2010 wasn’t the bottom, will 2011 be?

From HousingWire:

Home prices dip 3.8% in 2010 RadarLogic index

Home prices in 25 metro markets tracked by analytics firm RadarLogic in its RPX Composite index declined by 3.8% in 2010, the firm reported.

Stability in home prices during the beginning of 2010 was attributed to stimulus of the housing market that came via the government’s homebuyer tax credits, low-down-payment Federal Housing Administration loans, and the Federal Reserve’s purchase of $1.25 trillion in mortgage-backed securities and $175 billion of housing agency debt, which helped keep mortgage rates near record lows.

When the stimulus ended mid-year, weakness returned to housing markets.

On a month-over-month basis, the RPX Composite price performed worse than its 10-year average in 10 of 12 months in 2010. On a year-over-year basis, the performance of the RPX Composite price through Dec. 31 was worse in 2010 than in any other year save for the bust years of 2007 and 2008.

The RPX Composite prices for the Midwest, West and South in 2010 each declined in excess of 5% from one year earlier. The RPX Composite price for the Northeast outperformed the prices for the other regions, declining just 1.5%. The Northeast price is heavily influenced by housing market dynamics in the New York metropolitan area, where home prices fared better than most other parts of the country.

In 2010, REO sales increased from 26% to 31% of total sales throughout the 25 metropolitan areas tracked by Radar Logic. Twenty-two of the metropolitan areas exhibited a year-over-year gain in REO sales’ share of total sales.

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136 Responses to 2010 wasn’t the bottom, will 2011 be?

  1. grim says:

    Headline I’d have chosen for this one would have been “Seller was an idiot”.

    From the Record:

    ‘Price and value came together’ after 3 years

    Asking price: $725,000 in 2007; reduced to $539,000 by 2010

    The result: Another agent brought in the buyer and the house sold for $485,000.

  2. grim says:

    From the AP:

    Atlantic City casinos see 6.2 percent visitor drop

    More than 26.6 million people visited Atlantic City casinos last year, a decrease of 6.2 percent. But a new survey finds spending per visitor fell by only half that amount, indicating that the people who have stopped coming to the nation’s second-largest gambling market are the less-profitable customers the casinos have been paying less attention to in recent years.

    The stakes are high in Atlantic City, which is in the fifth-straight year of a revenue decline brought on by the explosion of casino gambling in neighboring states and made worse by the poor economy.

    For the past five years, it has been trying to remake itself as a destination resort for higher-spending customers willing to stay a few days and take in shows, go shopping and eat at gourmet restaurants in addition to gambling.

  3. grim says:

    From Bloomberg:

    Sales of Existing U.S. Homes Probably Declined in February

    Sales of U.S. previously owned homes probably dropped in February to a three-month low, indicating a sustained housing market recovery has yet to develop, economists said before a report today.

    Purchases decreased 4.7 percent last month to a 5.11 million annual rate, according to the median forecast of 60 economists surveyed by Bloomberg News. Sales in January rose to the highest in eight months as investors used all-cash transactions to buy distressed properties.

    Foreclosures are adding to the glut of distressed properties and pressuring prices, leaving some Americans with bigger mortgages than their homes are worth as joblessness hovers near 9 percent. The figures underscore the Federal Reserve’s view that the housing market “continues to be depressed” even as the rest of the economy improves.

    The labor market is “improving but not rapidly enough to fuel a sharper rebound in the housing sector,” said Scott Brown, chief economist at Raymond James & Associates Inc. in St. Petersburg, Florida. “You’re still seeing prices drifting lower, which is a big problem.” Existing-home sales are being “inflated by the amount of short sales and foreclosure sales going on,” he said.

    The National Association of Realtors’ data are due at 10 a.m. in Washington. Economists’ estimates ranged from 4.8 million to 5.3 million following January’s 5.36 million pace.

  4. Mike says:

    Good Morning New Jersey

  5. Mikeinwaiting says:

    grim 3 Should not the sales increase in Feb as we approach the spring selling season.
    If the call is a decrease & it does, what does that tell use about the market overall.

    I am stating the obvious, let us see how the NAR spins this one.
    Bottom 2011 not so sure on that one either, foreclosures moving like turtles through the process will keep downward pressure on pricing. My thinking is even if they get most done by next spring they will hit the market like a ton of bricks.

  6. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Europe, Asia all green, US futures up rally on. QE 4 just around the corner, can’t take away the punch bowl. Party on Garth.
    Do you really think the FED has the balls to take it away, not.

  7. grim says:


    Contracts begin to increase in February, while closings are hitting their yearly low point.

  8. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Grim so they are counting closed sales not contracts signed as in new construction, no?
    In that case we will need more time to elapse to get a feel on direction. What do you,30 Year see on the ground? I have a pretty good idea on Debt/Clot’s view.

  9. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Oh Grim whenever you have a chance send me Gary’s email we are going to do a lunch.
    May be in your neck of the woods if you want to join us. Unemployed lunch outing, employed people welcome! Sorry nothing fancy we are on the dole.

  10. Mikeinwaiting says:

    School delay up here in the woods . Snow, freezing rain, ice what do they call it a wintery mix. Sh*t I thought we were over this crap. You folks getting rain down below?

  11. #10 – Nothing but rain by the shore and in Manhattan.

  12. Mikeinwaiting says:

    On a good note.
    7:15 AM Efforts to cool the pools holding spent fuel rods at the Fukushima nuclear reactors appear to be working, the temperatures having fallen below the boiling point.

  13. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Tosh I figured as much, colder high up here in the mountains. Dam just lost satellite no CNBC cheer leaders for now, must be getting pretty thick up above.Winter wonder land out my windows snowing at a pretty good clip now. Better check out the radar.

  14. gary says:

    I was talking to a friend who was downsized a few years ago and out of work for a while. He finally got a temp assignment with a Wholesale Pharmaceutical firm in Piscataway this past November and then hired fulltime recently. He just received word last week that operations are moving overseas. He has four months to find another job. He currently has two kids in high school and one a freshman in college.

    This is just the beginning of the transition. Not only will we be working willy nilly temp jobs per diem but we will eventually be bidding to work any job at lower and lower prices just to make something that resembles an income. Water will always flow until it reaches its gravitiational balance. If someone is making $12 a day in some faraway land, what did you think is eventually going to happen?

  15. Shore Guy says:


    WOW! This evokes St. Petersburg just before the fall of the czar.

  16. JJ says:

    Citigroup announces 1-for-10 reverse stock split
    John Spence

    BOSTON (MarketWatch) — Citigroup Inc. (Symbol : C
    on Monday announced a 1-for-10 reverse stock split of its common shares effective after markets close on May 6. Separately, the banking giant said it plans to reinstate a quarterly dividend of a penny a share in the second quarter. “The reverse stock split and intention to reinstate a dividend are important steps as we anticipate returning capital to shareholders starting next year,” said Chief Executive Vikram Pandit in a press release.

  17. chicagofinance says:

    An enema that renews……the fresh air of Spring…

    Mets release Oliver Perez

    PORT ST. LUCIE — The Mets’ long, national nightmare is over.

