White Elephant Returns to Jersey

From the Star Ledger:

McMansions swell the real eastate market as homebuyers think small

Ten years ago, when their grandchildren were young and visiting often, Frank and Rosemary Santoloci bought a brand new five-bedroom, four-bathroom home on four acres in Sparta.

There was ample room to play indoors, swim in the pool and and spend time outdoors.

But now the boys have gown up and don’t come over as frequently, so last spring, the couple put their home on the market. The house sold within four months — after they cut the price.

The Santolocis are among the lucky ones.

There is a glut of these McMansions on the market in the suburbs throughout New Jersey, real estate agents and analysts said.

Certain homebuyers once prized these large houses, tucked away on a few acres of land and featuring half a dozen bedrooms, grand entranceways, and three-car garages.

But in the face of the economic collapse, declines in personal wealth, a tight housing market, and a shift of what prospective homeowners want, all that has changed.

Major demographic changes could also make the market shrink even further in the next five years, as baby boomers retire and look to downsize. The generation behind them is smaller and has less money and a desire to live closer to urban centers.

“We definitely have an oversupply of inventory for the so-called McMansions,” said Mary Pat Spekhardt, a real estate agent with Coldwell Banker in Sparta who worked with the Santolocis.

“Houses are staying on the market double the time that they used to, and everyone is frustrated,” she said. “We can’t make buyers, though, that’s the problem. We market, market, market the house and make the house stand out, but the buyers are few and far between.”

In New Jersey, it would take 14.6 months to sell the current inventory of houses listed between $600,000 and $1 million, according to real estate analyst Jeffrey Otteau, president of Otteau Valuation Group. The only houses that are selling are those with unique features, like an inground pool or a media room in the basement, agents said.

And the issue is only going to get worse.

This entry was posted in Economics, New Development, New Jersey Real Estate. Bookmark the permalink.

167 Responses to White Elephant Returns to Jersey

  1. grim says:

    From HousingWire:

    Housing to gradually improve in 2012, NAR economist says

    Gradual improvement in the housing market is expected next year, with existing-home sales edging up 4% to 5% and new home sales getting an even bigger boost off this year’s record lows, the chief economist of the nation’s largest real estate group said Friday.

    “Tight mortgage credit conditions have been holding back homebuyers all year, and consumer confidence has been shaky recently,” Lawrence Yun, chief economist of the National Association of Realtors, said. “Nonetheless, there is a sizeable pent-up demand based on population growth, employment levels and a doubling-up phenomenon that can’t continue indefinitely.”

    Yun, who made his comments during the annual NAR conference for real estate agents under way in Anaheim, Calif., projected gross domestic product growth of 1.8% for 2011, rising to 2.2% in 2012 with the unemployment rate declining to 8.7% by the second half of 2012.

    Mortgage interest rates, he predicted, would gradually rise from record 2011 lows to 4.5% by the middle of 2012.

    “Very favorable affordability conditions will dominate next year as well, which will probably be the second best year on record dating back to 1970. Our hope is that credit restrictions will ease and allow more homebuyers to take advantage of current opportunities.”

    With falling inventory, the median home price should rise in 2012, he said. “Home prices have yet to show a definitive stabilization pattern in most areas. Still, given an over-correction in prices, there likely will be moderate appreciation in 2012,” Yun said.

  2. grim says:

    From the LA Times:

    In foreclosure-plagued Vegas, empty homes go to pot

    The Ballard house was as unassuming as any in the stucco outskirts of Las Vegas: a two-story box the color of an oatmeal cookie. Police charged inside one night searching for a domestic violence suspect. Instead, they smelled something skunky.

    Marijuana. Lots of it.

    Two-foot-tall plants fought for space in a hallway, police later testified. Half a dozen jars of buds hid in a closet. The master bedroom was something of a jungle, with two Ballard children, ages 8 and 9, asleep on the bed.

    The home — with four bedrooms and 61 plants — was one of the smaller alleged grow operations authorities have dismantled this year. At another home, authorities seized 878 plants worth an estimated $2.6 million.

    Las Vegas has a pot home problem. And like many of the region’s maladies, it’s tied to the housing slump.

    Last year, authorities took down 153 indoor grow sites in Nevada and seized more than 13,000 plants, compared with 18 sites and 1,000 plants in 2005, the U.S. Drug Enforcement Administration said. (By comparison, California busted 791 indoor sites last year.)

    “You can’t have crime without opportunity,” said William Sousa, a criminologist at the University of Nevada, Las Vegas. “And all those empty homes present an opportunity for criminal activity.”

  3. Bocephus says:

    A country boy can survive.

  4. grim says:

    From the Washington Post:

    Housing woes won’t yield to quick fix

    We Americans think of ourselves as problem-solvers, but the housing collapse has so far eluded all solutions. Perhaps 10 million homes have gone into foreclosure since 2006; millions more will follow. From their peaks during the real-estate bubble, home prices are down 30 percent, new housing construction has dropped 75 percent and existing home sales are off almost 30 percent. Housing’s collapse is one reason the economic recovery is so weak. Construction remains depressed, as are the appliance and furniture sales spurred by home buying.

    It may be that patience is the only cure. Home prices have to find bottom; only then will more buyers return. Almost all efforts to accelerate that process by stemming foreclosures have come up short of promises. The Obama administration originally hoped that its Home Affordable Modification Program — lowering some homeowners’ monthly mortgage payments — would help up to 4 million borrowers; at last count, the number was 850,000.

    Americans assume that all problems have “fixes.” But some don’t. History suggests that it will be hard to overcome the housing bust’s powerful undertow. Pent-up demand and attractive prices may be the only cure. Economist Khater has studied regional housing collapses and finds that it takes seven to nine years before prices regain previous peaks. If anything, he says, today’s bust looks much worse.

  5. Mike says:

    Good Morning New Jersey

  6. Mike says:

    When these white elephants / mcmansions that nobody wants anymore come down to an irristable price what happens to the value of the smaller 3br colonials and capes? Here’s the formula x = y screwed

  7. grim says:

    If the drivers are upkeep, utilities, and taxes, perhaps that isn’t the case Mike, at least not in a perfectly linear fashion.

    There seems to be a bit of a gap between the Mega-McMansions and the average pre-bubble(s) home. From a size perspective, obviously, at least anecdotally anyway. Keep in mind that a big portion of the middle ground is found in the (generally) more upscale/nicer neighborhoods. Slightly older homes, with more generous proportions than the average crappy cape, but nothing on par with the 3k sq ft monsters.

    That said, could we potentially see the McMansions fall much harder than the rest? I think so.

  8. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Mike 6 Already happening here in the hinter land mcmansions 400 , chc 3 , bi-level a duece, ranches buck & a half.

  9. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Grim 7 you may have something there my rental mcmansion cost 7 k a year to heat (propane) now a CHC with lower heating & taxes might make it more attractive at a less than proportional decline. In my experience people do not look that closely like guy who bought it after I handed him the outragous heating & electric numbers. Think they have furniture 1.5 years later ,not!

