Been a while since the last … Weekend Open Discussion

This is the time and place to post observations about your local areas, comments on news stories or the New Jersey housing market, open house reports, etc. If you have any questions you wanted to ask earlier in the week but never posted them up, let’s have them. Also a good place to post suggestions, requests for information, criticism, and praise.

For readers that have never commented, there is a link at the top of each message that is typically labeled “[#] Comments“. Go ahead and give that a click, you might be missing out on a world of information you didn’t know about. While you are there, introduce yourselves to everyone.

For new readers that have only read the messages displayed on the main page, take a look through the archives, a substantial amount of information has been put online in the past year. The archives can be accessed by using the links found in the menus on the right hand side of the page.

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131 Responses to Been a while since the last … Weekend Open Discussion

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  9. Shore Guy says:

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  10. Shore Guy says:

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  11. 3B says:

    Don’t worry according to Ms. Madigan below, higher rates will not affect the recovery, rising rates used to be an economic drag, but according to Kate increased job growth will negate that. SO rising rates and rising food and energy costs help a recovery, not hinder it. So everything you thought you knew about how things work is wrong

    http://www.marketwatch.com/story/higher-interest-rates-wont-derail-recovery-2012-03-16?link=home_carousel

  12. Patricia says:

    Speaking as a person who was born and bred in NJ – and who thought I would probably die in NJ – I have to admit that I’m glad we moved out when we did (in 2010). We were among the fortunate ones who were able to escape right before the proverbial “window of opportunity” closed tight. We were able to sell at a reasonable price and, fortunately, did not lose our shirts. Did I want to move? No. Were we forced to moved? Yes. Everybody knows it takes at the very least two paychecks just to survive in NJ, so when you lose one of those paychecks due to a layoff, you’re pretty much screwed. It’s unfortunate that nationwide in general government favors the rich and sets up all sorts of “packages” to entice the rich to stay in their respective communities. However, in NJ – and especially with the current governor – it is so blatant that he is on the side of the rich, and thinks it’s perfectly right and normal for the middle class (which is now becoming a rare breed) to continually be taxed in order to support the lifestyles of the rich. Well, thankfully, we don’t have to deal with it any longer. By simply moving out of state, we’re saving $20k a year; how? No mortgage – sale of NJ home paid for current home in full – and property taxes went from $10+k a year to just under $2k a year! My advice….whenever you can, move! Despite all the so called “promises” of an income tax reduction and/or a property tax reduction, it will never happen. The state has already lost too much from people leaving the state, so they can’t afford to lose any more revenue. Trust me, it’s worth paying the initial 5% “exit tax” when you move – because you get to declare it on your tax return and wind up getting most – if not all – of it back. There are better places to live and raise families; places where you can enjoy life, rather than killing yourself just to pay your mortgage and taxes.

  13. gary says:

    Patricia [13],

    Great post! I’m not sure how it benefits the rich, however. I’m not necessarily disagreeing with you or supporting any group but you are definitely spot on with your description of the demise of the middle class.

  14. Shore Guy says:

    Follow the money (down the drain?):

    For years, retailers, marketers and businesses of all shapes and sizes have gone out of their way to try to win over that “all-important” 18- to 34-year-old demographic. Now that this age group is broke and facing huge student loans and a lackluster job market, though, the realization is setting in that perhaps it’s not such a good idea to focus on a bunch of consumers with little disposable income to spend and increasingly frugal habits.

    The perfect customer is one who is young (potential to keep being a customer for decades), hip (so others will follow in his footsteps and also become customers) and always supplied with plenty of money to blow on the latest products and services. Thanks to the Great Recession and its fallout, however, it’s unlikely that someone who is young and hip also has all that much cash to throw around.

    (MORE: Move Out of Your Parents’ House and Save the Economy)

    Only 54% of Americans ages 18 to 24 have jobs, the lowest rate since the government started tracking such data in 1948. Young Americans are increasingly more likely to live with their parents because they cannot afford to get out on their own, and outstanding student loan debt is near $1 trillion for the first time ever.

    The combination of soaring student-loan debt, rising costs of higher education and an employment market that’s short on jobs — and especially short on well-paid jobs for young workers — is forming the next massive “debt bomb,” according to a recent Washington Post story.

    In light of the poor financial situation facing many millenials, analysts cited by Bloomberg are saying that it may be time to ease off targeting the youth market. They’re young, and they may be trendsetters, but odds are they’re still not the best customers — because they just don’t have much money to spend.

    snip

    http://moneyland.time.com/2012/03/16/the-declining-economic-might-of-the-18-to-34-demographic/?xid=gonewsedit&google_editors_picks=true#ixzz1pHvtsFPm

  15. gary says:

    3b [12],

    The money is starting to exit bonds and treasuries and into equities. Three part-time jobs and a higher 30 year fixed mortgage rate is not going to start another “feed the squirrels” movement. The property taxes on top of energy and food prices is just another form of trauma. The only thing buyers have control over is the price of houses… and the price will continue to weaken indefinitely.

  16. By living in the suburbs of NYC I am able to earn a NYC salary which allows my wife to stay home Most people I know who bought before 1/1/2002 have no mortgage. Taxes in my town are 8-10K. A NYC salary is double the surburban salary. By moving out of state I would save 6K property taxes, take a tremendous hit to my income and my wife would have to go back to work full time. Sadly timing is everything in life and those folks who bought between 2003 and 2008 got crushed. But you know what the folks in Florida, Poconos, Vegas, Phoenix, Atlanta got crushed even harder in 2003 to 2008.

