once the
interest rates reset• Such loans made in Q1 2005 started to default in high numbers inQ1 2007,
which not surprisingly was the beginning of the current crises• The crisis has continued to worsen as even lower quality loans made over
the remainder of 2005 reset over the course of 2007, triggering more and more defaults
• It takes an average of 15 months from the date of the first missed payment by a homeowner to a liquidation (generally a sale via auction) of the home
• Thus, the Q1 2005 loans that defaulted in Q1 2007 are leading toforeclosures and auctions in early 2008
• Given that lending standards got much worse in late 2005, through 2006 and into the first half of 2007, there are sobering implicationsfor expected
defaults, foreclosures and auctions in 2008 and 2009, which promise to drive home prices down dramatically
In summary, today we are only seeing the tip of the iceberg: an enormous wave of defaults, foreclosures and auctions is just
beginning to hit the United States. We believe it will get so bad that large-scale federal government intervention is likely.
Credit crunch has been covered for at least three months. We talked about it here. Glad to be sitting it our right now and not soliciting additional credit, Methinks if you have some cash and decent credit you are in the driver’s seat regardless of what trolls here say.
82,
I commuted on the Raritan Valley Line (Fanwood) from 2000 through 2006 into downtown NYC (via Path - WTC). There was maybe one significant delay per year. I remember hearing more complaints from people in other parts of NY state or NJ. The main drawback is that one must switch trains in Newark Penn Station, but I eventually got used to it. For midtown from Scotch Plains/Fanwood, the bus is more convenient and faster.
clott,
wow, its starting to sound like a lot more people are taking the financial Mad max view looking at this weekends comments. Have we rubbed off????
Kettle1,
Will you be purchasing a ticket for the reinvestor vs. Clotpoll match in the Thunderdome?
“MasterBednar run Bubbletown!”
has anyone else noticed that the international press has a much more indepth coverage of the credit crunch in the US???
A lot of the international press seems to take the general view that we are TOAST
Stu
front row seat my friend
OT, but tangentially relevant
recently came across a quote that the US needs to take to heart,
“You are too prejudiced. You do not let your eyes see nor your ears hear, and that which is outside your daily life is not of account to you. Do you not think that there are things which you cannot understand, and yet which are? That some people see things that others cannot? … There are always mysteries in life.”
official media outlooks 1927 - 1933
Website has chart you may find interesting…
http://tinyurl.com/wfxu
1. “We will not have any more crashes in our time.”
- John Maynard Keynes in 1927
2. “I cannot help but raise a dissenting voice to statements that we are living in a fool’s paradise, and that prosperity in this country must necessarily diminish and recede in the near future.”
- E. H. H. Simmons, President, New York Stock Exchange, January 12, 1928
“There will be no interruption of our permanent prosperity.”
- Myron E. Forbes, .President, Pierce Arrow Motor Car Co., January 12, 1928
3. “No Congress of the United States ever assembled, on surveying the state of the Union, has met with a more pleasing prospect than that which appears at the present time. In the domestic field there is tranquility and contentment…and the highest record of years of prosperity. In the foreign field there is peace, the goodwill which comes from mutual understanding.”
- Calvin Coolidge December 4, 1928
4. “There may be a recession in stock prices, but not anything in the nature of a crash.”
- Irving Fisher, leading U.S. economist , New York Times, Sept. 5, 1929
5. “Stock prices have reached what looks like a permanently high plateau. I do not feel there will be soon if ever a 50 or 60 point break from present levels, such as (bears) have predicted. I expect to see the stock market a good deal higher within a few months.”
- Irving Fisher, Ph.D. in economics, Oct. 17, 1929
“This crash is not going to have much effect on business.”
- Arthur Reynolds, Chairman of Continental Illinois Bank of Chicago, October 24, 1929
“There will be no repetition of the break of yesterday… I have no fear of another comparable decline.”