  10. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Lots of typos today, I either need more coffe or a drink. OK where is Clot I have gone with the latter & hate to drink alone.

  11. Mikey, where are the good grow houses in Vernon?

  12. Toll Bros now offering a McMansion with quoins, wing walls, free finished basement and pot conservatory.

  13. Fabius Maximus says:

    #8 Mike

    You also need to start reporting Doublewides. That will be a growing segment as people start running out of cash.

    What amenities do you think a HOV McWide come with?

  14. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Clot 11 none that I know of but I am to old to run in those circles. Then again not that old as an eye opener in the morn is still an option.

  15. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Gotta run catch you later.

  16. The Original NJ Expat says:

    Reading grim’s posts today, maybe the answer lies between a few of those stories. Maybe the Obama administration could issue a tax credit and a grow license for indoor Marijauna grow sites so long as you buy a newer home with a 3 car garage, vaulted foyer and two stairways to the second floor. Call it the Home Empowered McMansion Marijuana Production Program (HEMMPP). Houses get sold, small business flourishes, what could be better?

  17. Shore Guy says:

    From McMansion to boarding house in one recession. How long before they tear up the lawns and start planting crops or turn the lawns into grazing land?

  18. Shore Guy says:

    Or like that article I posted yesterday, they start using them as dorms.

  19. Shore Guy says:

    “(HEMMPP)”

    Is that just for medical purposes? Or is it a sort of a Buds for Economic Justice program?

  20. 3B says:

    #1 Nonetheless, there is a sizeable pent-up demand based on population growth, employment levels and a doubling-up phenomenon that can’t continue indefinitely.

    Says who??

  21. borat obama says:

    Hi. Fivee

  22. borat obama says:

    Mornink jerseyy

  23. borat obama says:

    Firsttt

  24. chicagofinance says:

    FUKING JETS

  25. JJ says:

    This crazy bond was issued at par in January of this year and is selling in large amount on Fidelity in secondary with no prospectus attached. Wonder how many people jsut see words Morgan Stanley 10% coupon and just hit they buy button?

    MORGAN STANLEY D W DISC SRMTNS 10.00000 01/21/2026RGE ACRL NT
    Basic Analytics
    Price (Ask) 86.750
    Yield to Worst (Ask) 11.950%
    61745E2K6
    Beginning January 21, 2013, it is possible that you could receive little or no interest on the notes. If, on the related CMS reference determination date, the CMS reference index level is equal to or less than the CMS reference index strike, interest will accrue at a rate of 0.00% for that interest payment period. In addition, if on any day, the index closing value is determined to be less than the index reference level, interest will accrue at a rate of 0.00% per annum for that day. The determination of the index closing value will be subject to certain market disruption events. Leverage factor: 5 CMS reference index: 30-Year Constant Maturity Swap Rate minus 2-Year Constant Maturity Swap Rate.Please see “Additional Provisions—CMS Reference Index” on page 3. CMS reference index strike: 0.00% Index: The S&P 500® Index

  26. NJGator says:

    Shore (previous thread) – Not sure what’s going on, but I doubt Muschamp will be given long to right that ship. It feels a bit like the Ron Zook era. Sigh…

    And Meat, we do have power. Have had it for a week. Stu’s just lazy :)

  27. NJGator says:

    The Feds are coming to Elizabeth…

    Sources: FBI joins criminal investigation into abuse allegations against Elizabeth school board

    ELIZABETH — A criminal investigation into allegations of abuses within the Elizabeth Board of Education has been joined by federal prosecutors, according to two school district employees, who say they were questioned by the FBI.
    The two, who filed a lawsuit two weeks ago to halt an internal investigation into leaks of confidential school board records, would not disclose specifically what was discussed, but said they were both asked about a wide range of matters involving the board. The state-supported school district has been the focus of allegations of spending abuses, secret settlements and the pressuring of teachers to make campaign contributions in exchange for jobs.
    Neither individual was identified by name in the suit, citing fears of retribution if they came forward.
    A spokesman for the U.S. Attorney said he could neither confirm nor deny whether a federal investigation was under way.
    District officials would not say if they have received federal subpoenas. The Elizabeth board is already the focus of a state inquiry by the New Jersey Attorney General’s office, which filed criminal charges in September against board president Marie L. Munn and two others in connection with defrauding the National School Lunch Program. The three were charged with filing falsified applications to obtain free federally subsidized lunches for their children.
    The investigations come in the wake of a series of stories in The Star-Ledger detailing the school lunch program abuses, as well as allegations that jobs and promotions in Elizabeth were tied to the amount of money employees contribute to school board candidates and others running for political office.
    The board, meanwhile, has retained several criminal defense attorneys to help it respond to criminal subpoena requests for records and other information.

    http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2011/11/sources_fbi_joins_criminal_inv.html

  28. JJ says:

    doubling up refers to Zucatti Park, realtors are already trying to sell them condos as sooon as protest ends

  29. Anon E. Moose says:

    Mike [6];

    When these white elephants / mcmansions that nobody wants anymore come down to an irristable price what happens to the value of the smaller 3br colonials and capes? Here’s the formula x = y screwed

    Mike, I would not be suprized to see the prices of some smaller homes to exceed that of some larger homes – due to factoring in the cost of property taxes and the care and feeding.

    I’ll give you a very vivid example – light general aviation aircraft. The cost of a twin engine plane is, in many cases, less than that of a comparable performance single engine plane. The reason is that the maintenance costs is almost double (two engines to service, rather than one); the cost of flying it is about 50% more based on fuel consumption. The big ticket number, engine overhaul ($22k-25k each side), can easily exceed the current market value of some airframes.

    Total cost of ownership is being priced in, so it can be with houses.

  30. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    (24) chifi,

    Nothing personal, but you know I am enjoying the pain this morning.

  31. Anon E. Moose says:

    Shore [17];

    From McMansion to boarding house in one recession. How long before they tear up the lawns and start planting crops or turn the lawns into grazing land?

    Indeed… http://www.cnbc.com/id/45276709/

  32. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    Cramer mentioned a “developing rift between the US and Canada” and said “we are shafting canada left and right”. He suggested that the canadians aren’t going to stand for that much longer.

    Got loonies?

    How about a passport with a maple leaf on it?

  33. Juice Box says:

    So Buffet was watching Jeopardy and thought their Watson computer was like the HAL9000 and actually was self aware, so he goes on CNBC to pump his 10 Billion dollar investment. Did anyone tell him Watson did not see or hear the questions on Jeopardy since they were transmitted to it instantly, and a monkey with access to Google could do just as well?

  34. gary says:

    “Houses are staying on the market double the time that they used to, and everyone is frustrated,” she said. “We can’t make buyers, though, that’s the problem. We market, market, market the house and make the house stand out, but the buyers are few and far between.”

    Tick… tick… tick… tick…

  35. gary says:

    We went to an open house in Wyckoff yesterday. It’s the first time in a while that I went to one as it’s the same old dog and pony line but I was in the mood to kill some time before the Giants game (ugh).

