C19 Open Discussion Week 19b

From the Philly Inquirer:

Pa., N.J. workers set to lose the extra $600 in unemployment benefits this week

With no end in sight to the pandemic, Washington lawmakers are at odds over how to give more financial help to Americans. Democrats want to extend the full $600 enhanced unemployment benefit, while Republicans say that amount is too much, as some have earned more on unemployment than they did at work. Lawmakers are also weighing another round of direct stimulus payments, a payroll tax cut, and other measures to help the struggling economy.

Failure to pass something would deal a “body blow” to the economy, said Mark Zandi, chief economist at Moody’s Analytics. Companies continue to lay off workers at high levels and 17.3 million people nationwide were receiving unemployment benefits as of July 11. Cutting off financial help now would cause consumers to slash spending and force many to stop paying bills, plunging the economy back into a recession, he said. But scaled-back unemployment benefits along with other relief, such as a stimulus check, should be enough to keep things together, he added.

As of July 11, 795,000 New Jersey workers were receiving the extra $600 in federal help, according to the state Department of Labor and Workforce Development.

The Pennsylvania Department of Labor & Industry said Tuesday that it could not provide an exact number of recipients. On Monday, Susan Dickinson, the department’s director of unemployment compensation benefits policy, said the state has about 3.3 million claims between regular and Pandemic Unemployment Assistance right now, and said most of those likely received at least one $600 payment.

Although the federal program expires July 31, this is the final claim week for the additional $600 payments. Both state agencies said workers who are owed unemployment benefits for previous weeks will still receive the extra $600 for those weeks, too, even if payment is issued after the program expires.

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527 Responses to C19 Open Discussion Week 19b

  1. ExEssex says:

    Phirst.

  2. ExEssex says:

    Secondly — President Donald Trump reportedly tried, and failed, to get his Trump Turnberry resort in Scotland to host the British Open, according to The New York Times.

    Trump reportedly asked Woody Johnson, the American ambassador to Britain, to “see if the British government could help steer” the iconic golf tournament — one of the four major championships each season — to his course in Scotland in 2018.

    Johnson reportedly “raised the idea” of the course hosting the tournament to Scotland Secretary of State David Mundell, too, despite warnings from his deputy that “it would be an unethical use of the presidency for private gain.”

  3. AP says:

    That WSJ op-ed yesterday was borderline irresponsible.

    Some of the recent actions by the administration, like deploying Federal forces without a request from the local authorities, are quite unprecedented in the USA, in any previous administration as far as I know.

    If there is popular support for it come November, we will be in uncharted waters.

  4. joyce says:

    The silence from Fabius on China’s human rights abuses is deafening.

  5. Fast Eddie says:

    The silence from Fabius on China’s human rights abuses is deafening.

    I wonder what the NBA owners think of the abuse? The courts (playing courts) and the player’s jerseys will be sprawled with some type of BLM message or some injustice message. Do the players know they’re being… played?

  6. joyce says:

    Are you going to watch football this year, Gary?

  7. Juice Box says:

    We find out today if the detainment of the rioters in Portland is legal or not the Attorney general for Oregon will be in court Today arguing for a TRO, based upon some probable cause argument, about detainment and arrests.

    I would say he has no standing in Federal Arrests but hey what do I know. Supreme Court has ruled you have no right to resist arrest even if the police made a legal error, were malicious, broke the law etc. You get your day in court to argue in this country that is the Law.

  8. Juice Box says:

    AP – It’s not uncharted or new, mayor wheeler made the Portland PD stand down when the rioters took aim at the ICE detention centers in 2018. The federal police do not need to be invited to protect federal property, it’s law.

    As far as the OP Ed – WSJ is right, play stupid games win stupid prizes.

  9. joyce says:

    Juice,
    That’s why the AG filed a lawsuit in Federal court.

  10. 3b says:

    The left is strangely silent about China all around. They scream about Putin and Russia and its authoritarianism, but not China being a brutal repressive dictatorship. Not a peep about what they are doing in Hong Kong either.

    They also have up to one million ethnic Uighur locked up in concentration camps, not a peep from the left. That is my biggest complaint with those who identify as proud leftists; their hypocrisy.

  11. AP says:

    No, I would not say that the op-ed is right. There’s a volatile situation that needs to be handled professionally and effectively. Further inflaming the situation with aggressive, one-sided rhetoric is not the answer.

    The editorial page on the WSJ has not been very good for a long time. Look at the major events of the past two decades and see it consistently, militantly wrong on most things. Including factually wrong, presenting outdated studies, etc. The editorial page frequently embarrasses the quality reporting that happens on the inside of the paper.

    Re uncharted. Let’s keep an eye on it and see how this goes.

  12. Phoenix says:

    “Supreme Court has ruled you have no right to resist arrest even if the police made a legal error, were malicious, broke the law etc. You get your day in court to argue in this country that is the Law.”

    Well, here was someone’s day in court. Seems like the kind of place I would look for justice– not.

    According to the court transcript, when the woman described her encounter with the man, Mr Russo asked her: “Do you know how to stop somebody from having intercourse with you?”

    When the woman answered yes and said one method would be to run away, Mr Russo suggested, “Close your legs? Call the police? Did you do any of those things?”

  13. Phoenix says:

    “The left is strangely silent about China all around. They scream about Putin and Russia and its authoritarianism, but not China being a brutal repressive dictatorship. Not a peep about what they are doing in Hong Kong either.”

    And the right is enjoying the money they made in their Apple, Google, Walmart and Amazon stocks. Well, to be honest, so are the left.
    Wave the flag. Boomers sold out America in order to get “independently” wealthy as the only life an American cares about is their own.

    Soon we will see how that turns out. Of course, boomers hate the youth anyway so why not leave the youth a debt riddled country for them to live in. Won’t see it from the grave anyway.

  14. homeboken says:

    Uighur’s being blindfolded and lined up to board trains – Any here support this? Regardless of context:
    https://uk.news.yahoo.com/drone-video-alleged-uighur-prisoners-203657904.html

    WH Press Sec. on the exact legal authority to arrest and investigate crimes against Federal Property
    https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=606623526721751

  15. homeboken says:

    The press follow up question about jurisdiction is wonderfully naive.

    Imagine I rob a bank in Glen Rock, then run 30 yards north into Ridgewood and claim the cops can’t follow me.

    Remember playing freeze tag as a little kid. There was always a “home base” where you couldn’t be tagged? That is the average press pool understanding of criminal law

  16. Juice box says:

    Phoenix he was kicked from the bench

  17. Phoenix says:

    Today’s local paper:

    “N.J. had a substitute teacher shortage before coronavirus hit. What happens when schools reopen?”

    Too sick to Zoom, call Grim, he can get you one cheap from the Philippines.

  18. Fast Eddie says:

    Joyce,

    Are you going to watch football this year, Gary?

    I was talking with a friend about this yesterday. It was a tradition my whole life. You know, the Sunday morning thing, getting ready for the games. Sundays in the fall was football. I think it’s coming to end. How can you root for something or someone when it’s become a platform for politics and social justice? My desire is pretty much gone.

  19. Phoenix says:

    JB,
    I know, so what? Took something so blatant to get called out. This country should only have tribunals for reasons just like this.

  20. Phoenix says:

    “How can you root for something or someone when it’s become a platform for politics and social justice?”

    You ignore that part and just watch the game, because now everything is a platform for politics and social justice, and if you don’t ignore that part there will not be much for you to do except home repairs and gardening.

    Thank Mark Zukerberg.

  21. grim says:

    No tomato left behind.

  22. joyce says:

    She lost me with the comment about identifying themselves to crowds would put them at great risk.

    homeboken says:
    July 22, 2020 at 8:25 am

    WH Press Sec. on the exact legal authority to arrest and investigate crimes against Federal Property
    https://www.facebook.com/watch/?v=606623526721751

  23. joyce says:

    I thought you gave it up with all the kneeling. Did you come back and are now turned off again?

    Fast Eddie says:
    July 22, 2020 at 8:39 am
    Joyce,

    Are you going to watch football this year, Gary?

    I was talking with a friend about this yesterday. It was a tradition my whole life. You know, the Sunday morning thing, getting ready for the games. Sundays in the fall was football. I think it’s coming to end. How can you root for something or someone when it’s become a platform for politics and social justice? My desire is pretty much gone.

  24. 3b says:

    Phoenix: The boomers left and right sold out America, including Joe Biden, doing the bidding of his corporate masters for 45 years in Washington. Trump as bad as he is, was never a politician and is in Washington under 4 years. And yet Trump is the root of all that ails America? I don’t think so.

    And while we are bashing the boomers, let’s not forget the Generation X crowd, just as obnoxious if not more so than the boomers. Do you think the Gen X crowd care about the debt, left for future generations? No. High housing prices an issue for them? Keep prices high so they can profit handsomely. How about the millennials who have already purchased house do they want prices to fall? No. It will negatively impact them. To hell with the rest of the millennials and whatever generation after them. I got mine.

    Biden’s recent speech on reviving America and bringing jobs home is right out of Trumps play book. Where was Joe during his 8 years as VP? Where was he for all the other years he was in Washington? He and his Democratic colleagues and the Republicans sold this country out. I despise both parties and have for years. At least with Republicans it’s in your face, the Democrats pretend to care, and that’s what makes them worse in many respects in my opinion.

  25. homeboken says:

    Joyce – I disagree, criminals in the act of breaking laws should not expect to be able to quote the law back to the police.

    Black Blocked masked and concealed from head-to-toe rioter :

    “Hey this cop isn’t clearly identifying himself”

    Tough luck junior.

    Seriously – We will see how you all feel when antifa gets word that the citizen’s of joyce’s town are very pro-antifa. You will get to experience all those wonderful 5th amendment rights directly outside your window. Have a blast, keep them out of my town.

  26. Phoenix says:

    Went to Hershey park with my kid yesterday. Don’t know how that place is going to stay in business.
    Almost no wait times on any rides. You just get off then get back on as many times as you want until you are delirious with stupor from all of the high G turns and twists.

    Young employees on minimum wage trying to get visitors to keep their masks up, some employees had voices, others were mum. I’d say 80 percent of patrons were fully compliant in 90 degree weather, so I guess that’s pretty good.

    On a ride for ride basis, I got more than my money’s worth.

  27. Phoenix says:

    “And yet Trump is the root of all that ails America? I don’t think so.”

    You never heard me say that..

    And I agree Gen X is bad as well, after all, it created the “Karen.”

  28. Phoenix says:

    “To hell with the rest of the millennials and whatever generation after them. I got mine.”

    Okay.

  29. Fast Eddie says:

    Joyce,

    I was halfheartedly watching the last few years. No way as enthusiastic, just more of something to do as it was always what we did on Sundays in the fall. It’s sometimes tough to break life-long habits but this year, I’ll need to fill Sundays with something else.

  30. joyce says:

    What are you talking about?

    homeboken says:
    July 22, 2020 at 9:04 am
    Joyce – I disagree, criminals in the act of breaking laws should not expect to be able to quote the law back to the police.

  31. homeboken says:

    Joyce – This: “She lost me with the comment about identifying themselves to crowds would put them at great risk.”

    You have a strange conversation technique on this board, where you make a claim, get an opposition claim, then you claim confusion.

  32. Phoenix says:

    Joyce,
    Maybe they should be compliant and get down on their knees for their servants, then wait for help to arrive in the form of the court system of America.

  33. Phoenix says:

    “I’ll need to fill Sundays with something else.”

    Read the Washington Post-only kidding.

    If I could describe that paper as a sound- hundreds of crows and seagulls fighting over discarded french fries..

  34. joyce says:

    The reporter’s question was about why the officers didn’t have insignia’s for the agencies they work for on their uniforms. How does that put them at risk?

    homeboken says:
    July 22, 2020 at 9:18 am
    Joyce – This: “She lost me with the comment about identifying themselves to crowds would put them at great risk.”

    You have a strange conversation technique on this board, where you make a claim, get an opposition claim, then you claim confusion.

  35. joyce says:

    How would* that put them at risk?

  36. Bystander says:

    Ed needs the “choom summit” at Barry’s Vineyard compound. Invite the naked Antifa Portland protester to dance around to Dead 8/27/72. He will be ok, back to watching Giants stink up the field every week.

  37. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Come on, do you expect anything less? You would do the same thing if you owned. It’s human nature in a capitalist society. No one gives a sh!t about anyone but themselves. This is the price of progress. It’s a nasty competition.

    “High housing prices an issue for them? Keep prices high so they can profit handsomely. How about the millennials who have already purchased house do they want prices to fall? No. It will negatively impact them. To hell with the rest of the millennials and whatever generation after them. I got mine.”

  38. Phoenix says:

    “This is the price of progress. It’s a nasty competition.”

    Do you teach this in your schools, pumpkin? Or do you teach them all to be nice, share and work together as a team?

  39. Fast Eddie says:

    Bystander,

    Choom sounds good but Barry can stay at his tax-paid house. Collectible shows, rides to nowhere, model building, lots of reading will be the new norm on Sundays. I’ve been a die hard Giants fan all my life but now, it’s like being dumped by a lover… you somehow need to come to terms with it. Why did they need to ruin sports? It was so much part of the American fabric. Anyway, I’ve been an insatiable reader more and more the last few years. I’ll have to stack up on that and begin new trends for the remainder of my life.

  40. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I do exactly what they want. Try to get these kids to believe in a world of good. One that is fair and just. That they have the power to make this world a better place. Maybe one day, the new generations will become better human beings.

    College teaches them about the nasty competition, hence, why college students become so revolutionary and angry when they learn the truth about human nature.

  41. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    I watched the DHS and US Marshall’s press conference. They switched from name ID on their person to numbers because 70 of their employees were doxed online, presumably from the same group complaining that they have no identification.

    Unmarked vehicles are used in law enforcement at every level. Marked vehicles have been consistently targeted. The “abduction” that they are complaining about on video was an individual that they believe was shining a high powered green laser pointer at officers eyes. Rather than engage the crowd with force to obtain this person, they wait until they are isolated and apprehend them in a less forceful manner, or in this case, with no force at all. The person in question was suspected of a crime and they detained them for questioning. They were required to take them away in the vehicle because a crowd began to form to quickly so they transported them to a different location for questioning. They said they didn’t have enough evidence to charge the person and subsequently released them.

    DHS was very clear, if the politicians and people of Portland want them gone, they can either use their local PD to quell the unrest or the people can stop trying to burn down a federal building. The only reason they have the authority to be there is because the federal courthouse is consistently under attack.

    My sister lives in Portland right now. Basically, during the day, everyone goes about their life and when the sun sets, the idiots get set for their battle. She says, no one in the city even bats an eye. She says people are playing video games in all their apartments and having a good time while you hear the sound of antifa lighting off fireworks and screaming in the streets and police ordering them to disperse over loudspeakers.

  42. Phoenix says:

    “College teaches them about the nasty competition, hence, why college students become so revolutionary and angry when they learn the truth about human nature.”

    So college teaches them the truth while you lie to them. Okay, got it.

  43. homebuyer007 says:

    Yet people are lining up in the streets to buy a house over bidding. I saw a bunch of listing in Montclair sold for 200K over for a 900K house

    WTF is goin on in here

  44. leftwing says:

    Gave up Yanks season tickets when they moved stadiums and jacked prices. Magic was gone, for triple the price.

    Gave up Giants season tickets with the kneeling post-PSL, whole. Wasn’t going to keep an investment and pay more for the SJW BS.

    Gave up Devs season tickets because they put stringent limits on reselling, which you could only do below STH price anyway. The boys grew up, we were seeing fewer games, and I was eating way too many tickets.

    Never had an interest in NBA as to me they were always a bunch of overpaid, whining, individual showboaters. Really like college ball, wish we had a decent team nearby.

    My live sports experiences are now select one off Devs games and road trip college football, basketball and hockey games. Have absolutely less than zero desire to see NBA and NFL live.

    My viewing is NHL, the college sports above, and funny enough F1 where I’ve really become a fan (time sucks, it’s run Euro Sunday afternoons which is 9am here, hard to crack a beer with buddies over that one). Will probably grab a road trip to see one of those races with the boys next year when we’re through COVID. Before this BS I wouldn’t even have MLB or NBA on the TV as background noise, would watch some NFL. I’ll bag the NFL this year as my individual meaningless political statement.

    Pound for pound professional hockey players are the most understated, generous, unselfish and just down to earth likable pro athletes out there. Hope the NHL doesn’t get infected with all this foolishness (go blackhawks, lol).

  45. AP says:

    Fast, “it’s like being dumped by a lover”

    That’s sad. Don’t give up on your football, man. Just because some of the players have different views?

    Careful with a new phenomenon called “self cancellation”, where folks drop out of mainstream society, as soon as they are no longer the center of all conversations, and can then go down a road of conspiracy theories, radical/supremacist views, etc.

    For anyone experiencing the recent social movement as a loss, I encourage you to reassess your approach pronto. This is a multi-ethnic, prosperous nation, blessed with a mature democratic system of government. Different expressions of belief should not be a reason to check out.

    Watching less football and reading more is probably a good call though.

  46. TruthIsTheEnemy says:

    If you followed Andy ngo’s reporting, you would know that anarchy has been a major problem in Portland for years, and the city government has been complicit. There is ongoing lawlessness in many cities even those absent a federal presence.

    Claiming otherwise is bullshlt and part of the latest hoax to frame all of the chaos as federally incited. If these democrat cities don’t want the feds around then restore order.

  47. Fast Eddie says:

    leftwing,

    Yeah, I suppose F1 and some college ball might suffice. I was never a real big NHL fan but that might change now as well. The NFL was the biggest draw more than all others combined. I don’t know why they decided to commit suicide. I also think a lot of local HS games on a Friday night or Saturday might do. Some of the DIV III college games like Montclair U. or Caldwell on a Saturday might be an option.

  48. ExEssex says:

    I was never a huge sports spectator.
    Went to a Super Bowl once cause I won a sales contest
    (Steelers vs Cowboys) which was an experience. As far as playing goes
    Hockey is by far the most fun to play. Sports fanatics like most people bore me.

  49. ExEssex says:

    My brother in law in a VP at NASCAR….
    Talk about a trip. Yeeeesh.

  50. Bystander says:

    It is a tough time in this country but sports will prevail. As someone who disagrees with military budget, I felt it was politicized for years with intense Army commercials. Preying on kids with ads like they would be playing Call of Duty…or my favorite, they would be slaying the Fire demon from Lord of the Rings. Shameful with thousands of kids dying in Iraq and Afghanistan. I heard same things after baseball strikes, football strikes, hockey strikes. When any player signed a mega-deal, they were overpaid and ruining sport. When ticket prices were raised to insane levels, no one would attend. I heard Browns fans would never return after Modell’s stunt..people move on. Blame players? Recall just a few months ago, how Adam Silver responded to China controversy…kepy it tr%p shut and ensured owners remained in that huge Chinese market. Phoenix said truth, you want to blame left for not caring about human rights when US corps just want to slink silently back to Chinese market and not change a damn thing. We as Americans don’t really want to change a damn thing.

  51. 3b says:

    AP: Mature Democratic government? Dysfunctional bought and paid for government, dominated by special interests is how I would describe our government.

  52. 3b says:

    There is always Rugby!!

  53. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I don’t lie…I just try to focus on the good. Why fill them with so much hate and anger at a young age? Let them enjoy the innocence before reality makes them angry and sad.

    I still tell them how competitive life is. I explain that when they graduate, they are competing with myself and other adults for jobs. I explain that most low skilled jobs are being replaced by robots. Driving, which gives jobs to millions, will be automated. So I tell them to focus on their communication skills (reading, writing, and speaking), critical thinking, and learn how to be creative. I stress the competition of the system…that there are more people than jobs and that it’s only getting worst. So position yourself before it’s too late.

    Teaching them about the ruthlessness of human nature…that’s for later.

  54. Bystander says:

    3b,

    Sorry, I am middle Gen X and most people I know got f-ed. We were 25-35 around 2005 bubble and most people I know bought homes as we were told rates were insanely low. Values are still at 2004 levels so tell me how Gen X made out? I have family members and friends who took bloodbath when they had to move..even recently.

  55. TruthIsTheEnemy says:

    Looks like deblasio grew a spine and decided to break up the anarchist encampment before it took hold. Finally some common sense.

  56. ExEssex says:

    10:13 I played three seasons of college rugby.
    Holy mackerel it…was…epic

  57. TruthIsTheEnemy says:

    Yeah, I’m not sure now inclined I am to tune into an event where the opening ceremony consists of millionaire minority athletes chastising us about what bigoted PoS we all are and what an unjust and oppressive country we have. Meanwhile they are trying to sell us sweatshop products they endorse.

    I think myself and others will decide there is something more rewarding we co be doing.

  58. The Great Pumpkin says:

    San Fran housing market:

    Big Attitude Is Creeping Back

    In my quest to find more clarity in my local real estate market, I reached out to multiple realtors on multiple properties.

    The majority of realtors were very responsive and humble. However, most lacked conviction in their opinions on where they thought the real estate market would be in the next 12 months. Many also seemed baffled by why there is actually so much activity.

    Then I stumbled across a nice home with an ocean view for $1.8 million (near the median price in SF). I gave the agent a call directly to set up an appointment because the Redfin agent was unresponsive. When the listing agent picked up, she gave me the most exasperated, cannot be bothered tone.

    “Look, I’ve got 8 back-to-back showings. Who is your agent? I’m really busy. Are you preapproved already?”

    She made me feel like I was wasting her time, which is surprising since overall volume is down, which means overall business is down. If you’re in the people business, it’s best to be nice. There are simply no guarantees in this real estate market.

    Despite talking to me like a tick on a horse’s rump, I went out and viewed the house anyway. Her attitude was still the same, but she told me several interesting things:

    1) A mortgage officer at Citibank has been working 80+ hours a week for the past several weeks

    2) Many of her clients now have “millions in the bank” due to the rise of tech stocks. She specifically cited Apple starting the year at $300, going down to $229, and now up to almost $400.

    3) Demand for property under $2 million is hot. And the luxury market, which she defines as over $4 million is very hot too. So I asked what about in between? And she said it depends, but still strong. This supports my belief there is better value in homes 50%-100% higher than the median.

    4) We agreed that high rise condos are weak.

    The New Normal

    Then I talked to another listing agent at a different house at a similar price point. He said 10 disclosure packages had been given out and they were setting an offer date this week.

    But then he hedged and said they could see anywhere from one to eight offers. He simply has no idea, like most realtors I talked to. I’ve had similar conversations with three other listing agents.

    The one thing I am observing consistently is that fear has dissipated. People are sick of putting their lives on hold. We’re getting used to the new normal, all while wearing masks of course.

    I’d love to hear what type of activity you’re seeing in your area and at what price. The feedback I’ve received over Twitter has been uniformly strong, which makes me hesitate.

  59. leftwing says:

    “That’s sad. Don’t give up on your football, man. Just because some of the players have different views?”

    No, because what was once an enjoyable diversion has been taken over by activists with fundamentally no interest in the underlying sport and an interest only in jamming political views with which I fundamentally disagree down my throat. I am not in the habit of standing around while someone metaphorically turns on a megaphone and begins offensively screaming in my face, especially when I am paying to be there. I sincerely hope the NFL takes a massive financial hit when it restarts.

  60. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    Talked to someone in Connecticut, apparently NYers are buying up their properties very quickly as well. Neighbor behind me had his house fall through contract in late March. It is badly in need of updating/restoration and wildly overpriced. They now have an under contract sign on it.

  61. The Great Pumpkin says:

    For your location. Other locations have killed it. How much has Hoboken and JC went up since 2004?

    Cali coast? Seatttle? Portland? Dallas/Austin? Florida coasts? Carolina retirement locations? Colorado? Boston? Washington DC? Nyc?

    “Values are still at 2004 levels so tell me how Gen X made out? I have family members and friends who took bloodbath when they had to move..even recently.”

  62. The Great Pumpkin says:

    And now it’s your state’s turn to see appreciation over said locations. It has been held down for too long.

  63. Fast Eddie says:

    Talked to someone in Connecticut, apparently NYers are buying up their properties very quickly as well.

    I have two neighbors asking me to let them know first if/when I want to sell. I assume outsiders will jump quickly on the house as my previous homes sold within hours. I’m constant with upkeep and maintenance.

  64. Juice Box says:

    re: “deblasio grew a spine and decided to break up the anarchist encampment”

    He is too calculating. I would say he wants it to move from in front of City Hall where NYPD is responsible to in-front of a Federal building after Trump threatened a federal law enforcement crackdown in NYC.

    Plenty of room by the Federal Court on Pearl St to setup camp again.

    We shall see, there is still plenty of warm weather for the young people to camp out and protest and party all night.

  65. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    The NBA in the 90s and early 2000s was a great product. Very competitive, very physical. My father actually had season tickets to the Nets for 5 years and we went to every game in their two finals runs. It was a great atmosphere for those two years.

    Once they rewrote their rules to increase scoring, the game started to go downhill. Then Lebron nearly ruined it when he formed his superteam. Fortunately, they still got their butts kicked by the old guard in the Spurs and the Mavs. The Warriors were a great story until Kevin Durant joined them to make a superteam. The whole buddy up with your friends ruined the competition aspect of sports in the NBA. The only thing I like doing at this point it watching Shaq and Barkley make fun of all the young players on TV.

    As far as politics goes, the NBA players are composed of nearly 100% college dropouts. The NBA players got exposed for their hypocrisy in their Hong Kong debacle. Also, recall, none of them chose to kneel during the past 2 seasons because it was going take money out of their pockets. It wasn’t long ago the NBA had a system gun problem on their hands with players actually drawing guns on each other in an argument in the locker room. Why anyone would think their opinion hold weight is beyond me.

  66. TruthIsTheEnemy says:

    Could be, but even as cynical as I am, I think there are people who care about the city and the violence that’s ongoing.

    The propaganda and grievance industries, and the Democratic Party largely see the chaos as unfortunate collateral damage but at the grassroots level I suspect there is a feeling that enough is enough.

    He’s probably feeling some heat.

  67. Bystander says:

    Truly, you are about the dumbest person I have encountered..our turn? Like it naturally occurred due to economic fundamentals. People are running from a virus and making poor decisions while the Fed is buying all debt under the sun to push stock bubble up. Who is John Galt? Well, he believed in free markets until market went down then he believed in giant govt intervention so he could be keep his shirt and not become Tom Joad.

