#FOMO

From the WSJ:

Housing Rebound: Time for Millennials to Leave the Nest

Millennials appear to be in no rush to ditch their parents’ homes. Perhaps they should be.

More adults between ages 18 and 34 are now living with mommy and daddy than ever before, according to the Pew Research Center. And the millennials who have fled the nest have increasingly become renters rather than buyers, a major reason the U.S. homeownership rate hit a 48-year low earlier this year.

But times are changing. Job prospects are improving and wages are showing signs of breaking out. Those factors alone suggest conditions are favorable for home buyers. Yet record levels of student debt are weighing on millennials and that could prompt them to miss out on a ripe opportunity to buy.

Consider the coming S&P/Case-Shiller Home Price Index, due Tuesday. Economists polled by The Wall Street Journal estimate home prices across the nation rose 5.2% in the 12 months ended in October, up from a 4.9% increase in the comparable period a month earlier.

Of course, that is good news for current homeowners. They reap the benefits of seeing home values appreciate by more than twice the rate of inflation. But that doesn’t help a millennial skittish about becoming a first-time home buyer. Rising home values make it even more difficult to muster 20% for a down payment.

Furthermore, the benefit of ultralow mortgage rates won’t last forever. The average 30-year fixed-rate mortgage was still under 4% in December, according to Freddie Mac. With the Federal Reserve expected to keep raising interest rates at a measured pace in 2016, they should move higher as well.

Rising prices and interest rates may please the older generation, but not the one that hasn’t yet begun climbing the property ladder.

The fear of missing out—or FOMO, as the kids say these days—should prompt millennials to act now.

This entry was posted in Demographics, Housing Recovery, National Real Estate. Bookmark the permalink.

86 Responses to #FOMO

  1. grim says:

    Is #FOMO even a thing or am I looking completely ridiculous right now?

  2. Now Spanky be reasonable says:

    #FOMO on flaming hoverboards

  3. grim says:

    FMITA or FOMO?

  4. Now Spanky be reasonable says:

    If I rush into buying an overpriced house that I can’t afford because I FOMO, then yes, FMITA.

  5. grim says:

    If the last bubble was any indication – it’s the boomers and gen-xers that are the FOMO generations, not millennials.

  6. grim says:

    Ahhh, innovation. From the WSJ:

    Fannie and Freddie Give Birth to New Mortgage Bond

    The federal government is trying to get taxpayers off the hook for billions of dollars of potential losses if another mortgage crisis arrives—and in the process, it is quietly giving birth to a new asset class.

    Under government control, mortgage-finance giants Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac next year plan to ramp up sales of new types of securities that in effect transfer potential losses in a housing downturn to private investors.

    Called Connecticut Avenue Securities by Fannie Mae and Structured Agency Credit Risk by Freddie Mac, the securities are essentially bonds whose performance is tied to that of a pool of mortgages. If the mortgages default, investors in the bonds could lose some or all of their principal.

    Proponents of the risk-transfer deals see them becoming a mainstay of the bond and housing markets over time, perhaps even entering major bond indexes tracked by mutual funds and exchange-traded funds.

    The sales are especially notable because issuances of private-label mortgage-backed securities, which also give private investors mortgage exposure, are still moribund.

    Fannie and Freddie already have sold about $25 billion of securities since 2013 to private investors, including money managers such as BlackRock Inc. and Invesco, hedge funds, real-estate investment trusts and other investors.

    Earlier this month, the Federal Housing Finance Agency, which regulates Fannie and Freddie, said the companies would transfer to private investors in 2016 the credit risk on 90% of the unpaid principal balance of the riskiest mortgages the companies back—where homeowners get a mortgage of more than 20 years and make less than a 40% down payment.

    “We’re going from no place to some place,” said Lewis Ranieri, the financier who co-invented the mortgage-backed security. “There’s still a question of whether [the securities sales] can be expanded to really provide the goal of making the government the guarantor of last resort.”

  7. dentss says:

    We need the millennials to buy homes …who will pay for the constitutionally guaranteed pensions Sweeney is in such a rush to fund …with all the seniors fleeing the state (if they can ) who will be left holding the bag ?

  8. No Billionaire Left Behind (the good one) says:

    no doubt, but something is going on. next town over there were a bunch of teardowns and new houses doubled in taxes fast approaching $30k….3 houses went up in summer and sold by fall, there’s a group of who are doing very well and comfortably able to afford it

    Walking bye says:
    December 28, 2015 at 9:12 pm
    regarding the Ni suburb issue. taxes are definitely the issue here. As millenials continue to settle for other parts of the country due to housing cost and re taxes. Had family member report back after she married and moved to Denver. 2 years out there and they bought a home for $200k and taxes at $900. The difference to a millenial couple is if a spouse looses job in Denver they could still get by with working at whole foods/Starbucks to get them through. In jersey a loss of work puts you behind the 8 ball in a matter of weeks if your paying $26k in re taxes plus a mortgage. This in turn becomes a vicious cycle as newer startup companies look for a younger tech workforce.