    Anyway, the house was listed at 599K, 4 bd/2bth and dated across the board. It had septic so that pretty much rules that out unless their giving me the house. Nonetheless, I wanted to check it out. The first words out of the realtor’s mouth when we walked in was, “this house is not worth what it’s listed… I’m gonna tell you right now.” Ahhh… music to my ears. I like this girl!! We toured the house… needed work…. but decent layout. Whatever. We had a 45 minute conversation about the market and she agreed that it’s bad and it could get worse. No kidding. She told of us of a client who bought a house in Upper Saddle River in 2006 for 1.4 million and just had an offer for 850K. She said the owners are freak1ng out. Oh f*cking well!

    During our time at the open house, no one else showed up. There were three names on the sign-in sheet. Meh.

  36. JJ says:

    U.S. home prices will probably decline an additional 6 percent to 8 percent before bottoming, Pacific Investment Management Co.’s Scott Simon said.

    Potential home buyers are being kept on the sidelines by policy makers tightening rules for government-backed loans and banks being more restrictive than required by Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac and the Federal Housing Administration, Simon said in a radio interview on “Bloomberg Surveillance” with Tom Keene from Pimco’s headquarters in Newport Beach, California.

    “If you can borrow, housing is so cheap, but if you can’t borrow it’s infinitely expensive,” said Simon, the mortgage head at the firm, which runs the world’s largest bond fund.

    The worst housing slump since the Great Depression has so far driven property values down by about 31 percent since a mid- 2006 peak, according to an S&P/Case-Shiller index.

    Drops of 15 percent to 20 percent more would become a “dire situation” because that would leave nearly half of U.S. homeowners with mortgages owing more than their properties’ values, up from about a third now, he said.

  37. gary says:

    “Nonetheless, there is a sizeable pent-up demand based on population growth, employment levels and a doubling-up phenomenon that can’t continue indefinitely.” Lawrence Yun, chief economist of the National Association of Realtors, said.

    @sshole.

  38. Anon E. Moose says:

    Gary [35];

    I went to an open house a week ago Sunday on a house we’ve bid on. On the market (as in actively listed continuously) for 3 years. Currently $170k off OLP, and still listed at least $25k higher than an identical comp that sold two months ago (not even accounting for condition defecit of this property). It shows like a foreclosure (missing appliances, broken window treatments), and after rotting for three years unoccupied the sellers just don’t get it.

    I strategically timed my visit to be at the end of the open. Still, I was the first one there, and the only one, except for the neighbors who popped in to check on the current listing price. Presently convinced that with such business accumen, two successive generations will die owning the same property, though not by design.

  39. Anon E. Moose says:

    JJ [36];

    The worst housing slump since the Great Depression…

    I like having a goal — hom much longer until this housing slump surpasses the Great Depression?

  40. Anon E. Moose says:

    Gary [37];

    The organization of used house sales hacks have been saying that every year since 2007. I can’t get excited over it anymore.

  41. gary says:

    Drops of 15 percent to 20 percent more would become a “dire situation” because that would leave nearly half of U.S. homeowners with mortgages owing more than their properties’ values, up from about a third now, he said.

    Guess what! ;)

  42. gary says:

    Moose [38],

    When the over-grown vegetation has thoroughly masked any evidence that a house once stood there, perhaps then, the 20 watt light bulb will go on in the seller’s head.

  43. gary says:

    Moose [40],

    Yup! That’s akin to saying eventually, you’ll stop bleeding when you’re dead.

  44. Shore Guy says:

    The stench from happy Valley just gets worse:

    State College, Pennsylvania (CNN) — The judge who released former Penn State football coach Jerry Sandusky on bail has had ties to his charity.

    After Sandusky was charged this month with 40 counts of sexually abusing children, Judge Leslie Dutchcot freed him on $100,000 bail, against the wishes of prosecutors.

    snip

    http://www.cnn.com/2011/11/14/us/pennsylvania-coach-abuse/

  45. Shore Guy says:

    Also from that CNN piece, what were the odds:

    “Sandusky’s backyard is next to the playground at Lemont Elementary School.”

  46. The Original NJ Expat says:

    From McMansion to boarding house in one recession. How long before they tear up the lawns and start planting crops or turn the lawns into grazing land?

    Nah, the thing landlords like to do when they get in that mode: Pave over the front, and perhaps side, lawn for more parking. More off-street parking means higher rent and less (lawn) maintenance. Win-win.

  47. Libtard in the City says:

    I’m still around Clot. As you all might recall, they’ve added another responsibility to my plate which already had overfloweth. Well this latest one has provided me with 5 more direct reports, only these guys are blue-collar. As usual with this level of employee, they are testing me every which way possible. From punching the clock early to attempted abuse of accruals, it has been non-stop babysitting. Hence, I haven’t been able to participate much over here recently. Fear not for my well being. I am fine and looking forward to a cruise next week (great price for Thanksgiving week).
    I know this will warm your innards Clot. Lil’ Gator has been recommended to try out for the U7 soccer program. He’s a scoring machine in the rec league. Unfortunately, at $600 per season, I think he’ll remain in rec until he’s a little older. I’m realistic. Ain’t no way he gets a college scholarship over the worst kid from Kearney.

    In other mad Montclair Mayor news, that bonehead freed was recently quoted saying…

    Fried said Wednesday that he hasn’t made up his mind yet about whether or not he’ll run again.

    He warned, though, that if there are several candidates running on a progressive platform, the votes might be split in such a way that a more right-leaning or fiscally conservative candidate could come out the ultimate winner.

    “That’s always a danger in Montclair,” he said.

  48. reinvestor101 says:

    >>I strategically timed my visit to be at the end of the open. Still, I was the first one there, and the only one, except for the neighbors who popped in to check on the current listing price.<<<

    It's this sort of thing that causes problems. Why does anyone go to an open house without absolutely no intent to buy the damn place other than to throw brine into the wound of the poor soul trying to sell the damn place? The only objective here is to cruelly tease the damn seller.

  49. gary says:

    The only objective here is to cruelly tease the damn seller.

    meh.

  50. chicagofinance says:

    Who says Bill Belichick is a boring quote?

    As the Patriots coach walked off the MetLife Stadium field, he threw his arm around his son, Stephen, and added an exclamation mark to the Patriots’ 37-16 victory over the Jets.

    “Thirty-seven points on the best defense in the league, s— my d—,” the Patriots coach said in celebration.

  51. reinvestor101 says:

    I see a couple of known cheapskates are still here. I’ll leave them nameless for now.

    Recently, I was reading an article called “On the Cheap” that gives weekly advice for scrimping. Cheapskates write in with suggestions as to how to not pay for stuff. Some damn cheapskate wrote in that before he buys a bunch a damn bananas, he takes off the damn peel so as to avoid them weighing more at the checkout. He figures the damn peel is useless, so why pay for it.

    It’s this sort of attitude that’s pervasive right now owing mainly to the activities of the real estate terrorists who not only expect someone to give away their damn house, but to actually pay them if they buy the damn place. No one wants to pay for stuff and it’s killing this damn economy.

