Open Houses… What’s the point?

From the NYT:

Brokers Divide on Utility of Public Open Houses

THE thought of holding a public open house makes Paul A. Falla wince: strangers traipsing through his five-bedroom contemporary in White Plains, peering into his closets, opening the kitchen cabinets and checking out the equipment in his home theater.

What is more, some of those strangers won’t be potential buyers, but rather the curious — among them, nosy neighbors — who like looking inside other people’s homes, especially the expensive ones.

Even so, Mr. Falla, a retired New York City firefighter, and his partner, Lisa Rizzi, a court officer, have agreed that a public open house might increase the prospects for a sale.

The 28-year-old house, which Mr. Falla bought eight years ago and fully renovated, is listed for $949,000. It came on the market five weeks ago, after an unsuccessful stint a year ago without a public open house.

Not all brokers, however, believe that inviting the public is worth the time and trouble, preferring instead to restrict open houses to other agents.

“I am the antithesis of the public open house,” said Mark Seiden, who owns a real estate office in Briarcliff Manor. “I’ve done that — invited all the neighbors, put up balloons and signs, and given people tours of the house. But in a year of more than 100 public open houses, all I got was a ton of what we call ‘looky-loos’ in the trade, and only one property sold.”

As a result, these days Mr. Seiden sticks to brokers-only open houses, and doesn’t offer lunch or a drawing for a bottle of wine as an enticement, as some agents do. If a house is priced right, he said, the other brokers will come.

Loretta Rapisardi of Julia B. Fee Sotheby’s International Realty in Rye, sees it differently. “The idea is to get as much exposure as you can,” she said. “There have been a couple of cases just within the past few weeks when someone walked into a public open house and purchased it on the spot.”

That is not to say that Ms. Rapisardi doesn’t also ply her trade using broker-only open houses and advertising heavily. But she has become partial to the public open houses. “You can never have enough exposure,” she insisted.

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130 Responses to Open Houses… What’s the point?

  1. grim says:

    …for the agent sitting it to find new clients.

    Which the writer completely misses.

    Or didn’t they want to let out that dirty little secret?

  2. safe as houses says:

    Why does a retired fireman and a court officer own a house supposedly worth 949k?

  3. safe as houses says:

    #1 grim

    Agents like to meet new people and be able to discuss with strangers books like Homer’s “The Illiad” and “The Odyssey” and whether or not they were written by one person, multiple people, or bard’s tales put down to paper.

  4. Final Doom says:

    If homeowners knew that agents wanted to use their house every Sunday as a remote office- for the purpose of meeting buyers and selling them other houses- that would be the end of open houses.

  5. Final Doom says:

    The national success rate for open houses being the primary cause of a sale of the subject property is a little under 2%.

    Not a gainful activity…but it’s a great way for a big company to create the illusion of hard work and activity for the home seller…while filling their offices’ buyer books.

  6. safe as houses says:

    Andy Kaufman lives!

    Anyone here about k-strass yo-yo man?

    http://deadspin.com/5535220/fake-yo+yo-trickster-fools-every-tv-station-everywhere

    Punked 6 midwestern tv stations so far.

  7. Cindy says:

    7. Safe – Crazy stuff…all I can think is…those poor hosts… Punked indeed.

  8. Cindy says:

    http://realestate.yahoo.com/California/Fresno

    National Real Estate

    A bit of a real estate snapshot from Fresno.

  9. safe as houses says:

    #7

    hear, even

  10. safe as houses says:

    #8 Cindy,

    It’s too funny. Also shows how little background checks and research is involved in the mass media.

    His yo-yo teacher was Eric “Stringer” lmao.
    He forgot to bring a string to one interview, another one he answered his cell phone. Too funny.

  11. Long-Legged Mr Hyde says:

    Some light reading for the day

    The U.S. Government Is About To Get Hit With ‘The Perfect Storm’ Of Debt
    by Chris Wood, Jake Weber, and Vedran Vuk, Casey Research :

    http://www.businessinsider.com/us-debt-casey-report-2010-5

  12. Long-Legged Mr Hyde says:

    Is this a bad thing????

