From Forbes:
Housing Boom Is The Best Chance For A Recovery For The Rest Of Us
Our tepid economic recovery has been profoundly undemocratic in nature. Between the “too big to fail” banks and Ben Bernanke’s policy of dropping free money from helicopters on the investor class, there have been two recoveries, one for the rich, and another less rewarding one for the middle class.
Viewed in this light, the recent run-up in home prices, the biggest in seven years, offers some relief from this dreary picture. Home equity accounts for almost two-thirds of a “typical” family’s wealth (those in the middle fifth of U.S. wealth distribution); there is no other investment by which middle-class families can so easily grow their nest eggs.
…
Perhaps even more important, the growth of housing sales also revives something many have written off as obsolete: “the American dream” of owning a home. Since the great recession, some economists have argued that the future of America will be a “rentership” society.Others such as Richard Florida have argued forcibly that home ownership is “over-rated,” maintaining that America’s fixation on it has fostered “countless forms of over-consumption that have a horribly distorting affect on the economy.” Workers, he argues, are better off as renters since this allows them to change jobs more nimbly. If anything, he suggests, the government would be better off encouraging “renting, not buying.”
…
Perhaps this is true for some, but overall the desire to own a home is far from dead. A 2012 study by the Woodrow Wilson Center found that over 80% of Americans associated homeownership with the American dream. A 2012 study by the Joint Center for Housing Studies at Harvard, found “little evidence to suggest that individuals‘ preferences for owning versus renting a home have been fundamentally altered by their exposure to house price declines and loan delinquency rates, or by knowing others in their neighborhood who have defaulted on their mortgages.”Some predict that changing demographics — and attitudes — will erode such sentiments. Yet homeownership seems to be embraced by two groups who will dominate our future: the emerging millennial generation and immigrants . Between 2000 and 2011, there has been a net increase of 9.3 million in the foreign-born (immigrant) population, largely from Asia and Latin America. These newcomers have accounted for roughly two out of every five new homeowners.
…
But, still, the housing recovery is the best news to hit the American middle class in at least half a decade. Some investors seem to be realizing there are limits to rental income and might be persuaded to start selling homes to individuals. Already in Phoenix, a hotbed of investor interest, the percentage of homes sold to investors dropped to about 25% in March from a high of 36% last summer.If this trend takes hold, investors, rather than undermining the market, could be seen as having played a critical role in maintaining housing during a very hard time. If they start an orderly withdrawal, or start selling their homes to families, the speculators, not always a lovable group, could end up being among the unlikely saviors of the American dream, particularly for the next generation.
From MarketWatch:
Americans’ views on housing rise to at least three-year high
As home prices continued to rise, consumers’ views on the housing market in May hit the highest level in almost three years, according to survey data released Monday by federally controlled mortgage backer Fannie Mae.
The share of respondents who said in May that it was a good time to sell a home reached 40% — the highest share since the survey began in June 2010 — up from 30% in April and 16% in May 2012. Meanwhile, the share who said it was a good time to buy a home also hit a survey high, reaching 76% in May, up from 71% in April.
“Sentiment toward selling a home appears to be catching up with the strengthening housing market,” said Doug Duncan, Fannie Mae’s chief economist.
…
Views on home prices also hit a survey high, with a May expectation that prices will grow 3.9% in 12 months, compared with an April expectation of a 2.7% annual increase, Fannie reported. While home prices have seen large gains over the past year, housing expert and economist Robert Shiller has warned that recent gains may be irrelevant to longer-term forecasts.
Where I work, if you completely space out about your retirement and don’t act at all, you are automatically enrolled in a401k plan at 2%.
Also, personal finance classes as pare of public school curriculum will be helpful for future generations. They should understand the concept of compounding interest.
Statler Waldorf says:
June 11, 2013 at 1:22 am
Comfortable in your retirement plans? Have a 401k? The below Frontline piece doesn’t even take into account taxes.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/retirement-gamble/
Caveat emptor.
Yes. It’s either that or save money the old fashioned way. No more conspicious consumption.
Did anyone else think there were a lot of open houses on the weekend? Esp in Essex, I’m wondering if there is more supply coming on after recent publicity. Anyone seen any uptick?
Ebb and flow really, some weekends I’m shocked, others are barren.
Essex Co. – May 2013
Active Listings – 3108 Average LP – $474,735
New Listings – 754 Average LP – $528,374
Essex Co. – May 2012
Active Listings – 3908 Average LP – $423,067
New Listings – 747 Average LP – $478,407
So we’ve got approximately 20% fewer listings on the market in Essex, and those fewer listings are priced higher, on average, than last year.
While the pace of new listings hitting the market is on par with last year, that new inventory is clearly priced higher as well.
We can’t say whether or not the mix has shifted though, are these new listings simply larger/better homes, or have the asking prices of the same kinds of homes increased.
10 year kissing 2.30
Recovery……I think it would be good for the middle class if there were increasing transactions. Not necessarily increasing prices.
From CNBC:
As Investors Return to Jumbo Mortgages, Big Banks Sell
As home prices rise, demand for jumbo mortgages is rising too. And as investors look for new ways to cash in on the housing recovery, these mortgages are starting to look more attractive.
Since the housing crash began, the market for jumbo mortgage-backed securities, pools of these loans sold to investors, has been close to nothing. Banks still make the loans, but hold them on their books. Now that is beginning to change.
