We like it here … but

From the Star Ledger:

N.J. is a good place to live but the taxes stink, residents say

New Jerseyans are conflicted.

A vast majority love their neighborhoods and most say the state is a good place to live, according to a new poll. But when it comes to the economy, they’re angry about the economic climate, pessimistic about the future and have grown increasingly likely to have an itch to move away.

It’s a mixed bag living in New Jersey, according to Rutgers-Eagleton’s 2018 State of the Garden State report.

Nearly 80 percent say their neighborhoods or “excellent” or “good” while 70 percent say the same about their towns.

Overall, 61 percent say New Jersey is an “excellent” or “good” place to live, compared to 39 percent who rate it “fair” or “poor,” according to the survey.

Ask New Jerseyans to consider their financial concerns with the state and majorities say they have grave misgivings.

Eighty-two percent are dissatisfied with how state government has handled taxes, including a majority, 61 percent, who are “very dissatisfied,” according to the poll. Three quarters say the same about cost of living and government spending

That could explain why the number of people who consider leaving the state has increased over the last decade: 30 percent — up from 22 percent in 2010 — say they have an itch to move.

“In a state that ranks near the top when it comes to outbound migration and taxation, it’s no surprise that New Jerseyans are upset with how state government is handling important financial matters – most of all, taxes,” Ashley Koning, director of the Eagleton Center for Public Interest Polling at Rutgers University-New Brunswick, said.

This entry was posted in Demographics, Economics, New Jersey Real Estate, Property Taxes. Bookmark the permalink.

111 Responses to We like it here … but

  1. Stutz Bearcat says:

    Cucks

  2. grim says:

    Fingers crossed the snow fizzles, heading out to SF for meetings tomorrow.

  3. Juice Box says:

    Shitcoins still in a freefall

    https://coinranking.com

  4. grim says:

    Cryptocurrencies are the stupidest stupid that ever stupided.

  5. Fabius Maximus says:

    I’m on an evening flight to LA.
    Prediction is 1″ with sleet rain mix and getting to 40deg. So I’m thinking it flights should be fine.

  6. Fabius Maximus says:

    Crypto will settle down. ATEOD we are still buying Tulips. They have a role to play, they just have to find their level.

  7. chicagofinance says:

    I hope they fly your plane into the WTC……. if not, I hope you get sucked out of the plane and impaled on an evergreen tree……..

    Fabius Maximus says:
    February 6, 2018 at 7:11 am
    I’m on an evening flight to LA.
    Prediction is 1″ with sleet rain mix and getting to 40deg. So I’m thinking it flights should be fine.

  8. Very Stable Genius says:

    @BillKristol

    The memo is and is intended to be a distraction.
    Mueller has flipped Gates, is talking with Corallo, may be close to indicting Trump family members and is about to enter a confrontation with Trump on testifying.
    Maybe Congress should focus a bit more on protecting Mueller?

  9. Very Stable Genius says:

    @PaulKrugman

    The Dow has crossed 25,000. Trump!Trump!Trump! Oh, wait — in the wrong direction?

    Actually, this is starting to look fairly serious.

  10. grim says:

    What did BC always say?

    If Janet’s yellin’, you better be sellin’

  11. grim says:

    They have a role to play, they just have to find their level.

    Sure, they are completely synthetic speculative instruments, and have no purpose otherwise. Calling them “currencies” is so far from the truth it’s absurd.

    Cryptocurrencies are a bigger farce than the worst synthetic MBS derivatives, played like pump and dump penny stocks. It’s like watching a bunch of idiots speculate on the movement of a random number generator and then proclaim themselves quants because they were lucky enough to ride the upside for a few days.

  12. Juice Box says:

    Did he really say testifying that neocon bill kristol is unhinged and irrelevant.

  13. Very Stable Genius says:

    @CNBC

    Stock futures point to Dow drop of about 550 points at the open, S&P drop of nearly 50 points and Nasdaq drop of 85 points

  14. Juice Box says:

    So Steve Wynn hooks up with a grandma who is in her fifties at the time with 8 kids and he’s getting in trouble for that? They should give him a medal, he apparently was doing it for a year.

  15. Bagholder says:

    ‘It’s like watching a bunch of idiots speculate on the movement of a random number generator and then proclaim themselves quants because they were lucky enough to ride the upside for a few days.’

