From the WSJ:
Home-Price Watchers Hope Drop Slows
By MAYA JACKSON RANDALL
August 25, 2008; Page A2
This week’s housing-market data won’t erase the souring situation surrounding Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, but there still might be a way to make lemonade.
Start with the S&P/Case-Shiller home-price-index report due out Tuesday. It will likely show continued price declines across the country as the housing slump drags on. Those are the lemons. To sweeten that up, look to the rate of price declines in hard-hit markets such as those in California and Florida. If the rate of declines slows, as some experts expect, there is your sugar.
The data are likely to be “negative pretty much across the board” and home prices are unlikely to bottom out until 2009 or 2010, said Mark Vitner, a Wachovia senior economist. But Mr. Vitner expects the rate of decline in home prices to begin to moderate “at some point in the second half of the year.” That could signal the worst is behind us, though Mr. Vitner says he thinks the market could easily sit at the bottom for at least a year.
At the same time, it would be souring if the rate of declines accelerates. All eyes are already on Fannie and Freddie, and data showing home prices plummeting more than expected wouldn’t help the mortgage giants.
“The more housing prices fall, the more foreclosures we get and the more each one of those costs Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac,” says University of Maryland business professor Peter Morici.
The week is chockablock with housing data. Existing-home-sales data, released Monday, will be interesting to watch. While economists expect a slight uptick in sales, it could be bittersweet — the result of troubled banks having to sell foreclosed homes at a deep discount. “I think the story there is simply that you have a lot of foreclosures and banks are pricing the homes so they sell,” said Global Insight U.S. Economist Patrick Newport.
On Tuesday, the Office of Federal Housing Enterprise Oversight will release its monthly home-price data through June. Additionally, the Commerce Department Tuesday releases data on July sales of new homes. Last month’s decline in sales was the fifth in six months.
From Bloomberg:
Home Sales Probably Held Near Decade Low: U.S. Economy Preview
Home sales in the U.S. probably teetered near a 10-year low, property values dropped and consumer spending cooled, signaling the economy has taken another turn for the worse, reports this week may show.
A total of 5.435 million new and existing homes were purchased in July at an annual pace, according to the median estimate of economists polled by Bloomberg News. June’s 5.39 million rate was the weakest since at least 1999. Spending probably rose 0.3 percent in July, half the prior month’s gain.
The real-estate recession will persist into next year as stricter lending rules and higher borrowing costs shackle demand. At the same time, equity is disappearing as home prices fall, and wages aren’t keeping up with inflation, depriving Americans of the means to maintain spending, the biggest part of the economy.
“The economy is going down a shaky path,” said Maxwell Clarke, chief U.S. economist at IDEAGlobal Inc. in New York. “We’re not going to see a rebound in housing anytime soon. Consumers are living hand to mouth, and the outlook for spending is very weak.”
From the Pocono Record:
Bus fare pushing commuters over edge
The gas price is finally going down, so why is Martz still increasing the price for traveling to New York city?
The bus fare was recently increased to $500 for one month’s commuter ride. There should be other bus companies. Why does Martz have a virtual monopoly in the Poconos? Can anything be done about the bus fare and support for the residents?
The residents and commuters of northeast Pennsylvania are hurting. We are not able to afford the rising cost of the bus fare to New York on a daily basis.
Jobs are not readily available in this area, nor is the salary competitive. Many of us have to remain in New York during the week and only go home on weekends. This arrangement affects the household. There is usually no one to supervise the children. We are concerned for the children. What about their homework, safety and guidance?
Does no one care about the residents in the area? We are hurting. We need help. A couple working in New York will have to pay $1,000 per month for bus fare only. Is this realistic? Traveling to other states, such as New Jersey and Delaware, the cost is much less for one month’s traveling for the same distance or more.
From the Star Ledger:
On the eve of foreclosure, a mother finds help in the system
Marisol Perez already had stopped answering her phone, knowing it would be just another hectoring creditor.
Then her hair started falling out from the stress of working two jobs but still not being able to cover her monthly mortgage payment.
Then she got the letter that jabbed her in the gut: A lawyer’s office informed her it was foreclosing on her house.
“That’s when it hit me: I’m going to be homeless with three kids,” said Perez, an X-ray technician who lives in Dover.
It’s the kind of realization that has been hitting more families around New Jersey, where foreclosures are up 140 percent over last year, according to the latest data from RealtyTrac, a California firm that monitors foreclosures nationwide.
But there’s another side to that story, one that’s offering encouragement to distressed homeowners: Loan modifications also appear to be surging.
