September Beige Book

From the WSJ:

Consumer-Spending Slowdown Weighs on Economy
Fed’s ‘Beige Book’ Cites Job Losses; Prices to Stabilize
By KELLY EVANS
September 4, 2008; Page A4

Consumer spending across the country is weakening, a roundup of reports from the Federal Reserve shows, while price pressures continue to plague a wide swath of industries.

The Fed’s “beige book,” a survey of economic conditions from the 12 regional Fed banks released every six weeks, shows that economic activity has weakened across most of the country since late July.

Eric Rosengren, president of the Federal Reserve Bank of Boston, expressed his concern about the economic outlook in a speech Wednesday. “Over the course of this summer it became clear that the economic headwinds have not subsided as hoped,” he said.

Businesses, according to the beige book, reported a notable slowdown in consumer spending, the largest driver of U.S. economic growth. That suggests the third quarter is off to a rough start. On a quarterly basis, consumer spending hasn’t declined since the 1990-91 recession; forecasters caution it could now do so because of a shaky labor market and ongoing weakness in the housing and credit markets.

The report also found that labor-market conditions were weak in most regions of the country and that wage increases were moderate at best, adding to the strain on consumers. The unemployment rate this year has risen to 5.7% from 4.9% as nearly half a million jobs have been lost, according to the Labor Department. The latest employment report will be released on Friday and is expected to show further job losses and perhaps another rise in the unemployment rate.

Commercial real-estate activity, which includes office and retail space, has for the past year helped offset the crumbling housing market, but it is increasingly showing signs of strain. The beige book shows that commercial real-estate activity has “moved down or remained weak in all Districts except Dallas” since late July. Many regions noted softening demand, a decline in leasing activity, rising vacancies and slowing construction activity.

From the Federal Reserve:

Beige Book, Second District — New York

The Second District’s economy has shown signs of stabilizing since the last report, though not in all sectors. Manufacturers report that business activity has steadied in recent weeks, after weakening for a number of months, and factories continue to report fairly widespread increases in both input costs and selling prices. Contacts at non-manufacturing firms generally also report some stabilization in business conditions but continue to indicate modest declines in employment. Consumer confidence was reported to be at record lows in July. Still, retail sales remained on or close to plan in July and early August, and were up slightly from a year earlier; moreover, tourism activity in New York City has firmed. Housing markets have been mixed but generally softer, and office markets have slackened. Finally, bankers report weakening demand for both residential and commercial mortgages, widespread declines in refinancing activity, continued tightening in credit standards, and increasing delinquency rates on home mortgages.

Housing markets in the District have been steady to weaker. Manhattan’s rental market has slackened somewhat: average asking rents were reported to be running 2 to 4 percent lower in July and August than a year earlier, and the rental vacancy rate, though still below 2 percent, is reported to have climbed noticeably over the past year. A major appraisal firm reports some further softening in Manhattan’s co-op and condo market: sales activity has been increasingly sluggish, with resale prices flat to weaker. A growing number of deals are said to be falling through, due to difficulty in getting financing–largely at the middle of the market. The sales market has weakened more noticeably in Brooklyn and Queens, as well as in eastern Long Island.

On a more positive note, a contact monitoring New Jersey’s housing industry reports that the resale market has shown signs of stabilizing, though at a weak level, especially for single-family homes. Inventories of unsold existing homes have declined in northern New Jersey, as many discretionary sellers have taken their homes off the market and other sellers have become more negotiable. Both prices and sales volume have leveled off, though they remain lower than a year ago. Concerns over foreclosures are noted, though their absolute number is described as relatively low.

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332 Responses to September Beige Book

  1. grim says:

    From the Courant:

    Brokers Accused Of Fraud

    A former Wall Street broker pleaded not guilty Wednesday to charges he and a colleague duped investors into purchasing more than $1 billion in high-risk securities by making it look as though the trades were protected by the federal government.

    An indictment unsealed in federal court in Brooklyn said because the securities actually were tied to subprime mortgages, Eric Butler and Julian Tzolov stood to pocket higher commissions. The scheme was exposed when the subprime market collapsed.

    “The defendants’ fraudulent misrepresentations and bait-and-switch tactics saddled investors with unknown risks they did not bargain for,” U.S. Attorney Benton Campbell said in announcing the case against the former Credit Suisse Securities brokers.

    Butler, 36, was released on $2.5 million bail following his arraignment on securities fraud, wire fraud and conspiracy charges. The Bulgarian-born Tzolov, 35, was out of the country but expected to return and surrender on the same charges.

  2. grim says:

    From CNN/Money:

    National City Offers Customers Cash To Cut Equity Lines

    National City Corp. (NCC), which is among the U.S. banks hit hardest by the subprime crisis, is trying to reduce its exposure to some home loans by offering customers cash to close their untapped home equity lines, the Financial Times reported.

    The bank is offering to waive closure fees and write customers a $200 check to close “open-ended” home equity lines – which are committed but as yet undrawn – the FT reported on its Web site late Wednesday, citing National City.

    The program in essence buys back the borrower’s right to access the line and reduces the bank’s exposure to lending money against houses that have fallen in value, the FT said.

    National city said customers have so far been “responding well” to the program, the newspaper said.

  3. Tom says:

    No surprise spending is falling. So many people didn’t have money to spend, just credit. The tighter credit market coupled with lower incomes, job losses an uncertain future… Now’s not the time to go out and spend like there’s no tomorrow..

  4. grim says:

    From Newsday:

    New state subprime lending reform law now in effect

    On Labor Day many provisions in the state’s new subprime lending reform law kicked in, but some protections apply to homeowners in general.

    In lenders’ letters notifying nonsubprime borrowers that foreclosure proceedings will be started, lenders must now advise homeowners to consult an attorney or Legal Aid. The notice must also say that nonprofits and government agencies are available to discuss options and negotiate with lenders. It must say that information is available from the New York State Banking Department. In addition, the letter must warn against foreclosure prevention scams.

    In comparison, subprime borrowers must get preforeclosure notices at least 90 days before the lenders begin to take action. The letters must tell them to consider going to housing counseling and list at least five nonprofit counselors in the borrowers’ region. Those counselors must be on the list of nonprofits approved by the federal Department of Housing and Urban Development or the New York State Division of Housing and Community Renewal.

    The law also attempts to deter foreclosure prevention scams. Distressed-property consultants must have written contracts before performing any services for the homeowners and cannot charge or accept fees before services are completed. Also, such consultants cannot accept power of attorney from homeowners, except in limited circumstances. Homeowners have the right to cancel the consulting contracts within five business days of both parties’ agreeing to the contract.

    Several restrictions also have been placed on subprime loans. Lenders will no longer be able to charge prepayment penalties and offer teaser rates of less than six months. “Loan flipping” – when loans are refinanced without any tangible benefit to the borrower – will be illegal. Also, lenders will have to put taxes and insurance in escrow.

  5. grim says:

    From Globe and Mail:

    Subprime fallout not over: HSBC

    There is more pain to come as the U.S. subprime mortgage crisis continues to wend its way through the world’s economy, says the chairman of HSBC Holdings PLC.

    “I don’t think we’re out of it yet, that’s for sure,” Stephen Green, who is also chairman of the British Bankers’ Association, said in an interview.

    London-based HSBC was one of the first banks to sound the alarm on the subprime crisis in early 2007, with the news that it was boosting provisions for souring U.S. home loans. That has given Mr. Green a front-row seat for the unfolding financial saga.

    There have been some positive signs in the U.S. economy lately, including reasonably strong growth, but that does not mean that the bottom has been reached, he said.

    “It’s a long way from saying that therefore things have turned, or that there’s a light at the end of the tunnel, let alone that there’s going to be a rapid bounce back.

    “I think the best assumption is that economic conditions both in America, and also in Europe, where there’s considerable weakness in a number of economies, are going to be difficult for the rest of this year and for much of next year.”

  6. grim says:

    From the Philly Inquirer:

    GMAC unit to close offices, cut 5,000 jobs

    GMAC Financial Services subsidiary Residential Capital L.L.C., of Fort Washington, said yesterday that the housing slump was forcing it to eliminate 5,000 jobs in its mortgage operations.

    The cuts – starting tomorrow with loan officers in GMAC Mortgage branches – will hit 60 percent of the lender’s workforce, including 168 in the Philadelphia region, where Residential Capital will continue employing 1,408, spokeswoman Jeannine Bruin said.

    “While these actions are extremely difficult, they are necessary to position ResCap to withstand this challenging environment,” the company’s chairman and chief executive officer, Tom Marano, said in a news release.

    he job cuts at ResCap will be swift, with 3,000 employees receiving pink slips this month, and an additional 2,000 expected to lose their jobs by the end of the year.

    ResCap last year eliminated 5,000 jobs, including 270 in Cherry Hill, Fort Washington and Horsham. The latest cuts would reduce overall employment at ResCap to roughly 3,300, from 14,000 in early 2007.

    Since the beginning of last year, financial companies have reported the elimination of 1,600 jobs in the Philadelphia region, based on notices to state departments of labor.

    Some of ResCap’s cuts will come from the closure of its 200 GMAC Mortgage retail offices. Locally, GMAC Mortgage has offices in Philadelphia, Marlton, Horsham, Wayne and Greenfield, Del.

  7. grim says:

    From the Record:

    Lawmakers press Corzine on Xanadu bailout

    Leading Republican lawmakers pressed Governor Corzine today for details on his administration’s private interest in Xanadu, the massive Meadowlands venture plucked from bankruptcy in 2006 following Corzine’s intercession.

    The Republicans, in a pointed letter to the governor, said the administration has failed to allay concerns that the Xanadu bailout personally benefited Corzine’s former top economic adviser, former Goldman Sachs partner Gary D. Rose.

    Both Rose and Corzine held a stake in Dune Capital when the private hedge fund emerged among a consortium of investors seeking to buy out Xanadu’s original owner, the Mills Corp. State documents show that Rose at the time also had substantial holdings in Goldman Sachs, which stood to lose more than $1 billion it had loaned the ailing Mills.

    “That Mr. Rose … was the architect of the bailout of Mills by a group that included Dune gives us pause,” said the letter, co-signed by Assembly Republican Leader Alex DeCroce and Senate Republican Leader Tom Kean Jr. “It … creates the appearance of a potential conflict of interest.”

  8. grim says:

    From the Record:

    Mortgage woes still hurting Hovnanian

    Hovnanian Enterprises Inc., one of North Jersey’s biggest homebuilders, posted its eighth straight quarterly loss after nine years of gains as buyers found it more difficult to secure financing.

    The loss for the three months ended July 31 widened to $202.5 million, or $2.67 cents a share, from $77.9 million, or $1.27, a year earlier, Hovnanian said today in a statement. Revenue slid to $716.5 billion from $1.13 billion.

    Hovnanian and other homebuilders are struggling to sell homes in the third year of the worst housing slump in a quarter century as financing gets tougher for potential buyers. Three- quarters of lending banks tightened credit for prime borrowers in the second quarter, according to the Federal Reserve, and 23 percent fewer home loans will be issued in 2008 compared with last year, the Mortgage Bankers Association said.

  9. grim says:

    From Bloomberg:

    U.K. August Home Prices Plunge the Most in 25 Years

    U.K. house prices plunged at the fastest annual pace in at least a quarter century in August as banks withheld finance for new homes and consumers lost confidence in the economy, HBOS Plc said.

    The average cost of a home dropped 12.7 percent to 174,178 pounds ($311,000) from the same month a year earlier, Britain’s largest mortgage lender said in a statement today. That’s the biggest drop since the series started in 1983. On the month, prices declined 1.8 percent.

    The housing slump threatens to push the country into its first recession since the early 1990s and Prime Minister Gordon Brown this week suspended a tax on some property purchases in an attempt to revive the market. While the fastest inflation in more than a decade will probably keep the Bank of England from cutting interest rates today, the economic downturn may force them to act later this year.

    “There’s still downward pressure on the market,” said Martin Ellis, chief economist at HBOS, in an interview. “There’s pressure from household finances and the economy slowing down. Though we’re not expecting a cut from the Bank of England today, there is likely to be something before the end of the year.”

  10. Tom says:

    “where’s the doom and gloom?”

    Anyone else think It’s only a flesh wound when they read that.

    NJ’s largest home building Hovnanian Enterprises has had 8 straight quarters of losses. But I guess if you can find a handful of houses that are selling above 2005 prices it balances out huh?

    Some people just can’t read the writing on the wall from everything out there. I can almost picture Frank saying “I move for no man”.

    Banks don’t seem to have a rosey outlook on the future either as 2 more auctions at last week’s Bergen County foreclosure auction went for well below judgment and peak prices again.

  11. grim says:

    From MarketWatch:

    Toll Brothers swings to 3rd-quarter loss; revenue off 34%

    Toll Brothers Inc., the Horsham, Pa., luxury-home builder, swung to a fiscal third-quarter loss from a year-earlier profit on 34% lower revenue. For the quarter ended July 31, the loss was $29.3 million, or 18 cents a share, compared with net income of $26.5 million, or 16 cents, in the year-earlier period. Excluding write-downs, Toll earned 35 cents a share in the latest period. Revenue fell to $797.7 million from $1.21 billion. Third-quarter net contracts — after cancellations — totaled 812 homes valued at $469.9 million. The figures are down 27% in units and 35% in dollars from the year-earlier period. Toll said that buyers canceled 195 contracts in the quarter, the lowest figure in nine quarters.

  12. Tom says:

    grim, 10 in mod.

    Is 3 links too many? I know it wasn’t for bad language since I didn’t say neet. :)

  13. SG says:

    Credit Suisse: Home price declines likely until late ’09

    The report, using two separate methods of predicting home price trends, says both methods “point to home prices moving back in line with past historical ‘equilibrium’ levels in 12 to 18 months…” The report notes that housing prices could “overshoot” their equilibrium levels, and fall for even longer than 12 to 18 months, in which case, “‘cheap’ housing is still about two years away.”

  14. Tom says:

    kettle1 et al from yesterday,

    That video of the repub talking heads bashing Palin was a riot.

    You know it’s going to be blamed on the liberal media for tricking them into broadcast how they really felt and not the message they were supposed to send.

    Sad that the only way to get “fair and balanced” news is when the people talking don’t think they’re being heard.

  15. SG says:

    An enterprising Realtor in Midland, Texas, has come up with a new way to advertise a listing in West Texas.

    She’s letting prospective customers know that the property for sale was the first home of Laura and George Bush, where the couple started their married life together. Listed for $239,900, the home at 1405 W. Golf Course Road has 2,406 square feet and was built in 1976, one year before the Bushes moved in.

    With light airy spaces and a mostly concrete back patio (“low maintenance yard” is how Realtor Ruth Young puts it), the home is where the couple had their daughters (1981) and the future president ran for Congress, and lost, in 1978 (see photo above). It still boasts Laura Bush’s original drapes, and offers buyers a chance to cook on Laura Bush’s original cooktop stove.

    http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/laland/2008/09/what-239k-buys.html

  16. Tom says:

    SG,

    Regarding swinging below where house prices “should be” is very likely in this area.