- Arthur W. Loasby (President of the Equitable Trust Company), quoted in NYT, Friday, October 25, 1929
“We feel that fundamentally Wall Street is sound, and that for people who can afford to pay for them outright, good stocks are cheap at these prices.”
- Goodbody and Company market-letter quoted in The New York Times, Friday, October 25, 1929
6. “This is the time to buy stocks. This is the time to recall the words of the late J. P. Morgan… that any man who is bearish on America will go broke. Within a few days there is likely to be a bear panic rather than a bull panic. Many of the low prices as a result of this hysterical selling are not likely to be reached again in many years.”
- R. W. McNeel, market analyst, as quoted in the New York Herald Tribune, October 30, 1929
“Buying of sound, seasoned issues now will not be regretted”
- E. A. Pearce market letter quoted in the New York Herald Tribune, October 30, 1929
“Some pretty intelligent people are now buying stocks… Unless we are to have a panic — which no one seriously believes, stocks have hit bottom.”
- R. W. McNeal, financial analyst in October 1929
7. “The decline is in paper values, not in tangible goods and services…America is now in the eighth year of prosperity as commercially defined. The former great periods of prosperity in America averaged eleven years. On this basis we now have three more years to go before the tailspin.”
- Stuart Chase (American economist and author), NY Herald Tribune, November 1, 1929
“Hysteria has now disappeared from Wall Street.”
- The Times of London, November 2, 1929
“The Wall Street crash doesn’t mean that there will be any general or serious business depression… For six years American business has been diverting a substantial part of its attention, its energies and its resources on the speculative game… Now that irrelevant, alien and hazardous adventure is over. Business has come home again, back to its job, providentially unscathed, sound in wind and limb, financially stronger than ever before.”
- Business Week, November 2, 1929
“…despite its severity, we believe that the slump in stock prices will prove an intermediate movement and not the precursor of a business depression such as would entail prolonged further liquidation…”
- Harvard Economic Society (HES), November 2, 1929
8. “… a serious depression seems improbable; [we expect] recovery of business next spring, with further improvement in the fall.”
- HES, November 10, 1929
“The end of the decline of the Stock Market will probably not be long, only a few more days at most.”
- Irving Fisher, Professor of Economics at Yale University, November 14, 1929
“In most of the cities and towns of this country, this Wall Street panic will have no effect.”
- Paul Block (President of the Block newspaper chain), editorial, November 15, 1929
“Financial storm definitely passed.”
- Bernard Baruch, cablegram to Winston Churchill, November 15, 1929
9. “I see nothing in the present situation that is either menacing or warrants pessimism… I have every confidence that there will be a revival of activity in the spring, and that during this coming year the country will make steady progress.”
- Andrew W. Mellon, U.S. Secretary of the Treasury December 31, 1929
“I am convinced that through these measures we have reestablished confidence.”
- Herbert Hoover, December 1929
“[1930 will be] a splendid employment year.”
- U.S. Dept. of Labor, New Year’s Forecast, December 1929
10. “For the immediate future, at least, the outlook (stocks) is bright.”
- Irving Fisher, Ph.D. in Economics, in early 1930
11. “…there are indications that the severest phase of the recession is over…”
- Harvard Economic Society (HES) Jan 18, 1930
12. “There is nothing in the situation to be disturbed about.”
- Secretary of the Treasury Andrew Mellon, Feb 1930
13. “The spring of 1930 marks the end of a period of grave concern…American business is steadily coming back to a normal level of prosperity.”
- Julius Barnes, head of Hoover’s National Business Survey Conference, Mar 16, 1930
“… the outlook continues favorable…”
- HES Mar 29, 1930
14. “… the outlook is favorable…”
- HES Apr 19, 1930
15. “While the crash only took place six months ago, I am convinced we have now passed through the worst — and with continued unity of effort we shall rapidly recover. There has been no significant bank or industrial failure. That danger, too, is safely behind us.”
- Herbert Hoover, President of the United States, May 1, 1930
“…by May or June the spring recovery forecast in our letters of last December and November should clearly be apparent…”
- HES May 17, 1930
“Gentleman, you have come sixty days too late. The depression is over.”