While the number of jumbo loans originated in the first quarter of this year was up 15 percent from a year ago, the number of those loans securitized and sold by lenders was up 400 percent, according to Inside Mortgage Finance. Four billion worth of jumbo loans were sold to investors, more than the $3.5 billion in jumbos originated in all of 2012.
Both Chase Mortgage and Everbank began issuing non-agency mortgage-backed securities at the beginning of this year. Before that, Redwood Trust and Credit Suisse were the only players in the market, and small players at that. Chase has made a big push in the space, rising to the number two spot in jumbo loan originations from number four in the market, and in turn opening the door for investors.
“We think over time it is important that private capital gets back into the mortgage business, and as guarantee fees have continued to increase over the last couple of years, the economics are right to start to bring that private capital back into the mortgage market,” said Kevin Watters, CEO of Chase Mortgage.
6. you mean 3.30? rates have gone up the past few weeks.
locked my rate for the refi below 3%. barely made it. have shaved a few yrs, almost same pmt
9 – 10 year bond yield, not mortgage rate.
30 year mortgage rates are now solidly low 4’s, 4.0-4.25, but given the most recent move up yesterday, I think a 4.0 is probably unlikely. I’d imagine 15 year mortgage rates are well into the 3’s at this point too.
Note from ChesCo. I’m seeing a lot of perfectly nice houses languish and price drops are the norm. No bidding wars, houses settling for less than ask. One house I saw got multiple offers right away but none were at ask and I thought it was priced reasonably. Another one I saw and liked was listed 30k under the purchase near peak. Beautiful house but no offers after first weekend. And one I saw a second time (nice house in a great neighborhood but no usable yard) has dropped price several times and the agent is begging us to make an offer.
It was briefly a sellers market here but not anymore.
[11] redux
For those not fluent in Inquirerspeak, ChesCo is Chester County, PA. And I know it isn’t jersey but offered for perspective.
[10] grim,
Given our propensity for job hops that involve geographic changes, I am leaning toward an ARM. Rationale is that we may be back on the market within 5 yrs anyway, and if not, we pay off or refi to a 15 before reset.
If this sounds nuts, I’m open to criticism.
12 – Thanks. That’s good to know. The good citizens of ChesCo are probably wising up, giving up their assault rifles, and moving to NJ……driving up the price of real estate here.
13 –
It does sound nuts. If your job requires you to move often, why would you lock into a home purchase? Yes, the ARM is also nuts. I think it’s way too much risk. Why would you want to do that? Breaking a lease is so much easier and less costly than selling a house. Where’s the upside?
[14] Brian
With any luck, yes. One thing I have noticed is that this is a ridiculously wealthy county. Some of the houses around me are scary large on big parcels. You go down a country road thinking there’s nothing there and you come across virtual compounds that look like Hyannisport with more land and horses.
I scoffed when I read that Chester was the wealthiest county in PA. I thought no way, has to be Montgomery with Radnor, Bryn Mawr, Merion, but I now see that there is a lot of wealth and ratables here, and less of the Philly garbage overflow.
At 2% Bogle states 401k fees will eat up over 60% of your balance at retirement. Then the government takes another 20% as you withdraw cash to live.
This was a good report, it shines light on many dirty secrets these companies would like to remain secret. High complexity, combined with slick television commercials, keep the public fooled.
Brian says:
June 11, 2013 at 6:08 am
Where I work, if you completely space out about your retirement and don’t act at all, you are automatically enrolled in a401k plan at 2%.
Also, personal finance classes as pare of public school curriculum will be helpful for future generations. They should understand the concept of compounding interest.
Statler Waldorf says:
June 11, 2013 at 1:22 am
Comfortable in your retirement plans? Have a 401k? The below Frontline piece doesn’t even take into account taxes.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/retirement-gamble/
Caveat emptor.
[15] Brian
I considered that but there are several economic and non economic factors. First, SFH rentals are rare, expensive and often undesirable. Many are also for sale. Second, I have school age kids so that argues for stability that renting cannot provide. Third, if there is another job hop, we may go back to a commuter marriage model. Fourth, if I get the right house, I can take advantage of that thin rental market myself. Fifth, we have the liquidity to pay cash, and would do so at reset, but having a mortgage preserves the ability to walk away if things got Scrapple bad and you save during those first years.
So I see where you are coming from but I’ve had to take the foregoing into account.
Nom, I was joking in post 14 but dead serious in 15. If mobility is important to you, homeownership should be off the table.
[18] redux
And already, I saw that one house that I looked at and nixed did sell well under ask and has immediately returned to the listings as a rental.
[19] Brian
If mobility was paramount, we wouldn’t have kids.
18 – It seems like you are trying to minimize risk, I don’t see the upside.
21 – Nom, understand, I’m not trying to be difficult….just helping you by arguing the other side…
If you and your family decide to buy I wish you guys the best of luck.
Since I had kids, much of my energy and thought is guided by what’s best for them. I don’t think there’s anything wrong with making them your highest priority.
21.Comrade Nom Deplume, Halfwit dumbass says:
June 11, 2013 at 9:23 am
[19] Brian
If mobility was paramount, we wouldn’t have kids.
[22] Brian,
Precisely, I am trying to minimize risk and cost. The upside is if the market doesn’t tank, then we can sell or rent out when the move happens. And since I can pay cash, getting an ARM is like buying a short duration put option. In fact just getting a mortgage is for negotiation with buyers–you keep the contingency as an out and use the appraisal to drive down the seller. I may even waive it as part of a lowball offer.