  52. reinvestor101 says:

    >>gary says:
    November 14, 2011 at 11:25 am

    The only objective here is to cruelly tease the damn seller.

    meh.<<<

    One day, you'll have something to desperately sell. We'll see how you feel then.

  53. freedy says:

    Many NJ home owners , who continue to be in denial will find out just how much
    the crape box is worth. Go try to sell it . Then you will hear the old refrain: “I’m not giving my house away”

    Of course the place needs , carpet,kitchen,roof,landscaping update,pumps,paint,windows,driveway,and last but not least ,a tax appeal

  54. gary says:

    reinvestor101 [53],

    Don’t hold your breath.

  55. Shore Guy says:

    Now, here is a house the likes of which one does not see every day:

    http://www.josephpelllombardi.com/5homes/newoctagon.html

  56. reinvestor101 says:

    >>Of course the place needs , carpet,kitchen,roof,landscaping update,pumps,paint,windows,driveway,and last but not least ,a tax appeal<<

    My damn place is beautiful and if you live in my town, you have to pay the damn taxes. How in the hell else are you supposed to get services otherwise? The problem is that the stinking buyers don't want to pay the price, the damn taxes or nothing else. What we have here is a bunch of damn cheapskates who are driving this damn country down a rat hole.

  57. freedy says:

    People are just running out of money , that’s the problem , and of course in NJ,
    we have by far the highest ,out of control property taxes in the country.

  58. mikey (14)-

    Wake and bake, baby!

  59. Anon E. Moose says:

    Re101 [49];

    >>I strategically timed my visit to be at the end of the open. Still, I was the first one there, and the only one, except for the neighbors who popped in to check on the current listing price.<<<

    It's this sort of thing that causes problems. Why does anyone go to an open house without absolutely no intent to buy the damn place other than to throw brine into the wound of the poor soul trying to sell the damn place? The only objective here is to cruelly tease the damn seller.

    You obviously missed the part about my having put an offer on the place. Or that its been on the market for 3 years? Or that a nearly identical house in better condition sold for 5% less money in four months because it was priced right?

    There’s one simple easy way to shut me up about pricing – sell it for ask. Can’t do that? The rest is just Charlie Brown’s teacher talking — *whah* *whah*, *whah* *whah* *whah*…

  60. JJ says:

    Maybe he can be Penn’s state new coach. Arm around young boy asking for to have someone s— my d—,”

    chicagofinance says:
    November 14, 2011 at 11:26 am
    Who says Bill Belichick is a boring quote?

    As the Patriots coach walked off the MetLife Stadium field, he threw his arm around his son, Stephen, and added an exclamation mark to the Patriots’ 37-16 victory over the Jets.

    “Thirty-seven points on the best defense in the league, s— my d—,” the Patriots coach said in celebration.

  61. lib (48)-

    Good move to save your soccer $$$ until age 8 or 9. Waste of money before then.

    Will be fun to hear Mayor Fraud’s excuses in a few years when the PR of Montklair queues up in the municipal BK line.

  62. 3B says:

    #35 gary: well if you were looking in the land of Unicorns, no Realtor would tell you that; things are just fine. Oh and we changed the name of the river, fro the portion that runs through it. Effective immediately it is no longer the Hackensack, it is Da Nile

  63. 3B says:

    People on this block will not be happy. Short sale listed for 299K. Sold for 430K in Feb of 2006, taxes are 10,700.00

    http://www.njmls.com/listings/index.cfm?action=dsp.info&mlsnum=1141875&dayssince=&countysearch=false

  64. Anon E. Moose says:

    Chifi [51]; JJ[61];

    Ehh… no real dog in this fight, but as I saw it they went toe-to-toe on total offense, and were helped by the time out call by Sanchez (inexperience), two ints – one a pick six (does Belechick consider that beating their defense too?); and Brady was forced to give up an intentional grounding safety. Bill should just take his win and STFU.

  65. Libtard in the City says:

    Meat (63):

    The upcoming local elections in Montclair will be very telling. Over the past 3 years, there has been an increasingly vocal group of residents who are at ends with our town’s insane spending and lack of services. They show up at council meetings, write letters to the local paper and volunteer on advisory boards which the town council and manager choose to ignore and at times not provide information to. When I questioned the mayor and his lapdogs as to why they choose to ignore this group which seems to make up the majority if judging by the meeting attendance and the letters? The mayor responds by saying that they are just angry, don’t understand government and that he would rather trust those who volunteer on the other boards as they are people who know civic service and what is best for the town. Personally, I think Montclair is going to get a whole slew of conservative spenders in the next council election, although none have yet thrown their hats into the ring. It will be interesting to see what happens when they do and how the town votes. Fortunately, the results don’t really have an impact on me much.

  66. Juice Box says:

    From what I am reading about MF Global. The missing customer assets are treasury, gold and silver certificates and warehouse receipts that MF Global was trustee for. Think about it for a second, these were certificates of people who wanted the safest asset classes they could think of. They didn’t buy bond or gold or silver funds, they bought the actual certificates and their broker entrusted them with MF Global.

    A poster at the WSJ surmises that the fact that MF Global is missing these certificates rather than actual dollars shows an intent to avoid the usual CFTC audits of the integrity of customer accounts.

    Comments over on Forbes are also a bit shocking as is the CTFC was involved in the fraud.

    http://www.forbes.com/sites/francinemckenna/2011/11/09/mf-global-assets-have-left-the-building-how-when-where/3/

    Jon Boy also seems to be in hiding right now. He is not at any of his NJ/NY residences according to the press who have been staking out his 3 homes in the area.

  67. 3b (64)-

    So this joint sells for about 240K, then the new owner appeals the taxes down to about $7,500…right?

  68. Happy Renter says:

    Too Big to Fail, Too Big to Save
    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/project_syndicate/2011/11/the_euro_is_doomed_how_the_collapse_of_italy_and_greece_will_destroy_the_currency.html

    “With Italy too big to fail, too big to save, and now at the point of no return, the endgame for the eurozone has begun. Sequential, coercive restructurings of debt will come first, and then exits from the monetary union that will eventually lead to the eurozone’s disintegration.”

    This will in no way affect all those foreigners who will snatch up “deals” on “Gold Coast” real estate and save the NJ housing market.

    Buy now or be priced out forever!

  69. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [51] chifi

    That sounds like urban legend material to me. Belichek is well-trained in the keeping_ one’s-mouth-shut school of thought, and it is curious that he’d take a shot that he’d bench a player for taking.

  70. 3B says:

    #68 There (Clot) Makes sense to me, and 240K with a 7,500 tax bill would be excellent. 240k would of course, but prices back at around 1997-98 levels.

    It is a nice block in town, and I am sure resident’s will not be happy with what it will sell at.

  71. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [51] chifi,

    Here’s something else that didn’t make sense. I saw the end of the game, and did not see the arm embrace described. Not that I had eyes on the entire time, but the cameras were on Bill quite a bit after the gun and he wasn’t hugging anyone.