  9. No Billionaire Left Behind (the good one) says:

    MAKING A MURDERER. (on Netflix)

    Filmed over a 10-year period, Making a Murderer is an unprecedented real-life thriller about Steven Avery, a DNA exoneree who, while in the midst of exposing corruption in local law …See full summary »

  10. grim says:

    Pretty sure millennials (or NJ expats) aren’t buying homes in Denver either, unless it’s somewhere is a third-tier suburb or shithole.

    http://njrereport.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/Screen-Shot-2015-12-29-at-8.46.03-AM.png

  11. grim says:

    I mean, great time to buy in Denver – I’m sure the long-timers in Denver are laughing all the way to the bank.

    http://njrereport.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/Screen-Shot-2015-12-29-at-8.56.22-AM.png

    Doubling of home prices in 4 years, nothing to see there, totally sustainable.

  12. No Billionaire Left Behind (the good one) says:

    Michael, Yome, check it out

    on Netflix

    “Making a Murderer” has several other stories to tell as well. One is a familiar tale of social class and provincial small-mindedness, with the middle-class denizens and institutions of Manitowoc County united in scorn against the Averys, who owned an auto salvage business and were thought of as the hillbillies on the edge of town.

    “Making a Murderer” relies on title cards, interviews, news reports and hour upon hour of courtroom and police interrogation footage. In its meticulous assemblage of almost 700 hours of footage, the series is, as Mike Hale of The New York Times puts it, “immersive, compulsive and unpredictable”

  13. 1987 Condo says:

    Bamboo…wow, can’t get away from this board…

  14. Ragnar says:

    How about anon spends more time on chat boards defending the Averys, based on a TV show he watched.

  15. Grim says:

    I hate the shit, people should be put in jail for selling it

  16. Ragnar says:

    6, grim,
    The sad fact about our economy is that it’s not really “the government” guaranteeing mortgages, deposits, failing politically connected companies, and investment bank carry trade and risk betting. The government is simply acting as an incompetent agent for every American citizen, co-signing our names on every risky contract, and taking out second and third mortgages on all of our assets. The government agents have minimal risk or liability – it’s all on those of us who have some income and assets left to be hocked.

  17. Ragnar says:

    Until I looked it up, I thought FOMO was the urban rallying cry for Obama’s third term. Like anon holding up a sign saying “FOMO years”.

  18. Fast Eddie says:

    Ragnar,

    Brilliant. I’m sure the masses will embrace it and expect to see the shirts being worn shortly.

  19. Fast Eddie says:

    Lemmy: RIP

  20. chicagofinance says:

    I am not kidding ….legalized cannabis drawing Californians?

    grim says:
    December 29, 2015 at 8:57 am
    I mean, great time to buy in Denver – I’m sure the long-timers in Denver are laughing all the way to the bank.

    http://njrereport.com/blog/wp-content/uploads/2015/12/Screen-Shot-2015-12-29-at-8.56.22-AM.png

    Doubling of home prices in 4 years, nothing to see there, totally sustainable.

  21. nwnj3 says:

    And Democrats refer to them as votes, what’s the difference?

    HouseWhineWine says:

    December 28, 2015 at 5:22 pm

    Re, post 11, sad that you refer to people as garbage. Really unnecessary.

  22. No Billionaire Left Behind (the good one) says:

    Ayn Rand would had loved it. Her perfect society where the strong is entitled with the right to rape the weak. And let that be a lesson to the weak

  23. D-FENS says:

    I take issue with welfare and government benefits, when offered and given improperly. I fear the impact on the nation’s treasury, not the immigrant or asylum seeker.

    I have no problem with people of any race or religion coming here seeking economic opportunity, or wanting to make a positive contribution here.

    I agree with house wine.

    nwnj3 says:
    December 29, 2015 at 9:43 am
    And Democrats refer to them as votes, what’s the difference?

    HouseWhineWine says:

    December 28, 2015 at 5:22 pm
    Re, post 11, sad that you refer to people as garbage. Really unnecessary.

  24. joyce says:

    By Steve Schmadeke and David Heinzmann and Dan Hinkel
    Chicago Tribune
    http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/ct-chicago-police-shooting-video-questions-20151223-story.html

    After her teenage son died in a police-chase crash, Jondalyn Fields’ lawyers asked the Chicago Police Department for the videos from their cars and along the route to try to find out what happened.

    While her lawsuit dragged on for six years, the city finally made a startling claim: Some of the videos it had long denied existed had been erased or recorded over.