This article puts into words those thoughts swirling around in my mind:
http://sports.yahoo.com/news/nfl–patriots–signing-of-tim-tebow-could-be-coach-bill-belichick-s-latest-masterstroke-223318894.html
[23] Brian,
Thanks. I asked for the pushback. Helps to test and clarify my thinking.
#17
A common couple with a house paid withrawing $1000 a month in 401k and taking in $2500 a month in SS benefits will have no Fed tax burden today. That is NO TAX for your before tax 401k and SS benefits.For most people, $3500 a month is more than what they are left , after paying for the mortgage. Trick is moving to a no State tax state with low property tax with a paid home.
28
Or to a low tax country
29
choose a country you wil move in
http://www.forbes.com/sites/kellyphillipserb/2012/09/25/the-most-tax-friendly-country-in-the-world-is-spoiler-alert-its-not-the-u-s/
Professional pole dancer? ……what a dude this NSA-leak prick is…..
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/lookout/snowden-girlfriend-nsa-mills-photos-131840670.html
US house prices
Realty check
Jun 10th 2013, 14:20 by Economist.com
Our interactive guide to America’s housing market
http://www.economist.com/blogs/graphicdetail/2013/06/us-house-prices
Grim (10): Both rates are up about 5/8ths from bottom now.
3.125% on 15-year up
4% on 30-year
For the people that are capable of self-regulation and clear headed analysis, these critiques hold water…..for the vast majority of everyone else, it does not apply…..as an aside, Bogel is a self-promoter and gadfly…..he is Suzy Orman in a nonagenarian wrapper……
Statler Waldorf says:
June 11, 2013 at 9:17 am
At 2% Bogle states 401k fees will eat up over 60% of your balance at retirement. Then the government takes another 20% as you withdraw cash to live.
This was a good report, it shines light on many dirty secrets these companies would like to remain secret. High complexity, combined with slick television commercials, keep the public fooled.
Also, if you have a company match in the 401(k), then don’t even think about any other issue……it dominates all these other machinations…..
It took until minute 9:00 to have a credible and informed source in this report. CIO of United Technologies…….Have on in the background……
Statler Waldorf says:
June 11, 2013 at 1:22 am
Comfortable in your retirement plans? Have a 401k? The below Frontline piece doesn’t even take into account taxes.
http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/pages/frontline/retirement-gamble/
Caveat emptor.
Yes, I forgot to mention match of 75 cents for every dollar.
34.chicagofinance says:
June 11, 2013 at 10:50 am
For the people that are capable of self-regulation and clear headed analysis, these critiques hold water…..for the vast majority of everyone else, it does not apply…..as an aside, Bogel is a self-promoter and gadfly…..he is Suzy Orman in a nonagenarian wrapper……
To minute 15…..so far there has been one profiled individual who has spoken from an informed opinion. Everything else is naïve people talking in platitudes and failing to take personal responsibility, or else individuals who have made poor choices and now want to blame others for their greed, lack of vision or abject carelessness.
Chi she is gorgeous got to give the guy props for picking up a leaving or maybe the leak helped him escape her crazy. Read some of the stuff she wrote about her last month and its screams narcissist.
there is probably some other pretty girl holding the keeping Eddie from getting killed info, though they both are probably in custody or already rendered. Spooks don’t like whistle blowers and neither does congress. Really reads like a bad movie.
Quote “wow, I can retire when I’m 45″……how is this different that the real estate nonsense we critique here every day?
At the end of the day, it is just nice to see the guys at Booz squirm……they make Goldman Sachs look like boy scouts…..
Painhrtz – Disobey! says:
June 11, 2013 at 11:16 am
Chi she is gorgeous got to give the guy props for picking up a leaving or maybe the leak helped him escape her crazy. Read some of the stuff she wrote about her last month and its screams narcissist.
there is probably some other pretty girl holding the keeping Eddie from getting killed info, though they both are probably in custody or already rendered. Spooks don’t like whistle blowers and neither does congress. Really reads like a bad movie.
At minute 23…..still have yet to focus on anything concrete…..make an unsupported assertion, make it seem credible, and then make an unrelated claim…..just to give an example, this report is about 401(k), but in 2013, they make it a point to profile a woman who lost her job and bankers in NYC were paid large bonuses…..wasn’t this from 2009? further what does this have to do with 401(k)’s?
minute 27….completely unrealistic claim….ostensibly supported by math….
Finally at minute 30, they come to attack kickbacks to brokers et al. ……. 60% done and they finally have something relevant.
The critical stuff comes at minute 40…..fiduciary standard….
Snowden does not add up.
This is one weird resume for as supposed ex-spook making 200k a year contracting for the NSA in Hawaii. I know they have allot of money to toss around but really this is the best we can do to recruit loyal hard working smart citizens to protect our nation?
2000 – drop out of high school
2002 – get GED
2003 – drop out of community college
2004 – enlist in army reserves
2005 – drop out of army reserves after training accident 4 months
2006 – get security guard job at NSA facility at U Maryland
2007 – suddenly a CIA IT expert under diplomatic cover in Geneva
2009 – private contractor job at unnamed NSA Japan facility
2013 – $200k per year job for Booz Allen in Hawaii
Robert Hiltonsmith looks alot like Paul Krugman doesn’t he?
teatards:
@RBReich: Don’t be distracted. The big story isn’t Edward Snowden nor intelligence leaks. It’s government’s disregard for privacy and civil liberties.