    Oliver Perez is history with the Mets, after Monday morning receiving word from general manager Sandy Alderson and manager Terry Collins that he would be released. The putrid lefty appeared in the team’s clubhouse at 8:15 a.m. and began shaking hands with players, ending a tumultuous run with the organization that gave him one of the worst contracts in baseball history.

    “They told me they were going to let me go, and I think that is best for the team and best for me,” said Perez, who will collect $12 million this season.

    The final straw came Saturday, when Perez allowed two homers in a relief appearance against the Nationals. Though the Mets had hoped Perez could re-invent himself as a lefty specialist, it was clear after Saturday’s implosion – which included Mets fans cheering in delight – that Perez’s release was imminent.

    It came only three days after the team swallowed the $6 million remaining on Luis Castillo’s contract. Castillo has since agreed to a minor league deal with the Phillies.

    Perez said he received a fair opportunity with the Mets this spring.

    “They gave me an opportunity – they were fair with me,” Perez said. “When I came here they were going to give me the opportunity to be a starter, and I didn’t do anything great. They moved me to the bullpen, trying to be a lefty specialist, and the last game that was a real horrible job.”

    Perez received a three-year deal for $36 million before the 2009 season. For that money, the Mets received all of three wins from Perez – and countless headaches. Along the way, the name “Oliver Perez” became synonymous with failure in the same manner “Madoff” is equated to fraud.

    “The people everywhere are free to say all that stuff,” Perez said. “I know I did everything I can to get better, and the result doesn’t work right. [The fans] pay to see us play. I think I can do better than that, and that’s why I’m not going to quit. I want to get better, for my family and me.”

  18. Dissident HEHEHE says:

    I was in Mexico all last week. Did I miss anything? NJ RE recover?

  19. JJ says:

    The Mets suck. Being a season ticket holder is insane. Went to a end of year game on tickets that had a face of $75 that was selling on stubhub for 99 cents.

    Even worse unlike the Jets who have had equal bad experiences for fans with reselling Mets do variable pricing, so they jack the prices up for few good games opening day/Yankess and for seats in first few rows. So even though a Jet fan eats two preseason and the last game most years they at least don’t have the balls to double the price of the Pats or Giants games or charge double for seats in the first few rows.

    The Nets going to Brooklyn is also trying to screw fans like Mets, the Yankees did it and it works but if you are Jets/Nets/Mets with seasons that the fans have to eat 30% of the tickets you should not be charging a prem on the best 30% of tickets.

    Teams don’t realize die hard loyaltiy to a team comes from attending games. Even if you watch 95% on tv. Soon fans will call it quits. College games are the only true sports anymore

  20. Juice Box says:

    re # 15 – Shore. I don’t believe that visual. The Charles De Gaulle aircraft carrier
    was still in port as of yesterday.

  21. Juice Box says:

    I smell burning plutonium this morning.


  22. All Hype says:

    Look at those markets, up 200 on absolutely no news. They must have done some serious back door currency manipuation last night to drive the dollar down to 75.50. Get your cheap money and sky the markets!

  23. sas3 says:

    Hype, the nuclear cloud fantasy turned to be a dud… All the foreigners buying return flight tickets to Tokyo will add to the economic activity.

  24. Juice Box says:

    re # 24- Who would of thought that glowing in the dark would be so cool! The new bottled water coming out of Japan called Am-241 will be all the rage and lead their export based recovery.

  25. Juice Box says:

    NARs Annual rate data of 4.88 million units is really about a million less units.
    Corelogic says NAR’s existing home sales data are overstated by about to 20%.

    A million less units bunch of lying sacks……

  26. Juice Box says:

    Timmay up at Bat…

    Geithner to decide on regulation of foreign-exchange swaps

    The Dodd-Frank bill signed into law in July allows Geithner to decide whether the vast market in foreign-exchange swaps — a type of financial instrument that businesses often use to guard against fluctuations in foreign-exchange rates — should be subject to heightened regulations as other derivatives are.

    “It will be very significant,” Karen Shaw Petrou, managing partner at Federal Financial Analytics, said of Geithner’s decision, adding that it will have major implications for the global, multitrillion-dollar foreign-exchange market.

    The coming determination is one element of Geithner’s broad new authority granted by the law. For example, Geithner now chairs the new Financial Stability Oversight Council, a group of top regulators that has power to seek additional regulation for large, complex financial companies whose failure could threaten the nation’s financial stability.

    Geithner is also in charge of the creation of the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau until the Senate confirms a permanent director.

    Although Harvard professor Elizabeth Warren has overseen much of that work, Geithner ultimately has the reins over the powerful new watchdog until it becomes an independent bureau aimed at protecting borrowers from abuses by lenders.

    Meanwhile, the decision about foreign-exchange swaps, which could come this week, has placed Geithner at the crossroads between big banks, which argue that such deals do not require additional oversight, and some regulators and lawmakers who believe they do.

    In an effort to provide greater transparency, the Dodd-Frank law requires that most swaps be traded on exchanges and be backed by clearinghouses that would ensure parties set aside enough collateral to pay off any bets that go bad. The debate over how to handle foreign-exchange swaps was part of a much larger fight over how to create oversight of various kinds of derivatives, some of which helped exacerbate the financial crisis by amplifying risks.

    The Treasury sought comment last fall on whether foreign-exchange swaps should be subject to the new rules and received nearly 70 letters from those on both sides of the issue.

    Many financial companies argue that foreign-exchange swaps did not contribute to the financial crisis and that they are far less risky than other types of derivatives transactions — and that they would still be subject to certain reporting and business-conduct standards if exempted from the new rules. In addition, they note that the Dodd-Frank law defined foreign-exchange swaps very narrowly in an effort to avoid creating loopholes that other types of derivatives dealers could exploit.

    “Today’s foreign exchange markets operate with high levels of transparency . . . and have performed extremely well throughout the recent market crisis,” wrote officials from the Financial Services Roundtable and Institute of International Bankers, whose organizations represent companies that participate heavily in the market.

    “[Foreign-exchange] trades are not the traditional derivatives trade,” said Bob Pickel, executive vice chairman of the International Swaps and Derivatives Association. He said that foreign exchange swaps consist largely of short-dated transactions and that forcing the industry to go through the expense and effort of setting up a clearinghouse would be costly and unnecessary for a market that has operated relatively peacefully for decades.

    “I don’t think there’s any indication that those markets froze up or shut down in any way” during the financial crisis, Pickel said. “There was greater volatility, but people could still hedge” their risks.

    On the flip side, some nonprofit groups, lawmakers and regulators, such as Gary Gensler, chairman of the Commodity Futures Trading Commission, which is in the process of writing new derivatives rules, have urged the Treasury to include foreign-exchange swaps in the new rules.

    Sens. Maria Cantwell (D-Wash.) and Tom Harkin (D-Iowa) wrote to Geithner and insisted that exempting foreign-exchange swaps from the new rules would result in a “huge unwarranted hole” in oversight.

    “No justification for an exemption is evident,” they wrote. “Any broad exclusion from the law will weaken comprehensive regulation of the derivatives market and create opportunities to structure swap transactions to evade regulation.”