    New Jersey Headed Toward Government Shutdown
    by Steve Adubato

    Governor Chris Christie unveiled a plan to cap property taxes as well as salary and benefit increases for police, firefighters and teachers in municipalities across the state. The cap is 2.5% for salaries and benefits, but if a town wants to spend more for its public employees by having the property taxes go up, they can vote on it. That plan makes sense to me.

    http://blog.nj.com/steveadubato/2010/05/nj_headed_toward_government_sh.html

  13. Outofstater says:
  14. jamil says:

    13:

    Christie2012.com

  15. Final Doom says:

    hyde (13)-

    A 2.5% cap on increases is 2.5% too much. There should be either no increases or mandatory reductions until such time as conditions allow otherwise.

    We are TAPPED OUT. Why won’t most of the people in the middle of this taxation debate start from that premise?

  16. Essex says:

    16. Eliminate County government, cut each homeowners taxes by 1/2. We’ll still be overpriced, but it’s a start.

  17. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    16. Doom
    so true. maddening that we’ve fallen victim to the “market psychology.” Like RE prices, there is no justification for a 50% increase in taxes in 7 years. None. Roll them back, not cap them. Be bold, Christie.

  18. Long-legged Mr Hyde says:

    Doom

    ..,,failure to understand the exponential function. An annual increase of 2.5% is exponential growth. Any biological system that demonstrates unrestrained exponential growth crashes.

    As you pointed out anything greater than 0 is a dead end!!!!

  19. The new Zune browser is surprisingly good, but not as good as the iPod’s. It works well, but isn’t as fast as Safari, and has a clunkier interface. If you occasionally plan on using the web browser that’s not an issue, but if you’re planning to browse the web alot from your PMP then the iPod’s larger screen and better browser may be important.

  20. meter says:

    A 2.5% increase YoY in an oppressive economy is why a firefighter and his court officer wife are living in a $1M home.

    Our public workers like austerity measures as much as the Greeks do.

  21. Essex says:

    21. No way. This guy might have had inheritance or a windfall. Or simply sold a lesser home at the right time. Salary alone won’t get them into homes like that.

  22. speedkillsu says:

    “Quit your job do what you want be creative because the taxpayer will pick up your health care” ! Nancy pelosi ..http://www.eyeblast.tv/public/video.aspx

  23. Shore Guy says:

    I would never allow an open house, were we to be listing our home for sale. That said, I do believe they have a value, and not in terms of selling a particular house and beyond generating leads for agents. Open houses allow potential buyers to tiptoe into the market; to see what is out there in their general price range and to allow them to figure out whether they want to take the step towards actually looking.

  24. Long-legged Mr Hyde says:

    Anyone who believes exponential growth can go on forever in a finite world is either a madman or an economist.-Kenneth Boulding

  25. Pat says:

    Essex…note, he’s retired. He’s had at least 20 years of gravy.

    I’m not saying he didn’t drag his beer belling down to an accident once a week or sit around eating ziti at about 200 firehall fundraisers….but come on.

    Exactly why, if he’s got the inheritance, did he work long enough to retire.

    Essex, sometimes I smile at you, and some times I want to smack you.

  26. Pat says:

    belling = belly in the real world.

  27. d2b says:

    Shore 24-
    I agree. When we were looking, going to open houses helped us move our decision forward. We were able to see 5 houses in one day and we saw what we liked. Certainly helped us decide.

  28. Pat says:

    WTF is the “making work pay and government retiree credit” on line 63 form 1040 and why would I be eligible for this as a private ee? I haven’t worked for Big Sam since like college in 1982 as a seasonal.

    Why is the IRS telling me I get fifteen hundred bucks.

    Who did they

  29. Pat says:

    O.K. if Essex tells me to cash the check, I will.

  30. Essex says:

    I don’t have a dog in that hunt.

  31. Essex says:

    26. I wonder too if his ‘ask’ is as far off as other property owners….maybe it’s only worth $750. All I know is that our household income is higher by a longshot and we aint’ livin’ in no $1M home.

  32. Essex says:

    26. and now you are sounding like every woman I have ever known.

