C19 Open Discussion Week 10

Aaaaaand, we’re back.

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225 Responses to C19 Open Discussion Week 10

  1. grim says:

    From the NY Post:

    People flock to NYC-area bars, beaches as ‘quarantine fatigue’ intensifies

    They’re partying like it’s 2019.

    Lockdown-weary New Yorkers ditched the distancing to get social instead this weekend — transforming parts of the Big Apple into a raucous, late-season Mardi Gras.

    Yet the city’s COVID-be-damned attitude was nothing compared with the scene in Belmar, NJ, a beach popular with Staten Islanders and Brooklynites.

    Huge crowds waited shoulder-to-shoulder on the boardwalk for their turn to buy beach badges.

    “The line for beach badges was like four non-socially distanced blocks long,” tweeted Jarrett Seidler, who described the boardwalk as “obscenely packed.”

    Outside popular bars on the Upper East Side, the Upper West Side, the East and West Villages and in Greenpoint, Brooklyn, The Post found booze hounds arriving for the takeout cocktails and then staying — and staying — to sip drinks on packed sidewalks and soak up the lively scenes.

    “How are you going to drink with a mask on?” one reveler, hairdresser Akeem ­Kelley, told The Post.

    His mask dangled below his chin as he stood outside the Upper East Side’s popular Dorrian’s Red Hand bar — where crowds exceeding three dozen people, nearly all unmasked, were found in the early evenings of Friday and Saturday.

    “They don’t care about us,” said Ann Trent, 72, of Manhattan, on Saturday.

  2. grim says:

    Boy oh boy, Ann is overreacting in her old age. In 1969, when she was 21, the rest of her generation through a festival called Woodstock in the middle of a global pandemic that killed up to 4 million people.

  3. Hold my beer says:

    Shelter in place will only have succeeded in trashing the economy. New York and New Jersey waited too long to implement it, and once it was in place kept moving the goal posts on when to reopen. Meanwhile Vietnam went into lockdown right away, banned all domestic and international flights, anyone who bought cold and flu medicine got a visit from the police, did aggressive testing and tracing and only had 300 cases with a population of 97million people. And have reopened it’s economy.

    Also over 60% of the cases in the US can be traced to spreading from New York and New Jersey. And the media acts like cuomo and Murphy are heroes for leading the fight against the virus.

  4. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Around New York City – the U.S. epicenter of the outbreak – New Jersey, Westchester, Long Island and even areas further away are drawing interest.
    “Our short-term rental market has nearly doubled year over year,” said Candace Adams, the CEO of Berkshire Hathaway HomeServices for New York, New England and Westchester Properties. “I think this is very similar to 9/11, where it was very fear-driven … and then the time of year with the kids being out of school, knowing that the summer was coming, I think a lot of people decided, ‘let’s just get out of dodge and go into to a short-term rental of three-to-six months and settle in for the summer.'”

    Fast money is prompting some homeowners in those areas to pack up and stay with family while they rent out their house.

    “Right now, the Hamptons are packed,” The Real Deal founder and publisher Amir Korangy said. “It’s as if you were in the middle of summer, the boom season. Houses that used to go for $10,000 to $15,000 per month, are going for $30,000 … It’s funny – where the city was getting top dollar, that’s shifting away.”
    Even Korangy, a longtime resident of New York City, has searched for a second home in the suburbs of Westchester. He’s bought nothing yet.

    AFTER CORONAVIRUS, ALL HOMEOWNERS SHOULD BE DOING THESE 5 THINGS
    Even so, the Berkshires, a second-home area in western Massachusetts two hours north of Manhattan, recorded the fastest pace of sales for the first quarter in 23 years. Prices are rising, too. Real estate agent Tom Doyle says that in some cases, New York buyers are purchasing without even visiting the property and are inspecting homes using a Facetime tour.

    Whether the interest in properties outside major metro areas turns into a real estate boom or a rush for the exits among city dwellers is yet to be seen, and will depend, in part, on whether the pandemic winds down or roars back this fall.

    https://apple.news/AmNQA-F7ZSe6rIZnrg3IyNA

  5. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Beer and soft drinks could soon be sipped from “all-plant” bottles under new plans to turn sustainably grown crops into plastic in partnership with major beverage makers.
    A biochemicals company in the Netherlands hopes to kickstart investment in a pioneering project that hopes to make plastics from plant sugars rather than fossil fuels.
    The plans, devised by renewable chemicals company Avantium, have already won the support of beer-maker Carlsberg, which hopes to sell its pilsner in a cardboard bottle lined with an inner layer of plant plastic.
    Avantium’s chief executive, Tom van Aken, says he hopes to greenlight a major investment in the world-leading bioplastics plant in the Netherlands by the end of the year. The project, which remains on track despite the coronavirus lockdown, is set to reveal partnerships with other food and drink companies later in the summer.

    https://apple.news/A5PtngCSwTi2WBJZ3qYWssA

  6. Hold my beer says:

    How long before we get viral videos of you tubers wearing a jockstrap like a mask?

  7. Juice Box says:

    Tennis Courts open today in Nassau County BUT remember the news rules 🤣
    “You can kick their balls, but you can’t touch them”

  8. grim says:

    Beach cams looking all pretty tame this morning.

  9. Juice Box says:

    Won’t be long now….

    A federal judge issued a temporary restraining order Saturday allowing indoor worship services to resume in North Carolina until a hearing can be held later this month.

    The order, issued by Judge James C. Dever III — a President George W. Bush appointee — states Gov. Roy Cooper’s executive order banning indoor worship services with more than 10 people is in violation of the Free Exercise Clause of the First
    Amendment.

    ““The judge was very concerned, as we have been from the beginning, that the church is being treated different from other entities,” Baity said. “It’s discrimination, that’s the bottom line. The church has been treated differently.”

  10. Phoenix says:

    “What’s Murphy hiding?” You mean what does all government in the state of NJ hide. This is one example, in other states they would just post it on You Tube. Here you pay for the camera to be used only to prosecute someone, but not to absolve you of a crime you did not commit. Why the secrecy?

    https://www.northjersey.com/story/news/local/courts/2018/08/13/police-dash-camera-recordings-not-public-under-opra-nj-supreme-court/975492002/

  11. Bystander says:

    Reading through posts yesterday and I swear I must live in alternative universe. I don’t see how WFH does not deteriorate the NYC suburbs overall. Only a dummy believes that corps will pay top dollar to have someone sitting in Westchester vs. Pittsburgh. RE articles will always focus on what elite are doing in Hamptons. Who gives a f-ck? 99 percent are going to see real pressure on wages. Work in IT, acctg, compliance or anything else, good luck. I am 45 miles to city on direct train route. Homes sales around me are going nowhere. Brand new construction sitting for 8 months now. Starter home for 399k around block..well bought in early 2010 for 410k. There is a real disconnect with reality somewhere.

  12. Grim says:

    The new model is being called hub and spoke work from home.

    It means you live driving distance from the office, are expected to show face by working a few days every few weeks, and being able to drive in for meetings or other events that require face time.

  13. 3b says:

    Boomer: From yesterday. You are right on both counts. I am the more pathetic one for responding to him. Thanks for the bitch slap.

  14. joyce says:

    It’s a good thing we’re smart and enlightened – not like those damn teenagers in Florida.

    And yes, Ann should just stay home.

    grim says:
    May 17, 2020 at 7:01 am
    From the NY Post:

    People flock to NYC-area bars, beaches as ‘quarantine fatigue’ intensifies

    They’re partying like it’s 2019.

    Lockdown-weary New Yorkers ditched the distancing to get social instead this weekend — transforming parts of the Big Apple into a raucous, late-season Mardi Gras.

  15. joyce says:

    NJ has one of the weakest open records acts in the country. It’s pathetic and not surprising. Coincidentally, Florida has a much better one.

  16. Phoenix says:

    ” I don’t see how WFH does not deteriorate the NYC suburbs overall. Only a dummy believes that corps will pay top dollar to have someone sitting in Westchester vs. Pittsburgh.”

    I agree. The noose will tighten.

  17. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Bystander,

    NYC has the largest pool of smart ultra competitive workers. The best of the best. Those jobs can leave, but they will be replaced with something that can support the market. Why? Because these people will make it happen. Tech is already moving in…they are taking up a lot of new space. I wonder why…

    You underestimate the NYC market. “If you can make it here, you can make it anywhere.” Never bet against NYC. It’s a fool’s bet.

  18. Hold my beer says:

    Phoenix

    Those comments on that video you linked to yesterday were great.

  19. Juice Box says:

    comment from REOPEN NJ for the post about NYC Beaches being closed next weekend.

    “Omg nj here they come”

  20. The Great Pumpkin says:

    You don’t get it. NYC and Cali are ground zero for capitalism. The competitive stay and the weak leave these areas. Not everyone can make it in these markets, so they leave. ESP businesses that have lost their way, are sick, and looking for ways to stay alive with short term cost reductions by leaving the area. They can no longer handle the market costs for having access to the brightest most competitive workers…so they leave Cali and nyc.

  21. Juice Box says:

    Caryn Lynne Doesn’t matter what Murphy says. NY just gave our beaches a death sentence because they’ll all be in NJ because their beaches are closed.

  22. grim says:

    What happened to coordination?

  23. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Murphy must have made a deal with trump to open up our state economy for some fed money. Lol

  24. Juice Box says:

    That REOPEN NJ FB Group is comedy gold.

    I can’t wait until tomorrow when that Gym Reopens and the State Troopers start whooping ass.

  25. grim says:

    Shit I may need to rejoin for that

  26. grim says:

    Lets close the bridge and tunnel.

  27. grim says:

    Asbury boardwalk looking pretty tame for noon.