    What I’ve noticed from making some of the charts for my site is that this area swings wider than the national average. This was evident in the 80’s/90’s bubble too. When we rise, we rise faster, the same is true when we fall. So when home prices in the area are “correct” I don’t think we would have hit bottom yet.

    Not all the charts I created made it to my site but you can see how Bergen County home prices over corrected last time and over shot the nation durring the boom in the last chart on that page.

  17. grim says:

    Is 3 links too many?

    Yessir

  18. Clotpoll says:

    SG (15)-

    So Bush owned a genuine W. Texas POS. That concrete backyard probably makes an excellent beach for scorpions.

  19. Clotpoll says:

    Just looked at Bush’s old house on Realtor.com. Damn.

    No wonder he drank.

  20. NJGator says:

    Clot previous thread – You on board to lead the ATF?

  21. chicagofinance says:

    Tom: did you see this?

    WSJ
    Open Mic Night at MSNBC
    September 3, 2008
    St. Paul

    Well, I just got mugged by the nature of modern media, and I wish it weren’t my fault, but it is. Readers deserve an explanation, so I’m putting a new top on today’s column and, with the forbearance of the Journal, here it is.

    Wednesday afternoon, in a live MSNBC television panel hosted by NBC’s political analyst Chuck Todd, and along with Republican strategist Mike Murphy, we discussed Sarah Palin’s speech this evening to the Republican National Convention. I said she has to tell us in her speech who she is, what she believes, and why she’s here. We spoke of Republican charges that the media has been unfair to Mrs. Palin, and I defended the view that while the media should investigate every quote and vote she’s made, and look deeply into her career, it has been unjust in its treatment of her family circumstances, and deserved criticism for this.

    When the segment was over and MSNBC was in commercial, Todd, Murphy and I continued our conversation, talking about the Palin choice overall. We were speaking informally, with some passion — and into live mics. An audio tape of that conversation was sent, how or by whom I don’t know, onto the internet. And within three hours I was receiving it from friends far and wide, asking me why I thought the McCain campaign is “over”, as it says in the transcript of the conversation. Here I must plead some confusion. In our off-air conversation, I got on the subject of the leaders of the Republican party assuming, now, that whatever the base of the Republican party thinks is what America thinks. I made the case that this is no longer true, that party leaders seem to me stuck in the assumptions of 1988 and 1994, the assumptions that reigned when they were young and coming up. “The first lesson they learned is the one they remember,” I said to Todd — and I’m pretty certain that is a direct quote. But, I argued, that’s over, those assumptions are yesterday, the party can no longer assume that its base is utterly in line with the thinking of the American people. And when I said, “It’s over!” — and I said it more than once — that is what I was referring to. I am pretty certain that is exactly what Todd and Murphy understood I was referring to. In the truncated version of the conversation, on the Web, it appears I am saying the McCain campaign is over. I did not say it, and do not think it. In fact, at an on-the-record press symposium on the campaign on Monday, when all of those on the panel were pressed to predict who would win, I said that I didn’t know, but that we just might find “This IS a country for old men.” That is, McCain may well win. I do not think the campaign is over, I do not think this is settled, and did not suggest, back to the Todd-Murphy conversation, that “It’s over.”

    However, I did say two things that I haven’t said in public, either in speaking or in my writing. One is a vulgar epithet that I wish I could blame on the mood of the moment but cannot. No one else, to my memory, swore. I just blurted. The other, more seriously, is a real criticism that I had not previously made, but only because I hadn’t thought of it. And it is connected to a thought I had this morning, Wednesday morning, and wrote to a friend. Here it is. Early this morning I saw Texas Senator Kay Bailey Hutchison, and as we chatted about the McCain campaign (she thoughtfully and supportively) I looked into her eyes and thought, Why not her? Had she been vetted for the vice presidency, and how did it come about that it was the less experienced Mrs. Palin who was chosen? I didn’t ask these questions or mention them, I just thought them. Later in the morning, still pondering this, I thought of something that had happened exactly 20 years before. It was just after the 1988 Republican convention ended. I was on the plane, as a speechwriter, that took Republican presidential nominee George H.W. Bush, and the new vice presidential nominee, Dan Quayle, from New Orleans, the site of the convention, to Indiana. Sitting next to Mr. Quayle was the other senator from that state, Richard Lugar. As we chatted, I thought, “Why him and not him?” Why Mr. Quayle as the choice, and not the more experienced Mr. Lugar? I came to think, in following years, that some of the reason came down to what is now called The Narrative. The story the campaign wishes to tell about itself, and communicate to others. I don’t like the idea of The Narrative. I think it is … a barnyard epithet. And, oddly enough, it is something that Republicans are not very good at, because it’s not where they live, it’s not what they’re about, it’s too fancy. To the extent the McCain campaign was thinking in these terms, I don’t like that either. I do like Mrs. Palin, because I like the things she espouses. And because, frankly, I met her once and liked her. I suspect, as I say further in here, that her candidacy will be either dramatically successful or a dramatically not; it won’t be something in between.

    But, bottom line, I am certainly sorry I blurted my barnyard ephithet, I am certainly sorry that someone abused my meaning in the use of the words, “It’s over”, and I’m sorry I didn’t have the Kay Baily Hutchison thought before this morning, because I could have written of it. There. Now: onto today’s column.

  22. chicagofinance says:

    grin unmod

  23. Clotpoll says:

    Gator (20)-

    Yes. But do I get to blow things up?

  24. HEHEHE says:

    My favorite Texas t-shirt:

    Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms, who’s bringing the chips?

  25. afe says:

    SG (15)

    At least all those people who bought over-priced POS ranches can hope to win an election sometime in the next 20-25 years.

  26. NJGator says:

    Clot 22 – Of course. Why else would we have put you in charge of the firearms?

  27. NJGator says:

    Gator’s favorite Texas quote:

    “You may all go to hell and I will go to Texas” (Davy Crockett)

    Stu got that on a T-Shirt and some BBQ as a souvenir from the recent trip that I took with the Lil Gator to Austin.

  28. microsoftyes says:

    google microsoft busy dog global mail all stay

  29. chicagofinance says:

    Clotpoll Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 7:55 am
    Gator (20)- Yes. But do I get to blow things up?

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IVtU8uz6Ox0

  30. Frank says:

    “Concerns over foreclosures are noted, though their absolute number is described as relatively low.”

    Is it a gloom and doom or just a typical slowdown?

  31. Tom says:

    I’ve been googling around trying to find out information about how much dubya bought that house for at the time and how much he was making. Don’t know if he was working as he was campaigning.

    When I was looking up information about about the initiatives intruduced to increase home ownership, I found a speech where Bill C recounted purchasing his first home.

    I still remember that home cost $20,500. It had about 1,100 square feet, and I had about a $17,500 mortgage on it, and my payments were about $176 a month, as I remember, something like that. And that was 20 years ago this fall that I signed that fortuitous contract. Those prices aren’t very much available anymore, but the objective for young people with their futures before them and their dreams fresh in their minds, starting out their families, to be able to own their home and to start a family in that way, that’s a worthy objective. Just as worthy today, and I would argue to you more important today than it was 20 years ago—more important today than it was 20 years ago.

    At the time he was a professor at the law school at the University of Arkansas. I couldn’t find what his salary was at the time. The national median income was around $40k and the median house price according the the US census was $32,500. A first year professor at the time in that area was probably making 30-40k based on a guess I’m just pulling out of thin air.

    Times sure have changed. It wasn’t until 1975 that the median house price exceeded the median yearly salary. And now we’re talking many multiples for the house price to income ratio. That just doesn’t seem right to me and we have a long way to go.

    By the way, I really enjoyed reading the full text of his speech. The recent sound bites they’ve had during his wife’s campaign really don’t do justice to his oratory abilities.

    Once in a while I catch some forums on those high numbered channels you can’t even remember the names of. There have been some very moving speeches and conversations from all sides that make me sad that all we hear from seem to be the boneheads that make it on tv.

    One of these was with former President BC. Two leather club chairs on a darkened stage of what I assumed was a university auditorium. The discussion was both moving and information which led my imagination to fill in the blanks of the rest of the scene. Tall finely crafted shelves filled with leather bound books stood in between the mahogony paneled walls. The smell of fine cigars and a hint of smoke from the fire which casts a warm glow to augment the light provided from the antique brass lamps. The sound of the crackling fire mixes in gracefully with the muted sound of ice hitting the side of the glass as it floats in a sea of aged single malt.

    Had the capabilities of the speaker been lower, it would have just been two dudes sitting on a dark stage.

    Now I’m trying to picture our current president in that setting and it just doesn’t work. I feel that even in his prepared speeches he cannot hold a candle to the ability of BC to engage and inspire even in his more “casual” conversations.

    There was a commedian that described the way President B spoke to us at press conferences. It ticked me off a bit because I felt he stole my line but was reassured knowing I wasn’t the only one that thought it. He said something like he’s not talking down to us, he’s just repeating it in the same manner as someone had to explain to him.

    When I see McC giving a sit down interview I get the sense he’s doing some sort of anger managment excercise inside his head to keep him from blowing up when he’s asked a question he doesn’t like. When that happens his tone becomes very rythmic and monotonous. I’d picture him rocking on a porch giving his interview and raising his fist when a neighborhood kid runs across his lawn to retrieve his ball.

    O might be good to watch years from now but I really don’t have much opinion on him. I think Biden would be the more interesting one. He gets a lot of flak for some of the things he says on the short bits he has in the media. But when he speaks he sounds like someone that knows and cares about what he’s talking about and doesn’t just regurgitate a list of talking points. Maybe you don’t agree with some of the things he says but it’s clear that he genuinely believes in it. He kind of started off his DNC speech awkward in my opinion but once he started talking about his mother and first wife’s accident his sincerity started coming through. The “more of the same” bit really wasn’t “him” in my opinion.

    How someone sounds may not seem important but communication is very important in leadership roles. You need to show you believe in what you say if you want others to believe it too. When we’re facing hard times, we need someone that can reassure us and explain to us their plan to change things.

    Ok went way off track… anyone know how much the home was purchased for? :)

  32. John says:

    That is great news, reminds me of the original S&L crisis where some banks credited you 102% for prepaying mortgages on their books. Hope we get some more deals.

    grim Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 6:21 am
    From CNN/Money:

    National City Offers Customers Cash To Cut Equity Lines

    National City Corp. (NCC), which is among the U.S. banks hit hardest by the subprime crisis, is trying to reduce its exposure to some home loans by offering customers cash to close their untapped home equity lines, the Financial Times reported.

    The bank is offering

  33. SG says:

    Tom: From your blog. Of the 30 properties scheduled for aution at the Bergen County Sheriff’s Foreclosure Auction last Friday, only 12 made it to the auction block. Two were sold and both of the highest bids were below the judgment and last sale price.

    Questions:
    Why 18 did not make it to Auction block?

    What is normally the reason, something is on Auction block but does not get sold?

    Just trying to understand foreclosure process. When I look at Somerset county sheriff’s website, there seems to be lot of properties that gets adjourned to next dates. Not sure why?

    http://www.somcosheriff.org/upcoming_sales.htm

    http://www.somcosheriff.org/sales.htm

  34. NJGator says:

    Nom – I hope you don’t have a problem with the executive decisions I’ve been making in your absence. I just thought it was my job as VP to run the place, in order to free up more of your time to do the important work of getting drunk and scoring hookers and blow.

  35. Fiddy Cents on the Dollar says:

    My Favorite Texas Quote:

    “If I owned both Texas and hell, I’d rent out Texas and live in hell.”

    General Philip Sheridan, Union Commander in Texas, 1867

  36. NJGator says:

    Fiddy 33 – Ha! There’s some merit to that quote. Texas in summer is hotter than hell. My 3 year old broke out in full body hives when we were there. I guess he’s allergic to the place.

  37. SG says:

    Grim – #32 in mod

  38. javaman says:

    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=alVIa8zYKQPQ&refer=home

    “The upper end is not immune to this decline,” said Kenneth Rosen, chairman of the University of California’s Fisher Center for Real Estate and Urban Economics in Berkeley. A worsening economy means “these people will have less wealth and they will spend less.”

    Vow!!!

    housing decline in full force.

  39. 3b says:

    #29 frank: Any proof yet that hosues in your neighborhood are selling for 10% over 2005? Just wondering, because the other day you said you had lots of examples.

  40. Renter says:

    #30
    Professors do not make that much today. The college where my husband worked offered someone from the midwest a position as a tenure track professor. They looked at homes with a realtor for a weekend and turned the job down on Monday.

  41. Fiddy Cents on the Dollar says:

    I think Frank is confusing “asking” price with “sold” price. A lot of people do that.

    And I’m sure there are plenty of examples of asking prices that are 10% over 2005.

    Closing Sale Price (minus any concessions) is what matters. That’s the Recorded Sales Price, not the rumour price that makes it’s way thru the neighborhood.

  42. Shore Guy says:

    The “Killa from Wasilla” did a great job last night and at least raises the possibility that Mc-Ca-in could win. If he does, it will prevent O from using a veto-proof congress to increase spending and making it more difficult for business to succeed on the world stage. If O wins, methinks the economy will take a bigger hit.

    Let’s see how M does tonight. If he focuses on reform, cutting the size and cost of government, and alternative energy, it should prove a success. If he focuses on the GWoT, he will have blown the opportunity.

  43. 3b says:

    339 fiddy: I have been trying to explain that cocnept to frank, but does not seem to get it. And he still insists he is right. He even claims to have lots of examples. I of course will offer my apologies, if he produces just one.

  44. Outofstater says:

    In some parts of the country, “Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms” refers to a convenience store, not a government agency.

  45. Secondary Market says:

    @40,
    the most notable part of the speech; her kid’s names:

    Track
    Bristol
    Willow
    Piper
    Trig

  46. Stu says:

    I watched the speech last night as well as Rudi’s liefest. She did better than I expected, but she was reading a teleprompter. It will be interesting to hear her debate.

    I was most disturbed by how often the networks focused on Trig. I swear we saw more of Trig than Sarah. That was pretty strange, no?

  47. Stu says:

    BI, remember those deceitful posts two days ago when you listed half of the tax numbers comparing O with M. Well fact check has looked into it and agrees with me about Republican’s attempts to deceive.

    http://www.factcheck.org/elections-2008/a_new_stitch_in_a_bad_pattern.html

    “Claims like these have led us to say that McCane’s campaign is engaging in a “pattern of deceit” when it comes to describing O’s tax plan. This most recent ad fits right into the template.”

  48. John says:

    The things I don’t like about Sarah have nothing to do with her qualifications, people with creepy trendy kid names scare me, think Moon Unit Zappa and Prince Jackson. Also she is throwing that down kid around like it is some type of toy, who exactly is going to be caring for that kid or helping her 17 year old daughter while she runs around DC. Plus it seems she is sticking her two older daughters with the job of raising the autistic kid. Also her husband is a creepy stage Mom. He is the one behind the scenes running things with his 90’s style goatee, almost like Sarah is his puppet. Plus she also belongs to some kooky type religion she was bapitized into at the age of 12.