    Time and again, lawyers suing over alleged police misconduct have found that the Police Department failed to produce crucial video or audio from the storage system the city spent millions of dollars to implement.

  25. nwnj3 says:

    #23

    Do you have any kids? How do feel about them having to deal with this mess after the malignancy festers for a generation or two?

    We already have a permanently disenfranchised underclass, you have to be insane or an opportunist politician to want to expand it.

  26. grim says:

    From MarketWatch:

    Home prices rise at fastest annual rate since August 2014: S&P/Case-Shiller

    U.S. home price gains quickened in October, and several cities saw double-digit growth.

    The S&P/Case-Shiller 20-city composite index rose 0.1% for the three-month period ending in October, for a 5.5% yearly gain. That was stronger than the 5.4% annual growth notched in September’s reading and the fastest annual reading since August 2014, when prices climbed 5.6%

    Twelve metros had higher annual readings in October than they had in September. Prices in Denver, Portland, and San Francisco climbed 10.9% to lead the group.

    The weakest showing was a 1.3% annual increase in Chicago, followed by 1.7% in Washington.

    Eight cities showed price declines for the month, led by Chicago’s 0.7% fall.

  27. grim says:

    From CNBC:

    US home prices rise 5.2% in October: S&P/Case-Shiller

    Tight supply of homes for sale is pushing home prices ever higher again — with annual gains swelling in most major markets. Home values in October were 5.2 percent higher than October of 2014, according to the S&P/Case-Shiller National Home Price Index, which measures all nine U.S. census divisions. This is wider than the 4.9 percent annual gain in September.

    Price gains were even larger in the nation’s top 20 housing markets, at 5.5 percent annually. San Francisco, Denver and Portland, Oregon, showed the highest year-over-year gains, with all three showing home values in October 10.9 percent higher than one year ago. Twelve of the top 20 largest cities saw bigger annual gains in October than in September.

  28. Fast Eddie says:

    Tight supply of homes for sale is pushing home prices ever higher again — with annual gains swelling in most major markets.

    Should I flip my house?

  29. grim says:

    S&P CS NY Commutable November

    Low Tier (Under $292798)
    YOY – 4.47%
    Since 2013 – 6.57%
    Since 2012 – 11.75%

    Mid Tier ($292798 – $466670)
    YOY – 3.85%
    Since 2013 – 5.83%
    Since 2012 – 12.54%

    High Tier (Over $466670)
    YOY – 2.38%
    Since 2013 – 4.32%
    Since 2012 – 9.20%

    Aggregate
    YOY – 3.08%
    Since 2013 – 4.93%
    Since 2012 – 10.10%

  30. Ragnar says:

    Borrow cheap and buy now or be priced out forever.

  31. D-FENS says:

    25 – I worry, but what parent doesn’t. I certainly don’t worry that people from foreign countries are coming to the United States.

    Full disclosure: My brother married a Syrian woman and my nephew is half Syrian.

  32. WALKING BYE says:

    Grim, From Bloomberg headline today, “The Return of the Affordable Starter Home” in of all places Denver. a quick look thru zillow, plenty of nice millennial newer starter homes 2,500 sf homes, on small lots for under $250k with tax under $1300. Try and do that in Bergen County and you get $400k POS cape that needs $50k in updates and a tax of 10k. Or one can read through Fast Eddies coffee table book “Better Homes and Catastrophes, a review of NJ RE” get the unrated version as its much more entertaining.

    And yes there are plenty of people buying into towns with taxes of 25k plus. As has been suggested they may be getting help from Bank of Dad. The question is how long will these prices last ? as the Boomers will be caught in a fixed income trap, stagnant wages will continue to drive millennials out, and taxes creep up to 30k by 2020? Make no mistake its not just North Jersey facing this problem, Its Rockland, Westchester, LI as well.

  33. No Billionaire Left Behind (the good one) says:

    Christie’s main promise when running for nj governor was to deal with property taxes. that worked well

    WALKING BYE says:
    December 29, 2015 at 10:59 am
    Grim, From Bloomberg headline today, “The Return of the Affordable Starter Home” in of all places Denver. a quick look thru zillow, plenty of nice millennial newer starter homes 2,500 sf homes, on small lots for under $250k with tax under $1300. Try and do that in Bergen County and you get $400k POS cape that needs $50k in updates and a tax of 10k. Or one can read through Fast Eddies coffee table book “Better Homes and Catastrophes, a review of NJ RE” get the unrated version as its much more entertaining.

    And yes there are plenty of people buying into towns with taxes of 25k plus. As has been suggested they may be getting help from Bank of Dad. The question is how long will these prices last ? as the Boomers will be caught in a fixed income trap, stagnant wages will continue to drive millennials out, and taxes creep up to 30k by 2020? Make no mistake its not just North Jersey facing this problem, Its Rockland, Westchester, LI as well.