  28. Hold my beer says:

    These protestors are awesome. It’s like something from the daily show with Jon Stewart or the onion.

    The guy asking everyone to cough on him is my favorite.

    https://www.reddit.com/r/PublicFreakout/comments/g9kzks/id_watch_these_coronavirus_protests_for_hours/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf

  29. Juice Box says:

    IT’s a chilly 57 degrees by the beach.

  30. grim says:

    70 and beautiful inland.

  31. Bystander says:

    Grim,

    I will ignore the one truck pony dufus, who knows nothing of corp strategy or competition. So, again, if I live in Northern Westchester with 800k house and 20k tax bill then I need 200k salary. The person who moved to Poconos who has brand new 250k home and 5k tax bill will survive on $100k easy. How long before those world collide? I have been seeing offering salaries moving downward for 5 years now.

  32. ExEssex says:

    At least six countries have had to restart their coronavirus lockdowns weeks after loosening them.
    China, Germany, Iran, South Korea, Lebanon, and Saudi Arabia all reimposed partial new measures after discovering a spike in infections.
    The renewed lockdowns are often limited to various districts where the virus has spiked, or limited to particular aspects such as travel restrictions or a curfew.
    The decision to ease lockdown measures may not have been dictated solely by public health: many of these six countries have been under political or economic pressure to reopen.

  33. 3b says:

    Microsoft says work from home is here to stay.

  34. leftwing says:

    “Deblasio bucks Cuomo, NYC beaches to stay Closed.”

    Pools closed too.

    Long range forecast shows temps in mid- to high 70s….they kick up five or so degrees there will be riots. Hope it happens.

  35. Juice box says:

    Just saw Scooter riding Scott with his oxygen machine at the supermarket.

    there will be blood

  36. grim says:

    Socialized healthcare is easier if we kill all the old sick people first.

  37. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Oh, what do you know, the Microsoft ceo agrees with me.

    “Microsoft CEO Satya Nadella warned in an interview with the New York Times on Thursday that making remote work permanent could lead to negative consequences for social interaction and mental health.
    “What I miss is when you walk into a physical meeting, you are talking to the person that is next to you, you’re able to connect with them for the two minutes before and after,” Nadella said.
    While Microsoft was one of the first companies to shift its tech workforce remotely when the pandemic began to spread across the globe, Nadella says that switching to entirely remote offices would just be “replacing one dogma with another dogma.””

    https://apple.news/AWD8BIJOiQV2K8gYUdMinxw

  38. chicagofinance says:

    They have discovered a potential cure for COVID-19 by adapting an existing treatment.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bmfudW7rbG0

  39. Libturd the generous says:

    And significantly cheaper.

    I was super busy this weekend. Just for the F of it I decided to break up the monotony and offered up my BBQ prowess to the block. They all know my skills from the annual block party. but I was blown away by the demand when I opened it up for household orders. Needless to say, I fed 13 households over 160 pounds of smoked meat.

    7 briskets
    18 racks of spare ribs
    40 pounds of chicken quarters

    I did it all out of the kindness of my heart and did not make or lose a penny. The briskets were crazy expensive so the final tab was $760.

    There was one family from Austin and she said my brisket was just about there, but my ribs were better than what she’s used to. I’ll call this a win.

    3B, just skip over Dumpkin’s posts. I have not read a single post of his since the big lie of his profession was revealed. It feels like the old days. Though, it’s pretty annoying when others still converse with the moron. He is a compulsive liar. There can’t possibly be a thing that comes out of his mind that could add any value. He is mentally ill and probably should not be trusted around kids.

    Otherwise, I can’t believe how polarized we’ve become as a country. The blue team won’t stop with the fear mongering and the red team is stupidly taking greater risk than they should.

    HOW DUMB ARE WE?

  40. Chicago says:

    Gaze with fondness on. The wrong one.
    https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=l6rsRLSglKo

  41. Libturd says:

    Awesome tune Chi. Perhaps I’ll buy the album.

    Always loved his dismal snarkiness. I played the sh1t out of Ouija Board when I was a dj back in the college days.

    If you never saw him live, it’s like a goth convention. Black clothes and white skin everywhere. Lots of pierced nips fo sho!

  42. Juice Box says:

    REOPEN NJ live stream on FB from the Atilis Gym in Bellmawr

    https://www.facebook.com/groups/2585262291688647/?epa=SEARCH_BOX

  43. Juice Box says:

    6 am no Police so far, just a few Media and maybe a few dozen supporters.

  44. grim says:

    Can’t they at least wear masks? Seems like the same dopes as online. Someone needs to take the megaphone away from that lady so much blabbing.

  45. homeboken says:

    Lib – this whole situation has given me an odd sense of pride for my country.

    I argued that many of these lockdown orders ran contrary to our inalienable rights as Americans. Our birth rights.

    What I recently realized is the funny things with birth rights, they don’t go away just because some politician hundreds of miles away says so.

    The lockdowns will end whenever we say they end. The consent of the people remains the only principal that elected officials can be trumped by.

    NYC close pools – go to NJ and watch for the return of the open street hydrant (not exact by an example).

    Can’t open you store by edict, do it anyway. Make your neighbor the cop come arrest you for trying to feed your kids.

    Honestly, what’s more American than that?

    I have one huge worry remaining from the COVID saga though. China – the one thing our govt is perfect at is waging war. The rhetoric between China and the US is bubbling up.

  46. Hold my beer says:

    Only saw 1 person wearing a mask in that crowd.

    Megaphone Megan is annoying

  47. Grim says:

    Wonder how many members are there.

  48. JUice Box says:

    Knuckleheads 90% aren’t wearing masks, the Gym owners want people to wear masks and social distance.

  49. grim says:

    One of the ladies that ran a FB feed was heckling people to take off masks.

  50. 3b says:

    Lib You are absolutely right. This time I really will just scroll by, it’s the only way to not get taken in by it. As for the red and blue team I look at it and say our choice is between a lunatic and someone who appears to have dementia. I don’t like throwing that term around as it’s an awful disease, but clearly there is something off with Biden. It’s more than he is just prone to gaffes. I did see that Biden is expanding his platform by including elected officials who support Warren and Sanders as part of his campaign policy and strategy. Looks like he is moving to the left. I of course will be sitting home Election Day. Biden away from any dementia concerns is a bought and paid for career politician. Trump is crazy! Sad that these are our choices.

  51. Juice Box says:

    CUMON where is Attorney general Grewal and his goons? Only PD at the demonstration is the the local townies.

  52. Fast Eddie says:

    Moderna (MRNA) reported positive results from a Phase 1 study of its coronavirus vaccine on Monday, prompting MRNA stock to catapult higher.

    https://www.investors.com/news/technology/coronavirus-vaccine-mrna-stock-flies-promising-phase-1-test/?src=A00220&yptr=yahoo

  53. Libturd says:

    I have no issues with these demonstrations. Not only will they get is to herd immunity sooner (if there is such a thing), but I do believe people should have the choice to get sick as long as they don’t overwhelm our frontline workers.

    Howard Stern is correct again. He says we are a nation full of idiots.

  54. Libturd, the Master Beta says:

    If a vaccine is released within the next few months. A lot of those crays crays are gonna be sorry.

  55. Fast Eddie says:

    Lib,

    Brisket and ribs and we didn’t get the invite? ;) I would have probably started scrubbing utensils, pots, pans, moving things and chipping in and helping you. It’s the story of my life… if it’s not making a living in my job, it’s constantly doing things to the house. So much so that I maxed out of my vacation days and my Director told me I need to take time off. lol.

  56. Libturd says:

    Ha ha. I took 2 days off in January for D’s MRI and audiology. I still have over 4 weeks plus all of my sick time. It’s really amazing how you don’t get colds and other sicknesses when you wash your hands a lot and rarely go out. Three months without even a headache during the high allergy season. It’s pretty amazing.

  57. grim says:

    No way the AG or state police roll up today.

    They’ll wait until Wednesday or Thursday afternoon, when the buzz dies down and nobody is around anymore.

  58. 3b says:

    Saw something on FB about lessons learned with pandemic, one of them was personal hygiene!! Really people needed a lesson in that!!??

  59. Libturd says:

    Same happened whenever I thru hiked the AT. You learn that your mom was right. You don’t get sick from the weather. You get sick from other people.

  60. ExEssex says:

    Meanwhile…..in DC….

    Suddenly concerned about the growing national debt now that corporations have secured access to trillions of dollars in Covid-19 bailout funds with little oversight, Trump administration officials are reportedly considering several proposals purportedly aimed at reducing government spending—including a pair of plans that would provide Americans with cash payments in exchange for delays or cuts to their Social Security benefits.

  61. ExEssex says:

    Anyone see a difference yet between the Dems and the Repugs.??
    Hope the base doesn’t need SS benefits.

  62. chicagofinance says:

    Didn’t really pay attention to the new Press Secretary……
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_07NZgGBePc

  63. chicagofinance says:

    The last 60 seconds is sublime……

    Libturd says:
    May 17, 2020 at 11:37 pm
    Awesome tune Chi. Perhaps I’ll buy the album.

  64. grim says:

    https://www.fox29.com/news/police-to-new-jersey-gym-that-opened-in-defiance-of-order-have-a-good-day?fbclid=IwAR3x4HMvjxmRnuYEolZChYmfwyqbZV-O4oCdSO-PiPOm9MkVdG8iCwe2ArE

    Around 10:30 a.m. local police officers approached the door through the crowd to speak with the gym’s owners. The officers informed them that they were “formally” in violation of the shutdown order.

    “We are and only were here for everybody’s safety today. We planned for the worst and hoped for the best, and it seems like that’s what we have out here today,” the officer said to the owners and surrounding crowd.