    He also was not that exuberant in the press conference. In fact, when he did crack a smile, it got reported.

    Just doesn’t pass the smell test. Sounds like Jets Nation is being punked.

  72. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [67] juice,

    Does he have a home in a tax haven that doesn’t have an extradition treaty with the U.S.?

  73. Happy Renter says:

    “Nonetheless, there is a sizeable pent-up demand based on population growth, employment levels and a doubling-up phenomenon that can’t continue indefinitely.”

    Gotta love it – the “pant-up demand” line never gets old.

    “We can’t make buyers, though, that’s the problem. We market, market, market the house and make the house stand out, but the buyers are few and far between.”

    Ruh-roh. The “they ain’t making any more land” argument meets its match. “They” apparently ain’t making any more buyers who can afford overpriced crapshacks anymore, either.

    Did someone say tsunami?

  74. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    Not that there wasn’t already some trash talkin going on, but all of it was coming from the Meadowlands. So maybe Bill was entitled to a little.

    If you’re gonna talk, deliver. ‘Nuff said.

  75. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [56] shore

    Saw octagon houses all the time. Very common in Mass as well as NY. My hometown still has two on this list (and may be the only town with two).

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_octagon_houses

  76. Juice Box says:

    Comrade – I wonder if the bent-nose crowd were customers?

  77. JJ says:

    WOW I have not checked ING rates in a year or so. I recall when we all had INGDirect CDs. Anyone who has a 1-5 year CD at ING will have some serious sticker shock when the CD rolls over.

    Orange CD Options
    Term APY Effective
    Date
    6 Month 0.60% 10/13/2011
    9 Month 0.60% 10/13/2011
    12 Month 0.60% 10/13/2011
    18 Month 0.60% 10/13/2011
    24 Month 0.60% 10/13/2011
    30 Month 0.90% 10/13/2011
    36 Month 0.90% 10/13/2011
    48 Month 0.90% 10/13/2011
    60 Month 1.10% 10/13/2011

  78. Libtard in the City says:

    Juice.

    Did you see that the gentlemen who through the protestor out is on lifetime disability from the NYPD? What a joke.

  79. Libtard in the City says:

    Threw…damn.

  80. JJ says:

    Big Deal, Fireman Ed is on lifetime disability from the NYFD yet jumps up and down on a rail for hours on end on national tv.

    Libtard in the City says:
    November 14, 2011 at 1:43 pm
    Juice.

    Did you see that the gentlemen who through the protestor out is on lifetime disability from the NYPD? What a joke.

  81. Libtard in the City says:

    I knew about Ed. Both of these men would make perfect poster boys for the Greek workforce.

  82. freedy says:

    Shorts the market as a Congressman. Keep his job . No harm ,no foul .

    What a corrupt nation we live in now, Third World

  83. Mocha says:

    Went to two open houses yesterday. Both clean and updated in decent towns, Ridgewood and Oradell. The Ridgewood home had three pages worth of attendees and the Oradell home drew no less than five bids, including and all cash and an offer above list price. Seems with the crap inventory out there the smart sellers are taking advantage before they have to compete with one another in the spring.

  84. Shore Guy says:

    Not bad digs for being the sword and shield of the liberal vanguard:

    http://www.nypost.com/p/news/national/mansion_puts_moore_in_htaOLHzkW2jcwTVaV68f6H#ixzz1dgeRmGWK

  85. gryffindor says:

    Results of Gold Coast Tour #2, still searching for “condo with a view”:

    1) Taxes in Bergen seem to be lower than Hudson. We saw an older waterfront 3 BR unit in Hudson that my husband was getting excited about. Even I had to agree it was nice. However, taxes were listed at 17K. And as a bonus, there is a $1200 assessment till June 2014 on top of condo maintenance! The realtor assured me someone with a similar unit had appealed their taxes down to $9K. I’m not going to gamble on that. In fact I heard this a few times yesterday at Hudson County condos “Oh, you can appeal the taxes.”

    2) Units in older condo buildings are being listed at somewhat affordable prices compared to newer buildings but the mortgage is ending up to be lower than the maintenance. I don’t mind an older unit as long as the building is sound.

    3) Edgewater is in a flood zone. I didn’t realize that but it makes total sense. We saw a unit built on a pier which the realtor described as “It’s built like Venice. But it might also sink like Venice, we just don’t know when.” There was a Lotus parked in the basement of the Venetian-style parking lot, that thing will be underwater should we get something bigger than Irene.

    4) The Venetian unit was a short sale with appliances stripped out except the dishwasher because the owner couldn’t figure out how to dismantle it. I see the words “short sale” come up a lot more than I would expect and we’ve visited a few.

    As I said yesterday, I am totally back open to renting. Since I’m still trying to convince husband to get over the notion of needing a view, I will consider renting a view as long as my monthly cost of living in NJ vs NYC comes down.

  86. Confused in NJ says:

    Interesting, “O” worrys about property owners whose house has fallen by 25% and placed them underwater mortgage wise, but could care less about property owners whose house has fallen by 25% and don’t have a mortgage becaused they saved to buy the house?

  87. Juice Box says:

    re #82 – JJ – Fireman Ed is union steamfitter in NYC and lives in NJ, he never worked for the NYFD. He is/was somewhere a volunteer fireman sometime. My cousin says he is the worst Steamfitter in NYC.

  88. Shore Guy says:

    Confused,

    You need not wonder. it is simple. A person who borrowed the money and the value went down in value was a victim andmust be saved, whereas the person who saved and the value went down was rich, so they don’t matter — except to tax.

  89. JJ says:

    Re 91 are you telling wikipeida is full of lies.

  90. Shore Guy says:

    Nom,

    Maybe Michael Moore will let you share his Nompound:

    http://biggovernment.com/files/2011/11/Aerial1.jpg

    There seems to be enough room in the 12,000 sq. ft. house.

  91. JJ says:

    I never understand why DINKs need a vew from their apt so bad, you are pretty much at work sunrise to sunset five days a week and blow a day on the weekends running errans. You have to pay 7 days a week for a nice view you only use one day a week.

    As I said yesterday, I am totally back open to renting. Since I’m still trying to convince husband to get over the notion of needing a view, I will consider renting a view as long as my monthly cost of living in NJ vs NYC comes down.

  92. Shore Guy says:

    John,

    Wikipedia is just another version of The Onion, only not funny.

  93. 3B says:

    #86 mocha: If you are interested in Oradell keep an eye on the school funding fight with River Edge. The Dept of Education was expected to make their decision my mid October; as of now, no decision has been made.

  94. Juice Box says:

    re # 80 – Disability can be mental too, and there are plenty of them out on disability because of mental issues.

  95. gary says:

    Mocha [86],

    Who told you that there were multiple offers on the Oradell home?

  96. Mocha says:

    3B, Yes, from reading this board I am aware of the school funding issue, but I was operating under the assumption that in the worst scenario Oradell’s tax formula won’t change. Am I wrong for assuming this?