- Herbert Hoover, responding to a delegation requesting a public works program to help speed the recovery, June 1930
16. “… irregular and conflicting movements of business should soon give way to a sustained recovery…”
- HES June 28, 1930
17. “… the present depression has about spent its force…”
- HES, Aug 30, 1930
18. “We are now near the end of the declining phase of the depression.”
- HES Nov 15, 1930
19. “Stabilization at [present] levels is clearly possible.”
- HES Oct 31, 1931
20. “All safe deposit boxes in banks or financial institutions have been sealed… and may only be opened in the presence of an agent of the I.R.S.”
- President F.D. Roosevelt, 1933
take a look, this sounds awfully familiar…
Official media outlooks on the Great Depression: 1927-1933
http://tinyurl.com/wfxu
sorry for all the multiple posts, my PC went nuts on me!!!!!
regarding the debate on whether living with parents as an adult is a good idea, Bru’s post from the prior thread says it all:
“Regarding the financial adviser who mentions how parents should stop subsidizing their kids: I wonder what she thinks about those girls who live fabulous Manhattan lives while working for low-paying jobs like PR and magazines. All my parents provide me with is a a roof over my head (along with theirs).”
Everyone needs to grow up at some point. The longer it takes you to become self-sufficient, the more difficult it will be in the end. Nothing more annoying than someone (man or woman) who has the mentality of a child well into his/her 30s or beyond.
The main problem with the media is they are not grounded in reality. The job requirement for those positions should be changed to require three years in a Turkish Prison on their resumes. Then possibly you could get unbiased reporting.
REinvestor 101:
“You’re either an unpatriotic lout or a foreigner trying to stir something up.”
Stop calling yourself a patriotic American and blame others as unpatriotic or foreigner. WE are Americans too. This country is ruined by such big mouthers like you who are arrogant and stupid.
” Many of you assumed that you’d be able to buy once you forced prices down with negative talk. Now that they’re down, you still can’t buy due to lack of credit.”
Dear Reinvestor 101: Talk with your fellow CNBC and WSJ reports, who are really talking down the prices. Markets force the price down, not you and me!!! A real American is a true captilist and believer of true market force. Stop clainming you are a patriotic American.
Sorry to tell you I have two houses under my name. How many do you own?
“You either agree with me or you don’t. Don’t try to distance yourself from the proper views I express. No need to qualify the damn truth”
Thank you. There is no black or white in this world. I don’t have to agree with you or do not agree with you. I will ignore you because you are not a real American nor a real free market people. All you have are those crazy mnationalism. You better go back to Nazy Gemany to get your citizenship.
“This is 2008, and we have mechanisms to prevent bank runs and the like. Get your head out of the 1930’s and move forward a few decades. Stop posting this damn nonsense.”
Dear Reinvestor 101: Who are “we”? What “machanism” you are talking? You are talking all those things made up by all those Jews who are controlling the government and finanical institutions? You are taking about you as American? You are one of those Jews who are deserted everywhere in this world but USA.
The Subprime Crisis is Just Starting
by Daniel R. Amerman, CFA | March 20, 2008
http://www.financialsense.com/fsu/editorials/amerman/2008/0320.html
Alex,
ignore Re101 he is GRADE A TROLL
“What Created This Monster?”
http://www.nytimes.com/2008/03/23/business/23how.html?_r=1&ref=business&oref=slogin
Let’s go easy on 50.5. How would you feel if you had buyer’s boot marks all over your face?
BC Bob,
are you suggesting that this:
http://tinyurl.com/3bwkdw
might be Re101?
or perhaps this??
http://www.nypost.com/news/2006photos/photo13.jpg
Re101 about to meet the market?
Kettle,
Could not say it any better than that.
my creativity for the day
http://i304.photobucket.com/albums/nn184/asdwerty/housing08.jpg
188
Nice job Kettle.
Kettle,
Keep it coming. I’m hiding on the backstreets; to borrow one from BOOYAAAA, a half moaning scream.