    Also I notice when I go places like Atlantis, Disney, Beaches or talk to people down South about cost of new cars, Ipads, data plans, gas prices, college tuition, clothes, food the folks in low cost parts of the USA are getting crushed. A baton rouge, milwaukee, cleveland salary there are folks making 50K full time with a college degree trying to suport a family. SS and 401K match is based on income so they are also not able to save for retirement or college. I know plenty of NYC folks who do the max in 401K and 529 no problem. Down South that is impossible. Heck it is even imposible on LI, SI or PA salary.

    A person in NYC could graduate a local college, start at a bank, brokerage or insurance comany at 21 at 50K, go get MBA at night on company dime, jump around one or two jobs and easily be making 200K by 40. Down South it aint that easy. As long as you dont buy at peak or buy expensive trade up homes the tremendous salary cut you take is overwelming. My neighbors did it and regret it. They can no long afford vacations, new cars, going out to dinner anymore. Yep they have no mortgage and cheap taxes saving them 2k a month. But guess what they took a 150K income cut. uess

    Patricia says:
    March 16, 2012 at 8:44 am
    Speaking as a person who was born and bred in NJ – and who thought I would probably die in NJ – I have to admit that I’m glad we moved out when we did (in 2010). We were among the fortunate ones who were able to escape right before the proverbial “window of opportunity” closed tight. We were able to sell at a reasonable price and, fortunately, did not lose our shirts. Did I want to move? No. Were we forced to moved? Yes. Everybody knows it takes at the very least two paychecks just to survive in NJ, so when you lose one of those paychecks due to a layoff, you’re pretty much screwed. It’s unfortunate that nationwide in general government favors the rich and sets up all sorts of “packages” to entice the rich to stay in their respective communities. However, in NJ – and especially with the current governor – it is so blatant that he is on the side of the rich, and thinks it’s perfectly right and normal for the middle class (which is now becoming a rare breed) to continually be taxed in order to support the lifestyles of the rich. Well, thankfully, we don’t have to deal with it any longer. By simply moving out of state, we’re saving $20k a year; how? No mortgage – sale of NJ home paid for current home in full – and property taxes went from $10+k a year to just under $2k a year! My advice….whenever you can, move! Despite all the so called “promises” of an income tax reduction and/or a property tax reduction, it will never happen. The state has already lost too much from people leaving the state, so they can’t afford to lose any more revenue. Trust me, it’s worth paying the initial 5% “exit tax” when you move – because you get to declare it on your tax return and wind up getting most – if not all – of it back. There are better places to live and raise families; places where you can enjoy life, rather than killing yourself just to pay your mortgage and taxes.

  17. We are in a Apple/Bank driven melt up in equities. The money exiting treasuries is headed into bonds. Junk Bonds and Corporate Bonds are holding up well and munis only had a slight sell off. People whine about property taxes but really it is not big deal. My friends down south paying 3K in Georgia has to send his kids to private schools as public shools stink. He told me it is the equivalent of 23K in property taxes if kids went to public schools. One good trading day could pay off your RE taxes. Get trading folks. It is back to 1999 bubble time.

    gary says:
    March 16, 2012 at 9:04 am
    3b [12],

    The money is starting to exit bonds and treasuries and into equities. Three part-time jobs and a higher 30 year fixed mortgage rate is not going to start another “feed the squirrels” movement. The property taxes on top of energy and food prices is just another form of trauma. The only thing buyers have control over is the price of houses… and the price will continue to weaken indefinitely.

  18. what is with all the spam today. Godless, scum sucking robots are attacking the site.

  19. 3B says:

    #16 gary: Agree. I have been looking at financing options for a mtg, and FHA which has been the only thing holding up whatever housing activity there is out there, has increased their rates and fees etc. The one vehicle that might turn around the housing market is becoming more difficult and expensive for buyers to obtain, makes no sense if the goal is to get more first time buyers in.

    And in that article I linked the writer states that higher rates won’t affect the housing market?? Is she kidding, and in the same article she claims that Bernanke won’t let rising rates derail the housing market? Well how is he going to do that? Is that where sterilized quantitative easing comes into play?

  20. 3B says:

    #18 JJ Yeah but once your friend is finished paying for private school he is finsihed, in NJ you are never finished.

  21. gary says:

    Brass Balls [18],

    Bill Gross today: Gross believes the 30-year long bull run for bonds may be coming to an end. “We’re certainly close and have been close for a number of months,” he said. It’s very difficult to imagine interest rates going lower. “The bond market, whether it’s Treasuries, mortgages, or investment-grade bonds in combination, basically yield a little higher than 2%,” Gross said. “And unless the U.S. economy replicates Japan, where yields are down to 1% on average, then you’d have to say that we’re close to the bottom in terms of yield.” He adds: “It doesn’t mean the beginning of a bear market, but it does suggest at least that the great bond bull market since 1981 is probably over.”

  22. 3b (12)-

    TPTB are dancing faster than before. More and more people are beginning to understand that we are being fed nothing but lies and propaganda. The doomsday moment approaches.

    Latest from Krieger on the inevitable fail of TPTB:

    “These guys are done for. Finished. I have never been more sure of this in my life. When I first started really writing on these subjects four or five years ago there was a certain percent of humanity I felt had to awaken to actually be able to transition from this ponzi scheme global economic system of oppression and death into something demonstrably better. We have now exceeded the number I thought was necessary by 2 or 3 times. At least.”

    http://www.zerohedge.com/news/guest-post-humanity-rising

  23. Mike says:

    Patricia 13 can you tell us where out of state and what influenced your decision besides reduced taxes and no mortgage? (which is a good enough reason) Are the Walmart’s, Home Depot’s still a hop skip and a jump away?

  24. 3B says:

    #24 There: It just amazes me, that someone could write the article i linked to and not even analyze what she wrote before submitting it. Maybe it is me, and I am just talking to myself again.