    ‘Furthermore, the prisoners would ‘assign credit and prestige’ to whomever among them could quickly remember which shadows came before, predict which shadows would follow and name which shadows were normally found together.’

    –Allegory of the Cave, Plato

  16. Stutz Bearcat says:

    It’s like watching someone claim responsibility For the weather.

  17. Fast Eddie says:

    Oblama promised them, and then let them down. No wonder they’e angry. Krugman went from an analyst to a wretched soul. What does that say about the loathing, angry p.ussies on this board?

  18. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    The Dow has crossed 25,000. Trump!Trump!Trump! Oh, wait — in the wrong direction?

    Actually, this is starting to look fairly serious.

    That’s rich coming from the number one supporter of 10 years of quantitative easing and ZIRP.

  19. ex-Jersey says:

    Gary it’s over buddy.

  20. ex-Jersey says:

    Your bull market lasted about as long (metaphorically) as little Donnie in Stormy Daniels.

  21. 3b says:

    So we are back to where we were in mid December.

  22. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    What I found fascinating about the cryptocurrency bubble is how much attention it garnered both here and by the so called experts on TV. It’s much like the clown show they call the Olympics. Who wins the medals really doesn’t matter. It’s the Eddie the Eagles, the Jamaican bobsledders and the maimed hot figure skater that capture the audience. How is it possible that humankind is getting dumber over time. I thought it was supposed to work the other way. Heck, my closest group of friends have had a thread about superhero movies going for over a year. Effin Spiderman. I try to watch these CGIed pieces of garbage with terrible acting and plotlines that could be written by a five-year old. What is the fascination here? Society is really devolving into a bunch of simpletons. I know I sound like a fuddy old duddy at 47. But watch a single episode of MASH. The writing is so far better than the poop that passes for original content today. Sharknado. Really?

    “Christ people, you don’t see the real problem? The whole lot of them are criminals.”

    What I’ve been saying since the first day I found this place. The masses really are asses.

    Want proof of the corruption? Forget about the Uranium and Real Estate Deals. Look at how many names the Swiss Banks revealed who were hoarding/laundering/sheltering income when they were demanded to open their books on American accounts. Look how much HRC was paid to speak to them and as SOS. This makes the pissing dossier (which no one has proved to be true one iota) look like nothing. This is FACTUAL. Not FICTION. But as Menedez walks after accepting hundreds of thousands of campaign contributions from a convicted criminal who absolutely required political favor by calling it a friendship. You can clearly see that there are two classes in America. Either you are in the criminal (political) class. Or you are not. What irks the fukc out of me, are those that are not, but somehow claim their political leaders are NOT the criminals that they are. Political Cheerleaders per se, among the masses.

    https://tinyurl.com/My-Party-TAKES-THE-HiGH-Road

  23. Juice Box says:

    Considering where it was last night at 23,088 the DOW futures have come way back now at 23,814.

  24. abeiz says:

    re: back to December

    Yup, like a really fast elevator.

    Ding!

    Why am I attracted to the idea of buying GE for kids portfolio like a fly to sht. Nostalgia, yes?

  25. Fast Eddie says:

    Steamturd,

    + 1

  26. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    Can’t say I didn’t tell you all this was about to happen. Pumpkin calls for wage inflation back in 2013 and gets it in 2018 and he claims he’s a mastermind. I tell you the bubbles about to bust for the last two weeks and huzzah. No one here needs a financial advisor. They simply need to grasp the mantra, if it’s too good to be true, then it’s too good to be true. A good advisor will protect you from putting all your eggs in one basket and will help you to reduce risk. But if you have discipline and can ignore the noise, you really can manage your finances yourselves and avoid the commissions. Though I do see the place for an advisor. If you have a very large net worth, they provide tax advantage advice (shelters) that’s not easy to understand. And, most people don’t have the discipline to stay out of BitCoin.

  27. Ex-Jersey says:

    A voice like and Angel and a mind like a steel trap. Libtard. You are doing it right, buddy. Greetings from the Leftest Coast.

  28. Ex-Jersey says:

    Honestly, over the past two weeks I have seen a big Bio-tech of considerable interest swing wildly like some nasdaq cutie in the 90’s/. I crave some stability. I also would like a leader not prone to taking credit for the weather. NATO i always thought was a good idea also, can we have NATO?