#188
Who is that? That looks like a spanish soccer jersey to me..,
[191],
Spitzer, in college, dreaming of his future as Client # 9.
Reinvestor,
I personally know both All Hype and Clot.
They are not the same person.
You are mistaken.
Probably not the first time you’ve heard that though.
sl
Looks like a Bear Sterns Partner who owns multiple houses purchased in 2005 with no money down and the mtgs are backed by the value of his BSC stock.
Perfect Storm
“Fed’s bold moves: Band-Aid or breakthrough?”
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cgi?file=/c/a/2008/03/23/MNOMVOG0E.DTL
#195
“To my mind, the best thing that could happen would be for the (housing) bubble to deflate more quickly,” said Dean Baker, co-director of the Center for Economic and Policy Research in Washington. “Instead they’re coming up with crazy schemes to get more money to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac to expand lending. That will keep (home) prices inflated.”
This guy should be on running the FED instead of Helicopter Bergabe
Syb and Kettle -
Are you guys soccer fans as well? I have two major time sinks in my life right now: this board and my Premier League fantasy team.
#197
Not as much as I used to be years ago.
Jmac
a casual fan, its the only big league sport i watch
still_looking:
Give me a call later in the week so we can catch up.
I told you guys I had to go to celebrate Easter with my family and a number of you chose to skewer me when I wasn’t around to respond. I don’t appreciate that low down underhanded type of crap. There’s too many damn attacks here to respond to each one or I’d be here all damn day. Tell you what, the next damn time you guys decided to attack me, elect one damn spokesman so I can deal with him rather than 15 different damn people.
Alex, you want to jump bad huh? Let me tell you something son, you have no idea who you’re messing with. Pantywaists like you and Stu like to talk a lot of shlt behind a keyboard, I’d like to see what you have to say in person. I’d like to see what you’d have to say when confronted with a good opportunity to buy a house. You’ll punk out crying about it’s “too expensive” or the “market is crashing”. You’d rather run through hell in gasoline underdrawers than to step up to the plate and invest. Punk.
Now as to the comments some of you seem to be moaning about. The credit crunch is an unintended consequence for you housing terrorists. You thought that all you’d have to do is undermine the real estate markets so you’d be able to buy on the cheap. Well guess what, that won’t happen because many of you won’t be able to get a loan now unless you’re willing to part with your first born….and that assumes that the bank is even willing to take only your first born. The bottom line is that many won’t be able to finance a house at all. That’s what you get for wishing ill will on your fellow citizens.
Stu, I’m not going to provide you with a damn bib and diapers while you bitch and moan about the government not wanting to provide your azz some cheese. You’re a dyed in the wool liberal and rather than work for your own damn cheese, you want big government to buy you a damn house. Let me tell you something, it’s time to grow up and realize that that sort of liberalism is dead and stinking. Goverment is supposed to look out for critical interests that benefit us all rather than the little things that your cheapskate azz wants. This means that the primary role of government is to protect us militarily and economically. The latter function was exhibited by the recent actions to address the Bear Sterns problems as well as the liquidity problems of investment banking in general. This is a proper government function that ultimately trickles down to help you. Unfortunately, you don’t want that sort of help.
I’m not done with you Stu. I’ll be back to respond to that rambling diatribe you posted.
reinvestor101 Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 5:44 pm
“Pantywaists like you and Stu like to talk a lot of shlt behind a keyboard”
“Alex, you want to jump bad huh? Let me tell you something son, you have no idea who you’re messing with.”
“I’d like to see what you have to say in person. I’d like to see what you’d have to say when confronted with a good opportunity to buy a house. You’ll punk out crying about it’s “too expensive” or the “market is crashing”. You’d rather run through hell in gasoline underdrawers than to step up to the plate and invest. Punk.”
reinvestor101:
It’s gonna be along nite for you my friend. You gotta write a lot of responses to all those people who disrespected you. Better fire up a large pot of coffee.