  33. 250k says:

    Don’t know many dual-public service worker HHs that look like this:
    http://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/945-Knollwood-Rd_White-Plains_NY_10603_1116779238

  34. Pat says:

    Yes, Essex, that was uncalled for.

    I just spend the afternoon cleaning up plastic bait containers, candy wrappers and McD’s garbage from in and around a fishing pond with at least seven smirking 14 to 15 year-old boys making wise cracks.

    They were obviously fishing.

    I tossed in the line and caught one on the first cast, then took off the fish and threw it at them.

    I’m just generally pissed.

  35. Shore Guy says:

    Last year, I recall, either the NY Times or the Star Ledger did a piece on a fire Lt from NJ whose wife worked as a court clerk and they had a house in NJ and had purchased something like a $700,000 oceanfront condo in Florida that had issues. I also seem to recall that after the article ran people beganking where the money came from and I believe she may have fallen under suspicion or may have been indicted. Does anyone know what happened to them?

  36. Pat says:

    And my new mountain bike is all messed up and has to go back.

    So you are going to catch the brunt today, big guy.

  37. Pat says:

    shore, beganking is almost as good a term as beer belling.

  38. Jim says:

    Shore,
    Wasn’t that the guy who bought a condo and was the only one in the entire building? The developer was trying to get him into the building next door where more people were living. The condo cost like 7 or $800,000.

  39. Shore Guy says:

    Yes. That is the guy.

  40. Shore Guy says:

    Pat,

    The dangers of posting from a thumb keyboard at a traffic light and not proofing.

  41. Final Doom says:

    Mr. Wantanopoulous-

    Our 11 face Thistle tomorrow in the State Cup semifinal. Our meetings are becoming quite spectacular displays of footballing thuggery and black arts.

    Makes me want to hit a few pubs in Harrison and pop a couple of snorts before and/or after. Tough to do with 12 y/o’s in tow, though. They tend to not like the smell of well whiskey and stale beer.

  42. Essex says:

    I can take it.

  43. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    my dad used to take me to the VFW when I was 12. I liked it ok.

  44. Pat says:

    http://i.cdn.turner.com/cnn/2010/images/05/15/tube.pdf?hpt=T1

    this is not it. The one that works is yellow and goes directly down through holes in the top of the riser pipe. It has circular wheels around it that look like tinker toy wheels with holes around the outside edge. They are around the yellow tubes going into the top of the pipe.

    Nick, what in heavens name could this be?

  45. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:

    17.

    Essex,

    You see 50 years ago it was stated that county lines would become increasingly irrelevant. What really needs to be done is eliminate federal government and then state government. Let the locals govern themselves. Sure, the federal and state tit suckers wouldnt like that very much but I guarantee you it will be imposed upon them whether they like it or not.

    They are useful idiots and I am thankful that they will be doing the rioting while I sit home.

  46. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    then we can have mini wars, like clans or like tribes. Oh for fun!

  47. Essex says:

    I dunno Al. Aside from your nihilistic tendencies, I would guess you like a good game of hide and seek. Cause that is pretty much what life would be like with complete anarchy.

  48. Joeycasz says:

    @safe as houses
    “Why does a retired fireman and a court officer own a house supposedly worth 949k?”

    I’m guessing 8 years ago it was probably bought for anywhere in the range of $450,000-$500,000. Even so, that’s a lot of bread. The taxes on it must be scary.

  49. Qwerty says:

    Stripes anyone?

    17 Huntley Rd Summit City, NJ 07901
    $400,000
    3 Bed, 1 Bath | 0.2 Acres | MLS #2772238

    http://p.rdcpix.com/v01/l6593ae42-m0o.jpg

  50. Joeycasz says:

    $400,000 for that is just plain insulting.

  51. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:

    48.

    Im not an anarchist Essex Doom is. Your posts, I believe are based on logic, but it reminded me of the following speech made 40 years ago.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qlWd_1Ph0r0

    You see its an agenda not only incompetence.

  52. safe as houses says:

    #50 qwerty,

    I prefer vertical stripes, horizontal ones make me look fat.

