Foreclosure Enron?

From DealBook/NYT:

Blame Abounds Over a Flawed Foreclosure Review

Private consultants and federal regulators are facing a fresh round of scrutiny in Washington after botching a broad review of foreclosures and failing to thwart financial misdeeds.

A new report by the Government Accountability Office will take aim at the Federal Reserve and the Office of the Comptroller of the Currency for creating a bureaucratic maze that delayed relief to homeowners in foreclosure, according to a draft of the 74-page document provided to The New York Times. The regulators, the report found, designed a flawed review of troubled loans that the consultants carried out and mishandled.

Adding to the scrutiny, the Senate Banking Committee plans to hold a hearing next week to examine the foreclosure review and other recent missteps at consulting firms like Promontory Financial and Deloitte & Touche, according to several people with direct knowledge of the matter. Senator Sherrod Brown, the Ohio Democrat leading the inquiry, is expected to broadly question the quality and independence of consulting firms that are paid billions of dollars by the same banks they are expected to police.

While regulators will continue requiring banks to hire consultants in times of stress, some officials say they are worried about the quality of the work. New York’s banking regulator, Benjamin M. Lawsky, is also investigating the use of consultants and could seek to impose greater oversight of the firms, a person briefed on the matter said.

The tales of anguished homeowners have prompted an outcry on Capitol Hill.

Senator Elizabeth Warren, Democrat of Massachusetts, and Representative Elijah Cummings, Democrat of Maryland, recently opened an inquiry into the consultants’ flawed review of foreclosure abuses. Representative Carolyn B. Maloney, Democrat of New York, also pressed regulators to disclose the consultants’ fee structure for the review.

Ben S. Bernanke, the chairman of the Fed, and Thomas Curry, the comptroller of the currency, replied to her request last week without detailing the payments or revealing the results of the review, saying that “we are currently in the process of developing and analyzing this information,” according to a copy of the letter.

Still, the regulators have not escaped criticism for their role in the bungled foreclosure review. The G.A.O.’s report traces problems to the regulators, not the consultants.

Homeowners paid the price, the G.A.O. report concluded. Struggling borrowers submitted requests for relief and “waited nearly a year before receiving an update,” the report said.

This entry was posted in Mortgages, National Real Estate, Politics, Risky Lending. Bookmark the permalink.

86 Responses to Foreclosure Enron?

  1. grim says:

    So are we turning Japanese, or are the Japanese turning American? Oh bother, I’m so confused, can someone keep all of these analogies straight?

    Anyway, it seems we are all subprime Keynesians now. From the WSJ:

    Money Spigot Opens Wider

    The Bank of Japan’s new leaders delivered on their pledge to radically overhaul its strategy to revive Japan’s economy, unveiling a package of easy-money policies Thursday so aggressive in scale and tactics that it surprised investors.

    Japan’s central bank will double its holdings of government bonds and the amount of yen circulating in its economy, joining major central banks that since the financial crisis have been testing the limits of their powers in a grand—and some say risky—experiment to stimulate the sluggish global economy.

    As the Bank of Japan embraced more easy money, the European Central Bank and Bank of England left their relaxed monetary policies unchanged Thursday, and some U.S. Federal Reserve officials have begun talking about when to end its $85 billion a month in bond buying.

    The Bank of Japan’s new tactics echo moves by the Fed: aggressive buying of long-term securities, accompanied by clearly stated targets and backed by bold talk of commitment from the central bank chief. The goal is to push down long-term interest rates, spurring consumers and businesses to borrow more, spend more and invest more.

    “This is an entirely new dimension of monetary easing, both in terms of quantity and quality,” the Bank of Japan’s new governor, Haruhiko Kuroda, said Thursday. The BOJ said the programs would continue at least two years.

    The strategy seeks to broadly change Japanese behavior and attitudes that have contributed to depressed spending, wages and prices over the past two decades. With rising consumer prices, the Bank of Japan seeks more spending and economic vitality.

