The Subprime Myth

From PBS:

The U.S. foreclosure crisis was not just a subprime event

Many studies of the housing market collapse of the last decade, and the associated sharp rise in defaults and foreclosures, focus on the role of the subprime mortgage sector. Yet subprime loans comprise a relatively small share of the U.S. housing market, usually about 15 percent and never more than 21 percent. Many studies also focus on the period leading up to 2008, even though most foreclosures occurred subsequently. In A New Look at the U.S. Foreclosure Crisis: Panel Data Evidence of Prime and Subprime Borrowers from 1997 to 2012 (NBER Working Paper No. 21261), Fernando Ferreira and Joseph Gyourko provide new facts about the foreclosure crisis and investigate various explanations of why homeowners lost their homes during the housing bust. They employ microdata that track outcomes well past the beginning of the crisis and cover all types of house purchase financing — prime and subprime mortgages, Federal Housing Administration (FHA)/Veterans Administration (VA)-insured loans, loans from small or infrequent lenders, and all-cash buyers. Their data contain information on over 33 million unique ownership sequences in just over 19 million distinct owner-occupied housing units from 1997– to 2012.

The researchers find that the crisis was not solely, or even primarily, a subprime sector event. It began that way, but quickly expanded into a much broader phenomenon dominated by prime borrowers’ loss of homes. There were only seven quarters, all concentrated at the beginning of the housing market bust, when more homes were lost by subprime than by prime borrowers. In this period 39,094 more subprime than prime borrowers lost their homes. This small difference was reversed by the beginning of 2009. Between 2009 and 2012, 656,003 more prime than subprime borrowers lost their homes. Twice as many prime borrowers as subprime borrowers lost their homes over the full sample period.

The authors’ key empirical finding is that negative equity conditions can explain virtually all of the difference in foreclosure and short sale outcomes of prime borrowers compared to all cash owners. Negative equity also accounts for approximately two-thirds of the variation in subprime borrower distress. Both are true on average, over time, and across metropolitan areas.

The authors’ findings imply that large numbers of prime borrowers who did not start out with extremely high LTVs still lost their homes to foreclosure. They conclude that the economic cycle was more important than initial buyer, housing and mortgage conditions in explaining the foreclosure crisis. These findings suggest that effective regulation is not just a matter of restricting certain exotic subprime contracts associated with extremely high default rates.

This entry was posted in Economics, Housing Bubble, Risky Lending. Bookmark the permalink.

64 Responses to The Subprime Myth

  1. grim says:

    This will go over well with the tea party constituents, we’re going to use technology to keep track of where people are, 24/7? Someone needs to tap him on the shoulder and tell him it’s time to go… From the Star Ledger:

    Christie defends ‘FedEx’ plan for tracking immigrants: ‘I don’t mean people are packages’

    Gov. Chris Christie on Sunday defended his recent suggestion that the U.S. use FedEx technology to keep track of immigrants living in the country on visas, dismissing critics who say he’s equating people with packages.

    “I don’t mean people are packages,” the Republican presidential candidate said during an interview on “Fox News Sunday.” “So let’s not be ridiculous.”

    During a campaign stop in New Hampshire on Saturday, Christie said if he were elected to the White House, he would ask FedEx founder Fred Smith to work with the federal government to come up with a system tracks immigrants from the moment their visas begin.

    “And then when your time is up, we go get you and tap your shoulder and say, ‘Excuse me, thanks for coming. Time to go,'” Christie told the crowd.

    But while interviewing Christie on Sunday morning, Fox News host Chris Wallace noted that some critics took issue with the plan, saying “people aren’t packages.”

    “They’re not,” Christie replied, “but what my point was this is once again a situation where the private sector laps us in the government with the use of technology. Let’s use the same type of technology to make sure that 40 percent of the 11 million people here illegally don’t overstay their visas. If FedEx can do it, why can’t we use the same technology to do it?”

  2. grim says:

    Maybe we can use this technology to keep track of our governor?

  3. Juice Box says:

    Fedex has a weight limit of 150 lbs.

    Tap them on the shoulder? Lol how about empowering bounty hunters? Going to need allot of detention centers, whose stock should I buy?