    Although Gensler has remained largely silent on the issue since Dodd-Frank passed last year, he wrote in the lead-up to the new legislation that he believed the law “must cover the entire marketplace without exception.”

    In the past, Geithner has shown an inclination toward exempting foreign-exchange deals, saying they pose less risk to the financial system than some other kinds of derivatives.

    “There is an elaborate framework in place already, put in place starting 20 years ago, to limit settlement risk and the other sets of risks that occur. And these markets have actually worked quite well,” he told the Senate Agriculture Committee in late 2009. “So, like in anything, we’ve got a basic obligation to do no harm, to make sure, as we reform, we don’t make things worse.”

    The Treasury declined to comment because Geithner’s decision is pending.


  27. Yelsi says:

    A decade of mortgage nonsense is not corrected in a couple of years. Real Estate will be flat at best and or slightly declining (2-4% or so) year over year till 2015 bare minimum. Before the earthquake in Japan’s major cities, houses generally sell for less than what they did 25 years ago! We could also go that way…..and a house in West Orange could be cheaper in 2030 be cheaper than it was in 2005.

  28. Shore Guy says:

    I was looking at photos of the destruction and reading that th World Bank estimated it would cost somewhere near $300B to rebuild. Then I realized that as bad as that is it is a fraction of what we have spent fighting in SW Asia.

  29. Shore Guy says:

    A basic question:

    Why should housing cost some multiple of income?

    Back in the day, people were born somewhere and likely died not far from there. Look around fellow NJ natives, how many of our parents settled and reared their families within 50 miles of wherethey grew up? In that environment, beingtied to an expensive piece of housing may have seemed logical. But, is it?

    I have no issue with people having as bi and fancy a house as they want but, borrowing multiples offincome to live in such a place does not seem to make any sense.

  30. Mike says:


  31. Dissident HEHEHE says:

    Nevermind, I see nothing has changed:

    “Things Are Less Than They Seem
    The bulls say that the U.S. economy is on the mend. Superficially, at least, that seems to be true. The unemployment rate shows signs of having topped out. Household finances appear to be in better shape than they were. Americans are surviving and spending despite everything that has occurred.

    However, when you dig down below the surface, you notice things are somewhat less than they seem.

    Here’s one article, for example, that suggests Americans’ personal balance sheets are not necessarily getting better:

    “Decrease In Credit Card Debt All Down To Write-Offs, Report Says” (Huffington Post)

    Credit card debt fell last year only because of consumer defaults and bank write-offs, a new study argues.

    In 2010, U.S. credit card debt dropped to the lowest level in eight years, according to credit reporting agency TransUnion. But there is more evidence http://education.cardhub.com/q4-2010-credit-card-debt-study/ Americans may have taken on more credit card debt than they paid off.

    A study by Cardhub.com of Federal Reserve data found that last year, while banks wrote off a total of $75 billion in credit card debt, the level of the debt only declined by around $67 billion. This, according to Cardhub, suggests that the “entire decrease [in overall debt] is the direct result of Americans defaulting on their debt.”

    And here’s a report that calls the official data on unemployment into question:

    “Hidden Jobless Live Behind the Numbers” (The Journal Gazette)

    Overshadowing the nation’s economic recovery is not only the number of Americans who have lost their jobs, but also those who have stopped looking for new ones.

    These workers are not counted in the Labor Department’s monthly unemployment rate, yet they say they are willing to work. Since the recession began, their numbers have grown by 30 percent, to more than 6.4 million, amounting to a hidden labor force that could stymie the turnaround.

    Adding these workers to February’s jobless rate pushes it up to 10.5 percent, well above the more commonly cited 8.9 percent rate. An even broader measure of unemployment, which includes people forced to work part time, stands at nearly 16 percent.

    Economists say the longer these workers stay out of the job market, the harder it will be for them to find employment, creating a vicious circle that can spiral for months or longer. Meanwhile, their delayed entry into the job market means smaller paychecks in the future. And if these ranks remain high, economists worry that it will signal a much deeper and more troubling problem for the country: Workers’ skills don’t match the jobs available.

    “It can be a self-reinforcing problem, where it just gets worse over time,” said Burt Barnow, an economist and professor at George Washington University.

    And finally, here’s a story that goes some way towards explaining why spending has remained resilient in the face of large job losses and compensation cutbacks:

    “Food Stamps and Tax Aid Kept Poverty Rate in Check” (New York Times)

    Without a flood of food stamps and tax benefits for low-income families, about 250,000 more New Yorkers would have slipped into poverty at the height of the recession, according to calculations to be released Monday by city officials.

    As it was, while the federal poverty rate for the city remained about the same from 2008 to 2009, 17.3 percent, by a measure developed by the city it rose to 19.9 percent. The city takes into account factors the federal standard does not — higher local costs of living and expenses for health care, commuting and day care, or the value of benefits like food stamps, housing allowances and tax credits that can supplement cash income.

    “To a large degree, economic stimulus programs and policy initiatives aimed at bolstering family income succeeded in preventing a rise in poverty in New York City,” according to the report by the mayor’s Center for Economic Opportunity.

    In other words, perhaps the best explanation for why the economy appears to be recovering is that the so-called experts are suffering from ignorance or delusion, or are guilty of deception.”


  32. Juice Box says:

    Shore – Oil is going to get awfully expensive soon if this keeps up.


  33. Kettle1^2 says:

    SAS3 24

    Are you kidding? Fallout has been a problem and the questions has always been to what degree, based on the need for accurate info from the authorities. I don’t believe anyone was seriously claiming Tokyo was going to be uninhabitable. The situation is not resolved yet either, so we won’t know the full impact to different areas for some time. The fallout pattern is also variable and has to be updated on the fly based on weather patterns. So far they have been fortunate that most of the fallout has gone out to sea. Dont forget that they have released only limited radiation measurements for Fukushima prefecture so far.

    Some local areas are now reporting ground water contamination. This wont be over for the locals for a while yet.

    The projections of a particularly nasty fallout cloud are/were based on spent fuel burning. So far that has note appeared to happen for any extended period, although there were early reports of a brief spent fuel fire.

  34. 30 year realtor says:

    #8 Mikeinwaiting – Don’t see anything positive! Investors who buy to renovate and flip are running scared. Lots of lookers at open houses, but few offers. Worst Spring market I can remember. Recovery? Where?

  35. Anon E. Moose says:

    30-yr [35];

    At what point do the agents stop blowing smoke up the bagholders’ a$$es, or just stop taking listings, including REOs, at prices they know good and well won’t sell?

  36. JJ says:

    Biggest issue with my search is comps. Wife and I looked at like 7-10 homes in December to Feb. Made low ball bids on two. Basically looked at all in my price range in three neighborhood I want that meet my criteria. Ended search. Not a house I looked at includuing two I made low ball offers on has sold. I have a lot of stuff going on next few months so I have stopped looking. Will do it again next December.

    Trouble is who wants to spend their life savings now on a property that you are unsure of price as nothing is selling, may or may not go up long term and short term we may not be at bottom. Also to afford a trade up home means you are in AMT which means the RE taxes are not tax deducatable. RE Taxes are through the roof. What is point of a 3k a month mortgage for a tax break that comes 2k a month taxes that are not deductable.