    “Formally, you are all in violation of the executive order. On that note, have a good day. Everybody be safe,” the officer said before walking away as the crowd erupted in cheers.

  65. homeboken says:

    I watched some old CSPAN videos of Biden in the Senate, date range about 15 years ago. The level of decline from 2005-today is unmistakable. The man isn’t just suffering from a stutter or gaffes. 15 years ago, he was a polished politician, holding court on the floor of the Senate. Today, not so much.

    It doesn’t matter though – Biden will not be the name you see on the ticket in November.
    I am no fan of the MAGA/Trump is Jesus crowd but they are rabid supporters. See that miles long Trump boat parade in Jacksonville? I can’t imagine Biden motivating his supporters in a similar way. The far left base doesn’t want Biden, they wanted Bernie. Anyone to the right will refuse Biden at the ballot box too. Are there enough voters in the center to mid-left range of the spectrum to win? It’s way too small ofa base to be serious.

  66. FakeNewsHoaxes says:

    Lol. The democrat rising star from CA who was best qualified to pole dance cost them a seat in the house. Hopefully it’s a sign of things to come in NJ and we can get rid of all of the Obama acolytes who crept in.

    I can’t imagine this state ever having a more worthless contingent than the group of losers currently being sent to DC. Their trademark issue of impeachment was a massive fail, time to flush.

  67. Fast Eddie says:

    Joyce,

    Post that link of me you posted the other day… the one I posted a month ago. I want to read it again.

  68. Hold my beer says:

    If this vaccine is available by the end of the year, how will it’s distribution be prioritized?
    Will it go to nursing homes and their care takers and other places that have had outbreaks like meat packaging plants, or will it go to those with $$$$ first?

    https://www.news.com.au/world/coronavirus/global/coronavirus-moderna-announces-first-covid19-vaccine-tested-in-humans-safe/news-story/ca1bc5600ac1375792d8f8f9297a751e

  69. grim says:

    Sure as hell the Reopen NJ group won’t be in line for vaccines.

    Crackpot central.

  70. Juice Box says:

    Beer-

    Beer it seems easier to make than a regular vaccine and they aren’t waiting.

    Technology transfer is expected to begin in June 2020, and the companies intend to manufacture the first batches of mRNA-1273 at Lonza U.S. in July 2020.

    “1 billion doses of mRNA-1273 per year for use worldwide assuming the currently expected dose of 50 µg”

    https://www.biospace.com/article/releases/moderna-and-lonza-announce-worldwide-strategic-collaboration-to-manufacture-moderna-s-vaccine-mrna-1273-against-novel-coronavirus/

  71. joyce says:

    A month from now, we’ll be talking about how the economy is bouncing back faster than expected.
    http://njrereport.com/index.php/2020/04/14/c19-open-discussion-week-5/#comment-1161880

    Fast Eddie says:
    May 18, 2020 at 11:30 am
    Joyce,

    Post that link of me you posted the other day… the one I posted a month ago. I want to read it again.

  72. Hold my beer says:

    Grim

    These lockdown protestors are crackpots. They make all the regular posters here seem dull and sane.

    “What we have here….statistically…is political science”

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8kkBseVTUow

  73. Hold my beer says:

    Juice

    At 1 billion a year it will still take 6-7 years to give vaccines to everyone who wants one.

    How will it be triaged?

  74. Fast Eddie says:

    A month from now, we’ll be talking about how the economy is bouncing back faster than expected.

    And… so it is.

  75. Juice Box says:

    Beer – that’s just here we are fronting nearly a half billion, they are partnering with other companies around the world to ramp up production.

  76. D-FENS says:

    You opening up next Grim?

    grim says:
    May 18, 2020 at 11:09 am
    https://www.fox29.com/news/police-to-new-jersey-gym-that-opened-in-defiance-of-order-have-a-good-day?fbclid=IwAR3x4HMvjxmRnuYEolZChYmfwyqbZV-O4oCdSO-PiPOm9MkVdG8iCwe2ArE

    Around 10:30 a.m. local police officers approached the door through the crowd to speak with the gym’s owners. The officers informed them that they were “formally” in violation of the shutdown order.

  77. D-FENS says:

    Outdoor Shooting and Archery ranges allowed open. I guess ANJRPC will be dropping their lawsuit.

  78. Walking says:

    Some more good news with regards to vaccines, Pfizer also started human trials of it’s vaccine (partnered with biotnet) at NYU school of med last week. I’m hearing from old Pfizer friends they are gearing up suites for fall 2020 release.

  79. 3b says:

    The economy was not great before all of this, the Fed lowered interest rates 3 times in 2019.

  80. Fast Eddie says:

    The economy was not great before all of this, the Fed lowered interest rates 3 times in 2019.

    Everyone I know, friend and family are working. Personally, I got my 2nd promotion in four years and was also courted for another position while not even looking. I keep my fingers crossed and I’m humble but sorry to disagree, the economy was motoring and the fear mongering is already losing it’s steam.

  81. Libturd, exhibiting downward pressure, like with a plunger says:

    The Fed lowered the interest rates because they have now, sadly become politicized. Trump first tried to fire Powell. Then he kept dragging all of the Fed leaders names through the mud on Twitter.

    Incredulously, while claiming this was the greatest economy ever. Which he borrowed 1 trillion dollars to juice two years earlier, which was clearly running out of gas.

    Like Stern said again this morning. “We are a nation of idiots.”

  82. Fat Fat Fast Eddie says:

    Like Stern said again this morning. “We are a nation of idiots.”

    And yet, the masses still clamor for our shores.

  83. 3b says:

    Fast I don’t disagree with what you say. But the fact remains you don’t lower rates in a so called booming economy you raise them.

  84. 3b says:

    Lib Powell should have done the right thing and resigned tell Trump to go scratch.

  85. Juice Box says:

    Gov Murphy better get a handle on his social media team, they are moving the goal posts for him

    Gov Murphy – on FB
    2 hours ago.

    “Until a proven vaccine is widely available, we cannot firmly enter the “new normal,” when life will once again return to all our workplaces, downtowns, and main streets.”

  86. JCer says:

    Last year I was with Bystander that the economy was a paper tiger, but really at the begin of 2020 anecdotally from my perspective things actually looked pretty good. A lot of people were getting rate increases, raises and new jobs paying good money.

    Trump was looking to drop rates to ensure re-election, my assumption was after re-election the fed would have started to raise rates. Lib the fed has always been politicized, their independence usually allowed them to play an unofficial role in who got elected.

  87. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    The economy has been a paper tiger for the better part of 15 years. If it wasn’t, they wouldn’t have needed rates near zero %. Print to prosperity actually does work until the world gets sick of storing dollars.

  88. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    Used a hand sanitizer from a distillery today. It smelled like pure bourbon. Has anyone else had this?

  89. 3b says:

    Jcer He tried raising rates at the end of 2018 and the market had a meltdown, so 2019 he started cutting again. He won’t be raising rates , he can’t. I agree the economy appeared to be doing well in many respects,but all predicated on low rates. Can they stay low forever??

  90. grim says:

    Yeah, most of us aren’t distilling it like vodka, just enough to hit the necessary alcohol concentration. When you distill at a lower proof, you get more flavor across.

    We made some fun “craft” hand sanitizer. We did a batch of limoncello, a batch of gin, some very neutral wheat vodka, a craft brewery’s IPA, etc.

    Overwhelmingly the limoncello with the winner.

  91. grim says:

    The IPA smells like a drunk hipster that spent a hot summer afternoon jogging between craft breweries in Brooklyn. Was not my favorite.

  92. Bystander says:

    JCer/3b,

    Economy was truly no better than Obama’s last year. Dumpy passed Paul Ryans tax cut which simply enriched already wealthy. Adding that 1.5 T to debt did not accomplish this massive repatriation of jobs that Donnies PR kept pumping. Like you said, Powell provided covert bailout campaign and rate dump to keep stocks pumping. Red hat fools ate it up but a decent economy is not “greatest economy in history”…pure bs from most amoral administration in history. I will agree with JCer that some thaw occurred in Jan. I had a few weeks of LinkedIn recruiters pinging me. None were great rates but one came back at $100/hr after two weeks of no progress on filling role. Seriously it is unheard of to get over $100 in finance right now. Most want $65 to $80 max for Sr level NYC roles. It was been absolute distaster since Feb. No linkedin contacts at all. One BS $30/hr IT PM job. Horrible right now.

  93. homeboken says:

    Trump just told the press that he has been taking HydroxyChloroquine and Zinc for 3 weeks.

  94. Juice Box says:

    Homeboken – Bet he got a shot of mrna-1273 tooo, we ware giving them almost a 1/2 billion for the vaccine.

  95. JCer says:

    bystander, that’s not true in Jersey. One of our BA/PM’s who was at 1k a day got $1200 from someone else in Feb, and 2 other BA’s were bumped to 1k per day from $700-800. If you want to know the culprit for the crummy low rate jobs, they aren’t real jobs….. So much is a result of people trying to get Visas so they have to advertise the jobs, the advertisements are intended to ensure no one applies.

    The real economy hasn’t been wonderful since the 90’s. I do think the tax cut, the resulting repatriation of funds and the roll back of regs was having an effect. In your particular industry the reg rollbacks removed a lot of pressure from the financial firms, they responded by scaling back IT spend and outsourcing more as the impetus of avoiding fines from the Obama extortion agency disappeared.

    Of course rates could not meaningfully rise as the government is a huge debtor. After re-election the WH probably stops caring so much about rates and you would have seen some token increases. Now with COVID, just forget about it, zero rates to infinity and lets hope no great depression.

    Now just forget about it, job market is finished. If you have something paying decently just be happy you still have it. Employers are totally taking advantage of the situation too.

  96. Hold my beer says:

    Did Murphy lose a bet? Why else would he go out in public with hair like that?