  4. grim says:

    Maybe Trump for Governor if he doesn’t win? Also from the Star Ledger:

    Donald Trump comes to The Barclays and all hell breaks loose

    Donald Trump was stopped immediately at the front entrance to Plainfield Country Club for his first of more than a hundred (no exaggeration) selfies and then headed inside. He took another quick selfie with Eric LeGrand — “Eric! Great to see you!” he said to the stunned former Rutgers football player — and then set off to watch the golf tournament.

    And make no mistake: He loved every minute of it. An impromptu security detail of six Edison police officers surrounded him, but Trump made it clear that he wanted no special “inside the ropes” access that would take him away from the people. He wanted to be seen.

    “This is an affirmation,” he told me. “People want our country to be good again. This is a great affirmation. You see it. Not a heckler in the whole group out of thousands of people.”

    That might sound like hyperbole, but it wasn’t too far off. I followed him closely for more than an hour, and the only thing close to heckling occurred when one fan said to the cops around him, “You’re protecting his guy? What happens when he cuts all your pensions?”

    Trump didn’t hear that one. Mostly, he heard screams of “Mr. President!” and “Don’t quit on us!” At one point, Steve Sanguiliano, from Flemington, yelled, “I hate Rosie O’Donnell, too!” so Trump grabbed him and said, “Come in for a quickie selfie.”

    “My wife hasn’t voted in 30 years!” a volunteer named Michael Zahn yelled. “She says she’s going to vote for you.”

    I am not a political pundit, but if you thought that was some polling quirk, you needed to be out here.

    I finally got alongside him and asked about all the support.

    “A lot of fans. A lot of great people,” he said.

  5. Comrade Nom Deplume, celebrating first day of school says:

    The problem with the lead is that it will upset The established narrative that the left used so effectively into thousand eight and 2012. The authors and any economists that contributed to that article will be expected to report for reeducation.

  6. Comrade Nom Deplume, celebrating first day of school says:

    Carly Fiorina’s campaign car hit a deer. I’m looking forward to the Twidiot posting a tweet from PETA on how the GOP is cruel to animals.

  7. Ottoman says:

    If I cared what racist morons think I’d be flattered that I affect you so deeply.

    “Libturd at home says:
    August 29, 2015 at 5:53 pm
    I really should save this for Monday, but here is why Anon, Otto and the like make me sick.”

  8. Ottoman says:

    From what I see, the lead says that deregulation was the problem and the blame can’t be put on people who took out the riskiest and most ill advised loans. Sounds exactly like what the left agrees with– taking down unbridled corporate control of our economy and no longer blaming the poor for the country’s problems. Glad you agree more government regulation is the solution!

    Comrade Nom Deplume, celebrating first day of school says:
    August 31, 2015 at 7:22 am
    The problem with the lead is that it will upset The established narrative that the left used so effectively into thousand eight and 2012. The authors and any economists that contributed to that article will be expected to report for reeducation.

  9. grim says:

    la la la la

    grim says:
    July 27, 2015 at 10:42 am

    Watch as the State of NJ shifts pension obligations onto the counties and municipalities. You’ll see. Each jurisdiction will be sent a bill, and it will be up to the municipalities to pay the piper.

    You’ll see, quote me, save this post.

    It will play out in the form of a “Special Assessment” on property holders, and it will apply to everyone, including age restricted housing, non-profits, religious organizations, state/federal operating within a municipality, properties previously provided with PILOTs. It will likely be a multi-year special assessment based on property value, taken as part of your municipal, county, and school taxes.

    Mark my words.

  10. grim says:

    From the Star Ledger:

    N.J. Senate prez pushing for paid sick leave law, taxing hospitals

    State Senate President Stephen Sweeney says he remains committed to passing legislation that would require businesses to provide paid sick days and for nonprofit hospitals to pay property taxes.

    But he doesn’t see either issue gaining momentum until after the Assembly elections in November.

    Developing a tax on hospitals — prompted by the June 25 court ruling that Morristown Medical Center should pay property taxes on most of its 40-acre property — is likely the easier challenge, Sweeney said during an editorial board meeting at The Star-Ledger.