  68. ExEssex says:

    Gen X here. I would have made more selling my (NJ) home 6 months after I bought it, than I actually did make selling it 15 years after we bought.

  69. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I remember just a few years ago, that a home with a big yard and pool was a liability on the price. Now, any home that has those features is gone. Goes to show you how life works. Nothing is constant, hence, why you are able to make money when there is blood in the streets. You want to make money, attack the Commercial side of real estate in the next year. Based on history, you won’t be sorry. You will be called names like stupid or dumb, but those people just don’t get it. That’s why you make money, because most devalued it to the point that there is blood in the streets. They won’t touch it, which limits your market competition, giving you a sick price.

    Just like retail. The internet won for now, but you know what’s going to happen? What no one expects, brick and mortar are somehow, someway, going to make a huge comeback. People are going to get sick of the screens and crave live experiences. Whatever entrepreneur figures out how to deliver this will make millions when the shift in mindset happens.

    I just have to believe we are at bottom for retail, the virus killed off a lot. So that change will be coming this decade. What will the retail store of tomorrow look like? If you have the answer, you are rich…

  70. ExEssex says:

    Fellas I still love baseball.

  71. 30 year realtor says:

    How many of you whine and complain about the cancel culture of the left? How does that differ from the views expressed here about professional athletes and their sports?

    You guys are a panic!

  72. Juice Box says:

    First listing by me in a while as there were none all spring and until this week. They updated some stuff in the now empty Grandma’s old 1974 split level house and claim it’s a 6 BR @3200 sq ft with family room and one B/R in the basement ask is priced $699. Most homes of this design only fetch $499 with no additions and updates. Come get it now before you are priced out forever, mothballs are no charge, and bring some landscaping and home remodeling experience too, windows, doors, siding, yard all need updating.

  73. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I don’t agree. The virus is not responsible. They use it as an excuse, but they just don’t know better. What’s happening is what I always said would happen at this exact year. Millennials (the biggest demographic group by a mile) would leave the city for the suburbs. They want to raise their family in a place that is safe, has good schools, more space, and is cheaper(kids cost money). The virus is actually holding this back. It destroyed the economy, and now put these home buying dreams on hold for some. Make no doubt, if there was no virus, the economy would be absolutely on fire driven by massive run on real estate. Housing drives the economy…esp family building. All the new stuff they have to buy…you get the point.

    This virus saved you from 4 more years of trump, but it cost you deadly in terms of economics.

    Bystander says:
    July 22, 2020 at 11:00 am
    Truly, you are about the dumbest person I have encountered..our turn? Like it naturally occurred due to economic fundamentals. People are running from a virus and making poor decisions while the Fed is buying all debt under the sun to push stock bubble up. Who is John Galt? Well, he believed in free markets until market went down then he believed in giant govt intervention so he could be keep his shirt and not become Tom Joad.

  74. 3b says:

    Blue Have family in northern Connecticut, lots of activity up by them, people fleeing from NYC and north Jersey. Not really commutable to NYC, but with many not going back at all or only one or two days a week, it makes sense. More value for my money, and more property than north Jersey. Although CT is by no
    Means a great state financially, it’s better than NJ.

  75. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Dearly not deadly

  76. Bystander says:

    Hah, JB. I have in ground pool. Paid 570K 5.5 years ago but going to list for one million. I mean, a pool afterall…in CT.

  77. 3b says:

    Juice Not much inventory by me, and what little there is, is being priced down, or new price as some of those realtors say. I guess people balk at dropping 750k on a house with 50×100 property size and 15k In taxes.

  78. 3b says:

    30 year a little self awareness by these obscenely paid athletes is in order, before pontificating on how awful this country is.

  79. Fast Eddie says:

    3b,

    They’re not fleeing from North Jersey and every house around me is gone in a week. I don’t know what you’re seeing.

  80. Juice Box says:

    Bystander – My pool is 87 degrees and crystal clear today. PH is exactly 7.5 and I converted to the salt system this year so I have almost zero maintenance on it and no chemicals to buy anymore. I will be taking a dip once the sun goes down a bit. I really don’t need to get skin cancer with all of this extra sunlight I have been getting between walking the dog morning noon and night and swimming nearly every day. Who needs and Office Building anyway?

  81. 3b says:

    Fast: I would not be so sure of that, there are 3 families that. I know in my town that are dumping their houses here and moving further north. Two to northern CT, above Ridgefield, and one to Putnam Co They all purchased in the last 3 to 5 years. My wife’s cousin who lives in northern CT, said their new neighbors are transplants from Clark NJ, and another young couple moved in down the block with NJ license plates from kid.
    Her Brother lives in Putnam Co, and their new neighbors are from Mahwah. Got caught up on things this past weekend at a graduation party in Bergen Co So perhaps fleeing is dramatic on my part, but it is happening.

    There is no real need to pay to be close to NYC any more. And some people are realizing that.

  82. Juice Box says:

    Where is our Hoboken Realtor? Can we get an update on the who is sticking around the mile square? I know of a few families still roughing it there, one is away at their summer home since March and the others are just toughing it out.

    I see railroad crapshacks are still fetching 1 Million dollars.

    401 Monroe St APT 2L
    Hoboken, NJ 07030
    2 beds 1 bath 600 sqft
    SOLD: $1,000,000
    Sold on 07/20/20

    https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/401-Monroe-St-APT-2L-Hoboken-NJ-07030/38883397_zpid/

  83. AP says:

    Some people grew up thinking that the entire world and history was centered around them, and their narratives of hard work and simple, decent values.

    Any challenge, no matter how trivial, to that world view is experienced as a tremendous dislocation and loss. Then they turn against anything, even democratic norms of tolerance and dialogue, to bring back the old narrative asap.

    This mindset, taken to it’s logical extreme, calls for the elimination or imprisonment of entire demographics that don’t fit into the narrative.

    The alternative: accept that different views are held by other legitimate participants in the democratic process and show concern and care for the most vulnerable

  84. The Great Pumpkin says:

    What?! You really don’t appreciate this area for some reason. It has a lot to offer.

    “There is no real need to pay to be close to NYC any more. And some people are realizing that.”

  85. Bystander says:

    Ridgefield is great. North of Ridgefield is Danbury. I almost moved to northern Ridgefield but commute would be 1. 25m drive to Danbury then 80m ride to NYC so 2 hrs each way or 2. drive 10m to town, take 25m bus to Golden’s bridge for 70m train to NYC so 2 hrs each way..rational side won out. Outisde Fairfield cty, mostly run down towns / cities, pockets of wealth along coast and gamlbing up north. It is small state with nothing east of New Hav or Hartf ord. The mill calcs are crazy too. Show up from NYC with Cayenne and be prepared for several Gs car tax bill. I would move to northeast PA and save a ton, retire earlier

  86. Juice Box says:

    Here is Deblasio on script today like many other mayors talking about Portland for the first few minutes of his broadcast, not about the massive issues in NYC but the issues of Portland.

    https://twitter.com/i/broadcasts/1OdJrWmpMjlxX

    Lets see how many riots now spring up now in-front of Federal Buildings….

  87. TruthIsTheEnemy says:

    If you can’t see the difference between cancel culture , which is about controlling dissenting opinion at all times and venues, and objecting to the paid participants of a a sporting event protesting on the field, which is their workplace, then I don’t know what to tell you. I wouldn’t expect a ups guy to slap KAG stickers all over his truck and it to be ok.

  88. homebuyer007 says:

    I always thought pumpkin was biased and everyone used to thrash him.. but looks like he was right all the way and even now.. In terms of RE trend and North NJ trend.

    There are too many experts on this board who think they know everything but know nothing. I learnt my lesson for now.

  89. leftwing says:

    “How many of you whine and complain about the cancel culture of the left? How does that differ from the views expressed here about professional athletes and their sports?”

    Uhhmmm, because I’m not out there proactively trying to ‘cancel’ things for other people.

    NBA a bunch of overpaid crybaby showboats? I don’t go. You do you.
    NFL taking a knee? I don’t go. You do you.

    Don’t like civil war flags at NASCAR? Don’t go. Oh that’s correct, it’s the LEFT so they need to cancel everything for everyone….

    The Left is entirely intolerant unless you conform to their view.

    You really can’t see that difference?

  90. 3b says:

    Bystander: I like the Ridgefield area as well. And yes commute to NYC is tough to say the least, but with that no longer as much of an issue it is an attractive alternative. CT. Of course has a lot of problems and old and rundown areas. It’s similar to NJ in many respects, but also quite different. My Daughter and future husband bought a house in Chester Co. PA. Nice area and great value vs NJ.

  91. 3b says:

    If people have a problem with the NFL and still go whenever that might be, or watch it on TV, than they are hypocrites. If you want to send a message, don’t go and don’t tune in. Otherwise you are full of crap.

  92. leftwing says:

    AP, re: your two posts on cancellation, diversity, and weirdly ‘self centeredness’….

    What the Left is entirely incapable of processing is that parts of their belief system are as offensive to us as certain of parts of our belief system are to them.

    The definition of diversity includes acceptance of these divergent views.

    The Left’s definition of diversity accepts a variety of beliefs so long as each one is acceptable to the Left alone.

    In their minds they are the final and only arbiter of Truth. There is no room for divergent opinion.

    Reading your posts is like falling down the rabbit hole…..everything you imply are traits of the Right/Establishment are exhibited in spades by the Left….I mean seriously, have you ever seen such a large group of petulant children as today’s Left?

  93. 3b says:

    Leftwing is right, the left is intolerant of different opinions, and want to shut honest discussion wherever it leads down. Your choice be silent or agree, and even staying silent makes you suspect. It’s a pity Americans in general have such a disinterest in history, both their own and the world in general.
    This has happened before, take a look at what Wilson did in World War One, and of course FDR with locking up Japanese Americans in World War 2.
    And of course Europe where people who disagreed were sent to re education camps.

  94. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Left nailed it in that last post. On a roll today.

  95. 30 year realtor says:

    I call bullsh*t! You aren’t happy if they express views you disagree with off the field either.

    TruthIsTheEnemy says:
    July 22, 2020 at 12:05 pm
    If you can’t see the difference between cancel culture , which is about controlling dissenting opinion at all times and venues, and objecting to the paid participants of a a sporting event protesting on the field, which is their workplace, then I don’t know what to tell you. I wouldn’t expect a ups guy to slap KAG stickers all over his truck and it to be ok.

  96. AP says:

    Left, I don’t think that philosophically speaking either side has a monopoly on these illiberal tendencies.

    We all grow up with a certain mindset, and as we get older this mindset is continually challenged by reality. My point is that we shouldn’t wall ourselves off from challenging views.

    “everything you imply are traits of the Right/Establishment are exhibited in spades by the Left”

    Oh, I’m well aware of this. There are literally mentally ill people out there among the protesters. No question about it.

    My main point is, if someone is taking a knee, that doesn’t offend me at all, and it actually makes me proud to live in a country where free expression is permitted. Unlike some other regimes discussed on this board today.

  97. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Thank you.

    Those calls were absolutely amazing. I’ll toot my own horn…I don’t care. I know how difficult it is to make those kind of far off calls with that kind of accuracy. That doesn’t happen often and I’m proud I was able to do it.

    homebuyer007 says:
    July 22, 2020 at 12:08 pm
    I always thought pumpkin was biased and everyone used to thrash him.. but looks like he was right all the way and even now.. In terms of RE trend and North NJ trend.

  98. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I love teaching, but I always wonder what I could have done in the corporate world.

  99. Bystander says:

    Because you have a fleabrain mixed with undeserved arrogance. See I live in CT and saw houses sit on market for 8-10 months unsold..until last month. The millennials did not have a big mtg and say “now is the time”.

    The Great Pumpkin says:
    July 22, 2020 at 11:11 am
    I don’t agree. The virus is not responsible. They use it as an excuse, but they just don’t know better

  100. TruthIsTheEnemy says:

    I still disagree dummy but protesting on your own time doesn’t prevent me from watching. These subtleties escape you.

  101. leftwing says:

    “And of course Europe where people who disagreed were sent to re education camps.”

    Posted when it occurred…a neighboring town was to have a march supporting black rights. Local HS kid POC organized it for a weekend afternoon.

    BLM Morristown punched in on twitter blowing up the event because “they weren’t consulted”. They “demanded” the event be cancelled.

    They stated, and I quote….”Before any call for unity can be made, [town] needs a Truth and Reconciliation action.”

    For real. Truth and Reconciliation action. Upper case. Administered by them.

    The tweet goes on to propose a “Teach-In…to create a space for education, truth, and reconciliation. Then, and only then, can [town] move toward reform, and after that, unity.”

    I saved the tweet in a screenshot because not only was the concept mind boggling – don’t you dare express a view on race even it agrees with ours without consulting us and until WE administer Truth and Reconciliation – but because they had the hubris, total self centeredness, and lack of self awareness to actually put it writing.

    Anyone wants to see it tell me how to do one of those imgur things.

    Otherwise, I read AP’s view on diversity and being ‘self centered’ by the Right and nearly laugh myself to death.

    Yeah, great examples of diversity, inclusiveness, and tolerance there. LOL.

  102. leftwing says:

    ^^^^and mind you the sh1tstorm of tweets by BLM Morristown directed at this kid was over a march he had developed to show unity with BLM’s ideals…..if that’s how they respond when you are agreeing with them then…..

  103. AP says:

    Left, I never said self centered, bud. I’m talking about philosophical and historical views. Many people are being presented with new evidence and lines of argumentation that are surprising and unsettling.

    I wouldn’t advise taking a “left” or “right” position on any of this. If you have taken the trouble to listen and read outside of your normal sphere, I compliment you on that.

  104. No One says:

    My daughter’s former elite private HS is now scheduling for parents to receive racial counseling. All racially segregated. Whites get their session, North Asians theirs, separate from South Asians, Latinx get their own, blacks theirs. All outsourced to a race-hustler from Plainfield. These race studies majors are having a field day now.
    I would enjoy being the turd in the punch bowl at these re-education sessions but my wife forbade me. She hates this stuff as much as me, as she got her fill of diversity groups in big companies (to which she was invited to be a member) observing it was a bunch of loser malcontents looking for excuses with no high performers like herself.

  105. Bystander says:

    Homebuyer007, SmallGovConserv, Blumpy..it is like the movie Split in here. Something must be wrong on home front.

  106. Bystander says:

    “but I always wonder what I could have done in the corporate world.”

    Shown the door, many, many times.

  107. 3b says:

    Bystander:I would say homebuyer 007 is suspect.

  108. ExEssex says:

    1:05 buuuuurn.

  109. 3b says:

    AP Take the knee, fine, but what’s the point?? Hey look at me??!! It’s the national anthem, it’s a matter of respect for those who fought to defend it, and what it represents or strives to represent. Why can’t it just be left at that? At this point just end playing the national anthem, because that’s what they really want at the end of the day. Just end it and be done with it!!

  110. Fabius Maximus says:

    The best comment I read about the British Open was along the lines of

    “What idiot wood ask Woody Johnston to try and deliver a Championship?”

    “How many of you whine and complain about the cancel culture of the left? How does that differ from the views expressed here about professional athletes and their sports?”

    30 year, it actually goes further. Kappernick should stick to his lane, but Nick Bosa should be free to express his MAGAness.

  111. AP says:

    3b, thanks for engaging with my argument.

    I think the answer lies in somehow merging those “energies” with the national mainstream, rather than violently rejecting as if it was a foreign body.

    For example, the stuff JayZ is doing with the league has been severely criticized, including by “the left”, but it shows a potential way forward.

    Somehow we have to make the tent larger. Our national history and greatness supports that larger inclusion.

  112. Bystander says:

    “My Daughter and future husband bought a house in Chester Co. PA. Nice area and great value vs NJ.”

    A peabrain that does not work in private sector would have no idea on executive mindset. Like a call where one said anyone going back to India for visa renewal will now stay there even if life was here for year bc it costs less to have them in India. Anyone believe that same mind is not thinking, why pay someone bc they decided to live in high cost NJ. You would be a fool to think WFH is not coming hard for this area’s salaries. People would be better served getting out of NYC area all together if you are not super high income. Certainly, two income generic job families are foolish to be moving north to pay 800k and 15k taxes

    Smart move by your daughter. That was another area I visited as place to live abut 7 years ago. I like Brandywine region. Chadds Ford is snooty but nice. West Chester seemed like solid town. Good area for financial companies and very reasonable house price and taxes. DE right below has no sales tax for purchases too.

  113. Fabius Maximus says:

    Joyce,

    I condemn all countries that partake in Human Rights abuses. Always have. What I have found over the years is the same pattern. The groups bringing these abuses to light are usually from the left and they are usually exposing right wing dictatorships. Funny that.

    Little light afternoon music from the Leftists
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fcqiJzJ1anI

  114. leftwing says:

    AP, didn’t mean to come off as running you personally, I’m not…You’re a balanced and thoughtful poster…my responses were generated because while your postings of general max1ms are relevant and useful they appeared to have a political slant by attributing certain characteristics to “some people…[who] grew up with narratives of hard work and simple, decent values”.

    Honestly, I have three large social circles. We find ourselves getting together much more often and, yes, proactively excluding more than a few of people in these circles who we would have previously invited to c00kouts, p00ls, drinks on the deck, etc.

    While not an echo chamber, and certainly not your “self cancellation” concept, the fact of the matter is that the int0lerance of the Left is currently at such a state that as well placed execs and business owners we’d have to be fools to try to have any reasonable dialogue about current events outside of peers whom we know share our idea(l)s.

  115. 3b says:

    Fab: You can never come out and say yeah you have a point; it’s always qualified. Even in your response you don’t acknowledge China. Can you tell us which left wing group has criticized the Chinese Communist dictatorship?

    As for right wing dictatorships they have to be condemned as well, and yet history shows that left wing dictatorships have slaughtered far more than right wing dictatorships, and did it in the name of the people they claimed to serve.

  116. leftwing says:

    cont’d

    In this hostile environment, yes and without apologies, if you’re one of us you are…otherwise your not.

    I’ve made nearly 60 trips around the Sun on this frozen rock in locations, cu1tures, and experiences so varied I don’t have enough fingers and toes to count them all. Generally, I have found the Left to be much more int0lerant than the Right and, most ins1diously, to be so while telling you they are exactly the opposite.

    Max1ms and platitudes matter. Walking the talk matters more.

  117. Bystander says:

    This songs pops in my head but I think about people a year from now, making rash decisions and the new Wfh/wage paradigm that is coming,

    “And you may find yourself
    Living in a shotgun shack
    And you may find yourself
    In another part of the world
    And you may find yourself
    Behind the wheel of a large automobile
    And you may find yourself in a beautiful house
    With a beautiful wife
    And you may ask yourself, well
    How did I get here?”

  118. leftwing says:

    Man, the filters are killing me today. Even broke open the blacklist, still can’t figure it out.

    Best to get back to the salt mines.

    G’day all.

  119. Fast Eddie says:

    …and yet history shows that left wing dictatorships have slaughtered far more than right wing dictatorships, and did it in the name of the people they claimed to serve.

    The ivory tower progressives are doing it in this country right now. The meek and weak lemmings are being used and abused all in the name of equality and justice. Never let a crisis go to waste… which means use every weapon at your disposal. Too bad the lesser informed masses are too stupid and clueless to know they’re being used as human shields.

  120. leftwing says:

    ” Bystander says:
    July 22, 2020 at 1:44 pm
    This songs pops in my head…”

    Oh no!!!! Just like summoning Beetlejuice!

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nSuregWhlWk

  121. 3b says:

    Bystander: Chester Co is a really nice area. They made a smart decision. And WFH is definitely coming hard for NYC area salaries. As it stands companies were already in the process of geographically dispersing their work force, prior to the pandemic. Shockingly to some NYC centered snobs there are lots of smart talented people across this country who have no desire to live in this area. Zuckerberg acknowledged that fact as well.

    With WFH people can and some appear to be broadening their search outside of the NYC orbit. I agree a generic high income couple paying 800k and 15k in taxes is insane.
    And corporate America is most certainly watching all the rioting and chaos in many cities including NYC and may come to the conclusion no need to be here.

  122. Bystander says:

    Left,

    Freaking awesome..it just replaced fish slapping as best remix I heard this year.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VBcT2rcYlWA

  123. joyce says:

    You need to constantly repeat saying this, lest someone accuse your silence as condoning it.

    Fabius Maximus says:
    July 22, 2020 at 1:30 pm
    Joyce,

    I condemn all countries that partake in Human Rights abuses. Always have.

  124. Yo! says:

    Juice 11:41, I rented a bedroom in that apartment in early 2000s for 1 year. $650 a month. I don’t believe the $1,000,000 but maybe. Will try to confirm it. Landlord was guy I rented from down the street and he bought 401 Monroe pad for high $100,000s.

    Bad Memories: Gunshots popping outside Big Banner Plaza shopping center unfortunately killing a guy. Brakes screeching and plastic cracking 10 am Sunday. Car bike collision. I wake up, look outside, guy hobbles back on on bike and drives off. Like Excitebike.

    That building smelled and was off balance. None of the doors could fit and close.

  125. joyce says:

    Freedom is part of the national anthem (land of the free) and i thought it’s what those who fought to defend it were fighting for… so if the employers do not want to institute rules to stop the practice, your beef is with them.

    3b says:
    July 22, 2020 at 1:20 pm
    AP Take the knee, fine, but what’s the point?? Hey look at me??!! It’s the national anthem, it’s a matter of respect for those who fought to defend it, and what it represents or strives to represent. Why can’t it just be left at that? At this point just end playing the national anthem, because that’s what they really want at the end of the day. Just end it and be done with it!!

  126. Phoenix says:

    Pumps,
    A lesson for you—teacher:
    Lying by omission is when a person leaves out important information or fails to correct a pre-existing misconception in order to hide the truth from others. … Some people view omissions as more than just white lies, but as outright lying, because by omitting information, you’re no longer being transparent

  127. AP says:

    Left, thanks for that comment.

    “your postings of general max1ms are relevant and useful they appeared to have a political slant”

    Thank you, sir. That statement was definitely meant to be a bit provocative.

    Regarding the left being insidiously less tolerant than the right, I think the historical score is pretty evenly split on that.

    There’s a recent anti-scientific bent to some of “the right”, a certain affection for obscure conspiracy theories, that is at least as concerning as Cancel Culture excesses in my view.

  128. Fabius Maximus says:

    3b

    I’ll also add that while Saint Ronnie was chasing his “Paranoid Vistas of Mad Sandanistas” across swaths of South America, he did nothing but embrace what Pinochet was doing in Chile.

    Here is a nice Irish tune for you. Long intro, but I’m sure you’ll appreciate it.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UQpTnUAgA5E

  129. homeboken says:

    I will never kneel for the anthem. I will never burn a flag.

    But I defend any other American’s right to kneel and/or burn. That is what the 1st amendment is all about. If you like 1A, then you must defend the right of others to speak things that you may personally find disgusting.

    It is not cancel culture to “vote with my feet” and decide that while I defend anyone’s right to kneel during the anthem, I certainly don’t have to pay them for the privelege to watch them kneel, like say, before an NFL game.

    You are free to have whatever opinion you want, but you are aren’t entitled to have anyone else agree with you.

    The NFL is an absolute powerhouse of a brand, with a huge hard-core audience. Unlikely that they take a big financial hit due to these social trends. And that is all they are, trends.

  130. homeboken says:

    If the NFL really wants to prove their virtue – They should take 1/3 of the stadium and cancel the season tickets. They should sell them at a reduced or free price to low-income fans that could never dream of paying hundreds of dollars per seat, or buy a PSL that costs as much as a new car.

    Until the NFL puts virtue over profit, it is hard to take any of these signals seriously. They are pandering to their customer base. It’s got nothing to do with them finally becoming “woke”

  131. 3b says:

    Joyce: it’s a matter of respect in my opinion. A time and place for everything. A football field is not in my opinion the place for it.

  132. AP says:

    Home, absolutely fair point re supporting businesses that align with your values by voting with your wallet.

    The original concern I was raising is that there is a growing number of people kinda dropping out of mainstream society in order to avoid any threats to their long-held mindsets.

    Not saying it’s the case with you or anyone on this board necessarily, but it’s a real issue these days.

    For example, I heard a talk at work recently about BLM by a facilitator. Didn’t have huge expectations going in but was surprised by a bunch of interesting new information.

    I did not hear any blame or guilt in the mix, but just a bunch of constructive suggestions. If I would have gone in with a different mindset, or avoided going at all, would I have been better off?

    In this I think many corporate leaders are actually on the right side of history. They realize there’s a profitable horizon for Democratic Capitalism beyond racist practices, and if we make a push now it will pay off in dividends over time.

    There’s a ton of talent and contributions locked out right now, and if we can bring more folks into the system everyone wins.

  133. 3b says:

    Fab: I have heard the tune. Christy Moore is a talented entertainer, he along with more than a few Irish people were obsessed with Ronald Ray gun!! And how he was going to blow up the world; which of course did not happen. And I heard countless times how awful American policy in Central America was. These were the young university educated at the time. And they were the experts. Yet when I bought up what was going in the north of Ireland, and how most Irish people and the government ignored atrocities carried out by the British army and Loyalist death squads. Provo violence was condemned of course, and rightly so. I told what the hell did I know I lived 3000 miles away, yet they were experts on Central America 5000 miles away.

    As for Pinochet he ruled for 17 years. Chile today is a thriving democracy/economy. The Sandinistas have been back in power in Nicaragua for years, and the country is still a mess. Cuba still a leftist dictatorship over 60 years. North Korea over 70 years.

  134. joyce says:

    Okay. I know others share that opinion. But what would be a better venue to do this? We’re talking about a football game here…

    3b says:
    July 22, 2020 at 2:52 pm
    Joyce: it’s a matter of respect in my opinion. A time and place for everything. A football field is not in my opinion the place for it.

  135. 3b says:

    Joyce: I have reconsidered, and actually you are right. If the NFL as an organization are Ok with taking the knee as they are the employer, than you are right they should be allowed to do it even if it is disrespectful. However, it is also the right of the fans myself included, in a free country to voice our displeasure by not attending games or not watching the games. If they do not, than they are hypocrites, and full of crap. I don’t want to hear for love of the sport nonsense. I will not be attending or watching.