  2. grim says:

    Some Econorap for a Friday morning. On the train? Turn up the headphones, your neighbor will appreciate it, the classic Keynes vs Hayek rap-off:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d0nERTFo-Sk

  3. Fabius Maximus says:

    #2 grim

    So will Lib do this beatbox at the next GTG?

  4. Mike says:

    Good Morning New Jersey

  5. grim says:

    Grim’s wife, after walking over and briefly watching #2: “If there was any remaining shred of doubt that you are a not a nerd, I think this settles it.”

  6. Brian says:

    I’ll party with Keynes anytime…..

  7. Natasha says:

    #5
    I think I have to agree with Grim’s wife :)

  8. Painhrtz - Doc Daneeka says:

    Lawyers, scientists and computer professionals, Were there any doubts this board was filled with geeks. Hell the only alpha male here is JJ ; ) now I need to get back to my debate on why the Emperor needed Anakin to turn to bring balance to the force on another board

  9. Comrade Nom Deplume, briefly up for air says:

    Just heard from Kettle1. That was a nice surprise.

  10. JSMC says:

    Japan is in a very bad place on the long term for their economy for one very simple reason: they aren’t having kids.

    Women there are becoming more independent, and in a place like Japan where a woman has to choose housewife or career, most are choosing career. The men are increasingly becoming sad, pitiful excuses that live with their parents for years, don’t get jobs, don’t even go out and try to find a girlfriend; they just sit around whacking off to their cute Anime girl body pillows. They are the anti-JJ.

    If they don’t start pumping out kids, it doesn’t matter what the gov’t over there does, they won’t be able to rebuild their economy as the population gets older, retires, and no one younger can take over.

    That country needs a huge culture shock if they want to survive another 50 years.

  11. grim says:

    +88k jobs, hugely under estimates, unemployment rate fell to 7.6%, but nobody is going to care (participation rate fell). Prior two months were revised significantly higher, Feb +27k, and Jan +29k, probably the only positive news this morning.

  12. JJ says:

    There are a lot of hot jap girls. Tokyo is extremely expensive, commutes are long and housing is extremely expensive and small. There is also immense pressure to study in school dawn to dust 7 days a week than land at a top company where to move up the ladder you need to work 16 hours a day.

    Hard to pump out tons of kids.

    I was at a Big Four Public Accounting Firms Office in Tokyo during non-busy season. It was 8pm and tons of folks there. I say 75% had run out of work but did not want to leave “early”, some kids had two hour commutes. So leave for work at six am get home from work at 11 every day.

    Also Japan does not value youth, kids get paid peanuts, until you are over 40 you get paid peanuts. Usually the big promotion they make you wait till 40 and there is no job hopping.

    Folks like me dont exist in Japan.

  13. grim says:

    The men are increasingly becoming sad, pitiful excuses that live with their parents for years, don’t get jobs, don’t even go out and try to find a girlfriend; they just sit around whacking off to their cute Anime girl body pillows.

    (moms, turn away)

    The only hope for de-pussification of America is that they re-released the sharp metal Tonka trucks again. Now your boys can too hop on board their rusty, tetanus encrusted Tonka dump truck and kamikaze down the biggest hill in the neighborhood without any regard for their safety. If they are lucky, they’ll only break an arm and be the most popular kid in school for 2 months. God bless the USA.

    Dads, your job this weekend is to build a bicycle ramp so you and your kids can jump your BMX bikes over a pile of flaming garbage.

    Me? I have a girl, I’m going out to buy a Mossberg.

  14. JJ says:

    Realtors crack me up. Anyhow so agent does usual trick where they try to make you “pregnant” with the deal. Meaning before final price is decided I have to get my lawyer involved and a home inspection so if I back out I am out like $1,000 bucks. Realtors call it making buyers “pregnant” with deal as it is very hard to get out of and few do.

    After I get done getting rammed in every orifice by the agent I am about to put ink to contract after mulling it over for nearly one month. I announce I want a 25K price cut.