    “We absolutely will work toward moving it, at least in the Senate,” said Sweeney (D-Gloucester), adding that the hospitals “have not been fair.”

    Sweeney said he agreed with the ruling. Proposed legislation under review include a payment in lieu of taxes, payment based on a percentage of revenues, or a straight up property tax, he said.

  11. Comrade Nom Deplume, celebrating first day of school says:

    [8] Otto

    I gave up trying to see what you see months ago. Suffice it to say, we wouldn’t agree on the time if we were looking at the same clock.

    I do see your point, and I’d agree with you simply out of inertia but then we’d both be wrong.

  12. anon (the good one) says:

    @MMFlint:

    10yrs ago today the world got to watch a live show from New Orleans whose plot line was already well known & well worn 2 any AfricanAmerican

  13. anon (the good one) says:

    @bendreyfuss:

    Wall with Mexico! Wall with Canada! The fukcing Army Corps of Engineers couldn’t build walls good enough to keep water out of New Orleans

  14. HeHateMe says:

    Kyane West is running for President now. Finally Trump has a real opponent.

  15. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Yes, more evidence that my prediction on the housing market and wage inflation seems to be dead on. People want to blame it on other things, but it’s really mainly due to demographics (spending patterns of groups with the focus for this one on the baby boomers who represented the largest group and were in their peak spending years from 1997-2007) and also the business and real estate cycles. Tie those three things together and you have a recipe for growing bubbles and the eventual bust.

    “The authors’ findings imply that large numbers of prime borrowers who did not start out with extremely high LTVs still lost their homes to foreclosure. They conclude that the economic cycle was more important than initial buyer, housing and mortgage conditions in explaining the foreclosure crisis. These findings suggest that effective regulation is not just a matter of restricting certain exotic subprime contracts associated with extremely high default rates.”

  16. Ben says:

    Yes, more evidence that my prediction on the housing market and wage inflation seems to be dead on. People want to blame it on other things, but it’s really mainly due to demographics (spending patterns of groups with the focus for this one on the baby boomers who represented the largest group and were in their peak spending years from 1997-2007) and also the business and real estate cycles. Tie those three things together and you have a recipe for growing bubbles and the eventual bust.

    I think the upcoming full moon is also evidence of your wage inflation prediction.

  17. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Maybe.

    Ben says:
    August 31, 2015 at 8:54 am
    Yes, more evidence that my prediction on the housing market and wage inflation seems to be dead on. People want to blame it on other things, but it’s really mainly due to demographics (spending patterns of groups with the focus for this one on the baby boomers who represented the largest group and were in their peak spending years from 1997-2007) and also the business and real estate cycles. Tie those three things together and you have a recipe for growing bubbles and the eventual bust.

    I think the upcoming full moon is also evidence of your wage inflation prediction.

  18. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Introduction
    Historical data indicates a strong relationship between the age distribution of the U.S.
    population and economic and stock market performance. Key demographic trends today include the aging of the Baby Boom generation, and the coming of age for the Millennials(sometimes called Echo-Boomers or Generation Y). Both of these trends will have a major impact on the economy and stock market over the coming decades. This paper examines several important consequences of our demographic trends, and identifies industries that should benefit from our shifting demographics.

    http://www.janney.com/file%20library/insights/isg_boomers-to-millennials_v4.pdf

  19. The Great Pumpkin says:

    20- “Millennials are the
    Key to Future Economic Growth
    The peak of the baby boom generation (those
    born between 1946 and 1965) was in 1981 when
    boomers were 24 years old, and it’s no coincidence
    that the economy and stock market had a 20-year
    surge as this generation went through its peak
    spending years. With the leading edge of this
    group now entering retirement, the focus turns
    to the Millennials (those born between 1982 and
    2001) and their ability to grow the economy.
    The good news is that the Millennials are a bigger
    population (thanks to a little help from immigration),
    with the peak of this generation now 24
    years old and at the beginning of their major consumption
    years. At the end of 2012, Baby Boomers
    numbered about 82.5 million. The Millennial generation
    is expected to be over 88 million people
    by the end of 2016—about 8 million more people
    than the Baby Boomers.
    Figure 1 compares the demographic landscape of
    1980 (just before the great bull market run of the
    80s and 90s) to the projected 2015 population. “