Grim,
76 N Colonial closed $570K and I think has gone straight to rental.
48
To whom is Reich referring ?
Libtard,
You use credit karma, correct? Do you have anything negative to say about it?
50.
to them:
@pourmecoffee: Is Snowden a hero or a traitor? Stay tuned if you can only hold one simplistic juvenile idea in your head at a time.
Fair enough, but I am going to act very provincial and NIMBY about this one. This a-hole was screwing around in Hawaii and hiding out in HK….meanwhile, he puts my hometown NYC at risk…..because at the end of the day, of the next 10 “events”…you can bet 7-8 or them are going to happen around here…..sucks for us….
anon (the good one) says:
June 11, 2013 at 12:10 pm
teatards: @RBReich: Don’t be distracted. The big story isn’t Edward Snowden nor intelligence leaks. It’s government’s disregard for privacy and civil liberties.
[52] Anon (the liberal one),
I’m sorry, what did you say? I was thinking about sex.
Joyce, (51)
Kreditkarma is good. My only advice to you is to make sure you are only signing up for the free stuff. They offer a lot of extras, but there is no need for them. Also, you might get sent a bunch of email alerts until you figure out how to turn them off. Otherwise, it’s easypeasy. I see that my score has dropped by 10 points since my 2 refinances have closed and Honda of America has run a hard check. No biggie. They also might have sold my email address to Quicken Loans as those guys are sending me offers via FedEx. They must have spent $50 already courting me for a refinance. I’m hoping they stop now that I’m locked in at the bottom.
Grim,
Put down my five-hundy deposit at Planet Honda and I am first on the list. I can get the deposit back anytime until the car is physically shipped to the dealer. I asked who else was on the list and they said a lot of people applied, but no one made a deposit. He mentioned two people from the Willowbrook Mall area (one must be you) and one from Stony Point New York. But without the deposit, they are not on THEIR list. I should hear back on Thursday with a BS shipping estimate. He claimed to have heard through the grapevine that it’s one to two months. We’ll see and I’ll keep you updated.
53
Chicagofinance,
Without getting into any of the legalities…
I really do not understand that position at all. How does revealing this information put anyone at risk? NYC or elsewhere… plus, I thought you lived near Red Bank?
Please spy on me to keep me safe. I am so afraid.
Humor me and throw out some names of those who are and are not defending the govt on this one?
anon (the good one) says:
June 11, 2013 at 12:10 pm
teatards:
@RBReich: Don’t be distracted. The big story isn’t Edward Snowden nor intelligence leaks. It’s government’s disregard for privacy and civil liberties.
Lib few things about planet honda since we bought our Element there.
Do a 100% walk around of the vehicle when you receive it. they damaged the car and kept us in the showroom until after dark hoping we would not see it and be they would be off the hook for liability.
Second they drove the car for 400 miles from the time we signed the initial paper work until we picked it up 3 days later. Needless to say Odometer did not match sales contract. Huge misrepresentation and could have cost them dearly. so we ended up getting a boatload of accessories for nothing and the car fixed. Plus they had to deal with my wife, poor ba$tards. They have since done right by us on a coouple of occasions but the first impression was horrid and they know we will never buy another car with them.
they really do not like smart customers, think it is based on location.
http://www.cnn.com/2013/06/11/us/new-jersey-princeton-evacuation/index.html
Scrapple I’m afraid that I am not going to have enough bullets when they finally come for me. :
I’m sure I will be portrayed well in the news reports. Nice guy kept to himself, always helped neighbors blah blah blah..
pain (62)-
Did you pick up that pressure cooker for me yet?
Today, only about half of Republicans (52%) say it is acceptable for the NSA to obtain court orders to track phone call records of millions of Americans to investigate terrorism. In January 2006, fully 75% of Republicans said it was acceptable for the NSA to investigate suspected terrorists by listening in on phone calls and reading emails without court approval.
Democrats now view the NSA’s phone surveillance as acceptable by 64% to 34%. In January 2006, by a similar margin (61% to 36%), Democrats said it was unacceptable for the NSA to scrutinize phone calls and emails of suspected terrorists.
http://www.people-press.org/2013/06/10/majority-views-nsa-phone-tracking-as-acceptable-anti-terror-tactic/
baa baa
Sure you can stay at my place on the black Sea.
Russia would consider granting asylum to NSA whistleblower Edward Snowden, Vladimir Putin’s spokesman Dmitry Peskov said Tuesday.
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jun/11/edward-snowden-russia-asylum-request
[59] joyce,
The MSNBC editorial board must be having fits over this Snowden thing.
Scrapple why would I waste a good gulash maker on a bomb when a bucket of ball bearings would have the same effect. Besides the only real terrorists are in Washington, and according to Joyce’s post above 52% of Rs and 64% of Ds like it that way.
the country is lost
66
Right. Cause there is actual differences between them all.
Pain – we aren’t even close to lost. People forget 70 years ago what we did via executive fiat we are a long way from those days.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Executive_Order_9066
Pain,
I appreciate the warning. No doubt they used your car for test drives or to shoot down to Lookers.
There’s a reason I call it the ghetto Honda. The Hillside Nissan and Lynne’s in Bloomfield is even worse. I’m very careful. I told them that they have three weeks to get me the shipping date in writing on a document with the Planet Honda logo or I will be calling the credit card company to cancel the deposit if they won’t refund it to me in the 5 business days in which they said they would if I requested it. They were also surprised by how much money Honda Finance prequalified more :P And this is after refinancing nearly 700K in mortgage debt.