  29. Ex-Jersey says:

    Mention discipline and Gary gets turgid. Betcha he role plays in those vintage brown uniforms.

  30. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    SharkNATO?

  31. No One says:

    Steamturd,
    Correct. People are abandoning logic and reason and are satisfied with substituting memes and tweets for actual thought. Everyone joins one or more tribal clans and go to war with each other with this junk. Both the highly educated and the less educated.
    The only good news is that a few rare reasonable people actually have supporters, suggesting there are more sensible people out there in the world than meets the eye. For example see Mike Rowe, Libturd.

  32. JCer says:

    Steam on the financial advisors…..go back to the earlier post about people being a bunch of simpletons. People are incapable of using good judgement and having common sense, left to their own devices most people bet it all on red……and their retirement investments become atlantic city gambling.

  33. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    I just wish some people would listen. Though it really doesn’t matter. You’re all welcome to visit me in Costa Rica. $365 RT direct flying most Sundays from JFK to Daniel Oduber (Liberia) on Jet Blue. I’ll save you some fish.

  34. Fabius Maximus says:

    Chi,

    Do you want to ask Jim to put that in the next client newsletter.

  35. 3b says:

    Looks like we are up over 300 now. Good news was bad news. Which now maybe is not such bad news that caused good news to be bad news in the first place.

  36. Fabius Maximus says:

    Chi, I have no problem with people getting paid for speeches. Paying $700K for Rudi G, I don’t claim to understand, but if he can pull that coin fair play to him., I think Donnies rate was $1.5mil and thats a record I don’t have a problem him boasting about.
    Menendez you move over to Campaign Financing and that where the reform is needed.

    But the Red team gave us Citizens United, which reinforces that you can always buy influence.

  37. Fabius Maximus says:

    I’ll call it the nwnj Fallacy

    “The genetic fallacy occurs when one bases conclusions solely on where information came from, not whether it’s accurate.”

  38. Fabius Maximus says:

    Johnathan Pie on epic form today.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4Q1ydhgJPTE

  39. Fabius Maximus says:

    Sorry 9:59 was for Lib.

  40. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    “Looks like we are up over 300 now. Good news was bad news. Which now maybe is not such bad news that caused good news to be bad news in the first place.”

    I wouldn’t bet on the market finishing in the positive.

  41. NJOut says:

    Steam, 9:28 that’s what the partisan stuff is supposed to do. People get so worked up vilifying the other team while claiming their team takes the high road that neither sees what is happening in the background. How about politicians who speak to our greatest domestic and international challenges and options to address them without being constrained by partisan / childlike behavior. Between party pressure and special interests, a politician thinking and acting independently on individual issues seems impossible.

  42. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    Just heard the blue collars outside my door say that the recent market drop was Obama’s fault. Didn’t stick around for the justification.

  43. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    NJ—yup.

    My high road leads to Costa Rica.

  44. 3b says:

    Stu I agree.

  45. Fabius Maximus says:

    And were back down.

    This is quite funny.
    https://www.cnn.com/2018/02/05/politics/donald-trump-economy-taxes/index.html
    As Trump spoke, televisions across the West Wing — including those tuned to Fox — showed the stunning side-by-side images of Trump touting a booming economy while the Dow plummeted.
    One aide said it was jarring to watch the President’s speech cut off by Fox News, which broke in when the drop hit the 1,000 point-mark.

  46. leftwing says:

    “Just heard the blue collars outside my door say that the recent market drop was Obama’s fault. Didn’t stick around for the justification.”

    Only fair LOL.

    Obama himself put everything including the weather on GWB for the first 30 months, like clockwork.

  47. Nwnj says:

    Nice try with your straw man Fabius. Both the source and veracity matter. Problem is when you don’t have the sources to verify information and you present it to the court as evidence you have committed a crime.

  48. Comrade Nom Deplume, licking his proverbial wounds says:

    chicagofinance says:
    February 6, 2018 at 7:56 am
    I hope they fly your plane into the WTC……. if not, I hope you get sucked out of the plane and impaled on an evergreen tree……..

    I thought the same thing at first but I would not want innocents to die in our little war.

  49. Comrade Nom Deplume, licking his proverbial wounds says:

    Here’s something that is barely being reported in MSM but it pretty prominent in the industry newsletters I receive.