  25. 3b (21)-

    Funny. Years of low mortgage rates…then the rates drop even lower than that…no matter, the rates have NO effect on the pace of sales or on stabilizing prices. Now…escalating mortgage rates will HELP the recovery?

    You have to be beyond brain-dead to accept the crap that being dished out by the media.

  26. JJ says:

    I pay 5K a more year in taxes and he took a 150K pay cut. He will have to live a long long time to come out ahead. Everyone in New Jersey makes 250K a year, the fat gov of NJ told me, wait or was it the gov from the vampire squid place or was it the cheating in the closet gov. Anyhow one of the govs said everyone in NJ is rich.

    3B says:
    March 16, 2012 at 9:30 am

    #18 JJ Yeah but once your friend is finished paying for private school he is finsihed, in NJ you are never finished.

  27. JJ says:

    Rates were rising in 1999 and 2000 and home prices were rising. Rising rates are indicative of a boom job market, booming stock market and inflation. Home purchases are driving by job market, downpayments amounts and it is a good hedge against inflation. Rising mortgage rates are good. I recall back in 1999 and early 2000 many friends extremely secure in jobs cashing out their huge stock grants to buy houses. More so than in 2002 when rates were lower, stocks crashed and job security was non existant. Plus rising rates push fence sitting buyers to buy before rates go higher.

  28. 3B says:

    #30 JJ I get tired of trying to educate you. But here goes again. Home prices were rising form a very depressed level, and property taxes were 50 to 60% and more less than what they are now. Jobs were booming, yes good jobs, and the whole dot.com craze. And raises of 5% and more every year were the norm

    Meanwhile fast forward to today, and rates are low, and yes prices have fallen, but are still high, relative to stagnating incomes, property taxes have doubled and more in some cases, low and no raises are the norm, and benefits have been slashed.

    Amazing to me that you would compare the economic landscape of today with 12 or 13 years ago, as s justification for why rising rates will not the economy is incredible.

  29. 3B says:

    #29 JJ Either you are telling tall tales (would not be the first time), or your friend is an idiot. Who takes 150k pay cut??

  30. 3B says:

    #27 There: Exactly what I have been saying!!! And yet some people will read that nonsense and accept it as gospel. I guess you too have the same disease of talking to yourself as well!!!

  31. Juice Box says:

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  33. gary says:

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  35. JJ says:

    He left for the South back when he was making 50K like the rest of us. His current salary is 15oK less. I have seen this lots of times, folks in their mid twenties to late twenties cant afford house in NY/NJ want their mcmansion now see a big old mcmanion down south for 200K buy it and and move, flash forward 20 years and on average making 150K less. Years of no bonus plus a 3-4% raise does a number on your income Heck my friends who work for the state got clobbered too. You need to be consisently getting 10K a year raises to keep up with the jones.

    3B says:
    March 16, 2012 at 10:15 am

    #29 JJ Either you are telling tall tales (would not be the first time), or your friend is an idiot. Who takes 150k pay cut??

  36. jj (30)-

    Rising rates this time around are a sign that we are buggering our currency into oblivion and that the vigilantes are on the way.

    Yield must be paid, mf’er.

  37. 3b (31)-

    If you consider jj a proxy for the general attitude on WS, imagine the wailing and gnashing of teeth there when the inevitable shitstorm hits.

  38. JJ says:

    Stock Market up 100% in last three years, raises are back, bonuses are back, gold and bonds had a huge run. There is once again a WAR for TALENT> we trimmed the trees very hard from 2008-2011. We pushed out all the dead wood, stopped hiring college grads, people retired early or became house wives or stay at home dads. Now people in the sweet spot of 25-40 can name their salary. As long as they survived the crisis. No lay-off, good schools, good knowledge, blue chip companies. We are desparate for them . They are the home buying people. The rest aint buying homes anyhow.

    3B says:
    March 16, 2012 at 10:13 am

    #30 JJ I get tired of trying to educate you. But here goes again. Home prices were rising form a very depressed level, and property taxes were 50 to 60% and more less than what they are now. Jobs were booming, yes good jobs, and the whole dot.com craze. And raises of 5% and more every year were the norm

    Meanwhile fast forward to today, and rates are low, and yes prices have fallen, but are still high, relative to stagnating incomes, property taxes have doubled and more in some cases, low and no raises are the norm, and benefits have been slashed.

    Amazing to me that you would compare the economic landscape of today with 12 or 13 years ago, as s justification for why rising rates will not the economy is incredible

  39. jj (38)-

    All your years of 10k raises won’t matter when the pitchfork mob invades your office.

    No one will be spared. No one.

  40. Brian says:

    Am I the exception to some rule? Am I the only one with a stay at home wife? I think part of the problem Patricia is that people insist on living beyond their means. They confuse what they need with what they want. They have to have two new cars, ipads, brand name clothes vacations, etc. I do those things but I pay off my cars, vacation with the extended family and we all chip in for the rent, fix the cars myself, no landscaper, plumber etc. It’s not an easy life but it’s still the same or better than what my parents, and grandparents had.

    I make good money I guess, just not on the scale that JJ talks about. There were times when I wondered how a bill would get paid when I first bought my house but, things got better with time.

    I just don’t see myself moving out of new jersey.

  41. Brian says:

    Bill’s employer (Pimco) is looking into the equities markets. Financial Firms see big money in equities over the next ten years. Pimco stole two of our top equity fund managers recently. Word is it’s because they’re looking to start up a global equity value fund. There’s a huge marketing campaign touting equity funds over the next ten years and the wholesalers are out preaching here at my current employer to sell equity funds.