In other news, I convinced my downstairs tenant to trim the 40 yard hedge at my multi for $50. The guy who mows my lawn wanted $150. I hope he doesn’t lose any fingers. :P
Everytime I hear the name Snowden, I can’t help but think of the small mountain at Killington that shares the same name. I’m not sure why everyone is making such a big deal out this anyhow. Everyone knows the internets and phone lines are tapped. Only the sheep find this to be a real story. Hell didn’t Bush go crazy with it after 911? Same story different party. Baa Baa.
69
Juice Box,
We still do that today… it’s called Gitmo, or any other site around the world run by the intelligence groups.
What is PRISM?
http://news.cnet.com/8301-1009_3-57588253-83/what-is-the-nsas-prism-program-faq/
Viva Ike Davis….
http://newyork.cbslocal.com/audio/865-wfan-audio/06-11-viva-ike-davis/
quikenloans also wrote/call me non-stop. there was an art in NYT about the co being well-run, great costumer service. and making and effort to improve Detroit housing (good luck with dat). anyways, would had liked to give them my biz, but their rate wax much higher
Everyone knows the internets and phone lines are tapped.
Cue the Leonard Cohen, and play the 45 on 33 for effect.
This Snowden kids one of the last heros left in this country. The NSA completely overstepped the law. They are not legally permitted to monitor emails and phone calls made by US citizens within the US without a warrant.
Of course you’d be naive not to think that they weren’t doing it anyway.
One has to wonder what benefit there is to the collection though. Did it prevent an act like Boston? Nope. They didn’t even have an ID on those two clowns and had to count on the public. So if it’s of no use in preventing such attacks what benefit is there? Blackmail of future politicians? Silencing detractors?
I have nothing to hide, so I don’t really care honestly. I understand there are larger issues at stake, but I guess watching the buildings fall in front of me on Pier A in Hoboken kind of changed my mind. Then spending the next 3 years going in and out of the WTC site for business reasons and looking at everything and thinking those bastards…..and you know Zazi lived literally in a 3 family house that I used to play handball on the garage door, right? and his Mosque was walking distance to my elementary school…..you don’t understand my position? really….
You know I also rented a truck from the same Ryder facility in JC to move in 1993……
and I special? NO…..these fcking people live and target my back yard……
joyce says:
June 11, 2013 at 12:52 pm
53
Chicagofinance,
Without getting into any of the legalities…
I really do not understand that position at all. How does revealing this information put anyone at risk? NYC or elsewhere… plus, I thought you lived near Red Bank?
also, I used to work for AT&T you know……this sh!t has existed forever……
Now we are all aware of what the NSA was gathering and how they were accessing it. If you are somebody with intent to do us harm, you now know you must avoid the forms of communication that Snowden leaked about in order to aid in avoiding detection.
I’m trying to understand what they were doing and have been watching the Snowden interview and reading about the PRISM program. My best guess is that if you’re hot on the trail of a terrorist, it’s tough to quickly gain access to all of the data you need to figure out their next move if you’re stuck trying to subpoena records that may come to you in all sorts of data formats, then search them quickly…..
Putting them all in one nice neat database makes it so much easier.
The frighening thing about it is the ease with which it might be abused. We are supposed to believe our government when they say “just trust us”….we won’t abuse it. It’s become more diffucult in recent months to trust them in light of IRS abuses and Justice Department AP wiretaps…..
57.joyce says:
June 11, 2013 at 12:52 pm
53
Chicagofinance,
Without getting into any of the legalities…
I really do not understand that position at all. How does revealing this information put anyone at risk? NYC or elsewhere… plus, I thought you lived near Red Bank
am I special? NO
Chi,
So get a warrant. It’s not that hard. Tell the judge its for anti-terrorism purposes and you are guaranteed they’ll say yes.
Anybody who gives up their civil liberties for some ambiguous feeling of “safety” is a fool. In this instance they weren’t even given up; some hack administrative lawyer likely wrote some baseless legal opinion to give cover for the entire program.
Put down my five-hundy deposit at Planet Honda and I am first on the list. I can get the deposit back anytime until the car is physically shipped to the dealer. I asked who else was on the list and they said a lot of people applied, but no one made a deposit. He mentioned two people from the Willowbrook Mall area (one must be you) and one from Stony Point New York.
Talked to my local dealer yesterday who told me he was scrapping his list because they had no idea if they were even going to be allocated a second car. He said he would give me first dibs and would call me immediately if they heard anything. I’m first on the list out in Sussex, but they also have no idea if one is coming, or when. Sussex was the dealer who had told me that Honda wasn’t allowing deposits to be taken due to the uncertainties around delivery.
The total volume released is only expected to be 1,100 or something over 2 years. And I think that more than 1/3rd were already leased in California last year. It’s plausible that only a small number of dealers will even get a second car, let alone a third.
I wouldn’t bother getting on a list unless you were 1 or 2, the chances of getting a car are non-existent.
Dealers will only be allocated 1 unit at a time, and they are shipped from California so it isn’t like Honda has a big pool available at the port.
If any activity involves the gubmint, it will inherently devolve into misuse of power and petty political tit-for-tat.
Wait until the gubmint has your entire medical history. It will make tapping your phone and e-mail seem like child’s play.
I’d hate to be vying against Charlie Rangel for a new liver.