  97. joyce says:

    What are you talking about? Stock indices up today = economy on fire

    JCer says:
    May 18, 2020 at 4:39 pm

    Now just forget about it, job market is finished. If you have something paying decently just be happy you still have it. Employers are totally taking advantage of the situation too.

  98. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    I can picture getting pulled over. I smell the alcohol on you. No sir, that’s my craft distiller hand sanitizer. Although, Limoncello hand sanitizer, I could go for that. The bourbon one I have is just funny.

  99. Bystander says:

    JCer,

    Not arguing that Jan to Feb may have seen a loosening of money. I don’t turn over every rock anymore, mostly contacts or applications via Linkedin. Very clear only looking at Sr roles. I can assure you that 2018 and 2019 were mostly horrendous and laughable rates. Current rates? Well, you know the drill, guy coming in has 15 years of Oracle dev/ ETL and taking $700/day after vendor takes cut. Took us 6 months to fill this one role bc no skilled person will take pay. Now, different story…

  100. homeboken says:

    By – so IT was rough at the tail end of the last boom. I wonder if there are any other jobs available and how they fired during 2017-2-019

  101. grim says:

    So anyone have plans for the big holiday weekend?

  102. homeboken says:

    *fared, not fired. though both kind of work.

    Point is, the IT sector being squeezed has a lot more to do with price competition with work visa holders and an oversupply of IT workers in the last decade.

    Now I understand, IT skill levels vary hugely, like any field. But adding tens of thousands of young college grads into the IT world doesn’t help to push up the salary base.

  103. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Home,

    I was trying to tell him that it was his field, that people were getting nice raises, but he would not listen. Kept applying the IT labor market to the whole spectrum. No one was going down except for his field. He posted some crazy job description work requirements for 30 an hour the other week. Who in their right mind would take that job when you can go get a fast food job (floor in labor market) for almost 15 an hour.

  104. The Great Pumpkin says:

    At 15 an hour, that’s around 30,000 a year. 125,000 after 4 years of working. So that tells you, the floor for housing is getting close to 300k for most of the United States (areas you can actually find a professional job, not retirement communities that pay crap).

  105. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I am counting that as a duel income household. No one working fast food should be able to afford a house. So if a two income household working at mcds can make 250k in four years, the absolute floor has to be around 300k or higher.

    3b still waiting for cheap housing which will never come…he doesn’t get it.
    Only way you get 50% drop in housing is if people make 50% less.

  106. Fabius Maximus says:

    Best Liquor store sign, since Clot stuck up his “No Snookie”

    https://twitter.com/margari_r/status/1262585834290778112

  107. Juice Box says:

    Plans for the weekend? BBQ, and relax by my pool. What else can you do? No family coming over, no neighbors etc. We may do a social distancing thing in the street with neighbors and some drinks but that won’t be more than an hour or so.

    We may go for ice creme at the local takeout Lighthouse Italian Ice in Red Bank.

    I am in need of more fireworks too….

  108. Juice Box says:

    Classic Clot circa 2012. I visited him there at the Liquor store and picked up a case of wine, this seems like a century ago now as I was living in Hoboken at the time.

    https://www.nj.com/hudson/2012/02/snooki_jwoww_banned_from_anoth.html

  109. 3b says:

    Juice Is clot still in NJ? Too bad he does not post anymore.

  110. Bystander says:

    Boken,

    I don’t reply to lying beta male losers so to answer question, yes, I agree it is the flood of visa holders into Northeast. I linked this before but Pew estimated that over 40% of all H1b over 10 year period ended up in Philly/NJ/NY/Boston corridor. There is certainly enough demand to soak up IT grads into market but area wages can’t sustain onslaught of decreased IT spending and H1B flood in NYC area. Govt should force H1B to work in Iowa, Missouri and other states rather than free float wherever. All states should have access to that talent. Other jobs? Well, my bank moved all back office and most middle office from NYC area to the South three years ago. Most firms have been doing same so compliance, acctg, legal, operations are all being squeezed as less jobs available in NYC. You have to be in med, digital sales, fintech or something else to get wage growth but those in 40s/50s are not going to be hired in those companies. Moving is only career option if working for old dinosaur. WFH will hasten people having to exit area.

  111. Not Bloomberg News says:

    Thoughts on this 2.5 minute synopsis on China….start at 8:30 go to 11:00

    https://www.cnbc.com/video/2020/05/19/rep-mccarthy-on-new-house-relief-package-rising-china-tensions-and-more.html

  112. Juice Box says:

    3B he made an appearance on the March 15 reboot thread.

    He slings his opinions on FB now, along with Libtard and Grim.

    Click the link in his name here to find him.

    http://njrereport.com/index.php/2020/03/15/step-away-for-a-minute-and-the-world-goes-to-shit/

  113. Libturd, the Master Beta says:

    Besides my realtor starting to send me new listings of multis going up for sale and having received 4 calls directly this week (most likely from vultures), I just got this headline in my mailbox.

    COVID-19 Changing North Jersey’s Real Estate Landscape, Realtors Swamped
    by Zak Failla & Cecilia Levine 05/18/2020 9:30 a.m.

    With the novel coronavirus (COVID-19) outbreak ongoing, many wealthy New Yorkers are leaving the city to head toward the suburbs.

  114. Juice Box says:

    Please don’t give Pumps a real estate boner…

  115. Libturd, the Master Beta says:

    Grim,

    Post this on that ReOpen NJ Facebook group.

    https://news.yahoo.com/thought-coronavirus-fake-crisis-then-163213420.html?.tsrc=daily_mail&uh_test=1_04

  116. Juice Box says:

    New lock-down in China..

    “Chinese officials have imposed quarantine restrictions on two cities in the province of Jilin located in northeast China. Jilin is part of a wider province located in the Dongbei region – which is home to more than 100 million residents. The threat level in the area has been raised to “high-risk” by health authorities.”

    https://www.express.co.uk/news/world/1284199/China-coronavirus-new-lockdown-latest-Jilin-province-quarantine-COVID-19-update?fbclid=IwAR1kGAEnuZ4cnlBtr4I4L9NT8OJ_bJ67dxiDap6lgp958ay2A0w8s3kNL5U

  117. Bystander says:

    JB,

    No worries. One ride on NJTransit and catching COVID in the city might be the better lifestyle option.

  118. 3b says:

    Juice: Thanks must have missed that. Is he still living in NJ?

  119. 3b says:

    Lib There will probably be bargains on penthouses in Manhattan!!

  120. Juice Box says:

    Bystander- A friend of mine in Bergen County did catch Covid that way, rode the bus and took the subway.

    Nobody I know who works in the city wants to go back. One company is trying to get approx 25% of the workforce back next month, with a 2 week in office and 2 week remote plan to have only 12.5% of the workforce in the office at anytime.

    No volunteers.

    This building cost 2 Billion dollars to build and had 7,500 workers in it. Is it really needed anymore? We are going on 10 weeks now…..seems to me the answer is no.

  121. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    Real estate agent near me claims that New Yorkers are the only ones buying homes in Mercer County right now.

  122. Juice Box says:

    3b – Not sure, his FB profile says yes, but his business location says no as it would be a 200 mile commute, and it’s closed? Not sure really.

  123. ExEssex says:

    The coronavirus pandemic is likely to bring about many deep, long-lasting changes in U.S. society and the economy. It’s difficult to predict what most of those will be. Unfortunately, one likely possibility is that college towns will suffer.

    For the past few decades, college towns have been a pillar of the economy. Universities draw in lots of educated workers, in large part because of their research activities. This in turn lures private capital, which draws in yet more educated workers — a self-reinforcing effect. The result is that college towns and their surrounding areas have been some of the big winners from the knowledge economy. In some cases, universities have even become the seeds for tech clusters, creating thriving new metropolises. Austin, Texas, and the Research Triangle cities of North Carolina are good examples. Some Rust Belt cities such as Pittsburgh have built their economic revivals around top universities. But even when colleges don’t do much research, they can still generate modest but real benefits for declining regions, simply by drawing in and concentrating money and consumers.

    But even before the pandemic, this golden age of college towns was under threat. The Great Recession caused most states to make deep, long-lasting cuts in university funding. Even by 2018, with the recovery complete, most states were still spending substantially less than before the recession. Meanwhile, demand for for-profit and private nonprofit schools had fallen, shuttering a growing number of colleges.

  124. Juice Box says:

    Blue that would be some commute….. Hamilton to NY Penn is 90 minutes each way on a perfect day.

  125. 3b says:

    Juice: Wall Street is/will embrace the cost savings of WFH, it’s something they simply cannot ignore. There are NY ers running out to the suburbs now, but it’s to me a knee jerk reaction at this point. The suburbs close to NYC are expensive due to proximity to NYC, if a large chunk of office workers remain WFH, what is the point of paying the premium to be next to a city a lot of people don’t want and no longer need to go to? It’s going to be very interesting going forward.

  126. BoomerRemover says:

    I’m by the new LG building in Englewood Cliffs. Brand new, custom built from the ground up, not yet occupied by staff, multiple open floors of LEED gold everything. Only people that set foot in it were the Turner construction crews.

    3b,
    For the longest time everyone has said that the premium is schools, education, high IQ neighbors. You gonna be the first to gentrify bumblefakville and put your offspring in a school with Cletus?

  127. Bystander says:

    Boomer,

    How about move to bumblefk, spend $250k on new mansion, pay $5k in taxes, do WFH for $100K salary and use savings to send kid to private school. Who is coming to pay the 800k/20k tax bill in Wayne? Company going to pay double for you bc you chose high cost location? Not likely. Dual income/dual stress/high housing costs/paying someone else to raise kids..insanity.