  136. 30 year realtor says:

    But it isn’t ok to voice your displeasure with Goya and not buy their beans?

  137. AP says:

    Pinochet is the original “bad hombre”. The shadow he cast over that country lingers to today. The cruelty and brutality was both staggering and exquisite. This name should live in eternal infamy.

  138. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    I didn’t advocate any cancel culture with respect to sports. I still watch them. I just tune out their uninformed politics. They can say what they want and I can ridicule them for being ridiculous.

  139. 3b says:

    3o Year yes it is there right. It’s also the right of the CEO to support Trump. Is that how it is going to be going forward with the left? If we don’t like your personal politics you get boycotted? Or is it only if you support Republicans? And Hispanics do love their Goya products, as do many non Hispanics. As well the company has done much to benefit the various Hispanic communities, who by the way are not monolithic.

    Finally bending the knee and Goya are two very different matters in my opinion, but regardless I have changed my opinion on taking the knee.

    The NFL knows that at the end of the day,despite outrage in some quarters Americans will continue to watch/attend.

  140. 3b says:

    AP he was an evil man, but gone in less than 20 years. That little fat bastard is still in North Korea!

  141. 30 year realtor says:

    The NFL should go back to doing what it used to do, play the anthem while the players are still in the locker room. End of controversy.

    Goya and other CEO’s should keep their politics and their business separated if they are concerned about backlash. Doesn’t matter where you line up politically.

  142. No One says:

    AP
    Now tell us what you think of Allende, Hugo Chavez, and Maduro.

  143. 3b says:

    3o years fair points. Just seems it’s only Republican politics or Trump supporters where it’s an issue. I would confidently say very few Hispanics are boycotting Goya, because the CEO supports Trump.

  144. 3b says:

    No One The left make Allende our to be a martyr but from everything I have read it appears he was going down the road of Castro. But he is long gone. The Sandinistas are still there in Nicaragua.

  145. Phoenix says:

    As men, you don’t matter anyway. You need to convince your wives to do the boycotting. They control the spending.

    “This Bloomberg blog from a seasoned consumer marketer will tell you how do the genders behave in consumer marketing space and if the consumer economy is given any gender, it would be female. That is why the global professional services firm Ernst and Young (E&Y) had predicted in 2014 that the impact of women in the global economy will be at least as significant as that of China and India together. That is about 70-80% of all consumer purchasing.”

  146. 3b says:

    Phoenix We both love Rugby so we are good!! That foreign game!!

  147. AP says:

    What happened after WWII is that a lot of the former regime elements in Germany actually escaped to Argentina, Chile and Brazil, to blend in into very large German immigrant communities in those countries.

    During WWII these countries had aligned with the US, and all evidence and indications were that this positioning was going to continue.

    No One, I think if you read the history of the Pinochet regime, in its excruciating details, you will understand the term “crimes against humanity”.

    Allende is not on record for committing crimes of this nature as far as I know. Even Maduro has not been able to implement anything like this.

    Personally I’m completely opposed to non-democratic regimes. But once the line of “crimes against humanity” gets crossed, that name should no longer be spoken except in disdain and condemnation.

  148. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Why is it that anytime you don’t like what a poster says, I get throw into it? I don’t know how many times I’ve been accused of this, but it’s getting old. I do not know who these people are, I just know that’s not my handle. Why would I do that?

    Bystander says:
    July 22, 2020 at 1:03 pm
    Homebuyer007, SmallGovConserv, Blumpy..it is like the movie Split in here. Something must be wrong on home front.

  149. The Great Pumpkin says:

    You are lost in the woods. Guy thinks nyc area is going to fall off a cliff and nowhereville USA is going to rise. Get out of here with this nonsense.

    Do you actually believe overall salaries are going to go down in the long run? Get your head out of the sand. Wake up.

    If everyone is working from home in 10 years, I’ll kill myself. That’s how much I believe it has zero chance of happening. Some yes, and hybrid forms, sure. But the idea that everything is going to WFH is absolutely crazy.

    3b says:
    July 22, 2020 at 1:55 pm
    Bystander: Chester Co is a really nice area. They made a smart decision. And WFH is definitely coming hard for NYC area salaries. As it stands companies were already in the process of geographically dispersing their work force, prior to the pandemic. Shockingly to some NYC centered snobs there are lots of smart talented people across this country who have no desire to live in this area. Zuckerberg acknowledged that fact as well.

    With WFH people can and some appear to be broadening their search outside of the NYC orbit. I agree a generic high income couple paying 800k and 15k in taxes is insane.
    And corporate America is most certainly watching all the rioting and chaos in many cities including NYC and may come to the conclusion no need to be here.

  150. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Also, do you think this craziness in the city is going to last? It’s a social cycle, it happens every so often. Too many people stuck out home and they just needed a match to set them off. They will cry like babies, and eventually give up. Just let them keep venting till they realize it’s a waste of time.

  151. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Capitalism shows what kind of babies make up the population. You create an economic system based on competition. What happens? Half the population want to hit reset on the game because they are losing and it’s unfair. What a bunch of cry babies.

  152. 3b says:

    AP: Allende was not in power long enough, but as I said it appears he was going to install a Cuban style dictatorship in Chile. As far as Nazi influence after the end of world war 2, I would say minimal impact. South and Central America has been unstable since independence for the most part. Numerous attempts at various time to unify some portion of South America. Wars between Chile and Bolivia, as well as Argentina, Uruguay and Paraguay. The only relatively stable countries have been Chile, Argentina, and Venezuela, and I use the term loosely. In Central America it’s Costa Rica.

  153. 3b says:

    He is going to kill himself because of WFH?? Good Lord!! Now that’s extreme! WFH is here to stay and will be the norm. It’s here, of course those of us that actually work in the corporate world see it.

  154. Bystander says:

    3b,

    Is that another benefit of WFH?…I kid, I kid. Blumpy would never change his handle except to post here after blog shutdown. He was promptly called out on it. There is no delusion like self delusion

  155. AP says:

    3b, not sure there was evidence of that inclination on Allende’s part. Left to its own devices I think the situation there would have drifted towards European style social-democracy.

    My point with the N@zi link is that there was a common political DNA between the regimes. Argentina has its own disturbing history with eugenics.

    The problem with post-independence Latin America is that unlike the in the USA there were extremely few small land/farm owners. The colonial model was highly extractive and exploitative comparatively. Large land owners deploying an extractive, non-industrial economic model.

    Latin America has always had, and continues to have, more political and fraternal ties with the USA than any other country, including the Ruskies.

  156. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Yea, keep telling yourself that. Extreme, because is has zero chance.

    Everyone is going to move away from the cities and WFH in some rural area to save money. Got it. And with this new found savings, what exactly are they going to do with it in nowhereville? There is absolutely nothing to do. The beach isn’t close. No restaurants. Seriously, wtf do you in these rural areas? Shoot cans in the backyard with your gun?

    You are telling me that people who like having everything at the snap of a finger are going to enjoy living in the middle of nowhere? They will go insane with boredom.

    3b says:
    July 22, 2020 at 5:19 pm
    He is going to kill himself because of WFH?? Good Lord!! Now that’s extreme! WFH is here to stay and will be the norm. It’s here, of course those of us that actually work in the corporate world see it.

  157. The Great Pumpkin says:

    It wasn’t me…I don’t know who called you out.

    Bystander says:
    July 22, 2020 at 5:23 pm
    3b,

    Is that another benefit of WFH?…I kid, I kid. Blumpy would never change his handle except to post here after blog shutdown. He was promptly called out on it. There is no delusion like self delusion

  158. 3b says:

    AP Agree to disagree but if you have the chance read up on the Allende era. As well after the Cuban Revolution, there was no way the US was going to take a chance. South American countries started out with promise and just did not make it. Even the reformers turned out to be dictators as well, Peron in Argentina, Chavez in Venezuela, even Batista in Cuba. He ironically enough was of indigenous Indian stock, not Spanish. He instituted major reforms including the 8 hour work day. The American mob totally corrupted him and he became a dictator.

  159. Juice Box says:

    We shall see if my Law and Order legal chops are better than Fab’s hysterical twitter tweets about the Federal Police activities in Portland.

    I argue no standing, Fab argues some vague thing about detainment and arrest.

    “David M. Morrell, a U.S. Department of Justice attorney, argued that the state doesn’t have standing to sue the federal government and failed to prove that the detention of Pettibone or the man captured on video was unlawful. He also pointed out Rosenblum withdrew a second video exhibit contending the same practice by federal officers, after learning that the video depicted someone in San Diego, not Portland.

    Regardless of Mr. Pettibone’s state of mind, the state has offered nothing to suggest there was no reasonable basis to believe Mr. Pettibone engaged in criminal or violent conduct,” Morrell said.

    U.S. District Judge Michael W. Mosman heard about 90 minutes of arguments during the hearing held by video conference and didn’t rule from the bench. He’s expected to issue a written ruling soon.”

    https://www.oregonlive.com/crime/2020/07/oregons-attorney-general-argues-for-temporary-restraining-order-against-federal-law-enforcement.html

  160. ExEssex says:

    We sail around the world:

    https://youtu.be/PMddrdowUFM

  161. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Joe Biden’s disastrous plans for America’s suburbs

    https://nypost.com/2020/07/21/joe-bidens-disastrous-plans-for-americas-suburbs/

  162. JUice Box says:

    Ho hum my new A/C stopped this evening blower was not on and compressor was running. Error code was “Internal control fault”. A reboot cleared it, but really now damm thing is brand new.

    Seems I will

  163. Juice Box says:

    Pumps – re: “disastrous plans for America’s suburbs”

    Biden is the same guy who was against integration via busing.

    Pravda even confirms it.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2019/07/15/us/politics/biden-busing.html

  164. AP says:

    3b, keep in mind the following regarding Brazil, Chile and Argentina in the mid-20th century: the economic system in place then, still in place today to some degree, is barely Capitalist, but closer to Feudalism in nature.

    Talking about stuff like mine workers collapsing from exhaustion, entire families resorting to eating grass at times because they had no land to cultivate even a small garden, a semi-feudal system in every regard.

    Allende was arguably playing an important moderating role among the different political factions at the times.

    One thing is for sure, whatever could have hipothetically happened was no worse than what did in fact happen.

  165. 3b says:

    Bystander: He most definitely posted here after the shutdown, and his post was something to do with people fleeing the city and how that might impact house prices in Wayne. That sealed it of course, and he was called out and than that “someone else” just disappeared. As well he lacks zero reading comprehension skills, as I have never said people were all going to move to rural areas in the middle of nowhere. Amazing how he seems to think he knows what corporate America will and will not do, because he says so. Still though in all my years on the blog I have never heard any poster present or past threaten to kill themselves if something happens that they don’t want to happen. And of course we all know why he does not want it to happen, but it’s already happening!!

  166. 3b says:

    AP Perhaps regarding Allende, but history shows those who start out as reformers end up becoming ruthless brutal dictators no better than what they replaced and often times worse.

  167. Why? I don’t know says:

    Why? I don’t know Michael / Lost / Pumpkin / Deadconomy

    The Great Pumpkin says:
    July 22, 2020 at 4:49 pm
    Why is it that anytime you don’t like what a poster says, I get throw into it? I don’t know how many times I’ve been accused of this, but it’s getting old. I do not know who these people are, I just know that’s not my handle. Why would I do that?

  168. AP says:

    3b, fair point. And that’s why democratic and constitutional checks and balances are so critical.

    Democracy: so imperfect, so indispensable.

    Imagine the human suffering that could have been avoided with more skillful means of handling that scenario. Work within the framework of diplomatic influence, civil society influence, etc.

    That’s why I say: we who appreciate democracy and human rights should never look at those dictatorships as a necessary evil. They were the bottom of the pit. The end of the road. The final social and spiritual dead-end that we should at all costs avoid repeating.

  169. chicagofinance says:

    173 comments WTF?

  170. chicagofinance says:

    If you told FabMax the Uighur’s were Jews, he would have blown a load….

    homeboken says:
    July 22, 2020 at 8:25 am
    Uighur’s being blindfolded and lined up to board trains – Any here support this? Regardless of context:
    https://uk.news.yahoo.com/drone-video-alleged-uighur-prisoners-203657904.html

  171. chicagofinance says:

    Tremendous

    Phoenix says:
    July 22, 2020 at 9:26 am
    Read the Washington Post-only kidding.

    If I could describe that paper as a sound- hundreds of crows and seagulls fighting over discarded french fries..

  172. chicagofinance says:

    As much as I want Stevie Cohen to win the bid for the Mets, I am pretty sure Citifield will morph into the Yankee Stadium abyss. The new stadium is pure stunning garbage. Cohen will be compelled to fcuk all Mets fans….. it’s his DNA

    leftwing says:
    July 22, 2020 at 10:00 am
    Gave up Yanks season tickets when they moved stadiums and jacked prices. Magic was gone, for triple the price.

  173. chicagofinance says:

    Met McDonough at a Northern Trust function in 2017….. he is so NHL and Chicago. Just a regular guy…. could see him sitting at a bar and just talk about whatever game is on the tube.

    leftwing says:
    July 22, 2020 at 10:00 am
    Pound for pound professional hockey players are the most understated, generous, unselfish and just down to earth likable pro athletes out there. Hope the NHL doesn’t get infected with all this foolishness (go blackhawks, lol).

  174. joyce says:

    I’d love to know what FabMax said ~15 years ago to warrant the continual comments implying anti-semitism.

  175. The Great Pumpkin says:

    You don’t get it. Ever see the series, “Office?” Well, some people clearly think it’s funny to write posts to f’k with me. You know how many times my own handle (The Great Pumpkin) was hacked and used to mock me? I thought you guys are all in on it, so I ignore it…joke on me. Haha.

    3b says:
    July 22, 2020 at 7:50 pm
    Bystander: He most definitely posted here after the shutdown, and his post was something to do with people fleeing the city and how that might impact house prices in Wayne.

  176. The Great Pumpkin says:

    You have consistently claimed nj is dying from day 1 on this blog I assume. Still not correct, but always doubling down.

    You constantly yap about WFH becoming the norm and NYC area collapsing, yet you never said this…okay. You clearly are f’ing with me.

    “As well he lacks zero reading comprehension skills, as I have never said people were all going to move to rural areas in the middle of nowhere.”

  177. JCer says:

    AP democracy has a time and place, for every success there are many more failures. Even the rise of N@zi Germany begins in the democratic process. At some point the system stops working and it is replaced by a dictator often at the request of a lot of people.

    When TSHTF democracies are very slow to respond and they collapse almost every time. History has proven over and over again democracies end in existential crisis, a vacuum of power and an eventual dictatorship.

  178. chicagofinance says:

    Was going to say the exact same thing…… also even the youngest boomers have frozen corporate pensions and fat 401(k)’s. They barely saved, but there was such umbrage at the loss of pensions that corps stuffed their 401(k)’s in the early years before pulling back. The worst part about the boomers is that they completely don’t see how godd they have it…… they just whine a lot…… most of the frozen pensions have an NPV of $300K-$800K for sone scrub middle manager….. they act like it’s nothing…..

    Bystander says:
    July 22, 2020 at 10:23 am
    3b,

    Sorry, I am middle Gen X and most people I know got f-ed. We were 25-35 around 2005 bubble and most people I know bought homes as we were told rates were insanely low. Values are still at 2004 levels so tell me how Gen X made out? I have family members and friends who took bloodbath when they had to move..even recently.

  179. chicagofinance says:

    Which years were your back and neck surgeries?

    ExEssex says:
    July 22, 2020 at 10:28 am
    10:13 I played three seasons of college rugby.
    Holy mackerel it…was…epic

  180. chicagofinance says:

    Same thing with the BLM crap at Starbucks and Whole Foods….. I go in there to chill out, not to be wound up by some snot nosed kids……

    leftwing says:
    July 22, 2020 at 10:34 am
    “That’s sad. Don’t give up on your football, man. Just because some of the players have different views?”

    No, because what was once an enjoyable diversion has been taken over by activists with fundamentally no interest in the underlying sport and an interest only in jamming political views with which I fundamentally disagree down my throat. I am not in the habit of standing around while someone metaphorically turns on a megaphone and begins offensively screaming in my face, especially when I am paying to be there. I sincerely hope the NFL takes a massive financial hit when it restarts.

  181. 3b says:

    Chgo I don’t dispute any of what you say, and in fact as you know I have been railing against the boomers for a long time, and I am one. But there are Gen Xers that are just as bad, and self centered and self medicated. As far as house prices, I bought at the height of the market in the 80s and sold 10 years later for the exact same price and that was with renovations as well. There are also Gen
    Xers with nice pensions as well. I feel bad for younger couples today however that’s defined today who pay 500k or more with a 10k plus yearly tax bill, plus day care and all the rest. Stuffing money into a mortgage instead of a 401k in the hopes they can sell the place 20 plus years out for a big profit. It’s a shame. And I
    Think it’s financial suicide. High house prices and property taxes are not a positive.

  182. chicagofinance says:

    I disagree. NJ has much better fundamentals and potential than CT, albeit it poor leadership and debt load. Look at RI, CT’s neighbor…… that is their future…..

    3b says:
    July 22, 2020 at 11:12 am
    Although CT is by no
    Means a great state financially, it’s better than NJ.

  183. 3b says:

    Chgo Rugby is a great sport and the parties afterwards were legendary!!

  184. JCer says:

    Chi and Bystander as bad as you think GenX had it, it has only gotten worse. I look at my generation and it is bad and the I look at the millennials and see how bad it has gotten. They shipped away so many jobs, only the most qualified have anything remotely resembling a fruitful career, there are no positions for them, all entry level is don overseas or has been automated. Opportunities in the workforce to do office work or factory work are rapidly shrinking. I feel like we barely hire kids out of college most work is outsourced or off-shored.

    As for the talk of the housing market, it is totally COVID related. I know a lot of city dwellers looking to leave. People pay absurd amounts for little space, the premise is they are close to work, and all entertainment venues, the buildings have plenty of entertaining spaces none of that matters anymore. Looking at it the values are still very high in NYC, Jersey City, Hoboken, and Brooklyn. When you factor all the costs, the insane cost to own a car(most families in cities have one), the maintenance fees, etc the suburbs look attractive. With COVID and riots people are locked inside that 1200 square feet for 3-4 people no longer looks so good. The housing market is crazy, makes me wish I took a flyer on some suburban real estate, in the past 2 months I could have made enough money to retire.

  185. 3b says:

    Chgo Agree to disagree to agree to disagree!! Both bad choices but still believe Ct better and now NJ with the 10 billion borrowing makes it even worse.

  186. JCer says:

    NJ has a better chance at Urban Renewal than CT. Most CT cities are like Newark or Camden but without Hope because they are not satellites of larger cities. Both states were run into the ground by democrat politicians, taxes hurt, when these states were low tax people and businesses were running to them and now they are leaving en-masse. If NJ could figure out how not to be a basket case and could get taxes under control so it has a better business environment than NY things would be better here.

  187. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    So, I went to Asbury Park today. Nearly empty again. My daughter painted her hair purple with some chalk thing this morning. She then did it to my hair. So, I basically showed up to Asbury with purple hair. The girl at MOGO liked it.

  188. Fabius Maximus says:

    Joyce,

    Thank you for picking up on that. As others have noted in the past, there is no basis. He just keeps lobbing this at me hoping to get a rise. It started when I called him out for unprofessional behavior for someone with a semi-public persona. A lot of us know who he is in real life and who he works for. He doesn’t keep that secret.

    These days I just put it down to “Dude has issues”

  189. chicagofinance says:

    AP: You are softening what is happening…… there is a shocking level of aggression, so the “surprising and unsettling” is producing alarming and concering.

    The basic moorings of this country are being more than questioned. They are being attacked as arbitrary and unjust, which a pragmatic review of the facts sincerely does not justify. Further, the attack is being delivered as a set of commands. It is more than just disquieting…… concurrent with a maniac in charge of the country too.

    AP says:
    July 22, 2020 at 12:58 pm
    Left, I never said self centered, bud. I’m talking about philosophical and historical views. Many people are being presented with new evidence and lines of argumentation that are surprising and unsettling.

  190. chicagofinance says:

    I love you man!

    Fabius Maximus says:
    July 22, 2020 at 9:33 pm
    Joyce,

    Thank you for picking up on that. As others have noted in the past, there is no basis. He just keeps lobbing this at me hoping to get a rise. It started when I called him out for unprofessional behavior for someone with a semi-public persona. A lot of us know who he is in real life and who he works for. He doesn’t keep that secret.

    These days I just put it down to “Dude has issues”

  191. Fabius Maximus says:

    CT has issues, but I dont think you can land all of that the Dems Door. The GOP held CT through the 90’s and 2000’s with Roland being impeached .

  192. No One says:

    The Pinochet regime definitely did some bad things. Sort of like a civil war but a good bit of the killing and arresting happened after taking over government rather than before it. They also cleaned up the Marxism-inspired economic crisis Allende created.

    But all of Pinochet’s sins and worse were commited by Chevez and Chavistas in Venezuela, by the Castros in Cuba. Dictatorship, imprisonment, killing of political opponents. Yet they are treated as heroes by some rather than being accused of “crimes against humanity”. Ask yourself why.

  193. chicagofinance says:

    Kapernick is not a good player and barely belonged in the league when he started his campaign. It was a last gasp in the final days he was on the stage. He knew it. I think it was surprised at how he was able to parlay it into serious coin. Good for him. But he is a capitalist now….. and don’t forget it. and the irony is that his second career wouldn’t exist without the persecution he derides. His second career is going to be far more lucrative than his first.

    Also, Nick Bosa is already a much better player than Kapernick ever was…. not that I care, and I am no fan of political displays in sports.

    Fabius Maximus says:
    July 22, 2020 at 1:21 pm
    30 year, it actually goes further. Kappernick should stick to his lane, but Nick Bosa should be free to express his MAGAness.

  194. chicagofinance says:

    Typical post dripping with moral authority……. you hate the United States….. why are you here?

    Fabius Maximus says:
    July 22, 2020 at 1:30 pm
    Joyce,

    I condemn all countries that partake in Human Rights abuses. Always have. What I have found over the years is the same pattern. The groups bringing these abuses to light are usually from the left and they are usually exposing right wing dictatorships. Funny that.

  195. Phoenix says:

    “If NJ could figure out how not to be a basket case and could get taxes under control”

    When pigs fly….

  196. Phoenix says:

    Kaepernick was like a low oil pressure indicator on your dashboard and you decided to keep driving as if nothing was wrong, in fact, thought it was humorous and annoying.

    There was already severe engine damage as your bearings were scored which is why you were hearing that knocking sound you would ignore but it was not going anywhere- chose not to address it even as it got louder.

    Well, you do that long enough until a rod goes through the side of the block-like some teenage girl who never read the manual you act surprised. Either way, not going to be easy to put that genie back in the bottle. Was a much easier fix and should have been addressed in 2016 instead of ridiculed. I know, I lived it.

    You embrace those guys as heroes and brag about how good the American justice system is. Well folks, it’s not, it’s like a cheap ass oil filter you bought at a Dollar General that just leaked all of your oil out and caused you a major engine failure.
    Deal with it.

  197. AP says:

    Chi, “The basic moorings of this country are being more than questioned.”

    It depends where you look. I think right now there’s a large middle group of folks putting forth reasonable grievances, and some loonies along for the ride as well.

    I so see a certain historic continuity between say the Emancipation Declaration, Reconstruction, Civil Rights era and today. Seen in its best light, it’s a great story of a country in evolution, of a more perfect union.

    I think the country is greater and stronger than its critics, and that dialogue, even critical challenges, can actually make the country even stronger.

  198. 3b says:

    No One and all the morons running around with their Che shirts on. The only reason Castro promoted him was he had no qualms killing whoever Castro asked him to. He was a disaster as an administrator in Cuba after the revolution. And he died as a coward whining and begging for his life in the mountains of Bolivia.

  199. 3b says:

    Jcer I am not sure how beneficial being a satellite city is going to be going forward.

  200. Fabius Maximus says:

    Chi,

    As I said to Eddie, I don’t hate you, that would require effort on my part that’s just not worth it. So go ahead and throw what you you like at me. Honestly I don’t care.

    I could craft a pithy response about “Words like Violence!”, but I’ll go with Tae Tae;
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfWlot6h_JM

  201. JCer says:

    Seriously the situation in CT is a function of poor tax policy. That tends to fall firmly on Democrats, who espouse progressive income taxes and inheritance taxes which have dire effects on economic development. CT ranks 42nd in business climate, they have 12% inheritance tax, nearly 7% income tax. When you chase your rich benefactors to other low tax states and have a poor business climate it is a recipe for disaster, the politicians are tone deaf.

    Here is the deal I’ve seen it personally anyone who is impacted by a state inheritance tax decamps to a no tax state upon retirement, furthermore high progressive tax rates make it economically prudent to relocate. If the income tax were flat, and relatively small they will retain more taxes. Democrats want 10% state income taxes for their progressive dreams but 10% of 0 is 0. Malloy was like pouring gasoline on a fire. My mom could have stayed an NJ resident but realistically she was going to FL in the winter anyway the estate tax prompted it as did the high income tax it was too much to ignore. Honestly though the whole family is in NJ, the kids, grandkids etc it is actually a challenge to spend the majority of the time in FL.

    If New Jersey could distance itself from the very bad democrats(and republicans for that matter) who have been running it for 30 years, go to flat income tax, cut education aid to cities(enacting equal aid to all districts), eliminate wasteful government employees and welfare programs the states finances could recover and maybe people would want to live here again.

  202. JCer says:

    3b, until COVID urbanization was a positive. That is unlikely to change, people make knee jerk reactions all the time. COVID will eventually end, memories will fade and people will go back towards cities.

  203. Fabius Maximus says:

    “Kapernick is not a good player ”

    Yea, 4-2 in the playoffs, that guy sucked?

  204. Fabius Maximus says:

    ” you hate the United States….. why are you here?”

    No i don’t! I’m here by abjure will call out enemies, […] domestic

  205. Fabius Maximus says:

    If you get it do you get two scoops of Ice Cream?

    https://twitter.com/i/status/1286132416361488386

    Honestly Gary, how long are you sticking with this? Is this Greatness?