    Seller and Agent are about to feel like fresh meat at Platos Retreat. I am about to back out, unit is empty all their stuff is moved out, they hired a lawyer, paid for new copy of offering plan and it turns out it is near impossible to get a condo mortgage on a sandy damaged building it could take two to four months I am told so their choices are not cut price make a cash deal, furnishing entire place to make it a summer rental. Make it a full time rental which means they have to paint it and throw 5k into it then wait several weeks or try to sell to next person which will take 1-3 months then 1-3 months to close.

    I may be Pregnant but they are having triplets. Then I announce there is another new listing in building, women has terminal cancer desperate for cash willing to take a huge discount, I dont like that unit but I could always just say what the heck.

    So the knuckleheads leave me hanging till 8pm before they knock off 5% for a cash deal.

    I tell realtor you know what this is what I originally wanted to pay, but you nickled and dime me up. Now I had to nickle and dime you back down you just wasted a lot of time.

    Realtors are like girls who make you buy them flowers before they put out so they dont feel like a Ho. The realtor rather than just accept my low ball offer, had to show seller she was doing her job by fighting with me for a few weeks before she finally gave in. I give her credit she was not easy. BTW I would date girls quicker who made me buy them flowers first then girls who after a few one liners at Bordy Barn is swallowing harder than the winner of the coney island hot dog eating contest.

  15. JSMC says:

    #13

    I’m not quite that pessimistic about our country’s chances. We already respect a woman’s ability to have kids and a career, and as long as teenage boys continue to chase teenage girls, the situation in Japan won’t happen here (at least to the extent it does over there). All the sad excuses of men have to do is get laid and we’ll continue to survive…as a country of pansies, but survive nonetheless.

    However, be very scared when VR porno is invented. That will be the downfall of society, and no one will notice.

  16. anon (the good one) says:

    this got to be politically motivated. % unemployment would significantly go down if they were to hire all yhe ppl needed.from the nyt

    “Before the recession, at the start of 2007, Walmart had an average of 338 employees per store at its United States stores and Sam’s Club locations. Now, it has 281 per store, having cut the number of United States employees while adding hundreds of stores.

    “In its larger supercenter stores, Walmart can’t keep the shelves stocked, and that is driving customers away,” said Terrie Ellerbee, associate editor at the grocery industry publication The Shelby Report, in an e-mail.

  17. Natasha says:

    Me? I have a girl, I’m going out to buy a Mossberg

    The Mossberg isn’t going to help you when she is out in the world without you pushing the stroller. They get older and go out without you a lot! My daughter goes to the mall with her friends and is accosted by random boys every time. The boys “try” to be all cool and witty, but they end up being all “stupid”. The girls just smirk and walk away :) Don’t worry-girls have all the power-always did and always will.

  18. Mike says:

    Natasha 16 You are 100% right about that one.

  19. Bystander says:

    JJ,

    I thought the market was red hot with cash investors lined up to buy investment properties. Why are you able to delay and strong arm sellers? The media narrative does not make sense, if so.

  20. Brian says:

    13 –
    Don’t buy a Mossberg now, you’ll get robbed (by the seller that is). Wait until after all the conspiracy theory wackos stop bellyaching about gun control and the dust settles.

  21. Comrade Nom Deplume, briefly up for air says:

    [16] natasha,

    True, but a father or uncle with a whispered reputation for being one with bloodhound skills who will leave your body in a shallow grave in a state forest just for feeling up their 15YO daughter or niece cannot hurt.

    My niece’s friends fall into two camps: Those who think Uncle Nom sounds pretty cool, and those who told my niece that they are vaguely afraid of Uncle Nom. The latter set is very small and made up entirely of boys.

  22. Comrade Nom Deplume, briefly up for air says:

    [16] natasha

    “Don’t worry-girls have all the power-always did and always will.”

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ufdpf7bCXBo

  23. Natasha says:

    #21 Comrade
    LMAO- that is “exactly” what I was talking about.

  24. Essex says:

    13. I once smacked a kid on the head with a metal tonka truck. Was my birthday party and he crossed the line.

  25. JJ says:

    I am only looking at Sandy Damaged Properties that cannot get a mortgage and owner is no longer living there and carrying two places.