  34. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Jcer, you are usually on point, but you are wrong about the millennials. I’m a millennial, I should know. Ever hear the saying that 30 is the new 20? Well, apply that to my generation. They hit their 20’s in pretty much a depression(even though technically we call it a recession). That’s why they lived the way they did…in parents basements or renting in city areas (can’t rent in suburbs, can’t afford a car and rent). So had to be close to whatever crappy job you were offered. The millennials who did well for themselves by getting a good job, also flocked to major cities. Why? Everyone their age was in the city, and want to party and go drinking.

    Here is what is happening when they hit their 30’s. They are finally getting “real jobs”. Not some bs job that you can’t survive on. They are getting career jobs now. Guess what they want to do next? Yes, get married. Guess what happens after? They have kids. As soon as they have kids, they all leave the city for the nice suburbs. Every single millennial I know, is moving away from the cities for the burbs as soon as they are mature and ready for a family. When these other millennials start getting jobs from baby boomer’s that are retiring, the housing market will get going and will go hard. Will be so many people competing to buy a house at all levels. Meaning the starter home gets purchased, which pushes someone up into a bigger house, which in turns pushes someone to a nice house…and so on. It’s coming. Life will be good in the 2020’s.

    jcer says:
    December 28, 2015 at 5:39 pm
    80, property taxes are a huge part of the problem. As for millenial hipsters, good luck. Only certain suburban towns apply, you need a downtown and a train, think Ridgewood,Montclair, Summit, Maplewood(Already Brooklyn west), etc and they prefer smaller homes with smaller lots and lower taxes. By and large millennials do not put huge emphasis on the big suburban home, they are looking for just enough, hence the city living and lack of cars. Home owners are dreaming if they think property values are going to shoot up from where they are now, if anything suburbia will just about keep pace or even fall behind inflation. The incomes drive the property values and Millennials aren’t making the money, they are the poorest generation in decades and have a wealth distribution that is incredibly uneven with a small group of extremely skilled and talented people taking home the vast majority of the wealth. Certain places will benefit others will not my money is on the best towns in great commutable locations being a good investment, everything else in NJ will decline.

  35. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Millennials that are pot heads are moving there. They will leave, once they are done with their 20’s and ready to start a family.

    You do understand where the money will come from…you just stated it. From their wealthy parents, who exactly do you think is going to get all their parents money? Parents sell the house and eventually that money will be for their kids home, if they don’t outright just give them their house. Combine this with a growing economy and there will be plenty of money to drive up these prices.

    WALKING BYE says:
    December 29, 2015 at 10:59 am
    Grim, From Bloomberg headline today, “The Return of the Affordable Starter Home” in of all places Denver. a quick look thru zillow, plenty of nice millennial newer starter homes 2,500 sf homes, on small lots for under $250k with tax under $1300. Try and do that in Bergen County and you get $400k POS cape that needs $50k in updates and a tax of 10k. Or one can read through Fast Eddies coffee table book “Better Homes and Catastrophes, a review of NJ RE” get the unrated version as its much more entertaining.

    And yes there are plenty of people buying into towns with taxes of 25k plus. As has been suggested they may be getting help from Bank of Dad. The question is how long will these prices last ? as the Boomers will be caught in a fixed income trap, stagnant wages will continue to drive millennials out, and taxes creep up to 30k by 2020? Make no mistake its not just North Jersey facing this problem, Its Rockland, Westchester, LI as well.

  36. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Exactly, do people not realize how much money is out there. High taxes maybe for you, but not someone with money. If nobody had money out there, builders wouldn’t have concentrated new construction on the high end market in single family homes during the downturn in this real estate cycle. They knew the rich were still flush with money, it was the starter home buyer(millennial) that they didn’t focus on.

    No Billionaire Left Behind (the good one) says:
    December 29, 2015 at 8:37 am
    no doubt, but something is going on. next town over there were a bunch of teardowns and new houses doubled in taxes fast approaching $30k….3 houses went up in summer and sold by fall, there’s a group of who are doing very well and comfortably able to afford it

    Walking bye says:
    December 28, 2015 at 9:12 pm
    regarding the Ni suburb issue. taxes are definitely the issue here. As millenials continue to settle for other parts of the country due to housing cost and re taxes. Had family member report back after she married and moved to Denver. 2 years out there and they bought a home for $200k and taxes at $900. The difference to a millenial couple is if a spouse looses job in Denver they could still get by with working at whole foods/Starbucks to get them through. In jersey a loss of work puts you behind the 8 ball in a matter of weeks if your paying $26k in re taxes plus a mortgage. This in turn becomes a vicious cycle as newer startup companies look for a younger tech workforce.