    She is the type of women who might be great at her job but I certainly wouldn’t want to mix with that kook outside of work and being VP includes a lot of personal life intertwined with work. I am still going to vote for her as she has chuztpa and a lot of moxie. I don’t agree with half of what she says but at least she has an option and is not waffling like Obama.

  49. Secondary Market says:

    @44,
    the strangest part was the 3 year old holding the 3 month old licking her hand and giving the baby the ol’ wet willy hair style. did anyone else see that?

  50. John says:

    The things I don’t like about Sarah have nothing to do with her qualifications, people with creepy trendy kid names scare me, think Moon Unit Zappa and Prince Jackson. Also she is throwing that down kid around like it is some type of toy, who exactly is going to be caring for that kid or helping her 17 year old daughter while she runs around DC. Plus it seems she is sticking her two older daughters with the job of raising the autistic kid. Also her husband is a creepy stage Mom. He is the one behind the scenes running things with his 90’s style goatee, almost like Sarah is his puppet. Plus she also belongs to some kooky type religion she was bapitized into at the age of 12.

    She is the type of women who might be great at her job but I certainly wouldn’t want to mix with that kook outside of work and being VP includes a lot of personal life intertwined with work. I am still going to vote for her as she has chuztpa and a lot of moxie.

  51. Stu says:

    “I am still going to vote for her as she has chuztpa and a lot of moxie.”

    Is that your way of saying she is hot?

  52. Renter says:

    Stu

    Maybe the focus on Trig is a focus on her pro-life stance. The vast majority of women who find out they are carrying a child with down syndrome abort. She knew she had a down syndrome child and decided to keep the baby. It shows she not only talks the talk but walks the walk.

  53. John says:

    I hate to say it, but if sarah wins it will be four more years of bush in the whitehouse.

  54. John says:

    Nah, she says it as it is, I rather ride Cindy M anyday. Old John can’t handle that and I would love to treat her like a rented car on spring break.

    Stu Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 9:36 am
    “I am still going to vote for her as she has chuztpa and a lot of moxie.”

    Is that your way of saying she is hot?

  55. Stu says:

    Secondary Market:

    I noticed that too. It also seemed quite contrived that M’s 2nd wife Cindy was holding him too. I’m sure the two families have nothing in common. I really doubt someone of her means would knowingly bring a retarded child to term, although its pretty certain that she and her party would support the creation of such a restriction on everyone else.

  56. Renter says:

    Here is the link and a quote stating they knew.

    http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2008/08/29/trig-paxson-van-palin-sar_n_122474.html

    “Trig is beautiful and already adored by us. We knew through early testing he would face special challenges, and we feel privileged that God would entrust us with this gift and allow us unspeakable joy as he entered our lives. We have faith that every baby is created for good purpose and has potential to make this world a better place. We are truly blessed.”

  57. lisoosh says:

    Anecdata –

    Company which owns my rental has a huge number of properties all over the state, all different standards/income levels.
    Manager was telling me the other day that they are seeing a VERY big uptick in evictions, mostly long term, previously reliable tenants, all working, many two jobs. They just can’t keep up any more.

    Course, as we are talking in many cases about the working poor, a rather weak voting block, don’t expect any rescue packages from congress in the near future.

  58. lisoosh says:

    Sarah Palin –

    Once they announced that the party machine had written her speech for her I didn’t bother listening. Nothing to learn from pre-packaged nonsense.

    Like someone said above, I’ll wait to see how she does in a debate.

  59. lisoosh says:

    Renter – She walks the walk if she actually raises him herself rather than passing him off to her older kids and a bunch of nannies.
    Producing the child is the easy part. The day to day daily grind of actually dealing with the attendant issues is the hard part.

  60. Renter says:

    You make a good point about the reality. I was mainly referring to the initial decision to carry to term.

  61. Tom says:

    lissoh,

    Something I read said that when she was running for governor she claimed that her husband would stay at home and take care of the kids. That didn’t last long and when he went back to work, her mom looked after the kids. She made some more comments regarding how her mom does everything she tells her. It was somewhere on the internets so take that for what it’s worth without checking. The stuff about her husband was in some AK news site.

    But that was when she was running for the #1 spot in AK not the #2 spot in the US. So I guess gramma Palin will be moving to the Naval Observatory as well.

  62. skep-tic says:

    You guys are pretty funny. Like Mr. O and every major politician out there doesn’t have speech writers. For some reason, Mr. O gets credit for being the wise man when he reads the teleprompter but this lady does it just as well and she is dismissed.

    Regarding the families, again I think a few people here just reveal their lack of class through their comments. Maybe you should list all of the names of your children so we can make fun of them. Or perhaps you’d like us to speculate what a person of your means thinks of handicapped children.

  63. SG says:

    Tom: Question for you in post #33.

  64. PGC says:

    #56 Renting

    “We knew through early testing ”

    As a friend of mine said. “Why test, no matter what the results are we are keeping the baby.”

  65. Renter says:

    #50

    How can you name a child after a branch of mathematics?

  66. chicagofinance says:

    Shore Guy Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 9:18 am
    If O wins, methinks the economy will take a bigger hit.

    Shore: If you dig deeper, I don’t think that you can really consider that thought a valid result from the facts. Honestly, O is tossing out a lot of garbage right now, but regardless, it is really the conditions of the financial sector for the next 12 months that is going to be ultimate arbiteur of 1/2009-1/2013 economy. From my perspective, if you view McC and O as actually very much the same in terms of ultimate impact, it makes a lot of the convention rhetoric on both sides look particularly foolish.

  67. Renter says:

    #64

    There are reasons for testing. My friend found out her child would have club feet and she was able to do research and make financial arrangements to secure the best surgeon. She was so glad she was prepared to do the best for her son.

  68. John says:

    Hey Cindy has a special needs husband, with his two crippled arms, I am sure when they are all in the white house when Cindy is throwing a fresh pair of Depends on John how hard is it to throw a fresh diaper on the little kid.

    Stu Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 9:40 am
    Secondary Market:

    I noticed that too. It also seemed quite contrived that M’s 2nd wife Cindy was holding him too. I’m sure the two families have nothing in common. I really doubt someone of her means would knowingly bring a retarded child to term, although its pretty certain that she and her party would support the creation of such a restriction on everyone else.

  69. John says:

    What exactly are club feet and does it have anything to do with the sandwich?

    Renter Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 10:12 am
    #64

    There are reasons for testing. My friend found out her child would have club feet and she was able to do research and make financial arrangements to secure the best surgeon. She was so glad she was prepared to do the best for her son.

  70. skep-tic says:

    “How can you name a child after a branch of mathematics?”

    my understanding is that Trig is a Norse name. She is from a rural community with different ethnic groups than are common around here, so it is not surprising that the names may seem unusual to us. The real point is though that the names of her children are totally irrelevant to this campaign (just as Mr. O’s rather odd name is similarly irrelevant)

  71. NJGator says:

    It seemed to me like they were holding Little Baby Trig out like he’s the Little baby Jesus.

  72. Tom says:

    O didn’t choose his name.

  73. chicagofinance says:

    lisoosh Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 9:48 am
    Sarah Palin – Once they announced that the party machine had written her speech for her I didn’t bother listening. Nothing to learn from pre-packaged nonsense.
    Like someone said above, I’ll wait to see how she does in a debate.

    L & Stu: I think we are on the same page here.

    L: What I will say is that there were certain attacks that crossed a very subtle line.

    This one is bad:
    My fellow citizens, the American presidency is not supposed to be a journey of “personal discovery.”

    Honestly, who is she to be saying such a thing, and also it is just unseemly, especially coming from a personal of G-d.

  74. Sean says:

    Palin is dangerous liar.

    Last night she claimed to be an advocate for special needs children yet she cut the budget in Alaska 62% or 5 million dollars.

    The Annual budget for 2007, which preceded Gov. Palin was $8,265,300.

    The Annual budget for 2008, enacted by Gov. Palin is $3,156,000.

    This is the future “advocate in the White House” for the parents of special needs children, a fking liar.

  75. Renter says:

    Don’t worry skep-tic, I won’t vote based on a name.

  76. kettle1 says:

    Thought of the day: PEOPLE SUCK

    On my way to work, some guy sopped in the middle of a busy intersection, dropped 2 kittens out the door and drove off. Needless to saw the ensuing game of frogger did not end well for the kittens.

    That guy should be volunteered for IED removal in iraq.

  77. chicagofinance says:

    personal = person

  78. skep-tic says:

    Actually, O did choose his name. He chose to stop being called Barry and to go with B-arack. He did so consciously to get closer to his African roots. He also chooses to totally downplay his middle name. These decisions were at least partly political (unlike the naming of P’s children), but I will be the first to say that O’s name is and should be completely irrelevant as a campaign issue.

  79. NJGator says:

    Excerpt from a letter SP wrote to friends and family after giving birth to the Baby Jesus:

    “In a letter she e-mailed to relatives and close friends Friday after giving birth, Palin wrote, “Many people will express sympathy, but you don’t want or need that, because Trig will be a joy. You will have to trust me on this.” She wrote it in the voice of and signed it as “Trig’s Creator, Your Heavenly Father.”

    http://www.adn.com/626/story/382864.html

    Doesn’t the current occupant of the WH think the Creator speaks directly through him? We all know how fantastic that turned out.

  80. gary says:

    So, I can expect to see a fresh list of comp killers any moment now from our good friends on this blog who are privy to that information, correct?

  81. max says:

    this whole election is a joke,,,

    this is the best we got.

    pray for us all.

  82. max says:

    and get the rosaries out for hov

  83. kettle1 says:

    82 max,

    you pray, i am going shopping. Guns, gold, food, and a nice little plot outside the country. Actually already have the last one, but need more of the first 3

    Clott,

    ever see the drive through tobacco stores in TN, some also sell ammo! 2 outta 3 aint bad

  84. PGC says:

    Word is that SP will be kept away from mainstream media. No big sit downs the the political journalists. Questions from small town journalists only.

    I expect the first big interview will be a sit down with Diane Sawyer or a visit to “The View”

  85. skep-tic says:

    #73

    “the American presidency is not supposed to be a journey of “personal discovery.””

    this is one I will touch. Doesn’t it sometimes strike you that, as a politician, Mr. O is just a little too enamored with his own personal saga and not enough enamored with delivering substance? What we have gotten from O throughout the campaign has been a lot of inspiring discussion of his own personal journey, which he rightly says would only be possible in the USA. It is an interesting story and something worth lingering on for a bit, but this guy has written two books on it already before he reached 45 and has used it as the primary basis for his candidacy for the presidency. The story is at this point after 20 months is starting to reveal a tendency toward solipsism and I think many people rightly wonder when the navel gazing is going to stop and when O is going to start to actually work deliver something of substance.

  86. Frank says:

    ‘I think Frank is confusing “asking” price with “sold” price. A lot of people do that.’

    No I am not, I just don’t access to MLS to get the details and I don’t have the time to dig thru the tax records.

  87. kettle1 says:

    Just came across a nice M3 chart.

    http://www.nowandfutures.com/key_stats.html

    it looks like the printing presses are struggling to keep up. we are on a bumpy plateau. If the printing presses cannot keep up now, what happens when things deteriorate, what happens when a WAMU or Wachovia go down? What happens when the GOV bails out Freddie and fannie for 5-10 trillion or the treasury bails out the FDIC for about 500+ billion.

    deflation! bernanke is about to lose his battle with the market

  88. Nicholas says:

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trichinosis

    I thought it was Trich, my mistake for thinking you named your baby after a parasitic disease.

  89. Tom says:

    I don’t know if I would call his decision to be called Barry political as it seems he made that decision back in college.

    It’s common for people of immigrant decent to use more Americanized names. Tom is not the name on my legal documents and it became easier for me to use it even in more diversified NY public schools because I was easier than constantly correcting people.

    As for middle names, it’s not like John McC is using his full name of “John Sidney McDamnSpamFilterCain III”. Maybe it’s because some people consider it a girl’s name. In fact, isn’t there a current US Senator who is running for prez who named his daughter Sidney?

  90. 3b says:

    #87 frank:No I am not, I just don’t access to MLS to get the details and I don’t have the time to dig thru the tax records.

    Than how do you know that houses in your neighborhood are selling for 10% over 2005 asking prices.

    If there are so many examples, than finding one should be relatively easy.

    Just think of the satidfaction you will get by me having to apologize.

  91. Stu says:

    skep-tic:

    I will agree with you for the most part. Keep in mind though, O was piss poor compared to all of his counterparts and didn’t see any real scratch until he released his books.

    On the flip side, his lack of experience gives him less material to discuss. On the bright side, he has surrounded himself with many smart advisers. Unlike W, and most likely M (the maverick), he might even consider their advice and not ask to have them all quit when he doesn’t like what he hears.

  92. Nicholas says:

    Kettle,

    We used to have this street called “Kitty Kill Lane”, and we always avoided running over paper bags on that street.

    I think you can guess why.

  93. Tom says:

    “No I am not, I just don’t access to MLS to get the details and I don’t have the time to dig thru the tax records.”

    Frank, I’m sure if you at least provided the town and streets (not even the whole street address) or some other little bits of information, others on here would take the time to do the digging for you.

  94. Tom says:

    kettle1,

    RE: kittens… are you serious? Did you get the guys license and report him?

  95. 3b says:

    #86 skeptic: I agree with you on that, he does appear to be quite full of himself, which leaves me ambivalent at best about him. Also haven written 2 memoirs at the age of 47 seems a littl much to me at this point.

    That being said McCain and Palin do not do anything for me either. Watching last night’s conevtion, I could not help but notice all the old folks clapping when the various speakers talked about cutting government spending, and entitelements and all the rest.

    I do not think they would be clapping if there were talk sbout cutting their Social Security payments.

    One final thought Carly Fiorina and Rudy were IMO terrible.

  96. kettle1 says:

    The M3 chart i linked to includes the new Fed TAF, TSLF and PDCF windows. even with these windows M3 is staying flat since the

  97. Nicholas says:

    Anyone think it was wierd that Giuliani says “how dare they call into question when she will have time to spend with her children, they never ask a man that” (I’m paraphrasing)

    Then she takes the stages and calls herself a “hockey mom” aka “soccer mom” or whatever else you want to call it. Honestly, what do you expect people to think when you stereotype yourself into that position?

  98. Stu says:

    Ket: The M3 numbers are astounding. Like most homeowners and many business owners, his strategy seems to be to hope. Hope that the economy turns brighter and quick enough so that everyone will ignore the Fed’s moral hazard. Unfortunately, the economy requires impetus to turn it around, and stimulus checks were a complete joke. Expect another round of borrowing from your children to continue the ignorance of our economic realities.

  99. kettle1 says:

    95 Tom,

    No i actually jumped out of my car and tried to grab them. I didnt get to them in time and almost got run over.

  100. Tom says:

    And how is McC going to help the job market iner in America, when his own daughter needs to go to Canda to find work? :)

  101. 3b says:

    #81 gary: It would not make a difference to you anyhow.

  102. 3b says:

    #98 Nicholas: Yeah this from a man whose own Son does not speak to him, the same guy who was having an affair while still married to his children’s mother. He is a class act.