    Companies aren’t just paying 1K bonuses or increasing their starting pay. Many are also quietly paying money into their pension plans. Large employers that might have reduced or eliminated company matches following the financial crisis are restoring them. And they are doing so because of the tax savings.

    This is big news and potentially far more significant than 1K bonuses. Yet it is barely being reported.

  50. Comrade Nom Deplume, licking his proverbial wounds says:

    “Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:
    February 6, 2018 at 10:26 am
    Just heard the blue collars outside my door say that the recent market drop was Obama’s fault. Didn’t stick around for the justification.”

    There’s an argument there but its attenuated. Sort of like Butterfly Effect.

    That said, this correction was called for and I am astounded at the Left wishing for it and more given the fact that it occurred in response to good economic data. Basically, the left would like to talk down the entire economy so they can get back into power.

    Oh, and if we are going to “blame Trump” for this downdraft, be fair and blame Obama for the Flash Crash and the Taper Tantrum, and the other market corrections that occurred on his watch.

  51. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    “NTSB: Failure to screen NJ Transit engineer for sleeping disorder caused Hoboken crash”

    Of course. What a cop out. You know what you’re doing when you drive drunk. This conductor gained over 90 pounds in three years. I’m sure this was not the first time the conductor fell asleep at the wheel. If you are overtired, you should not be putting other people’s lives in danger. This is what caused that Continental Express (I think) plane to crash over Buffalo a decade or so back. The pilot did not get enough sleep. There is no personal responsibility anymore.

  52. Hold my beer says:

    Comrade,

    Blame butterfingers Brady.

  53. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    I blame this bubble on an overheated market. When I make 50% in a year without changing my risk profile, then I know it’s too good to be true.

  54. Fabius Maximus says:

    Nwnj

    “Both the source and veracity matter”.

    And were disclosed. Steele has always had veracity based on previous submissions to the FBI. One thing I have not see is the Trumpers jumping over the dossier to point out inconsistencies or anything that can be proven wrong. That couln’t have happened as X was elsewhere.

    Nice to see Nunes walking it back.
    “But in an appearance on “Fox & Friends,” Nunes was asked about reports over the weekend that the FBI application did refer to a political entity connected to the dossier. It is unclear precisely what language the application might have used.

    Nunes conceded that a “footnote” to that effect was included in the application, while faulting the bureau for failing to provide more specifics.”

  55. Comrade Nom Deplume, licking his proverbial wounds says:

    Further to my point about pensions, a quick back of envelope calc for the companies mentioned in my latest edition of Pen and Ben was well north of $3 Billion in payments into pension plans and increased 401(k) matches. And that was just a handful of large employers that P&B reported on.

    Several Billion in pension health improvements versus hundreds of millions in one-time bonuses? Seems that Pelosi was right about crumbs but she missed the sandwich spread on the next table.

  56. Comrade Nom Deplume, licking his proverbial wounds says:

    Glutes,

    Steele and Fusion GPS have a credibility problem. It’s that simple. Not that the other actors here don’t (everyone is suspect), but you’re engaging in classic confirmation bias.

    Naturally, I expect you to disagree.

  57. chicagofinance says:

    These movies are not being produced for North American audiences anymore. Follow the money…..

    Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:
    February 6, 2018 at 9:28 am
    Heck, my closest group of friends have had a thread about superhero movies going for over a year. Effin Spiderman. I try to watch these CGIed pieces of garbage with terrible acting and plotlines that could be written by a five-year old. What is the fascination here? Society is really devolving into a bunch of simpletons.

  58. Fabius Maximus says:

    A sobering read.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2018/02/02/opinion/leaving-the-fbi.html
    Furthermore, a congressional memo released on Friday accuses the F.B.I. and the Justice Department of abusing their surveillance powers to spy on a former Trump campaign adviser. But every statement of fact included in an affidavit for foreign intelligence collection must withstand the scrutiny of at least 10 people in the Department of Justice hierarchy before it is reviewed by an independent court.

    There is, however, a difference between oversight by those in charge of holding the F.B.I. accountable and criticism by politicians seeking partisan gain. Political operatives are weaponizing their disagreement with a particular investigation in a bid to undermine the credibility of the entire institution. “The system is rigged” is their slogan, and they are now politicizing the Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act process used to collect critical intelligence about our adversaries.