  37. sas3 says:

    Ket, my (somewhat optimistic) view… Power to reactors and cooling them down will eliminate or reduce emissions to insignificant levels. There will be contamination in the vicinity, but +

  38. Kettle1^2 says:


    Its not doomsday, but it is consequential. here is a link for you:


    Far greater amounts of radioactive iodine and cesium were found in rain, dust and particles in the air in some areas over a 24-hour period from Sunday morning due to rainfall, the science ministry said Monday.

    ”Considering the results of a separate test, radioactive materials in the air and drinking water are confined to levels that would not affect health,” an official of the Education, Culture, Sports, Science and Technology said. ”The impact on agricultural crops needs to be examined mainly by the Health, Labor and Welfare Ministry.”

    In a notice to the nation’s 47 prefectures, the health ministry called on local governments on Monday to advise residents to stop giving babies water in forms such as baby formula if radioactive iodine is found in drinking water at levels greater than 100 becquerels per kiloliter.

    ”Babies can easily absorb radioactive iodine in their thyroid glands,” a ministry official said, explaining the reason for issuing the notice. The intake limit set by the central government is 300 becquerels per kiloliter of water.

  39. sas3 says:

    … but no long term damage for areas farther. The biggest economic damage would be the damage by the tsunami, followed by costs in repairing/rebuilding/closing the reactors.

  40. Kettle1^2 says:


    the reactors they got power back to arent the ones generating the plumes.

  41. Double Down says:

    ‘Price and value came together’ after 3 years

    This headline works too:

    “It’s the price, stupid”

  42. DL says:

    Shore/29: Don’t forget to add Libya to the mix. Imagine what a 12 year no fly zone will add to the deficit.

  43. please do keep on putting up more info!

  44. DL says:

    As long as sellers insist on “not giving their house away”, their only other option is to die in it.

  45. sas3 says:

    Ket, reducing exposures through food and drinking water will be very important, but it is a doable task — versus a scenario where there are high levels of groundshine or airborne material that living in the area will be impossible.

    Note that I was trying to make fun of Beckish doomsday scenarios some guys were posting here last week — and some people in CA popping iodide pills.

  46. Double Down says:

    JJ, why buy a big house in a “rich town” when doing so would obviously make you unhappy? You think the ballers there worry about tax deduct-ability of RE taxes?

    The carry and taxes will always be high. Either make the move, or look at a smaller house / cheaper town.

  47. Shore Guy says:


    I lived downwind of Three Mile Island and not far from Oyster Creek. While those people in CA may have been over cautious, they were not behaving in an irrational way. All it takes is a failure to act a minute in time to have a life-altering experience with fallout.

    So they spent a few dollars unwisely at least it was their own money. People may t may not new to put lights n timers When away from home in order to prevent a brrak in, but many do

  48. Shore Guy says:


    I’d prefer to have someone die in their overpriced millstone than to tie It around my neck.

  49. Kettle1^2 says:


    MMMMMMM Japanese sea food. Not really a surprise. All of that sea water being pumped into the reactors had to go somewhere. Once again, not doomsday but far from optimistic or even “stable”.

    NEWS ADVISORY: Radioactive cesium 24.8 times higher detected in seawater near nuke plantNote
    01:35 22 March
    NEWS ADVISORY: Radioactive iodine 126.7 times higher detected in seawater near nuke plant


  50. 30 year realtor says:

    #36 Moose – NEVER! If you couldn’t tell, I’m a little negative on the market. Right now we are playing out my worst expectations for the Spring market. There is nothing positive for me to hang my hat on at this point.

    Agents and sellers will continue the same dance forever, good market or bad.

  51. Kettle1^2 says:


    Would you have stayed put with your family in Tokyo or one of the closer towns and taken the governments word at face value? Would you have gotten/taken iodine ?

  52. Kettle1^2 says:



  53. Kettle1^2 says:



  54. Juice Box says:

    re #51- Large specific gravity and insolubility will cause the radioactive elements to settle down into the sediment, no worries it will just stay there offshore for eons. I would not eat the shellfish!

  55. chi (18)-

    3 years, 36 mm guaranteed belongs in the Mets’ hall of shame right alongside Bonilla’s mortgaged contract.

  56. A.West says:

    This is not the time of year that lowballs are likely to work. There is lots of hope in Spring, as this is the start of the selling season. Sellers don’t start getting desperate until they realize that the peak season is over, people don’t want to move their kids during the school year, so they need a contract by August at the latest.

    From what I’ve seen, Spring is the time to pay higher prices for the most desirable properties – the best lots in the best locations, the most prepped and updated houses. Because there are more new homes coming on the market and to choose from by April or so. The prettiest ones often get picked off by the less price sensitive buyers, assuming the sellers aren’t deluding themselves on prices. Most are, so price reductions come in after a month or two, getting contracts offered in May, June, July. By September, you can confidently lowball – and find out if the seller really wants to sell or has just been trolling for suckers all summer. You just have to watch out that the end of season bargains aren’t houses with hidden problems, maybe they went off back on market because of inspection issues, or other issues others caught.

    In terms of property tax, that’s all part of the concept that housing is an expense, not an investment. I’ve budgeted not only for mortgage, but also for property tax hikes, plus an ongoing 5% annual decline in the value of my house, until it stabilizes at 30% below my purchase price (still wouldn’t be underwater). Even after budgeting for all that, I calculated that we could afford to make my wife happy with our new house, and continue to build up savings. No point in living/dying like Hetty Green, though this is the opposite problem most Americans have.

  57. Kettle1^2 says:

    Juice 56

    its not the shellfish that will be the problem, but the top predators int he relevant food chain. Bio-accumulation is a b1tch! Materials that settle on the bottom like heavy metals accumulate at the highest levels at the top of the food chain.


    I seem to recall that in terms of immediate exposure the shorter half-life isotopes were more dangerous then the long half-life isotopes to due to the more energetic decay ( in general) of the short half-life species (i.e you can hold a chunk of plutonium in your hand if you are wearing heavy gloves and be fine but doing the same with iodine-131 would be a very bad idea due to gamma emission and its short half-life). The short half-life concept is also the principle behind salted nukes (cobalt-60 with a half-life of 5 years) used to inflict high degrees or radiation damage.

  58. chicagofinance says:

    We have some good ones coming down the pike, such as the day Piazza is exposed as a steroid cheat……..

    Debt Supernova says:
    March 21, 2011 at 12:30 pm
    chi (18)- 3 years, 36 mm guaranteed belongs in the Mets’ hall of shame right alongside Bonilla’s mortgaged contract.

  59. west (58)-

    Any seller who isn’t absolutely shocked by the complete absence of ready, willing and able buyers right now will not panic when Memorial Day comes, as stupid is forever. It is slower now- by several magnitudes- than it was Fall ’08 through Spring ’09, so any seller delusional enough to even be trying to sell a house into this holocaust would sooner respond to a bullet between the eyes than a listing agent telling him to price correctly.