  103. skep-tic says:

    O will of course surround himself with ostensibly smart advisors; all presidents do that (even in the current white house, if you look on paper, they appear smart). but the president himself must ultimately make the decisions.

    I really think that if you stip away the inspiring and unusual personal narrative, O is basically the equivalent of John Edwards when he ran for president in 2004 (before he joined Kerry). Both were 1st term senators with thin records. Both of their policy platforms centered upon economic redistribution schemes. O is on a character level much more respectable than Edwards, but no one knew that about Edwards at the time.

  104. Stu says:

    “economic redistribution schemes”

    My only ‘real’ reason for supporting O over M. Now if we could just cut some spending for a change…huzzah!

    Everything else is truly noise, but who ever said it is not fun making noise.

  105. kettle1 says:

    stu 98,

    if the stimylus checks were such a joke perhaps we should issue another round of them? for about 10,000 this time? that buys a fair amount of hookers and blow! i would feel stimulated.

  106. Victorian says:

    103 – skep
    “(even in the current white house, if you look on paper, they appear smart)”

    – Donald Rumsfeld, Paul Wolfowitz, John Bolton, Alberto Gonzalez ???

    These guys were proven to be a$$hats before they were selected. Obama’s advisors have a proven pedigree.

  107. Stu says:

    Forget the checks…Just have China send us some LCDs and Plasmas. Isn’t that what the government really wanted us to do with the checks in the first place?

  108. Nicholas says:

    3b,

    I don’t think the speaker of the idea was important. I was actually impressed when I first heard the idea that she shouldn’t be treated any different then if she was a man.

    I don’t think I would have given the children a second thought if the VP was a man. Unless that man started calling himself a “hockey dad”, making lunches, and taxi-ing the kids to practice.

    I just don’t think you can have it both ways. Who is going to be the “hockey mom” for your kids now, because you can’t be both. If your going to push those responsibilities onto the other parent then stop flaunting the idea because no one wants to hear how you “were a hockey-mom”.

  109. kettle1 says:

    $10,000 stimulus checks for every american! 10k x 300 million = 3 trillion!!!

    that’s a bargain. If freddie and fannie have a 10 trillion blank check why not the american public. Its not like our we will every see the bill. Besides our kids are smart, they will figure something out!

  110. All Hype says:

    Bill Gross – bail out everybody!

    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=aDXbHi9QRUgE&refer=home

    He is a real self serving jerk.

  111. kettle1 says:

    DO we want a hockey mom facing down Putin???

  112. Tom says:

    Ah, this reminds me of something McC said a couple of years ago about American workers wouldn’t pick lettuce in Yuma for $50/hr.

    I don’t know about the rest of you, but I’d probably sign up for a deal like that. 3 month season so lets say $40k to work 3 months in a beautiful area where you can buy a nice 4bed 2bath home for under $200k??? Then the rest of the time much around hiking, biking, sipping iced tea, probably visiting a chiropractor because of all the bending and occassionally working on the things americans will do since I’d pretty much have most of my expenses covered in 3 months.

    Talk about out of touch.

  113. kettle1 says:

    current misery index ( a real index)!

    http://www.nowandfutures.com/images/pain_misery_housing_index.png

    notice that we are level with the 1920’s high and above the 1930’s high

  114. Nicholas says:

    Tom,

    I with you on the sun and hard work for three months for 40k. Let me know where to sign up.

  115. jcer says:

    My big problem with O, is I have not seen any substance. He also strikes me as someone who will pander yet claims he doesn’t. I don’t like the fact that he is close with Carter and I can see him negotiating with Hamas a group of people that we should not deal with. It seems to me he plans to raise taxes on the middle class to support a boatload of entitlement programs. I think he is representative of the current Democratic party run by Dean(aka the schmuck), not the party of Clinton, Gore, and Lieberman. Not pragmatic, but ideologically driven. My problem with M is he is a part of the wacky republican party which too is very ideologically driven. While he seems more moderate it seems the party has him on a short leash and he is not the “Maverick” they claim he is, if he was he would have reached across to someone like Lieberman or Bloomberg as his VP not this nut job SP. I really think neither party is representative of the vast majority of Americans and it is about time the people were represented not the political party. Oh we didn’t know how good we had it when Gore and Lieberman could have taken office, compared to the options today.

  116. kettle1 says:

    tom 111,

    i would do it for $50/hr. I suggest McKain put his money where his mouth is. Offer the jobs for 1 season and require verification of citizen ship for all who take the jobs.

    I bet you fill the slots in about 2 minutes

  117. skep-tic says:

    there are two simple problem with redistribution as an economic strategy:

    1. the amount you can take from the rich alone is not sufficient to significantly improve the lives of the non-rich. so at some point if you want to realize the goals of the redistribution, you will have to go down the ladder and start taking from less and less well off.

    2. the more you take from people, the more you disincentivize wealth creation. in this sense, redistribution is ultimately self-defeating.

    I would honestly like Mr. O to be forced to address these points at some point.

  118. Frank says:

    “DO we want a hockey mom facing down Putin???”

    Yes we do, GWB is afraid of him.

  119. All Hype says:

    “DO we want a hockey mom facing down Putin???”

    Yes we do, GWB is afraid of him.
    _________________________________________________
    Frank, that is the first smart thing you have written on this board. Congradulations!

  120. Victorian says:

    hey! where is the Palin bounce in this market?

    or is that the palin “bump”?

  121. Nicholas says:

    I heard last night or this morning someone talking about republicans.

    They were saying that republicans think they are doing poorly in the poles because they are not right-wing enough and that the party has shifted too much to the left and has lost a lot of their support base.

    I think that guy with the nice hair that spoke last night was about as right-wing as I have seen for a long time. From what I am seeing, there has definitely been a shift towards more right-wing ideology.

  122. gary says:

    3b [101],

    I’m still holding on to a glimmer of hope. :)

  123. 3b says:

    #110 But this will mena more government regualtion, and more government hand outs, and entitlement, it will mean bigger not smaller government.

    Goes against all that the Republicans were yabbering on about last night,

  124. 3b says:

    #122 gary: It is all unfolding right now, no need to hold on to a glimmer of hope;it is fact. Nobody here drinking the Kool-Aid.

  125. 3b says:

    #118 frank: Why are we facing down Putin? He has done nothing to us, and we have our hands full with Iraq and Afghanistan.

  126. Nicholas says:

    News Flash: This just in…

    Jim Real Estate got his head stuck in the toilet and was forced to give himself a swirly. Repeated attempts to get Jim out of the toilet have failed for the last year. Friends and speculators don’t expect the toilet to loosen its grip on Jim for another 12 to 18 months during which time renters will be allowed to administer on-the-spot swirlies at will.

  127. 3b says:

    #125 frank: Actually that should have been directed to kettle. I apologize.

  128. lisoosh says:

    # skep-tic Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 10:24 am

    “He also chooses to totally downplay his middle name. ”

    Sorry, but that is just silly. The only people who generally use their middle names are those who prefer them to their given first names. T. Boone Pickens springs to mind. Ronald Reagen didn’t emphasize his middle name (did he have one?) nor did Jimmy Carter. W. seems to use his to distinguish himself from daddy H.W. more than anything else.
    As for the his reversion to “Barack” after being “Barry” at school, as someone above mentioned (Tom?) it is very common with foreign sounding names as unfortunately people here tend to mangle them (my husbands name has been changed by concensus over the years). And everybody knows that kids can be mean to those who stand out.

    As for Obama and telepromters – I think you are trying to shape the debate by setting up a straw man. Just because somebody doesn’t think that a professionally written speech gives much insight into Sarah Palins personality, thought processes or idealogy isn’t an indication that they automatically view Obama as the Second Coming.

    I don’t hate either candidate, nor do I see either as a savior for the nation. I do get Obamas pick of Biden – older, experienced, a good attack dog. Much like Bush’s choice of Cheney (or Cheneys choice of Cheney). I see McCains choice of Palin and it just seems off. Picking a woman for being a woman is cynical enough (I don’t really think she will siphon off disaffected Hillary supporters) but there are a LOT better, more experienced Republican women out there to be a heartbeat from the presidency. And ones a lot more appealing to swing votors. Makes me think the Republican leadership operates in an echo chamber of their own making. But no surprise there.

  129. Stu says:

    Skep,

    The income gap is the big issue:

    http://money.cnn.com/2008/04/09/news/economy/incomegap/index.htm

    To answer your questions:

    1. We should not only take from the rich. By taxing everyone more, the government can create the infrastructure that supports the wage increases for the middle and lower classes. In turn the lower and middle class increase their spending making the wealthy business owners and executives wealthier.

    2. Same as 1.

    The real problem is that the economies of scale that should be gained by pooling tax dollars is lost in the public sectors’ inability to be efficient. There is no profit motive in government so there is little incentive for government workers to gain efficiencies.

    Perhaps the solution is to privatize the government? :P

  130. lisoosh says:

    Grim – 127 in mod

  131. Nicholas says:

    Stu,

    Maybe the solution is to continue to hand the reigns of government between big-spenders and cost-cutters.

    By allowing each to have a turn you end up funding important government sectors and then trimming the programs that are ineffective or inefficient.

    I think that this is a natural trend in American Politics but might have been broken by the current cost-cutters in office. In fact, they haven’t cut costs as expected, they continued to spend like crazy.

    I think it is high time that someone who can bring real trimming to the gov. bring change to washington.

  132. HEHEHE says:

    Biden might want to consider bringing criminal charges against his son first. The only bad thing about this election is there isn’t even a third party candidate worth a crap. I’d vote Liebertarian until I saw that Bob Barr wacko somehow got on their ticket.

  133. Nicholas says:

    Hehehe,

    I saw about 15 mins of the Green Party National Convention. Had about 500 people in attendance.

    Maybe you should look into what they are doing?

  134. Stu says:

    Uh Oh. The DJIA is slowly approaching the so-called mid July bottom.

    Meanwhile…My bond funds in the 401k are chugging along at 5%. I’m probably losing to inflation, but at least I’m not losing as much as most of my peers who drank the Kool-Aid.

  135. 3b says:

    #131 Hehe: What is the story with Biden’s Son. I missed that.

  136. Renter says:

    The availability of credit may be what created the crazy prices of housing and tuition. My middle class parents were able to pay for my tuition to college in the late 80’s without any problem. What middle class family can pay $25,000 to $50,000 a year now?

  137. skep-tic says:

    I understand the frustration with the income gap, but this is a result of the effect of global trade on wages for skilled vs. unskilled workers, not income tax policy.

    I have not yet heard a credible argument as to how taxing the rich more will eliminate or slow global wage arbitrage. Much more credible is the argument that taxing the rich more will cause capital flight from the U.S. and harm entrepreneurship. The people who would suffer the most from this are not the super-rich: it is the low skilled workers whose jobs would be lost.

    To me, a more coherent solution to the effect of international wage arbitrage is to shift priorities in the current budget of the U.S. to improve education. Neither candidate has addressed this approach to my knowledge.

  138. chicagofinance says:

    Wonderful.

    Some please shoot me in the head.

    WSJ
    Palin’s Faith Is Seen In Church Upbringing
    By SUZANNE SATALINE
    September 4, 2008; Page A6

    At the Pentecostal church where Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin worshipped for more than two decades, congregants speak in tongues and are part of a faith that believes humanity is in its “end times” — the days preceding a world-ending cataclysm bringing Christian redemption and the second coming of Jesus.

    The Rev. Ed Kalnins, pastor of the Pentecostal church, Wasilla Assembly of God, says he has told church members that God put President George W. Bush in office and that America is locked in a “holy war” with terrorists.

    Mr. Kalnins’s views and the teachings of his church provide a glimpse of the religious upbringing of Gov. Palin, 44 years old, whose Christian credentials and antiabortion views have been lauded by social conservatives. Gov. Palin hasn’t discussed her personal and spiritual beliefs since she was named to Sen. John McCain’s ticket on Friday, and the campaign hasn’t been eager to discuss them.

    “I am not going to get into that. I think talking about where she worships today and how she characterizes herself speaks for itself about where she is today on this issue,” says Maria Comella, a campaign spokeswoman.

    As a junior high schooler, Gov. Palin was baptized at Wasilla Assembly of God, where she attended with her family until 2002 before joining another church, which is evangelical and nondenominational, according to Mr. Kalnins, the pastor since 1999. He said the governor has continued to visit his church for meetings and conferences.

    At Mr. Kalnins’s invitation, Gov. Palin appeared on stage in June before a youth group at Wassila Assembly of God, where she reminisced fondly about getting baptized there, before asking the young people to pray for a proposed natural-gas pipeline in Alaska and for American soldiers.

    “Pray for our military men and women who are striving to do what is right also for this country,” Gov. Palin said, in a video of the talk posted on the church’s Web site. Pray “that our national leaders are sending them out on a task that is from God. That’s what we have to make sure we’re praying for: that there is a plan and that plan is God’s plan.”

    David Gushee, a Christian ethicist at Mercer University in Atlanta, says he is troubled that a public official might presume that government action could be God’s intent. “I would never think it is appropriate to describe the actions of the United States military or the strategies of our commanders as a plan from God,” Mr. Gushee says.

    Mr. Gushee says Gov. Palin should explain her beliefs concerning the inevitability of a cataclysm and the end of time. “To me, it is highly relevant to someone who potentially has her hand on the nuclear button,” he says. “If that is her worldview, I would want to know about that.”

    The McCain campaign has said Gov. Palin was baptized as an infant in the Catholic Church and that for the last seven years, she and her family have attended the Wasilla Bible Church, a nondenominational church in Wasilla. The church is evangelical, though not Pentecostal or charismatic, and believers don’t speak in tongues, said its pastor, the Rev. Larry Kroon. He described the church’s teachings as “so normal.” Several sermons, posted on the Internet, discuss aspects of common Christian theology, such as the significance of communion.

    While in Juneau, the state capital, Gov. Palin attends the Juneau Christian Center, an Assemblies of God church, while in session, said her spokeswoman, Sharon Leighow.

    At the Wasilla Assembly of God, Mr. Kalnins’s predecessor, the Rev. Tim McGraw, who served until 1998, says Gov. Palin attended a “discipleship class … to deepen her faith in Christ” and worshipped at the church at least twice a week.

    The Wasilla Assembly of God and its parent denomination — the three-million member General Council of the Assemblies of God — espouse core beliefs not widely ascribed to by major Christian factions. Many members pray in undecipherable sounds or “tongues.” The denomination’s Web site says some scholars believe that the “end times” foreshadowing the end of the world was confirmed in 1948, with the founding of the state of Israel, marking the Jews’ return to the Holy Land, fulfilling a Biblical prophecy. The Assemblies of God is part of a Pentecostal movement that numbers 80 million people world-wide.

    The Bible, Mr. Kalnins said in an interview, foretells world events. “I don’t think it’s God’s will to have a war,” he says. But in Iraq, America is fighting an enemy that has made it a war over beliefs, he said. “I really think it is a holy war. It’s a war of gods. … When someone fights in the name of God, that becomes a holy war.”