Re101,
maybe you should show up at the next get together and you and see if all of us real estate terrorists still talk the talk
Re101,
maybe you should show up at the next get together and you can and see if all of us real estate terrorists still talk the talk
#204
Fat chance.
pantywaist101 Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 5:44 pm
“Pantywaists like you and Stu like to talk a lot of shlt behind a keyboard”
Dear Reinvestor 101: Who are “we”? What “machanism” you are talking? You are talking all those things made up by all those Jews who are controlling the government and finanical institutions? You are taking about you as American? You are one of those Jews who are deserted everywhere in this world but USA.
What the hell? I’m just reading this crap and son, let me tell you something, I’m having real problems with you. Just where the hell do you get off making a racist remark like this? Call me what you want, but I’ve never ever made a racist remark on this board at any time. It’s time for a damn fact check to deal with this however. This ought to be interesting since you’ve demanded facts from me. On what factual basis are you making the claim above? BTW, I’m not Jewish.
I couldn’t make the last gtg because I had a previous commitment. I’ll be there next time and I’ll be bringing my investor friends as well. I’d like to see all the terrorists who post here so I know who I’m dealing with.
kettle1 Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 6:02 pm
Re101,
maybe you should show up at the next get together and you can and see if all of us real estate terrorists still talk the talk
Stu,
Your new handle fits you well!
Liberal Unpatriotic Anti-Housing Terrorist Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 6:01 pm
reinvestor101:
It’s gonna be along nite for you my friend. You gotta write a lot of responses to all those people who disrespected you. Better fire up a large pot of coffee.
reinvestor101:
I am not Stu. Once again you are wrong. But you will need a large pot of coffee to get thru all these negative posts.
look forward to meeting you RE101 :)
i would also like at add this quote:
“We will not have any more crashes in our time.”
- John Maynard Keynes in 1927
think about the timing of that statemtn!
Grim,
can we change the name of this blog to:
NJ Real estate Jihadist report???
reinvestor101:
All joking aside, I would like to meet your friends as they would have some interesting insight on how to make money. I am always up for hearing for other ways to make some extra money.
#213
They probably have some real good recipes for ramen too!
Sybarite Says (213):
I welcome all ideas. RE101 seems pretty sure of his investments, so let’s hear what he and his posse has to say.
“RE101 seems pretty sure of his investments”
As did the flippers who are now crying for a bailout/bigger window.
Pat (131)-
Har! Your kid is channeling some good stuff. :)
Hype (136)-
Some nice haymakers there. Too bad you’re punching a pumpkin.
“As did the flippers who are now crying for a bailout/bigger window”.
Totally agree. I was just wondering if he had any other non-real estate investment strategies.
#215
All I hear from RE is a lot of whining and rhetoric.
Essex (143)-
Ben Stein is a living example of why putting people in stocks and chains in the town square should be reinstituted.
Tard (146)-
Sorry, Hype isn’t me. Spent my day outdoors, pretending I have a life. Now about to watch Chelsea v. Arsenal on the Tivo. Didn’t even bother to check the Carolina game…my guess is, they jumped all over Arkansas. If they didn’t, I lost a ton of money and don’t want to find out ’til tomorrow, anyway.
God, you’re stupid.
Clot,
You made a ton.
vodka (170)-
My black box keeps telling me Mad Max is the likely outcome of this ultimate Monte Carlo sim. I keep changing the inputs and assumptions, but the results come up the same.
BC (223)-
Yipee!
Stu (171)-
Two men enter; one man leaves.
Syb (206)-
Just like Grim has always maintained:
Blog trolls never show up for get-togethers.
mac (197)-
Got Cristiano Ronaldo on your team? Gotta think whoever has him or Torres has got your league wrapped up.
Tard (208)-
“I couldn’t make the last gtg because I had a previous commitment…”
Surfing p@rn and neo-Fascist websites isn’t everyone’s idea of “previous commitment”.
Just saying.
Existing home sales due out tomorrow morning, should make for an interesting Monday.