    Gary, My realtor told me that there are multiple bids on the property. LOL that sounds bad when I read it back to myself.

  97. Juice Box says:

    re #93 – JJ – working a steamfitter now perhaps.

    Engine 69 and Ladder 28

    http://www.nyc.gov/html/fdny/html/medal_day/2004/medals/dolney_medal.shtml

  98. 3B says:

    #00 Mocha: True, but RE sends over 325 more students, which could increase, especially if any of these multi family projects ever get done in town. There are now some residents in RE calling for complete regionalization of all the schools in both towns. Something Oradell is adamantly opposed to. This (IMO) would only occur if the state forced it, (and I do not think they will). Me personally if I were just starting out, I would avoid towns with these kind of major uncertainties. Of course things can change in any town, but this is what is going on in RE & Oradell now.

  99. 3B says:

    #00 Mocha: You should provide gary with the details so he can go to the next open house, and she can tell gary that.

  100. Shore Guy says:

    Stu,

    From the people who brought us Adolf Eichmann on a plane from Argentina:

    http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8599,2099376,00.html?xid=gonewsedit&google_editors_picks=true

  101. gary says:

    Mocha [100],

    That says it all! Thank you! ;)

  102. Mocha says:

    Wait a minute. You think my realtor would be bull$hitting me about the multiple bids?

  103. gryffindor says:

    #95 JJ – husband works at a flexible firm and often works from home. He either stares at ESPN or out the window hence his desire for a view. If we get some outdoor space, that would be even better because will go out there and grill while taking in the view and I get to come home to a hot meal.

  104. gary says:

    3b,

    Heresay, rumor and rhetoric are considered details for most realtors. This young lady that was hosting that open house in Wyckoff yesterday was very candid. She was telling it like it is and was pretty much saying what we say here. Like I said: three names on the sheet and no one else showed up in a 45 minute span for a house in the Sicomac area. Meanwhile, we have multiple bids with some over asking and cash offers in Oradell?? I’d like to meet one of those “bidders” as I will “sacrifice” my house at 95% of ask price. And of course, my asking is at 2007 level so it’s quite affordable. :o

  105. gary says:

    Mocha [106],

    What do you think?

  106. gary says:

    Mocha,

    In fact, ask the realtor to see those multiple bids and watch the reaction on their face.

  107. Mocha says:

    “asking is at 2007 level so it’s quite affordable”

    would you believe that’s what our realtor told us.

  108. gary says:

    Mocha [111],

    LOL… yes, I do believe that’s what your realtor told you. We can supply you with “The Realtor’s Guide to Greatest Bullsh1t Lines” if you’d like!

  109. JJ says:

    WOW will you marry me? Seriously, he sounds like a mammone.

    Sounds like an anchor this mammone menefreghista you married, capishe

    I am not even italian but only italian words describe mama boys.

    gryffindor says:
    November 14, 2011 at 2:43 pm
    #95 JJ – husband works at a flexible firm and often works from home. He either stares at ESPN or out the window hence his desire for a view. If we get some outdoor space, that would be even better because will go out there and grill while taking in the view and I get to come home to a hot meal.

  110. 3B says:

    #08 gary: Sicomac area is very, very nice. We had plans to move to Wyckoff years ago,(sorry I did not at the time), and the extra commute time for me now makes no sense. But I always liked that town. Oradell suffers from some of that same affliction that affects it’s you know who neighbor to the south, in that it is so special and blue ribbony, and people will still pay (over pay) to live here.

    If you are starting out (young kids) etc, and your choice is Oradell vs. Wyckoff (and you can do the extra commute), you choose Wyckoff,every time.

    And as you would say, any questions??

  111. gryffindor says:

    113 JJ – LOL. Anchor, yes. Mama’s boy, no. To his credit, he successfully keeps his mama far away from us and believe me, I am glad I only have to deal with the in-laws the 3 weekends a year when we visit them.

  112. gary says:

    3b [114],

    I agree. Certain towns just have this label attached where some just need to buy or they’ll die. I remember going to an open house in 2000 just before we bought my current home. The house was in Upper Montclair technically but somehow had a Little Falls address due to some mailing/zip code thing. The realtor was explaining it to this young couple (girl was pregnant) as we listened in. When the preganant girl heard it had a Little Falls address, she immediately said, “Oh no, we ‘need’ a Montclair address!” Yup!! So… there’s this thing that people have where they’ll give blood if it means having a certain lable attached. Ridgewood seems to be one of those towns and there are so many more… like Chatham or Madison, etc. I don’t think Wyckoff has that label although it is, in my opinion, top of the checklist. We’ll see.

  113. chicagofinance says:

    griff: I absolutely apologize for what I am about to write. Before you go one step further, find a way to track your husband’s movements for about a month without telling him. Track him using his cellphone or hire someone to check him out. Also, do a check of his credit report…….I hope everything comes back as a chest x-ray should….negative….this opinion is a professional recommendation….

    gryffindor says:
    November 14, 2011 at 3:07 pm
    113 JJ – LOL. Anchor, yes. Mama’s boy, no. To his credit, he successfully keeps his mama far away from us and believe me, I am glad I only have to deal with the in-laws the 3 weekends a year when we visit them.

  114. Barbara says:

    I had a multiple bid threat from the sellers realtor just hours before we put in an offer with a three day expiration date. I called a few h ours later and to my surprise, that other offer that was going to come through that day, well, it was never brought up again. Now the realtor is my neighbor, not sure how I feel about that. Maybe an offer was mentioned but never transpired, or maybe she’s just a big fat liar. It’s just business, right? Right?

  115. JJ says:

    I agree, but before we talk pricing I will need your age and measurements. My pricing is quite complex.

    Actually, funny story we once followed a guy for a lady at work who thought her husband was cheating on her. My buddy borrowed his Dads Crown Victoria and we were following him around reporting his every detail. We took his Dads car as we figured looked like a cop car, if he caught us following he was more likely not to come back and hit us.

    chicagofinance says:
    November 14, 2011 at 3:23 pm
    griff: I absolutely apologize for what I am about to write. Before you go one step further, find a way to track your husband’s movements for about a month without telling him. Track him using his cellphone or hire someone to check him out. Also, do a check of his credit report…….I hope everything comes back as a chest x-ray should….negative….this opinion is a professional recommendation….

    gryffindor says:
    November 14, 2011 at 3:07 pm
    113 JJ – LOL. Anchor, yes. Mama’s boy, no. To his credit, he successfully keeps his mama far away from us and believe me, I am glad I only have to deal with the in-laws the 3 weekends a year when we visit them.

  116. Shore Guy says:

    Barbara,

    If some agent pulled that stunt with us, our inclination would be to withdraw the offer that instant. And, when the multiple other bids failed to materialize, our next offer would be lower than the prior one. This BS tactic by agents must be punished.

  117. Barbara says:

    Shore she was the sellers realtor and we didn’t flinch and got the house for exatly what we thought it was worth. After six years I could only take responsibility for my realtor’s actions and my emotional responses to all the tactics.