  37. The Great Pumpkin says:

    37- They focused on building rentals for the millennials. Too bad the millennials will move away from rentals, creating a nice rental bust in cities in the 2020’s, when these millennials starting heading to the burbs. It might not be huge bust, but it will certainly bring rental prices down, or stagnant for a couple years.

  38. WALKING BYE says:

    Pumkin yes I have seen the married millennial move out of Hoboken/Gold Coast to the suburbs. So I won’t deny that. It does happen right around when kids enter the picture and before they start school. The surprising reason I’ve heard though is the noise that their babies cause. I would have thought it would be the space constraints. Apparently these luxury apartments have paper thin walls and occupants are constantly written up for noise issues.

  39. WALKING BYE says:

    Years ago I was at party on a Friday night and we all had to whisper after 9pm. The owner below the apt had a very sick cat and complained to the board that the noise was causing undue duress for both of them. I don’t care how nice the view is, that life is not for me.

  40. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I know one millennial couple in hoboken, he is a lawyer and she is doctor. They are 32, been married a year and now have a kid on the way. Guess what, they are looking to move to the burbs. Shocker! They were even thinking about looking in the town I live in.

    After they leave, I will only know of one more couple that still lives in hoboken. They have been married for like 7 years and bought a condo in hoboken around that time. They are 34 and 35. I don’t know if they are having kids. She is feminist and I don’t know if she is into the whole kid thing. She didn’t even take his last name when they were married. So they might be city dwellers for life. Kids is what makes people go to the burbs.

    WALKING BYE says:
    December 29, 2015 at 11:42 am
    Pumkin yes I have seen the married millennial move out of Hoboken/Gold Coast to the suburbs. So I won’t deny that. It does happen right around when kids enter the picture and before they start school. The surprising reason I’ve heard though is the noise that their babies cause. I would have thought it would be the space constraints. Apparently these luxury apartments have paper thin walls and occupants are constantly written up for noise issues.

  41. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Let the kids experience the city in college or after college. You don’t want to grow up in a city/ and I’m not knocking anyone that has. I just feel like single family homes are great for raising families, esp if it’s a beautiful neighborhood/town. It really is a great way to grow up.

    WALKING BYE says:
    December 29, 2015 at 11:49 am
    Years ago I was at party on a Friday night and we all had to whisper after 9pm. The owner below the apt had a very sick cat and complained to the board that the noise was causing undue duress for both of them. I don’t care how nice the view is, that life is not for me.

  42. Juice Box says:

    re# 39 – “the noise that their babies cause”

    The allure of a quick commute, and nightlife take the back seat when kids arrive.
    For us it was the school system. I did not want my kids growing up stoopid and then say that with a Hoboken accent as well. We were already looking when Hurricane Sandy hit, that just solidified our resolve to get out of dodge.

    My kids made plenty of noise when we lived in Hoboken. We even had one tough guy bang on my ceiling more than once because a baby as crying. He and his GF moved out after we had words more than once in the middle of the night. Our old place was well insulated for sound compared to most places in Hoboken too. Only the brownstone I lived in on 9th and Hudson had better sound insulation, mainly because of the solid brick construction high plaster ceilings and the building was detached. Biggest noise complaint in town was actually garbage trucks, anyone with a street facing bedroom complained and wanted to move. They pick up garbage nearly every day in Hoboken usually 4am too.

    Then there is the fact 90% of our friends moved out as well, even daily trips to the park with the kids became a hassle mainly do to the dogs and their waste which was everywhere because of lazy owners. Once the shine is off it’s time to move. We keep in touch with friends that remain in town, most now leave town ever weekend to get away.

  43. No Billionaire Left Behind (the good one) says:

    20k or so can be considered cheap to put 2-3 kids in high quality public school

    if you are an extremist old fart, make space and move to Kentucky they have low taxes and no minimum wage

  44. Juice Box says:

    re: #41 – married 7 years? Don’t ask… I did once. Most likely he shoots blanks or bad eggs. I knew one married childless couple for a decade who I drunkenly suggested they adopt. Well once I started the conversation I quickly found out they went through 10 rounds of IVF before giving up, and then they told me the story of their adoption nightmare as well. Something like 40+ hopeful adopters all competing for one available “healthy” and “white” newborn.

  45. chicagofinance says:

    My wife and I waited 7 years to have kids……best decision in my life….we could never get those years back and that bonding kept us married through the worst of times…..

  46. chicagofinance says:

    This judgement is so bad……I side with the customers’ rage, but it is just unbelievable that business owners can get annihilated in this manner….

    Oregon bakery pays $135,000 in state-ordered damages to same-sex couple after refusing to bake wedding cake

    Oregon bakers Aaron and Melissa Klein, owners of Sweet Cakes by Melissa, baked ten cakes saying “We really do love you!” and shipped them to ten LGBTQ organizations.
    It would have been a whole lot cheaper to just let them eat cake.