I predict the number will suck, and the stock markets will rally on the news.
/sarcasm
From MSNBC:
Home equity loans drying up for some
Like many homeowners during the housing boom, Lynnette Madden and her husband decided to open a home equity line of credit about a year and a half ago as “padding” for emergency expenses and a cushion for Madden’s commission-based real estate career. The couple, who live in Bakersfield, Calif., never paid the bill late and never drew more than $14,000 in debt from the line’s $100,000 credit limit.
That’s why Madden was surprised when Countrywide sent her a letter in late January stating that the couple’s home equity line was “suspended” and they could no longer use it. The reason? Their home, the letter stated, had declined in value and thus the couple no longer had the amount of equity they did when they opened the line.
“I went ballistic,” Madden says. “I could understand it if we missed a payment or maxed it out, but we’ve been responsible.”
CLott,
would you mind sharing what your idea of a coming crash would look like? financial only (i.e great depression II), financial and some social breakdown, or do you really go for the all out end of society mad max version? how do you see any crash progressing?
RE…You are a bonafide moron.
You spew more krap than an elephant suffering from diarrhea.
It must really suck to be on the wrong side of the worst performing sector in the market. Especially when you begin to realize that we are probably less than a third of the way down. If I were you, I would be spending more time figuring out how to bail out of your poorly performing investments rather than trying to change the minds of a few bloggers who have been on the ‘proper’ side of the trade.
Now I must catch the 3rd part of John Adams on HBO. Rest assured RE, I will be hoping the Red Coats kick our ass. My lack of patriotism has me unsure of how this story ends. Perhaps with a large shipment of government cheese to the colonies? I can only hope.
Moron.
Oh, and one more thing RE.
Don’t waste your time responding to me. I find no value in your rantings and would be more inclined to take advice from a serious sex offender.
This topped the news in the local Chambersburg paper over the weekend
Welcome to Public Opinion - Chambersburg, PA
Pig lungs clog I-81
By NATALIE WILLIS Staff writer
It took more than six hours to clean up 38,000 pounds of pig lungs after a tractor trailer crashed and spilled the mess on Interstate 81 at 1 a.m. Thursday.
The accident occurred at mile marker 28, between two Shippensburg exits — King Street and Fayette Street — when the driver of a tractor trailer traveling north on I-81, “blacked out” before entering the median strip, according to Pennsylvania State Police, Carlisle.
Police said the truck driven by James Alton Barbour, 32, Four Oaks, N.C., went through the median strip and crossed both southbound lanes before hitting a dirt embankment on the western side of I-81. The trailer flipped onto its side, spilling the load of pig lungs.
Barbour was treated at Chambersburg Hospital for a minor injury to his left arm, police said, and the southbound lanes of the interstate were closed for several hours, reopening at 7:45 a.m.
A front-end loader was used to pick up the mess of lungs, blood and mud, which were hauled away in a different truck, said Public Information Officer, Tpr. Karl Schmidhamer. He was told the pig lungs were going to be used for dog food and not considered hazardous waste.
Nick Moxley at Vigilant Hose Company said the fire department’s engines were dispatched to clean up mud and blood from the spill.
“We stayed there cleaning up until complete,” he said.
172 kettle
Yes - I’ve noticed the same.
FX Manipulation on tap…..
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aApFo4qYpFes&refer=us
vodka (233)-
It looks like the book I’ve been raving about here for a few weeks: Love in the Ruins, by Walker Percy. I’ve loved it since I read it almost 30 years ago, but I figured the breakdown of society he depicted was more metaphorical than literal.
However, the more current events unfold, the more Percy’s description of the breakdown of everything seems ominously prescient…from the first sentence of the book, to the last.
I don’t necessarily see a Depression-style thing playing out, nor do I believe we’re going to get a Mad Max/Thunderdome denouement to this mess. I think it’s far more likely that the physical breakdown of infrastructure and concurrent spritual/moral/Zeitgeist erosion will be met with equal and separate waves of ennui, apathy and denial.