    23.gary says:
    March 16, 2012 at 9:38 am
    Brass Balls [18],

    Bill Gross today: Gross believes the 30-year long bull run for bonds may be coming to an end. “We’re certainly close and have been close for a number of months,” he said. It’s very difficult to imagine interest rates going lower. “The bond market, whether it’s Treasuries, mortgages, or investment-grade bonds in combination, basically yield a little higher than 2%,” Gross said. “And unless the U.S. economy replicates Japan, where yields are down to 1% on average, then you’d have to say that we’re close to the bottom in terms of yield.” He adds: “It doesn’t mean the beginning of a bear market, but it does suggest at least that the great bond bull market since 1981 is probably over.”

  42. 3B says:

    #41 JJ: I am not going to argue with you, except simply to say raises are not back, and neither are bonuses. On the street or anywhere else. And yet you claim to have your finger on the pulse of what is going on.

  43. 3B says:

    #40 There: JJ is a legend in his own mind, and makes have his stuff up (as we all know), but he is entertaining.

  44. Brian says:

    Raises were lame here but our bonus pool was fully funded. I recieved one of the largest bonuses I’ve ever recieved in my life. If there’s economic turmoil in my field, (IT) we’re usually the first to know. We get all of the termination notifications.

    The only reason raises were lame here is because our fiscal year ends in September. Markets were a tad volitile at that time. Just crappy timing.

    45.3B says:
    March 16, 2012 at 11:02 am
    #41 JJ: I am not going to argue with you, except simply to say raises are not back, and neither are bonuses. On the street or anywhere else. And yet you claim to have your finger on the pulse of what is going on.

  45. Anon E. Moose says:

    Juice [7];

    Knock Knock
    Who’ there?
    It’s the Sherriff you have 10 minutes to gather your belongings and get out!

    Juice, I just now recovered from laughing at that one. You’re a funny guy!

  46. gary says:

    Brian [50],

    We have bonuses here where I work as well. Every Friday, someone brings in a few boxes of Dunkin Donuts. Even us temp workers are allowed to have one! :)

  47. Painhrtz - I ain't dead yet says:

    Gary you are spoiled you ingrate now get back to the salt mine

  48. Anon E. Moose says:

    JJ [38];

    He left for the South back when he was making 50K like the rest of us. His current salary is 15oK less. I have seen this lots of times, folks in their mid twenties to late twenties cant afford house in NY/NJ want their mcmansion now see a big old mcmanion down south for 200K buy it and and move, flash forward 20 years and on average making 150K less. Years of no bonus plus a 3-4% raise does a number on your income Heck my friends who work for the state got clobbered too. You need to be consisently getting 10K a year raises to keep up with the jones.

    You forgot the part about how he lives like a king on $150k less, rather than living like a schlub in middle-class slums.

  49. He has a mansion, a new car, works 9-5, has a pool, maid and a vacation home while making 150K less .

    Anon E. Moose says:
    March 16, 2012 at 11:52 am
    JJ [38];

    He left for the South back when he was making 50K like the rest of us. His current salary is 15oK less. I have seen this lots of times, folks in their mid twenties to late twenties cant afford house in NY/NJ want their mcmansion now see a big old mcmanion down south for 200K buy it and and move, flash forward 20 years and on average making 150K less. Years of no bonus plus a 3-4% raise does a number on your income Heck my friends who work for the state got clobbered too. You need to be consisently getting 10K a year raises to keep up with the jones.

    You forgot the part about how he lives like a king on $150k less, rather than living like a schlub in middle-class slums.

  50. 3B says:

    #47 Brian: I cannot speak for your firm, but on the street as a whole this was one of the worst years of bonus money on record. As far as other industries, from people I have spoken too the typical raise was under 3% this year; assuming they got one.

  51. Brian says:

    Don’t forget he can legally play with fireworks, shoot guns, ride in the beds of pickup trucks, and smoke all of the cheap tobacco he can get his hands on.

    Yeeehaaaaaa

    52.Brass Balls AKA JJ says:
    March 16, 2012 at 11:56 am
    He has a mansion, a new car, works 9-5, has a pool, maid and a vacation home while making 150K less .

  52. xolepa says:

    My brother-in-law, same age as I, graduated Ivy League yet wound up in Eastern Washington state. Makes around 100k, definitely less than yours truly. However, he lives in paradise. Dry summers, growing seasons from April thru October. Recreational activities galore. An abundance of fresh vegetables, fruits, etc. Beautiful tall mountains an hour away. As long as you have access to water supplies in that part, your set. My wife always wanted to move there, but family ties kept us close. Bottom line is the quietly of life is much better there. The stress level is actually lower, not as described elsewhere in this forum.
    Like someone once said, but with a slight twist : On one’s death bed, did anyone ever regret not having spent more time on Wall Street.

  53. xolepa says:

    55 : quietly=quality

  54. xolepa says:

    Like an other saying: He who has the most toys at the end wins.

    WRONG!

    He who plays with his toys the most wins.