    Therefore Cash Only Quick Sale needed to stop the bleeding. I am rolling dice as usual and practicing what I preach, never waste a good crisis.

    Selling all my garbage taxable Junk Bonds trading above Par to buy, here is a beauty I just sold at 101.246 I bought back in the crisis for 46. Nice fat 100%+ gain.

    People think buying cash at all time low rates is always a bad move. Depends. In my case I am selling bonds at all time highs to buy so I am still taking advantage of low rates. I am only selling taxable bonds as now that tax rates went way up and they are overpriced they are no longer great investments, I would say they are so so investments.

    AMERICAN GEN FIN CORP 6.00000% 12/15/2014 FR
    Margin Shares: -11,000.000 Price: $101.246 Amount: $11,347.89

    Bystander says:
    April 5, 2013 at 9:32 am

    JJ,

    I thought the market was red hot with cash investors lined up to buy investment properties. Why are you able to delay and strong arm sellers? The media narrative does not make sense, if so.

  26. Painhrtz - Doc Daneeka says:

    A girl with self esteem is a dangerous weapon in and of themselves. Then again me meeting future boyfriend with a Kimber .45 tucked into my waisteband is just as effective.

    Though I think I am going the clot method and introducing her to hockey and lacrosse. Turn her into an undateable weapon of mass destruction at least for high school anyway.

    Grim we bought both little pains the metal dump trucks. Every kid should get tonka related stitches

  27. Juice Box says:

    No cheerleaders in this group I gather. My two boys have my devastating good looks blue eyes and the dormant blond hair gene has come back into the family since we rejoined the Viking blood lines that were separated by a few thousand years of history. I am worried that I will be a grandfather in a decade. Don’t laugh about half of teen fathers are Caucasian.

  28. Libtard in Union says:

    That video. Why? Just Why!

  29. yome says:

    How can I determine the amount that is taxable on my Social Security Benefit?

    To see if your Social Security payment is taxable, follow these two steps:

    (1) Find the sum of these three amounts (your ” combined income”) :

    — Your gross income (the total in the “Income” section of your tax form) +

    — Your nontaxable interest income (e.g. from municipal bonds) +

    — Your “countable” Social Security (1/2 of your yearly Social Security as shown on your SSA-1099)

    (2) Compare to the IRS Base Amount:

    — Individual: $25,000
    — Filing Jointly : $32,000

    The amount that is taxable could be anywhere from 0 to 85% of your Social Security. To determine the exact amount, see the IRS instructions for your tax form.

    The bottom line is that if you are single and your combined income is $25,000 to $34,000, you may have to pay taxes on up to 50% of your Social Security. If your combined income is over $34,000 you may have to pay taxes on up to 85% of your Social Security.

    If you file jointly and your combined income is $32,000 to $44,000, up to 50% of your Social Security may be taxable. With combined income over $44,000, up to 85% of Social Security could be taxable.

    Note that Social Security is tax-advantaged: under the formula, at least 15% of your Social Security is tax-free income.

  30. Juice Box says:

    Speaking of Japan, there are probably a least a dozen missile boats by now in the Sea of Japan, they are expecting a launch on April 15th.

    We are going to blast any North Korean missile out of the sky.

    http://english.yonhapnews.co.kr/national/2013/04/05/59/0301000000AEN20130405004300315F.HTML

  31. grim says:

    I hear the state department is prepping the dream team for an exhibition game in Pyongyang. Clearly, Rodman was only marginally successful, they should have played Jordan instead.

  32. Happy Renter says:

    “Me? I have a girl, I’m going out to buy a Mossberg.”

    I have a daughter as well, and in my experience the recoil is a bit too much to start her off on that. Start her off with a 22, they come in pink:

    http://www.ellettbrothers.com/ItemDetail.asp?iID=0136581

    ;-)

  33. Juice Box says:

    If there was any doubt who is getting tossed under the bus news is sprinkled today that Chained CPI is coming to Social Security it is and is proposed by the Democrats and will be in Obama’s Budget beginning October 1.

  34. Statler Waldorf says:

    Eh, worst case you’ll find yourself under water.