    Aaron Klein and his wife Melissa, co-owners of the now-closed Sweet Cakes by Melissa shop in Gresham, Ore., paid out more than $135,000 in damages to the lesb!an couple they refused to bake a wedding cake for in January 2013.

    Klein turned in a check for $136,927.07, which included interest on the July 2015 state-ordered judgment, to the Oregon Bureau of Labor and Industries in Portland after violating the Laurel and Rachel Bowman-Cryer’s civil rights, according to OregonLive.com.

    “My clients are happy the Kleins paid the fine and are moving forward,” the Bowman-Cryer’s lawyer Paul Thompson told the Oregon paper. “I hope to see the ruling upheld on appeal.”

    Bowman-Cryer filed a complaint and Labor Commissioner Brad Avakian approved of the hefty damages, noting it was a violation to discriminate based on the couple’s sexual orientation.

    The Kleins refused to pay the amount, citing financial hardship, and filed an appeal of the ruling.

    In the wake of news surrounding their shop, the couple netted over $500,000 in donations through multiple online fundraisers — which appeared to contradict claims that they were short on money and could not pay the fine.

    The Kleins prolonged paying the judgment in hopes of having their lawyer get a stay on the order until the case was brought before the Court of Appeals.

    The bakers found themselves embroiled in yet another controversy in August when they mailed 10 cakes, inscribed with “We really do love you!” to LGBT centers in California. The Kleins’ peace-offering was seen as a publicity stunt.

  47. grim says:

    Too bad the millennials will move away from rentals, creating a nice rental bust in cities in the 2020′s, when these millennials starting heading to the burbs

    I agree with this.

  48. grim says:

    Maybe a bit later though.

  49. Ben says:

    married 7 years? Don’t ask… I did once. Most likely he shoots blanks or bad eggs. I knew one married childless couple for a decade who I drunkenly suggested they adopt. Well once I started the conversation I quickly found out they went through 10 rounds of IVF before giving up, and then they told me the story of their adoption nightmare as well. Something like 40+ hopeful adopters all competing for one available “healthy” and “white” newborn.

    Had a friend who’s father adopted 3 children. He already had 3 kids of his own. The daughter was 12 and the brothers were 2 and 3. The daughter had run away by age 16. The two younger brothers are both in prison. The daughter was probably a lost cause but the 2 brothers were the two craziest people I’ve ever been in contact with. Just bad genes…

  50. Ben says:

    Hoboken gets old once you hit 28 and are trying to get serious about actually moving forward in life. I don’t know one person who lasted there beyond that age. They all move in at 24 and are out by 28.

    I find that all the 20 somethings that I’ve worked with over the years are doing the same thing in Morristown. They are all living in Morristown loving the life. I predict they’ll all be out of there by age 30.

  51. Libturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    What’s below simpleton?

    “Christie’s main promise when running for nj governor was to deal with property taxes. that worked well”

    It surely would have if the Dems in the assembly didn’t make his property tax cap resemble the condom that got your mom pregnant resulting in your sorry ass.

  52. Libturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    Ben,

    Did the Jersey City thing with three or four roommates. Agreed, it gets old around 30.

    Chifi,

    Dated Gator for 7 years before the ring. Then waited like two more years before the first kid. Had to get the finances in comfortable place. Never paid a penny in interest in my life besides car loans and mortgages. Some people are responsible. Most who are not blame the government.

  53. Walking bye says:

    The noisy apt/condo was one of those Avalon built homes. The corridor floors leading to the condo had the bouncy feel of a construction/school trailer.

    I will say the one guy I know that went to Denver mid level project engineers utilities was able to get higher salary and better growth prospects there. Went from working full time here with a 2nd weekend/night job to just a full time job. So for him and his family it worked out. From what I have seen utilities, pharma, chemical project engineer types salaries are similar across the states. Doctors actually tend to do better in the Midwest and south.

  54. Ragnar says:

    Libturd, 52 – what’s below simpleton?
    The anon-o-bot’s lack of mental capacity is difficult for us to score.
    It’s difficult to imagine whether it’s due to some genuine disability or simply repeatedly stumbling across the wrong mental paths, over and over.
    I’m sure there are many less intelligent, hard-working, and ethical people, so associating anon with those good people is an insult to the term “simpleton”. Anon has the maliciousness that they do not.
    This Devo song may provide some clues
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZDl_R8Zp2E

    I suspect the anon-o-bot could be a younger immigrant from one of the low-achieving groups (explaining the weak language skills), or perhaps someone who trained in ebonics, with no academic achievement, who has found either no employment or only low employment. Perhaps one of those people who found part-time work protesting for one of Soros’ organizations. Maybe he’s trying to work his way up that organization to the job of cyber community organizer, which at least would be a goal. Yet he seems fairly aimless, mostly lashing out at “the rich,” likely as a way to make societal excuses for his personal failures.