This might be the first serious recession in history that occurs in an environment in which 75% of all Americans don’t even realize it’s happening.
The fact that I-81 was so smeared with pig lungs that it had to be shut down may strike many as an odd, random event that holds no mirror to the world at large.
To somebody who’s read a lot of Ayn Rand or Walker Percy (or listened to too much Pink Floyd), it’s a harbinger of the complete breakdown of everything.
I guess Depeche Mode could be included in #240. They’re sort of a Gen-X version of Pink Floyd…
Alex Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 1:10 pm
“Dear Reinvestor 101: Who are “we”? What “machanism” you are talking? You are talking all those things made up by all those Jews who are controlling the government and finanical institutions? You are taking about you as American? You are one of those Jews who are deserted everywhere in this world but USA.”
EXCUSE ME!!!! WTF!!??!!
This is just as offensive and racist as it gets. And you are calling a common or garden troll offensive and dirty mouthed? I DARE you to show up anywhere I will ever be.
clott,
i would be interested in discussing your comments abit more if are so inclined, get my e-mail from grim if you wouldnt mind, as this may not be the forum.
vodka (243)-
Will reach out tomorrow. Suffice it to say that when I get wound up on this topic, I can get going. You may be begging me to stop after a while.
Funny, that Gil Scott-Heron song about the revolution not being televised. I think the revolution is being televised, 24/7, and we’re so hypnotized, jaded and stoned by cathode rays, we either don’t care or can’t see it all happening in real time.
Disclaimer: a friend of mine- who is a shrink- also tells me that my kind of thinking is also commonly displayed by paranoid schizophrenics.
soosh (242)-
I’d pay good money to watch you open up a can of whoop on this loser.
Clot(244) - Although I could never put it to words quite as gracefully, you are not at all alone in your thoughts. You, Ket, and some others seem to see things in the same light, for what that seems to be worth these days.
Wag (246)-
“You, Ket, and some others seem to see things in the same light, for what that seems to be worth these days.”
And, a sociologist might just tell you that it’s an early symptom of mass hysteria within a self-selected host environment.
Ket,
“Chance favors the prepared mind.” — Louis Pasteur.
Clot - An Israeli journalist was in Russia once. Met an old babushka and asked her about the Jews. She went on and on with similar BS. He told her “you’re really brave telling me all this”. “Why?” she asked. “Well” he answered, “if they are really so connected and rich and control everything, I’d imagine they are watching you right now, listening to every word you say, and making plans”.
Scared the cr@p out of the supertitious old bird.
If you are going to be a member of an all knowing, all powerful cabal there might as well be SOME benefit.
Problem solved when Ben buys all the bad mortgages;
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=akhm.v.Wd1YQ&refer=home
lisoosh Read that post was wondering when someone was going to hammer Alex at first I thought I read it wrong & was going to ask what he/she meant then I read`it again.I should have put it to him right then & there but got called away from keyboard.No place for that here to any group or religion. Bully for you.
201 reinvestor
“Pantywaists like you and Stu like to talk a lot of shlt behind a keyboard, I’d like to see what you have to say in person.”
I’ll meet you for lunch, pencil-neck.
“
Reinvestor
“I couldn’t make the last gtg because I had a previous commitment. I’ll be there next time”
I can’t wait to see you. I’m easy to find: I’m the guy who weighs 265 pounds.
242 lisoosh
I missed that (didn’t read that post as had determined that the poster can’t write) but you’re 100% right (_obviously_). Alex is far worse than reinvestor.
Bigot, plain and tall.
And ’soosh, you get a ten point bonus for fitting the phrase “common or garden” in that post.
Patient - 265 muscle or 265 gut?
Mike - cheers.
‘Soosh
Plenty of each. Still can toss up 200 on the bench a few times despite being a professional desk jockey.
Also love wine and chocolate and pasta.