  206. Fabius Maximus says:

    Chi,

    The list of the people hired ahead of Kapernick. This to me is the worst metric of all.

    https://theundefeated.com/features/33-quarterbacks-signed-before-colin-kaepernick-free-agent/

    The only person close to his numbers is Josh Mc Cown who was on the tail end of his career.

    Reality is that Kapperick should have a good 8 tears of top flight fitness left. But is totally shut out

  207. leftwing says:

    “The list of the people hired ahead of Kapernick. This to me is the worst metric of all…Reality is that Kapperick should have a good 8 [y]ears of top flight fitness left. But is totally shut out.”

    I’ll take the other side of this argument. It’s easy and rational.

    First, I’ll agree his numbers qualify him. But…

    It’s all about the locker room and team dynamic.

    K is definitely shut out. Not because of his race. Not because of his specific message. But because he’s made himself a polarizing figure which can be disruptive to his teammates and the locker room.

    In every team sport at every level from teenager, NCAA, and through the pros the scene is littered with talented players left behind because of “off-field” issues. The NY sports scene has had its share.

    It’s hard enough to win at the highest levels when everything is going according to plan. No coach, GM, or owner in his right mind would take a gamble that introduces a whole new level of unnecessary uncertainty and disruption into that weekly game plan. Shake your while muttering “too bad”, cross that name off your list, and look at the next one in line.

  208. leftwing says:

    Shake your *head* while muttering “too bad”…..

    Still on only my first cup of coffee lol.

  209. AP says:

    Interesting article this morning over at the “Pravda” about persecuting N@zi crimes.

    https://www.nytimes.com/2020/07/23/world/europe/holocaust-trial-nazi-guard-germany.html

    Crimes against humanity aren’t the same as other political or even heinous crimes. Never again.

    But there are people out there who make apologies for Germany, saying “but WWI!”, “But the N@zis were a reaction again Marxists in the Weimar Republic!”.

    I am completely comfortable condemning the Soviets Gulags and the Pinochet regime at the same time. I can condem political violence and persecution anywhere it takes place.

    But some people on the board think Pinochet “did some bad things”. I have nothing but contempt for this position, except when I recognize that it’s perhaps not borne out of callousness but just ignorance.

    I urge anyone making justifications for the regime in Chile to take the trouble to read reports of the times. I assure that outside of reading about the Holocaust you will not find more shocking events.

  210. homeboken says:

    Professional sports relies on cash paid by consumers.

    If Kaep could bring $ into an organization, he would be hired, warts and all. The business exists first to make a profit. Winning games is usually associated with profit but there are some cases where a brilliant player is still a net negative on team value.

    Like any private enterprise – Try to maintain your employment while be a net negative to the enterprise that employs you. You may swing that for a year, maybe two. But eventually. someone will notice the trend and say “We make more money the day we fire this guy/gal” And that is the end.

    Lebron James could slice a head off a puppy live on instagram – He will still be employed by someone, so long as he could sell a product.

  211. Juice box says:

    Portland Mayor after being tear gassed by the feds and assaulted by the rioters got his snippet Of a sound bite in last night against trump.

    .
    @tedwheeler
    says, “I saw nothing that provoked this response” when asked about his thoughts on federal law enforcement deploying tear gas.

    The building had been set on fire and rioters were throwing explosives. #PortlandRiots

  212. homeboken says:

    There is willful compliance by far too many local leaders in allowing lawlessness and rioting.

    I don’t know if this is a large political game or fear. But the mayor of Portland, Chicago, Minneapolis, etc are some of the most mediocre people I have ever seen take public office, and that is already a REALLY low bar.

  213. Fast Eddie says:

    I don’t know if this is a large political game or fear.

    If their hatred for Trump outweighs their duty to uphold laws and keep peace, then these mayors should be charged with multiple criminal counts. If they’re afraid to ask for help out of fear, then they’re not fit for the job and should resign.

  214. ExEssex says:

    Former national security adviser John Bolton believes Russian President Vladimir Putin thinks “he can play” President Donald Trump “like a fiddle,” saying in an ABC News interview Trump lacks “the competence” to be president.

    “I don’t think he’s fit for office,” Bolton told ABC’s Martha Raddatz. “I don’t think he has the competence to carry out the job. There really isn’t any guiding principle that I was able to discern other than ‘What’s good for Donald Trump’s reelection.’”

    Bolton alleges that Trump was compromised in his dealings with foreign leaders because of the president’s obsession with winning a second term, which superseded the political ramifications of his decisions. Bolton said this sole focus on reelection made it easy for adversaries like Putin to take advantage of Trump.

  215. homeboken says:

    John Bolton – The guy that would start a war with your kids for opening a lemonade stand. Enjoy sidling up next to that guy.

  216. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Think of it like WWI, the assassination was the spark, but the war was already happening. This is exactly what happened with people intent on building families and living in the city. When you start building a family, space matters and suburbs appeal. Suburbs were made to raise families while cities appeal for an exciting quality of life for singles, no kids, and parents done raising their kids. So with the suburbs, you get to raise your family in a more comfortable environment for raising families, but are still close to the excitement.

    Also, the cycle of the market is at play. After the millennials drove up the price of cities, the suburbs became a value. Market spillover comes into play. They drive up the suburbs till the city becomes a value in comparison to the burbs. This doesn’t happen overnight. Sometimes it takes a decade or two to play out. What was it, 15 years since the last time suburbs were very expensive and in demand, compared to the city?

    “As for the talk of the housing market, it is totally COVID related. I know a lot of city dwellers looking to leave. People pay absurd amounts for little space, the premise is they are close to work, and all entertainment venues, the buildings have plenty of entertaining spaces none of that matters anymore.”

  217. No One says:

    AP,
    Glad to see this passion against violators of individual rights.
    Against such people and governments, what are you saying should be done?

  218. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Politicians are always playing their game of power. They are doing this crap on purpose, all in the hopes of taking out trump. I really hope this dangerous game they are playing doesn’t blow up in their face. Anarchy can spread fast once it’s out of control.

    homeboken says:
    July 23, 2020 at 8:12 am
    There is willful compliance by far too many local leaders in allowing lawlessness and rioting.

    I don’t know if this is a large political game or fear. But the mayor of Portland, Chicago, Minneapolis, etc are some of the most mediocre people I have ever seen take public office, and that is already a REALLY low bar.

  219. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Some people are also New Yorkers for life. So there will still be families there. They are going to lose a ton of population. The population of the leading cities might stagnate or fall a little for the time being, but you are not going to see a massive exodus.

  220. Bystander says:

    3b/JCer/Chi/Fab,

    I tend to agree that NJ is in better position. No point in going into politics as both states have out of control spending and taxation. The argument is mostly geographical. CT is in no man’s land while NJ has direct NYC access in the north and Philly access in the south. That is a strong economic sandwich. CT is 45m by train to NYC from Greenwich then gets worse from there. Boston is too far away so no economic spillover. The state’s entire hope is pinned to Fairfield County and Stamford which worked when UBS, RBS, GE Capital and hedge fund industry were centered there. Now, they are mostly gone and it is a shell. Jersey City won out as financial center several years ago. The perfect analogy is look at athletics as their respective state universities. UConn men’s BB has perhaps most dominant performance over 20 years (better than Puke, NC or UK) with 4 NCs from ’99-2018. Women’s BB has been incomparable on court with 11 NCs. UConn can’t find a big time conference to offer them and now withering on the vine. Rutgers has non-existent BB history. When comparing football programs, Rutgers has been failing longer than any program in the country. Pretty shameful..sorry. UConn moved up to D1 in 1999 and made to Fiesta bowl in 2011 which surpasses level Butgers ever achieved in 150 years of playing. Now because of proximity to NYC and Philly market and their viewers/money, Rutgers athletics will be paid millions to get pounded by OSU, UM and PSU every year in the Big Ten. UConn, being in middle of nowhere, will see its championship programs die a long, slow death. Same applies to corps and business world.

  221. The Great Pumpkin says:

    The ultimate clue to knowing that cities will live on; they serve too many roles. They are efficient at housing massive amount of people. NYC alone has more population than most states. Where the f’k are you going to efficiently move all these people to if we are moving away from the city model?

    Just take the nyc metro area. North jersey, west Chester, rock land, Long Island, and southern conn; the total population of this area is insane. Where the hell are all these people going to go if nyc dies? How will they survive? What place has the infrastructure to absorb that kind of population? It’s like saying Honolulu is dying, it’s finished, and everyone is moving out. Okay, what part of the islands can absorb that population? Well apply that to nyc metro area. It’s not going anywhere and will only grow over time.

  222. homeboken says:

    Any doctors or nurses here know what the hell this guy is talking about?

    https://youtu.be/NeDulyoiIGc

  223. Bystander says:

    Only red hats dolts could surmise that Goya, Scott Baio, Antonion Sabato are correct while the entire segments of mayoral/gubernational/fed intelligence/National security/military leadership communities/Trump ex staff and even family members are just compromised deep state, Donald haters..truly looking glass stuff.

  224. AP says:

    No One, thanks for this response.

    I think a model similar to post-War Germany is a good one. A strong denazification program, resolute determination to own up to and repudiate the crimes of the past, and appropriate reparations for the victims and survivors.

    Truth is actually the most important thing in avoid this in the future though. That may be why I was so passionate about it last night and this morning. We need to shine a light on these despicable practices wherever we find them.

    Good convo though. I appreciate it.

  225. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I don’t know if it’s a good thing, but the experts agree with me.

    “Experts say that despite many residents leaving, it’s only a small amount of the 8.3 million population in New York City.”

    https://abc7ny.com/realestate/some-nyc-residents-still-choose-to-move-despite-city-reopening/6328699/

  226. Yo! says:

    Mahwah based retailer Ascena is bankrupt. Got $32 million Grow NJ tax credit a few years ago. My view is they liquidate and fire all NJ employees. Whacked hundreds of them last year.

    Ascena not a household name but similar scale as Toys r Us.

  227. Juice Box says:

    Ascena operated nearly 2800 stores across all of its brands, too bad most are in malls, even without Covid-19 they were still a sinking ship.

  228. The Great Pumpkin says:

    A massive banner showing Mayor de Blasio holding the severed head of the Statue of Liberty was draped over the Staten Island Expressway in time for the evening rush hour Tuesday.

    The banner, which was hung from an overpass on the northbound expressway near Fingerboard Road in Arrochar, shows de Blasio grinning and wearing a t-shirt depicting Cuban revolution figure Che Guevara.

    https://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nyc-crime/ny-de-blasio-staten-island-banner-20200722-7ajpiapbdvatbnuki5e33eihwi-story.html

  229. Juice Box says:

    Pumps old news, the Che T-Shirt was a nice touch though.

  230. Nomad says:

    On the lighter side, a couple of 17 yr olds trying to figure out how to work a rotary dial phone.

    https://twitter.com/Davey_Sojourner/status/1286176940294995970

  231. 3b says:

    Bystander: I would agree that NJ is in a better position geographically than CT, but I don’t know how important that will be going forward, certainly it won’t be as important as it was. WFH is changing the need for proximity to NYC. For instance we were WFH 2days a week prior to the pandemic. We have already been told that it is being expanded, so definitely 3 days a week WFH possibly 4,and maybe all 5 for some areas.
    So in this example being close to NYC in my mind is not really that important. Under these circumstances if I were starting out today, I would not live in Bergen Co, other more attractive options further away from NYC/JC, and if I had to do long commute for 2 days a week would not be an issue.

    I also think the riots did not help NYC. There has not been riots and looting in NYC since the black out in 77, 43 years ago. This will influence corporate decision makers in spite of any lip service that says we are committed to NYC. This could potentially help JC, if some companies decide to move from NYC. Still a lot of summer left any additional rioting/looting will be another negative for NYC.

  232. Juice Box says:

    Speaking of Mayors……

    “Chicago Fraternal Order of Police president John Catanzara slammed Mayor Lori Lightfoot’s leadership Tuesday, accusing her of “running the Titanic into an iceberg intentionally.”

    “The mayor likes to use the word ‘unhinged.” The ironic part is the mayor became unhinged,” Catanzara told Fox News’s Laura Ingraham Tuesday night. “I wish I could show you the text messages that she sent me over the weekend as soon as she found out that I had sent the request to President Trump.”

    “She was the one who became totally unhinged, unprofessional, childish,” he said, “and it was really pathetic for the leader of a city.”

    She’s literally running the Titanic into an iceberg intentionally,” Catanzara added. “Fifty-six rounds fired, I’m told, and 17 people shot tonight at a funeral where there was police … special attention because of the gang victim that was already being waked at the funeral home.”

  233. joyce says:

    If a city needs this type of support from the Federal government, who has the authority to ask for it? The mayor? The governor?

    Juice Box says:
    July 23, 2020 at 10:42 am
    Speaking of Mayors……

    “Chicago Fraternal Order of Police president John Catanzara slammed Mayor Lori Lightfoot’s leadership Tuesday, accusing her of “running the Titanic into an iceberg intentionally.”

    “The mayor likes to use the word ‘unhinged.” The ironic part is the mayor became unhinged,” Catanzara told Fox News’s Laura Ingraham Tuesday night. “I wish I could show you the text messages that she sent me over the weekend as soon as she found out that I had sent the request to President Trump.”

  234. Bystander says:

    3b,

    Yep, my post is more backward looking. NJ’s location will simply allow it to hold on longer. CT will have come to Jesus moment sooner – businesses growth horrific due to high taxes (strike one), geographically limited / no major city or job hub (strike two) and pushing burden further on taxpayers, forcing them to move (strike 3). CT is last pitch now. It will be next 5 – 10 years where you will see exodus. I have received a few job WFH inquiries but from San Antonio and TN and they can’t commit to it being permanent…yet so it makes no sense. The tax implications are also going to hold up process. Congress will have to act. Once companies firmly commits then gloves are off, national work force for millions of jobs. National wage arbitrage that favors cheaper cost of living locations. Home address in Ridgewood? No, thanks.

  235. Juice Box says:

    Joyce – The DOJ, FBI, DEA and ATF has been busy in Chicago for decades. Didn’t Bobby Kennedy start the war on gangs and organzied crime back in 1960? Trump has surged support from the City of Chicago since the day he took office. What is your question exactly about “ask” for help? If the elected officials don’t “ask” for help then the Feds should pull all federal officers out of a city? Please explain. I am pretty sure a citizen do I have the right to petition my government for assistance if the elected officials don’t.

  236. No One says:

    AP,
    So where is the movement for DeChavezification of Venezuela, DeCastroization of Cuba, and the de-CCPization of China? They’ve all done at least equal crimes, if not far worse assaults on rights and people. Yet I see the left hailing two of those regimes as inspirational and happily dealing with the largest one.

    Here’s my assessment – these countries have committed atrocities in the name of Marxism and class revolution, so they get a pass from the boot-licking leftist intellectuals. The spirit of Walter Duranty lives on strong in this group. And then this trickles down to the pseudo-intellectuals writing in and reading the NYTimes and such media, who react to, or ignore, what they’re told to.

  237. Bystander says:

    3b,

    Gotta run but guessing next year or two will be status quo. Recover from virus economically and WFH will be 3 days week, 2 in office. Execs will have to figure out long term, workforce, real estate and tax legalities. WeWork type sites will skyrocket. Commercial spaces will be chopped up until smaller, multi-tenant spaces. Shorter lease terms will be norm. In 5 years, landscape will completely change and high cost areas start decline.

  238. 3b says:

    Bystander:Agreed. I have a friend in a high up HR spot, and she told me all the mid and large size companies are seriously looking and or implementing WFH on a permanent basis. She said depending on the company real estate is typically the second or third biggest expense for companies. Also said WFH and geographical dispersing will
    Allow companies to put in place salary tiers based on cost of living in various areas.

    Additionally she said younger couples with children want WFH due to quality of life issues; this of course subject to schools getting back to normal.

  239. Fast Eddie says:

    If the WFH model is now in full bloom, why would a potential employer look for a candidate in higher price locales such as the NYC or San Fran area, for example? Why not an adequate candidate from the middle of Nowhere, USA that would take the role at a substantially lower salary?

  240. Juice Box says:

    Killing it in the Hamptons.

    “The median price of a single-family home in the Hamptons reached a record $1.1 million in the second quarter, an increase of 25% over last year’s second quarter, according to a report by Miller Samuel and Douglas Elliman.”

    https://www.cnbc.com/2020/07/23/coronavirus-home-prices-in-hamptons-hit-record-as-wealthy-new-yorkers-flee.html?__source=sharebar|twitter&par=sharebar

  241. Bystander says:

    Exactly, Ed. That is it but WFH is not full bloom. Seedling is sprouting. Implications are too complex but I had call with group IT head who said they are looking at complete WFH strategy for many people.

  242. 3b says:

    Fast: Some are already doing that. Zuckerberg said in a recent interview that he believes there are talented people all over the country who have no desire to live in NYC or SF, and FB would like to reach them.

    Also with real estate savings that could have a positive effect overall on salaries, and I would guess some sort of geographic metric might be used, based on where an employee lives, this in turn may force cost of living declines in the NYC metro area. Lots to determine but I am sure the big companies are already looking at it.

  243. homeboken says:

    Who here believes that we will see 3, in person, traditional POTUS debates?

    Traditional meaning, Trump and Biden,not in person. No audience probably.

    Curious who thinks that we will see all 3 debates as established by the Commission for Presidential Debates?

  244. homeboken says:

    Not in person should be “In person”

    Not any sort of virtual debate

  245. 3b says:

    No One: That is my problem with those who proudly identify as leftists. They won’t condemn repressive brutal regime like the Chinese Communist government.

    In the 80 s the left was all about how we need to engage with the Soviet Union. A brutal dictatorship. Today Soviet Union gone, but Russia is a right wing dictatorship, and the left has been screaming about this brutal dictatorship, and how they tried to influence our election. Meanwhile the Chinese Communist government, has put up to one million Uighurs in concentration camps, and are settling thousands of ethnic Hans in their province to dilute the native population. And Hong Kong has been effectively muzzled and fully incorporated into the country and their rights eliminated. Not a peep from the proud leftists in the USA. Total hypocrisy.

  246. AP says:

    No One, that’s a very cartoonist view of history. There’s lots of efforts to “promote democracy” abroad. Some more successful than others.

    There’s plenty of denounciation of human rights violations from the left as well, including of those regimes you discussed. Your argument has no basis in facts just political ax-grinding mixed with personal animus, it appears.

  247. AP says:

    3b, factually wrong. There are tons of positive coverage of the protests in Hong Kong all across the media. There are plenty of condemnation and concern with the Uighurs.

    Question is what specific policies and diplomatic approaches resolve problems. Working to get a Golf championship moved to your property for example, is not very effective, I would argue.

  248. ExEssex says:

    Yeah seriously the right can suck a huge dick. See you in November dickheads.

  249. No One says:

    Sanders honeymooned in the USSR, and DeBlasio honeymooned in Cuba.
    It is history, and they are cartoonish.
    I’ve seen a lot of facts over the years and the study of individual rights has been a particular interest of mine. I’m sad to see how modern intellectuals have changed the meaning of rights over the last several centuries, such that many promoters of “human rights” are demanding the negation of individual rights. This is why one now sees serial rights violators on the UN human rights commission, and why so many of the NGO human rights groups are pretty much useless on large matters. They too have some of their own peculiar political axes to grind.
    I try to keep my personal animus appropriately aligned with the facts.
    I don’t know who AP is. You teach AP history to intellectually unarmed children or something like that? Maybe you should stick to lecturing the uninformed.

  250. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Wtf? People were forced to WFH. This was full bloom and it highlighted why education and all corporate jobs can’t be WFH. You guys are too focused on the tech aspect, your bias is leading you to forgone conclusions. Of course the techies dreams of a world that is WFH based on their platform and an education system based on their platform. These nerds forget about the human aspect and what breeds creativity.

    Seriously, you want to spend your life working from home instead of mingling with people? The show “The Office” just shows you how much fun an office can be if you know how to laugh and have fun. They made a hit series out of it. You tell me you want to work for a company where you have never met your co-workers or boss in real life? How do you work efficiently with this person if you really don’t know them. Don’t know their quirks and what makes them go.

    I don’t know. Maybe people want to be isolated and miserable, highly doubt it though…

    Bystander says:
    July 23, 2020 at 11:44 am
    Exactly, Ed. That is it but WFH is not full bloom. Seedling is sprouting. Implications are too complex but I had call with group IT head who said they are looking at complete WFH strategy for many people.

  251. AP says:

    No One, I’m a Capitalist, bud. Like JJ, I eat what I kill.

    I share your concerns about individual rights though. Both are important.

  252. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Just look at Silicone Valley. You are telling that creativity would have happened in a WFH environment? No f’ing way. They were like a college frat house community. They lived off each other’s energy and competition.

  253. joyce says:

    I was wondering more about general law enforcement / civil unrest. Nothing about investigating federal crimes (drugs, federal property, etc.). I am unsure if there’s protocol and if there is, if it’s a legal requirement or just tradition.

    Juice Box says:
    July 23, 2020 at 11:19 am
    Joyce – The DOJ, FBI, DEA and ATF has been busy in Chicago for decades. Didn’t Bobby Kennedy start the war on gangs and organzied crime back in 1960? Trump has surged support from the City of Chicago since the day he took office. What is your question exactly about “ask” for help? If the elected officials don’t “ask” for help then the Feds should pull all federal officers out of a city? Please explain. I am pretty sure a citizen do I have the right to petition my government for assistance if the elected officials don’t.

  254. ExEssex says:

    12:25 “silicon” – That part of the culture can/should die.
    Rich tech weasels outdoing each other. No the new push for WFH will
    Push each and every player to develop better collaborative software and better pipes
    To and From the house for super-broadband for consumers.

  255. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Oh that’s why he is leasing new space in nyc.

    Also, if you think a one time savings from real estate is going to workers…you need to wake the f up. This is a one time savings move. It’s not saving you more and more each year.

    3b says:
    July 23, 2020 at 11:46 am
    Fast: Some are already doing that. Zuckerberg said in a recent interview that he believes there are talented people all over the country who have no desire to live in NYC or SF, and FB would like to reach them.

    Also with real estate savings that could have a positive effect overall on salaries, and I would guess some sort of geographic metric might be used, based on where an employee lives, this in turn may force cost of living declines in the NYC metro area. Lots to determine but I am sure the big companies are already looking at it.

  256. 3b says:

    AP: No not factually wrong. I never said there was no coverage. I said there is no outrage among the left here in the USA. It’s either silence, or we need to engage in meaningful dialogue with the Chinese government. It should be unequivocally condemned by the left in this country and it’s not. That is factually correct.

  257. The Great Pumpkin says:

    And if it saving the companies money, it’s destroying the real estate market. So how is the working winning in this when their asset they just worked their life for is worthless?

  258. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Not “working” —“worker”

  259. ExEssex says:

    11:56 it’s the moderates you have to fear in November – get ready.
    Use of the leftest label only is useful for identifying you the user as a cunt.

  260. 3b says:

    Pumps it was in the same interview about the space in NYC. Reading comprehension child.

  261. SmallGovConservative says:

    AP says:
    July 23, 2020 at 12:02 pm

    “There’s plenty of denounciation of human rights violations from the left as well, including of those regimes you discussed. Your argument has no basis in facts…”

    Haha! That’s funny…

    https://nymag.com/intelligencer/2019/12/michael-bloomberg-china-pbs-climate-xi-dictator.html

    “Asked by Firing Line’s Margaret Hoover about how the U.S. can get China and India to be good partners in the fight against climate change, Bloomberg argued that the Chinese Communist Party was ecologically friendly, democratically accountable, and invulnerable to the threat of revolution.”

  262. 3b says:

    Ex Essex: you can be incredibly ignorant, and arrogant. I would imagine you don’t have too many friends. By the way cunt is an ignorant disgusting word.

  263. 3b says:

    Pumps Are you not a proud capitalist? That’s how a capitalist system works, some win some lose. Guaranteeing the price of your house is not a capitalist system.

  264. ExEssex says:

    12:39 I still have friends from 30 years ago and even a couple and really only a few from my stay in NJ. Jersey is full of douchebags so no not a lot of buddies in the Garden State.
    You can cunt on that.

  265. ExEssex says:

    Nothin rankles me more than a bunch of middle class drones cherry picking elitist bullshit and tossing around terms like leftist.

  266. Democratnomore says:

    WFH
    I have WFH for almost 15 years. It is great when raising children although small children still require childcare. You can’t actually work a full time job from home and take care of a toddler. It just doesn’t work. Once kids are in grade school, it is ideal as you can take a coffee break when they come home and you get to see how they are etc. But as they grow up it becomes isolating. It is not great on the mental health.
    Also, when the company started, it was all made up entirely of US employees. After a few years, they started an office overseas and now those folks make up ½ of the company and make ½ of what US folks make. The company I worked for was simply responding to the willingness( or lack of willingness) to pay by US clients so they started offices where they can pay people less. It was either do this or lose the business.
    Of course, WFH means that companies will see that they can go overseas and pay less. Not completely, but it will happen to some extent.

    On the topic of one generation selling another down the river…hmmm
    The state of nature is the war of each against all..
    People just work to maximize their own utility. As the old joke goes…they are liberal about everything that doesn’t affect them. Most people do not sit around thinking about how they can destroy others.. they are thinking about how to make the most money …how to give their kids a leg up. Because my father rose from abject poverty, he taught me to fight for myself and mine. There was money given to the church, but other than that, the money went for expenses and then under the mattress. I wasn’t raised to do community service….this idea would never have entered into my parents mind. When I raised the idea of going into the Peace Corp., my meek humble mother lost her sh!t. She said “Your father and I killed ourselves so you never had to suffer for anything, and now you tell me that you are going to take this college education that we gave you and go to some %$#&^% without running water. No, you are going to get a corporate job in an air conditioned office”
    Needless to say, that I did not go to the Peace Corp.

  267. Phoenix says:

    How is Jersey ever going to lower it’s taxes when it is so far in debt to the retirees you need a proctologist to get to the bottom of it?
    Home prices at all time high.

    The only things that would work is a massive drop in prices to overcome the amount you pay in taxes, or substantial increases in salaries in N.J.

    “I’m Stanley Johnson. I’m in debt up to my eyeballs. I can barely pay the interest charges. Somebody help me.”