    Mr. Kalnins is an enthusiastic supporter of “Governor Sarah,” as he calls her, and of President George W. Bush, who, he believes, was put in office by the hand of the divine. “I believe criticisms come from hell. God has placed this man in authority. … You criticize the authority, you’re literally bringing in hell with the criticism.”

  139. gary says:

    3b,

    You know I wasn’t trying to be harsh with the Kool aid phrase; it’s just out of frustration, nothing more. It wasn’t aimed at anyone. I share everyone’s pain just the same. :)

  140. chicagofinance says:

    Wonderful.

    Some please shoot me in the head.

    WSJ
    Palin’s Faith Is Seen In Church Upbringing
    By SUZANNE SATALINE
    September 4, 2008; Page A6

    At the Pentecostal church where Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin worshipped for more than two decades, congregants speak in tongues and are part of a faith that believes humanity is in its “end times” — the days preceding a world-ending cataclysm bringing Christian redemption and the second coming of Jesus.

    The Rev. Ed Kalnins, pastor of the Pentecostal church, Wasilla Assembly of God, says he has told church members that God put President George W. Bush in office and that America is locked in a “holy war” with terrorists.

    Mr. Kalnins’s views and the teachings of his church provide a glimpse of the religious upbringing of Gov. Palin, 44 years old, whose Christian credentials and antiabortion views have been lauded by social conservatives. Gov. Palin hasn’t discussed her personal and spiritual beliefs since she was named to Sen. John McC’s ticket on Friday, and the campaign hasn’t been eager to discuss them.

    “I am not going to get into that. I think talking about where she worships today and how she characterizes herself speaks for itself about where she is today on this issue,” says Maria Comella, a campaign spokeswoman.

    As a junior high schooler, Gov. Palin was baptized at Wasilla Assembly of God, where she attended with her family until 2002 before joining another church, which is evangelical and nondenominational, according to Mr. Kalnins, the pastor since 1999. He said the governor has continued to visit his church for meetings and conferences.

    At Mr. Kalnins’s invitation, Gov. Palin appeared on stage in June before a youth group at Wassila Assembly of God, where she reminisced fondly about getting baptized there, before asking the young people to pray for a proposed natural-gas pipeline in Alaska and for American soldiers.

    “Pray for our military men and women who are striving to do what is right also for this country,” Gov. Palin said, in a video of the talk posted on the church’s Web site. Pray “that our national leaders are sending them out on a task that is from God. That’s what we have to make sure we’re praying for: that there is a plan and that plan is God’s plan.”

    David Gushee, a Christian ethicist at Mercer University in Atlanta, says he is troubled that a public official might presume that government action could be God’s intent. “I would never think it is appropriate to describe the actions of the United States military or the strategies of our commanders as a plan from God,” Mr. Gushee says.

    Mr. Gushee says Gov. Palin should explain her beliefs concerning the inevitability of a cataclysm and the end of time. “To me, it is highly relevant to someone who potentially has her hand on the nuclear button,” he says. “If that is her worldview, I would want to know about that.”

    The McC campaign has said Gov. Palin was baptized as an infant in the Catholic Church and that for the last seven years, she and her family have attended the Wasilla Bible Church, a nondenominational church in Wasilla. The church is evangelical, though not Pentecostal or charismatic, and believers don’t speak in tongues, said its pastor, the Rev. Larry Kroon. He described the church’s teachings as “so normal.” Several sermons, posted on the Internet, discuss aspects of common Christian theology, such as the significance of communion.

    While in Juneau, the state capital, Gov. Palin attends the Juneau Christian Center, an Assemblies of God church, while in session, said her spokeswoman, Sharon Leighow.

    At the Wasilla Assembly of God, Mr. Kalnins’s predecessor, the Rev. Tim McGraw, who served until 1998, says Gov. Palin attended a “discipleship class … to deepen her faith in Christ” and worshipped at the church at least twice a week.

    The Wasilla Assembly of God and its parent denomination — the three-million member General Council of the Assemblies of God — espouse core beliefs not widely ascribed to by major Christian factions. Many members pray in undecipherable sounds or “tongues.” The denomination’s Web site says some scholars believe that the “end times” foreshadowing the end of the world was confirmed in 1948, with the founding of the state of Israel, marking the Jews’ return to the Holy Land, fulfilling a Biblical prophecy. The Assemblies of God is part of a Pentecostal movement that numbers 80 million people world-wide.

    The Bible, Mr. Kalnins said in an interview, foretells world events. “I don’t think it’s God’s will to have a war,” he says. But in Iraq, America is fighting an enemy that has made it a war over beliefs, he said. “I really think it is a holy war. It’s a war of gods. … When someone fights in the name of God, that becomes a holy war.”

    Mr. Kalnins is an enthusiastic supporter of “Governor Sarah,” as he calls her, and of President George W. Bush, who, he believes, was put in office by the hand of the divine. “I believe criticisms come from hell. God has placed this man in authority. … You criticize the authority, you’re literally bringing in hell with the criticism.”

  141. Everything's 'boken says:

    When SP identified herself with pitbulls, she also assumd some of the their unfortunate traits, such as instability, ruthlessness, lack of self control, and the inability to distinguish the innocent from the enemy.

  142. PGC says:

    Jcer

    Lieberman is not a democrat. He may be registered as one, but he is in the Senate as an Independent. He lost his parties primary on his war stance and then ran on his own. Its fair that he won. His name recognition and previous record carried him when he split the vote. When he is up for re-election he will have a lot of work to do to stop being kicked to the curb. A lot of people will see his current antics as sour grapes and petty retaliation. I don’t think he can realistically join the Republicans as the base would not tolerate him. Although Bloomberg has flipped between parties, either side would be glad to have him back as he has run the independent line without bitterness.

    Here is a fun focus group from Detroit. Interesting comments.

    http://www.freep.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20080903/NEWS15/80904002

  143. 3b says:

    #135 renter: True. But many parent’s have drank the Kool-Aid regaridnh colleges, which ones their kids must attend, and how much it is worth.

    I know people who are overwhelemd with student loans/home equity loans trying to pay for college education’s.

    And all for a generic BA/BBA. Also there is the beleif that seems to be more endemic in NJ than in many other states that kids must go away, far away, and only freak kids would live at home.

    And yet one can get a straight BA/BBA at Ramapo College, or Montclair State for a cost of about 8k a year, if they chose to live at home.

    They could than spend the big bucks on business or law school, if that is the direction they are headed.

    So 8k a year for a total of around 32k for all 4 years is IMO very doable for many middle class families.

  144. kettle1 says:

    3b Re Putin

    I think our current face off with putin is stupid and unnecessary. It is/has been caused by hawks who have tunnel vision and do not see the big picture.
    It will take an administration with the skills of a chess master to interact with russia in a productive manner for both sides.

    we have discussed this before in regards to georgia. You and i are on the same page in regards to russia 3b.

  145. 3b says:

    #138 gary: Understood, no problem.

  146. Tom says:

    I think we should continue to give more credit to americans so they can spend and the super-rich can get super-richer and give the rest of us even more credit. Cause that’s been working so well before.

    By the way, the $50/hr thing I kinda did something similar a few years back. Not quite Yuma but moved out of the area for a contract in a place where the cost of living was quite a bit cheaper. It was pretty sweet.

    Move out to Yuma, work in the sun, get tan, develop big quads from all the squatting, would be fighting off the ladies with a stick. Work 3 months a year, live in a cheap house fight off ladies with a stick. What’s not to love?

    By the way, people did try to apply for the position when he said it but he didn’t take applications. Apparently people even showed up to his office the next day with applications according to this.

  147. kettle1 says:

    ChiFI,

    American Jihad???? i thought those were the people we wanted to bomb, the jihadist? when do the smart bombs start raining down on wasilla?

  148. leftwing says:

    kettle1 Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 11:17 am
    DO we want a hockey mom facing down Putin???

    Hell yeah, if there’s any facing off to be done. These women have b*lls. I’ve seen more than one of them thrown out of the rink after climbing the glass to have a go at the ref after their kid got laid out and no penalty was called.

  149. HEHEHE says:

    Kettle,

    wars and circuses

  150. 3b says:

    #143 kettle: I agrre whole heartedly, and yes we are on the same page.

    It is just really scary, when these clowns are going around scaring gullible Ameircans into believing that Russia is an enemy.

  151. lostinny says:

    “for about 10,000 this time? that buys a fair amount of hookers and blow! i would feel stimulated.”

    I nominate Kettle for quote of the day.

  152. kettle1 says:

    Given the current choices, Putin might actually make a better candidate for US president

  153. HEHEHE says:

    Merrill May Fail to Sell Bad Loans to Korea Asset (Update3)

    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=a0QemFmcMrdA&dbk

    Why do these guys all think the Koreans want this crap?

  154. skep-tic says:

    WSJ Editorial Page today has an interesting piece on how a major source of economic anxiety for middle class americans these days is the weak dollar (whether or not they realize it). they rightly point out that this huge issue is not being discussed at all in the presidential campaign. not surprisingly, I tend to think O’s policies would greatly increase the risk of dollar collapse. proposing massive new entitlements when we cannot pay for the ones we already have further undermines the credibility of our ‘full faith and credit’

  155. Tom says:

    Everythin’,

    I’ve also seen pits eat their own vomit and diahrrea. Palin doesn’t even eat her own dogfood.

  156. Renter says:

    #B

    New Jersey just seems so much wealthier and people expect more.
    I am from Ohio and when I drive into Cleveland I immediately see the difference in the age of the cars.

  157. Shore Guy says:

    # 117 “GWB is afraid of him”

    Frank,

    W is not AFRAID of Putin; W seems to have a CRUSH on him.

  158. HEHEHE says:

    I am from Cincinnati. I’ve heard it’s just that Cleveland sucks.

  159. kettle1 says:

    leftwing:

    i dont want a brawler trying to outwit Putin. they will lose every time. I do not want an average american in office. i do not want a soccer/hockey/football mom in office. I want a politically adept, motivated individual (m/F is irrelevant to me) who is in the 90+ percentile of intelligence, has a real vision for the county that doesnt include the return of jesus, and actually understands 1 or 2 foreign cultures.

    yes a tall order but the stakes are fairly high in this game.

  160. 3b says:

    #150 kettle: We could not do any worse. And Russians for the most part appear to like and support him.

    What is it with Americans running around the world screaming DEMOCRACY?

    I believe in democracy, but every country/society has to find their own road to it, and their own version of it.

    We are running around telling the rest of the world to be just like us, and quite frankly I think the rest of the world is laughing at us.

    As far as our democracy, it could use some help as far as I am concerned. Look at the choices we have running for President, and no chance of ever having any real viable 3rd party alternative.

  161. PGC says:

    While resisting the urge last night to throw things at Rudys head on TV, the funniest comment of the night came from Huckabee

    ” Now, O was right when he said that this election is not about him; it is about you. When gasoline costs $4 a gallon, it makes it tough if you’re a single mom trying to get to work each day in a used car that you drive. You want something to change.”

    Ummm, isn’t that the Democrats main point. The last 8 years have caused the $4 gallon and the economy in the toilet.

  162. Shore Guy says:

    # 105 Ket,

    As one who did not get a check, the thought of ponying-up more of my $ to fund even a $10 stimulus check fails to appeal to me.

    Now, cutting government spending to the point that we can use the excess revenue to eliminate the debt and then be able to cut taxes 30%, THAT makes me warm all over.

  163. jcer says:

    PCG, Lieberman was a democrat. He was forced to go independent when the party stabbed him in the back because the party went Left after the 2000 election loss. They were displeased with the fact that he was not alway liberal. Any party that tosses out an incumbent who can and will win without party support is insane, he should be pissed at the dems and there is no way he could go republican. I don’t necessarily politically agree with Lieberman but I think he is a good politician and seemingly honest. I never said either bloomberg or Lieberman were dems, I was trying to say they are not republicans or generally accepted by them they are socially liberal and have appeal to many registered democrats.

  164. kettle1 says:

    left wing,

    while i am not supporting any one candidate at the moment, palin doesnt not fit into any of the criteria I mentioned above.

  165. What gives with DJI, IXIC & SPX?

    Did I miss some big news?

  166. Stu says:

    Skep:

    “but this is a result of the effect of global trade on wages for skilled vs. unskilled workers”

    I don’t necessarily agree with you on this, but do agree that the income tax structure is not entirely to blame. I do agree that making education a priority in this country would go a long way to help us compete globally. American’s have too much of an ‘American # 1’ attitude. We are rapidly falling behind in so many categories that it is downright depressing. If people would just save and invest rather than spending to impress, a lot of our problems would go away. If China ever does have a social revolution bringing more of a democratic freedom to the people, we will be in deep doo doo.

  167. kettle1 says:

    Shore,

    I agree, was joking about stimulus checks, although Mrs kettle does enjoy some hookers and blow ;)

    3b

    At least with Putin you know that the country will end up stronger at the end of his reign then when he took office. ALl the current candidates seem to be in a race to bankrupt the country and sell off the assets for pennies. Oh, and you wont here about his dirty laundry as he will have any “loose ends” encounter “accidents”

  168. Tom says:

    I loved this part for Palin’s speach.

    “I told the Congress, thanks but no thanks on that bridge to nowhere.”

    I guess she means, Thanks for the money, No Thanks, we’re not going to build the bridge.

    “If our state wanted to build a bridge we were going to build it ourselves.”

    Uhm… Congress didn’t want to build a bridge in alaska. Alaskans wanted the bridge. They came to Congress for the money. The problem according to Palin is that she didn’t want Alaska to pay for any of the bridge. Had she received enough money from Congress to pay for the bridge entirely, I’m pretty sure they’d build that bridge.

    Unless by “Congress” she means Alaska’s Repr Don Young and Sen Ted Stevens who pushed the issue in Congress.

    This is what she said regarding the Gravina Island Bridge:

    “Ketchikan desires a better way to reach the airport, but the $398 million bridge is not the answer. Despite the work of our congressional delegation, we are about $329 million short of full funding for the bridge project, and it’s clear that Congress has little interest in spending any more money on a bridge between Ketchikan and Gravina Island. Much of the public’s attitude toward Alaska bridges is based on inaccurate portrayals of the projects here. But we need to focus on what we can do, rather than fight over what has happened.”

    By the way, the island also got federal money to build a road that would lead to the bridge as part of another earmark. If they didn’t build the road, they would have to get the money back. So guess what, they built the road to the bridge to nowhere that doesn’t exist! more here

    That guy that released the kittens on the road isn’t sounding so bad anymore.

  169. kettle1 says:

    shore,

    dont worry about stimulus checks, you arent paying for it, your children and grandchildren are.

  170. Tom says:

    awe shucks 166 in moderation I thought I was doing well today :(

  171. Nicholas says:

    Isn’t Cincinatti part of greater Kentucky?

  172. Shore Guy says:

    # 164 “although Mrs kettle does ”

    Do you have a youtube link ;)

  173. HEHEHE says:

    Nah Cincinnati is an oasis of class between the underarm that is Cleveland and the nether regions of the south.

  174. Renter says:

    Our culture respects wealth and idolized the wealthy. We are an anti-intellectual culture.