Clot (228)
Our league works with a budget rather than a draft, and you are free to churn your roster each week if you want to. Player values are determined by position (strikers generally cost more than midfield, defense, or GK) and recent performance. If you buy a player, and his value rockets, the purchase price counts against your budget as opposed to the market value so in a lot of cases it might make sense to keep a player through a bye week, suspension, or short injury.
Sure enough, the dude ruling our league bought Torres early on for 12 pounds. Torres now costs 26 on the open market — the salary cap is 100 pounds so you’d blow a quarter of your budget on him. He’s a player worth keeping through a bye week or a short stint on the DL. So far fantasy soccer has been a sobering lesson in economics and information access. Much like real estate…
Your home is not an investment.
Your home is not an investment.
Your home is not an investment.
The belief that a home purchase is like winning the f-ing lottery is what caused this mess. I wish I had a dollar for every homeowner who bragged about how much “money” they “made” in the market. Money isn’t “made” from a home until it’s sold and the gain is realized. In most cases, the realized gain goes right back into the next home purchase.
Your home is a roof over your head. It does not magically produce income. It should not form the cornerstone of a financial portfolio, regardless of the NAR propaganda. I almost feel sorry for the baby boomers who thought that their homes would magically cover their retirements. Almost, because they believed in the fairy tale of ever-increasing prices.
ReTraitor101,
I’ll be toothless, dressed in rags with flies buzzing around me at the next gtg. I ignored everyone’s advice, I didn’t buy a home in 2003-06 and now I’m living under a bridge.
I’ve noticed some generic-looking townhomes being built across the Turnpike from the Secaucus rail station. I’m assuming this is the “transit village” that had been talked about for years.
I’m not getting much via Google… I’d like to know the following:
- Who is the developer?
- Is there an estimated completion and/or sales date?
- Is the project active, or has progress been halted due to the market?
Thanks!
What the hell, I’m just quaking in my boots.
I got a few pounds on you Inpatient. I’m 6′2″ at 270 lbs. I pretty much look like a football player and I don’t scare easily, if at all. Wuss.
njpatient Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 11:26 pm
Reinvestor
“I couldn’t make the last gtg because I had a previous commitment. I’ll be there next time”
I can’t wait to see you. I’m easy to find: I’m the guy who weighs 265 pounds.
What the hell, I’m just quaking in my boots.
I got a few pounds on you Inpatient. I’m 6′2″ at 270 lbs. I pretty much look like a football player and I don’t scare easily, if at all. Wuss.
njpatient Says:
March 23rd, 2008 at 11:26 pm
Reinvestor
“I couldn’t make the last gtg because I had a previous commitment. I’ll be there next time”
I can’t wait to see you. I’m easy to find: I’m the guy who weighs 265 pounds.
Serves you right.
Do try to bathe.
jmacdaddio Says:
March 24th, 2008 at 12:33 am
ReTraitor101,
I’ll be toothless, dressed in rags with flies buzzing around me at the next gtg. I ignored everyone’s advice, I didn’t buy a home in 2003-06 and now I’m living under a bridge.
ReKoolAid101,
The joke’s on you. In my present state, I can’t even get into a dive bar so I won’t be at the next gtg. I should have bought a McMansion in Monroe Township using 3% down and a 3/1 ARM in 2005. I could have retired off the appreciation since then.
264 recoward
“I got a few pounds on you Inpatient. I’m 6′2″ at 270 lbs. I pretty much look like a football player and I don’t scare easily, if at all. Wuss.”
It’ll be great to see you. I’ll show up, and wager you won’t.
Recoward101
It’ll be nice to finally put a face to all the whining, moaning and crying, alternated with threats.
I use that last word advisedly.
“pencil neck” (giggles…)
“panty-waist” (giggles some more…)
I feel like I’m in second grade here.
My brother used to ask me:
“Is that your face or did your neck throw up?”
And that’s about at the same maturity level where I place ‘tards comments…
(Anyone who saw the South Park Leave Britney Alone episode can probably get a visual…)
I love it when Internet tough-guys start talking about how big & tough they are.
Seriously, some of you guys need to get a life.