  268. Phoenix says:

    “Also, when the company started, it was all made up entirely of US employees. After a few years, they started an office overseas and now those folks make up ½ of the company and make ½ of what US folks make. The company I worked for was simply responding to the willingness( or lack of willingness) to pay by US clients so they started offices where they can pay people less. It was either do this or lose the business.”

    America the great. Wave the flag. Be a patriot. Support your country. Outsource American jobs. This is about as fake as religion. Once again, George Carlin is right.

  269. Phoenix says:

    “The state of nature is the war of each against all..”

    Another patriotic statement. Why teach our kids to be part of a team and be patriots to our country instead of teaching them to be rabid capitalists? It is the goal to strive for, is it not? Then just donate a bit and look altruistic while getting a tax break.

  270. AP says:

    SmallGov,

    Why would you post an article that contradicts your own argument?

    “Bloomberg’s views here stand in stark contrast to those of Bernie Sanders. […] The self-avowed “social1st” has cast Xi’s China as the leader of an “international authoritarian axis,”

  271. AP says:

    ““The state of nature is the war of each against all..”

    That’s a common anthropological/evolutionary misconception. In fact collaboration and empathy played an even bigger role than it’s been recognized in the past.

  272. chicagofinance says:

    Typical response. I stated that you harbor enmity for this country. You twist that comment into “I hate you”, which I don’t. Then you proceed to position yourself as taking the moral high ground. Consistent with my allegation that you are an intellectually dishonest participant on these threads….. but you know this…..

    Fabius Maximus says:
    July 22, 2020 at 10:45 pm
    Chi,

    As I said to Eddie, I don’t hate you, that would require effort on my part that’s just not worth it. So go ahead and throw what you you like at me. Honestly I don’t care.

  273. ExEssex says:

    Anybody with any real talent isn’t going to work for Facebook.
    That ship has sailed.

  274. Fast Eddie says:

    How is Jersey ever going to lower it’s taxes when it is so far in debt to the retirees you need a proctologist to get to the bottom of it?

    Combine municipalities, cut administrative jobs, cut state programs that serve little purpose and outsource maintenance, inspection and service jobs to the private sector.

  275. chicagofinance says:

    Prima facie evidence of your weak argument……
    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SancMa00/gamelog/post/

    Fabius Maximus says:
    July 22, 2020 at 11:06 pm
    “Kapernick is not a good player ”
    Yea, 4-2 in the playoffs, that guy sucked?

  276. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    I remember when Rage Against the Machine had a Che Guevara on a B-Side album cover in 1992. I literally thought it was a picture of the lead singer, Zack de la Rocha. My father told me it was Che Guevara. His friend from Argentina that he met in medical school in Mexico knew him. His friend’s father went to med school with Guevara and were best friends while they were in med school before he was radicalized. Both rich kids from Latin America. He has one of his hats at his house. Apparently Guevara would still stop by to see him from time to time to take time off from murdering people.

  277. TruthIsTheEnemy says:

    Does everyone agree that we should be referring to Biden 2020 as the Orwell platform?

  278. Bystander says:

    Dem,

    Tools and techn coming will be nothing like WFH in past. Cameras will always be on with Zo*m blocks, ability to drag and manipulate screen data. Meeting storage, archive and access, and documentation will all change. Interaction will be tracked and part of your yearly review. Might even be on screen emoticon and ratings which feed into empl comp. Just remember millennial love this stuff, grew up with it. Gen Z won’t even know another life.

  279. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Do you understand that for the avg American, real estate is the only way they have money? I understand that you don’t own and are bias, but to sit there and cheer on the destruction of the biggest wealth builder in our nation is lame.

    Keep dreaming about major economic hubs like the nyc metro area falling under due to a concept like WFH. Dream on.

    3b says:
    July 23, 2020 at 12:41 pm
    Pumps Are you not a proud capitalist? That’s how a capitalist system works, some win some lose. Guaranteeing the price of your house is not a capitalist system.

  280. 3b says:

    Fast: I agree but people will fight it, especially in Bergen Co , too snooty.

  281. 3b says:

    Pumps: Ah but I do own, and I háve stated that to you many times. As for seeking the destruction blah , blah, I never said that. I said you can’t say you are a proud capitalist and then want guarantees your house price won’t decline.

  282. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Thank you for your honest opinion. When it comes out of my mouth, it’s not taken seriously for some reason.

    It’s also common sense that WFH should be outlawed. You highlight it, it’s creating an environment in which it is a race to the bottom. The employers pushing this should be honest, they want to have access to a global workforce that will work for pennies on the dollar. They are looking for easy profit on the back of pitting 1st world workers vs third world wage slavery. If this becomes the norm, goodbye to first world nations. They can’t survive in an environment where their working class is pitted against 3rd world nations. No way, no how.

    Beware the Trojan Horse…

    Democratnomore says:
    July 23, 2020 at 1:03 pm
    WFH

  283. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Then why are you always raging against your asset appreciation. Stop lying.

    3b says:
    July 23, 2020 at 2:08 pm
    Pumps: Ah but I do own, and I háve stated that to you many times. As for seeking the destruction blah , blah, I never said that. I said you can’t say you are a proud capitalist and then want guarantees your house price won’t decline.

  284. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Oh great, my employer is putting surveillance in my house and I get to pay the cost of running it. That’s a very very scary place you describe below. Hope the young generation is smart enough to see the danger.

    Bystander says:
    July 23, 2020 at 1:57 pm
    Dem,

    Tools and techn coming will be nothing like WFH in past. Cameras will always be on with Zo*m blocks, ability to drag and manipulate screen data. Meeting storage, archive and access, and documentation will all change. Interaction will be tracked and part of your yearly review. Might even be on screen emoticon and ratings which feed into empl comp. Just remember millennial love this stuff, grew up with it. Gen Z won’t even know another life.

  285. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I play fantasy football competitively. Kaep had one good run, and then the nfl defenses figured him out. He can’t accept that he was no longer a starting nfl qb and started acting like a baby. Dude was raised by two white individuals and had to go with the race card when things didn’t go his way. Have no respect for him…

    chicagofinance says:
    July 23, 2020 at 1:45 pm
    Prima facie evidence of your weak argument……
    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SancMa00/gamelog/post/

    Fabius Maximus says:
    July 22, 2020 at 11:06 pm
    “Kapernick is not a good player ”
    Yea, 4-2 in the playoffs, that guy sucked?

  286. 3b says:

    It’s not taken seriously, because you don’t work in the corporate world, and have no basis to comment on whether it is good, bad, or indifferent. And secondly you don’t care about a race to the bottom or if American corporate employees will be negatively impacted. You don’t like or want WFH because you are concerned it will negatively impact the value of your house. At least be honest.

  287. The Great Pumpkin says:

    “WASH­ING­TON—Sec­re­tary of State Mike Pom­peo is call­ing on the Chi­nese peo­ple to al­ter the rul­ing Com­mu­nist Par­ty’s di­rec­tion in a speech ex­plain­ing the Trump ad­min­is­tra­tion’s full-throt­tled re­sponse to an as­sertive China.”

    “Mr. Pom­peo, in an in­ter­view ahead of the speech, said any pos­si­ble re­tal­i­a­tion to the Hous­ton con-sulate clo­sure would be up to Bei­jing. He por­trayed the U.S. step as nec­es­sary for na­tional se­cu­rity and to pre­vent the theft of in­tel­lec­tual prop­erty from sen­si­tive en­ergy and health-care busi­nesses in the Hous­ton area.

    “We are now decades into Amer­ica not re­spond­ing to Chi­nese ag­gres­sion,” he said, de­scrib­ing U.S. pol­icy as an ef­fort to restore bal­ance to a re­la­tion­ship the ad­min­is­tra­tion sees as un­fairly tilted to­ward Bei­jing.”

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/secretary-of-state-pompeo-to-urge-chinese-people-to-change-the-communist-party-11595517729?st=g18gs114hxwoocv&reflink=article_copyURL_share

  288. Phoenix says:

    ” By the way cunt is an ignorant disgusting word.”
    Guess he could use the word “Karen” instead.
    There are some similarities.

  289. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    In boxing news, 20 years too late, Mike Tyson is planning on fighting Roy Jones Jr. in an 8 round exhibition.

  290. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    NJ Pandemic Response whistleblower is claiming that quest labs processing delays are leading to misleading data.

    NJ Pandemic Warriors
    @NjPandemic

    LOL, @Quest
    lab delays have artificially deflated NJ cases for weeks now. Time to erase the @GovMurphy’s claims that NJ had one of the lowest case increases. It was actually on par with many states, despite “bold moves” like the outdoor masking requirement. Political theater.

  291. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Something happened in your life that you want north jersey real estate to fail. I don’t know what happened or why, but it made you hate the people who made money off of real estate.

    You can think what you want, but my reasons for not believing in and supporting WFH have been stated.

    3b says:
    July 23, 2020 at 2:28 pm
    It’s not taken seriously, because you don’t work in the corporate world, and have no basis to comment on whether it is good, bad, or indifferent. And secondly you don’t care about a race to the bottom or if American corporate employees will be negatively impacted. You don’t like or want WFH because you are concerned it will negatively impact the value of your house. At least be honest.

  292. Nomad says:

    WFH, will a majority of these jobs eventually turn into contracted positions vs FTEs? That eliminates the tax issues pretty quickly. Salaries further driven down not only by hiring in lower cost areas, but backing out commuting costs and every other cost incurred when traveling to and from an office each day. All someone needs is a few wrinkle free tops and sweatpants.

  293. PuMpKIn lOgIC says:

    If I recall correctly, the Pumpkin’s better half works for a company that leases NYC office/commercial space. This may explain his obsessive fear of WFH.

    The Great Pumpkin says:
    July 23, 2020 at 2:02 pm
    Do you understand that for the avg American, real estate is the only way they have money? I understand that you don’t own and are bias, but to sit there and cheer on the destruction of the biggest wealth builder in our nation is lame.

    Keep dreaming about major economic hubs like the nyc metro area falling under due to a concept like WFH. Dream on.

  294. Phoenix says:

    “Combine municipalities, cut administrative jobs, cut state programs that serve little purpose and outsource maintenance, inspection and service jobs to the private sector.”

    Eliminate the unions…

  295. JCer says:

    Pumps I agree it’s craziness I won’t zoom in my house with work, I’m not letting coworkers into my house. Permanent WFH isn’t going to happen, at some point people need to speak in person, no amount of technology overcomes the need for interpersonal relationships between those working. I do think companies will get more open to the idea of flexibility and reducing office footprints.

    My bosses in the past were always shocked that I could cut red tape in ways that most others could not, it was because I developed personal relationships with people working in the different areas and if I really needed it I could walk over to someone, or go to lunch with them and get them to expedite my request because I knew them could ask them how their kids were doing, shoot the sh*t, etc. The person requesting over email or phone who they didn’t know, forget about it you are in the queue we will get to your request as quick as we can first come first serve if you need it faster escalate with management. It’s much harder to say no face to face and it’s much easier to avoid you if the person is WFH.

    Knowing your people is a big part to building an effective team, I’ve done it remote it is tough. I used to manage a dev team in Denver, it was always good for us to go out there, it allowed us to foster a better relationship than over the phone or video conference allows. Meetings are too impersonal and planned one on ones over video are not conducive to building these kinds of relationships. We don’t need to see people every day but there still will be offices and people will still go in.

  296. Dictators Galore says:

    About Pinochet. He’s human rights abuses were well known like any dictator. Latin America and fascism got to together like Pastrami and Rye.

    However, what escalated his reputation powered by a Saturn V Rocket into hell was the revelations that came out after the Boston Globe Catholic Church priest scandals.

    It seemed that one of Pinochet’s thing was to kill off both parents. If kids were usually less than 3 or so, they were given to “nice catholic” families. Anything older, that had attachment issues or any other issue were sent to orphanages. These orphanages were local centers for well connected religious and political people to get their jollies off with the kids.

    In short, Chile just like Ireland probably does not have a 10 year old orphanage boy from that time frame that was not molested.

    That is the difference of Pinochet vs other dictators. He’s in the pantheon of the likes of Japanese troops who used comfort women.

  297. Democratnomore says:

    I don’t live in a 12th century village…..so I will stick with Hobbes view of the state of nature.
    All I can say is that I inherited a worldview from my dad….who was taken out of school in the 6th grade. A man who no one helped and still managed to carve out a life that included sending me to college.
    I will say that my company did keep it’s US people and has hired more US people. But it needed to expand overseas to be a competitive option.
    Sometimes even existing clients want to expand the service they buy from us but demand lower cost per head so the company is forced to hire non-US people to expand.

  298. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Those costs are people’s jobs. You take a naive view of it.

    Just tell me, how can the economy survive with dramatic cuts in costs? Those are jobs tied to traveling. Mechanics. Car washes. Restaurants. Construction. You get the point..

    Tax issue? So who is going to pay taxes?

    Nomad says:
    July 23, 2020 at 2:34 pm
    WFH, will a majority of these jobs eventually turn into contracted positions vs FTEs? That eliminates the tax issues pretty quickly. Salaries further driven down not only by hiring in lower cost areas, but backing out commuting costs and every other cost incurred when traveling to and from an office each day. All someone needs is a few wrinkle free tops and sweatpants.

  299. Juice Box says:

    Pumps – What kind of history do you teach anyway? It it some kind of early Sumerian History or something like that? It surely isn’t American History.

    Silicon Valley is famous for tech that started out as WFH. William Hewlett and David Packard began developing their first product, an audio oscillator, in a garage. Steve Wozniak and Steve Jobs worked out of a Los Altos garage. Google, and Amazon were also founded in suburban homes as well.

    Tech they all contributed too now allows us to work remotely. You may hate it but that is the reality we live in now. I drove by the train station at 8:45 AM this morning, still only about 2 dozen cars parked when it used to be several hundred.

    NYC MTA subway ridership data still way way down, by 4 million rides a day. Where did all of those strap-hangers go? It isn’t too an office building that is for sure.

    Tuesday, 7/21/20 1,230,999 -77.6%

    Monday, 7/20/20 1,154,391 -79.0%

  300. The Great Pumpkin says:

    It really is. Just like the tech world took advantage of building free data through Facebook and other apps, the public never saw it coming till it was too late.

    JCer says:
    July 23, 2020 at 3:00 pm
    Pumps I agree it’s craziness

  301. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Oh right, so WFH I’m going to be hosting a bunch co-workers at my house everyday, right? This was their office because they couldn’t afford anything else. And that’s my point, why Silicon Valley was so effective. It was basically like frat houses in a college town. All these smart people socializing and growing together to form a powerhouse creative hub.

    Are you telling me Apple’s sick new campus is worthless? Everyone, go home and work. Sure..

    Give it up, guys. Majority of the population will not be working from home because it makes that business uncompetitive.

    “Silicon Valley is famous for tech that started out as WFH. William Hewlett and David Packard began developing their first product, an audio oscillator, in a garage. Steve Wozniak and Steve Jobs worked out of a Los Altos garage. Google, and Amazon were also founded in suburban homes as well.”

  302. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Lmao…yes!!! Keep the comedy coming!

    My goal is to figure out why 3b and a few others hate north jersey so much. There has to be a reason…

    PuMpKIn lOgIC says:
    July 23, 2020 at 2:45 pm
    If I recall correctly, the Pumpkin’s better half works for a company that leases NYC office/commercial space. This may explain his obsessive fear of WFH.

  303. chicagofinance says:

    Didn’t have time for a write-up but I agree. He was a better Tim Tebow. You can’t teach accuracy and also how to read defenses. He is not very bright, and he was only good with a good running game and the pistol. Even LaMarr Jackson is on watch in my book. Is he a playoff choker, or is it that any good defense with time to prepare can shut down a quarterback who can’t throw and can’t read defenses.

    The Great Pumpkin says:
    July 23, 2020 at 2:25 pm
    I play fantasy football competitively. Kaep had one good run, and then the nfl defenses figured him out. He can’t accept that he was no longer a starting nfl qb and started acting like a baby. Dude was raised by two white individuals and had to go with the race card when things didn’t go his way. Have no respect for him…

    chicagofinance says:
    July 23, 2020 at 1:45 pm
    Prima facie evidence of your weak argument……
    https://www.pro-football-reference.com/players/S/SancMa00/gamelog/post/

    Fabius Maximus says:
    July 22, 2020 at 11:06 pm
    “Kapernick is not a good player ”
    Yea, 4-2 in the playoffs, that guy sucked?

  304. Nomad says:

    Pumpkin,

    The tax issue is once someone works from home vs office, how are they taxed? Living in NJ, CT or other and no longer going into the city. No office there. Give it a bit of time, the outflow of people from NJ will escalate. Auto plants need to run flat out to cover big overhead. Its the last few cars off the line that represent the profit. NJ is a big factory with lots of overhead, take away a few % of the population along with the bids on the real estate they own and the downward pressure intensifies and all that fixed overhead and pensions is spread over a smaller base of people. Bark all you want, once people WFH and the metrics get measured, the east coast bravado won’t mean squat because the productivity #s will tell the tale of the tape. PS, don’t shoot the messenger.

    A CEO of a public company has one job, maximize shareholder wealth. The financial viability of a car wash is not their concern unless of course, the CEO runs a car wash company or entity that provides goods and services to the car wash.

    I remember the first time I worked for a large company. I was amazed at how many people did nothing. I told my father (small business owner) they could easily fire 1/3 of the people and not miss a beat and he told me welcome to corporate America. Some at big companies do have a lot of drive but that is not the majority. Even today in a leaned out world, there is fat to be cut. There just are not that many that can plant their backsides at their desk at 7 am and grind for 12+ hours. I knew a successful entrepreneur who said he only worked half days, M-Sat 7-7.

    Gundlach is right, blood bath coming. Early days of COVID, corp America was all nice warm and fuzzy. Now that 10Qs are about to show up, demeanor is going to change.

    https://finance.yahoo.com/news/jeffrey-gundlach-sees-unemployment-wave-hitting-white-collar-jobs-224443437.html

  305. AP says:

    Democratnomore, I liked your comment about your dad’s work ethic and the peace corp plan.

    David Brooks has a recently book about his concept of a “second hill”. The idea is that in your forties/fifties you have claimed the “first hill” in life: establishing a career, having kids, etc, whatever that means to you, then you still climb a “second hill” which is your own individual dreams.

    Maybe it’s too late to join the Peace Corp but there’s other ways to honor that impulse as an adult in a sensible way.

  306. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Nomad,

    You didn’t understand my point about the impact on the economy. Let me try a different way.

    Do you think sending jobs overseas has had a positive effect? I don’t. The anger we are seeing in the streets is a product of that. Bunch angry 20 somethings mad that they don’t have access to good jobs.

    WFH=shipping of American jobs. Do you understand that they no longer have to be physically located in America. So listen to Ross Perot. You want to hear a giant sucking sound of American jobs, then allow companies to be run from home. Will end well.

  307. AP says:

    “In The Second Mountain, David Brooks explores the four commitments that define a life of meaning and purpose: to a spouse and family, to a vocation, to a philosophy or faith, and to a community.”

    https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/217649/the-second-mountain-by-david-brooks/

  308. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Also, how many jobs would be lost if we eliminated offices and destroyed cities. Do we really want to destroy this? Just doesn’t make much sense to me. It will end badly.

  309. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Milton’s philosophy is dead. It has evolved to understand that there are other costs and ramifications that should go into decisions. Hopefully we don’t go back to the other way of thinking.

    “A CEO of a public company has one job, maximize shareholder wealth.”

  310. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Chi,

    Nailed it with his play…

    I’m with you with Jackson. I would never pay the price for his cost in fantasy when his play has to regress to the mean.

  311. JCer says:

    Here’s the deal NYC and it’s surrounding areas have been in trouble for a while. It’s the cost and the taxes, it’s an expensive place to do business. What has kept NYC relevant is the talent, it is a good market for certain kinds of talent. If you need bankers or people with finance industry experience the people are in NYC, it is hard to hire elsewhere. Even for tech workers they don’t tend to want to live in the middle of nowhere hence the concentration in SF, Seattle, NYC.

    WFH would totally be used for wage arbitrage and to hold down salaries in high cost of living locales. There are certain people who are extremely effective working from home, these are the types of people who work alone and might have some social phobias, aspergers, etc. This is especially true in tech there are some folks who can just go off and disappear and produce something, these people are rare. Guys like Bill Joy who basically wrote the original TCP/IP code after the company hired to do it couldn’t get it to work he disappeared for a few weeks and wrote the first working version as a grad student by himself. But this is not normal, I’ve met a few people like this in my career and even in the office these people are cubicle hermits, they truly don’t like to interact with people and are smart enough they can get a lot done without doing so.

    Dictatorsgalore, among these monsters we can not even fathom what they did or would allow to be done, there are very few who ruled with absolute power who did not commit absolutely atrocious acts. The depravity of man knows no bounds, truly sick. Only one really comes to mind is Salazar in Portugal, he was a dictator for sure but it does not seem he was as evil as some of the others and there is a good argument to be made that he saved the country from anarchy, a democracy would not have survived in Portugal.

  312. Nomad says:

    Pumpkin,

    I agree, WFH long term creates loss of what are currently high paying jobs in this country. But, if you have a single breadwinner making a decent buck, a couple of young mouths to feed, what are they going to do? They have no choice, they will take the WFH job at lower pay. I listened to Perot’s speech live at the Detroit Economic Club in 86, I am from steel country, I get it. You really want to right this ship, get rid of Citizens United, Super Pacs, Pacs, Dark Money, Lobbyists etc. Until this happens, all the political back and fourth is just bad theatre that a majority of Americans are swayed by. For the most part, until now, its been the working class who got screwed by offshoring. White Collar folk aren’t as tough, the cut much easier. Lets see how they do.

    PS – make sure when you can you buy products made in America. PPS – there was a time that if you parked a foreign car in the parking lot of an American steel mill it would be destroyed in short order. PPPS – Wilbur Ross made his money piecing together several bankrupt steel mills into LTV. People with 30+ years at those mills whose bodies had the tar beaten out of them by the work only to see their pensions and healthcare evaporate. Not only screwed the workers, not one penny paid in environmental clean up which he was legally obligated to do.

    If nothing changes, nothing changes. So far, nothing has changed.

  313. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Jcer,

    That’s why high cost areas don’t go down in price. The most talented individuals in the economy are attracted to places like NYC. They like the energy, they like the fast pace of life. And let’s be serious, the most expensive locations are the best real estate in the country. Something about the location, maybe the view, maybe the demographics, whatever it is, it attracts successful people with lots of money.

    I love NYC. I love miami. I love sf. I love Boston. Would love to live in each of these cities when I retire. Do a year lease in each spot. Will sell, and go enjoy the city life in my retirement with my wife. Just have to keep hustling to make it happen, it will be expensive…esp the restaurants on a daily basis.

  314. grim says:

    Here’s the deal NYC and it’s surrounding areas have been in trouble for a while. It’s the cost and the taxes, it’s an expensive place to do business. What has kept NYC relevant is the talent, it is a good market for certain kinds of talent. If you need bankers or people with finance industry experience the people are in NYC, it is hard to hire elsewhere. Even for tech workers they don’t tend to want to live in the middle of nowhere hence the concentration in SF, Seattle, NYC.

    A bit of a misnomer I think, to give so much weight to people who work in cubicles in NYC.

    Go drive around some industrial back road in Edison, or Harrison, etc. All of those industrial buildings, they are a huge part of the local economy. A big part of the wealth generation is tied to these small and mid-sized businesses, the ones you never heard of, and never will. These businesses are tied to this area, they’ll probably never leave.

    Was in a machine shop in Paterson a few months ago. They build equipment that goes into pharmaceutical pilot plants. Everything is made from scratch with impeccable precision, everything is one-off, everything is custom. It’s 5 or 6 old Polish guys, in a shop you wouldn’t ever even take a second look at if you passed, and they do millions of dollars of business a year.

    Move? Why? Pretty sure if I walked in there today, they’d all be working their asses off to be making the equipment to build vaccine plants.

    Typical Goldman Sachs idiot would look at those guys and think, bunch of wetback poor immigrants with dirty fingernails. Meanwhile, those guys bought houses for their kids, their grandkids, paid everyone’s college, have everyone set for life, and still show up to work at 72 year old. The prospect of moving to North Carolina has never once in their lifetimes even crossed their mind as a possibility. Why would it?

  315. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Nomad,

    Glad we can get on the same page.

    We took the lead in the world. Bunch of losers want to give it back to make a quick buck. Someone needs to slap them for creating jobs in other countries at our expense. Can’t make this sh!t up.

    That’s what people should be protesting in the streets. Close up shop. Keep the resources at home. Build up our quality of life on a domestic system. We have the resources to do it. We don’t, because a bunch of companies keep trying to win on the strategy of beating the competition with cheaper labor.

  316. AP says:

    Wow, JCer, Salazar? Really? Complete garbage and it stinks to high heavens!

    Political prison camps, suppression of democratic opposition, secret police, censorship? Anything to defend there? Wow.

  317. Bystander says:

    No one wants to destroy anything..they just want to pay the least amount legally allowed..or not legal. Just like everyone wants to hire American except when paying for their landscaping work farm work, or home improvements or nanny care. It was just me…surely everyone else hired American..those cheap bastards!

  318. Bystander says:

    Che Guevara Lynch..traces his lineage to back to Galway, Ireland and a long line of Irish rebels. Wait, we liked those guys in Ireland?!

  319. JCer says:

    AP, please dispense with your 21st century american view point. 1920’s Portugal was a very different place, a repressive government but what was the alternative? There was no genocide and abuses were against those deemed to be enemies of the state, remember it was a dictatorship so that is kind of part and parcel of being a dictatorship. The country was stable and there was fairly objective rule of law, the regime lasted longer than necessary.

    Grim point taken there is a large network of small and mid-sized businesses that generate a lot of revenue. What does a stifling regulatory and taxation climate in the greater NYC region do to these businesses. These businesses are here for 2 things access to the local market(which is huge, there is a big concentration of population much of whom have disposable income, many companies have a big footprint in the region), access to local talent(there is a big pool of people it is easier to find the skill you are looking for in this market rather than a smaller one), and regional significance, this area is the center of the eastern seaboard not only massive in it’s own right but smack dab in the middle of huge strategically important markets. NJ and CT both benefit from a lot of this and in years past a better tax climate allowed this to foster. When the drug co’s pick up stakes and leave NJ what doe these small businesses do who support them do? Maybe they stay and continue to maintain the same business relationship or maybe they pick up and move. The money those WS idiots bring into the region is big and it has an effect on a lot of businesses(they are idiots none of them could run a real business….just saying). NJ has a huge strategic advantage because of location but you cannot overplay that hand, the government is a liability for sure.