    I’d be shocked if anon-o-bot actually owns any NJ Real estate or directly pays property taxes.

  55. Fast Eddie says:

    Hoboken is the most overrated, money-making scam going. It’s laughable and I laugh every day when I go to work.

  56. grim says:

    I don’t spend much time in Hoboken these days, but every time I do, I subconsciously expect it to look something like it did in 1995, and it always shocks the hell out of me to see how much it’s changed.

  57. grim says:

    Very much remember the Maxwells “brewpub” era, pre and post.

  58. Walking bye says:

    Hoboken -it’s summer camp for adults.

  59. jcer says:

    45, I am in the having kids in the apartment issue. If I could afford to stay I would, the commute is easy but nice 3 bedroom apartments are over a million, still have 15-20k in taxes and then private school on top of it. The issue in Hoboken, the mold coast, or Jersey City is high costs, and bad schools. Most of the people we know are staying put, everyone we know has reluctantly decamped to the suburbs by the time their kids it 4 or 5 it is the school issue 30k+ for private schools is hard to swallow. Denver is a big big place even those who aren’t pot heads. I still contend the successful millennial has different preferences than suburban purchasers of the past, downtown’s are important, house size is more in the 4 bd 2 bath extremely well finished home with a good commute, access to transit and in a great school district. The other issue is by and large the millennials are not doing well with employment. I’m astounded at how few of them I encounter in my professional career in software, I see far more cost cutting(The visa crowd) and experienced hires than fresh young kids. Until jobs recover for the youth I see slow growth in housing prices.

  60. Walking bye says:

    Grim was that you in the grunge flannel shirt and Sony discman walking around Hoboken listening to pearl jam?

  61. Marilyn says:

    #33, Raleigh, especially Durham and Chapel Hill, I see so many nice young people here your age all buying property. They call me their 2nd Mom. Its all young 23- 38 ish buying property. And they all take motherly advise. They are all happy as hell. No anger. No one yet has give me the finger.

  62. grim says:

    Punk and ska, never really grunge.

  63. yome says:

    Americans’ median incomes have recovered the ground lost since the beginning of the Great Recession — and it only took 8 years.

    A report released Tuesday by Sentier Research drew on Census Department data to show what a long slog it’s been. The median annual household income was $56,746 in November. That’s barely above October’s median of $56,688, but it was enough to top the $56,688 reached in December 2007, when the recession began.

    But that’s just 1.9% higher than where it was in June 2009, the beginning of the economic expansion. Perhaps even more discouraging, the median income is 1.1% lower than in January 2000, when record-keeping began.

    http://www.marketwatch.com/story/american-median-incomes-are-finally-back-to-prerecession-levels-2015-12-29?link=MW_home_latest_news

  64. chicagofinance says:

    Hoboken is different and in a good way…..although I respect Fast Eddie’s opinion, his job is closer to the idiotville section where metrosexual-kid-adults live with all their iSh!t and also “Jerzey’s finest” parties……….the uptown northeast section is very much baby carriage central….a good number of parks and amenities…..I still wouldn’t have anything more than elementary school aged kids there….by the time your kids are 6 or so, you need to be the hell out of dodge, but it is really very nice in many ways…..if you factor in being married around 32-ish…..you are able to be there until about late 30’s without really being out of place (note in the uptown section). There is a good deal of social support and peer groups…..

    Ben says:
    December 29, 2015 at 1:41 pm
    Hoboken gets old once you hit 28 and are trying to get serious about actually moving forward in life. I don’t know one person who lasted there beyond that age. They all move in at 24 and are out by 28.

    I find that all the 20 somethings that I’ve worked with over the years are doing the same thing in Morristown. They are all living in Morristown loving the life. I predict they’ll all be out of there by age 30.

  65. Marilyn says:

    I think young 30’s something will buying house in NJ too. I see it coming. I actually am positive for once.

  66. Libturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    I’ve got a bunch of friends who were raised in Hoboken (when it was a shithole). All went to parochial schools of course. Of the four of them, three moved to Los Angeles after college and one moved to West Paterson. Today, two still live in LA. West Paterson lives in Wall and the other actually returned to Hoboken and is trying to raise his kids there. We’ll see if he makes the 1st grade move out.

    Hoboken was the Thursday night hangout for many of us in college. It had a great mix of dive bars and clubs. I remember when it was cheaper to get ticketed to park in the street at an expired meter than it was to park in the 3 identical garages near the Path. I also remember being to drunk to find my car way too often. Usually we started in the Village at Boo Radley’s, Down the Hatch or at Karavas, famous for serving the underaged. Sometimes we would do the Limelight. We would always finish up in Hoboken. There was this one long narrow bar by the Path adjacent to the Clam Broth House which we would usually finish the night off at. It was a locals bar and they too served 18 year olds. It was dirt cheap too. We really weren’t the Texarizona (it that the name of that place) crowd. Often grabbed a bite at the Spa or Benny Tudinos. Though, I recall locals always going on and on about how great the food was there. Before the Sushi Lounge, I couldn’t really find a single memorable meal.