  59. Fast Eddie says:

    Wipe it clean? You mean with a cloth?

  60. chicagofinance says:

    Market comment: As opposed to the village idiot, I will make a market call. If we settle in here (IF!), then this little cleanout will be the impetus for a good rally. I am more concerned structurally about post-Labor day and forward looking views in 2019. This little incident is more punishment for all the people that looked at their 401(k) and reallocated to large cap growth after seeing the outsized 4Q2017 & 2017.

    But WTFK? ….. we could go in the sh!tter too…..I just don’t think so……

  61. chicagofinance says:

    From a drunk irishman…..

    Fabius Maximus says:
    February 6, 2018 at 12:35 pm
    A sobering read.

  62. Fast Eddie says:

    Several Billion in pension health improvements versus hundreds of millions in one-time bonuses? Seems that Pelosi was right about crumbs but she missed the sandwich spread on the next table.

    Wealth is produced by redistribution. When will you learn?

  63. ex-Jersey says:

    12:41 you mean the Wall Street Bailout….?

  64. ex-Jersey says:

    Billionaires have admitted that they are the beneficiaries of QE. For example, billionaire hedge fund manager Stanley Druckenmiller said the following about QE:

    “This is fantastic for every rich person,” he said Thursday, a day after the Fed’s stunning decision to delay tightening its monetary policy. “This is the biggest redistribution of wealth from the middle class and the poor to the rich ever.”

    “Who owns assets—the rich, the billionaires. You think Warren Buffett hates this stuff? You think I hate this stuff? I had a very good day yesterday.”

    Druckenmiller, whose net worth is estimated at more than $2 billion, said that the implication of the Fed’s policy is that the rich will spend their wealth and create jobs—essentially betting on “trickle-down economics.”

  65. Fast Eddie says:

    12:41 you mean the Wall Street Bailout….?

    I was referring to the $870,000,000,000 Oblamy handed to his cronies in the guise of shovel-ready jobs.

  66. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:
  67. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    I thought Marvel did a great job with Logan.

  68. xolepa says:

    10:27
    Be very careful about what you wish for. I was just in Panama and Costa Rica 2 weeks ago, albeit on the Atlantic side. I did not see a single property that was NOT fenced in or had impediments to entry. Most property owners used razor wires to keep intruders away. The ghetto dwellings even had razor wire at street and every upper story level. All resorts there were gated and guarded.

    I wonder how the Pacific side is.

  69. Nwnj says:

    Only someone who is helplessly deluded by party politics would consider unverified propaganda provided by a British spy procured from Russian intelligence to be credible.

    Fabius and Comey come to mind. No worries, looks like doj ig is about to come down on the bama admin deep state conspirators like a ton of bricks. A long way to go to root all of this out.

  70. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    Pacific Side is different. You were in Puerto Limon no? Gotta get 5 miles out of the cities and all is good. Same with Panama City. Really, it is no different here in Paterson, parts of Elizabeth and most of Newark.

  71. Steamturd supporting the Canklephate says:

    Though, I feel safer in Costa Rican cities since guns are nearly impossible to obtain down there although they are legal. There is 1/10th the number of guns there then in the US.

  72. Fabius Maximus says:

    Stu,

    Its not a real chart unless it has Stick Men.

  73. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Give me a break!! I called 2017/18 way back in 2012/13. You are better than this, stop being like that.

    “Pumpkin calls for wage inflation back in 2013 and gets it in 2018 and he claims he’s a mastermind. “

  74. The Great Pumpkin says:

    And I stand my post yesterday. There is nothing to justify this drop. Nothing more than the big boys shaking the tree and taking some profit.

  75. 3b says:

    Fab Wow! So your side is bad too! Well look at that. For those of us who don’t like either side it’s no surprise!

  76. chicagofinance says:

    I stand my post today. There is nothing to justify you ever posting here. Nothing more than a little big boy shaking his wee-wee.

  77. chicagofinance says:

    Someone needs to stick a stake through your heart….

    Fabius Maximus says:
    February 6, 2018 at 1:22 pm
    Stu,

    Its not a real chart unless it has Stick Men.

  78. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I’m still amazed at the reaction to higher rates. It’s comical. It proves some people are never happy. These people were crying about ultra low rates for how long? Now the rates finally adjust to a growing economy and they act like it’s the end of the world. Shaking my head.