  320. Phoenix says:

    Ahh, the damn drug companies, with the love and support of our government, charge Americans 2000x what they charge other countries for the same medicine.

    Bet they love the flag in front of corporate headquarters….

  321. AP says:

    JCer, listen, these principles aren’t new to the 21st century. Also we are having this discussion in the 21st century, so you have a chance now to not equivocate about a regime anyone with a right mind wouldn’t want their worst enemy to live under.

    It’s incredible that anyone would have to even say the words I’m saying, but here we are.

    Where are we going next in this convo “Mussolini made the trains running time”?

  322. Vornado says:

    Wow, it took all got dam day for the Idiot to realize people in here are not supporting or cheerleading something, just saying they think it will happen because that’s what TPTB will do to save money and enrich themselves.

    -Not an Idiot

  323. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Hater,

    I helped contribute to some engaging topics today. I enjoyed the back and forth debates. Now…go cry to your mommy (Arnold voice)

  324. 3b says:

    Bystander: Yes we do like those guys, big difference between Che and the Irish War of Independence. My two Grand Uncles were in the IRA at the time, one was in the British Army, prior to his service in the war of independence. They took opposite sides in the civil war, but remained close. The one on the losing side left like many others and came to NYC. The other one who accepted the treaty a few years later when the new Irish government signed away the north of Ireland to the British.

  325. Fabius Maximus says:

    Chi,

    If you are reaching for bad Jets QBs, you are sort of making my point. In 2016 coming off injury and starting 11 games on a crap team, he still cranked out better numbers that Ryan Fitzpatrick. Was he top 10, no, but he was top 30. In fantasy he was better. A 4:1 TD to INT ratio. Lots of rushing yards and TDs.

    But now you have Fitzpatrick starting for Miami and even Geno Smith warming a bench at Seattle and Kap cant even get an interview?

  326. 3b says:

    Grim Whether we like it or not, those cubicle dwellers will impact what happens in the NYC area. My Father was an immigrant and worked his whole life, but that generation is just about gone.

  327. Vornado says:

    Idiot,
    Stop lying and people will give you less of a hard time.

  328. 3b says:

    Vornado WFH is here to stay whether people like it or not, and it will have an impact on the NYC area, including house prices. I don’t expect and never said it would be 100 percent. NYC and it’s environs has priced itself into oblivion.

  329. Fabius Maximus says:

    So here is Freedom of the press under assault,

    Department of Justice arguing that reporters don’t have a right to document the nightly, violent federal crowd clearing in Portland:
    https://twitter.com/7im/status/1286363314721705984

  330. Phoenix says:

    FM,
    Yup. Gotta love those lawyers…

  331. The Great Pumpkin says:

    3b,

    Have you seen real estate prices in places like Canada or Australia? How bout some of Asia’s largest cities. I know it’s hard to believe, but these aren’t outrageous prices. You might hate NYC because you take it for granted, but for a lot of people, that’s the coolest place on earth.

  332. Fabius Maximus says:

    Guess you lost another sport Gary!

    Every player and coach on the Yankees & Nationals took a knee before the national anthem tonight in D.C.
    https://twitter.com/HoarseWisperer/status/1286443886857117700

  333. AP says:

    Fab, that was actually an interesting move because they took a knee _before_ the anthem, as less of a protest and more of a show of support. Not sure it matters to those who are offended, but interesting move.

  334. joyce says:

    “he saved the country from anarchy, a democracy would not have survived in Portugal.”

    Anarchy might be preferable to a dictatorship.

  335. AP says:

    Joyce, keep in mind that that was a completely bogus argument to begin with. Portugal one hundred percent could and would have survived as a Democracy if it wasn’t for the concentrated, brutal efforts of those who think that dominating others, like cattle, is doing them a favor.

  336. JCer says:

    AP my point is you are viewing historical events from a very comfortable position in the United States during the 21st century. At the time Salazar came to power most normal people were looking for someone to prevent a fall to communism. If given the choice between Franco’s Spain(which was way worse than Salazar’s Portugal) and Stalin’s Soviet Union, I’d choose Franco’s Spain everyday of the week. That was the reality of that time and that place, real democracy was not an option. Let us not forget what triggered the Spanish Civil War, escalating political street violence ending with the leftists murdering the parliament opposition leader. Democracy fails to work when the side that is power, uses that power to subvert the will of the people. In the scheme of things as dictators go Mussolini was far from the worst, he enjoyed a lot of popular support for a time, the trains being on time was a minor accomplishment, his biggest accomplishment was bringing the Mafia to heel, he was the only person in the history of modern Italy(post Garribaldi) to do so. A good many Historians agree on Salazar, he saved Portugal, the republic was a mess and there were widely granted civil liberties under his rule. The only people who had to fear the secret police or the government were communists and their sympathizers. Salazar actually aided the US effort in WWII and aided Jews in escaping the holocaust. I would not put him in the same category as the other dictators you have touched on, if you weren’t a political enemy there was rule of law, separation of church and state and stability there were plenty of democracies at the time that were far worse places to live.

  337. joyce says:

    I’m not commenting on Portugal or anything else other than Anarchy might be better than Dictatorship. I was taught Anarchy means absence of recognized authority or government… most definitions also include “disorder” or “unrest”. Not trying to be pedantic.

    AP says:
    July 23, 2020 at 8:02 pm
    Joyce, keep in mind that that was a completely bogus argument to begin with. Portugal one hundred percent could and would have survived as a Democracy if it wasn’t for the concentrated, brutal efforts of those who think that dominating others, like cattle, is doing them a favor.

  338. 3b says:

    AP: I will do some research on the Salazar dictatorship, but it’s long gone, along with Franco, and, Pinochet. Cuban left wing dictatorship still going, along with China, and North Korea.

  339. Jcer says:

    Joyce and AP that is so totally false without western support Portugal would have been a Soviet satellite, they were supporting the agitators.

    Look at the Stalin death count and then what Salazar did, reformed the economy, balanced the budget cut waste, restored rule of law brought literacy from 25% to nearly 100%, sustained economic growth at 6% annually. There is a reason he is still held in high regard by a large percentage of Portuguese people. In the 20’s, 30’s, 40’s and into the 50’s he was legitimately ruling with a popular mandate. It was not until the 1950’s that election fraud became common.

  340. AP says:

    There was no inherent inability in Portuguese culture/situation that prevented a Democracy from surviving, the regime “saved” nothing, but was fundamentally, philosophically opposed to Democracy as a matter of principle. The entire goal of the Salazar regime was to prevent an American or British style system to take hold in Portugal.

    They believed they knew better and could tell their citizens exactly how to think, act, and speak. It was an incredible, and incredibly twisted social experiment.

    Your views on Mussolini are just absurd to me. Hard to fathom how anyone can find, let alone advocate for, any positives in that thrash fire.

  341. joyce says:

    So the lesser of two evils?

  342. AP says:

    Besides that, JCer, your view contains so many factual inaccuracies. It’s borderline embarrassing.

    You say something like “only leftists had to fear”, and that is patently false. Anyone was at risk, just for defending democratic principles.

    You have a point that there is tons of nostalgia for the regime in some quarters. That is precisely the problem, and in my view shouldn’t be something we accept in the USA, where we know the value of Freedom.

  343. joyce says:

    Would be nice if the govt/media regularly reported Active cases rather than Total.

  344. joyce says:

    “…where we know the value of Freedom.”

    I disagree wholeheartedly. We pay lip service to it, nothing more.

  345. joyce says:

    ” “We don’t condone illegal behavior, so I’m not wild about 15 years (old), or whatever, drinking alcohol, on the one hand, okay, so please don’t break the law. Period. But on the other hand, this isn’t a witch hunt,” Murphy said at an unrelated news conference in Long Branch. “This is a public health pursuit that the contact tracing corps is after.”

    https://www.nj.com/coronavirus/2020/07/contact-tracers-hitting-brick-wall-after-20-teens-get-coronavirus-at-nj-party-over-underage-drinking-fears-murphy-says.html

    Kids don’t get enough credit these days. Unless they offer you immunity, keep your mouth shut. And even then…

  346. leftwing says:

    “…he still cranked out better numbers that Ryan Fitzpatrick…But now you have Fitzpatrick starting for Miami and even Geno Smith warming a bench at Seattle and Kap cant even get an interview?”

    Again, it’s very simple. Has absolutely ZERO to do with the numbers. He’s an overall liability, any Coach, GM, and Owner takes a pass based on that….

    If you don’t ‘get it’ I don’t know what to say….other than I hope you’re not one of the guys howling on the sideline at your daughter’s travel lax games because, yeah, she’ll be passed over for a scholarship because of you too.

    Off field matters. Especially the higher up you go.

  347. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Wow, 354 posts. The worse the economy gets, the better this place becomes. (Top Gun theme song playing in the background).

  348. leftwing says:

    First round pick. Outstanding stats. $20m a year. Couldn’t dish him quickly enough.

    Issues not worth the stats…..

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRnVJC5Z6OU

  349. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Just admit it’s a f’ing powerhouse of an economy the world has never seen. It’s pretty crazy. You want to make money, you come here. There is a reason so many immigrants continue to pin point this location. The opportunities are glorious. People are blind..

    “Grim point taken there is a large network of small and mid-sized businesses that generate a lot of revenue. What does a stifling regulatory and taxation climate in the greater NYC region do to these businesses. These businesses are here for 2 things access to the local market(which is huge, there is a big concentration of population much of whom have disposable income, many companies have a big footprint in the region), access to local talent(there is a big pool of people it is easier to find the skill you are looking for in this market rather than a smaller one), and regional significance, this area is the center of the eastern seaboard not only massive in it’s own right but smack dab in the middle of huge strategically important markets. NJ and CT both benefit from a lot of this and in years past a better tax climate allowed this to foster. When the drug co’s pick up stakes and leave NJ what doe these small businesses do who support them do? Maybe they stay and continue to maintain the same business relationship or maybe they pick up and move. The money those WS idiots bring into the region is big and it has an effect on a lot of businesses(they are idiots none of them could run a real business….just saying). NJ has a huge strategic advantage because of location but you cannot overplay that hand, the government is a liability for sure.”

  350. The Great Pumpkin says:

    People risk it all to get a piece of the New York economic pie. Leave their countries for this exact location, now why?

    So as much as you hate this place and take it for granted, admit it’s special. God bless you if you were born into Kansas as opposed to Brooklyn or Clifton.

  351. Phoenix says:

    “Kids don’t get enough credit these days. Unless they offer you immunity, keep your mouth shut. And even then..

    Some are getting much smarter-just like they need to.
    And most don’t trust the police and with good reason.

  352. JCer says:

    Joyce, in anarchy people starve and the relative norms of life cease to exist. The average person cares way more about living their life, putting food on the table than anything else. The problem with dictators is they are permanent, it becomes hard to get rid of them, post WWII Salazar was probably not needed anymore but held onto power as I see it mostly due to fear of communism.

    Franco was bad but not even close to Pinochet with regards to depraved terror. Post civil war there were far fewer people disappeared, etc. Franco isn’t even in the same league of evilness as Mao, Stalin, Hitler, etc.

  353. leftwing says:

    “Some are getting much smarter-just like they need to.
    And most don’t trust the police and with good reason.”

    Always a source of minor aggravation when black parents complained they had to have “the talk” with their kids…..

    WTF do you think I do? I’ve had several talks….around at least four serious interactions they could have with authorities/police from ages 14-21….

    Very pointed in the latter case….

    “The talk” is your responsibility as a parent….not some fcuking racial cross you bear. Get with it.

  354. Fabius Maximus says:

    Left I’m glad to hear its not about the stats.

    ODJ, yes Giants dumped him, but the Browns took him on. There is a long list of flawed players that NFL have given a pass to. Vick with the Animal Cruelty, Peterson, beating his kid, how many Girlfriends Wives have been beaten? Plax shooting himself!

    Kappernick took a knee, Yes he has a few A-hole moves with things like his socks. But he is not on the disruptive level. Even with all that the locker rooms loved him.

    Again can you acknowledge that the issue is with the issue and not the person. From there, why is this Issue different if the league wont address Domestic Violence in a meaningful way?

  355. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Getting a little deep here, but can a democracy coincide with human nature. Did the American system just hit a sweet spot based on vast reserves of natural resources combined with random luck events like Pearl Harbor to make a democracy last so long?

    We can say the same for China. They might of hit a sweet spot that makes it look like an authoritarian socia!ist/market based hybrid system works for a certain period of time.

    Deep subject, but throwing it out there for discussion.

  356. ExEssex says:

    9:49 guy I knew was the custodian at a school I worked at.
    Was a huge singing star in Serbia. Described neighbors
    going over to neighbors houses killing one another.
    That’s a real life example of Anarchy or something like it.
    No thanks. The left has to acknowledge that “yes” there
    Are people on the left who legitimately want to burn the whole thing.

  357. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I crave this deep intellectual talk that most teenagers could never give me. It must have been tough for true scholarly professors during this random period of “everyone goes to college.” Thank god, it’s over. Time for a degree to get back its shine and prestige.

  358. Fabius Maximus says:

    For the record, my daughter plays Ice Hockey, but taking a break at the moment. I cant see the point of LAX, but that’s on me.

    I have seen so many bad coaches and seen the same frustrations as most. In all my sporting adventures with my kids, while the coaches are A-holes and should not be there I will respect that they are there and would never intervene in their game.

    My kids are not that athletically talented and I’m ok with that. The only time I came close to calling out a coach was a CYO basketball game. It was a nothing game, but there was a tournament coming up that weekend and the coach wanted this game to practice. He had six 9 yo kids and my kid did not see a second of playtime in the first half. He was coaching the team he was going to put out. The half-time buzzer went. He huddled with his five. I walked across center court to the bench and told my son it was time to go. As we walked out past the coach, the only thing I said to him is that “You should not be coaching kids”

    When my daughter hits high school, we will hit Hockey again. My goal is RPI in New York. She has the grades to get there, but the matching money for women’s sports is a 96% scholarship grant.

    The girls fight over tennis and swimming money, look to the outlier sports.

  359. leftwing says:

    “But he is not on the disruptive level. Even with all that the locker rooms loved him…Again can you acknowledge that the issue is with the issue and not the person.”

    Absolutely not. Because my point is exactly the opposite.

    Run the two alternative scenarios…..K as QB and the next guy on the list….

    Fundamentally, when you get out of the truly elite, the difference between number 15 and number 16 is totally indistinguishable.

    So as a Coach, GM, and Owner who am I taking? Think Tuesday before you play your division rival on the weekend….

    Do you take the guy who is all about the sport, who when the mics are shoved in front of his face is professional and the questions by the media are about the game, his offense, the teams preparation, the opponent’s defense, and other on field questions?

    Or the guy who is going to have the media all over him about off field issues, and how he feels about them, and what he is going to do during the anthem and if his teammates are going to participate and what if they don’t?

    (cont’d)

  360. leftwing says:

    (cont’d)

    First case as the coach I’m taking Tues and Wed and going over game tapes at night with my sole focus to win that fcuking game on Sunday.

    With K? I’m sh1tting bricks that after the med1a is done with him they’re grabbing my offensive line and asking their opinions, and my Ole Miss offensive lineman may say something that explodes. I’m not looking at game tapes on Tues/Wed, I’m sleepless and lecturing players how to (not) respond to these issues which are the first and only questions that are going to be popped from Tues through kickoff. Who the fcuk wants that distraction?

    The night before K took his first knee he had a fork in the road.

    He had a public podium unlike any other – NFL QB – and could have gone proactive. Start a foundation to help black youth with police matters – call it Bridge the Gap. Bring in your NFL peers from sh1t cities to participate – Li0ns, Sa1nts, C0lts, Ra1ders players. Tap Peps1 and N1ke for major funds. Big TV events where he brings kids and cops together on eachothers’ turf. Fcuking amazing funding and media coverage, K is a leader and forward thinker.

    Or he kneels during the anthem, which as any seventh grade kid in the Midwest can tell you is going to alienate you personally and shut people down to any message he is trying to promote.

    He chose the latter, and became radioactive.

    As any coach will tell you, distinguishing between the 15th and 16th QB in the League (and that’s being generous to K’s skill set) is impossible.

    So, who you going to choose?

    Radioactive guy, or the guy right underneath him?

    Where were K’s parents, mentors, and agent to guide him the night he made his decision? To say, are you fcuking crazy, you are committing professional suicide? To say, if this topic is important to you, here is how you best advance it while also advancing yourself professionally as well?

    He fcuked up majorly, and the fact that he is Typhoid Mary now is solely on him. Not on the League, owners, or racism.

    That he held that ‘skills’ tryout says he still doesn’t get it….it’s not about his skills. It’s about something much more important.

    His JUDGMENT. Or more importantly, his demonstrable lack thereof.

  361. Fabius Maximus says:

    Left the answer from the coach was the classic its not a football issue.

    https://www.si.com/nfl/2017/03/30/chip-kelly-colin-kaepernick-zero-distraction

    The issue we have here is that you are taking a 99 over a 15.

    I would point out two things for clarity:

    The first that Kap came out of Business School with a 4.0. Yes Nevada is not Chi’s Fabled Cornell or Chicago, but it does crack top the US 100, so he’s not dumb in his actions.

    Next as a Niners fan I was on the side of Alex Smith getting his Job back after injury. That’s not against Kap, but more against Harbaugh.

  362. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Fab,

    He knows majority of white people are good (like his parents), but he continues to focus on the race card for obvious personal gain at this point. History books will be treating a dude that was getting paid millions to ride the bench as a modern day Harriet Tubman. Get the f’k out of here with this nonsense.

  363. Fabius Maximus says:

    For any of those Head Coaches out there afraid about hard questions on Social Issues.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gCSqCCOHzDg

  364. The Great Pumpkin says:

    He’s right. If you watch the show “Walking Dead,” it focuses on this idea. What comes of a society left to anarchy. You see all these different attempts at what someone thinks society should look like. Good series.

    JCer says:
    July 23, 2020 at 9:49 pm
    Joyce, in anarchy people starve and the relative norms of life cease to exist. The average person cares way more about living their life, putting food on the table than anything else. The problem with dictators is they are permanent, it becomes hard to get rid of them, post WWII Salazar was probably not needed anymore but held onto power as I see it mostly due to fear of communism.

  365. leftwing says:

    I can’t explain it any differently other than to repeat myself which I won’t.

    In the article the fact that as the coach says “he met with with team after his first protest…he met with other team leaders…” is exactly what I am talking about….

    As coach says he is one of the top 64 QBs around….So why take the guy where you are having team meetings about extraneous BS?

    It’s the way the world works….you want some anecdotes from teams that have gone to T1 Nationals in your kid’s sport where much more qualified players were frozen out because of off ice issues? I’ll give you a bunch (btw, NJ hockey coaches are the absolute worst).

    Want more examples from the corporate world where ED bankers are up for promotion to MD which is a golden life ticket moving them from single digit seven figures to multiple sticks and they get passed over despite having the best numbers because they are “prickly”? I have a bunch….

    Doesn’t matter where you are…..if you are an elite (athlete, corporate, etc) player a gap in your actual skill set can be fixed.

    What can’t be fixed – can’t be taught – is judgment, instinct, and heart. These traits distinguish the really good from the great, and a serious deficit in any one is non-starter.

    K has a serious judgment deficiency and that is the reason he is not being picked up.

    Do you really expect the NFL coach to offer that up? Or the kid’s hockey coach to tell the goalie parent the reason their kid wasn’t taken is because the parent is a cancer? Or the MD Promotion Committee to tell the perplexed ED whose booked $50m of sole accountable revenue and has now been passed over two times the reason he’ll never make MD is because he’s an ass?

    Stop talking stats in this matter please. Makes you sound like one of the bad NJ hockey coaches lol.

    K is a distraction with poor judgment and taking someone – anyone – further down the list is preferable if you are an owner, GM, or Coach.

  366. Fabius Maximus says:

    Again, I am glad we are agreed that Stats are not the issue and we can drop them out of the conversation.

    Yes A-Holes don’t get promoted, but that’s not what we are looking at here.

    Its not his personality its the issue and it lies with the NFL to address it. He takes a knee and is excluded yet the rest bigger player issues get a pass.

  367. Fabius Maximus says:

    Need to take a deep breath on that Harriet Tubman reference.

    You actually teach History and you posted that?

  368. Libturd says:

    Left,

    Agree with you on Kap. Was going to point out the poisonous O’Dell and how making it all about you does not work in the NFL. It does not work that way in the NBA either (Marbury). I never found Kap kneeling offensive though. I actually thought it was a pretty cool move until he sold out to N1ke. For that, he loses all credibility.

    Grim,

    Loved the story of the Poles making a fortune building custom machinery. So true and there is a lot of that. I try to raise my kids with similar work ethics and morals. You know who else are like that? The Marble.com outfit that did my counter tops in both homes. Amazing price, amazing service, hardest working guys I ever saw. It’s no wonder they are successful.

    AP,

    The 2nd mountain is my Costa Rica. I honestly know so little about that country, but I know it’s where I am going to end up and I plan to make a lot of mutual relationships there through my generosity and BBQ. :P

    Pumps,

    Stop lying and maybe people will care what you have to say. Though, I won’t.

    Everyone else,

    The whole left, right has been interesting to read about. Fab mentioned something about avoiding certain individuals at your pool parties. I disagree here. My friends are a complete mix of everything and I prefer it that way greatly. It’s the extremists I would avoid inviting. Those are the annoying ones who will never find common ground nor do they really think for themselves. But to cast out those who don’t agree with you is both ignorant and quite frankly boring. It’s what makes Grim’s blog really great.

    The truth is, what is happening in Portland, Minnesota, and Chicago is extremists on both sides acting like big babies. Both sides are wrong. And at the end of the day, who really cares who wins the lame tug of war as it doesn’t really impact us in any meaningful way. So as stupid as Leftist dads with leafblowers are, equally as stupid is Trump rounding them up with hidden federal agents. Though, I will say this. The populism of Trump has brought out the fight in the Left. I blame the Republican Party for allowing a moron like Trump to take the red/blue division to the next level.

    I was chatting with Gator about RBG and her cancer as I said she looked like she wasn’t going to make it to the inauguration. We both agreed that Trump and the entire Republican Party would do everything in their power to choose her replacement to swing the court into a dangerously lopsided position. As divisive and political as Obama and the Pelosi crew is claimed to have been, they were much more fair about allowing the next elected president to make the appointment. So which is the party more willing to work with the other side?

  369. Chicago says:

    Left: don’t get sucked in; he is not interested in a discussion. He needs entertainment.

  370. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I called this…all from nyc. Damn, what a call. Remember the articles a few years back saying how millennials don’t want jersey…drop the mic.

    “Among the top-10 states where millennials are moving, five states are in the West and four are in the South. The other state on the top list is New Jersey.

    The state from where the most rich millennials are leaving is New York, according to SmartAsset. The state lost a net 5,533 rich millennials from 2017 to 2018.”

    https://apple.news/Ang8HRvHNQKasyIzwwfcqgg

  371. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Seriously, kiss my ass. Put me through hell, and I was right.

    Now you want to challenge me on WFH as the future. Lol..

  372. JCer says:

    AP, Salazar was the minister of finance after the coup in 1926, he tried to step down multiple times from that role, the republic was on the verge of insolvency, extremely politically unstable, and had assaulted the privileges of the church, they had something like 9 presidents in 16 years, and was deeply unpopular among most people. The Army ended it and the country still had issues, people like Salazar were anti-democracy because they lived through 16 years of a failed democracy, something we have never experienced. You are so rigid in your pro-democracy view point you cannot see a scenario in which it fails or becomes ungovernable which has actually happened many times. Our system was designed with all kinds of protections from the masses and developed in place at a time that did not have the problems of 20th century Portugal, the early 20th century on the Iberian peninsula had some of the most extreme political division and violence ever seen in anywhere, members of parliament killed in the streets, excessive abuses of power on both sides. True Democracy was not going to be accepted as an option, the left and right factions were ready to fight to death, the so called republics or democracies were anything but these were wars being fought to determine who would be “King” the others would be repressed.

  373. AP says:

    Good morning, JCer:

    The proper thing for the armed forces tondo in that scenario is not to implement a dictatorship, put to quickly restore order and to immediately cede power to a democratic process.

    This is not my 21st century lenses on, this was widely discussed and acknowledged at the time.

    There was a perverse core to the regime, a desire to meddle with the very fabric of society, and to shape it according to the desires of a small cabal of radical zealots.

    The Portuguese deserved better. Many people died to restore Democracy in that country. It was given back to them.

    My point with all of this is that we cannot allow the normalization or relativization of dictatorships.

    Many people treat Pinochet, or even Salazar, as some kind of necessary evil, and that is a viewpoint that has no factual base.

    The dictatorship wasn’t a natural phenomenon. It was a deliberate, long running, twisted program.

  374. Glaring Light of Day says:

    Well, you can bump and grind, it is good for your mind
    Well, you can twist and shout, let it all hang out
    But you won’t fool the children of the revolution
    No, you won’t fool the children of the revolution, no no no
    Well, you can tear a plane in the falling rain
    I drive a Rolls Royce ’cause it’s good for my voice
    But you won’t fool the children of the revolution
    No, you won’t fool the children of the revolution

    T-Rex, this and a cup of coffee is the breakfast of champions

  375. 3b says:

    Work from home is the future, only it’s here now and it’s growing and quickly. A school teacher in Wayne’s rage against it does not change the fact.

  376. Vornado says:

    pop the champagne baby!!
    https://smartasset.com/mortgage/where-rich-millennials-are-moving-2020

    Washington – 2,600
    Colorado – 1,800
    Texas – 1,800
    Florida – 1,100 bunch of losers that can’t cut it
    North Carolina – 900 more losers
    Oregon – 677
    Idaho – 531 yuuuge losers here
    Arizona – 500
    Tennessee – 500 what’s worse than a loser?