  20. The Great Pumpkin says:

    “Three major features stand out in Figure 1:
    1) The Millennials are a larger population today
    than the Boomers were in 1980, and they are just
    entering their peak consumption years;
    2) The retiring Baby Boomers are a source of
    slower economic growth, which was not present
    in 1980 (see page 4, Drivers of Long-term Economic
    Growth); and
    3) There is a large population group of approximately
    63 million between these two, known as
    Generation X. This group is currently in their
    peak consumption years and will remain there for
    quite some time.
    The combination of Millennials entering peak
    consumption years, supplemented by Generation
    X that is already there, provides a strong
    source of economic demand. This demand should
    more than offset the declining consumption of
    the retiring Baby Boomers. Figure 2 shows how
    consumption varies with age. Combining the
    demographics and consumer spending by age,
    analysis shows that consumer spending should
    grow about 1.2% per year. This increase only
    includes the benefit of more households, which
    offsets the drag due to a higher percentage of
    households in the 65+ age group. In addition, consumer
    spending should also grow as family income
    increases with an improving economy.
    The Congressional Budget Office (CBO) looks at
    this from the viewpoint of economic growth potential,
    and they summarize the impact of today’s
    demographics with growth projections for the
    next decade. The CBO projects that the economy
    can grow by 2.1% per year, on average, over the
    next decade. See Drivers of Long-term Economic
    Growth, for a more detailed discussion. “

  21. The Great Pumpkin says:

    “Millennials Present
    Investment Opportunities

    Millennials will make up the largest population
    cohort the U.S. has ever seen, and the consumer
    spending of the Millennials will be a key driver
    for equities. We identify several reasons for optimism
    below.

    Millennials Are Headed Toward Higher Income:

    Employment opportunities get better with
    age, especially with a college degree. The unemployment
    rate drops dramatically for 25- to
    34-year-olds, especially for those with a college
    degree (see page 5, Importance of Student Loans to
    Millennials). Entering your thirties often means
    marriage and better pay. Federal Reserve data
    shows that average household income and net
    worth rises the most (percentage- and dollar-wise)
    when transitioning from the under-35 to the 35–44
    age group. A large factor is marriage, and the stability
    of having a household with dual incomes.

    Favorable Housing Demographics:

    Just as household income has a dramatic jump
    as young adults transition from their 20s to their
    30s, so does home ownership. The median age
    of a first-time homebuyer is 31, and the biggest
    percentage point increase in the home ownership
    rate occurs when transitioning from households
    aged 25–29 (36.8% home ownership rate) to
    those aged 30–34 (51.6% home ownership rate).
    Figure 3 illustrates the results of a Millennial
    profiling survey, and clearly shows the group is
    interested in spending on housing (after they pay
    off their student loans—see page 5, Importance
    of Student Loans to Millennials). Survey data also
    shows that buying a home is the most important
    long-term financial goal of Millennials.

    Unlike some other durables, home ownership goes
    up with age (see Figure 4). This means that despite
    aging Baby Boomers, housing should have demographic
    tailwinds. This is in addition to significant
    pent-up demand for housing as a result of the
    Great Recession (see Figure 5), and very attractive
    affordability due to low interest rates.
    Autos should also benefit and have additional tailwinds
    due to good affordability (low interest rates),
    a record vehicle age of over 11 years, and significant
    pent-up demand since the Great Recession
    (see Figure 6). Millennials are also very interested
    in purchasing cars, as shown in Figure 3.”

  22. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Importance of student loans to Millennials:

    The benefits of a college education are clearly
    demonstrated in unemployment rates and average
    earnings. The unemployment rate for college
    grads stood at 3.4% in 4Q 2013, while the rate for
    a high school degree was 7.3%. Average annual
    earnings for a high school grad are only $32,493,
    while bachelor degree holders earn $59,415
    and advanced degree holders earn $87,981.
    The benefits of a college degree have also been
    magnified since the financial crisis.
    However, large student debt burdens for today’s
    Millennials is a growing concern. Student loans
    outstanding almost tripled between 2004 and 2012,
    and the aggregate student loan balance is now
    greater than $1 trillion. Student debt now exceeds
    aggregate auto loan, credit card, and home-equity
    debt balances—making student loans the second
    largest debt of U.S. households (about 8% of
    household debt), following mortgages.
    According to the Federal Reserve’s most recent
    comprehensive student loan report, the average
    amount of student loan debt stood at $24,218,
    but the median borrower only owed $13,662. The
    difference reflects borrowers with especially large
    amounts of student loan debt. 3.7% of borrowers
    had six-figure student loan debt, and 0.5% had debt
    over $200,000 (dominated by those with medicine
    and law degrees, where potential income is higher).
    40% of borrowers had balances of less than $10,000.
    Recent analysis by the New York Federal Reserve
    confirms that student loan debt may lessen other
    forms of borrowing. The Fed’s work shows a
    significant impact, since the financial crisis, on
    home and auto borrowing for those who have
    student debt relative to those who don’t. Other
    surveys show that student debt and a lack of savings
    are an issue for Millennial consumption. However,
    Millennials have a strong desire to own homes and
    cars—and will eventually be in a position to do so.

  23. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Student Loans Should Not Cause
    The Next Financial Crisis:

    With student loan debt levels, delinquencies,
    and defaults on the rise, there is concern about
    another financial crisis similar to housing in 2008.
    Fortunately, there are major differences with the
    housing crisis, and the systemic financial market
    risks posed by student loans are probably overstated.
    At their 2008 peak, residential mortgages totaled
    some $10.6 trillion (according to the Fed’s Flow
    of Funds report) versus some $0.97 trillion in
    student loans currently outstanding (one-tenth the
    size). At the onset of the crisis, mortgages without
    any (implicit or explicit) government guarantee
    totaled $5.2 trillion. In addition, the credit risk
    was multiplied many times over by the presence of
    $450 billion in exotic financial instruments, such
    as cash-collateralized debt obligations (CDOs) and
    extremely large (multi-trillion-dollar) positions
    in synthetic credit default swaps and CDOs. In
    comparison, private parties own the credit risk on
    only $150 billion of private student loans (PSLs)
    that are not guaranteed by the U.S. government.
    In a low-delinquency/default environment,
    student lending is a big money-making business
    for the government. Given that the Department of
    Education can borrow at low Treasury rates, larger
    loan volumes produce greater earnings. Indeed,
    for new loans issued in fiscal year 2013, even after
    accounting for the fairly high projected default
    rates cited above, the U.S. government expects to
    earn $5.7 billion.
    However, any rise in student loan delinquency/
    default rates will be systemic in the sense that
    the burdens of the losses will be borne broadly
    by U.S. taxpayer

  24. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Read this paper, I highlighted a lot of the points in the above posts. After reading this, maybe you won’t think I’m so crazy for thinking the stock market should be good to go till at least 2030 and the housing market will start to boom early 2020’s. Can’t lose right now if you invest in real estate or stocks long term. Truly a golden period to be investing at the bottom, too bad most people don’t realize this is the bottom or they just don’t have the funds to take advantage. In 10 years, a lot people will be saying I SHOULD HAVE BOUGHT A HOUSE WITH CHEAP RATES, OR I SHOULD HAVE INVESTED IN THE STOCK MARKET.

  25. grim says:

    Was educated on a new business model this morning.

    Party goes out and acquires cell phone numbers previously belonging to someone else, prepaids, etc. Amasses hundreds of numbers, telephones and SIM cards.

    Approach is to sit around waiting for the phone to ring, and then to sue any party who calls, which is largely made up of parties who were previously provided consent to that number.

    Apparently this is very lucrative business.

    There are now businesses who are identifying these parties and their books of numbers, and selling access to those lists.

  26. A Home Buyer says:

    27 –

    Confused. What are they suing for? And how is it profitable?

  27. grim says:

    Reassigned and wrong numbers were ambiguous under the TCPA, which opened the door to lawsuits, or even more lucrative, settlements. These were essentially “lawsuit factories”. The penalties were something like $1,500 per call or text message, and I hear that you could settle for significantly more (since the cost to defend is very high).