    The market is completely broken now and will not clear. 100% illiquid, 100% sham. Can’t do short sales, because the borrowers know the sheriff sales have halted. They are prepping to stay in their homes for another 3+ years. Can’t do REO, because the banks are stockpiling them, and the only ones they list for sale have asking prices that are laughable.

  60. JJ says:

    Cheaper town? Did my tax return on Sunday and current value of home is ten months income.
    My taxes are cheap, like $8,400 buy imagine my displeasure when I entered it into turbotax and saw my taxes and refund amount not change at all. 100% non-deductable. Tommorow is my tax challenge meeting. I got 15 minutes to go over why I am over taxed on my house. With no mortgage on house RE taxes are only expense if I can knock that down win/win. More money in my pocket and makes my home worth more if I sell. I most likely will lose but I love a fight.

    I hate my town. One women in school told my neighbor only two types of people in town stuck up bit%ches and white trash. Women ran off before she could ask which one she was.

    Double Down says:
    March 21, 2011 at 11:58 am

    JJ, why buy a big house in a “rich town” when doing so would obviously make you unhappy? You think the ballers there worry about tax deduct-ability of RE taxes?

    The carry and taxes will always be high. Either make the move, or look at a smaller house / cheaper town.

  61. My next move may be off the grid (cooking, back-of-house foodservice, etc). The idea of being anonymous and impossible to contact is beginning to really sound appealing. I’m close enough to the Lehigh Valley to do it there without getting outed. Some really good restaurants & farms out there, too…much better food scene than in NJ.

    Slicing 10 years off my age & resume today. Wife says a little Grecian Formula should do the trick. Thank God I’m healthy and can pass for younger.

    Will have to practice shutting my mouth and limiting conversation to sports and music to really pull this off.

  62. Needless to say, my disappearance from the grid will coincide with my universal default. :)

  63. sas3 says:

    Ket, I’d have probably bought a few iodide pills and started thinking about contingency plans to move out of Tokyo if I were there. However, if I were in CA, I’d definitely not buy iodide pills and not at all ingest them (a friend was mentioning how a colleague was chugging down some iodide pills in their office in SF).

    Also, the short half life may be a good thing for longer-term exposures (stay away from contaminated foods/areas for a few months and the doses will become closer to background levels).

    For comparison, where would you rank the reactor fallout in relation to BP, 3-mile island, and Chernobyl?

  64. In retrospect, it is amazing how long we have been able to sustain the illusion of a good and productive life within the framework of a completely rotten society and economy.

    It’s all turning to shit, folks. We’re weeks to months away from a Tom Joad standard of living for all. Smoke ’em while you got ’em.

  65. Shore Guy says:


    Of course, the health effects of radiation largely depend on whether it is an internal or external dose. An ingested alpha emitter will ruin one’s day.

  66. Kettle1^2 says:

    SAS 65

    I dont think TMI can be compared to this in temrs of health effects. Physical containment of the melt down was contained and the primary containment structures were never compromised.

    How Fukushima compares to Chernobyl cant be said yet as Fukushima is still on going and the available data is incomplete at best. At this point, I dont think it will be worse then Chernobyl unless they have 1 or more spent fuel pools ignite and burn for a non trivial period of time. However there is a heck of a spread between Chernobyl and the GOM BP incident.

    I guess i would range them as follows, with the disclaimer that there are huge differences between each of these.

    Chernobyl > Fukushima > BP GOM > TMI

  67. DL says:

    Treasury’s Mortgage Debt Sale Comes at Tough Time for Housing

    Do ya think?

  68. DL says:

    Existing-home sales fall 9.6% in February
    Median sales prices drops to lowest level since 2002


    Can’t be true.

  69. Kettle1^2 says:


    Reversion to mean is a b1tch

  70. JJ says:

    Annual Nassau County Home Price Appreciation Rates. If you look at this the 1980-1988 RE Run up was a lot bigger than the latest melt up. Kinda forgot those days. 1984 to 1986 was a crazy run up.
    1980 15.40%
    1981 12.38%
    1982 13.93%
    1983 18.01%
    1984 27.33%
    1985 19.62%
    1986 20.12%
    1987 15.42%
    1988 3.96%
    1989 -2.02%
    1990 -6.52%
    1991 -0.50%
    1992 1.88%
    1993 0.59%
    1994 -2.34%
    1995 2.11%
    1996 1.62%
    1997 3.62%
    1998 7.88%
    1999 13.00%
    2000 13.26%
    2001 12.11%
    2002 15.17%
    2003 13.61%
    2004 15.43%
    2005 13.82%
    2006 3.18%
    2007 -2.12%
    2008 -7.26%
    2009 -5.07%

    The highest annual home appreciation rate in the Nassau Real Estate Market
    was 27% in the twelve months ended with the 4th Quarter of 1984. The worst
    annual home appreciation rate in the Nassau Market was -7% in the twelve
    months ended with the 4th Quarter of 2008.

  71. NJ Toast says:

    Debt – 63:

    Good food in the Lehigh Valley, one to chew on – know nothing about it:

    We want to try one of these in 2011, anyone ever go?


  72. yo'me says:

    You have to remember Property taxes can only be deducted up to $10,000.And a second home is a total waste.Can’t deduct property tax at all.

  73. nj escapee says:

    Good luck Debster!!

  74. DL says:

    In Brielle, Monmouth County, Terri LaPoint has helped about 15 friends and neighbors navigate the property tax appeal system.

    “People don’t know they can do this. It’s very easy,” she said of appeals to the county Board of Taxation.

    LaPoint said everyone she’s helped so far has slashed their assessments by at least $65,000. LaPoint lopped 20 percent off her own assessment, saving herself nearly $1,500 in taxes.

  75. hughesrep says:


    You can file your Monmouth county appeal online. I did it while eating lunch today.

  76. prtraders2000 says:


    Real estate taxes are deductible over 10k and on your second property for Fed. NJ limits you to the 10k. JJ lives in NY. 10 to 1 he’s in AMT and that’s why his real estate taxes made no difference in his overall tax liability.

  77. Barbara says:

    Debt Supernova,
    I have always been intrigued by the Lehigh Valley. When you say restaurant scene, do you mean in Easton and Bethlehem? I was seriously looking into buying in Easton, but the school system is horrible. Beautiful houses up in that Lafayette U area and the downtown is amazing looking.

  78. JJ says:

    I filed on line and got turned down. Tommorrow is the in=person meeting to beg my case. I am two for four in grieving. I really don’t want to go to two in five.
    Comparables sales lower, double yellow line on street, smoke stack/power lines/cell phone towers visiable from property, adjacant to commericial property, school near house, eyesore next door or neighbors house blown out on top of yours are good. Also find out what comparables they used and see if they are mitigating factors which makes your house worth less. Show up on time, dress business casual, act like you are middle class and be nice but make them know if you don’t get something off you are filling further petition. Also go to Americas Most Wanted site or EPA site and maybe you will get lucky and a pedophile or toxic waste is near house.

    hughesrep says:
    March 21, 2011 at 1:56 pm

    You can file your Monmouth county appeal online. I did it while eating lunch today.

  79. hughesrep says:


    I had real solid comps and was realistic in the current value. I was going to skip the begging and go with bribery. I figure slide him a few hundred for this year and then blackmail him in the future.