  175. HEHEHE says:

    “Our culture respects wealth and idolized the wealthy. We are an anti-intellectual culture.”

    I am going to put that on t-shirts and bumper stickers and sell it;)

  176. Shore Guy says:

    # 66 Chifi,

    One would have thought that the financial realities would have long ago restrained unrestrained sprnding in washington: from an unfunded and off-the-books war, to Medicare Part D, etc. The folks we have there (and have had for many years) are unable/unwilling to curb spending, cut debt, and stop making expensive future promises.

    If O were in power with a Rep. House and Senate, his ability to do damage to the long-term financial stability of this nation would be limited. A Mc-Ca-in faced with the reality of a Dem controlled (and perhaps veto-proof) house and Senate, will not be able to bully the congress and will need to reach across the aisle in order to accomplish anything. O faces with the same congress will be, as Fred Thomp-son might say “like a man in a rubber suit sliding down a greased bobsled track”; the legislation will flow like water from a firehose, without restraint, and without the level of sound analysis and thought that the nation should expect. Some of the legislation will likely reflect sound policy; that said, I am willing to wager that much of it will not and we will suffer greatly because of it.

  177. SC says:

    #78 – Reason enough to vote dem

  178. Shore Guy says:

    “she has chuztpa and a lot of moxie”

    I hear that can be cured with the proper drugs.

  179. skep-tic says:

    how are we to conclude that Ms. P is not intelligent or capable? Everything she has accomplished indicates the contrary. She is governor of perhaps our most strategically important state right now. She negotiated the development of $40B natural gas pipeline. She cut her budget and sent a check to every single citizen when she found there was a surplus. Meanwhile, all of Mr. O’s supposed intelligence is on paper. Come to think of it, can anyone find a note that he wrote when he was on Harvard Law Review? Kind of unusual not to write one if you’re in that position, but apparently he didn’t. Also, no published scholarship whatsoever from his stint as a constitutional law professor. Again, a rather undistiguished performance, especially considering his image as an intellectual.

  180. SC says:

    HEHEHE Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 11:43 am
    Biden might want to consider bringing criminal charges against his son first. The only bad thing about this election is there isn’t even a third party candidate worth a crap. I’d vote Liebertarian until I saw that Bob Barr wacko somehow got on their ticket.

    Why is Bob Barr a wacko? Because he defends the Contitution? I know you Republicans think that is crazy.

  181. Shore Guy says:

    # 175,

    Skep,

    Do you know whether AK has any debt? If not, sending the check seems a reasonable action. If so, it was imprudent.

  182. HEHEHE says:

    Bob Barr is a bs political opportunist who’s changed parties three times now in the attempt to further his political dreams.

  183. hughesrep says:

    Cincinntucky an oasis? I guess if you are into tobacco chewing, toothless, cheap beer swilling red necks it is. And those are just the women.

    Hell, anything south of 70 is pretty much Kentucky.

  184. Stu says:

    Alaska has only 9 billion worth of debt. Perhaps that surplus might have something to do with her 80% popularity rating?

  185. HEHEHE says:

    All you northern Ohio types are so jealous. Like the Browns and the Super Bowl all I can say is keep reaching for the stars.

  186. Tom says:

    not sure when comment will get unmoderated but I finally watched the whole palin speech. She is so full of crap.

  187. skep-tic says:

    #177

    Looks like AK has about $9B in debt when you consider all direct borrowings and guarantees of municipalities, universities, etc. For those interested, detailed report on AK’s finances below:

    http://www.revenue.state.ak.us/treasury/programs/documentviewer/viewer.aspx?428f

  188. skep-tic says:

    #181 Google is amazing

  189. kettle1 says:

    a friend of mine just mentioned he is starting to look a buying a home.

    is there anyplace that has collected all the various charts and data to show the extent of the housing bubble and how far down we have to go?

    I directed him here as well, but the extent of the situation is not immediately clear unless you have been reading this blog for a while.

  190. Stu says:

    Political positions

    Main article: Political positions of Sarah Palin

    Palin has described the Republican party platform as “the right agenda for America,” adding “individual freedom and independence is extremely important to me and that’s why I’m a Republican.”[3]

    Palin has called herself as “pro-life as any candidate can be.”[46] She would permit abortion only in cases where the mother’s life is in danger,[102] and supports mandatory parental consent for abortions.[103] Palin is a member of Feminists for Life.[104] Palin has been described as supportive of contraception.[46] She backs abstinence-only education and is against “explicit sex-ed programs” in schools.[105][106][107]

    Palin supports capital punishment.[108]

    Palin opposes same-sex marriage[46] and supported a non-binding referendum for a constitutional amendment to deny state health benefits to same-sex couples.[109]

    Palin has said she supports teaching both creationism and evolution in public schools, but not to the extent of adding creation-based alternatives to the required curriculum.[110]

    Palin has strongly promoted oil and natural gas resource development in Alaska, including in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR).[49] She has opposed federal listing of the polar bear as an endangered species warning that it would adversely affect energy development in Alaska. [68] Palin does not believe that global warming is human-caused.[52]

    Palin, a long-time member of the National Rifle Association, strongly supports its interpretation of the Second Amendment as protecting individual rights to bear arms, including handguns. She also supports gun safety education for youth.[111]

    Palin’s foreign policy positions were unclear at the time she was picked as McCain’s running mate.[112] When asked for her views about troop escalations in Iraq, she replied “…while I support our president, Condoleezza Rice and the administration, I want to know that we have an exit plan in place…”[113][114]

  191. Victorian says:

    I think Biden has given the most succinct reaction to the speech:

    “On ABC Thursday morning, Mr. Biden said he was still looking for her specific views. “The bottom line here is the phrase middle class was not mentioned once. The economic plight, the hole the Republicans have dug so deeply the last eight years was not mentioned. No specific plans about how were going to get out of that hole was mentioned.”

    He also said, “They don’t want to defend the past and they don’t have any clear picture for what they’re going to do for the future.””

  192. Stu says:

    P’s positions from Wikipedia

    Political positions

    Main article: Political positions of Sarah P

    P has described the Republican party platform as “the right agenda for America,” adding “individual freedom and independence is extremely important to me and that’s why I’m a Republican.”[3]

    P has called herself as “pro-life as any candidate can be.”[46] She would permit abortion only in cases where the mother’s life is in danger,[102] and supports mandatory parental consent for abortions.[103] P is a member of Feminists for Life.[104] P has been described as supportive of contraception.[46] She backs abstinence-only education and is against “explicit sex-ed programs” in schools.[105][106][107]

    P supports capital punishment.[108]

    P opposes same-sex marriage[46] and supported a non-binding referendum for a constitutional amendment to deny state health benefits to same-sex couples.[109]

    P has said she supports teaching both creationism and evolution in public schools, but not to the extent of adding creation-based alternatives to the required curriculum.[110]

    P has strongly promoted oil and natural gas resource development in Alaska, including in the Alaskan National Wildlife Refuge (ANWR).[49] She has opposed federal listing of the polar bear as an endangered species warning that it would adversely affect energy development in Alaska. [68] P does not believe that global warming is human-caused.[52]

    P, a long-time member of the National Rifle Association, strongly supports its interpretation of the Second Amendment as protecting individual rights to bear arms, including handguns. She also supports gun safety education for youth.[111]

    P’s foreign policy positions were unclear at the time she was picked as M’s running mate.[112] When asked for her views about troop escalations in Iraq, she replied “…while I support our president, Condoleezza Rice and the administration, I want to know that we have an exit plan in place…”[113][114]

  193. Stu says:

    Noticed that too Victorian:

    Not a single mention of the economy from either SP or Rude-E. Nor a mention of GWB as well.

  194. WaitingInRent says:

    I’m with Gary #81. I think it was Rich in NY, would love some BC comp killers, but I guess for that to happen we would need some sales?

    I guess the future comp killers would be nice.

  195. Victorian says:

    187 – Kettle

    Calculated Risk has just the right post on right now to answer that question.

  196. kettle1 says:

    stu 180,

    wait, you mean the USA has an approx 60 trillion SURPLUS???? Sweet, when do the Plasma’s for the masses get sent out?

  197. Stu says:

    Like Ron Paul, there is a lot to like about her, but the religious crap gets in the way. Does anyone want to remind the Republican’s that this country was founded on the freedom to practice one’s religion. For some reason, they seem to want to IMPOSE religion these days.

  198. NJLifer says:

    183 – Tom

    What part of ‘she is a politician’ don’t you get? They are all full of krapp.

  199. Secondary Market says:

    @159,

    Shoreguy,

    If you were presented with a stimulus check during the days of living out of your car, would have taken it?

  200. Victorian says:

    194 – Stu
    “For some reason, they seem to want to IMPOSE religion these days.”

    When you get people to start worrying about eternal damnation, $5.00 gas/gallon seems trivial.

  201. kettle1 says:

    stu 193,

    the republicans have discovered the same thing that the pope and the the megachurch pastors did. There is a boat load of money and a lot of power to be had by being the leader of a large religious group. They are also easier to control as they tend to be self policing and resistant to alternative ideas.

  202. chicagofinance says:

    Shore Guy Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 12:33 pm
    # 66 Chifi, O faces with the same congress will be, as Fred Thomp-son might say “like a man in a rubber suit sliding down a greased bobsled track”; the legislation will flow like water from a firehose, without restraint, and without the level of sound analysis and thought that the nation should expect. Some of the legislation will likely reflect sound policy; that said, I am willing to wager that much of it will not and we will suffer greatly because of it.

    Shore Guy: why? Off-hand if you had to ask who is the most intellectually curious and even-handed person out of the four here…who would that be? Ultimately, to blindly assume he would implement stuff mindless is suggesting quite a bit. Honestly, you actually couldn’t have instituted more wrong-headed and money wasting stuff than has been done in the last 6-7 years. If O means fast tracking the unwind, then that seem like saved money to me. Seriously, what about this Medicare disaster? Indefensible!

    His economic advisor is Austan Goolsbee, no f—ing slacker in my book. Look, I am no O-fan, but at this juncture, I feel insulted by McC…

  203. skep-tic says:

    The failure of massive government programs is staring us in the face every day. Look at the gov’t foray into mortgage lending / securitizations. Look at the gov’t attempt to create a public pension scheme. Massive inefficiences; unsustainable risk taking; overwhelming agency costs. I don’t see how you can look at these failures and think we need more beaurocracy, more gov’t domination of another huge sector of our economy. Yes there are big problems with the status quo but some people don’t seem to understand what the source of the problems is.

  204. Stu says:

    alternative ideas = damnation to hell

    I understand clearly.

    Religious Right = Damnation or damned nation?

  205. Stu says:

    “The failure of massive government programs is staring us in the face every day.”

    Homeland security? Star Wars?

  206. Shore Guy says:

    “Alaska has only 9 billion worth of debt”

    Stu,

    In my calculus, if one has debt, then a surplus is not really a surplus. If the “rebate” to the good people of AK was greater than $6B, it should have been used to retire the outstanding debt, thus bringing even greater savings to the state over the long run. If the “rebate” was less than $6B, it should have been used to pay down the total debt load, again putting more $ in the hands of Alaskans in the long run.

    I hate fiscal game playing.

  207. 3b says:

    #200 And yet this is what so many Republican so called free market capitalists are advocating.

    The belief seems to be cut gov spending/entitlement programs across the board, except for when we mess up, then there must be government intervention, no matter the cost.

    Then when the crisis has passed, get out of the way, and do not regulate or oversight us, and continue to cut government spending/entitlement programs, until we mess up again, and then repeat the above.

    Seems to me you cannot have it both ways.

  208. Stu says:

    Where’s BI. I need him to mock some of my investments s’more. His comments yesterday resulted in a tidy 4% gain ;)

  209. Stu says:

    Shore Guy:

    Sort of like the way Corzine raised our sales tax by 1% to pay for property tax relief. Some of us got it back and some of us didn’t. Of course this year, none of us will get it back, although the 1% tax will stand. Where did it go?

  210. Victorian says:

    200 Skep –

    “Look at the gov’t foray into mortgage lending / securitizations”

    Wouldnt you say that lack of govt regulation led to the mess we are in right now? All Paulson is doing is trying to bail out his GS buddies.

  211. 3b says:

    #191 Waiting RichNJ has presented numerous examples of Bergen Co comp killers over the last few months, as has grim.

  212. Stu says:

    Right on Victorian: All the meanwhile, these rich bitches pay a lower income tax rate than my family due to loopholes and lower tax rates on the wealthy thanks to the Bush tax cuts. But fear not. According to some unnamed posters on this board, this behavior creates an incentive for the wealthy to create more jobs for the lower and middle classes.

  213. Frank says:

    All Hype,
    All you still can’t spell.

  214. schabadoo says:

    If he does, it will prevent O from using a veto-proof congress to increase spending and making it more difficult for business to succeed on the world stage.

    And after all that hard work done Bush and the Repubs to reign in spending….

    What a farking joke. Do you giggle when you type these things?

  215. bi says:

    today skep-tic is lightening you up. but you seem too dense so far…

    >Stu Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 1:22 pm
    Where’s BI. I need him to mock some of my investments s’more. His comments yesterday resulted in a tidy 4% gain ;)

  216. Stu says:

    DJIA approaching -300 drop on the day. Sarah and Rudy’s speeches have really got the market rolling.

  217. Shore Guy says:

    # 198 “to blindly assume he would implement stuff mindless is suggesting quite a bit.”

    In the final analysis, all spending bills originate in the House. Beyond this, the Dems legislative agenda has been blocked by the Rep.s skillful use of Senate rules for the past several years. The Dem leadership is champing at the bit to move legislation forward. I do not have faith that O will stand up to the Dem leaders in the congress and put the breaks on things. If O wins, in the 90-day rush after Jan 20, much will likely move quickly through the congress and down the street for a signature. I have full faith that much of that legislation will cost the nation money it does not have and will otherwise harm the nation.

    O’s own legislative agenda does not have to cost anything for an O administration to further harm this nation. In fairness, the Republican leadership abdicated all prudence while in charge and they should be keelhauled for the damage they wrought on this nation.

  218. Stu says:

    Did I say 4% BI? I meant 5%.

    And I’m lightening up apparently. Must be my diet! What comes next? Thunder?

  219. Shore Guy says:

    # 210

    see above. I agree with you that Bu-sh and the Reps did a miserable job with the nation’s finances. I for one admire what occurred during the Clint-on years; recall, though, that the improvement in our financial health came with divided government.

  220. Shore Guy says:

    # 205

    I hate that sort of gimmick. Just cut the damn**ed spending, then tax rates can come down. It is not rocket science.

    I do not hold out much hope that politicians will do the right thing at either the state or federal level as long as they receive pensions for the job of legislator. Kill the pensions and one kills the incentive to stay for ever. Kill that incentive and it kills the “I must do everything possible to stay in power” outlook.

  221. skep-tic says:

    “Wouldnt you say that lack of govt regulation led to the mess we are in right now? All Paulson is doing is trying to bail out his GS buddies.”