  55. Mike says:

    sell your bonds and put your money into some of these safe CD’S nothing like a 10 year yielding 2.00% .
    Monroe Savings Bank, SLA 2.33% 10 Year CD
    Bank of America 2.30%† 120 Month CD
    Millington Savings Bank 2.02% 120 Month CD
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    Chase Manhattan Bank 2.00%† 120 Month CD
    Magyar Savings Bank 2.00% 120 Month CD
    iGObanking 1.80% 10 Year iGOCD
    Haven Savings Bank 1.75% 10 Year CD
    Investors Savings Bank 1.75% 10 Years CD
    Pentagon Federal Credit Union 2.50% 7 Year Money Market Cerificate
    Liberty Savings Credit Union 2.85% 72 Month CD
    Millville Savings and Loan Association 2.42%7 Year CD
    Flagstar Bank 1.85%† 120 Month CD
    Susquehanna Bank 1.65% 120 Month Fixed Rate CD
    Audubon Savings Bank 1.50% 10 Year CD
    INOVA Federal Credit Union 2.50% $200 – $1,597 6 Year CD
    Clifton Savings Bank 2.06% 84 Month Bonus CD
    Colonial Bank, FSB 2.05% 84 Month CD
    Dime Savings Bank 2.05% 7 Year CD
    The First National Bank of Absecon 2.02% 84 Month CD
    Franklin Bank (NJ) 2.00% 84 Month Interest Credited Monthly CD
    USAA Bank 1.95% 7 Year CD – Standard
    Manasquan Savings Bank 1.85% 7 Year CD
    Firstrust Savings Bank 1.75% 84 Month CD
    First Financial Credit Union 2.00% 72 Month Savings Certificate
    Third Federal 2.00%† 72 Months CD
    SunTrust Bank 2.00%† 72 Month CD
    Broadway Federal Bank 1.97% 72 Month Manager’s Special CD
    Intervest National Bank 1.77% 6 Years CD
    GCF Bank 1.51% 7 Year CD
    Ocean City Home Bank 1.50% – – 84 Month CD
    Bank of American Fork 1.75% 72 Month CD
    Roma Bank 1.50% 7 Year CD
    UnivestDirect 1.75% 72 Month CD
    E-LOAN.com 1.70% 6 Year CD
    NVE Savings Bank 1.60% 72 Month CD
    Principal Bank 1.56% 72 Month CD
    Comerica Bank 1.25%† – 10 Year CD
    Ally Bank 1.74% – – High Yield 5 Year

  56. Sounds horrible. Even places like the Catskills or Poconos in the summer gives me the heebeejeebees. I have been out there, it looks really nice. But I dont do outdoor activities, climbing mountains, biking canoes etc. I like to lay on a beach and have someone serve me drinks. Plus he is stealing from his children by earning so little. Come college, wedding, first car, helping first house and inheritance he wont have two nickles to rub together. Plus it is a myth people work around the clock in high paid jobs. The issue is commute. Many choose not to live in city. The hours are fairly similar to rest of country. Issue is in rest of country they get home from work in five minutes. I have buddies who live in Battery Park City who go home for lunch, drop kids off from school etc. Trouble with that relocate you cant relocate back. I seen some kooks do it after 9/11 and then by 2004 their brain rotted out and wanted to come back to city but nobody wanted them. Flatleavers are the worst. Next time we have a bombing or something are they going to quit again.

    xolepa says:
    March 16, 2012 at 12:02 pm
    My brother-in-law, same age as I, graduated Ivy League yet wound up in Eastern Washington state. Makes around 100k, definitely less than yours truly. However, he lives in paradise. Dry summers, growing seasons from April thru October. Recreational activities galore. An abundance of fresh vegetables, fruits, etc. Beautiful tall mountains an hour away. As long as you have access to water supplies in that part, your set. My wife always wanted to move there, but family ties kept us close. Bottom line is the quietly of life is much better there. The stress level is actually lower, not as described elsewhere in this forum.
    Like someone once said, but with a slight twist : On one’s death bed, did anyone ever regret not having spent more time on Wall Street.

  57. Brian says:

    Maybe but I gotta tell ya, I was just over on the trading floor and everybody over there is smiling laughing having a good time. They seem pretty happy.

    Everybody in my department is tired and overworked. All of our maintenance windows are in the middle of the night and on the weekends. We have to work the weekend again too.

    55.xolepa says:
    March 16, 2012 at 12:02 pm
    Like someone once said, but with a slight twist : On one’s death bed, did anyone ever regret not having spent more time on Wall Street.

  58. xolepa says:

    (59) Wrong again. Children are all grown up. Since he had more time to spend with them when they were growing up as compared to the NYC-NJ working mindset, he made sure they were decent athletes. No college debts. Max paid $3k annual due to scholarships. The Washington state colleges prefer locals. Also, kids at mid 20’s bought homes. No help from pop needed.
    Does one take the easy way out here and throw there kiddies on subways so they can attend local NY state/city colleges? That may be fine for some, but I prefer sending mine to places that will leave them with positive memories for life.

    I seriously doubt that guy has traveled west of the GWB.

  59. Brian says:

    Plus if you get stressed out, just complain to the doctor that you have a hangnail, and stop off for your medicine at the local dispensery.

    61.xolepa says:
    March 16, 2012 at 12:36 pm
    (59) Wrong again. Children are all grown up. Since he had more time to spend with them when they were growing up as compared to the NYC-NJ working mindset, he made sure they were decent athletes. No college debts. Max paid $3k annual due to scholarships. The Washington state colleges prefer locals. Also, kids at mid 20′s bought homes. No help from pop needed.
    Does one take the easy way out here and throw there kiddies on subways so they can attend local NY state/city colleges? That may be fine for some, but I prefer sending mine to places that will leave them with positive memories for life.

    I seriously doubt that guy has traveled west of the GWB.

  60. xolepa says:

    And to continue on this, my wife’s cousin and family lives in Ohio, nowhereland. Have big house, extra rental house on acreage with lake. Kids all grew up, all having Ohio State scholarships due to athletic abilities. Father spent an extraordinary amount of time coaching his kids in sports. He had the time. Not something you would find here on the East. Would you rather be in your office at 3 in the afternoon or hanging out and coaching your daughter and her friends and generally, having a great time during the day?

  61. gary says:

    JJ,

    Does your friend also own a mansion and a yacht? Is his name Elmer Fudd?

  62. Happy Renter says:

    [43] You’re not alone (my better half’s “job” has been staying home and raising our young kids) but I definitely think families with a stay-at-home parent are in the minority in NJ. Most others are busy little worker bees making payments on little* Graydon’s first BMW.