  53. Bruce Wantanapolous says:

    Doom [42],

    Let me know time/place. I’ll invite the Harrison Redevelopment Corp. Thistle? That calls for before and after. GTG, tomorrow?

  54. Bruce Wantanapolous says:

    “U.S. Treasurys are perhaps not the risk-free assets they once were,” said Michael Hasenstab, who manages the Templeton Global Bond Fund”

    Templetom Global? If this guy managed the NJ Vulture Fund, he would have realized the same approx 4 years ago.

    Michael, buckle up. Just wait until the bond vigilantes take on good faith and credit. It’s a bigger bubble than 2002-2007 RE.

    http://www.marketwatch.com/story/abandoning-treasurys-for-safer-bets-overseas-2010-05-14

  55. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:

    50.

    Qwerty,

    Dam, I want that lawn. My backyard grass looks like sh$t. Im thinking about ripping it all up and growing a tomatoe lawn.

    The problem with N. Jersey is not only the Communists but the POS real estate inventory.

    There are basically 3 options.

    1. Circe 76 Bilevel sh_tbox. No matter how much you spend updating its still a sh_tbox.
    2. POS Cape. These can be updated successfully but its like living in Abraham Lincolns home.
    3. The Brady Bunch ranch.

  56. Bruce Wantanapolous says:

    AG,

    Rip up the lawn and bury a safe, topped with 3 ft of concrete. Place a huge sign on the lawn; “We don’t accept tungsten”

  57. Long-legged Mr Hyde says:

    Hey Bruce

    when is this gold bubble going to burst

  58. MSP says:

    Regarding open houses. Had one good offer on our house a week after it went on the market. I usually subscribe to the idea that the first offer is usually the best offer, but since we had an public open house scheduled for that Sunday (May 2nd) and the broker open house the previous Tuesday had gone so well, we decided to leave the offer on the table until afterward. This proved to be a good decision as we had five more offers a few days later.

  59. MSP says:

    AG,

    I had a lawn that was all weeds too. Take the following steps and in a few years, you’ll have a virtually weed free lawn.

    This Spring

    1. Have your soil analyzed (Rutgers Cooperative sells inexpensive kits) – If you have a lot of weeds and little grass, your soil could be too acidic (weeds love acidic lawns, grass doesn’t). If too acidic, apply pelletized lime in November (lime takes about 6 months to do its job, so your soil should be good next Spring.

    2. Apply Ortho Weed Killer for lawns (for small areas, use a tank sprayer or Ortho dial and spray applicator for larger areas)

    This Fall

    1. Rent a dethatcher. Lawns that have been neglected sometimes have a thick layer of thatch that prevents new grass seedlings from germinating

    2. Apply pelletized lime (assuming your soil needs it)

    Next Spring (late March or very early April)

    1. Rent a core aerator-power seeder combination and seed your lawn with good quality seed. The core aerator will pull plugs out of your soil to sure compaction issues. As you’re aerating, a hopper with seed will drop seed into the holes made by the aerating process.

    2. If its a dry Spring – water, water, water

    Obviously, its a lot of work and takes time, but its worth it in the end. If you want faster results. Kill the existing lawn with a non-selective herbicide (Round-up) and re-seed or sod. You should still have your soil tested though.

  60. Essex says:

    52. I appreciate that link. always wondered what they stood for. Yet, the two or three largest financial and environmental debacles of the last few years are due to TOO LAX government oversight. Imagine no regulation. The Earth would be pillaged in a matter of years.

  61. NJCoast says:

    Thanks to Lookin at Lucky for the dinner and nice bottle of champagne last night. $100 to win. Wooohoo.

  62. Cindy says:

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748703950804575242433435338728.html?mod=rss_com_mostcommentart

    “Detroit Shrinks Itself, Historic Homes and All”

    “Mr. Bing hasn’t yet fully articulated his ultimate vision for what comes after demolition, but he has said entire areas will have to be rebuilt from the ground up. For now, his plan calls for the tracts to be converted to other uses, such as parks or farms.”

    Wait a minute, we talked about this here eons ago – complete with the parks scenario.

    Then there is Las Vegas….