    I do not think a lack of regulation was the cause, although I do think this is a good opportunity to rethink how mortgages should be regulatated. I think the cause was the same thing that causes all speculative bubbles (euphoria, mistaking short term phenomena for a “new paradigm”). Could there have been better enforcement of existing regs– absolutely. But I think even with this there would have been a bubble. I think a much larger harmful effect came from Fannie/Freddie and the means in which they facilitated the game of hot potato that developed with MBS. They were immune from market discipline (still are) because of their gov’t affiliation. This to me is a powerful lesson against claims that government is equipped to solve problems of this sort.

  222. Victorian says:

    209 – Stu.

    “According to some unnamed posters on this board, this behavior creates an incentive for the wealthy to create more jobs for the lower and middle classes.”

    Ahhh – That explains the rocket-fueled growth in jobs seen over here in the past 7 years.
    Ooops, sorry – we arent talking about China, India are we??

  223. PGC says:

    #160 jcer

    “He was forced to go independent when the party stabbed him in the back because the party went Left after the 2000 election loss.”

    I don’t think the Dems moved left, I would say he got bumped by diving too far right. His stance on the war caused a revolt within his state party.

    He made an interesting comment after his speech, he said he admired M for taking on his party and trying to change the party from within. M wanted to take back his party and reform it. My thought was that why didn’t you try and do the same with the Democrats if you felt so strongly, instead of standing there like the odd one out at dance with no partner.

  224. John says:

    The problem with redistribution of wealth is most millionaires are self made. When I grew up piss poor in the Bronx, families had four or five kids jammed into two bedroom apartments in the 1960s and early 1970’s and we all wore hand me downs and were broke and that was ok. Well most of those kids are in their 40’s and 50’s making well over 100K mid career at the peak of their incomes. Well the Big O wants to punish that crowd who pulled themselves up and give rebate checks our of their paychecks to today’s poor in those same apartments. Well today’s poor now has no incentive to move up the ladder as long as they have their free govt. cheese coming from Mr. O. The free govt cheese is bad enough but making the now well off who pull themselves up by their bootstraps pay for the playstations and nikes of today’s lazy poor is an insult.

  225. Shore Guy says:

    Secondary,

    Re. living in a car. I never lived in a car, although things were bad. During my poor-as-dirt period I was, because of political connections, offered a nice job with a high-level Reagan official. I possessed none of the background to do the job well, it was in an area outside my area of expertise, and it would have paid well, with lots of government-paid travel to lots of great places here in the US and abroad. I declined the job because it was not right for me to have been offered it in the first place.

    I preferred to work my way up and out on my own, eating ramen (sp?) noodles, for the main course of every lunch and dinner for quite some time, and freezing at night because the gallon or two of K1 I was using to heat the place overnight would run out before I got up (couldn’t afford a full tank delivery and no company around offered partial deliveries, not that I could have afforded much of a delivery anyway).

    Consequently, I do not know that I would have cashed the check. Of course, the lure of a chance to eat some chicken or beef might have been enough to overcome my objections to a stupid policy.

  226. Tom says:

    According to city-data.com Wasilla has 69 full-time city employees. While P mocks O for being a director of a community activist organization, he took the number of employees from 1 to 70. I think P doesn’t understand the big fish/small lake concept.

    I think the timing for O is all messed up. It sounds like he did a good job in the state legislature and would have been good in the senate if he didn’t start his campaign so early. If he didn’t do it now though, he might have lost his opportunity.

    I was reading something about this legislation he got through in Ill regarding making police videotape questioning and confessions to help cut down on beatings and other coersion by police. Looked like everyone was against it, left, right, gov, cops but he got it through.

    Based on the support he’s gotten for his campaign he seems like someone who can get people to work together. I would have preferred to see him in the senate longer and do more but when Biden first came into office people considered him to be a new star but I guess new stars kept coming in and the shine fades fast. Pretty soon he was just another legislator. If O didn’t run now it would probably be 8 years before he could again.

    By the way. McC doesn’t seem to be a lawyer or have gone to law school. Who writes his legislation? After reading some things out of congress, I always wondered how legislators with no background in law can claim to write such complicated legal documents.

    I know they have staff.. but then is it really them that can claim writing the legislation? For all the crap lawyers get I think it makes sense for politicians to have a background in law.

  227. Victorian says:

    “I think a much larger harmful effect came from Fannie/Freddie and the means in which they facilitated the game of hot potato that developed with MBS”

    Skep-

    I think FRE/FNM are relatively in a much better situation than the private business precisely because of the restrictions placed on them. Of course, they stretched the limits. But they would have been bankrupt by now if not for the restrictions in their charters.

    “I think we can give Fannie and Freddie their due share of responsibility for the mess we’re in, while acknowledging that they were nowhere near the biggest culprits in the recent credit bubble. They may finance most of the home loans in America, but most of the home loans in America aren’t the problem; the problem is that very substantial slice of home loans that went outside the Fannie and Freddie box. But Krugman is right to focus on the fact that it was the regulatory and charter constraints of the GSEs that kept that box closed.”

    http://calculatedrisk.blogspot.com/2008/07/krugman-on-gses.html

  228. Stu says:

    Yeah,

    I’m flying out to Columbus Ohio in a dash-8 this Saturday at 5pm. Who wants to bet the flight gets canceled. Just checked the seating chart at Continental.com and there are about 7 of us on the plane. I guess this is why the airfare was $120. If it does fly, look for me in the obits.

  229. Stu says:

    Shore/Ket,

    Have you been following IKE? My guess is that it’s gonna be a 3 or 4 and it’s gonna hit Florida pretty hard. We’ll see.

  230. Major Bloodnok says:

    John
    “most millionaires are self made”

    Horse poop. Link?

  231. Major Bloodnok says:

    Manhattan commercial re is officially scrod.
    Vornado now unable to unload a giant, prime commercial space next to my office for upwards of a year.
    Hate to think what the carrying costs are.

  232. ben says:

    most millionaires were people making commissions and bonuses off selling dot-com stocks and mortgage backed securities.

  233. kettle1 says:

    stu,

    re IKE,

    i agree, but atleast florida isnt behind levees and has something of a history of hurricane building codes

  234. Major Bloodnok says:

    Bi

    “today skep-tic is lightening you up. but you seem too dense so far”

    He defends his corporate masters well.

  235. John says:

    WASHINGTON MUT INC SB NT 4.625% 04/01/2014 Price (Ask) 49.520
    Yield to Worst (Ask) 20.107%

  236. still_looking says:

    mb 228,

    what’s really sick is the number of residential foreclosures that are still growing geometrically.

    then I popped over to look at ajwillner auctions… gyms, carpet/flooring stores and a caterer (among others.)

    all bankruptcy related — court ordered…

    and the giant pig is still not anywhere near the a.s.s end of the snake…. barely just past it’s gullet.

    sl

  237. Major Bloodnok says:

    kettle

    “atleast florida isnt behind levees and has something of a history of hurricane building codes”

    I keep wondering what we’ll all say when the Big One hits San Francisco.

    Hurricanes will seem so passe.

  238. Secondary Market says:

    @228
    do you have an address?

  239. John says:

    most millionaires are older folks in their 50s who make around 80-120K a year who have consistently chipped in to 401k, have paid off house or nearly has and had a good stock or bond plan and made some decent gains from 1988 t 1998. millionaire is just a million in assets, hard to imagine a 55 year old still employed between 401K and home equity in the NY/NJ area that don’t have a million. Now making a million a year income is a rarity. But most folk got their million through steady savings and no unxepected events over 30 years and came from a plain old middle class type of family.

  240. NJGator says:

    FROM THE AMERICAN PROSPECT

    Shorter version of the speech: Alaska! [Cut to baby] “Community organizers” suck. [Cut to baby] DRILL, BABY, DRILL! [Cut to baby] John McCain = American hero. [Cut to entire family onstage.]

  241. John says:

    http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601093&refer=home&sid=atUvJoPc9zpU

    I am sorry my posting has been sporadic of late but it is a new season of GG and the housing crisis will have to wait for a few months.

  242. Major Bloodnok says:

    235 secondary

    near UBS building in Manhattan.

  243. NJGator says:

    FROM THE AMERICAN PROSPECT

    Shorter version of the speech: Alaska! [Cut to baby] “Community organizers” suck. [Cut to baby] DRILL, BABY, DRILL! [Cut to baby] John McC = American hero. [Cut to entire family onstage.]

  244. Major Bloodnok says:

    Big Three bailout may be around corner
    http://tinyurl.com/58pwuq

    So now we’ve got to bail out the auto makers who are also too big to fail.

    I’m beginning to think we need a list of American corporations that do NOT need to be bailed out. Fewer names to remember.

    We’ll teach capitalism along with Latin.

    Dead economic theories to go with dead languages.

  245. PGC says:

    #225 Stu

    If SP is one of the 7 I would get off the plane.

  246. Julie says:

    Stu Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 1:28 pm
    DJIA approaching -300 drop on the day. Sarah and Rudy’s speeches have really got the market rolling.

    http://preview.tinyurl.com/5pglcf

    Huh? I thought it was from the retail and unemployment data.

  247. Nicholas says:

    On the Big Three bailout topic,

    My office mate says that a bailout won’t help the Big Three if no one wants to buy their cars. He noted in a conversation from someone from West Texas about “what kind of cars do they drive around here?”

    The response was if your poor you drive a ford ranger, if your rich you drive an F150″

    Honestly, a bailout just makes me sick. The US auto manufactures knew for a very long time that there was a trend towards more fuel efficient vehicles. I was at the University of Maryland back in the early 2000’s and they had a hybrid vehicle project sponsored by GM. GM cut the funding to the program and it was dropped from the University. The very next day I went out and bought foreign.

  248. John says:

    I save give us all a 20K tax rebate if we purchase a 2009 Caddie!!!!!! Heck how about a Hybrid Tahoe XL so I can crush those little Prius clogging up the hybrid only spots at wild by nature.

  249. Nicholas says:

    Big Three have had 8 years to retool for more fuel efficient vehicles and they squandered it.

    The crickets should have been taking notes on what the ants were doing instead of spending the summer playing. Winter is in and its getting cold…

  250. Stu says:

    “Huh? I thought it was from the retail and unemployment data.”

    Well both numbers were not that bleak. I thought the beige book report yesterday was much worse, but the market rallied a bit on the release at mid-day. On the bright side, Walmart is up ;) Must be all of those wealthy people shopping to create jobs for us low and middle classers.

    Honestly, the big report comes tomorrow. The dreaded (and manipulated) unemployment rate. Duh duh duh duhhhhhhh.

  251. Stu says:

    And yes, I realize that I’m loaded with anecdotal evidence and strawmen arguments to support my cause. Didn’t I mention that I’m a registered Republican?

  252. rhymingrealtor says:

    Doesn’t the current occupant of the WH think the Creator speaks directly through him? We all know how fantastic that turned out.

    Thanks Gator,

    I have said that on many occasion, it is not only GWB who thinks that he is led by god lest we not forget Os@@@ B*n La$%n. I do not put faith in people who think God leads them I fear them.

    KL

  253. Shore Guy says:

    Stu,

    From around Morristown to Cleveland is about 6-61/2hours driving. Given the drive to the airport, the time it takes to get through security, delays, flight time, and time getting a rental car on the other end, I would advocate driving. It is not a bad drive to Cleveland. You can leave around the same time you would anyway and get there the same time, without having to worry about getting stuck in airline hell.

  254. I save give us all a 20K tax rebate if we purchase a 2009 Caddie!!!!!!

    Ewww. How about I get the 20k tax rebate, buy a used Citroen DS and keep a mechanic employed for a few years.

  255. Julie says:

    “Didn’t I mention that I’m a registered Republican?”

    Then you must be a bitter American.

  256. d2b says:

    I need a new TV. I want to keep standard cable, but run it through a flat screen. Does anyone do this? What will the picture quality be like?

  257. #247 – You’re right the numbers weren’t that bleak. We’ve seen as bad before without this reaction. I’m at a loss here. Unless someone got a sneak peak at the employment numbers.

  258. Clotpoll says:

    skep (116)-

    O probably does understand this. However, much like Corzine, he is too beholden to a constituency which demands massive wealth redistribution. He must forge ahead in his plan, no matter what the consequence.

  259. Victorian says:

    254- db

    Better than a tube for sure. But standard definition TV definitely pales in comparison to HDTV.

    Plus, some LCD TV’s do have ATSC tuners built-in – so, if some channels are broadcast in HDTV, they automatically pick them up.

  260. #253 – I did. Picture quality will depend on your cable service provider. Most cable companies compress their signal a lot; the more channels you have, the less bandwidth you have to send data for any single channel and the crappier the channels will look. Most regular TV looks bad in HD, it doesn’t have to but it does because of the compression.
    Basically if you can see blockiness and artifacts on your TV in standard def it’s going to be very obvious in HD.
    DVDs look very good though.

  261. bi says:

    the best way to get name recognition is by tabloid type of news. the liberal media did a great favor for her. now RNC completed its first step in its stragegy package. Next, they will argue that even our number 2 has more experience than your number 1.

    “In fact, it came close to upsetting 0’s historic address on Thursday — the most-watched convention speech in history (38.4 million viewers).”

    http://www.thrfeed.com/2008/09/palin-ratings-s.html

  262. Stu says:

    bi:

    Wow. And I thought it would have had super bowl ratings.

    For what it’s worth, offshore online bookies put O ahead of M as a 9 to 5 favorite over M. Of course this line could change, especially it the Republicans get any kind of ‘bump’ in their polls.

  263. Jaw says:

    I am looking for the NJ Real Estate blog, can someone please direct me to the right place? Thanks.

  264. MrT says:

    “Didn’t I mention that I’m a registered Republican?”

    Then you must be a bitter American.

    “yeah..bitter…and clinging to your guns and religion”..ha…Sarah slammed that arrogant dork last night..

    by the way…..when is Rev. Jeremiah’s next sermon? I can’t believe the dems didn’t let him speak w/ that empty suit obama in front of the plastic roman columns in Denver..

    they could’ve had Michelle and Jeremiah do a fist bump everytime Obama said he’d raise taxes..

    I still can’t believe Obama is the guy the dems got behind instead of hilary…..idiots……ha

  265. Stu says:

    ShoreGuy:

    I have driven to Cincinnati and Columbus as I have a sister and brother who live in those cities respectively. Although I weighed the option of driving, I am now meeting my sister on Saturday night 10 miles south of Dayton. Plus, as my Civic ages gracefully, it begins to overheat when I drive over 75 in the Summer. If I have the AC on, that drops to 70 top speed. Since flying is cheaper than driving (got a $120 round trip fare) the ‘man’ won’t reimburse me. I like turbulence anyway so those 50mph gusts will be fun in a turbo prop. most likely, flight will be canceled and I’ll go on an ERJ in the morning on Sunday. I do appreciate the advice though.

  266. Stu says:

    Jaw: The election is in 10 weeks, after that the program should return to normal, I’m sure.

  267. bi says:

    this will probably be the most interesting election in your life time. if 0 wins, he will be the first half black and half white american president with funny name. if M wins, you will see first female VP(and eventually P in 4 years i think). more importantly, unlike previous 4 elections, their views and policies are so different. worth watching.