  128. BoomerRemover says:

    Nom, nom, nom, nom… this is ridiculous.

    h–ps://youtu.be/4VrNfmsQxGA?t=180

  129. ExEssex says:

    Bystander knows the ol’ mächïne was broken way before the Covid.

  130. Fat F.uck Eddie says:

    I have a friend living in Wayne since 1991. He says the town is white trash with some money. lol. His words, not mine. ;)

  131. Libturd says:

    Took another look at the Covid charts this morning. As expected, the wave has clearly started. The big question now is, how bad is it going to get.

    My goal is not to fear monger or start the reopening vs. economic depression debate.

    Don’t be an idiot like Trump and make believe you should not wear a mask. I personally know of too many people who either died or have done irreparable damage to their lungs and/or organs which will sure shorten their lives. Some these people believed this was no worse than the flu and like the gym owner in Bellmawr, thinks getting Trump re-elected is more important than his own private health. You couldn’t pay me a million dollars to stand in that crowd without a mask.

    I get we need to reopen. But only with proper protections. If the blood wasn’t on Trump’s hands from completely mishandling this at the start. It’s completely on his hands for making his supporters think they can run around without any protection. He is truly the dumbest and most ignorant leader I have ever witnessed. He really does deserve to be on a pedestal with the likes of that Kim and Vladi.

    Listen. Open the country up. Just do it with protection! Jeez.

    I’m really not sure what is more dangerous. Electing a president with memory loss who might not make wise decisions because of it or electing a president who is so ignorant and worried only about his ego, who might not make wise decisions because of it? At least creepy Joe might accidentally do the right thing.

    Sorry Gary, but Trump really should hang. And this is not the mass media talking.

  132. JCer says:

    bystander, there is no 250k mansion in east bumble. WFH is working on a small scale so far 2 months. Does it prove effective long term? My guess is no, advances in tech have made it better but there still is no substitute for in person interaction. Right now people are scared, this is not what people want, it’s not that they don’t want to go back to the office, they don’t want COVID.

    My money is on the model that Grim mentioned, where people live close enough to commute occasionally but not locally. People need to be close enough to come in when needed but can be remote a large amount of the time. I’ve personally seen that work just fine, it is rare that a 100% remote situation works as smoothly as someone who is coming to the office periodically.

    On IT wages, H1B and the outsourcers have had a real impact on wages. But still I keep hearing kids out of college are getting 90-100k to start as developers and that is from NJIT, Rutgers etc.

  133. Libturd says:

    BR,

    They need to color the mask Homer Simpson yellow to really make it ridiculous.

  134. Fat F.uck Eddie says:

    Listen. Open the country up. Just do it with protection! Jeez.

    What does this mean and how do you achieve it? Post the covid chart you’re looking at because I view about 10 of them.

  135. BoomerRemover says:

    Bystander,
    I am standing at that precipice now and wrestling with same. I agree there are easier and arguably better places to live.

    It’s easier to gentrify a ten by ten block radius like Bushwick then a rural area. In the latter one can simply walk over to Williamsburg to get a fix.

    My concern is that while I consult currently, if I can’t reinvent the product to match advancing tech and need to be employed again, I would ostensibly need to be close to some type of high paid labor market.

  136. Libtard says:

    FFE (love the name),

    https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-us-cases.html#g-cases-over-time

    The top chart clearly shows it as do the individual state maps. AND IT’S EARLY STILL. Throw in the fact that it’s Tuesday, when the underreported numbers for the weekend clearly drive the line lower than it is and you can clearly see the turn.

    The truth is, I need only look at the moronic behavior of the unmasked masses on the news. Even worse, the more liberty loving (right wing) the group is, the less likely they are to wear masks. A lot of people have died in the name of Jesus and Allah. Please, don’t do it for Trump. He is not a savior.

  137. Libturd says:

    This is NOT going to work. Below is from a gambling addict for sure.

    So here’s my observations of The New Casin0 Norm, at least at Harrah’s Cherokee. Sorry if this is too much information.

    In order to enter the property, you had to show a print-out of your invitation.
    Only two people per car.
    Only 30% of room capacity were invite.
    You were then given an orange wristband to wear at all times to show that you have permission to be on the property.
    They then took your temperature (no contact). This went far in making me feel more comfortable about everybody else.
    They then gave you a mask (you could use your own..). It was comfortable.
    The entire evening, I never saw anyone without a mask.
    No valet.
    Check-in was as usual, though judging from the lack of people at front desk. I think most people opted not to stay overnight.
    Up/down escalators that were right next to each other were shut down.
    Elevators were used as usual. Hm on that one, though I don’t know what else they could do. The restriction on number of people per car, however, resulted in our never being in elevator with more than two other people.
    Room had a sign “Cleaned and Sealed”, meaning no Harrah’s employee could enter the room during your stay.
    No coffee machines in room.
    No drinks sent up to room.
    No pen and pad in room.
    No kids, so the halls were extremely quiet, which was nice.
    Did not see any dogs.
    No smoking.
    Machines on casin0 floor were socially distanced.
    Staff was always cleaning the machines.
    Hand sanitizers available throughout the casin0 and common areas, especially at ATMs.
    Only a few shops open and only two people allowed in at one time.
    Pens are decommissioned after every use.
    Food court: only burgers, pizza, donuts (you don’t touch them). Not even snacks, like chips, etc.
    Only one restaurant open, for takeout.
    And Starbucks, but no tables.
    Room service available.
    Drinks available on casin0 floor, which surprised me.
    Masks

  138. BoomerRemover says:

    I know Paulson is a big bird buff and he was one foot out the door back when I saw him at the UES Y, but what is Tim Geitner up to these days anyway? I haven’t seen him pop up on CNBC or anything.

    Lib, a flair for the dramatic, eh?

  139. Libturd says:

    As for big weekend plans.

    None. Though we are getting ready for crabbing season. I just re-stringed my traps and drop lines. We’ll probably head down to the back bays the first week in July and will rent a nice boat. It’s super safe and super fun. Maybe catch a few fish too?

  140. Libturd says:

    What drama?

    Only a complete fool of a leader and his VP would not wear a mask in a public place. Not just for their own protection, but to set a good example for the public. Especially if that public place is a Covid clinic.

  141. Fat F.uck Eddie says:

    Lib,

    A few of the charts are fluctuating. I can’t view the NYT link, don’t have a subscription and besides, they’ve turned into a tabloid anyway. But, the numbers are bouncing around and may very well spike or flare up. I get it. But to force everyone to comply is impossible. What’s even worse is watching small business, 66% of this countries workforce, withering away and dying. Glad you like my name, it fits! What until you see me again! :)

  142. Bystander says:

    JCer,

    Perhaps mansion for $250k in a stretch but brand new 2500 sq ft in East Stroudsburg, PA or surrounding area? Absolutely. In fact, I workd with several people who work from home in Poconos and shoot into Hudson county a couple of times a quarter, max. I am not claiming that 6 figure jobs are gone. 90k is dirt for tech talent and jobs are easily available in that range. Start trying to get that $150k or so as a sr. developer and you will see pushback. 10 years ago, we had basic UAT testers getting $700/day. The cap is more my point. Experience is no longer valued after 7 or so years.

    Ed,

    Very good…hah

  143. JCer says:

    Lib, people are done with this regardless of government mandates. I’m seeing a big difference in stores. I’m seeing traffic on the roads. I went to home depot with weekend(to by carpenter bee foam…those things are the worst) and people have flooded that store to buy gardening stuff and other unnecessary supplies with their children in tow. Now you tell me in general having your small kids running through homedepot is a bad idea in general, but during a pandemic?

    The irony is the people who are afraid and have quarantined themselves are largely those with little to fear. Also I called it early on IL-6 blocking drugs are highly effective at reducing mortality in severe cases, I’d wager almost every young person impacted by this was a victim of their own immune system. The study results from Actemra have been positive. Throw out the 40,000 ventilators Cuomo needed, they aren’t going to save you, we need antibody treatments, Tocilizumab(Actemra) and yes Remdesivir. I think we are close to effective treatments and a vaccine, by next year I think this will be a bad memory.

  144. ExEssex says:

    11:37 sounds like heaven.

  145. Fat F.uck Eddie says:

    Bystander,

    I agree with you about the job market. I know it’s not the same. Keep working until you can retire and then get the f.uck out and do what you love. I’m probably older than you… shorter of breath and one day closer to death. ;)

  146. chicagofinance says:

    clot is in the PRI

    Here is his business.
    https://thefallswineroom.com/

    I may be up there again in July…… I will report if so.

    Juice Box says:
    May 19, 2020 at 10:02 am
    3B he made an appearance on the March 15 reboot thread.

    He slings his opinions on FB now, along with Libtard and Grim.

  147. Juice Box says:

    Reviewing the latest clinical trials for Covid19 treatments to prevent death from lung failure, some are looking more promising for the severe cases.

    Tocilizumab is phase 4 now in Israel (cytokine storm treatment)

    Sargramostim is Phase 4 in Belgium (nebulized inhalation for lung function failure)

    https://clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/results?cond=covid19&age_v=&gndr=&type=&rslt=&phase=3&Search=Apply

  148. Juice Box says:

    Amazon eager to expand its apparel business may buy bits and pieces of JC Penny in bankruptcy?

    Pier 1 Imports liquidating no takers.

    WAlmart flushing Jet.com into the Hudson River. $3 bIllion down the tubes as Walmart Q1 online sales jump 74%.

  149. Juice Box says:

    Several Malls reopening in Minnesota the big on Mall of America is waiting until June 1st.

  150. Libturd, the Master Beta says:

    I agree, it’s becoming less and less of a death sentence. Which is great. Until it kills you. I am not advocating staying inside. I am advocating people wear a mask to protect themselves and even moreso, to protect others. To not wear one is incredibly selfish. Our president is extremely selfish.