    “I am only looking at Sandy Damaged Properties”

  35. yome says:

    34 you know it will not pass. The right will ask for more, then he will say I compromise, they moved the goal post again.

  36. JJ says:

    This time I have flood insurance. I be collecting FAT checks like my neighbors next time. Hope Obama Care is in place by next hurricane dont want to hurt myself lifting my fat stacks of FEMA cash.

    Actually the 3-9 months after a major flood or hurricane based on past info from Andrew or Gloria is time to buy. People have short memories. Look at stock market and RE market now people have forgot the crash, Look at Condo and Coops downtown near world trade center, way up since towers were blown up.

    You will never get rich overestimating the intelligence of people.Folks selling in a panic today will be buying in three years.

    The flood in my town is already being forgotten. Sure we got dumpsters in every four house and some stores boarded up. But for most part by Fourth of July this will all be over. Of course we need to make it through next hurricane season undamaged. But by Spring 2014 folks will be all over Long Beach and Jersey Shore with fat stacks of cash.

    I am getting winter tenant anyhow, making him or her carry the content coverage on a renter policy and if not FEMA will sweep in if it is their primary and take care of them.

    BTW I am checking into if I can get the place furnished as a SANDY Survivor. Does anyone know of anyone who can hook me up with free furniture?
    Statler Waldorf says:
    April 5, 2013 at 11:43 am

    Eh, worst case you’ll find yourself under water.

    “I am only looking at Sandy Damaged Properties”

  37. grim says:

    “You will never get rich overestimating the intelligence of people.”

    Wiser words have never been spoken

  38. grim says:

    PT Barnum?

  39. Juice Box says:

    JJ with a dumpter every 4 houses as you say a little diving for furniture is in order?

  40. Juice Box says:

    re # 36 – Yome no budget means shutdown. Unless they decide to vote every few weeks for emergency appropriations to keep the Government open.

    Chained CPI is coming so buy up these stocks.

    Iams = Proctor and Gamble
    Friskey = Nestle

  41. Natasha says:

    Duplex in Seaside Park listed in paper for 100,000. Doesn’t mention condition of house.

  42. Anon E. Moose says:

    Juice [42];

    The show, which also stars new Hoboken residents Caroline and Albert Manzo. The Manzo’s sons, Albie and Chris, are part owners of soon-to-be-open restaurant Little Town NJ in Hoboken.

    Hey Clot, you gonna bar them from the store, too? ;-)

  43. JJ says:

    I mean brand new furniture. The dumpsters have mainly sheetrock, instalation, old bathrooms and kitchens, everyone threw out contents by Thanksgiving.

    Sleepies supposedly will give me brand new mattresses. I heard they have stacks and stacks of them to give out they donated at full MSRP from last year’s stock. I just need the beds to put them on.

    Juice Box says:
    April 5, 2013 at 1:08 pm

    JJ with a dumpter every 4 houses as you say a little diving for furniture is in order?

  44. Libtard in Union says:

    “Does anyone know of anyone who can hook me up with free furniture?”

    Wait for Spring flooding. Go to worst hit area and give flood victim $100 if you can dump old furniture into flooded basement (get some old couches from bulky waste pick up). Wait four weeks for FEMA check. This is how it’s done along the mighty Passaic.

  45. Natasha says:

    Correction #43
    Seaside Heights-big difference :)

  46. JJ says:

    Cuomo in NY is on to that scam. He now says you dont need to keep the old furniture just throw it out and tell them it was there at one point.

    Kinda like SBA lower credit people instead of loans they just give them cash. Why bother pretending they are giving it back

    Libtard in Union says:
    April 5, 2013 at 2:33 pm

    “Does anyone know of anyone who can hook me up with free furniture?”

    Wait for Spring flooding. Go to worst hit area and give flood victim $100 if you can dump old furniture into flooded basement (get some old couches from bulky waste pick up). Wait four weeks for FEMA check. This is how it’s done along the mighty Passaic.