  268. d2b says:

    The flat screen is going in a commercial location. I want to hang it on the wall in my office, replacing an old 20 in set. You get a few free channels when you have comcast Internet. So right now my cable is free. I would bet that Comcast will want an arm and a leg for HD cable in a commercial establishment. That’s why I don’t want to upgrade. I will probably go flat and if the quality is very poor I will upgrade the cable.

  269. Tom says:

    The big three really screwed up. I would have thought they would have learned after the first time Japan came over and ate their lunch but they didn’t.

    Japan beat them out by making better, higher quality cars. The big three started making a comeback because they started building bigger cars, not better cars and were able to make huge margins on them.

    But when the credit got tighter and the gas got too expensive, and the big three had no backup plan.

    Times were easy for a long while and people have to realize they’re really going to have to start working for their money again.

  270. d2b says:

    I love the election debate. But I feel that it all comes down to Ohio and Florida. I think that O would have been a lock in Ohio if he picked Hillary. It will be interesting to see what the Clinton’s role in this will be and what price that O will have to pay if they come out in full force.

    In the end, Red states will vote Red and Blue states will vote Blue.

    When millions of people are grasping at reasons to justify SP’s qualifications, you realize the intense hatred that is involved in modern day partisan politics. Do people love SP or hate Democrats?

  271. randy says:

    i’m not that interested at all in the election, neither of these Bozos is qualified to run a corner bodega nevermind oversee the crash of the once mighty USA

  272. 3b says:

    #255 toshiro:Unless someone got a sneak peak at the employment numbers.

    Always a possibility, or perhaps people are finally realizing that no matter how much the powers that be try to manipulate this market/economy/mtg mess real estate bubble, in the end the market will win, and this has to play out accordingly.

    I have been astounded over and over again to hear supposedly intelligent knowledeable people talk about a turn around in the second half of 2008;sbolutely amazing to hear that chatter.

    Maybe the realtiy is finally setting in that this thing has to play out, there is no good news on the horizon and there can be no turn around until we hit bottom.

    And on a real estate note 5 new listings have come on in my town since Tuesday. In addition as I predicted in the past, quite afew of the houses listed in the low 400K’s have now been reduced to the 399K level.

    They are not all great, but one, I was told in the past by several “knowledgeable” long time local realtors we would never see a house in my town listed for under 400K again, (well they were wrong as we now have 10), and two this now puts pressure on all of the other listings in the low 400k’s which in turn puts pressure on the higher priced houses available and so on.

    And this is in my Bergen Co train town.

  273. jcer says:

    Randy, finally someone has said it, you speak the truth. None of these people really seem to represent the best that America has. Besides O none of them seem very intelligent and O I think is blinded by his myopic view of the world and ideology.

  274. Hard Place says:

    Jaw Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 3:58 pm
    I am looking for the NJ Real Estate blog, can someone please direct me to the right place? Thanks.

    Didn’t you realize talking about real estate is passe unless it goes up? We may not be talking about RE for quite some time.

  275. afe says:

    grim- are you on vaca?

  276. Tom says:

    People don’t genuinely love SP. At least I don’t believe most people do.

    I think they HAVE to lover her. They don’t really have a choice. McC could have pulled out Ahmadinejad and the republicans would have been forced to accept him and praise him.

    He’s the only horse they have in this race so they have to get behind him and in public say the best they can about the ticket. Even if they say otherwise when the mic is turned off.

    I think that the RNC is probably fighting hard to convince people not to have someone break away and get on the ballot independantly.

  277. Hard Place says:

    Since we are talking politics, I really don’t like either ticket.

    I miss the Clinton/Gore days…

    Also wish that Gore took the helm. He’s a politician that gets it.

  278. HEHEHE says:

    I think my expatriate Ohioan’s from all corners of the state can celebrate the fact that we won’t be there to watch the mind numbing hours of campaign commercials.

  279. Mike NJ says:

    Comcast puts out digital as well as analog cable without a converter through their lines. You won’t know what you get until you hook up an HDTV and perform a full “channel scan”

    If there are HD digital channels they will come in. More than likely you will get CBS, NBC, ABC, Fox, 9, 11 and PBS all in digital HD. This is all without a converter box. You just need to make sure you get a TV that has a QAM tuner built in.

    I get all these channels in HD in my upstairs bedroom without a box. Works great.

  280. skep-tic says:

    #260 Here is an update on the real estate market, GOP style:

    “And the fruits that thy soul lusted after are departed from thee, and all things which were dainty and goodly are departed from thee, and thou shalt find them no more at all.” Revelations 18:14

    Discuss in tongues.

  281. John says:

    Who says Japanese make better cars? My ten year old totaled Sable still drove like a champ under its own power onto the flatbed the insurance company sent over. The damm top of the line Lexus scores a near perfect score in consumers but those final few points cost you 40K over an american car, not a good value proposition. Better to me is price versus price, Consumer reports seems to throw that out the window. They compare Japanese and German Cars that are at a far more cost, a 32K 2009 CTS is up agains 45K BMWs and they say the BMW is slightly better, yea that I agree with, but for 13K it should be a heck of a lot better.

    Also what does the Big o drive?

  282. MrT says:

    “Didn’t I mention that I’m a registered Republican?”

    Then you must be a bitter American.

    Huh??

    yeah..bitter…and clinging to your guns and religion..

    ha…i love how that alaska governor slammed that arrogant dork last night..

    by the way…..when is Rev. Jeremiah’s next sermon? I can’t believe the dems didn’t let him speak w/ that empty suit obama in front of the plastic roman columns in Denver..

    they could’ve had Michelle and Jeremiah do a fist bump everytime Obama said he’d raise taxes..

    I still can’t believe Obama is the guy the dems got behind instead of hilary…?

  283. Tom says:

    “Also what does the Big o drive?”

    The way some people talk about him my first guess would be a winged chariot.

    But I remember seeing a report that said he drove a Chrysler 300C.

  284. All Hype says:

    Gotta love LEH. They come up with some pretty funny ideas….

    http://biz.yahoo.com/rb/080904/lehman_assets.html?.v=2

    What’s next?
    1. Bake sale
    2. Car wash
    3. ????

  285. HEHEHE says:

    Five Things You Need to Know: Pimco’s Gross Lets the Freak Out

    PIMCO’a Gross calls for the government to buy financial assets.

  286. HEHEHE says:

    Five Things You Need to Know: Pimco’s Gross Lets the Freak Out

    PIMCO’a Gross calls for the government to buy financial assets.

    http://www.minyanville.com/articles/PIMCO-gross-Federal-Reserve-Alan-greenspanasset/index/a/18807

  287. 3b says:

    #280 All: Leh? These are tough guys

    3. Beefsteak Fundraiser.

  288. John says:

    http://www.car-accidents.com/

    Since we are talking auto crashes and the housing crash this site has some great photos, you can even search by make and model and see what your own car looks like after a major crash.

  289. kettle1 says:

    all hype,

    maybe they should call jerry lewis.

  290. bairen says:

    ATTENTION ALL BAGHOLDERS and POSERS

    1) The housing ATM has been turned off

    2) Most stock options are underwater

    3) Your 401k are now 201ks

    4) Your credit cards are getting maxed out

    How long before you capitulate in mass?

    Sorry, you are individuals, not IBs or money losing manufacturers. The government will not bail you out but will feel for you as the compassionate conservatives like to say.

  291. Tom says:

    Lehman is going about it all wrong.

    What they should do is set up a program with the SBA to give guaranteed low interest loans to 10’s of thousands of minority and woman owned small businesses to start up local RE companies to buy up it’s RE assets.

    The argument could be that the locals will be able to better manage the assets because they are more familiar with the target markets.

    Lehman gets a pat on the back for giving opportunities to these underserved small business markets and then as they fail they collect from the SBA.

    Kind of a fight fire with fire approach.

    See, you don’t need to be a Harvard Business School graduate to come up with this crazy crap.

  292. make $ says:

    Kettle,

    Try the koreans they almost bought some junk from Merrill. A fool and their money will go separate ways.

  293. HEHEHE says:

    Maybe the Koreans will want to buy it?

  294. make $ says:

    What they should do is set up a program with the SBA to give guaranteed low interest loans to 10’s of thousands of minority and woman owned small businesses to start up local RE companies to buy up it’s RE assets.

    Tom,

    And where are they gonna get this money to loan out. They do not have any cash on the Balance sheet

  295. Tom says:

    make $,

    They borrow it from the FED.

  296. Tom says:

    make $,

    It would be a short term loan. They borrow the money from the FED, loan it to the small businesses, which in turn use the money to buy the LEH RE assets. Then they pay off the FED and watch what the suckers do.

  297. bi says:

    CBS/NYT poll: M 42%, O 42% from Monday to Wednesday. O dropped 8% from last week.

    http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/09/04/opinion/polls/main4416798.shtml

  298. skep-tic says:

    I think it will be very interesting to see Mr. O on O’Reilly tonight. Yes, O’Reilly is not the most respectable guy on TV, but I expect that this will be the first time (and perhaps only in this election) that Mr. O will actually be asked difficult questions.

  299. pgc says:

    #294

    I predict that he will roll over like a puppy. Fox will either go neutral or for O.

  300. Tom says:

    O’hothead to O “You’re a good guy and we like you.”

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8bTlJGg_SU&feature=related

    Bill also has a video of what happened before the incident. He claims an O Staffer was blocking the shot. On the phone to someone else at F News Bill states he may have called him an SOB but there was nothing phisical. You can clearly see Bill O pushing this guy twice in the clip he showed.

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-H-s2AHbfeE

    I don’t get these people. Do they think we’re this stupid? That with the information available to us we can’t see how they’re copletely full of it.

    Apparently a lot of people are that stupid as bill has the most watched news show out there.

    Some parts I pointed out on SP’s speech are still in mod :(

  301. Mikeinwaiting says:

    It would seem that Palin did better than expected. As I have posted before I think it was a good move on M’s part. Also looking forward to O on O Reilly. What ever the out come of election we are going to hell in a hand basket. As most here know the worst is yet to come in a lot of ways.
    Long & short term. So relax my friends we are aware & I hope prepared. Best to all in the troubled times ahead to all.

  302. NJGator says:

    296 Chifi – It’s sad that John Stewart has become the best source of real news in America.

  303. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Did I really say “all” twice have to type slower & think.

  304. bairen says:

    300th!

  305. NJGator says:

    Palin Accuses ‘O/B Ds’ of Attacking Her Family, But Campaign Can’t Name One
    September 04, 2008 8:05 PM

    Alaska Gov. Sarah Palin sent out a fundraising solicitation today that charged that “the O/B Democrats have been vicious in their attacks directed toward me, my family and John McC.”

    I asked spokespeople of the McC campaign and the R National Committee just which “O/B Ds” they’re referring to.

    The response I got was that O spokesman Mark Bubriski erroneously attacked Palin as a supporter of Pat Buchanan.

    That’s it. That’s the evidence.

    An attack on Palin herself.

    In other words, they can’t name one person affiliated with the O-B campaign who attacked the Palin family.

    But she made the charge anyway, to help raise money.

    Incidentally, in 1998 Sen. John McC, R-Ariz, told the following joke at a Republican fundraiser:

    “Why is Chelsea C so ugly?” McC joked about the then-President’s then-teenage daughter. “Because her father is Janet Reno.”

    ”This is the bad boy,” he told the New York Times’ Maureen Dowd. “It was stupid and cruel and insensitive. I’ve apologized. I can’t take it back. I could give you a whole bunch of excuses, but there are no excuses. I was wrong, but do you want me crucified? How many days does it need to be a story?'”

    Now THAT is attacking someone’s family!

    http://blogs.abcnews.com/politicalpunch/2008/09/palin-accuses-o.html

  306. Essex says:

    Matt Scully, speechwriter for Quayle and Bush–a longtime pro at reaching this particular constituency, as well as a Rove team player–wrote Palin’s speech. (I won’t go into how the Obamas write their own.) We’ll see what will come out of Palin’s mouth when she’s just talking

  307. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Sorry Gator not going O on one off the cuff remark by M.

  308. NJGator says:

    Michael Strahan’s ex has listed their Montclair mansion for sale. Asking price is $7.75M. The house was purchased in 2000 for $1.37M.

    The current assessment (Oct 06 market) is $3,833,400.

    Jean Strahan bagholder? Or did the Strahan’s get the sweetest assessment in town during the revaluation? If that house is really worth $7.75M, then they are getting an $80,000+ tax break each year.

    http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2008/09/michael_strahans_exwife_is_sel.html

  309. Confused In NJ says:

    The interesting thing about all the current candidates is they don’t seem to cast reflections in mirrors. I am moving a portion of my assets into silver bullets, garlic, wooden shaft cross bows, and holy water.

  310. chicagofinance says:

    Am I the only one here who plans to stay in New Jersey?

  311. NJGator says:

    Chifi 320 – If you’re the only one left, you can squat in the Strahan house. It seems pretty comfy.

  312. Stuck in NJ says:

    We have to stay because of my husband’s job or we would leave.

  313. chicagofinance says:

    chicagofinance Says:
    September 4th, 2008 at 10:27 pm
    Am I the only one here who plans to stay in New Jersey?

    I did not post this item.
    I am logging off for the evening, so anything else under my handle is not genuine.

  314. Mikeinwaiting says:

    M did well let the debates begin.

  315. Shore Guy says:

    Mike,

    A solid B to B- for M, which I count as a victory. That combined with P’s A to A+ and it looks like the ship might not sink after all.

  316. Mikeinwaiting says:

    We are in the hunt Shore. B for sure as this is not his strong suit. It is going to one of the most interesting & critical elections in a long time.

  317. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Chifi, someone using your handle not cool.

  318. Mikeinwaiting says:

    http://newmls.gsmls.com/public/show_public_report_rpt.do?report=clientfull&Id=36060483_11260

    Here is some bang for the buck. I’m sure one of are able negotiators could get a deal on this one. Sh*t that commute again! Sorry about the tease.

  319. Mikeinwaiting says:

    3b 280 Good now it is getting interesting.
    Know most of the top agents in town they don’t want to get into it with me since I told them last year what would happen, all going as predicted now I don’t think they want to know. But they aren’t trying to dispute me any more. Really sh*ting on my call for 1 year from now. Gotta love it.

  320. Renter says:

    What is your prediction?

  321. Tom says:

    Ooops.. either my eyes or wikipedia is playing tricks on me. Doesn’t seem to say 70 employees now.

  322. evildoc says:

    ==Lieberman is not a democrat. He may be registered as one, but he is in the Senate as an Independent. He lost his parties primary on his war stance and then ran on his own. Its fair that he won. His name recognition and previous record carried him when he split the vote. When he is up for re-election he will have a lot of work to do to stop being kicked to the curb. A lot of people will see his current antics as sour grapes and petty retaliation. I don’t think he can realistically join the Republicans as the base would not tolerate him. Although Bloomberg has flipped between parties, either side would be glad to have him back as he has run the independent line without bitterness.===

    I speculate McCain will make Lieberman his secretary of defense.

    regards

    evil

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