    To be fair, all non-NJ states are for losers so I should not pick on some.

    got dam I’m on fire today

  377. Vornado says:

    Washington – 2,600
    Colorado – 1,800
    Texas – 1,800
    Florida – 1,100
    North Carolina – 900
    New Jersey – 700
    Oregon – 677
    Idaho – 531
    Arizona – 500
    Tennessee – 500

  378. Juice Box says:

    re: covid-19 cluster in Middletown NJ. We have had about 40 positive over the last 10 days, and there is a cluster of high school kids who were partying.

    https://nypost.com/2020/07/23/nj-party-leads-to-coronavirus-cluster-parents-wont-cooperate/

    Governor has it wrong as usual. The parties for the high school kids started about three weeks ago, right after the Governor allowed outdoor gatherings on July 2nd, parents then began to organize parties on FB etc some parties were very large. As far as I know the parents were organizing and perhaps even supplying *shocker* booze.

    I am a member of one local private FB group they won’t share who is sick and worse who was there so the contract tracers can do their job and notify people to get tests. They all know to get tested since they chat like crazy online about it, and now it’s in the media.

    Since it is mostly high school kids and one parent I hear that tested positive, they are downplaying it as fever/chills etc but chances are one of them might end up in the ICU.

  379. chicagofinance says:

    I make excuses bases on the moral relativism argument. The United States is flawed, but we are the best country in the world. Pricks like Fab Max take their grievances, born in their homeland, and map them to the United States. We are Americans. We are the only country where people immigrate and become part of the fabric. There is no other place that is the same. We also have an open society. You come here, you can find friends of any color, any stripe. You will not be outcasts either. You won’t be the persecuted minorities that seek each other out for kinship.

    For all our flaws, we are so much better than alternatives.

    FabMax looks at the U.S. and see this….. his views are cynical and jaded.

    WSJ
    WORLD EUROPE
    In Ireland, Protests Spur Push for Hate-Crime Laws

    Though people of color report frequent attacks, nation is one of few in West without specific laws to prosecute those motivated by racial or religious hatred
    By Alistair MacDonald and Paul Hannon

    Last August, two Muslim girls were attacked by a group of teenagers in Dublin, who kicked and stamped on them, ripped off one victim’s hijab and yelled racial and religious slurs.

    Local police said they didn’t believe the attack was a hate crime.

    People of color in Ireland, many of whom are among the rising numbers of immigrants to the country, report among the highest rates of racial harassment in Europe, according to surveys conducted by the European Union and others.

    But official Irish statistics on hate crime reveal relatively few cases because the country is one of the few in the Western world without specific laws to prosecute attacks motivated by racial or religious hatred.

    The killing of George Floyd by police in the U.S. has spurred protests against racism around the world. In Ireland, protesters are seeking to accelerate a drive to criminalize hate crimes—and signs suggest the government is listening.

    After centuries in which Irish emigrants fanned out across the world, Ireland’s booming economy has over the past couple of decades been attracting immigrants. Most of the newcomers are from Poland and other parts of Europe, but a minority come from Nigeria and other areas in sub-Saharan Africa, as well as the Middle East and Asia.

    When Jennifer Ikponmwosa heard that a Black Lives Matter protest was being organized in her home city of Limerick she felt relief. “I’m from Ireland, but it is always, ‘Where are you actually from?’ ” said Ms. Ikponmwosa, whose parents emigrated from Nigeria.

    The 19-year-old nursing assistant said she often experiences racist abuse, including racial epithets, taunts of “go back home” and comments such as “You are beautiful for a Black woman.”

    The August attack on the two Muslim girls, who were 15 and 16 at the time, happened in daylight in a south Dublin suburb and nobody intervened, said one of the girls, whose mother asked for her name to be withheld for fear of blowback. In the attack, she was kicked in the head twice and someone jumped on her chest.

    The girls, whose family came from Egypt, were called “dirty Muslim” along with racist insults, according to the victim, who said racial and religious abuse is an almost daily occurrence for her. They said nobody has been prosecuted for the attack.

    Percentage of people of African descent whosay they experienced racist violence in thepast five years, by country
    The police, who issued a statement at the time saying they didn’t believe the attack was a hate crime, declined to comment. In response to an earlier inquiry, a spokesman said they take hate crime seriously and investigate all reports of it.

    In the one hate crime on the statute books, prosecutors must prove someone publicly incited others to violence based on hatred. That sets a very high bar for prosecution, said Ivana Bacik, a professor of criminal law at Trinity College Dublin and a member of Ireland’s Senate.

    In the past 20 years, there have been 52 prosecutions using the act, with only three resulting in jail and one a fine. In England and Wales, there were 12,828 prosecutions under race-hate legislation in 2019 alone, over 75% of which resulted in conviction.

    Even without explicit legislation, police in 2019 documented 250 crimes where hatred of race, religion, sexual orientation or other personal characteristics were counted as a factor. In neighboring England and Wales—where the population is 12 times bigger—police recorded 103,379 reports of hate crimes that year.

    But that low number isn’t reflected in Black people’s experiences. In a survey released in 2018 by the EU’s Fundamental Rights Agency, 13% of people of African descent in Ireland said they had experienced at least one assault they perceived as racist violence in the previous five years. Among the 12 EU states surveyed, that was jointly the second-highest percentage alongside Austria, according to the agency. The U.K, with 3%, had the second-lowest rate.

    Ireland is one of only two EU countries with no specific provisions for hate crimes involving direct physical or verbal attacks, according to Warsaw-based rights’ group the Office for Democratic Institutions and Human Rights.

    While crimes motivated by racial hatred can be prosecuted under other laws in Ireland, the discrimination isn’t seen as an aggravating factor. In other European countries, crimes motivated by hate are viewed as more severe and the punishment is increased accordingly.

    Legal experts also say criminalizing hate crimes acts as an extra deterrent, and victims prefer seeing the crime punished as such.

    Ireland’s new government formed last month says it plans to enact race-hate laws. The step is backed by the country’s six main political parties.

    In the U.S., there has been a debate over whether hate-crime laws are necessary. But there isn’t any serious debate about it in Ireland—except by some who question why it has taken so long.

    A spokesman for Ireland’s Department of Justice and Equality said it was treating the framing of new laws to deal with hate speech and hate crime as a priority.

    He said Ireland’s police have also adopted a “working definition” of hate crime as part of a new strategy aimed at “enhancing the identification, reporting, investigation and prosecution of hate crime” that covers hostility or prejudice based on a range of factors, including race, color, religion and sexual orientation.

    The government in June established a new Anti-Racism Committee to develop a strategy to tackle the problem. The committee includes people who have directly experienced racism, among them Boidu Sayeh, who moved to Ireland from Liberia at the age of 8 and is a Gaelic football star.

    Dami Babade, 22, said he and a female Chinese-born friend who is now an Irish national, were attacked by a group of men and women in Dublin. Passersby didn’t come to their aid, and a man in his car sounded the horn and shouted, “Get that black bastard,” said Mr. Babade, who runs a media startup.

    “In Ireland there is no blueprint for treating something as a racial attack…and the police don’t treat racism seriously,” he said. The police haven’t made any arrests, he said.

    Unlike the U.K., France and other European nations, Ireland’s experience of large-scale immigration is relatively recent. Even now, the majority of newcomers, who represent around one in eight in the country, are white. According to Ireland’s most recent census, conducted in 2016, just 1.2% of the population identified themselves as Black Irish or Black African, while a further 2.1% identified as Chinese or other Asian.

    There have been some high-profile successes in integrating immigrants and their children, including former Prime Minister Leo Varadkar, the son of an Indian doctor.

    But many people of color say that the Irish remain focused on their past mistreatment, in particular as a former colony of Britain, from which it won independence almost a century ago.

    “There is a lot of, ‘We can’t be the oppressor because we have been oppressed,’ ” said Felicia Olusanya, 24, a poet and author who came to Ireland from Nigeria at the age of 8 and said she has experienced racism, including slurs, hostile looks and monkey noises.

  380. chicagofinance says:

    Fab Max is the worst kind of critic. He has the choice to be here. Resides here because there is the greatest opportunity. However, complains because the system unduly benefits those with superior skills. Well, return to your soc!alist and racist backwater, or STFU. White guilt. Limousine liberal. But ultimately, just a dishonest European.

  381. chicagofinance says:

    Is that a Whitney Houston song?

    3b says:
    July 24, 2020 at 8:37 am
    Work from home is the future

  382. Juice Box says:

    Chi – the example they use is a poor one and it’s children on children in Dublin. Might as well be a story about a playground fight in Queens, but anyway here is one of my favorite stories from Ireland as I go back every few years to visit family.

    I was visiting the rural little village on the mighty Shannon river that my mother grew up in. As usual our night ended up at the local pub with a bunch of cousins. Since it’s a small place of perhaps 400 people across several miles of farmland they all congregate on a Friday night in one or two hot spot pubs in the village. Around 8 PM in walks a tall slender man of a darker complexion, and like almost a scene out of the sitcom Cheers where the barflies cry “Norm” the tall slender man is welcomed to a cheer of “Saddam”.

    Turns out he was from Iraq, and was granted asylum in Ireland sometime around the gulf war. Nice man, we spent the evening chatting, he has fully integrated with the Irish, married a local woman, attends the pub and community events and works hard to take care and raise his children. He also likes his whiskey as we chatted over at least a whole bottle that evening. Point is racism can be found almost anywhere, but reality is it’s not everywhere.

  383. chicagofinance says:

    Northwestern Europe.
    Wholly and completely jealous of the United States.
    They are Judge Smails at Bushwood…….. they look at the United States and see Al Czervik……. loud, brash, successful, immature, ignorant…… they hate us for it, they hate our system, they will do anything to deride us. Shackle us in any way possible.

    But what are they? An entire continent of empty suits….. falling into the Atlantic Ocean in a state of chronic irrelevancy, hubris, societal decay, retiring glory.

    They are angry in their malaise, but they are also idiotically politically correct. They can’t target minorities, because of their dogma, so they pile their hatred on the most convenient place possible…. the Jews……

  384. chicagofinance says:

    …and no, I don’t have issues….. I speak the truth that you don’t want exposed….

  385. 3b says:

    Juice: Chgo is wrong to single out Ireland, simply not fair. My wife’s cousin is married to a Nigerian, and they have kids, and he has never experienced racism. Their Son is a star player in the local GAA team, and they are educated in gaelscoil all subjects taught in Irish. Immigrants have also contributed to and are welcomed in rural areas that have suffered depopulation over the centuries. Of course there is racism there as there is in every country. But to paint Ireland as broadly racist is simply unfair. They have come along way after centuries of brutal colonial rule.

  386. AP says:

    The problem with Europe was a history of blood-sucking Monarchic dynasties, followed by a legacy of Colonialism and naked exploration of foreign peoples and lands.

    The anti-Semitism in Europe, and frankly around the world, is absolutely unacceptable, scandalous, and must be forcefully combatted.

    There are many, many good things about European culture and peoples though. Ideally we would learn from each other’s histories and continue to build a prosperous, free world.

  387. 3b says:

    Europe is a fascinating place and I love it. It’s old and it’s creaky and it has tons of problems. They look at us, and see the USA making some of the same mistakes they have made. I find the people in general are more informed than the average American, but their leftist rhetoric is tiresome. We went to France two years ago, after avoiding it for years after hearing from multiple people how anti American they were. We experienced none of that and found the people especially friendly and helpful with directions. And many spoke English. Americans myself included are sorely lacking when it comes to speaking more than one language.

  388. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    There’s a big difference between the people of Paris and the people of the countryside.

  389. Yo! says:

    http://tax1.co.monmouth.nj.us/cgi-bin/m4.cgi?district=0905&l02=090500264____00003__01C010GM

    Back to NJ real estate: Toll Bros moves Hoboken Hudson Tea condo for $3 million +.

  390. 3b says:

    Brt: I would imagine there is, but we were told the people in Paris were particularly hostile to Americans, and we did not experience that at all.

  391. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Don’t hate the player, hate the game. It kills you how that I’m right, i get it.

    Vornado says:
    July 24, 2020 at 9:15 am
    pop the champagne baby!!
    https://smartasset.com/mortgage/where-rich-millennials-are-moving-2020

    Washington – 2,600
    Colorado – 1,800
    Texas – 1,800
    Florida – 1,100 bunch of losers that can’t cut it
    North Carolina – 900 more losers
    Oregon – 677
    Idaho – 531 yuuuge losers here
    Arizona – 500
    Tennessee – 500 what’s worse than a loser?

    To be fair, all non-NJ states are for losers so I should not pick on some.

    got dam I’m on fire today

  392. Fabius Maximus says:

    Chi,

    So the whole point of that diatribe is that yes America has flaws, but I’m not allowed to comment on them, because I’m a First Gen Immigrant.

  393. 3b says:

    Fab: I don’t agree with a lot of what you post. But you are an American citizen I presume, and it is your right to comment one way or the other.

  394. Juice Box says:

    Covid-19 mental heath check. One of my coworkers a great engineer quit today with no notice and is not taking txt or calls. He has had depression issues in the past, so we are a bit worried.

    Just saying…it may not be the virus that kills someone do to the pandemic, check in on those you worry about.

  395. 3b says:

    Juice: I agree, people are having issues with it. Not being able to do all the summer things weighs on you. It’s fine Monday to Friday as we are working anyhow, but in the evenings and weekends it’s tough. Missing my favorite pub, and the beach, and concerts and music festivals we would normally be going to.

  396. Democratnomore says:

    What?!
    Is this real? If anyone called me into a meeting separated by race, I would not accept that. Do I submit a DNA report beforehand so these wackadoos can tell me what group I should be in?

    My husband would be put into a different session than I am because his DNA would say Jewish (Ashkenazi)? Why are people accepting this?

    Posted by No one. 7-22
    “My daughter’s former elite private HS is now scheduling for parents to receive racial counseling. All racially segregated. Whites get their session, North Asians theirs, separate from South Asians, Latinx get their own, blacks theirs. All outsourced to a race-hustler from Plainfield. These race studies majors are having a field day now.”

  397. Juice Box says:

    3b – I am more worried about the kids. That is why I got my kids a puppy this year even though my wife is allergic. We managed to get a breed that is pretty hypoallergenic, so far so good. The puppy gets my kids out of the house and more importantly they smile allot more, before it was all scowls only seeing mom and dad all day.

    I also enrolled them in camp even though most parents are fearful, and we have had several small pool parties with cousins and a few friends so far this summer, as my home is perfect for entertaining outdoors.

    I don’t frequent pubs not since my Hoboken days, but we are fortunate down here to have good neighbors who are social so we get our adult time that way. My wife is out now with two neighbors at lunch in Red Bank. They went even though the weather is crappy to sit outside. Hopefully they don’t complain too much about me walking the dog this morning at 5:30 AM in my underwear :)

  398. Phoenix says:

    Yankees taking a knee- that might send one of my co-workers right over the side of a bridge.

    Her house is practically wallpapered in Yankee memorabilia.

    I can only imagine……

  399. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Of course you leave WFH out of this. You really don’t get it, WFH is not healthy. It’s like Groundhog Day, you are always home. You lose track of what day it even is. Some people become dirty and stop showering regularly. This type of setting might work for some, as they are anti-social, but most can’t handle it.

    It’s like with kids and school. Some kids need to be homeschooled, they are anti social and can’t handle it. Makes them sad. The majority of kids, love school. Why? They love seeing and being with other kids. I used to love looking at girls and flirting away. School was great. College even better. Best social years of your life. Anyone that avoids it is missing out.

    So I laugh when the tech nerds think you can replace school with zoom. You only think it’s about the content, but school is more than that, it’s also about learning how to socialize. Learning how to make friends and memories.

    3b says:
    July 24, 2020 at 11:14 am
    Juice: I agree, people are having issues with it. Not being able to do all the summer things weighs on you. It’s fine Monday to Friday as we are working anyhow, but in the evenings and weekends it’s tough. Missing my favorite pub, and the beach, and concerts and music festivals we would normally be going to.

  400. Phoenix says:

    Just looking for work and trying to make themselves relevant when really their jobs should be eliminated.

    Posted by No one. 7-22
    “My daughter’s former elite private HS is now scheduling for parents to receive racial counseling. All racially segregated. Whites get their session, North Asians theirs, separate from South Asians, Latinx get their own, blacks theirs. All outsourced to a race-hustler from Plainfield. These race studies majors are having a field day now.”

  401. The Great Pumpkin says:

    You want a world where your kids are always home instead of at school? Just to save a buck? So why would we advocate this for adults? Just to save a buck?

  402. Juice Box says:

    Pumps – I can recommend a good lobotomist in Wayne if you need one, been known to work miracles on personality issues.

    Here is something you should teach about History.

    https://www.pbs.org/wgbh/americanexperience/films/lobotomist/

  403. Phoenix says:

    “Just to save a buck?” Ha ha. Of course, Pumpy. Granny does not want to pay taxes to you, don’t you get it? You and your cohorts have the state over 200B in debt.

    That’s some serious chump change..

  404. Phoenix says:

    Not sure if this is the coffin corner we are in just yet, but we are getting close.

    The parameters are getting tighter by the minute.

  405. 3b says:

    Pumps: Please STFU, seriously, you have issues, and your hatred of WFH is disturbing, as it has nothing to do with you, save it’s going to lower the value of your house, and perhaps your wife’s career will be impacted if she is in commercial real estate.

    As well I pointed out to you your lack of reading comprehension skills, which I would deem critical as a teacher.

    My post said it’s not the WFH Monday to Friday that is an issue, as whether we are home or in an office we are working. It’s the evenings and the weekends, especially being the summer that are difficult.

  406. Phoenix says:

    “Missing my favorite pub, and the beach, and concerts and music festivals we would normally be going to.”

    The beaches are open. There are outdoor music venues. Bars are open, you just sit outside.

    Personally I find it refreshing. Wearing a mask is a non-issue.

  407. Juice Box says:

    Speaking of Pubs for the ex-Hoboken crowd, it seems Barney from Nags Head has retired, new bar is supposed to be some kind of dog friendly safe space.

    I remember arguing in that bar about dot com bubble and the release of J2SE 1.2 good times back then…

    https://www.hobokengirl.com/nags-head-pub-closing-hoboken-news/

  408. Phoenix says:

    Just wait till this administration pisses China off enough that it decides to send Coronavirus 2.0….

  409. FWIW says:

    https://www.reuters.com/article/us-usa-election-republicans-donors/the-wealthy-republicans-who-want-to-oust-trump-in-novembers-election-idUSKCN24P12Q

    WASHINGTON (Reuters) – Jimmy Tosh, who runs a multi-million dollar hog and grain farm in Tennessee, is a lifelong Republican. He is pro-gun, supports lower taxes and agrees with most of Republican President Donald Trump’s agenda.

    He is also spending his money to help defeat Trump in November’s election.

    “I agree with 80% of the things he does; I just cannot stand a liar,” Tosh, 70, said of Trump.

    Tosh is one of a growing number of wealthy conservative Americans who say Trump is a threat to democracy and the long-term health of the Republican Party. They are actively supporting his Democratic opponent in the Nov. 3 vote, former Vice President Joe Biden.

    Several billionaire and millionaire donors to The Lincoln Project, the most prominent of Republican-backed groups opposing Trump’s re-election, told Reuters that elected Republicans should also be punished for enabling him. Some even support the ouster of vulnerable Republican senators to hand control of the chamber to Democrats.

    Hydroxy study by Henry Ford Health System

    “Treatment with Hydroxychloroquine Cut Death Rate Significantly in COVID-19 Patients, Henry Ford Health System Study Shows”

    July 02, 2020

    https://www.henryford.com/news/2020/07/hydro-treatment-study

  410. 3b says:

    Juice: If my children were young that would be my primary concern as well. I feel for them, and their parents. We would be totally focused on our kids mental health as well if they were young. Sounds like you have a great neighborhood! We have a small family graduation party next week, and I am looking forward to it.

    We did not do pubs for years, but with our kids grown, we started to go again. Some great music ones too when they were open. Plus concerts and festivals as I said. Glad you and your family are well.

  411. 3b says:

    Phoenix The bar openings are limited and none of them are offering music that we go to. No music venues that I am aware of at least where I am.
    Beaches are open yes, but packed on weekends and people acting recklessly from what I am hearing. We are going to hit the beach on a weekday as they are less crowded.

  412. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    Covid-19 mental heath check. One of my coworkers a great engineer quit today with no notice and is not taking txt or calls. He has had depression issues in the past, so we are a bit worried.

    Just saying…it may not be the virus that kills someone do to the pandemic, check in on those you worry about.

    I know two people that have taken their lives in the past 3 months. One 25, the other 41 with kids.

  413. AP says:

    FWIW, “Hydroxy study by Henry Ford Health System”

    I heard it only helps when you’re already severely compromised, not on mild cases and certainly not as a preventative measure.

    Democratnomorw, they would let you self-identity, I’m sure. Let’s not get ahead of ourselves. Also I would imagine the event must have been optional. I might be wring, but I would be surprised.

    How else are people going to discuss what’s happening in the world and in their school communities if not in an organized event, facilitated hopefully by a qualified professional?

  414. Juice Box says:

    Phoenix – There are several bills pending in congress before the August recess. Republicans won’t release their version of the next bailout covid bill until next week. We can expect a fight but a muted one as both parties will want to head to their summer camps by July 31st to plan for their return for the war of words until the election.

    Plan is to reduce the 100% wage replacement down to 70% of wage replacement to encourage more workers to get off the beach and back to work. Not sure about state and local budget bailouts yet.

  415. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Exactly what I called you out in the post. You totally blow off WFH being a part of the equation. You say I’m obsessed, but look at you. Any chance you get to throw in a claim that WFH is here and it will destroy nyc metro area real estate, you do. Then you get mad at me for calling out your statements as nonsense. Own it.

    “My post said it’s not the WFH Monday to Friday that is an issue, as whether we are home or in an office we are working. It’s the evenings and the weekends, especially being the summer that are difficult.”

  416. Phoenix says:

    Save some money and avoid the Corona..

    https://youtu.be/uy8gQtExMAs?t=34

  417. Juice Box says:

    3b – if you ever went to Tommy Foxes on a Sunday night you would I bumped into my mother on the dance floor. She is most bummed about not enough live music especially Irish.

  418. Phoenix says:

    “I know two people that have taken their lives in the past 3 months. One 25, the other 41 with kids.”

    More people are dying on the rails of NJ Transit than are actually riding on the trains.

  419. Fast Eddie says:

    I think the WFH thing can become toxic. It’s nice to leisurely get up, pour coffee and work in shorts or sweats but the lack structure or having colleagues is not healthy. At least for me, this is not good long term. I need to rise, shower, dress and commute. It’s the only way I know.

  420. Juice Box says:

    Pumps – Mother nature is dictating WFH right now. You aren’t going to change that reality. If there is a vaccine come winter things may change but for now buckle up buttercup there is nobody going back to an enclosed spaces to work. My advice to you is find a new hobby instead of your current one which is arguing with people online. I hear train surfing can be quite exhilarating, they should be a club nearby you can join.

  421. Phoenix says:

    Eddie,
    You can always take a part time gig as a roofer as therapy.

    Just joking :-)

  422. ExEssex says:

    I dig wfh. Artists in general dig it.
    Lots of people – even high achievers
    Find office politics tedious. Oh and the
    New Open plan offices many firms have adopted?
    You can kiss those goodbye…

  423. 3b says:

    Juice: I have been there many times. My wife is a great dancer, always has been like her Father. I go with her from time to time, as if i did not dance she probably would not have married me. My wife knows a lot of the old Irish ladies that go to Tommy Foxes; she may know your Mom as well.

  424. Fast Eddie says:

    Phoenix,

    Maybe a high rise steel worker? :o

  425. Phoenix says:

    “Plan is to reduce the 100% wage replacement down to 70% of wage replacement to encourage more workers to get off the beach and back to work. ”

    Hope there is work for them to go to. Overheard my neighbor saying her bank account is overdrawn but Jesus usually helps her when this happens.

  426. Juice Box says:

    3b- Ask you wife about Mary, she is unmistakable and a regular over the decades.

  427. 3b says:

    Fast: I honestly don’t have a problem with it, if everything else was normal. I have been working for years, and don’t need the social thing. Some need it, and I understand that.
    As well the office can be distracting. Additionally, and it’s not a criticism just an observation, I find the millennials crowd always with head phones, they appear not to be into the social thing.

  428. 3b says:

    Juice: Mary?? Seriously? And Irish ? I am sure she does, I will ask her, and I
    Am sure she will know more than one!!

  429. Phoenix says:

    Eddie,
    You actually need skills for that job. Roofing we can just have you carry bundles all day, they are only 80 lbs.
    You will have colleagues, you can shower if you like, your coworkers may not, you can commute together in the same truck, and you will need to rise as the job starts @8am sharp.
    Plus you can tell all the dirty jokes you like and not have to worry about sexual harassment like you do at your previous job. There are no female roofers, at least that I have ever seen.
    Plus you get paid in cash, and benefits include you learning a second language for free.

  430. 3b says:

    Juice even with a vaccine, it won’t be business as usual, many companies will be fully implementing various WFH plans on a permanent basis. It’s a cost saver, and employees want it. We are going from 2 days to at least 3, perhaps more , and I don’t think we are returning to the office in whatever fashion until January.

  431. Fast Eddie says:

    3b,

    I have way more distraction at home. It’s not the social aspect, it’s the structure of being in a workplace which creates a stricter environment and enables me to focus. It’s about having colleagues to collaborate with on issues. It’s about routine and process. You’re there to concentrate on work, not listen to family members in the other part of the house or to be distracted in and around the home. You’re in an environment that calls for certain behavior and are being expected to perform at a certain level.

  432. Fast Eddie says:

    Phoenix,

    When you said roofer, I thought you meant I had the option to jump. lol. I figured as a steel worker, jumping would leave no doubts about the outcome. :)

  433. Phoenix says:

    Eddie,
    Sell that crapshack already and buy a house where you have a wing all to yourself.

    I know you can afford it…

  434. Phoenix says:

    Eddie,
    I don’t generally joke about jumping as through work I have dealt with many people who have attempted and failed. It’s not pleasant.
    There are things I have seen and would like to erase but the “Neurolyser” does not yet exist….