  118. 3B says:

    #16 gary: I do not think Wyckoff has this reputation either, and If I had to guess they like being under the radar. Keeping it a secret if you will. It is amazing to compare the taxes there to the the taxes in the 2 you know who blue ribbony towns next to Paramus. Ridgewood definitely has the must have designer label. Those other 2 towns residents think they have that must have label too;IMO they don’t. Something is wrong when sellers in Wyckoff seem to understand that the bubble has popped, and they need to price to move. And it is amazing to see you can still buy houses there with yearly tax bills under 10k. I hope it works out for you. Great town.

  119. Shore Guy says:

    “and my emotional responses to all the tactics.”

    I have to prevent my Sicilian from emerging when someone tries to jerk me around. In general, I am a very nice guy and let most things roll off my back, but… when I finally get ticked off….

  120. JJ says:

    If someone did that to me I would forget about it. But if I thought all offers were fake I would call seller at home and tell her how much I love her house and if all those multiple bids the agent told me about fall through to give me a call. If there are bids the seller will say thanks I will get back to you. If there isn’t the fun begins.
    Shore Guy says:
    November 14, 2011 at 3:33 pm
    Barbara,

    If some agent pulled that stunt with us, our inclination would be to withdraw the offer that instant. And, when the multiple other bids failed to materialize, our next offer would be lower than the prior one. This BS tactic by agents must be punished.

  121. Shore Guy says:

    This photo just seems like it could apply to so many things lately: the economy, housing, the current state of politics, etc:

    http://i.huffpost.com/gen/403244/thumbs/r-NEW-ZEALAND-SHIP-large570.jpg

  122. Juice Box says:

    3B & Gary – Franklin Lakes > Wyckoff > Oakland

    Don’t think it does not happen their either with the labels, especially with the two High Schools shared between the three towns.

  123. 1987 Condo Buyer says:

    #91, ???? First it is FDNY, not NYFD….second he appeared in uniform for the west side stadium commercials, third my brothers are BC in FDNY and knew of him when he was active.

    BC= Battalion Chief

  124. Juice Box says:

    “when I finally get ticked off”

    Shore does this tick you off?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0tyKKnoFfA&feature=player_embedded

  125. 3B says:

    #26 Juice: Oh I am sure it does, and I know Oakland is considered the poor step child to other 2. But one could argue (for those who care about such things), is that at least in the case of Franklin Lakes there may be some justification. And for those same people, the Wyckoffer’s can say, OK well we are not Franklin Lakes, but at least we are not Oakland, and on and on as that goes.

    But for RE & OR to carry on with that nonsense is jokish IMO.

  126. Juice Box says:

    re: #127 – My cousin who works the trades in NYC and I were talking Saturday at a Baptism about the Jets chances against the Pats and he swore up and down that Ed is a steamfitter and the worst one in NYC. Don’t Firemen usually have more than one job?

  127. Barbara says:

    Shore Guy, by controlling my emotional response I meant not buying into the fear tactic and over bidding. Poker face.

  128. JJ says:

    Drunk Irish Cousin steamfitter at a baptism gave you wrong info? How could that be? I do like Steamfitter Ed better.

    Fireman Ed is retired on Disability and lives near stadium. Supposedly full pension for life tax free from fire dept and free medical for life and I heard although Jets don’t directly pay him and he pays for his tickets, he can keep money from commericals such as Pizza Hut which nets him around 150K a year.

    Full tax free pension, free medical and 150K for yelling JETS, I doubt he is doing anything with pipes. Plus he is in his mid 50’s with a bad back anyhow. Last thing you want is a physical job that requires bending.

    Juice Box says:
    November 14, 2011 at 4:26 pm
    re: #127 – My cousin who works the trades in NYC and I were talking Saturday at a Baptism about the Jets chances against the Pats and he swore up and down that Ed is a steamfitter and the worst one in NYC. Don’t Firemen usually have more than one job?

  129. Juice Box says:

    re # 129 – I was in RE & OR over the weekend and I agree some of those POS capes are really looking decrepit, there is one section of OR that is better than the rest just east of Forest but that was probably built in the 60s on bigger lots where the rest was built in the 40s. It does not float my boat for what you get. I would take Wyckoff any day if I actually did not mind a killer commute which I do.

  130. shore (104)-

    I hope the Mossad and Israeli air force turn that place into a parking lot.

  131. Bocephus says:

    Liquor up front. Poker in the rear.

  132. gryff (107)-

    Wow. What a catch. When is his Mensa certification card coming?

    “…husband works at a flexible firm and often works from home. He either stares at ESPN or out the window hence his desire for a view. If we get some outdoor space, that would be even better because will go out there and grill while taking in the view and I get to come home to a hot meal.”

  133. Juice Box says:

    re: # 132 – JJ- Cousin is no steamfitter and is 4 years away from retirement 51 years old last kid entering college now. I asked him what he will do when he retires and just like the rest he is heading away from NY Metro. He is no drunken fool, his house paid for, and he built it himself with his own two hands 25 years ago. I can see him laughing at his retirement party at me and the rest who will be corporate lackeys for another few decades if we make it that far.

  134. Hey, gryff…at least he isn’t having lunch at Scores every day.

  135. chi (117)-

    Maybe she can jam one of those pet transmitters under his skin while he’s in an ESPN-induced stupor.

    “…find a way to track your husband’s movements for about a month without telling him.”

  136. 3B says:

    #33 Juice: West ok KKR is the more desirable, and by that I mean nicer area of Oradell, also in and up around by the HS. As far as RE, it is really starting to look rough around the edges, but Unicornians are great deniers, so of course that will be ignored. Wyckoff is brutal is you are commuting into NYC, but if you are and you are looking long term, and can handle the commute. Your money is better off being spent there.

  137. A.West says:

    Meat, (12)
    Thanks for mentioning quoins. I was wondering what those ugly things were called. They look like pus-filled boils on the edges of houses. A lot of EFIS houses have them, I’ve noticed. Possibly made of painted styrofoam. Looks like flippers also would glue them on to boost street appeal.

    Anyone here have or like quoins?

    Sorry I’m absent all the time. I just got a promotion and have very little time left. Email me if anything comes up important.

  138. Juice Box says:

    re: #141 – Worst use of quoins are those remodeled 1950s sugar maple split level homes where they take off the aluminum or vinyl siding and then add yellowish stucco and quoins. It looks cartoon house when the rest of the neighborhood is either faded greenish aluminum or white vinyl.

  139. JJ says:

    Only party my 51 year old buddies will be attending is their kids kindergarten graduation party.

    Key to his early retirement is having kids early and free medical, not the union job or house paid off. Most of my buddies his age who are corportate lackeys have house paid off and over one million in bank.

    However, if you are 51 with a 4, 6, 8 year and three colleges, and a few weddings ahead of you and the need for medical it is not a matter of being a corporate lackey.