  63. Cindy says:

    http://www.nytimes.com/2010/05/16/business/16builder.html?src=busln

    “Building is Booming in the City of Empty Houses”

    Okay – so don’t they need to do the Detroit demolition derby deal as well?
    Go figure…

  64. freedy says:

    the crisis is over, don’t you know.

  65. Essex says:

    Told the wife I want to list next year prior to the town reassessment.ready to throw in the towel.

  66. Mr Hyde says:

    Cindy

    Vegas is dead, it just doesnt know it yet. They are out of water and they source of income ( the avalanche of debt dumped into housing and gambling) is toast.

    Vegas’ future:
    http://www.photosfan.com/images/las-vegas-strip-in-19541.jpg

  67. Mr Hyde says:

    SO anyone notice that little rebellion.. opps,i mean protest in bankok

  68. Essex says:

    Welp….wife talked some sense into me….We are in for another few years “all things being equal”….

  69. Temporarily Anonymous says:

    Shore Guy,

    Yes the family was from Weehawken and moved to Tampa. This was supposed to be a top-notch luxury condo complex (unlike the stuff they try to pass off in NJ).

    You have to read the articles, some of the quotes are funny.

    A less recent but more detailed article:
    http://www.news-press.com/article/20100308/NEWS0110/3080347

    The article indicates no change in status at the time except that
    the wife had just started serving a prison term.

    – a sometime lurker who sometimes posts

  70. Temporarily Anonymous says:

    Some more info…

    A more recent update here:
    http://www.news-press.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=20104280381

    Also check the same address with AID=2010100427077

    Apparently Bank of America initiated foreclosure proceedings on the complex.

  71. toomuchchange says:

    Re #13 – 2.5% cap on salary and benefits

    How can this be done?

    With health insurance going up 10% and more per year and with New Jersey so behind on pension contributions, how can a limit of 2.5% increases per year be imposed for the long term?

    Even doing it for the next few years of this terrible recession would be difficult, wouldn’t it? The unions would have to give back quite a bit, lots more than I see them doing voluntarily.

    For example, the really good family health plan where I work is now over $20,000 and I think even the worst plan isn’t far from $15,000 now. I assume the civil servants have really good plans, so a 10% increase in family health insurance would be $2,000 more per year, every year, as long as health costs increase at the current phenomenal rate. God only knows what the pension catch-plan works out to be, on a per-employee basis, whenever the state gets up the courage to do it.

    Not arguing it shouldn’t be done, just wondering — how can it?

    Frankly I think we’ve reached the point where it’s clear the State cannot fulfill all the promises made and so the promises should be modified — and not just for future hires but current hires and even current retirees. But can this be done?

  72. toomuchchange says:

    73 – Correction

    Should have said “health plan where I USED TO work” because I’m not there anymore. In fact, I’ve been gone so long that my COBRA subsidy ends in two weeks. That was a true godsend to me, and I say that as someone who is reasonably healthy. Now I get to have another source of anxiety, starting June 1.

    So I’m grateful to Obama and Co. for that and for the 99 weeks of unemployment. The unemployment needs to go beyond the 99 weeks, though, with so much long term unemployment.

    The stories from the people whose been looking for two years for work and have now lost their unemployment are heartrending and scary too.

  73. stan says:

    Chris Christie speaking at RU graduation right now.

    Half the place is cheering loudly, the other half is booing.

    Should be a fun afternoon….

  74. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:

    61.

    MSP,

    thanks for the info. My ego wouldnt let me get my soil tested but instead of wasting money every year Im going to follow your advise to the tee.

  75. meter says:

    @73 –

    “With health insurance going up 10% and more per year and with New Jersey so behind on pension contributions, how can a limit of 2.5% increases per year be imposed for the long term? ”

    Not my f’in problem, bro. Public workers need to start contributing to their bennies and get used to the idea of less of them to boot.

    It’s now becoming evident that my less-intelligent, less-motivated, less-talented peers who went into government work – while I took my talents to the private sector – will have cushy, fully-paid retirements at age 50 while I’m slaving away at 60 to support it all.

    Those days are over.