    If Christie is going to increase my out of pocket health insurnacecosts by 6K I’ll have to get it back somehow.

  80. Shore Guy says:


    For me, the images of 1 and 3 are the most disturbing.

  81. Shore Guy says:


    A detailed PowerPoint and asking about each level f appeal through the courts has kept me the lowest assessed house on the street, although larger than many others.

  82. JJ says:

    wow grieving taxes is exhausting. A nieghbor a few doors from me is operating an illegal business from home, guy has multiple commerical vehicles at house and workers coming and going and he parks the vehicles on street and driveway overnight.

    So it is a slam dunk if a commercial business is near me to grieve taxes. Wow. Guy had his address advertised on trucks, internet, yellow pages, even D&B yet I can’t find his damm house on tax records to prove that address exists. Finally it comes to me it is a corner house. So check this out, he has two mail addresses . One is his residential mail box with real address. Second is a business mailbox using the the street name and since their is gaps in numbers on street he picked a number between his two nieghbors. Hene he can have a commerical business in a residential street as with corner house he created second fictional address. Took me over two hours to figure it out. Interestingly if neighbors called to complain about trucks and business at that address it all ties to phony address. Guy even put the fake number on the door on the side street and took off real number on real street. Pretty smart. Any zoning complaints gets tossed due to fake address. Trouble is I figured it out and under real address on assessor site they have a picture of his house with his truck in driveway with fake address visable. I may not win tommorrow but the person who hears my case may have a fun time.

    almost as good as the day I got a speeding ticket on a fall day where the wind was blowing at gusts up to 45 mph and I got a 45mph in a 30mph and cop could not remember top wind speed that day.

    hughesrep says:
    March 21, 2011 at 2:16 pm

    I had real solid comps and was realistic in the current value. I was going to skip the begging and go with bribery. I figure slide him a few hundred for this year and then blackmail him in the future.

    If Christie is going to increase my out of pocket health insurnacecosts by 6K I’ll have to get it back somehow.

  83. Kettle1^2 says:

    Shore 87

    Of course there is no time/date info on those images. In a related thought, 5 of the original 50 are reported to now be dead from radiation and 15 are reported as “injured”

  84. LW says:

    Re grim’s comment #1..I saw that article yesterday in the Record online and left a comment along the line of the 35% haircut that house took and …funny..never did the comment appear in the comments section.
    I wonder if I had applauded the hard work of the agent if I would of been published quickly…

  85. JJ says:

    I am the lowest assessed house on my block right now. But as Charlie Sheen said Winning, DUH. I won’t use powerpoint as us blue collar middle class folk don’t know how those big fancy computers work. It is the rich folk working out of home not paying their taxes that bring down the property values of us poor folk. My weird pet pieve is they somehow assessed my home really cheap for 2009, then jacked if ofr 2010 and now is normal for 2011. It appears they raised my assessment 10% in 2009 to offset the way too big drop in 2008. That is not how it works. So it is just the 2009 assessment I am fighting. A one year thing. Nassau re-assesses every year. So it is always fun when they screw up one year to offset a screw up the year earlier

    Speaking of poor, I hate nmy BMW sometimes, went to get a quote on something on Saturday and had to park down the block. My old wagon I pulled right up front. The damm BMW I have to hid so the damm blue collar folks don’t out blue collar me.

    Shore Guy says:
    March 21, 2011 at 2:43 pm

    A detailed PowerPoint and asking about each level f appeal through the courts has kept me the lowest assessed house on the street, although larger than many others.

  86. Kettle1^2 says:


    Here si some oblivion for you!

    Police say a San Antonio Taco Bell customer enraged that the seven burritos he ordered had gone up in price fired an air gun at an employee and later fired an assault rifle at officers before barricading himself into a hotel room.

    Brian Tillerson, a manager at the Taco Bell/KFC restaurant, told the San Antonio Express-News that the man was angry the Beefy Crunch Burrito had gone from 99 cents to $1.49 each.


  87. gary says:

    chicagofinance [50],

    Udo Dirkschneider!!. Yup, I had this album! Cool! Still not as twisted as Rammstein and a few others, though!

  88. gary says:

    Where does the George Foster deal rank with the Perez thing? The Mets have got to hold the record for the worst player transactions in the history of professional sports.

  89. toast (74)-

    Bolete is the real deal. Better than a lot of alleged “top” NYC places…definitely lacking the piss poor attitude, too.

  90. babs (83)-

    You just need to go to Hellertown/Saucon Valley to buy. Good HS there.

    I have also heard good things about Parkland HS in Allentown.

  91. JJ says:

    Name of issuer Apollo Global Management
    Industry Financials – Investment Trusts
    Security type Class A Common Stock

    Big time sign market is overpriced. Apollo IPO is out of the gate.

  92. vodka (93)-

    Why just fire an air gun at the employee, when he could’ve opened up with his assault rifle?

  93. jj (98)-

    This is Leon Black’s version of selling the world a big bag of shit.

  94. Confused In NJ says:

    With U.S. and coalition forces bombarding Libya leader Muammer al-Qaddafi’s forces from the sea and air, the cost for the first day alone of the operation was well over $100 million with the total price tag expected to grow much higher the longer the strikes continue, analysts said.

    Operation Odyssey Dawn appears to be focused on creating a limited no-fly zone mostly targeting Tripoli and other areas along the coast, which will require a wide range of military assets.

    With allies expected to shoulder some of the bill, the initial stages of taking out Libya’s air defenses could ultimately cost U.S.-led coalition forces between $400 million and $800 million, according to a report released by the Center for Strategic and Budgetary Assessments earlier this month.

    Maintaining a coastal no-fly-zone after those first strikes would cost in the range of $30 million to $100 million per week — not pocket change by any means, but far less than the $100 million to $300 million estimated weekly cost for patrolling the skies above the entire 680,000-square-mile country

  95. JJ says:

    also has a bunch of idiots working there who will listen to his rants and has very little support departments. who needs hr/accounting/finance/audit – Leon knows what they need.

    ebt Supernova says:
    March 21, 2011 at 3:37 pm
    jj (98)-

    This is Leon Black’s version of selling the world a big bag of shit.

  96. cobbler says:

    Great chart on radiation:

  97. chicagofinance says:

    A local newscast from Easton that may interest you…..

  98. Anon E. Moose says:

    Debt [100];

    “selling the world a big bag of shit.”


  99. Anon E. Moose says:

    Con’t [105];

    “selling the world a big bag of shit.”

    As compared with selling the world decrepit overpriced crapshacks?

  100. chicagofinance says:

    MARCH 21, 2011
    The One Met Their Fans Most Loved to Hate


    This spring in Port St. Lucie, Fla., Mets loyalists are engaged in a tug of war over which player—the recently released Luis Castillo or the likely soon-to-be-released Oliver Perez—is the most loathed in team history.

    Perez’s detractors rightly cite the left-hander’s three-year, $36 million contract; his 0-5 record, 6.80 earned run average last season and his mind-decaying inability to throw a pitch that travels (A) straight, (B) faster than 82 mph and (C) past the hitter.