    Gary, whether you can see the proof or not really doesn’t matter at this point. You’ll hear about it in the coming weeks. Still don’t know how bad it will get.

    If this group below is any representation of the greater public. We are in big, big trouble.

    https://bit.ly/36ecewB

    How many of them are going to be in the hospital risking the life of a frontline worker next week? They are a bunch of selfish pr1cks being lead by a very dangerous POTUS.

  151. 3b says:

    Boomer We can go back and forth on the education thing and which states are better, but in my opinion there are good school systems all over the country. This arrogance that ours are the best is just arrogance. Can’t tell you how many kids I have seen over the years go to University of Rhode Island, and Delaware, Ohio and many others ironically states not known for their primary school education systems. It’s ironic if you ask me. As for higher IQs perhaps, but I work with incredibly smart and talented people from all over the country. And we have an over abundance of self absorbed assholes in the greater nyc metro area. We really do need to get over ourselves in this part of the country.

  152. ExEssex says:

    Hard to beat this / cheap houses in Iowa
    Gorgeous woodwork:

    https://www.instagram.com/p/CAYIF_1BxuQ/?igshid=153uvl212nyxf

  153. njtownhomer says:

    I question the strength of the economy last year in 2019. They what the hell was freezing the bond market requiring FED opened a window for billions of dollars each day to open up. Also what made the gold spiked above $1400 last year, was it the demand or toyed interest rates.

    The fact that it started in 2001, but made worse in 2008 and became much much worse since late last year. Bond market was feeling insecurity, insolvency and waiting this bubble will pop up. Covid triggered it, but the gas was building up.

    Actually Obama years economy was feeling stronger. At least paying off the trillions of costs for wars and GFC Bush left over. Trade tensions were lower, we had significant technology leadership (still in semiconductors, computing and IT). People had more realistic jobs. Recent few years, anybody driving a car, shopping for someone else counted as employees, while not getting a sustainable wage.

  154. BoomerRemover says:

    BTW small business willing buyer willing seller multiples have compressed from 3-3.5 X EBITA to 2.5X and a solid 2X across the board in more hard hit service sectors.

    In a few months one may be able to shop out of the bargain bin aka “assets” section.

  155. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Have been across the country? We really are different here in NYC metro. How can you not understand that?

    Think of economics. If housing is cheap, what does it tell you? It’s sh!t and nobody wants it. Otherwise the market would drive up the pricing. For example, Florida. Yea, Florida is cheap, but any desirable area in Florida costs how much? Oh right, nyc prices or more. Apply this to any state.

    To sit here and not acknowledge nj as different is nuts. Burlington county and Bergen county….polar opposites and the real estate reflects it. But continue thinking there is some magical place where you can get cheap housing while having neighbors you want to interact with and a school where your child doesn’t have to mingle with people you are not really fond of. Going to private school doesn’t help as they are all undesirables.

    A cheap location doesn’t attract winners. I’m sorry..

    3b says:
    May 19, 2020 at 1:25 pm
    Boomer We can go back and forth on the education thing and which states are better, but in my opinion there are good school systems all over the country. This arrogance that ours are the best is just arrogance. Can’t tell you how many kids I have seen over the years go to University of Rhode Island, and Delaware, Ohio and many others ironically states not known for their primary school education systems. It’s ironic if you ask me. As for higher IQs perhaps, but I work with incredibly smart and talented people from all over the country. And we have an over abundance of self absorbed assholes in the greater nyc metro area. We really do need to get over ourselves in this part of the country.

  156. BoomerRemover says:

    Pumps,
    You remind me of that one guy who is fascinated by that which is obvious to others and shouts it from the rooftops to a room full of disinterested people.

    Seeing as how you literally made 3b’s argument – and now that’s he’s not addressing you directly – you likely won’t hear from him. Fingers crossed.

    Living on a through street next to a state worker with neo-jersey columns ain’t exactly living to the fullest.

  157. JCer says:

    Essex, I’ve been to Iowa….no thanks. My wife’s has family out there. That house looks like a dump as well. You have to consider what a move in ready home costs. I really shudder to think that I’m agreeing with pumps but when you go elsewhere the places you’d want to live are more expensive than you’d think. I mean down in South Florida, if you want to live in Palm Beach county or the Miami area you’ll quickly find anything that isn’t ghetto or somewhat heinous is somewhat expensive and the taxes are no bargain. That being said if I didn’t have children and could work it out there are some really nice areas offering a good lifestyle, arguably better than the NYC metro area for 8-10 months of the year.

    Texas is largely the same, if you don’t want to live in the middle of nowhere, established neighborhoods are not that cheap. Probably not at north jersey levels but close, biggest thing is newer housing and MUCH lower taxes.

    North Jersey housing costs(outside of the hudson coast) haven’t changed in MANY years. I mean I don’t think my house is close to it’s 2003 price and that seems somewhat consistent. House prices in North Jersey seem to be at 2004-2005 levels or less. What is insane is property taxes, which is why pricing hasn’t moved. Given ridiculously low rates, the tax aspect is the issue for many buyers.

    On education, it is really bad in many states, yes there are outliers, certain districts that are good but overall education in the sunbelt is poor. It is a matter of spending, due to cost of living they can spend a lot less and still over decent education. The problem is the amount spend in some districts is a lot less than in the northern areas of the country.

  158. Fat F.uck Eddie says:

    4bd/2bth with a “2” handle is hard to beat if you’re WFH 3 days per week. There’s a number of houses in that Butler/Bloomingdale/Pompton are to be had. Put 10% down and you’re living under 2 grand per month on PITI:

    https://www.trulia.com/p/nj/bloomingdale/14-sunrise-ave-bloomingdale-nj-07403–2006429953?mid=0#lil-mediaTab

  159. Fat B@stard says:
  160. homeboken says:

    Re Covid case uptick: The only data that really matters is death per confirmed cases.

    We will never stop the spread of a virus. We may slow the spread, maintain hospital capacity and buy time to work up treatments/vaccines.

    But everyone should expect to be exposed to this virus, unless you plan on staying home for another year. That might be hard to hear for those with comorbidity concerns but what can we do?
    We did the quarantine thing for 10+ weeks. We bought as much time as we could. If you are high risk, you should stay home until the herd develops some immunity to this. But if you expect to live any normal type of life and not be exposed to Covid, I just don’t think that is possible.

  161. 3b says:

    Jcer You make some valid points throughout your post. But to simply write off almost the entire country with the exception of the nyc metro area as being horrible places to live and educate and raise your family is stupid and arrogant. That criticism is not leveled at you but at some that feel that way. It’s the BS people tell themselves to justify high prices and property taxes, and the collapsing infrastructure and all the rest. My point earlier on the schools and colleges where is so many n j high school graduates is simply this people scream about our superior education system, yet there kids go to state schools where the primary education is deemed inferior. Some will say with aid it could be cheaper, I didn’t see that when my kids were going to college. But that’s not the point, you pay high property taxes for a superior school system only to turn around and your kids to state schools where the overwhelming majority of the students come from the same supposed inferior school systems. Makes no sense.

  162. Yesi Merino says:

    Of course not everybody is going to stay home and follow the rules being outside. Humans are programmed to socialize and have human contact, so staying home for months is going to cause “cabin fever” to some. I personally rather stay inside and dare not to be in a crowd.

  163. Libturd says:

    People need to spend some time in the rest of the country and the world. And if schools are so good around here, why is customer service so incredibly sh1tty around here.

  164. Libturd, the Master Beta says:

    The uptick even in Jersey is clear.

    I know it sucks, but dollars to donuts, the rest of the country is about to experience what the tri-state has.

    I don’t agree with everything Homeboken says, but he’s right about thinking that there really is no way for life to go on normally without risking infection.

    Hope everyone gets through okay.

  165. Hold my beer says:

    Blue ribbon nj towns are a cult. How else can their residents rationalize paying 450k with 12k in taxes for a pos 1,600 sq ft house built before their parents were born and poorly maintained

    Nothing symbolizes haughtyville New Jersey better than a rotting house with multiple 50k cars in the driveway.

  166. 3b says:

    Lib: Yes they really do. I am amazed at how many supposedly sophisticated people in this area have traveled so little and almost never overseas. The Bahamas and Mexico don’t count!!

  167. 3b says:

    Hold Well said!

  168. 3b says:

    Sidewalks in my town have never been so bad. Apparently the town does not go after the homeowners any more to repair them.

  169. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Have you gone to these cheap locations? I have. If they are nice they are either more expensive than north jersey prices or filled with old retirees. Those are the nice places. If you look where the 20’s to 40’s live in these “cheap” locations, they are trash people. I don’t want to mingle or live amongst them. They look at me like I’m a “city boy” “yuppie”…blah blah. I look at them as trash, your typical Homer Simpson. Go get drunk off your cheap beer and look down on anyone that drinks a higher class beer. They don’t want to be around me and I don’t want to be around them.

  170. Hold my beer says:

    Not everyone dreams of living on a highway in jersey

  171. Hold my beer says:

    3b

    I live in a town with a great school district, housing is still affordable enough that teachers can afford to live in the district.. Amazing how many people in jersey can’t comprehend how nice and affordable nice areas in Texas, the south and midwest are compared to New Jersey and think its only full of local trash or losers who couldn’t make it in New York and California.

  172. ExEssex says:

    Today was a gooood day.
    Got a job offer & a set of Ping Be Cu’s.

  173. Libturd says:

    This is where my sister used to live. Property taxes are half what ours are. Real estate, a solid 1/3rd cheaper. Schools? Mason High is ranked 400th in the country. Last I looked, Wayne Hills was closer to 2,400.