    So, let’s say you went into a T-Mobile, Boost, Walmart, etc and purchased 100 pre-paid SIM cards with the Paygo plan, your cost for maintaining the cellphones was approximately $40 a year (or thereabouts) – per number. So now you have a $4,000 investment. You can acquire cases of junk phones for free, which all work just fine. In major urban metros, there are not enough phone numbers, so they are routinely recycled.

    Big bonus if that previous owner was a deadbeat (which is highly likely using a prepaid/paygo SIM from a bottom tier carrier), since every collection call, marketing call, etc – is a payday. A “jackpot” might be something like a health club, utility, etc – who might make dozens of calls or send dozens of text messages. Now that single $40 investment might pay back tens of thousands. Also of note are small businesses that use text messages for marketing coupons – like your local yogurt shop, pizza place, or even bigger retailers like Bed Bath and Beyond.

    Also heard that some law firms that specialized in class action were doing the same thing to identify potential targets.

  28. HeHateMe says:

    Lock in your Heating Oil contracts today!!! Looks like oil might stay higher for awhile

  29. NJT says:

    Paid $1.97 this morn. for regular (Gasoline) and 1.75 for Home heating oil (self serve at same station – not locking in yet re: a major oil delivery as my provider’s accountant says its going even lower. Eh, first bump up I’ll call, sign and take delivery).

    These are the best prices since that short lived 2009 price drop.

    Wish one could store Gasoline these days as I know someone with a large underground tank and pumps (farmer) that NOONE knows about (well, I do).

  30. Comrade Nom Deplume, the Answer says:

    “Homebuilders are balking at a new labor law ruling that puts them on the hook for issues involving millions of subcontractors. Roofers, plumbers, electricians, framers are just some of the 25 categories of subcontractors used to build a home. The National Labor Relations Board (NLRB) could, in some cases, now deem them “joint employees” of the homebuilders.”

    http://www.cnbc.com/2015/08/31/homebuilders-call-new-labor-law-ruling-crippling.html

  31. HeHateMe says:

    John Denver the Country Singer had a huge underground gas tank installed in his house and when gas hit historic lows he locked in and filled the whole dam thing up and had enough gas for rest of his life.

    Too bad he went flying in a glider plane and died shortly afterwards. Oh Well.

    NJT says:

    August 31, 2015 at 1:34 pm

    Paid $1.97 this morn. for regular (Gasoline) and 1.75 for Home heating oil (self serve at same station – not locking in yet re: a major oil delivery as my provider’s accountant says its going even lower. Eh, first bump up I’ll call, sign and take delivery).

    These are the best prices since that short lived 2009 price drop.

    Wish one could store Gasoline these days as I know someone with a large underground tank and pumps (farmer) that NOONE knows about (well, I do).

  32. D-FENS says:

    @realDonaldTrump: For those that don’t think a wall (fence) works, why don’t they suggest taking down the fence around the White House? Foolish people!

  33. Banco Popular Trust Preferred Shares says:

    Ok….. FlabMax gets to revel in this practical joke……fcuk you bstard
    http://www.ynetnews.com/articles/0,7340,L-4696040,00.html

  34. Comrade Nom Deplume, celebrating first day of school says:

    [35] banco

    Think he will be offended?

    http://www.gocomics.com/bloomcounty/1982/11/14/

  35. Walking Bye says:

    @35 explain?

  36. A Home Buyer says:

    35 – Banco

    No offense, but those people complaining need to chill out.

    A poorly constructed hose structure that mists water should not be a sight that causes offense. Especially when its purpose is generally understood as a cooling station.

  37. D-FENS says:

    Caution, reading this article has been known to cause Xenophobia in some people…proceed with caution.

    http://www.breitbart.com/big-journalism/2015/07/10/rape-deniers-9-facts-about-illegal-alien-crime-the-media-covers-up/

    Did you know that in the state of Texas alone over the last few years, more than 2000 illegal aliens were deported after committing sex crimes?

    Did you know that in the state of Texas alone over the last few years, nearly a thousand illegal aliens have been convicted of sex crimes against children

  38. China’s investors find safe haven in American real estate

    “Worldwide in the last 12 months, Chinese investors bought $21.1 billion in commercial real estate – income-producing properties priced above $2.5 million – according to data compiled by Real Capital Analytics. Nearly $5.9 billion was invested in the United States, with the lion’s share – $4.5 billion – going to Manhattan.