    Aren’t rates currently lower than historical avgs? So why get so worked up about a rising 10 year yield. Oh no!! Inflation is coming!! Run!!

  79. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    And I stand my post yesterday. There is nothing to justify this drop. Nothing more than the big boys shaking the tree and taking some profit.

    Put a prediction out there. Where’s the Dow gonna be at the end of 2nd quarter? Humor us.

  80. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Blue,

    I will not get involved with useless short term predictions that mean absolutely nothing. Want a real prediction? Dow 50k or higher by 2025, maybe even a year or two earlier, but it’s coming.

  81. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    God I hope I’m not on this board in 2025. How about a 2 year prediction?

  82. 3b says:

    The rise in rates will reveal who is swimming naked.

  83. chicagofinance says:

    To be clear……not out of the woods…..this was just a 50% retrace…..

  84. chicagofinance says:

    Dude….. my first post was September 2005…… yikes!

  85. chicagofinance says:

    A kind man saves a seagull with broken wing
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ciIl9JjGvFw

  86. Juice Box says:

    Your tax dollars at work.

    Live view of Elon Musk’s tesla roadster launced into space today, with the Starman behind the wheel.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aBr2kKAHN6M&feature=youtu.be

  87. ex-Jersey says:

    Sigh. Winter in SoCal will make a believer out of you. The air is perfect.

  88. ex-Jersey says:

    6:15 How else will alien life forms know how we roll….?

  89. Fabius Maximus says:

    NWNJ

    Keep reading
    https://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2018/02/05/christopher-steele-dossier-smearing-216940
    In this regard the memo pretends that all of the allegations in the Steele reports are false. As I’ve written previously (“A Second Look at the Steele Dossier,” “The Steele Dossier in 2018: Everyone’s Favorite Weapon”), significant pieces of the dossier ring true. Even the recent Stormy Daniels saga is eerily similar to Steele’s reporting. Just like in the dossier, Trump’s bad behavior with women put him in a vulnerable and compromising position. Also, in both cases, his personal “fixer” Michael Cohen allegedly paid hush money to cover up the wrongdoing – even using false names and shell companies to cover his tracks in the case of Daniels. (He denies it.) On the other side of the coin, aside from labeling it “garbage” and “fake,” Trump’s supporters have been unable or unwilling to disprove any significant fact in the dossier.

  90. Grim says:

    SpaceX was brilliant today, an amazing feat.

  91. Fabius Maximus says:

    Meanwhile over at NASA, the climate denier in charge is finishing up the first year of his budget cuts. Maybe its lights off next year!

  92. Juice Box says:

    Fabius – “disprove any significant fact”

    Facts? really? You take that dossier and facts and not hearsay? Hey I will be first to admit Donnie has skeletons but I would say they are owed to the Han ethic people.

    That entire article makes no mention of Fusion GPS or the Clinton campaign who paid for it.

    At least the Washington Post covers the actual time line of Steel’s filings of 17 separate reports he sent directly to Fusion GPS and NOT the FBI. We know how well he was concerned about getting paid that is for sure.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/graphics/2018/politics/steele-timeline/?utm_term=.6d45e0eea4a0

    By the way Steele is now hiding from the Courts in England. Claiming State secrets or something like that. He isn’t James Bond, when the criminal warrant is issued Downing street will have to give him up.

  93. Nwnj says:

    Fabius can’t make a distinction between the legal system and the court of public
    Opinion. Tell the judge you have no legit evidence but what you have rings true see how that works out.

  94. Fabius Maximus says:

    Juice, can you take the other side of that argument and say that with 100% certainly that the contents of the dossier are not true?

    You can take the contents on face value and you can look to corroborate or refute. Its a bit like this.

    We took Trumps “No contact with the Russians” at face value, but it did not survive the basic digging to the point we get to this.

    “Jared Kushner’s failure to turn over to Senate investigators an e-mail exchange – with the subject line “Russian backdoor overture and dinner invite” – also hinted at possible efforts by the campaign to collude with Russia. Although Kushner initially told campaign staff to turn down a request from Putin crony and alleged criminal Alexander Torshin to meet with then-candidate Trump, Donald Trump Jr. ultimately met the Russian at a May 2016 NRA dinner event. Again, we only learned this only after Kushner was confronted with previously withheld material.”