Parents of Navy SEAL Killed in Afghan Crash File the First Suit on NSA Spying
A couple in Philadelphia has filed a class-action lawsuit against the National Security Agency and Verizon, claiming they and their phone records were targeted for surveillance because of their outspoken criticism of Barack Obama and the U.S. military. This is believed to be the first official lawsuit filed against the government and the company, since it was revealed that Verizon had been ordered to turn over phone metadata for all of its customers.
http://news.yahoo.com/parents-navy-seal-killed-afghan-crash-file-first-164807941.html
Chi – odds are 1 – 1oo million you will be killed by a terrorist over a 10 year period. You skated on that one dude. Perhaps they thought you were one of them? How is your tan?
Odds are you will die of cancer or a bum ticker before the terrorists will get you, so perhaps spend some more money on SPF 50 and shop at whole paycheck more.
I really think the expense of collecting INFO on all of us and then using programs to find the needle in the haystack is an extremely inefficient and super expensive way to do this properly.However all of this spending is after all one big jobs program, for you see we must pay high school drop outs $200k to listen to phone calls. Everyone gets a six figure job and a stripper for a GF. HA, I should have tossed the books and partied more! Our De-Fense budget is $527 billion. Not sure how much goes to actually De-Fence. All we need to do is cut the budget and the problem goes away. Cue the cyring inside the beltway. It will never happen in this nanny state after all deficits really really don’t matter, I hate to say it but Dick Cheney was right.
chifi, they don’t get into fees until the middle of the program. They have quite a variety of experts in the piece, see what you think at the end of the program.
The main thrust of the program is that the burden is too high for the average person, leaving them at the mercy of those far more sophisticated with motives that may not align with the consumer. The industry does not want a standardized 1-page fee summary (as with credit card fees).
Clearly the way fees are buried 50 pages into the fine print, given names that have no meaning to most people, and their method of calculation, is a mystery to the vast majority of consumers. One might characterize it as sophisticated deception.
Prism reality http://imgur.com/r/funny/GSmI6u3
Snowden..blah, blah..NSA overstep..blah, blah..the truth is that Obama could play catch with Snowden’s head with his @ss wrapped in the U.S. constitution while the NSA head rattles off pron sites visited by Tea party members..won’t change a thing. This country is too weak willed now. Powers know this. They won
Grim,
Well I’m number one and they sold two so far this year, so here’s to hoping. Some other nice benefits:
10% discount on GSP and NJTP off peak
HOV lane use
Cars standard trim is pretty nice (heated seats, NAV, backup camera, IPOD controller, cruise control, etc.)
A cheap man can dream, can’t he?
Oh, and no sales tax too.
No mortgage debt in NJ? Perhaps 8 people. Agree leaving NJ key, as the annual burn rate is approx $40,000 if you never buy a new pair of socks.
$1,000 prop taxes
$1,000 prop insurance
$400 utilities
$300 snow removal / lawn care
$500 maintenance
—————————————–
$3,200 TOTAL MONTHLY (ANNUAL: $38,400)
yome says:
June 11, 2013 at 9:38 am
#17
A common couple with a house paid withrawing $1000 a month in 401k and taking in $2500 a month in SS benefits will have no Fed tax burden today. That is NO TAX for your before tax 401k and SS benefits.For most people, $3500 a month is more than what they are left , after paying for the mortgage. Trick is moving to a no State tax state with low property tax with a paid home.
Richard…awesome find.
Your prop insurance is $1,000 per year, not month. Your other numbers seem a little high as well. Especially the $6,000 per year in maintenance. My suggestion…buy and older house where whatever was supposed to break already has.
Now that Cheney is no longer in office, I bet he now says deficits do matter. Every party wants to indulge in as much deficit spending as they can win votes with.
How no tax?
$300 snow removal / lawn care
Clearly I’m the only idiot in NJ that does his own lawn maintenance.
$300 a month?
Boy it sure is nice to be rich.
Especially the $6,000 per year in maintenance.
Concur – At this price your talking about a major system or component failure almost every single year.
http://www.ncsl.org/issues-research/energyhome/state-electric-vehicle-incentives-state-chart.aspx
Very disappointing that this was the first thing that came to your mind.
chicagofinance says:
June 11, 2013 at 2:20 pm
I have nothing to hide, so I don’t really care honestly.
Yeah…I do my own too. At $300 per month, you could buy the fanciest lawn and snow blowers made and obtain 100% ROI in six months.
I want a 42″ zero turn
I’m telling you Grim, it’s almost too good to be true. Getting one is probably too good to be true, unfortunately. I would like to thank everyone here in advance, for your incentives which will allow me to be, well, cheap.
stat: I am no fan of any advice not given at the Fiduciary Standard. However, this report is pitched for sensationalism and entertainment and falls short on the authoritative front. The first 30 minutes can be discarded. The remaining portion when it focuses specially on cost in a responsible way is fine, but likely without being intentional, it mixes the issues of advice, cost, asset management, product sales, and the theoretical justification of passive investing into one big soup. The basic message is that you are being ripped off so be pissed. The problem is that it does a good job of creating an emotional response, but it does nothing to provide a solution.
As a practitioner, it is readily apparent that a good number of people simply do not care about this stuff……and I mean they REALLY do not care to the point that if I prod them too much they will fire me………it is similar to a fat 70 year old smoker complaining about their health when they have been told for 40 years to clean up their act…..
Statler Waldorf says:
June 11, 2013 at 2:35 pm
chifi, they don’t get into fees until the middle of the program. They have quite a variety of experts in the piece, see what you think at the end of the program.