    During that period, the overall U.S. commercial real estate market was $459 billion. Foreign nationals bought $62.1 billion of those properties, with $19.7 billion from Europeans and $18.8 billion from Asian buyers. Canadians were the largest buyers of American income-producing real estate, with new investments totaling $13.2 billion.

    High profile acquisitions by Chinese buyers of Manhattan landmark properties have been likened to that of another Asian powerhouse – Japan in the late 1980s.”

    http://finance.yahoo.com/news/china-s-investors-find-safe-haven-in-american-real-estate-171923676.html

  39. NJT says:

    #32 [Comrade]

    Had to settle out of court for ‘hidden defects’ ($10,000 though they wanted much more) on a home I sold ‘as is’ (never lived in it).

    *Note – No ‘realtors’ involved in the transaction.

    Buyers wife was a legal secretary on her way to becoming attorney.

    *karma – they got divorced and lost the house. But I’m still out $10,000.

    This was in the early 2000s. Now, there’s NO WAY they’d blackmail me like that.

    The law was: Seven years to find the stuff and sue. Heh, the house was 80 years old and 90% renovated. Gold diggers and to think I welcomed them to the neighborhood!

    Live and learn.

    Yeah, a piddly amount but it still bothers me despite their demise.

  40. Alex says:

    According to CNBC, due to budget deficits, Illinois is no longer paying lottery winners who win $250,000 or more. They are issuing IOUs instead.

  41. A Home Buyer says:

    43 –

    It’s actually amounts more then 25K. That article is about a winner who was supposed to receive 250K and is being delayed until the budget is resolved.


    “Due to the ongoing budget situation in Springfield, some lottery winner payments have been delayed. All winners will be paid in full as soon as the Lottery and the Illinois Comptroller have the legislative authority to do so. Currently, winners may claim prizes under $600 at any of our 8,000 retail locations, and prizes under $25,000 may be claimed at any Lottery claims center, found at illinoislottery.com.”

  42. Alex says:

    44-

    Thanks for the correction. 25K or more winners do not receive payment, just IOUs

  43. grim says:

    John Denver the Country Singer had a huge underground gas tank installed in his house and when gas hit historic lows he locked in and filled the whole dam thing up and had enough gas for rest of his life.

    I can’t imagine any realistic situation where this would have a positive ROI. Installing an underground storage tank has huge environmental barriers, and the equipment is not cheap. Let’s say he installed a 10,000 gallon fuel tank. That probably costs $100,000 to do so (just ask anyone who has built a gas station). Gasoline would need to delta upward rise of $10 a gallon to just break even.

    I call bullshit.

  44. grim says:

    40 – You’d have more fun in a dive bar in Milwaukee than you would with a bunch of rich pricks in Ibiza, someone should tell him this.

  45. grim says:

    How long till they find him dead of a drug overdose?

  46. Banco Popular Trust Preferred Shares says:

    FlabMax finally located…..no wonder he hasn’t posted recently…
    http://nypost.com/2015/08/31/white-supremacist-found-guilty-of-jewish-center-murders/

  47. Banco Popular Trust Preferred Shares says:

    I tend to disagree with you…..the gas chambers were described as “showers” to the unsuspecting…..
    “In front of the gas chamber was a dressing room. On its walls was written in all languages: “Put shoes into the cubbyholes and tie them together so you will not lose them. After the showers you will receive hot coffee.” Here the poor victims undressed themselves and went into the chamber. There were three columns for the ventilators, through which the gas poured in. A special work detail with truncheons drove the people into the chamber. When the room was full, small children were thrown in through a window. Moll grabbed infants by their little legs and smashed their skulls against the wall. Then the gas was let into the chamber. The lungs of the victims slowly burst, and after three minutes a loud clamoring could be heard. Then the chamber was opened, and those who still showed signs of life were beaten to death.”
    http://www.fpp.co.uk/Auschwitz/stories/Pelt_sources/Buchenwald_Report_extract.html

    A Home Buyer says:
    August 31, 2015 at 3:18 pm
    35 – Banco

    No offense, but those people complaining need to chill out.