    Cincy, a really safe clean city is 20 minutes away. Two major airports too. Want to save money? Cross the river into Kentucky and shop there.

  174. JCer says:

    I’d argue that within the different MSA’s housing tends to track the income and overall wealth. If you want to live in the neighborhoods with the doctors, lawyers or executives it will not be cheap, they will also have the best school districts. It’s all a matter of income level and here dual income families making 250k-400k are fairly common. That is probably not the case in a lot of other MSA’s. Barrier to entry for a home around here is 500k+, that is probably 250-300 in a different MSA where people earn less. At the higher end the cost delta isn’t a linear relationship. Higher end housing trades at a bigger premium in the cheaper MSA’s.

    To the point of Pumps I could probably get my million dollar home for 750k in a different market. Taxes would probably be 12k instead of 30k. The wife and I earn 15 to 20% more than we would in a different market, so instead of 400k total it would be 320k. So yes I get dinged 18k on property taxes and everything else but what does an extra 80k in income mean, 250k on a 30 year mortgage is maybe 10k. So the way I look at it my housing cost is at most 30k higher than it would be in a cheaper market but I make 80k more per year because of the market. Compared to the people I went to college with only those who went to major markets make the kind of money we do. Those in TX, NC, midwest are all earning 30-50k less for similar jobs. That being said they have less stress, work fewer hours and still have good quality of life….

  175. Bystander says:

    “House prices in North Jersey seem to be at 2004-2005 levels or less.”

    Yep and it feels like a tomb purchase for those buyers (including myself). My parents bought in Morris County in 1972 for $35k and sold for $157k in 1987. Where is our run up? Basically, most of suburbia is toast except for those who bought before 2000.

  176. JCer says:

    Bystander we aren’t getting it. As I was saying about income levels. The people I know who went to CA. Are making bigger salaries, housing on the other hand is at another level. Income is going the wrong way here, property taxes are eating any gains. The quality jobs are under assault and are being replaced by H1B visa holders…..

  177. chicagofinance says:

    Monmouth County on the outer fringe of commutable can net you $700,000 with 12-14K taxes. $1M is probably closer to $20k, but mostly because north of $750K, the market is so dead that there is a ton of house you can get, but you need to rent it from the town.

    JCer says:
    May 19, 2020 at 5:31 pm
    I’d argue that within the different MSA’s housing tends to track the income and overall wealth. If you want to live in the neighborhoods with the doctors, lawyers or executives it will not be cheap, they will also have the best school districts. It’s all a matter of income level and here dual income families making 250k-400k are fairly common. That is probably not the case in a lot of other MSA’s. Barrier to entry for a home around here is 500k+, that is probably 250-300 in a different MSA where people earn less. At the higher end the cost delta isn’t a linear relationship. Higher end housing trades at a bigger premium in the cheaper MSA’s.

    To the point of Pumps I could probably get my million dollar home for 750k in a different market. Taxes would probably be 12k instead of 30k. The wife and I earn 15 to 20% more than we would in a different market, so instead of 400k total it would be 320k. So yes I get dinged 18k on property taxes and everything else but what does an extra 80k in income mean, 250k on a 30 year mortgage is maybe 10k. So the way I look at it my housing cost is at most 30k higher than it would be in a cheaper market but I make 80k more per year because of the market. Compared to the people I went to college with only those who went to major markets make the kind of money we do. Those in TX, NC, midwest are all earning 30-50k less for similar jobs. That being said they have less stress, work fewer hours and still have good quality of life….

  178. Walking says:

    I’m not sure why many of you still sheltering, just passed grims store and the park near there had high school football camp going this afternoon. Looked like Passaic kids and coaches had them running drills a good 40 of them sprinting in pairs and doing line drills. As for my neighborhood I see parents dropping off kids fir okay dates all afternoon, both street basketball hoops have groups of 4-8 kids playing .

  179. 3b says:

    Jcer Work fewer hours, less stress, and a better quality of life, shouldn’t that be what it’s all about?

  180. 3b says:

    Hold my beer: Yeah that’s the attitude a lot of people in this area have about the rest of the country, all low life, dirty white trash, missing teeth, and married to their first cousin. Incredibly ignorant, but the BS they use to justify living in a 450k POS cape with 12k in taxes.

  181. 3b says:

    Hold And they probably don’t lie about their professions either.

  182. The Great Pumpkin says:

    According to Fried, ”[Bezos] said people who were right a lot of the time were people who often changed their minds […]. It’s perfectly healthy — encouraged, even — to have an idea tomorrow that contradicted your idea today.”

    Bezos went on to explain that the smartest people he’s observed were always “revising their understanding, reconsidering a problem they thought they’d already solved. They’re open to new points of view, new information, new ideas, contradictions, and challenges to their own way of thinking,” Fried recalls.

    In short, smart people (a.k.a. those who are “right a lot”), change their minds — a lot.

    Nothing is definite

    When asked what trait signified someone who was “wrong a lot” of the time, Fried says Bezos’ answer was “the tendency to be obsessed with details that only support one point of view. If someone can’t climb out of the details, and see the bigger picture from multiple angles, they’re often wrong most of the time.”

    https://www.cnbc.com/2019/03/12/amazon-billionaire-jeff-bezos-explains-why-the-smartest-people-change-their-minds-often.html?__source=facebook%7Cmakeit

  183. Walking says:

    3b , every time I go to a Broadway show I end sitting near someone from Midwest or south. Compared to the locals from NJ, the outsiders are often dressed to the nines with not hint of Beverley hillbilly in them. NJ locals tend to go in sweatshirts and jeans. My trips through the Carolinas to Florida outside of metro areas are the same. People tend to dress better compared to NJ.

    For what it’s worth my rentals in Florida are all paying on time and currently yield about $100 less per month compared to a Clifton rental. Taxes are 1/3 of NJ. My NJ rentals are about 30 days behind.

  184. The Great Pumpkin says:

    We are generalizing. You can find a nice town in any state. What I am pointing out to you is what goes for normal here is not normal there.

    For example, Wayne has a trailer park along the Passaic River across from Fairfield. Trash. Would that represent the norm for north jersey? No, so we don’t associate north jersey with trailer parks. Now if you go to one of these southern states, a lot of the areas are trailer parks. That’s the norm.

    Yet, somehow you think these other states have town after town of classy professionals. That’s a rarity, won’t find that in many places. North jersey has that. In north jersey, you are either rich or poor. There’s a lot more rich than poor. Most of the poor live in urban areas. Nj has it good, but this flies right over your head. You don’t appreciate it.

    3b says:
    May 19, 2020 at 6:22 pm
    Hold my beer: Yeah that’s the attitude a lot of people in this area have about the rest of the country, all low life, dirty white trash, missing teeth, and married to their first cousin. Incredibly ignorant, but the BS they use to justify living in a 450k POS cape with 12k in taxes.

  185. Glaring Light of Day says:

    “they are trash people. I don’t want to mingle or live amongst them.”

    Bwahahahahahaha! Hehe…hahahahahaha!

    Stop, please stop! Bwahhhhahahha! Hahahaha!

    Oh my….can’t breath…holy shinola…bwahhahahahahaha!

  186. Hold my beer says:

    I was voted King of my community cause I still have all my teeth and only have 3 toilets as planters in my front lawn.

  187. leftwing says:

    “I agree, it’s becoming less and less of a death sentence.”

    No, it’s not. And that is part of my issue with the idiot governors such as our own, the one across the river, and the one on the other coast with their ‘lockdown’ policies.

    I spent 45 minutes today on the phone with my mid-80s parents who have more co-morbidities than I have fingers and toes. They are considering a long postponed overnight drive to visit my sister when the governor ‘says it’s safe’ and lifts the lockdown shortly.

    There is no difference in their risk whether they drove two weeks ago, today, or two weeks from now. Just like there is no appreciable difference in risk among the the many closed businesses and Walmart and liquor stores.

    Contrary to these governors’ constant bleatings that they will be driven by ‘data and science’ their opening and closing proclamations have been, literally, random.

    Our Governor Idiot just approved golfing foursomes, rather than pairs. Whew. Good thing he considered that timing so closely to make an informed decision. Bet those 5,000+ dead nursing home seniors’ families are relieved.

    Anyone following these mandates rather than their own common sense is a fool.

    And, yeah, Lib…I have strong emotions about these people too. Pride.

    https://bit.ly/36ecewB

  188. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    With respect to the state administration, the political machine runs deep with political hires. When I was 24, one of my wife’s coworkers husbands had just finished his Masters in Public Administration. He was connected and immediately propelled to one the top positions of the Department of Health under Corzine. No science of medical background at all. When Corzine lost, they tried to move him every three months to hide him. Eventually Christie fired him. He immediately landed at some bigwig position at Horizon.

    He used to tell me about the few people above him in the Department of Health. Same deal. If I remember correctly, the top person was a Spanish major. It’s no different in any other position. That’s why Brett Schundler was commissioner of education. Health care professionals are not in charge here.

  189. 3b says:

    Hold: So no car or trucks on the front lawn or backyard? How about a fridge on the front porch to keep the long necks cold?

  190. Hold my beer says:

    3b

    I once was on the cover of better lawns and toilets Texas edition.

  191. ExEssex says:

    Perhaps this is more in line and you stay firmly NE.

    https://www.instagram.com/p/CAY5taOhXvb/?igshid=6dbcdg9ws7qg

  192. zaraza19 says:

    We see this billboard off route 301 in Florida. That’s the cut from Route 75 to 95 in North Florida. There is another further north of town….WALDO. Yep, that’s the name of the town. Now, Where’s Waldo?

    Hilarious.

  193. Hold my beer says:

    ExEssex

    Looks haunted. I like it.

  194. 3b says:

    Hold : Those toilet tanks make great planters!

  195. Libturd says:

    Left.