  435. Juice Box says:

    3B – As soon as Covid-19 spikes again in NY and NJ and it will, Cuomo and Murphy will be pulling the plug on working in offices. We are going to have a false start in September and a flood of NEW lawsuits since it seems the trial lawyer lobby is winning and there is no lawsuit immunity in the current congressional legislation.

    Here is the current Covid-19 lawsuit tracking so far, 3727 complaints filed. You can sort by state and category.

    https://www.huntonak.com/en/covid-19-tracker.html

  436. AP says:

    Afternoon musical interlude, courtesy of AP. Only first heard this Beach Boys song today. Man, those guys were exploring some …far out musical places:

    https://youtu.be/jVoB1Q6Bjjk

    Lib, re Second Mountain, I’m still figuring that out to some degree, but maybe there’s a book or at least a short story in me, who knows

    Re WFH, in my company, at least, it’s clearly making things better. Now that everyone is expected to be available on chat, it’s faster and easier than ever to talk to people and collaborate.

    Email can’t go away fast enough. Unless it’s for some long form stuff, keep it brief and let’s sort it out on chat.

  437. Phoenix says:

    “keep it brief and let’s sort it out on chat.”

    Boomer to friend : I hate when those kiddies are texting and chatting. Damn screen touchers.

    Boomer to boomer coworker : I’ll never admit it but those damn kiddies were right-but don’t ever tell them.

  438. Juice Box says:

    re: “Email can’t go away fast enough”.

    No way, get rid of Chat. Asynchronous communication is way better, as the expectation is you will not respond immediately. Too many people in Chat get upset when you don’t stop what you are doing to respond immediately. Worse is they then get your phone number and then pester you via SMS. Who the F*k said you can txt me at 10 PM ahole!

  439. 3b says:

    Juice : I hope you are wrong on the spikes in NY/NJ but if true it’s back to lockdown.

  440. 3b says:

    AP I still want my e mail. And I find zoom meetings just as effective as meeting in person.

  441. chicagofinance says:

    You are a hypocrite, intellectually dishonest, a major gadfly and a closeted anti-semite. Other than those issues, I have no concern with what you do or say.

    Fabius Maximus says:
    July 24, 2020 at 10:38 am
    Chi,

    So the whole point of that diatribe is that yes America has flaws, but I’m not allowed to comment on them, because I’m a First Gen Immigrant.

  442. 3b says:

    Fast: if possible you need to find a dedicated spot, unused bedroom, or basement if finished. I don’t have any distractions with kids etc.

  443. homeboken says:

    Juice – my firm uses slack. Was sold to us as the better replacement to email.

    Of course, it ballonned and now have several hundred slack channels to monitor. No improvement for me.

  444. Fast Eddie says:

    Phoenix,

    I don’t generally joke about jumping as through work I have dealt with many people who have attempted and failed. It’s not pleasant.

    What the he11 do you do for a living?

  445. Juice Box says:

    3b – It only takes one sick person in your building to shut it down for cleaning. How often can they do that?

  446. AP says:

    Juice, these days I’m trying to train myself to treat email like chat. Just a brief one-liner and try to avoid the boring, formal:. “Best,” unless it’s to a customer.

    If someone gives anyone a hard time for not responding right away during a pandemic, when kids are at home with their parents, is probably toxic to the culture. I know they are out there.

    I guess what I’m saying is that I’m trying to make email more synchronous and chat slightly less synchronous. That’s the sweet spot : )

  447. AP says:

    Home, re chat channel proliferation. I treat it as soft of a living to-do list. If someone @ me anywhere I get an alert, but otherwise just check in on about 6-8 consistent channels.

  448. Juice Box says:

    We have Slack and Teams. I avoid the Slack channels here as it is clogged with copy pasta crap code, that I have desire to look at anymore.

    Teams for us is the new Webex and a so so replacement for SharePoint collaboration. With Teams Microsoft just simply created a new place for documents to go and die.

  449. 3b says:

    Juice: we have teams as well; I was on the pilot for it when first rolled it. I am indifferent to it at best. E mail is fine. Teams gets filled with just chatter in general I find.

  450. ExEssex says:

    12:52 my guess….fluffer…!

  451. chicagofinance says:

    I lived a 1/2 block from Nags Head for 4 years. One of the first major bars that was several blocks off Washington and integrated into the neighborhood. It was the beginning of 1st Street becoming a second Washington Street.

    Miss Kitty’s (Busker’s) had a ex-Daniel sous chef running their brunch….. it was one of the first places to get breakfast in Hoboken other than a diner or greasy spoon.

    We drifted over to Zack’s for some reason….. probably due to Bubba the bartender who ended up owning Hudson Tavern.

    Juice Box says:
    July 24, 2020 at 11:42 am
    Speaking of Pubs for the ex-Hoboken crowd, it seems Barney from Nags Head has retired, new bar is supposed to be some kind of dog friendly safe space.

    I remember arguing in that bar about dot com bubble and the release of J2SE 1.2 good times back then…

  452. Phoenix says:

    Eddie,
    I assist in reassembling people that jump off of buildings.
    Or fall down stairs, crash their cars or stick their hands in running snowblowers.
    Plus other things…

  453. Bystander says:

    Busy day..day off and trying to get sh*t done for kids and myself. Any competitive online refi lenders that people recommend? I think Amex has 2500 offer for using Better. Want to move this along today.

    3b,

    My Che comment was just a little jab. I love throwing that one out there especially to R members of my Irish community.

    JB,

    My mother grew up in Letrim and retired to town on Shannon a few years ago. It is a small world. My brother and I were in Cabo 20 years ago partying. Wake up red-eyed for breakfast and woman next to us starts talking with thick brogue. Start to chat and learn she was from same town as my mother. Her father was my town postman. My mom knew him. Unreal

  454. Phoenix says:

    But Eddie,
    I have had many other careers before. Plus hobbies.
    Really helps to know woodworking, electronics, plumbing, hydraulics, video, computers, etc while doing what I do.
    It’s also why I laugh when I hear whiners complain about wearing masks……

  455. Bystander says:

    Leitrim..geez

  456. Phoenix says:

    Eddie,
    Stuff like this. Stock video, no relation.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WmK9tKP_wr8

  457. 3b says:

    Bystander: I figured that on the Che comment. No worries. So your Mom went back to retire, I am sure you guys miss her. I know Leitrim, fairly well, my Dad was from Cavan. I have been to Carrick on Shannon, and Balinamore, and Manorhamilton many times.

  458. Bystander says:

    3b,

    Damn, Cavan. I have spent many weeks there visiting my aunt and cousins. I have no doubt that our families know each other. My uncle was a bouncer at local pub. Most gentle soul you could imagine. Seriously he could flick me like a flea. Even my wirey farmer cousins, strong as can be. My soft American @ss was tossed quickly. They laugh at my soft handshakes..seriously

  459. Fast Eddie says:

    Phoenix,

    WTF!! What is your actual occupation?

  460. Bystander says:

    Ireland is still agricultural enough that you are judged on soft hands. My cousin met a successful guy from Dublin consulate. Educated, nice and money..her first comment was his soft hands were a turn off. Irish farmer girls..hah

  461. 3b says:

    Bystander: Hand crushing hand shakes. My cousin still has cattle farming, graduated with a degree in agriculture. I am amazed how it’s changed since I was a kid with cattle raising, very mechanized now. His wife is a school teacher. I would not be surprised if the families knew each other, close connections between the two counties, and Fermanagh. Beautiful country side outside of the mean stream tourist areas.

  462. Juice Box says:

    re: soft hands

    My youngest first cousin in Ireland does stone masonry today for a living, the walls you see lining everyone’s home and roads. It was the only work he could find after the housing collapse is 2008. He reminds me of a gentle pitbull he is so muscular and will probably live to a 100 years old like my great-uncle who did the same thing. I worked with my great-uncle when he was 90 years old when I was 16 and spent a summer there learning hard labor does not pay.

    Man was that old guy strong. I used to lift weights for high school sports etc, and was no where near as strong as him, that old guy could probably still dead lift 500 lbs at his age.

  463. FWIW says:

    https://www.wsj.com/articles/companies-start-to-think-remote-work-isnt-so-great-after-all-11595603397

    Companies Start to Think Remote Work Isn’t So Great After All
    Projects take longer. Collaboration is harder. And training new workers is a struggle. ‘This is not going to be sustainable.’

  464. Vornado says:

    What were you right about that 6% of these people moved to Jersey and the majority of others moved to loser states? Great call Copernicus.

    The Great Pumpkin says:
    July 24, 2020 at 10:37 am
    Don’t hate the player, hate the game. It kills you how that I’m right, i get it.

    Vornado says:
    July 24, 2020 at 9:15 am
    pop the champagne baby!!
    https://smartasset.com/mortgage/where-rich-millennials-are-moving-2020

  465. AP says:

    Just got a letter from the school superintendent for our district. For grades 3-6: two groups, alternating days, 8:30 to around one, you can do fully remote if you choose.

    Subject to change, of course.

  466. Juice Box says:

    Family in Michigan fundraising for an outdoor school. Doesn’t it snow there in October?

    Check the design.. A tent might be cheaper..

    https://givebutter.com/dws-outdoors

  467. 3b says:

    FWIW: I know there are issues with WFH, especially with new hires, but the majority of the work is getting done. The Office will never go away completely, at least not in the short to mid term, but the traditional 5 day a week in the office is not coming back; no need for it.

    On another note FWIW is new here, are you sure you are not pumps?

  468. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Vornado,

    This is what matters to me. The big dogs. And discount it all you want, it’s only going to grow. Wasn’t I told no millennials are coming to jersey, and I said bs. Got ragged on. Yet, here we are, the strongest of the millennials are attracted to NJ. The best of the best. Read up, this comes from your article.

    “New Jersey is the only East Coast state that makes it into our top 10. Between 2017 and 2018, there was a net migration of 746 millennials earning at least $100,000 to the state. In fact, close to 500, or roughly two-thirds, of those individuals earned upwards of $200,000; that’s the second-highest gross net migration of millennials in that income bracket in our study.”

  469. The Great Pumpkin says:

    For god sake, I’m not posting under other handles. Why the hell would I do that? I would have loved to read that WSJ article first, and then put it in your face that I was correct! Why would I need another handle to do that?

    3b says:
    July 24, 2020 at 3:15 pm
    FWIW: I know there are issues with WFH, especially with new hires, but the majority of the work is getting done. The Office will never go away completely, at least not in the short to mid term, but the traditional 5 day a week in the office is not coming back; no need for it.

    On another note FWIW is new here, are you sure you are not pumps?

  470. The Great Pumpkin says:

    And now acknowledge that maybe my position has nothing to do with my personal life and more about calling bs on a trend getting pushed as if it’s here to stay. Looks like Wsj agrees with me…it doesn’t work on a massive scale. You are insane to think otherwise.

    You want to destroy your company? Tell them to all work from home….good luck. Now tell me you would take your hard earned capital and invest in a company where everyone works at home. Would you buy that business? I sure as hell won’t.

  471. chicagofinance says:

    Regarding WFH

    As soon as someone gets laid off or passed over for promotion, the WFH thing will get old super fast……

  472. Phoenix says:

    When you get laid off from home on Zoom does your screen just go blank?

  473. Bystander says:

    ” Great call Copernicus.”

    I prefer Nostradumb@$$.

  474. Juice Box says:

    We can lend our way to prosperity.

    Case in point the Pensions, imagine if they were to get and 18% return?

    https://www.nj.com/opinion/2020/07/new-jersey-needs-a-public-bank-fast-opinion.html

  475. Phoenix says:

    Yeah, that’s what I want. To borrow money from the State Bank of NJ@18% to help pay for Pumpy’s retirement.

    When will the psycho news stop coming…..

  476. AP says:

    Re mental health check. The only part that’s starting to get to me is the repetition. Every day is so much like every other. Gonna have to start taking some longer walks or outings.

    WFH is a good thing, but the occasional customer lunch, coffee shop hangouts, really helped.

    Of all the movies I watched growing up, didn’t think Groundhogs Day was the one to be worried about.

  477. Phoenix says:

    AP,
    Join your local rescue squad. I’m sure they need members. Get a real taste of life without a big commitment.

    It won’t be like groundhog day that’s for sure.

  478. Yo! says:

    Have relatives in Goatstown, Dublin, Ireland. Made money in 1990s and early 2000s in construction biz and bought condo in Florida. First time they saw Hispanic and Jewish people. They asked me many weird questions.

  479. AP says:

    Phoenix, funny you say that. Our local volunteer ambulance squad folks do need more folks, I heard….

  480. 3b says:

    WFH is not going anywhere, regardless of the problems and drawbacks, these will be addressed in time. And again I state it won’t be 100
    Percent, but it will be significant. My HR contacts have said repeatedly working parents want it. I have spoken to multiple people friends / family who want it, assuming kids go
    back to school normally. It will be a dramatic quality of life improvement. Anyone who believes we are going back to 5 days a week with a sprinkle of WFH does not have a clue.
    As for promotions we had two announcements over Zoom this week.

  481. No One says:

    It’s real. They take it because this is how people virtue signal and get kids accepted to ivy league schools. Princeton is full of guilty rich do-gooders, with spoiled kids spending tens of thousands getting their photos taken with poor Guatemalans saving the earth, and driving to school in Range Rovers. Now the hot luxury belief is BLM. They disgust me.

    What?!
    Is this real? If anyone called me into a meeting separated by race, I would not accept that. Do I submit a DNA report beforehand so these wackadoos can tell me what group I should be in?

    My husband would be put into a different session than I am because his DNA would say Jewish (Ashkenazi)? Why are people accepting this?

    Posted by No one. 7-22
    “My daughter’s former elite private HS is now scheduling for parents to receive racial counseling. All racially segregated. Whites get their session, North Asians theirs, separate from South Asians, Latinx get their own, blacks theirs. All outsourced to a race-hustler from Plainfield. These race studies majors are having a field day now.”

  482. Juice Box says:

    Here is out school reopen plan released today.

    Kids last name begins with A-K Monday and Tuesday in school for 1/2 day everyone home Wed, Kids last name begins with L-Z Thursday and Friday for for 1/2 day.

    How the heck is a teacher going to teach half the class in school and the other half home at the same time?

  483. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    It’s real. They take it because this is how people virtue signal and get kids accepted to ivy league schools. Princeton is full of guilty rich do-gooders, with spoiled kids spending tens of thousands getting their photos taken with poor Guatemalans saving the earth, and driving to school in Range Rovers. Now the hot luxury belief is BLM. They disgust me.

    There has to be some sort of organization that sets them up with it. I’ve had a number of students make a pit stop on their tropical vacation to do a day of volunteering to help the poor people.

  484. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    How the heck is a teacher going to teach half the class in school and the other half home at the same time?

    We have an early dismissal at 12:30 every day. We are to spend the other 2 hours doing online instruction related activities.

  485. Juice Box says:

    More Covid-19 driven news today from my family in Ireland. My cousin who was living in Dubai for the last decade or so has moved back to Ireland. They want to raise their kids there and be close to extended family, translation is the oil and gas party in Dubai is over, if this keeps up the desert may reclaim that city.

  486. AP says:

    No One, curious about who might be the people you approve of. Not messing with you, just want to give your thought a chance to shine.

    I sense a little class resentment in your caricature above, no?

  487. ExEssex says:

    5:5o you should ask Bill Barr – his daddy ran a school.
    NAMBLA much?

  488. Juice Box says:

    re: “They disgust me”

    Might was well tie in a CHE story tonight..

    I have got a few in my family oodles of money too, maybe more than our Governor. Virtue signal on social media any chance they get, but still send their grand kids to private school and don’t have any TVs in the house. One holiday way back when we went to see the Motorcycle diaries with them (excuse to check me out). It was all look what we all did to those people that built Machu Picchu etc. My response was I am not Spanish and my parents came here only a few years ago and yours came here two generations ago from Norway and Sweden how is what happened then and there anything to do with us? Crickets as I may have stolen a bit of their guilt from them with reason. As they are now in their 70s I keep it civil as we sing Christian Christmas carols at the country club every other year.

  489. Juice Box says:

    Essex – Between puffs you are as reasonable as any of us, but I have to ask WTF Willis are you talking about? Sins of the father?

  490. AP says:

    Ah, the Inca. Great builders. The Inca road is still partially there.

    Part of the reason why they were so quickly conquered and destroyed was because of internal conflicts and fractures within their empire. A false claimant to the true Inca lineage cause a massive civil war right before the Spanish landed.

    Still a lot we don’t know about that civilization. Their record keeping cords have never been deciphered, and most codexes were destroyed by the conquerors.

  491. ExEssex Onto Something says:

    ExEssex,

    There was always something triggering my spider sense regarding Barr. He’s a big opus dei type catholic, there is always some heavy perv going on. Case in point one of the biggest traitor in this country. Big Opus Dei perp catholic. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Hanssen

    There is reason to worry about so many conservative catholics in the Supreme Court. I wonder how many are having perp parties – I/m sure Scalia was a leader of them

  492. Juice Box says:

    re: “there is always some heavy perv going on”

    As if evil deviance, codified in religion or law over the centuries is ok? We could really go down the rabbit hole, so what the hell I might as well start since I am on the side of only reason.

    How is mutilating a child as a religious right acceptable? Some will argue vehemently all the way to the Supreme Court that it is. Bonus points if you can figure out how many cultures do this to millions of children every year.

  493. Vornado says:

    I read the article, the whole article. 94% of “rich millennials” moved elsewhere. Mostly to loser states. Argue with any strawman you want.

    The Great Pumpkin says:
    July 24, 2020 at 3:18 pm
    Vornado,

    This is what matters to me. The big dogs. And discount it all you want, it’s only going to grow. Wasn’t I told no millennials are coming to jersey, and I said bs. Got ragged on. Yet, here we are, the strongest of the millennials are attracted to NJ. The best of the best. Read up, this comes from your article.

    “New Jersey is the only East Coast state that makes it into our top 10. Between 2017 and 2018, there was a net migration of 746 millennials earning at least $100,000 to the state. In fact, close to 500, or roughly two-thirds, of those individuals earned upwards of $200,000; that’s the second-highest gross net migration of millennials in that income bracket in our study.”

  494. Deadconomy says:

    I don’t know, why would you.

    The Great Pumpkin says:
    July 24, 2020 at 3:21 pm
    For god sake, I’m not posting under other handles. Why the hell would I do that?

  495. No One says:

    AP,
    I’ll let you know if you make it into that select group. Some other posters are in. As is our host.. So far, it’s not looking promising for you, though.

  496. 3b says:

    Catholics on the Supreme Court?? Wow! Shades of JFK in 1960, with a hotline to the Pope.

  497. AP says:

    No One, man, I should tell you, I’m so happy where I’m at.

    I won’t tell you what my bracket is, but let me.putvit this way: I feel no need to post resentful comments about peoples vehicles or where their children go to camp. None of my business, really. I focus on mine.

  498. AP says:

    No One, these feelings you are harboring and expressing are very corrosive to your soul. It works against your own ability to succeed. Don’t fall for that trap.

    When I see someone buy a new car, I’m happy for them. When they send their kids, or their kids choose to go to a weird whatever camp, I say more power to them.

    Personally I’ve worked full-time for the greater part of college, ate ramen noodles, lived in a small bridge-and-tunnel studio apartment after that, and now, twenty years in of consistent, non-stop work I’m doing better than I ever dreamt I would or could.

    I’m so grateful for the opportunities I’ve been given, and for everyone who has helped me in my life : )

  499. Libturd says:

    Too tired too discuss advantages/disadvantages of WFH, but in short, both my company and yours truly benefit from it. More tomorrow.

  500. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I made my calls on this blog. Nothing to prove to you, trying to drag me into the mud. No desire to join you.

    Vornado says:
    July 24, 2020 at 8:10 pm
    I read the article, the whole article. 94% of “rich millennials” moved elsewhere. Mostly to loser states. Argue with any strawman you want.

  501. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Exactly. Don’t act like you are in high bracket when you are touting equality that comes from sticking a hand forcefully into your pocket. Nice job calling him out.

    No One says:
    July 24, 2020 at 8:49 pm
    AP,
    I’ll let you know if you make it into that select group. Some other posters are in. As is our host.. So far, it’s not looking promising for you, though.

  502. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Coming from the guy that said I was lying about 7% raises over the past decade. Sorry, my wife was consistently hitting raises while you were crying about 2% caps.

    Libturd says:
    July 24, 2020 at 10:53 pm
    Too tired too discuss advantages/disadvantages of WFH, but in short, both my company and yours truly benefit from it. More tomorrow.

  503. AP says:

    Pumpkin, what are you even talking about? When have I ever been seen “touting equality that comes from sticking a hand forcefully into your pocket”?

    Almost like you’re trolling me…. Hmm….

  504. The Great Pumpkin says:

    How do you achieve the economic equality you seek without doing so?

    AP says:
    July 25, 2020 at 12:22 am
    Pumpkin, what are you even talking about? When have I ever been seen “touting equality that comes from sticking a hand forcefully into your pocket”?

    Almost like you’re trolling me…. Hmm….

  505. JCer says:

    I’ve had flexibility in my job for the last 5 years. I did WFH for 6 months at one point and a few month long stints and then usually once a week. It’s a nice option when you need it but it cannot be permanent, if you want to go visit family or have a life event it’s great. Once or twice a week it’s nice to not have the grind of a commute and some quiet time to get work done. But it is isolating and you miss a lot of what is going on in the office, it is good to see people also I personally think like Eddie a bit of a routine is good and that can be difficult to have at home. The lack of separation between work and home I find to be mentally draining. This COVID thing is terrible with everyone in the house and all the interruptions the wife and I are finding to keep up with work we are logging 12-16 hours a day easily plus time on weekends. But even in my past WFH stints 6 months was too long a few weeks or months was fine.

  506. Phoenix says:

    “5:5o you should ask Bill Barr – his daddy ran a school.”

    Don’t know Bill Barr, but I approve of Bill Burr.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6HVvagEMLEU

  507. AP says:

    “How do you achieve the economic equality you seek without doing so?”

    We can achieve equality in economic _opportunity_ and provide sufficient help for the most vulnerable among us.

    Over time it would generate more overall equality.

    More access to free or affordable healthcare would already be a huge help to many, many Americans.

  508. Phoenix says:

    “What?!
    Is this real? If anyone called me into a meeting separated by race, I would not accept that. Do I submit a DNA report beforehand so these wackadoos can tell me what group I should be in?”

    Man, I have to say I love where I work. We are randomly thrown together like a bunch of mutts and purebreds all in the same room. And it works, thankfully. I can honestly say for the most part I love the people I work with and they are from all races and religions. Work can be hell but also a blast at the same time.

    I learn new things from all of them every time I go. I hope it continues. It’s nice being part of an overall great team.

  509. AP says:

    Phoenix “I don’t like those odds”

  510. JCer says:

    Pumps the whole notion of economic equality is intellectually dishonest. The economy is transactional, my company pays me what they pay me because they make money on what I produce, they are taking all the risk so I get hundreds of thousands while they make millions on my work in a good year. They try to pay as little as possible while paying enough to retain talent. So fundamentally my compensation is tied explicitly to the value I create and what the market of employers will pay for it. The number of people capable of producing the output determines the prevailing wage.

    Any discussion of income inequality typically advances an argument for asset redistribution. This is a fundamentally marxist idea that is only advanced by communists. Income will always be uneven, there will always be poor just as there will always be rich. The issue is the hollowing out, offshoring and automation of jobs that allow folks to earn a good living. Economic policy is what can help increase the size of the middle class. Taxing the rich more does not what will they do with the revenue, we have very little to show as it is.

  511. Vornado says:

    AP,
    He doesn’t know how to read.

  512. AP says:

    JCer, you’re wring again. Twice on the same day. Maybe you should take a break, bud.

    There’s nothing leftist about equal access to economic opportunity. It’s called a level playing field, Generaliss1mo.

  513. JCer says:

    AP I wouldn’t trust our government to run healthcare, they couldn’t even make the Marketplace work for the ACA, it’s a website people. I’m sorry to say when the government gets involved some politically connected folks make a fortune and we get stuck footing the bill and with the consequences of their incompetence.

  514. AP says:

    JCer, again, I never said government run healthcare. I said access to free or affordable healthcare.

    You seem like a peer of mine in age and I have nothing but respect for you, but you’re coming out with opinions that are way out in left field today.

    First Salazar, then a level playing field is leftism, now access to healthcare is a problem somehow.

    My positions are reasonable or at least approachable to both sides of the aisle.

  515. JCer says:

    AP phrasing is actually very important calling for economic equality has a connotation. Calling for equity of opportunity is a different conversation all together, ok Comrade. Giving a bunch of money to the government will do nothing to foster so called “economic equality”.

    If it is economic opportunity you want to foster you likely are supporting policies that are self defeating. You didn’t say opportunity your actual words are economic equality which carries a different connotation.

    Do you know any people from Venezuela? They can tell you how well economic equality has worked out for them….

  516. AP says:

    JCer,

    I have no utopian dreams or aspirations. It would be hard to pin that on me since that’s not my position. You are the one defending authoritarian regimes on this blog, never I.

    Call me a pragmatic bourgeois centrist who’s very invested in freedom, democracy, and prosperity, if you must apply a label.

    I know no one from Venezuela. I never mentioned Venezuela. I have never defended the Venezuelan regime.

    You are grasping at straws, my man : )

  517. JCer says:

    AP, you totally missed the point with the Salazar, I’m not saying the regime was a “good thing” but rather the better alternative at the time. Quite literally after the fall of the first Portuguese Republic someone needed to bring the country to order. Salazar saved the country from collapse, the repression early on was needed as you had left wing and right wing paramilitaries destabilizing the country, the alternative was a failed state. The alternative was a whole lot of human suffering or some other dictator Salazar was quite mild compared to most dictators. The regime lasted far longer than it needed to. I never defended any of the other dictators discussed. We need to agree to disagree on this point.

    I was triggered by the phrase “economic equality”, it is a phrase I don’t like and it is steeped in marxist ideology. I know many people who fled the oppression of communist nations and would wish it on no one. My opinions regarding “economic equality” are actually well explained by an article in the Atlantic, of all places….

    https://www.theatlantic.com/science/archive/2015/10/people-dont-actually-want-equality/411784/

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