  47. Juice Box says:

    re #4 4-

    Now the guy’s got Paulie as a partner……… But now the guy’s got to come up with Paulie’s money every week. No matter what. Business bad? Fuck you, pay me. Oh, you had a fire? Fuck you, pay me. The place got hit by lightning, huh? Fuck you, pay me. Also, Paulie could do anything. Especially run up bills on the joint’s credit. And why not? Nobody’s gonna pay for it anyway. And as soon as the deliveries are made in the front door, you move the stuff out the back and sell it at a discount. You take a two hundred dollar case of booze and you sell it for a hundred. It doesn’t matter. It’s all profit. And then finally, when there’s nothing left, when you can’t borrow another buck from the bank or buy another case of booze, you bust the joint out. You light a match.

  48. Juice Box says:

    re #44 – Now the guy’s got Paulie as a partner……(SNIP)…. But now the guy’s got to come up with Paulie’s money every week. No matter what. Business bad? Fark You, pay me. Oh, you had a fire? Farkyou, pay me. The place got hit by lightning, huh? Fark you, pay me. Also, Paulie could do anything. Especially run up bills on the joint’s credit. And why not? Nobody’s gonna pay for it anyway. And as soon as the deliveries are made in the front door, you move the stuff out the back and sell it at a discount. You take a two hundred dollar case of booze and you sell it for a hundred. It doesn’t matter. It’s all profit. And then finally, when there’s nothing left, when you can’t borrow another buck from the bank or buy another case of booze, you bust the joint out. You light a match.

  49. Juice Box says:

    And it’s gone……

    President Obama’s budget, to be released next week, will limit how much wealthy individuals – like Mitt Romney – can keep in IRAs and other retirement accounts.

    Under the plan, a taxpayer’s tax-preferred retirement account, like an IRA, could not finance more than $205,000 per year of retirement – or right around $3 million this year.

    http://thehill.com/blogs/on-the-money/domestic-taxes/292071-obama-budget-to-target-wealthy-iras

  50. Bystander says:

    JJ,

    You really are one cheap Irish b@stard. I love it. Typical 1st gen mentality- raised poor enough to reach for success but too traditional Irish to cherish anything but the simple things in life.

  51. JJ says:

    Growing up a day I did not get hit by the teacher or hit by the belt and by Dad was a good one. A pretty good day only one out of two hit me!

    My Caddie is now hip, 2.5 Men Ashton Kutchner bought one in last nights eposide.

    Bystander says:
    April 5, 2013 at 4:27 pm

    JJ,

    You really are one cheap Irish b@stard. I love it. Typical 1st gen mentality- raised poor enough to reach for success but too traditional Irish to cherish anything but the simple things in life.

  52. Bystander says:

    Well at least your Dad was so drunk he probably missed several times. Mine did. Those nuns were deadly.

  53. Fast Eddie says:

    “It was a glorious time. Wise guys were all over the place. It was before Appalachian and before Crazy Joe decided to take on a boss and start a war. It was when I met the world, and it was when I first met Jimmy Conway. He couldn’t have been more than 28, or 29 at the time… but he was already a legend.”

  54. relo says:

    8:

    What, no love for the bean counters?

  55. 250k says:

    grim and other dads of girls. you think its as simple as having a loaded mossberg around? the biggest threat to your little one might not be Jimmy, it might be Janie and her iPhone.

    http://www.suburbabble.com/post/46865510969/beauty-is-only-skin-deep-but-instagram-goes-all-the

  56. moose (44)-

    Manzos are all goombahs. They wouldn’t get near my store, since I don’t sell crappy Dago red.

  57. Fabius Maximus says:
  58. Fabius Maximus says:

    #8 pain

    You speak for yourself. I’ll put my 20s up against JJs anytime. For a small bald geek, I punched well above my weight. I spent a few years working crazy hours flying round the world and living in 5 star hotels. Nothing makes you fell like a winner at that point in your life than going to check out of a hotel and the bill is five figures.
    Fast forward to 1:35 and I did something similar at one point.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fc-uG56c7BY

  59. Fabius Maximus says:

    #13 grim

    If she is a gold star girl scout that is an instant $1K off the tuition at most colleges.
    People bash Scouts, but were else do your kids get such a grounding in the real world an learn life skills. I went camping with my son last year and work to a 40deg morning. There was no complaints out of my kid outside of a small, “Hmm, its a bit cold.” I don’t think my family will ever do the Disney cruise or the Caribbean all-in resorts. This year I have already booked a lot of camping. .