    Castillo’s bashers, however, have their own case. The former All-Star second baseman has no range, faded speed and a slow bat. He also committed what must be considered the most infamous drop of a pop fly in franchise lore—a June 12, 2009 blunder that allowed the Yankees to come from behind to defeat their crosstown rivals in the ninth inning.

    Yet for all the ire directed toward those two, it fails to approach 1/100th the level of venom once absorbed by Douglas Randall Sisk, a former Mets right-handed reliever who, through much of his five-plus seasons in New York from 1982-87, took as severe a beating as anyone in the history of the game.

    Or, to make a clearer point: During the team’s 1986 world championship season, Mets officials thought it would be fun to use Shea Stadium’s JumboTron scoreboard to play a fictionalized computer game between the ’69 Mets and the current team. As the battle went back and forth, a sellout crowd cheered. When Keith Hernandez homered, fans stood. When Nolan Ryan came on in relief, they clapped.

    When the game ended with a triumph for the ’86 club, the stadium went wild.

    Then, WP: Doug Sisk flashed across the screen.


    “You’re supposed to just ignore the negativity and pitch well,” says Sisk. “But it’s much, much, much easier said than done. When you know that your home fans are going to kill you every time you take the field, well, it isn’t helpful. I don’t care what people say about mind-over-matter—always getting booed takes a toll. It has to.”

    Now 53 and living in Tacoma, Wash., Sisk has the perspective of a ballplayer 25 years removed from the vitriol. He works as a part-time scout for the organization, as well as a broadcaster for the Triple-A Tacoma Rainiers. When he speaks of the dark days with the Mets, his voice conveys nary a trace of anger. “New York’s fans are amazingly passionate,” he says. “When they get behind you…”

    Once upon a time, they were, in fact, behind Doug Sisk. As a rookie in 1983, he was one of the few bright spots on a dreadful ballclub, posting a 2.24 ERA and 11 saves in 67 appearances. The following season was even better—50 games, 15 saves and a stellar 2.09 ERA. “Doug was awesome,” says Ron Hodges, a Mets catcher at the time. “He had that heavy sinking fastball that just fell off the table. If you needed a ground ball, Doug was the guy you wanted on the mound. It was pretty automatic.”

    Hodges thinks back to April 5, 1983, when the Mets hosted Philadelphia on opening day. Following a 5 1/2-year absence, Tom Seaver started for New York, holding the Phillies scoreless through six innings. When manager George Bamberger pulled him, he brought in Sisk. “Doug was terrific,” says Hodges of the pitcher’s three shutout innings. “I think he even got the win.”

    Indeed, Sisk did, and as he and Hodges shook hands after Tony Perez struck out to end the game, optimism oozed through normally dreary Shea Stadium.

    It was all a mirage.

    Sisk spent much of the 1985 season pitching with loose bone chips in his right elbow, but he followed the code of the tough-as-nails ballplayer and said nothing.

    What ensued was an ode to the Bump Hadley School of Mound Ineffectiveness. Sisk’s once-reliable sinker turned into an unmanned garden hose, twisting left, spinning right, spiraling into the ground and high up in the air. His ERA peaked at 8.53 following a nightmarishly zany 1/3 inning against the Reds on May 4, during which he faced five batters, allowed three hits and four earned runs.

    Whenever Sisk walked to the Shea Stadium mound, boos accompanied him. The narrative was a predictable one: Sisk would walk two, strike out one, walk another, allow two or three runs then exit with his head down and his reputation increasingly tattered.

    Before long, something in New York fans changed. Sisk wasn’t merely disliked—he was loathed. Mets loyalists took to scratching the paint off his car with their keys and snapping his antennae and windshield wipers.

    One time, while driving out of the players’ parking lot following a game, Sisk was shocked to see someone jump in front of his car, pull out a gun and point it at his head. “[Reliever] Jesse Orosco was with me, and we swerved out of the way,” Sisk says. “That scared the absolute hell out of me.”

    Shortly thereafter, Sisk was returning to his home in Port Washington when he noticed a suspicious car trailing him all the way from the stadium. Sisk turned, the car turned. Sisk sped up, the car sped up. “There was no way I was going to drive home to my wife and child with these guys behind me,” he says. “So I pulled into [the parking lot of] a bar I used to frequent and walked in. I told the bouncers to look out for these guys, and when they walked to the door the bouncers wouldn’t let them in. Clearly, they were there to rough me up.”

    Eventually, Davey Johnson, the Mets manager, stopped pitching Sisk at Shea, an embarrassing decision that the ballplayer glumly accepted. “What fans don’t always seem to understand is that the worst thing you can do to a hometown player is boo him,” says Hodges. “We hear it, and it’s never encouraging. I’ve never fully understood the concept—if you want the Mets to win, wouldn’t you cheer someone like Doug?”

    Sisk underwent elbow surgery toward the end of 1985, and he appeared in 41 games, with a 4-2 mark and 3.06 ERA, for the world champions the following season. Yet his contributions were more social than physical.

    Sisk gained a sliver of fame as a 1/3 member of the “Scum Bunch,” the unofficial back-of-the-airplane club he formed with Orosco and outfielder Danny Heep. The trio spent their time drinking beers, throwing fruit and causing moderate levels of mayhem. “It was all just fun,” Sisk says. “We were just baseball players having a good time.”

    Sisk lasted one more season in New York, spent 1988 with the Baltimore Orioles and then—after bouncing around the minors—returned home to Tacoma.

    He has been immortalized on the widely read team website, Ultimate Mets Database, where fans remember him as “The human embodiment of Charlie Brown when he was out there on the hill,” “Mel Rojas before the real Mel Rojas came along” and “[a pitcher who] could choke on sherbet.”

    Oddly, the same man once prohibited from pitching at Shea now understands. A couple of years ago, while watching a Seattle Mariners game on TV, Sisk found himself irked by the performance of J.J. Putz, at the time a reliever with the club. Putz was scuffling to get through the inning, and Sisk thought his body language conveyed surrender.

    “Then the weirdest thing happened,” he says. “I was all alone, but I started booing at my television. That’s when I realized what those fans felt with me.

    “For the first time, I empathized.”

  101. First, I wondered who would want a company as broken as Realogy. Then, Leon Black stepped in and bought it.

    Then, Leon Black continued to run the company into the ground, and his pal (and Realogy’s biggest senior bondholder), Carl Icahn, stopped him from trying to do a toggle deal with the debt that violated the company’s debt covenants.

    Now, Realogy faces a class action lawsuit from agents of its various RE entities for selling them bogus health/major medical policies that didn’t pay doctors in some states when claims were filed. Realogy told all its agents the policies were good in all 50 states.

    At the moment, Realogy is still trying to restructure debt. One of their bright ideas is to go public again, IPO, and swap debt for shares.

    Good luck with that, Leon. Hint: don’t say the word “Cendant” around anyone interested in that IPO.

  102. moose (106)-

    STFU, asshole.

  103. chicagofinance says:

    He has been immortalized on the widely read team website, Ultimate Mets Database, where fans remember him as “The human embodiment of Charlie Brown when he was out there on the hill,” “Mel Rojas before the real Mel Rojas came along” and “[a pitcher who] could choke on sherbet.”