    My youngest is not even in kindergarten yet. Pensions are rarely adjusted for inflation. Even if someone offered me 150K a year pension I could not retire. I have no clue how cops do it. My neighbor retired at 42 on a 70K pension. That was 7 years ago and now they are both down south unemployed and have learned even down sought 70k with two kids ain’t the same as 140k on Long Island. Plus he never gets a raise. He missed LI and his wife says it was a big mistake to quit wall street when she got married. When they were dinks 70K was peanuts in good times, home prices rising 70K a year, boss throwing her 25K bonus plus his full salary. Now just 1.2 of his 2005 salary.

    Juice Box says:
    November 14, 2011 at 4:42 pm
    re: # 132 – JJ- Cousin is no steamfitter and is 4 years away from retirement 51 years old last kid entering college now. I asked him what he will do when he retires and just like the rest he is heading away from NY Metro. He is no drunken fool, his house paid for, and he built it himself with his own two hands 25 years ago. I can see him laughing at his retirement party at me and the rest who will be corporate lackeys for another few decades if we make it that far.

  140. JJ says:

    quoins = garden state brickface

  141. Shadow of John says:

    “Anyone here have or like quoins?”

    Once out at Stony Brook but the health center took care of it.

  142. My favorite posters here are:

    Bocephus
    Borat Obama
    Shadow of John

  143. 3b says:

    146 I want to be on that list. What do I have to do??

  144. hoodafa says:

    NJ Taxes Cause Rich to Move, Economist Says

    New Jersey’s high taxes drive out wealthy residents, slowing the state’s recovery, said Charles Steindel, the state treasury department’s chief economist.

    Property, income and estate taxes are the top reasons people leave, said Steindel, who released a study of federal tax data and a survey of financial advisers today at an economic forum in Trenton organized by the treasury department.

    More at: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2011-11-14/new-jersey-taxes-to-blame-for-rich-people-moving-treasury-economist-says.html

  145. 30 year realtor says:

    Moose, going back to visit that same house you were complaining about months ago? What is with that? Got a real woody for that place?

  146. freedy says:

    The high property taxes does not apply in Bergen County. Bergen is different,supported by Wall street , the people are different, drive a high line car, only
    shop at high end malls, and the Schools , well they are just the best.

    We really don’t have an illegal problem, all is well .

  147. Anon E. Moose says:

    30-yr [150];

    As long as its still for sale (no danger of that changing) and I’m still in the market, there’s hope that the sellers (more to the point, the dead owners’ kids) will grow a brain cell between them. Alas, they misapprehended the meaning of “Last, Best and Final”. It may yet sell for $5k more than my offer – next year after the kids have paid another $15k in property taxes.

  148. gryffindor says:

    I already have tabs on all the money, cash and accounts. It’s not hard to know where he is. Some people are too dumb and lazy to cheat. This I know after 7 years. Once upon a time, he worked the workaholic jobs but unexpectedly he found this current position. If one can work from home in underwear and still get full corporate benefits, why would anyone turn that down to suit up, commute, and go slave at the office?

    Marriage is a compromise. He would rather we look at Westchester or CT but is going to NJ for me. The least I can do is entertain the notion of a city-view and pseudo car-free urban lifestyle if it fits our budget.

  149. J La says:

    I’ve lurked daily, forever. From the days of Richard and Duck to when John first disclosed a “pant up demand” on “crushed valor”. Now you’re hitting near and dear; the Wyckoff v. Franklin Lakes debate. Unless you’re a McBride, a move to Franklin Lakes has always been considered that of the “new money” of landscapers and builders done well and Bankers looking for a name. Not to say it doesn’t have it’s share of white collar do-gooders, but less lurks behind those McMansion walls than meets the eye; including a decent amount of molding and decorative taste. Wyckoff, in particular, Sicomac, always commanded, and still does, a higher educated caliber of
    person. More MD’S, corporate CEO/CFO’s, some TV personalities and even a federal
    district court judge happily fly under the radar and gladly give the flash to FL.

  150. Juice Box says:

    J La – Welcome. I have a cousin who recently bought in FL spent quite a bit a bit fixing it up. There is more value I gather if you are willing to deal with the commute.

  151. J La says:

    Juice, congrats to your cousin. Most of my friends are from FL. Not of course the “real housewives”. Although neighbors to those I know, they are poser freaks and in no way represent the majority of women who live there.

  152. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    (117) chifi

    if he has an android phone, she can surreptitiously activate latitude on it. it will show his location to the nearest cell tower. not very precise unless you also activate the wifi, but it costs nothing and is reasonably accurate to within neighborhoods.

  153. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    Reinvestor,

    Proud to be a cheapskate so feel free to use my name.

  154. gryffindor says:

    He does have an Android phone. Not sure what the latitude will tell me other than he left the apartment to get a sandwich for himself and maybe a cupcake for me if I holler enough.

  155. Libtard at home says:

    Shore,

    From what I learned in Hebrew School, the Massad is no joke. I just hope it’s not a case of Keyser Söze.

    Professor Griff,

    I’m with ChiFi. No personal harm meant, but something fishy is going on here. I would definitely rent. Just reading the stories on the excessive spending makes me wonder if someone might be subconsciously ignoring some undesirable things in the relationship. Also, too much talk about what you can afford here. If you are talking about it, then you are probably stretching. Just too many red flags here. My gut could be completely wrong, but it usually isn’t.

  156. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    (159) gryff

    I suggest you keep my email address as I suspect you will need it someday. I don’t do matrimonial law but I can give you referrals or asset protection advice.

    Nomdeplumenj@gmail.com

  157. gryffindor says:

    Thank you everyone for the opinions. Comrade, thank you for the email.

  158. 30 Year (150)-

    He’s a self-flagellant.

  159. Gluteus, Spurs are going for Fernando Llorente. Should be fun to watch him shred your shyte back four.

  160. Fabius Maximus says:

    #164 Clot
    You’ll see him before we will, so let us know how that goes.

    I will however throw you a bone. If you are in Jersey City on a Tuesday, check out Hudson County Community college for lunch. 70 Sip Avenue in Journal Square.

    Tomorrows menu
    Lunch
    12 noon to 1:30 pm
    One Price Buffet $9

    Soup
    Cream of Broccoli (Vegetarian)

    Salad
    Tossed Salad w/ Radicchio Lettuce (Vegan)
    Butternut Squash, Lentil, Brown Rice Salad (Vegan)(Non- Dairy)(Gluten-Free)

    Entrees
    Sage Roasted Turkey Breast, Gravy (on the side)
    Cornbread Stuffing (Vegetarian), Cranberry Relish (Vegan)(Non-Dairy)
    Cider Glazed Ham

    Sides
    Steamed Vegetable Medley (Vegan)
    Smashed Sweet Potato (Vegetarian)
    Dessert
    Sliced Fruit
    Cookies

    In the Season Beverage
    Mighty Leaf Apple Currant Tea
    Hot Mulled Pomegranate Cider

  161. Fabius Maximus says:

    #165 (redux)
    This is the cullinary institute students cooking a full service in the conference center.

    Tax dollars at work!
    http://culinaryconferencecenter.com/ccc.htm

  162. Robin says:

    good blog post, neat page template, keep up the great work

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