    *little = younger than 30 in today’s infantile culture

  63. Happy Renter says:

    [17] “By moving out of state I would save 6K property taxes, take a tremendous hit to my income and my wife would have to go back to work full time. ”

    JJ, surely a multi-millionaire investor / international man of mystery like you can afford to let his wife avoid full-time work regardless of how much salary you’re pulling down, no?

  64. gary says:

    I want my f*cking pony!

  65. I have no desire to coach anything. Unless it is the Knicks or Jets. Would I rather be in my air conditioned office with snacks and other adults or out on a freezing field at three pm listing to a buncy of whiney dikey pre-teen girls. Lots of guys in my town coach, firemen and cops and civil service workers. They have tons of it. Lots of them are retired. On a cost basis the cost involved in coaching, travel teams, equipment to get a free scholorship is not worth it. Plus really how hard is it to get a sports scholorship? And is it really worth it anyhow. If I wanted one at college I could not work part time so it was not worth it. I had financial aid anyhow so I would be playing for free, Quite honestly sports are a complete waste of time. I have nephews who are into sports they give me their resume. I kick ball, I throw ball, I catch ball, wow anything I can actually use in an office. I will call you when I need a ball kicked down the hallway. Now some folks like coaching. I find male coaches, priests and boys scouts leader a little creepy. I despise being anywhere near any other persons kids. It is trouble. Lawsuits, etc. Plus parents screaming for their kids to play etc. I actually have to do some stupid sports thing after work. I am hoping there is hot coffee, my blackberry is charged, and I have some new magazines to read. Wake me up coach when it is over.

    xolepa says:
    March 16, 2012 at 12:42 pm
    And to continue on this, my wife’s cousin and family lives in Ohio, nowhereland. Have big house, extra rental house on acreage with lake. Kids all grew up, all having Ohio State scholarships due to athletic abilities. Father spent an extraordinary amount of time coaching his kids in sports. He had the time. Not something you would find here on the East. Would you rather be in your office at 3 in the afternoon or hanging out and coaching your daughter and her friends and generally, having a great time during the day?

  66. He and his wife lucked out recently, they got divorced and both remarried rich people who dont want kids. They now have four sets of income to support their kids and since they have joint custody 50% of time they each are kid free. My buddy said that really helped. That is why he has a huge mansion on his 110K salary.

    gary says:
    March 16, 2012 at 12:47 pm
    JJ,

    Does your friend also own a mansion and a yacht? Is his name Elmer Fudd?

  67. POS cape says:

    #59 JJ:

    “Next time we have a bombing or something are they going to quit again.”

    Bunch of nancyboys.

  68. xolepa says:

    And now for the latest diversion. Big stuff goes on here in Hunterdon County, at least the main street media thinks so:
    http://www.nj.com/hunterdon-county-democrat/index.ssf/2012/03/two_flemington_men_charged_wit.html

  69. Brian says:

    That’s it. i’m leaving NJ. Too many dangerous criminals here.

  70. Bunch of sissy boys. The manliest man I know was a Partner in a consulting company who had a big client deliverable due that week, he son died in 9/11 but he still made his 9/14 deliverable date. He said his son would be proud. I knew another consultant who got thrown across floor cover in dust made his way to midtown to find a power cord and got his deliverable out by five pm. I recall another guy arguing with police on 9-12 cause they would not let him past the baricades to get to work.

    My head guy was the funniest, he did call it a day on 9-11 saying that some of us were distracted and we were not going to be too productive But he did said be ready for work at 8:30am, cuase if we did not work on 9-12 that would mean the terroists have won.

    I have worked with some really type AAAAAAAAA people Imagine telling them you had to coach a game and leave early. I took two days off for birth of my first kid adn boss was up my boss saying in his day that would not have been allowed. I worked 16 hours a day first two days back to make it up and guy still charged me two vacation days. That was a manly man. Funny that guy got a huge promotion to move down south and despises it, says his kids have gone lazy and soft down south.

    I live that consulting show on Showtime. So true. Work and consulting are like drugs. After working on a billion dollar deal and saving thousands of peoples jobs, taking out garbage at home and kissing wife is anticlimatic.

    POS cape says:
    March 16, 2012 at 1:02 pm
    #59 JJ:

    “Next time we have a bombing or something are they going to quit again.”

    Bunch of nancyboys.

  71. xolepa says:

    I think Grim has to have special filtering installed on this site. In light of today’s jury decision in New Brunswick, the NJ state prosecutors will be charging all those critical of Sissyboys and Nancyboys with bias intimidation.

    Seriously, you can now go to jail for such inane remarks. We are not far from a world where up will be down and back will be forth. Although my daughter will be attending college out of state, I will scrutinize her roommate to make sure she is not in a protected category. If she is, I will adamantly object and cite the NJ case.

  72. seif says:

    “The manliest man I know was a Partner in a consulting company who had a big client deliverable due that week, he son died in 9/11 but he still made his 9/14 deliverable date. He said his son would be proud.”

    Yes…if the son he raised was a total douche bag made in his own image, then I am sure he would be proud.

  73. chicagofinance says:

    The End Is Nigh (Horticultural Edition):

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    http://bhort.bh.cornell.edu/Atitanum/CornellTitanArum.pdf

  74. Juice Box says:

    xolepa – Those guys from the Revenge of the Nerds would all be doing 10-20 hard time for the crap they pulled.

  75. gary says:

    This one sold for $825,000 in January, 2007; then it sold for $694,000 in September, 2010 and now, it’s currently listed at $679,000.

    Let me know which part you’re having trouble understanding:

    http://www.trulia.com/property/3075803243-14-Stacey-Ln-Woodcliff-Lake-NJ-07677

  76. Guy was actually a great guy. His son died that week, he knew that and he loved his son. But bottom line, a huge recession was coming, He needed to hit his numbers, get that deliverable out. Peoples jobs depended on it as well as his wife and surving children.