The main thrust of the program is that the burden is too high for the average person, leaving them at the mercy of those far more sophisticated with motives that may not align with the consumer. The industry does not want a standardized 1-page fee summary (as with credit card fees).
Clearly the way fees are buried 50 pages into the fine print, given names that have no meaning to most people, and their method of calculation, is a mystery to the vast majority of consumers. One might characterize it as sophisticated deception.
I now feel very shortchanged by the clients who paid me $10 or $15 to mow their lawns as a kid. There was the occasional $20, which was nice, but $75 a week? I’d have been a KING at $75 a lawn.
Is that your casual rationalization to dismiss the rest of it?
joyce says:
June 11, 2013 at 3:11 pm
Very disappointing that this was the first thing that came to your mind.
chicagofinance says:
June 11, 2013 at 2:20 pm
I have nothing to hide, so I don’t really care honestly.
Retire underground in a luxurious 3 x7 box and you will never pay taxes again.
I’ve got so many toys in the garage, I’m not sure the Fit would fit into it. Need to find a spot for my hedge trimmer, weed wacker, lawn mower, snowblower, table saw, pneumatic compressor, wheel barrow, chop saw, tiger saw, router, jigsaw, circular saw, power sander, various drills, hockey goal (whoops).
[105] grim,
I have to pay 85 a week. A truck shows up and four professional riding mowers roll off. These guys fly around the property. Another mans the line trimmer. Takes 20 minutes. Would take me hours if I was using one home grade riding mower. There’s about 3 acres to mow.
Not to mention the dope correspondent admited to withdrawing from his own 401k like 3 times. No wonder his retirement sucks.
104.chicagofinance says:
June 11, 2013 at 3:16 pm
stat: I am no fan of any advice not given at the Fiduciary Standard. However, this report is pitched for sensationalism and entertainment and falls short on the authoritative front. The first 30 minutes can be discarded. The remaining portion when it focuses specially on cost in a responsible way is fine, but likely without being intentional, it mixes the issues of advice, cost, asset management, product sales, and the theoretical justification of passive investing into one big soup. The basic message is that you are being ripped off so be pissed. The problem is that it does a good job of creating an emotional response, but it does nothing to provide a solution.
As a practitioner, it is readily apparent that a good number of people simply do not care about this stuff……and I mean they REALLY do not care to the point that if I prod them too much they will fire me………it is similar to a fat 70 year old smoker complaining about their health when they have been told for 40 years to clean up their act…..
I am hiding all the bomb parts in my outgoing garbage every week!
(Now to sit back and wait to see if I get free trash pickup).
Grim No your not the only one. I want the billie goat 34 inch. I like to walk but man cutting nearly 3/4 acre with a push mower blows.
Since I was a landscaper many moons ago if you get all the bells and whistles 300 bucks is not far off.
Some kind of irony in the fact that folks will complain about $10k property taxes, but pay 1/3rd of that to some guy who sends illegals to mow a lawn.
“Some kind of irony in the fact that folks will complain about $10k property taxes, but pay 1/3rd of that to some guy who sends illegals to mow a lawn.”
Because the illegals actually work.
My lawn service is $35 a week. I would not even want to make a trip to fill a gas can for that. The lawn service comes by during the day on Thursday and cuts my whole neighborhood in one fell swoop. The guy with the string trimmer goes house to house first, then they guy on the ride on mower then another goes back around with the blower.
Only Forest Gump across the street does not take advantage, and he is out there all day Saturday making noise on his ride on mower. I hope he retires or downsizes soon and moves so a young hip family can move in. My new neighbor’s kids can then come by and tell my kids how lucky they are to have such a cool Dad, who does not even clean the pool, cut the lawn or do any kind of household yard work and can still hit the ball 225 on every drive.
No, sorry but I dismissed most of the rest of it due to (borrowing your line from #104) “it does a good job of creating an emotional response, but it does nothing to provide a solution.”
chicagofinance says:
June 11, 2013 at 3:17 pm
Is that your casual rationalization to dismiss the rest of it?
joyce says:
June 11, 2013 at 3:11 pm
Very disappointing that this was the first thing that came to your mind.
chicagofinance says:
June 11, 2013 at 2:20 pm
I have nothing to hide, so I don’t really care honestly.
Juice some day I hope to force my kids into slave labor performing my yard duties. not paying a landscaper when I’ will not be happy with the job they do.
Chi has allot to hide. His secrets start with applying black nail-polish then late late Friday night picking up the microphone and firing up the karaoke machine in his basement and doing his best rendition of Personal Jesus.
Chi I read they are coming around Aug/Sept are you still shopping for new Doc Martens?
Lib (108) – Don’t forget the 95 Civic too.
would love to do my lawn, but 14 daily hrs at the office get on the way. surprised to see all the free time that these GIVERS have.
Damn it. My own Personal Snowden just logged in.
120 – It’s light out until 8, just start your day earlier.
Kudos to the folks who will perform lawn care and snow shoveling during retirement. :)
Lawn care includes paying someone for spring cleanup, fall cleanup, mowing, trimming, blowing, raking, seed, fertilizer, weed killer, etc. Snow plowig the driveway isn’t cheap either. $300 monthly for both is probably fairly close here.
On insurance, there’s a typo of an extra zero, it should be $100 per month.
Housing maintenance in retirement isn’t cheap: roof replacements, stripping and painting the exterior every few years, gutter cleaning, resealing the driveway, fixing cracked sidewalks, cleaning windows, etc, etc.