  60. Natasha says:

    #61 Fabius
    I was a scout leader for my daughter’s troop. She was in from K-8th grade. It was all for fun and socializing, but it is an excellent asset for college resumes.

  61. Natasha says:

    Had Home Depot convince me to let one of their cabinet geeks give us an estimate on cabinet refacing. So the dude comes last night and did a lot of BSing. Finally says that the refacing, granite counter top, and tile backsplash would run app. $20k. He claims that a brand new kitchen-replacing cabinets- would run at least 50k-60k. This doesn’t sound right to me. Anyone out there have their kitchen done who can recommend? The refacing – btw- would be new doors, new drawers, new crown (which wasn’t as nice as the existing), sanding and staining frame.

  62. A Jerzy Lurker says:

    TO 51 – Juice :

    I think is a good thing to limit those Qualified/Deferred Accounts. One thing is to save for retirement, and let those account be a small kind of Estate Planning by allowing the accounts to behave like Life Insurance policies. It’s another one to abuse it and rig it like Romney did. Romney just had the legal and accounting power that allowed him to rig it his way.

    An educated guess along with some other readings tells me the following (tax accountant & lawyers can chime in please)

    Bain Capital had a management company. This company funded to the limit and tax deductible the employer’s side of- 1) Defined Benefit Plan (pension) 2) KEOGH – the management company’s principals were small enough to qualify for this plan – I doubt they chose the Defined Benefit Plan (pension) option or the Define Contribution Plan – Money Purchase, they probably went Define Contribution Plan- Profit sharing and contributed special stock shares (at likely pre-investment realization prices) of their Investment Funds. 3) 401K – Employer’s contribution – again in pre-investment realization prices special stock. Remember a KEOGH and 401K limits are separate and each are 50,000 I think this year.

    Romney himself probably maxed his employee side of contributions to Management Company 401k, likely Management Company also has a non-qualified top hat 457 Deferred Comp Plan. While talking about 457 – as governor, he probably contributed to the Mass Govt 457b for State employees ( maximum is consider independent of 401k contribution maximum)

    Then you cash out the define benefit plans, and roll over all of the other defined contribution, qualified deferred comp and KEOGHs into an IRA, and kaching – after doing this for close to 30 yrs=$100,000,000 IRA.

  63. joyce says:

    (65)

    I can hear Comrade now… “yes! yes! please make the tax code more complicated!!!” No offenses personally. But my point is this; we shouldn’t even have an income tax. If I’m forced to pick one, than a straight flat tax is it. We can fight over what is and isn’t income and that would be it.

  64. Essex says:

    Natasha and her wisdom remind me of ” Barbara”…,

  65. Fabius Maximus says:

    Ragnar,

    I disagree with Maher a lot of the time, but he nails the Randheads.
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b9PezT3n4To&feature=player_embedded

  66. Natasha says:

    #75 Essex
    Thank you? Or oh no? I don’t know Barbara.

  67. Jill says:

    Natasha #64: You can do refacing yourself; it’s not hard. I did about 3/4 of my kitchen and would finish it, except that I will come into a bit of money in the next few months — enough to redo the whole thing. You can see what I did here:

    http://www.flickr.com/photos/8864751@N02/sets/72157627486699406/

    Yes, it’s oak, and I know everyone hates oak, but there are a lot more options now, and plenty of online resources for buying the stuff. The key is this: 1) Sand everything off your old cabinet frames, wipe with a damp cloth, wipe with a tack cloth and make sure the whole thing is dry. 2) Pick up a can of water-based contact cement. Paint this on the frames no more than 1/2 hour before applying the peel-and-stick veneer. Do this and the stuff will never, ever delaminate. 3) Don’t cut the veneer flush. Leave a margin on the veneer and fold it into the face frames. It looks less like a veneer job that way. Then you sand the cracked edges very lightly with fine-grit sandpaper and use a stain pen to touch up. There’s a book by Herrick Kimball on how to reface cabinets. Pick up a copy and if you’re really dedicated, you can do it in a few weekends. Paying $20K for refacing is ridiculous. I spent in 2004 $1250 for 23 doors and the veneers.