  104. IMO, no deal can surpass Mel Rojas for utter stupidity.

  105. Interesting looking back and seeing how the Mets singlehandedly destroyed my love of baseball in a sort of “death by 1,000 cuts” kind of way.

  106. chicagofinance says:

    Babs: here’s some gangsta rap for y’all…..

  107. JJ says:

    Back over a year ago I bought a 3k Realogy bond with a 12% coupon for big dicount like I paid 2k. just for giggles I am about to get my third coupon. How a bond I paid 2k for from a broke company can continue to pay $360 dollars a year interest is beyond me but I guess the sr. bondholders are appollo just sucking the life out of realogy.
    Kodak and AMR zombie companies for decades have bonds from 1991 still paying out with 12% coupons. A 10K bond Kodak or AMR bond bought in 1991 has now paid 24k in interest payments. I don’t think original bond holders could care less if they bk at this point. It is all gravy. Realogy is same thing. Another sr. Apollo bond I own is Afinnion also with a 12% coupon. Have that two years now. It is a 15k bond that pays $1800 a year interest. Leon does not call them as somehow I imagne he owns most of them. Why leave a 12% bond that is callable and trading above par out there unless you own it and sucking common shareholders dry.

    Debt Supernova says:
    March 21, 2011 at 4:09 pm
    First, I wondered who would want a company as broken as Realogy. Then, Leon Black stepped in and bought it.

  108. JJ says:

    75605EAW0 REALOGY CORP SR SUB 12.37500% 04/15/2015
    Third Party Price 98.500
    Can’t believe this dog is at near par. Was around 60 not that long ago.

  109. JJ says:

    AFFINION GROUP INC SR SB NT 11.50000% 10/15/2015
    CUSIP 00828DAJ0
    Coupon 11.500
    Maturity Date 10/15/2015
    Third Party Price 104.500

    More Leon madness. How does he borrow at these rates and make money?

  110. Barbara says:

    I think your eyes look a little heavy here, but nice job overall.


  111. Clyde Crashcup says:

    gary (95)

    Amos Otis for Joe Foy

    Nolan Ryan for Jim Fregosi

  112. jj (116)-

    Simple. Black is the ultimate Amerikan businessman: buy a company, saddle it with debt, bust it up and sell it off as junked parts if need be…and always, always make sure he gets paid first and gets paid no matter which way things move.

  113. gary says:


    How about Mickey Lolich for Rusty Staub!


  114. chi (121)-

    Can’t top Lougainis.

  115. Anon E. Moose says:

    Debt [119];

    Simple. Black is the ultimate Amerikan businessman: buy a company, saddle it with debt, bust it up and sell it off as junked parts if need be…and always, always make sure he gets paid first and gets paid no matter which way things move.

    Its just so errie how much your description resembles the typical resedential real estate transaction, with the agent wearing the “Black” hat.

  116. You really are a worthless piece of shit.

  117. Neanderthal Economist says:

    “Why should housing cost some multiple of income?”
    Shore, great question. I think its an extremely crude measure, more of a rule of thumb. Still, it doesn’t take into account financing or property taxes.
    Pork as percent of income is way better, that’s clearly what everyone uses as a guide… just back yourself into maximum monthly payment and everything will be ok. I promise.

  118. Neanderthal Economist says:

    Pork = piti
    … darn android.

  119. Neanderthal Economist says:

    “It’s the price, stupid”

    Double down… this is hillarious

  120. Neanderthal Economist says:

    “almost as good as the day I got a speeding ticket on a fall day where the wind was blowing at gusts up to 45 mph and I got a 45mph in a 30mph”
    Jj. What does wind matter to a speeding ticket? Do you drive a sail boat?

  121. Neanderthal Economist says:

    I wish we could get debt and moose intoxicated and make them play eachother in a game of golden tee.

  122. Al Mossberg says:

    Worst Mets trade ever.

    Juan Samuel for Lenny Dykstra and Roger McDowell.

    Its like the 80’s Mets dynasty self destructed itself kind of like the American economy.

  123. Al Mossberg says:

    Josh Thole is looking good though.

  124. Al Mossberg says:


    Speaking of off grid living. I dumped some federal reserve notes into a 130 watt solar panel today. Maybe Ill build my own fukashima reactor someday.

  125. Kettle1^2 says:


    The black comedy that is Fukushima continues……

    “Cooling pumps at one of Japan’s crippled nuclear reactors are damaged beyond repair and will need to be replaced, officials learned Monday. The revelation dashed hopes for a quick resolution to the ongoing nuclear catastrophe at the leaking Fukushima Dai-ichi plant. An emergency order has been placed for new pumps for Unit 2 at the plant, but it’s unclear how quickly they would arrive, officials said.”.

    Gee, a nuclear reactor goes kaboom and no one thinks to order mission critical parts on day 1, “just in case”? They keep claiming they “just need to restart cooling pumps”. Reactor 2 is the most physically intact reactor of the 4 problematic ones and its pumps are damaged beyond repair. Yet they think that any major portions of the cooling systems even physically intact in the other 3?!?! Hey dont forget that electrical system love being doused in salt water.

    Per the link form earlier today with the cement truck next to reactor 3, they are just now talking about bringing in tanks like the american M88 from the japanese defense force that will allow them to work and still provide substantial shielding to the operators, and they are just now talking about bringing in boom truck / cement pumpers.

    This act is a freaking black comedy so far. While they are certainly withholding substantial amounts of info on the state of the event so far, they seem to be further behind the curve then if the only info they had was the censored data releases. The individuals working on site are brave souls assuming it is voluntary, but the management from both the government and the corporation should be personally carrying fire hoses up to the spent fuel pools in nothing but their underwear.

    It’s nothing personal the japanese are handling this as bad as we handled Katrina

  126. Kettle1^2 says:


    video of them spraying reactor 3 with fire trucks


  127. Kettle1^2 says:

    Vienna, March 22 (DPA) The International Atomic Energy Agency (IAEA) said Monday that high radiation levels were measured recently not only inside, but also outside the 20-km evacuation zone around Japan’s stricken Fukushima nuclear plant.

    Asked whether Japan’s authorities should consider widening the exclusion zone, a senior IAEA official said: ‘There should be a consideration about this.’ The official requested anonymity.

    At the same time, IAEA officials said radiation rates are declining and levels are not unhealthy in dozens of Japanese cities including Tokyo, for which the Vienna-based agency is receiving official Japanese data.

    On Sunday, one measurement 58 km from Fukushima registered 5.7 microsieverts per hour, the IAEA said in data provided to reporters.

    At that rate, people would be exposed to the IAEA’s annual recommended maximum radiation of one millisievert within about seven days.

  128. Foreclosures are adding up to the glut of upset properties and pressuring prices, leaving some Americans with bigger mortgages than their homes are value as joblessness hovers near 9 percent. The figures underscore the Federal Reserve’s view that the housing market “continues to be miserable” even as the rest of the economy improves.

  129. Quality post. In theory I’d like to write like this too – taking time and real effort to make a good article… but what can I say.. I keep putting it off and never appear to attain anything.

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