Isn’t it easier to just buy a condo and not have to worry about any of that?
Sure, if you can handle the fees.
“Isn’t it easier to just buy a condo and not have to worry about any of that?”
I pay a Mexican fellow $40 per cut on my two acre property. That includes string trimming and blowing. He is legit as he also owns a taxi business in town and showed me the insurance papers. I enjoy doing the other stuff around the property: mulching, gardening, fertilizing. And snowplowing – I used to own a snow blower. Sold it after a big winter storm over a decade ago. Never looked back. My total snowplowing bill last few seasons has never passed $100 for the entire winter. My driveway is 200 feet long with a 40×50 turnaround.
Well Stu if you get the fit you can always turn the civic into one of those rice racers. By the way the truck is getting a junk transmission and being resurrected. Reaching your levels of cheapness, used trucks are ridiculously over priced for something I’m just going to beat up.
And Grim, try lawn service for 1 year, then compare your quality of life. Lawn work is a colossal waste of time, and time is money. Especially Saturday and Sunday time.
xolepa, hold on to that fellow. $50 per snow storm is common, and three winters ago I believe it snowed 28 times.
chifi, people don’t like to feel stupid. If it’s too complex for consumers to understand, they feel stupid. I doubt they don’t care, instead, they likely don’t understand, even if you explain it to them 20 times.
“it is readily apparent that a good number of people simply do not care about this stuff……and I mean they REALLY do not care to the point that if I prod them too much they will fire me………it is similar to a fat 70 year old smoker complaining about their health when they have been told for 40 years to clean up their act.”
(128) Saturday and Sunday time is precious. However, the buzzing machines are at it all day long on the weekends here. One thing about all this rain, though. Many lawns are still beautiful this time of year. A combination of weed&feed couple times over make your house look like a Home&Garden cover. My front yard is the best it has looked in twenty years.
p.s. It does help when you get as a Christmas gift a tractor attachable fertilizer spreader that holds 175 lbs.
I want the billie goat 34 inch.
There is one in nice condition on craigslist for $1200 – Good deal?
Our lawn guys use dual Turf Tracers (one guy follows behind the other) which is about $12K worth of mowing goodness. Each blade of grass is mowed no less than 3 times during their synchronized lawn ballet.
I guess it all depends on the size of your lawn. I can mow and string trim my entire property in about 30 minutes. The Honda snow thrower, about 30 minutes too. It helps to have decent equipment (Honda in this case). Every two years, I send the equipment in to get it tuned at a place on Route 10 in Whippany. They actually pick it up and deliver it back for free.
Though I broke down recently and paid the local hardware store $13 a window screen to rescreen 3 screens on my multi. I’ve done this myself in the past and it’ a colossal pita. I also pay someone $35 a mow to do the multi. Of course this is a business expense. :P
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Where’s my gubmint dope?
For Joyce, George Takei reminds of when the soldiers came for him a child with no due process, nobody stood up and nobody protested.
We are far far far from those days. Sure they are spying now but at least everyone knows. If some Dystopian Future a Despot gains control and then decides to turn the spying against us we would all know immediately and could organize, hopefully before it all (the internet) goes dark.
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/george-takei/japanese-american-internment-museum_b_3130896.html
Too much grim 1600 new with warranty
Juice,
How is that not exactly like current times when the govt, without due process, declares someone an enemy combatant and is put in prison never charged and held indefinitely? or worse, assasinated without due process?
Joyce I have read up on the gitmo boys and men the difference for some of them
Is wrong place wrong time, but not all not even close. I don’t think we are at the point where a suburb of LA or Detroit or Paterson is where the US military should come knocking on the doors of an entire neighborhood and drag them all away.
The only difference I see is that today the internment camps were in this country and not on some foreign land. I hope it stays that way… actually, I hope it gets better but that’s naive thinking.
i said that backwards, but you know what I meant
(137)Actually, the Canadians were the first to do these dirty deeds. FDR just stepped it up one notch in WWII: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ukrainian_Canadian_internment
Joyce – thinking is a luxury for many, (me channeling orwell) conisder yourself a non-naive citizen.
I screwed up my point too, good night all.
I’ll try to watch the 401k show later. I’ll bet the folks investigating don’t say anything negative about the government having a goal of devaluing money by at least 2 percent annually, or criticism of the government for manipulating interest rates lower so that savers cannot earn a fair rate of return on fixed income. Of course not, because the government loves us and is our savior. When the government rips off investors it’s for our own good.
Got sixth row for face…..they screwed everybody and threw it up on Ticketmaster without telling anybody….it was added after the fact about a month ago….
http://www.revelresorts.com/events/depeche-mode
Rags: don’t waste your time or else skip to about 25-30 minutes in…..
Ragnar says:
June 11, 2013 at 11:32 pm
I’ll try to watch the 401k show later. I’ll bet the folks investigating don’t say anything negative about the government having a goal of devaluing money by at least 2 percent annually, or criticism of the government for manipulating interest rates lower so that savers cannot earn a fair rate of return on fixed income. Of course not, because the government loves us and is our savior. When the government rips off investors it’s for our own good.
BTW here is the latest song…video is a chopped up version so it doesn’t do justice….you get some titty in the shadows though, so all is good…..
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bt-28iNQnwY
Juice Box says:
June 11, 2013 at 3:43 pm
Chi I read they are coming around Aug/Sept are you still shopping for new Doc Martens?