    I had a family member die in 9/11 and two of my family members were in the building. I was supposed to be their that day but had training. You know what I finished my deliverable. I could tell that day when we were running through slides in some god forsake Jersey location with relocated survivors with boxes everywhere that some were shell shocked. When I was working at a company that lost 1/3 of their company on a project to recreate their T=3 trade blotter from the days prior to attack, created new GL, rent space and get up and running, some employees with fresh scars and burns rose to the occassion and some could never get over it. There is old saying never hire someone you would not trust in a foxhole with you. If the person in foxhole with you dozes off you are both killed. Back in 1987 stock market crash, 92 WTC bombing, 2011 WTC bombing and banking meltdown of 2008 is where you saw men become men. Down South or out West you read about things you don’t live them. Heck just last year I had Occupy wall street, a huricanne and and earthquake to deal with. Cant wait to see what this year offers. A good soldier wants to be in army when a war is going on. The years like late 2008 or early 2009 are what I live for. God Bless America, GS has it right, damm it we are hear to make money. No ping pong playing commie is going to ruin that for us.

    seif says:
    March 16, 2012 at 1:38 pm
    “The manliest man I know was a Partner in a consulting company who had a big client deliverable due that week, he son died in 9/11 but he still made his 9/14 deliverable date. He said his son would be proud.”

    Yes…if the son he raised was a total douche bag made in his own image, then I am sure he would be proud.

  77. It was 450K in 1997 so it is still up. 219K in only 15 years. That is well over a thousand a month increase for 15 years straight. I need a better example.

    gary says:
    March 16, 2012 at 1:53 pm
    This one sold for $825,000 in January, 2007; then it sold for $694,000 in September, 2010 and now, it’s currently listed at $679,000.

    Let me know which part you’re having trouble understanding:

  78. gary (49)-

    My bonus is: if I do a good job, I get to keep my job. Period.

  79. chi (76)-

    I’ll just sit back and wait for jj’s response to that thing.

  80. gary says:

    JJ [83],

    Sure, let me get right to it! :o

  81. Brian says:

    You should lick one then put it back. Bonus points if you have a cold.

    gary says:
    March 16, 2012 at 11:31 am
    Brian [50],

    We have bonuses here where I work as well. Every Friday, someone brings in a few boxes of Dunkin Donuts. Even us temp workers are allowed to have one! :)

  82. relo says:

    Sooo, my takeaway is muppets need deliverables?

  83. Sima says:

    #43 Some towns have lots of stay at home parents. For example, Cedar Grove doesn’t have school busing and so you can see long lines of parents in cars picking up their children at the end of the school day.
    I think it’s a quality of life issue (money vs being with children) – some parents don’t want to outsource childcare, while others don’t mind.

  84. gryffindor says:

    Someone must be getting bonuses. I can see Morgan Stanley from my window and our apartment rent is up $700/mo in two years. It must be those guys because it’s not us. Or maybe we are living the rental bubble someone described here a few days ago. We are instead moving 6 blocks away to save $950/mo on rent and no more ponying up Christmas tips for a staff of 18 including doormen who don’t open doors. We are actually moving back to the husband’s bachelor pad building where he lived for 6 years until I married him and made him move. I am a bit embarrassed because he is right, we never should have left that place. Just grease the super at Christmas and he takes care of you and all the packages and will even open the door for you if he’s around and sees you.

    As much as I hate moving, it still beats buying and getting stuck. And I have to thank this board for reminding me of this. We ended up buying the Acura RDX. What a dirty experience that was dealing with car dealerships. I still got a guy in Garfield to fix my crashed Civic back up to drive around within NJ because the RDX is a bit of a gas guzzler but it sure is a nice ride. Business is picking up for me a little and I still have my eye on buying the business property in NJ if I can swing it later this year.

  85. Patricia says:

    Mike, we moved to Virginia. Besides low taxes and no mortgage, we’ve got wide open spaces where you’re not living on top of each other, but you still have a neighborhood. We’ve always liked Virginia and wanted to move here once we’ve retired…….well, after being laid off, retirement was accelerated by about 10 years, so we decided to make the move now, and with currently expenses, should be able to stay put once we actually do retire!

  86. Patricia says:

    Mike – P.S. Yes, there are all those familiar stores close by for anyone’s shopping pleasure. It’s Virginia, not the mid-west!

  87. I did the math numerous times. If my wife worked between, commute clothes, he lunch, day care I would be losing money. It is a luxury to have a working wife. Plus then I can travel, work late, come in early, etc. And have to run home for kids things all the time. That would knock a hunk of my salary. Must companies I have worked at senior managment 95% have stay at home wives. The staff will say because they make a ton of money they can afford to have their wife stay home, I tell staff that is how they made senior managment. But “career women” are everywhere. One CEO recently said men need more time off to do stuff with kids and women need to take less time off. I can tell you I had several working moms tell me they have to leave early for sick kid etc. as my husbands job is too important for him to leave. One women made 20K more than her husband!!! Men need to start leaving for kids. But till then if men are expected to be at beck and call of boss working women is a zero sum game. My wife will tell while she was single and working on Wall Street she had a hard time being a single women, the men with stay at home wives got all the promotions. Now that she is a stay at home wife she is reaping that reward herself. Oddly equality of pay for women is a slap in the face of every stay at home Mom. They struggled for years in work force and now are working their butts off at home and lazy latte sipping “workin” moms want pay equality takin right out of the stay at home moms pocketbooks. The highest ranking women on wall street once told me women are their own worse enemy. When she found out people with kids with a stay at home spouse make more she told her husband quit his job and start watching the kids. You have to play in the rules. She was like there is no rule that stay at home spouse has to be a women, any women with a stay at home husband has the same advantage.