  67. Libturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    Looks like Santa was waiting for cooler weather.

  68. Libturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    Unless you asked for cancakes for xmas.

  69. Fast Eddie says:

    I knew Hoboken when it was Hoboken. Well, I practically grew up within walking distance and a matter of fact, walked up and down the viaduct a million times. The Italian feasts were real, the bars were playing Sinatra, Louie Prima, Jimmy Roselli and Tony Bennett and there were a half dozen great restaurants NOT located on Washington Avenue along with Biggies and two hole in the wall Italian stores where the muzz was so good, you could spread it like cream cheese. And Italian women were sweeping sidewalks dressed in black. That was Hoboken. I don’t know what the f.uck it is now.

  70. chicagofinance says:

    Anthony David had good food……Mision Burrito…. Precious Chinese…..some pretty decent pizza….Arthur’s was good until they raised the prices…..

  71. grim says:

    71 – You remember it pretty nice – I talked to some old timers who have told me it was tenements and poverty, and tremendous crime on the waterfront (or along the waterfront, ha ha).

    My wife’s aunt grew up there, she said they lived in a two room shack, the toilet was next to the stove in the kitchen, literally, in the kitchen.

  72. Fast Eddie says:

    There was good and bad everywhere. I remember the good because I was never exposed to the other. Speaking of the waterfront, my great uncle worked on the docks at Maxwell House (ahem… wink, wink).

  73. jcer says:

    74, it was the hood…the hood with italian food but the hood nonetheless, my grandparents fled to suburbia as soon as they could afford it. Shared bathrooms and cold water tenements, poor is the only way to describe it, the glory days ended when the tunnels went to manhattan and the trains didn’t have to layover in on the waterfront for a ferry or the H&M.

  74. Fast Eddie says:

    75 – None of us lived it, at least I didn’t. My father told me stories of no heat, electricity off at times. That was Jersey City but I guess it was all the same.

  75. No Billionaire Left Behind (the good one) says:

    sometimes you need to ask nicely to get fingered
    if you know what I mean

    Marilyn says:
    December 29, 2015 at 2:42 pm

    No one yet has give me the finger.

  76. grim says:

    I need to sit down and read City on Fire

  77. No Billionaire Left Behind (the good one) says:

    1,000 pages? better be good

    grim says:
    December 29, 2015 at 5:58 pm
    I need to sit down and read City on Fire

  78. No Billionaire Left Behind (the good one) says:

    this is what I’m reading this weekend. 2015 booker prize winner

    A Brief History of Seven Killings is the third novel by Jamaican author Marlon James.[1] It was published by Riverhead Books.[2] The novel spans several decades and explores the attempted assassination of Bob Marley in Jamaica in 1976 and its aftermath through the crack wars in New York City in the 1980s and a changed Jamaica in the 1990s.[3]

  79. leftwing says:

    please, please, please…..before i ever ‘arrive’ in pump’s ‘beautiful’ town put something large caliber against the back of my skull and leave a rorschach on the wall.

    the suburbs suck. immensely. sterile, self absorbed, shallow, striving, sad.

    i have no idea why one would want to locate or procreate there.

  80. NJT says:

    #43 re: Hoboken.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s3C0tr9RE-8

    TOO funny!

    *BTW – Bugs had Brooklyn accent though Hoboken/JC is very close to it.

  81. NJT says:

    More Hoboken (never lived there but had many connections to the place and partied there a few times) ;

    Both of my grandfathers HATED Sinatra (one grandmother went on a date with him, once, back in the 40s).

    Grandpa Speer said that ‘ol Blue eyes’ used to pay his bar tab because he brought in all the chicks.

    Both of them said he was a no talent Goomba.

    * Got free tickets to see him at the Garden State Arts center back in 1988. He sang (tried to) off a teleprompter.

    – I think I was the one of the few non-Italians in the audience.

    *At least back then you could bring lawn chairs, a bottle of wine and a wedge of cheese without being hassled.

    “Those Summer winds’….over now. Into winter (damn). Oh well, saved a lot of oil!

  82. Wily Millenial says:

    We watched “Delivered Vacant” in a college class. If you want to see some foreshadowing of Brooklyn in the 2000s, you can pretty much watch the same process occurring to the stevedores and lowlifes on film, complete with proto hipsters who you never see in Hoboken anymore now that Maxwell’s closed. Not that they were around much anymore before that.

  83. Libturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    Frist…sort of.

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