  68. joyce says:

    (77)

    That speech was embarrassing as it is incorrect. But in true form, you’re presented with a half nugget of truth and a pack of lies.

  69. Ben says:

    Bill Maher, the guy who claimed to be libertarian while advocating for government mandated health care.

  70. chicagofinance says:

    Bill Mahar is fine. His studio audience always scares the hell out of me. Foaming at the mouth Southern Califonian idiots. Stupid, shallow, and irreverent without a purpose.

    Fabius Maximus says:
    April 7, 2013 at 10:43 am
    Ragnar, I disagree with Maher a lot of the time, but he nails the Randheads.

  71. Ragnar says:

    #6 party with Keynes? You might get rearended.

  72. Ragnar says:

    Chifi,
    Rand was a brilliant philosopher. Libertarians have no philosophy, and Republicans have the wrong one. There is nobody in politics at present who have any real understanding of Rand’s philosophy, and Maher and the leftists actively misrepresent it, and are glad to have straw-men like Rand Paul or Paul Ryan to beat up on rather than someone who actually can speak for Rand’s actual ideas.

    This is not to say Rand would be popular with better representatives. She challenged 2000 years of increasingly dominant philosophical assumptions. I suggest you read Atlas Shrugged with your own eyes and mind, rather than take Maher’s clownish misrepresentations.

  73. Brian says:

    Penny pinching Hayek is more Anal.

    Ragnar says:
    April 7, 2013 at 2:21 pm
    #6 party with Keynes? You might get rearended.

  74. joyce says:

    Wouldn’t you say that libertarians (claim) they believe in the non-aggression principle?

    84.Ragnar says:
    April 7, 2013 at 2:29 pm

    Chifi,
    Libertarians have no philosophy,

  75. Natasha says:

    #79 Jill
    Thanks- I will have to consider making that my summer project :)

  76. A Jerzy Lurker says:

    To Ragnar #84

    Rand being a brilliant philosopher! Negro please. Rand was a frigid, half lesbo sadist that would have joined Dr.Mengele’s twin children experiment squad at Auschwitz at a drop of a dime. Her views were Hobbsian with a tinch of pre-execution Tsarist.

    You want to see a world populated by her views. Go to any State Prison and tell the guards to back off a while and see what happens. You can also take a flight to Calcutta or Rio de Jainero or another cesspool hole in the ground where empathy and elitism rule the day.

  77. A Jerzy Lurker says:

    Grim unmod # 84 please.

  78. A Jerzy Lurker says:

    My bad ummod #88

  79. Ragnar says:

    Joyce, one principle, floating in midair without support, isn’t a philosophy.

  80. Fabius Maximus says:

    #80 Ranger

    That is the perfect one line review of “Atlas Shrugged”.

  81. chicagofinance says:

    My comment about Maher was a general one, not specific to this particular video.

    Ragnar says:
    April 7, 2013 at 2:29 pm
    Chifi,
    and Maher and the leftists actively misrepresent it, and are glad to have straw-men like Rand Paul or Paul Ryan to beat up on rather than someone who actually can speak for Rand’s actual ideas.

  82. joyce says:

    ?

    91.Fabius Maximus says:
    April 7, 2013 at 5:16 pm
    #80 Ranger

    That is the perfect one line review of “Atlas Shrugged”.

  83. joyce says:

    I agree with that statement for the most part. But just to clarify, are you saying that about the Libertarian party or current “movement”? I think the idea of the use of force never being justified unless in self-defense is pretty sound.

    90.Ragnar says:
    April 7, 2013 at 4:53 pm
    Joyce, one principle, floating in midair without support, isn’t a philosophy.

Comments are closed.