  76. MSP says:

    AG,

    Forgot to mention fertilizer. Right after you core aerate and seed, apply a weed and feed specially made for seeding. Its much more expensive than weed and feed for established lawns but its necessary.

  77. MSP says:

    Anybody have an opinion on qualifying for the move up buyer tax credit ($6,500). If you have a signed contract before April 30th, but you’re not out of attorney review until May 5th, do you qualify for the tax credit assuming you close by June 30th? The thing that keeps throwing me off is the “binding contract” language in the law. Its not technically binding until you’re out of attorney review, right? However, there are all kinds of contingencies in RE contracts (home sale, mortgage, inspections, etc) that the contract isn’t really truly binding until after all the contingencies are satisfied. I’m torn and would appreciate those in the know on the board weighing in.

  78. Long-Legged Mr Hyde says:

    Say bye bye to the gulf for a decade ros o.

    Scientists are finding enormous oil plumes in the deep waters of the Gulf of Mexico, including one as large as 10 miles long, three miles wide and 300 feet thick.

    The discovery is fresh evidence that the leak from the broken undersea well could be much worse than estimates that the government and BP, the well’s operator, have given.

    “There’s a shocking amount of oil in the deep water, relative to what you see in the surface water,” said Samantha Joye, a researcher at the University of Georgia who is on the research vessel Pelican, one of the first scientific expeditions to gather extensive information about the disaster in the gulf.

    The plumes are depleting the oxygen dissolved in the gulf, adding to scientists’ fear that the oxygen level could eventually fall so low as to kill off much of the sea life near the plumes.

    http://www.omaha.com/article/20100516/AP/705169893

  79. Outofstater says:

    #81 That is just heart-breaking. All that beautiful blue-green water and sugar sand beaches. We have GOT to find another source of energy.

  80. Long-Legged Mr Hyde says:

    Who is it here who lives int he keys?

    NEW ORLEANS — Researchers tracking the massive oil spill in the Gulf of Mexico say computer models show the black ooze may have already entered a major current flowing toward the Florida Keys, and are sending out a research vessel to learn more.

    William Hogarth, dean of the University of South Florida’s College of Marine Science, told The Associated Press Sunday that one model shows that the oil has already hit the loop current, which is the largest in the Gulf.

  81. Pat says:

    Who needs blue-green water and sugar sand beaches, anyways?

    Gotta park my car in between those cavemakers or I just wouldn’t get my daily danger rush.

  82. njescapee says:

    83, Hyde, I do and we are very nervous and sick over this. One report has the spill about 35 miles north of that current. We have one of a few living reefs remaining on this planet seven miles from our shore.

  83. Long-Legged Mr Hyde says:

    NJescapee

    oil on gulfport beach:

    http://i.imgur.com/NT8J1.jpg

  84. Juice Box says:

    Shore – wife plead guilty and in the klink perhaps 2 years.

  85. Ben says:

    “computer models” usually mean we made 10 assumptions in order to cut down on the calculation and the results of our model are meaningless.

  86. Juice Box says:

    re: #85 – NJescapee – been there and snorkeled that reef, only living reef in North America, pristine for sure. I will say a prayer for it and may Gold protect it from this mess.

  87. Juice Box says:

    re#89 – a flub mean GOD….protect that reef.

  88. njescapee says:

    OIL SPILL UPDATE
    Loop Current closer to spill

    http://keysnews.com/node/23307

    The state said Saturday that the Loop Current was 35 miles away from the oil spill.

    The current, which frequently fluctuates, loops around the northern Gulf of Mexico, down Florida’s west coast to the Florida Keys, then into the Gulf Stream.

    Independent oceanographer Mitchell Roffer told The Citizen late Friday that the Loop Current will continue to move north and he suspected oil, in some form, already was in the current.

    But other experts have refuted that claim.

    Florida State University oceanography professor Eric Chassignet said Friday the Loop Current was to begin moving south. The spill has mainly been moving northwest from its origin, 50 miles off Louisiana’s coast, according to news outlets.

  89. Ben says:

    “when is this gold bubble going to burst”

    Once it hits $4000.

  90. safeashouses says:

    Australia ain’t different from the US.