    Sima says:
    March 16, 2012 at 3:06 pm
    #43 Some towns have lots of stay at home parents. For example, Cedar Grove doesn’t have school busing and so you can see long lines of parents in cars picking up their children at the end of the school day.
    I think it’s a quality of life issue (money vs being with children) – some parents don’t want to outsource childcare, while others don’t mind.

  88. Bank of America Stock up 22% over last four trading days. Wow. That is ten years interest in a treasury bond in four days.

  89. Andy Pettitte says:

    I’m back.

  90. Brian says:

    Any trouble finding a decent Italian Restaurant or a decent slice of pizza?

    Patricia says:
    March 16, 2012 at 3:15 pm
    Mike – P.S. Yes, there are all those familiar stores close by for anyone’s shopping pleasure. It’s Virginia, not the mid-west!

  91. Mike says:

    Patricia 90 I’m glad you are enjoying your retirement & Virginia!

  92. Jill says:

    Patricia #89: Ah, the state-sanctioned r@pe state! No thanks.

  93. At least they execute people fairly quick in VA.

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  97. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

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  98. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    Cinderella wants into the ball, and the ugly stepsisters going down hard this year. Along with brackets.

  99. gary says:

    Lehigh! Wow!

  100. reinvestor101 says:

    Man, I loved how everyone on CNBC tore that punk Greg Smith a new butthole. They said that jerk wrote that op-ed because he was pissed about his damn bonus. This dirtbag never made over 700K a year and was disgruntled. That’s why he chose to disparage poor Goldman Sachs who almost went under due to real estate terrorist activity and apparently these sickos planted a stinking mole in the form of Smith in Goldman so they could continue to upend our whole financial system. People like this punk Smith need to be made an example of so no one else starts to get any bright ideas. He should get the damn Wikileaks treatment. He’s done something and something needs to be gotten on him so he’s tied up in the damn legal system. That’ll teach him to open his stinking mouth

  101. reinvestor101 says:

    This is a damn flash in the plan and there’ll be no glass slippers for Lehigh, however there’s a pair reserved for a school from Bloomington Indiana—the school that spanked both the number 1 and 2 teams early in the season. Yeah, that’s right, the Big Red is back. Indiana is your Cinderella.

    >>>gary says:
    March 16, 2012 at 9:00 pm

    Lehigh! Wow!<<<

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  103. Dissident HEHEHE says:

    A few years ago I saw Duke beat Xavier in the Meadowlands. Sat next to this Duke alum and his kid. Anyway Duke was on fire from three in the first half shooting like 80%. I say to the guy, “Wow they are having a great shooting night”. He replies, “Actually they shoot like that every night”. Then he regales me for five minutes about the greatness of each Duke player as they touch the ball – completely unsolicited of course. I almost told his kid good luck having such a d%#@bag for a father before I left and sat with some friends in the cheap seats.

    Anyway, I hope that guy enjoyed last night’s Duke game as much as I did:)

  104. gary says:

    This one is listed at $678,900. Based on the long term trend line, not even factoring in the sky-rocketing property tax, it should be listed at 540K. But, little muppets being little muppets don’t realize it and fail to school the other side. So, when the assesment comes in and the sellers realize they fleeced themselves for $100,000, that’s when the shock will kick in. You’re seeing people getting hammered that bought from 2002 through 2010 as they try to unload and mitigate the damage. Eventually, the masses get the picture.

    http://www.trulia.com/property/3070562907-318-Meadowbrook-Rd-Wyckoff-NJ-07481

  105. gary says:

    HEHEHE [111],

    That’s what you call a homer. I used to sit next to Eagles fans going to Giants games down in Philly at the old Vet Stadium. I also had to endure them most recently at my daughter’s basketball games while doing the stats for the games. It’s all good until their team loses… and then they walk away without a word.

  106. gary says:

    And I just made my point. This one is listed at $589K which is basically the same house I listed above but $100,000 less on the ask. These sellers are closer to the trend and will get some action. The muppets in my post above will weep and wonder why not as many suckers are lining up.

    http://www.trulia.com/property/3076949371-Single-Family-Home-Wyckoff-NJ-07481

  107. J La says:

    Gary, the difference in these houses is location. Within Wyckoff, the Sicomac section has always been more “desirable” therefore commanding the “premium”. The quotes indicate that while I don’t necessarily agree, it is what it is in that town and has been since that section developed forty years ago.

  108. gary says:

    J La,

    It’s all a part of the muppet dance… the sales pitch. The difference in these particular areas within the town don’t warrant a $150,000 difference. I know the town well. It’s not like the lesser house is on Goffle Road, a half block from Hawthorne. Regardless, having the town label apparently is not enough; now, we have to be on a certain street between Avenue X and Avenue Y in order to be “exclusive”. This is how the absurdity began and this is why the cleansing will continue.

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  110. No one will be spared. No one.

  111. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [108] HEHEHE

    Now you know how I feel around Yankees fans.

  112. Mike says:

    Top Of The Morning To Ya New Jersey And Happy St. Patricks Day

  113. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    UMASS!!!!!! Suck it Jersey!

  114. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Now now Nom we were very kind about the Superbowl.

  115. J La says:

    Gary. I agree with you, however the premium and desirable locations within a town have always existed. It gives the Joneses one more thing to obsess about. I know Wyckoff really well too, and have noticed that you are considering it. I would be remiss therefore, if I didn’t point out what I know as “fact” in this area. Also, the blocks before Hawthorne are great, in fact there’s a whole neighborhood from which you have to go through Hawthorne to get back to Wyckoff (if that makes any sense, and not that any of this does)

  116. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [123] mike,

    Very true. Allow me to confine my remarks to the Hall.

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