    You are absolutely right about everything you posted. The state governors are completely inconsistent and are terrible fearmongerers and are making dumb decisions. But running around without a mask is not about pride. It’s just plain stupid. When one of them die (and one will), they will regret their decision.

  196. Libturd says:

    Watched Hannity tonight.

    I see he has adopted the same immature habit of the president. That is, he gives everyone he dislikes a dumb nickname. In this case, it was Joyless Baher. It truly makes him look stupid, especially when the nicknames are far from clever. This, is of course as lame as the Set Your DVR message that he flashes on the screen every few minutes. But just when you thought it couldn’t get any dumber, a commercial comes on for the “reputation defender.”

    How can the right watch this crapola? I can’t watch Maddow or MSNBC at all due to the non-stop exaggeration and conjecture. But at least they don’t make up nicknames like a dumb 2nd grader.

    We really are a nation of morons.

    Pride!

  197. JCer says:

    Libturd, yes we have more than our fair share of morons in this country. I don’t know how half these people on the news networks have jobs. Hannity is cr*p, as is MSNBC, I frankly don’t know how anyone with a half a brain can stomach any of it.

    Essex, I like the house in Elmira much more, accept it is in Elmira. It looks pretty big, needs a better paint job on the outside, probably needs plumbing, electrical, hvac, etc that ruin could cost 400k by the time you get done brining it to modern standards. At the end of the day you are still in Elmira and there are no jobs or any conveniences anyone from the non-rural world knows.

    On the government, BRT, that confirms it and it all makes sense. It is like the Soviet Union, the only qualification needed is to be a good member of the party…..

  198. BoomerRemover says:

    May 18th – MRNA releases great news, cure just around the corner. Markets rocket, stock pops.

    May 19th – articles claim that positive release was not backed up by numbers of any substance or use to the scientific community, also…

    Kim Lorence H. Chief Financial Officer May 18 Option Exercise 12.45 241,000 3,000,944 1,443,510 May 19 05:04 PM

    Kim Lorence H. Chief Financial Officer May 18 Sale 82.12 241,000 19,791,361 1,202,510 May 19 05:04 PM

  199. Libturd says:

    We are a nation of morons.

  200. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    I know someone that regularly appears om Fox News as a middle east and terrorist expert. The kid was my brothers best friend in HS. He read a few books and called into right wing radio stations. He has no qualifications. I don’t even think he finished his community college. Nice enough guy but puts on the obnoxious blow hard act and talks outa his behind when the cameras go on. It’s all nonsense.

    He actually at some point started visiting the middle east and has a popular youtube channel now. He actually does his homework and develops his opinions based on what the network wants to hear. Opinion for hire…that’s all the game is.

    Take a look at Megyn Kelly. Fox News personality converted to left wing heroine and reconverted to right wing heroine all in 3 years time.

  201. leftwing says:

    “…finished his Masters in Public Administration. He was connected and immediately propelled to one the top positions of the Department of Health…”

    “It is like the Soviet Union, the only qualification needed is to be a good member of the party…”

    Not quite as bad but close.

    One of my majors was Government (the department thought the title of Poli Sci was beneath them). I know these types well.

    Outside of the mainstream and commercial pre-law folks, the students who actually study and major in Government for government are a scary bunch. You would not have given them nor their opinions the time of day on campus.

    Yet they are the people now in charge. And you are following their judgment with regard to life and death health decisions.

  202. leftwing says:

    And in our latest example of “why in the world would you obey Governor Idiot”….

    Car dealerships yesterday were abruptly given permission to open for in-person sales today.

    The strong science underlying this decision is….strangely absent.

    Strangely present….Memorial Day weekend is a huge sales event for dealerships who have a strong lobby while sales tax from vehicles are significant revenue for the state.

    Yeah….continue to follow Governor Idiot’s covid19 orders.

    Because, y’know, he has your best interest in mind. Guided by science and facts of course.

  203. leftwing says:

    LOL, weekend is going to have some nice fireworks.

    Nice weather. NYC beach closure. City residents gaited.

    Watching the morning news Nassau (Jones Beach) just went to resident only in an emergency vote last night. County Administrator on TV blames “the reckless action of Mayor DeBlasio in closing NYC beaches this weekend”.

  204. grim says:

    You see the battle brewing with Sweeney saying campgrounds could open? Governor smacked that down.

  205. grim says:

    Thank goodness golf foursomes are permitted now.

    What’s the logic behind calling that out so specifically?

    With all the effort invested in reopening golf courses – two separate announcements even – you would think they somehow make up some substantial part of the NJ economy. Bunch of rich guys miss playing golf I guess, so it’s top of mind in those circles. Sure seems an inordinate amount of thought was invested in that very specific activity.

    Just like why barber shops and salons aren’t being actively discussed, but somehow all the folks on the press conferences appear to have fresh haircuts.

  206. Crushednjmillenial says:

    The house linked below is my personal best example of re-locating from nj for a better life. I’ve traveled throughout much of the US on business and have seen everyday areas of a lot of our larger cities (rather than just the main tourist attractions).

    $450k
    $10k annual prop tax
    5 bed, 3 bath give or take
    Built in late 1990’s, and still has curb appeal
    Richardson, TX
    Strong Dallas metro economy
    Dallas is our country’s 4th or 5th biggest metro area (nyc, la, chi, maybe SF)
    Lots of huge office buildings in Richardson on the commercial streets
    Commutable to Downtown Dallas
    Easy shopping access (retail and great restaurants)

    Anything similar to this in Bergen County would be $600k+ and $20k+ on prop tax, more or less

    https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/3510-Bradford-Dr_Richardson_TX_75082_M73374-00254?view=qv

  207. Bystander says:

    “left wing heroine and reconverted to right wing heroine all in 3 years time”

    So did the Orange clown sitting at 1600. The quotes are sitting right there.

  208. Walking says:

    Grim good point regarding golf. Same point could be made for 2 on 2 basketball, especially if we limit both activities to those under 30 as it’s for their own good. My guess not so many donors from the urban playground lining mc Murphy’s pockets.

  209. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    I am fully aware Trump identified as a Democrat years ago. I don’t care. Tariffs are the single best tool that the labor market as a whole gains bargaining power and we stop and outward flow of wealth out of the country. As far as I’m concerned, this is the single most important issue with respect to the wealth and now health of the country. Trump single handedly turned the entire Republican base from free market free trading ideologues into supporters of tariffs.

    I’ll gladly vote for anyone that adopts the same policy instead of the pro free trade pro China crap we’ve witnessed the past 3 years.

  210. chicagofinance says:

    It is so disappointing that Trump is such a moron. We need to beat the sh!t out of China, and when we are done, we should keep flogging a dead horse. Fcuk that entire government into the ground. Cause an uprising there. Coup d’Etat against Xi.

    Trump in his infantile, train wreck way has that major issue identified. He was early and on target, but not disciplined.

    I don’t trust anyone else to create the sufficient fear factor in Xi. The Europeans are pure empty suits. The Democrats can’t be trusted, because they are such ideologues. As soon as they get power, they will focus on reinstating the ACA and their agenda of leftist nonsense. China is the threat.

    Here is a novel opinion. I think CCP is so culturally distant from the rest of the world, that they actually think their Communist propaganda has any type of resonance. They are too superficial in their understanding of Western culture. They think Trump is diminishing U.S. dominance. Horsesh!t. But again, Trump – the bumbling fool he is – is actually beneficial for the U.S. because he manages to dupe China into thinking they can gain influence in the world and Asia amidst a vacuum created by Trump. They are mistaken, but they won’t have the blowback until 2021 or later. Hopefully, they overplay a hand that they don’t even have.

  211. chicagofinance says:

    Golf is a socially distant sport. You can be near people, but there is no requirement to do so. The only common touch point is the pin. Basketball is not.

    Walking says:
    May 20, 2020 at 10:02 am
    Grim good point regarding golf. Same point could be made for 2 on 2 basketball, especially if we limit both activities to those under 30 as it’s for their own good. My guess not so many donors from the urban playground lining mc Murphy’s pockets.

  212. JCer says:

    Here’s my take on Trump, he is absurd, ridiculous, uncouth, rude, a real a$$hole. Yet his take on certain issues is closer to correct than many other pols. China has absolutely become a massive threat, in the last 20 years we not only let them but active aided in them in their rise. The XI government is involved in crimes against Humanity and yet we give them a seat at the table, might as well be 1939…..

    The country needs to have borders, taking immigrants we should welcome those with qualifications or wealth, the notion of race based or nationality based quotas is ridiculous as is the lottery(even though I know people who won the green card lottery). Repealing regulation is needed, there is so much of it on the books no one even knows whats there. I’d argue Trump takes things too far but there is a basis to it.

    Also unlike Obama, I’d argue Trumps global attitude is positive. It illustrates the supremacy of the US, he is an awful person yet they still need to grovel at his feet. Other world leaders don’t like the fact that they have to kiss his a$$, yet they do it anyway.

    The path forward on China is taking away their markets, without a place to sell goods their centrally planned economy falls apart. They have made roads into Europe, we need to get Europe to close out China, when we closed off some of our markets they moved further into Europe, dumping cheap goods. We need to coordinate and target this together. Unfortunately there is a lot of stuff made in China that changing the supply chain overnight is impossible. Limiting China to low-end manufacturing is key and then trying to diversify away from China. The higher up the value chain the more likely they steal the process and compete. Make no mistake Huwei didn’t just appear overnight, the PLA has been steal IP, they access to every factory and can examine every product and how it’s made. They fleeced Apple, Samsung, et al to get their technology. Notice TSMC won’t put their current process on Chinese soil, because they know a state owned enterprise would pop up and compete with them using their own technology stolen with the aid of the PLA.

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