    A poorly constructed hose structure that mists water should not be a sight that causes offense. Especially when its purpose is generally understood as a cooling station.

  48. joyce says:

    I agree with A Home Buyer.

  49. A Home Buyer says:

    Still not seeing how “three columns for the ventilators, through which the gas poured in”, which I read as metal duct work and not even a pipe, in any way or form resembles a garden hose misting water during a heat wave.

    I wont claim to know the ins and outs of what happened during those atrocities, so please explain what I am missing… the physical descriptions diverge.

    Are they upset just because of the name, showers?

  50. Grim says:

    Context – most of Europe is experiencing a heat wave of record proportion. I’ve been to Auswitz twice, it’s filled with elderly people, it’s also an exhausting place in the summer, emotionally and physically.

  51. grim says:

    Anyone attributing those actions to malice is an idiot.

    From Accuweather:

    Dangerous Heat Wave From Poland to Ukraine and Romania This Week

    An unrelenting heat wave will continue to have a firm grip on eastern Europe for much of this week. Across Germany, the heat will come in pulses as shots of cooler air bring only temporary relief.

    While the jet stream and resultant storm track remain draped over the United Kingdom and western Europe, a ridge of high pressure will stay firmly entrenched over Poland, Ukraine and surrounding areas through at least midweek.

    Temperatures will soar daily into the lower and middle 30s C (near 90 to middle 90s F) in Warsaw, Minsk, Kiev and Vienna. Highs around 23 C (75 F) are more common this time of year.

    Amid this current heat wave, Warsaw set a new all-time August high temperature record on Saturday when the temperature peaked at 36.6 C (97.9 F). The previous record was 36.4 C (97.5 F) from August 1994, according to AccuWeather Meteorologist Tyler Roys.

    The cumulative effect of the persistent heat will prove extra dangerous for residents and animals who do not find ways to keep cool. Residents are reminded to drink plenty of water, wear light clothing and never leave kids or pets unattended in a sealed car.

    Strenuous activities should be avoided during the midday and afternoon hours, the hottest times of the day. If that is not possible, be sure to take frequent breaks.

  52. Banco Popular Trust Preferred Shares says:

    FlabMax is a neo-nazi

    grim says:
    August 31, 2015 at 9:01 pm
    Anyone attributing those actions to malice is an idiot.

  53. walking bye says:

    Blanco – blacks suffered a lot worse in their history yet do not go into fits when they see the confederate flag, talk about out of context r

  54. A Home Buyer says:

    55 –

    I think I know a few people who might take offense the term “Nazi” being flung around just to prove a point on the interwebs.

  55. A Home Buyer says:

    56 – Walking

    Well that’s peachy, debating who got the worse end of the brutality stick. I’m sure that argument wont be biased on either side.

    Besides my sarcasm, I also offer the following question. Do you consider the behavior and events surrounding the Confederate flag as an example of rational discussion in this country?

  56. Banco Popular Trust Preferred Shares says:

    I am not going to say you are definitively wrong, but unless you have ever visited this place, I think you should reserve making such a bold comment…….it makes you sound naive……
    http://www.ushmm.org/

    walking bye says:
    August 31, 2015 at 9:21 pm
    Blanco – blacks suffered a lot worse in their history yet do not go into fits when they see the confederate flag, talk about out of context r

  57. The Great Pumpkin says:

    “During the last U.S. presidential election, an editorial in a Chinese state-run newspaper declared that if Washington insisted on flouting Chinese interests (by selling arms to Taiwan, for example), Beijing should “use its financial weapon to teach the U.S. a lesson.” Three years later, America owes even more to China than the $1.16 trillion it owed then. But the increase in debt holdings hasn’t translated to an increase in leverage; quite the opposite. The U.S. has become for Beijing what Trump was for the New York bankers he borrowed money from during the 1980s — too big to fail.”

    http://www.bloombergview.com/articles/2015-08-31/china-has-lots-of-treasuries-not-much-leverage

  58. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    [59] You can make a case that the oldest currently living black generations were dealt the worst hand. And to add insult to injury they stopped making Pontiacs.

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