    I can guarantee that the Trumpers have been digging away at this dossier trying to find a wedge, not has appeared. I am also sure that the FBI have been working to corroborate the dossier and that information is going to come out in due coarse.

  95. Fabius Maximus says:

    NWNJ

    “Tell the judge you have no legit evidence” And here is what this comes down to. You and most of the world do not know what was presented to that court. We do know this dossier was produced, we do not know what was produced to support it.

    Heres what we do know. For the warrant to be re-upped (and it was three times) it has to show results. And it did and again we don’t know what they where as me and the rest of the world are not privy to the information. But like the last season of Game of Thrones, we can see it on the horizon.

  96. Nwnj says:

    Hey bonehead, the dossier was the evidence. And steele’s Leaks to the media were used as corroborating evidence. Stop reading fake news all day.

  97. Juice Box says:

    Grim in mod…

  98. Juice Box says:

    Mod again, sigh

  99. Fabius Maximus says:

    NWNJ

    Keep reading

    http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/jurisprudence/2017/09/a_lot_of_the_steele_dossier_has_since_been_corroborated.html

    “We learned that when Carter Page traveled to Moscow in July 2016, he met with close Putin ally and chairman of the Russian state oil company, Igor Sechin. A later Steele report also claimed that he met with parliamentary secretary Igor Divyekin while in Moscow. Investigative journalist Michael Isikoff reported in September 2016 that U.S. intelligence sources confirmed that Page met with both Sechin and Divyekin during his July trip to Russia. What’s more, the Justice Department obtained a wiretap in summer 2016 on Page after satisfying for a court that there was sufficient evidence to show Page was operating as a Russian agent.”

  100. Fabius Maximus says:

    I always wondered about this one. I am that political nerd that pays attention to the fact that the conventions are there to solidify the party message.

    ‘The quid pro quo as alleged in the dossier was for the Trump team to “sideline” the Ukrainian issue in the campaign. We learned subsequently that the Trump platform committee changed only a single plank in the 60-page Republican platform prior to the Republican convention. Of the hundreds of Republican positions and proposals, they altered only the single sentence that called for maintaining or increasing sanctions against Russia, increasing aid for Ukraine and “providing lethal defensive weapons” to the Ukrainian military. The Trump team reportedly changed the wording to the more benign, “appropriate assistance.”’

  101. Fabius Maximus says:

    The Orbis report also refers specifically to the aim of the Russian influence campaign “to swing supporters of Bernie Sanders away from Hillary Clinton and across to Trump,”
    […]
    John Mattes, a former Senate investigator who helped run the online campaign for Sanders, said he was struck by Steele’s report. Mattes said, Steele “was writing in real time about things I was seeing happening in August, but I couldn’t articulate until September.” It is important to emphasize here that Steele’s source for the change in plan was “an ethnic Russian associate of Republican US presidential candidate Donald Trump [who] discussed the reaction inside his camp.”

  102. Nwnj says:

    Seriously man, stop wth the fake news. It’s rotting your brain. Isikoff’s source WAS Steele.

  103. Pete says:

    “Nwnj says:
    February 6, 2018 at 12:58 pm
    Only someone who is helplessly deluded by party politics would consider unverified propaganda provided by…”

    This is breathtaking in its lack of self-awareness. Nwnj, I guess you have no idea that you are one of the most partisan party hacks that have ever frequented this board. You literally are a mouthpiece for Trump propaganda and can’t go a day without using the term “fake news”. Your posts would make Jamil blush.

  104. Pete says:

    Ironically on the same day Fast Eddie literally trumps you (no pun intended) for lack of self-awareness. The man plus ones a post by Steamturd decrying political cheerleaders. Fast Eddie is literally the biggest partisan cheerleader there is on this board. He publicly thanks President Trump. Its embarrassing, but he probably does not realize why he should be if he couldn’t even comprehend Steamturd’s pretty basic point.

    Dumber by the day this board gets.

  105. Fabius Maximus says:

    Pete, right on point. I would point out that Jamil for all his faults was running on his own views, he wasn’t getting spoon fed opinions by Hannity et al. At least they where his own dumb thoughts.

    NWNJ, Isikoff is not relevant here. If that’s the hat you are hanging your argument on, you have already lost!

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