    Borrowing money after Lehman’s collapse using a government guarantee to lend it to foreign companies at a higher rate. Sound familiar?

    http://www.smh.com.au/business/macbanks-code-red-20100516-v6fq.html

  91. Long-legged Mr Hyde says:

    Ben, escapee

    given that the huge amount of dispersants used causes the oil to settle towards the bottom and that large amounts of oil are developing subsurface, the lack of large quantities of oil on shores seems to be of little significance over all. If the seabeads and low level ecosystems are being inundated with chemcal dispersant as well as oil we are talking about major and long term e osystem damage.

    There were reports of oily shrimp bring pulled up from “officially” clean gulf fishing grounds over the weekend.

    I doubt anyone in the MSM is even willing to seriously discuss the implications of large scale disruption og gulf ecosystems from the bottom up

    and yes ben, models are just that, models, not reality until verified

  92. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    firing squad time

  93. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    dust bowl? tiddly winks. We done killed an ocean!

  94. Long-legged Mr Hyde says:

    Barb

    this spill is probably putting out the equivilent of 1 exxon valdez every week. So far the spill has been going on for about 4 weeks now

  95. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    Hyde,
    the silence is deafening in the MSM. Its downright apocalyptic….we broke the planet, literally!

  96. Long-legged Mr Hyde says:

    Barb

    a mess of epic proportions. And while not to minimize it, the ocean will “heal” itself given enough time, we may not like the results. Severly disturbed ecosystem often do not resemble theiroriginal state after they “heal” themselves. Look at some of the bays is austrailia

  97. njescapee says:

    Notice how well either major party governs. Regulations are just a bartering tool for politicians to take more bribes.

    MSM e.g., NYT, WP, Gannett has been burying this story

  98. njescapee says:

    Those 545 idiots in DC should all go to HELL.

  99. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:

    EUR/USD 1.2295 -0.0066

    lol?

  100. All "H-Train" Hype says:

    Hey Al:

    Check out the global race to the bottom:

    http://finviz.com/futures_charts.ashx?t=CURRENCIES&p=h1

  101. njescapee says:

    Oil nears Loop Current; some say it’s already in
    TALLAHASSEE: An update Sunday from the Governor’s Office said the Loop Current was a mere 20 miles from the oil spill.

    Some researchers said it was as close as 3 miles in other published reports; while others say the oil has already entered the worst-case scenario for the Florida Keys and the rest of the state.

  102. Shore Guy says:

    NJ Escapee,

    The best coverage I have found on the spill is the BBC. They were talking about the underwater plumes days before the US press.

  103. Shore Guy says:

    Perhaps we will scratch-off Captevia from our list.

  104. Shore Guy says:

    Ahh, prison for the sticky-fingered court clerk. And one has to wonder how much she really took and how much of the cost of the Florida condo came from her, um, activities.

  105. Ben says:

    “and yes ben, models are just that, models, not reality until verified”

    Climatologists, like Economists work with macromodels involving overly simplistic assumptions on overly complicated systems. The result is garbage in-garbage out 100% of the time. They are never verified.

    As a physicist/chemist, we know the limitations and the low relative value of a model of a macrosystem that we construct to try to explain an experimental result. We place a confidence of 1% on such methodologies.

    Meanwhile, climatologists and economists treat their models as absolute truth, even when they utterly fail. They put their full faith in a model or idea that probably holds no credence.

  106. Jill says:

    All the talk about local expenditures…when will people in these towns start holding their local officials accountable? I live in a Bergen County town in which the same people have run things for almost 30 years. Our former mayor was the town drunk, and he was allowed by his cronies to stay in office for 2 years after he moved out of town and put his house on the market. His same peeps are now still running things even after the town’s first contested election in almost 30 years. They were elected by a 2-1 margin. Oh, and by the way? They’re Republicans. There’s no cost-sharing with other towns. No joint projects. Contracts are granted without competitive bidding. Friends and cronies of the officials get those contracts.

    It’s the people who keep re-electing these clowns who are at fault. In my town they had a chance last November to shake things up and they didn’t do it. So I don’t know why they’re so surprised when the same cronies behave in the same way.

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