…
When Perez and her fiancé bought in Dover two years ago, foreclosure was the furthest thing from their minds. They put down $4,000 on a $245,000 home and took out two fixed-rate loans, one at 7 percent interest, the other at 9 percent.
The payments were doable. Then Perez said she and her fiancé broke up, he insisting she buy out his portion of the house. Perez refinanced, switching to a subprime loan with an interest rate of 10 percent and monthly payments of more than $2,500.
…
Under the new terms, the interest rate had been slashed in half, to 5 percent. The loan term was switched from 30 years to 40. The new payment was $1,768 a month — still a squeeze, but doable.
“These things don’t always work out this well. We’re thrilled when it does,” said Marshall.
From the Home News Tribune:
Drug industry jobs disappearing in N.J.
One of several people at the Dover unemployment office last week from the pharmaceutical industry, David Stern worked for a small company when layoffs hit a few months ago and a manager called him into an office.
“You get that sinking feeling,” Stern, 56, of Rockaway, said.
…
Some pharmaceutical and health care companies with ties to Morris County, such as Pfizer, Novartis and Wyeth, are among those that have announced planned work force reductions. It remains unclear how much impact will be felt in Morris County. But, based on notices sent to the state this year, Morris will lose hundreds of pharmaceutical and health care product jobs over the next few months.
Johnson & Johnson officials informed the state in a letter last month that its manufacturing plant on Jefferson Road in Parsippany, which employs 296 people and makes Ben-Gay among other products, will be closed before the end of the year. The workers were told about the closing more than a year ago, said Chris Clark, a company spokesman.
The company purchased that plant a little more than a year ago as part of a larger acquisition of Pfizer’s consumer products division, including four buildings in Morris Plains. One of those buildings never was completed and another remains vacant. Johnson & Johnson laid off about 350 workers there a year ago.
Abbott Laboratories has announced plans to close a manufacturing plant in Whippany where 134 people work by the end of this year. It also will close a Parsippany research facility with 83 employees by early next year.
This guy Quinn has attacked me in this article by repeating a post I made almost verbatim. He is not going to get away with calling me a “Great Denier” when in fact I support this damn country. He made a big mistake in going after me and he’s gonna regret that:
http://seekingalpha.com/article/92303-looming-financial-catastrophe-a-real-inconvenient-truth#comment-238074
The next obstacle is what I call the Great Deniers. They deny that there are any problems in America. They ignore the hard facts and spout rhetoric like: “We are the greatest country in the history of the world; There is nothing that’s going to occur to our economy except a continuance of the great economic success our great nation has always enjoyed; The sun is not setting on our great nation, it is rising!; It is morning in America.” It is difficult to have a logical discussion with these shills. They are disciples of the Ben Stein School of ignoring facts and figures. They are cheerleaders for America, when what we need are wide eyed realists. Many of these people have secure well paying comfortable positions in our society and fear a change in the status quo.
Cindy Says:
August 24th, 2008 at 1:21 pm
James Quinn has another article @Seeking Alpha – (I like this guy.) Looming Financial Catastrophe: A Real Inconvient Truth
From Bloomberg:
Libor Signals Tighter Credit as Banks Balk at Lending
Most of the bond strategists and salesmen that Resolution Investment Management Ltd.’s Stuart Thomson talked to last August expected the credit crunch to be long over by now. Instead, money markets show there’s no end in sight, and it may even worsen.
“It’s like an ongoing nightmare and no one is sure when we’re going to wake up,” said Thomson, a money manager in Glasgow at Resolution, which oversees $46 billion in bonds. “Things are going to get worse before they get better.”
In a replay of the last four months of 2007, interest-rate derivatives imply that banks are becoming more hesitant to lend on speculation credit losses will increase as the global economic slowdown deepens. Binit Patel, an economist in London at Goldman Sachs Group Inc., said in an Aug. 21 report that nations accounting for half of the world’s economy face a recession.
…
“These problems going into year-end are likely to be worse this time round because of the amount banks have to refinance in December,” Thomson said, citing a figure of $88 billion. “The suspicion is that banks are still hiding losses. The banking system relies on trust and at the minute there quite simply isn’t any.”
From the IHT:
U.S. economy depending on housing market
The willingness and ability of Americans to come back into the housing market over the next few months will determine whether the U.S. economy experiences a mild downturn or the deepest recession in 30 years.
Many economists say that home prices have another 10 percent to fall to bring them into balance with rents and incomes. A fall of that magnitude would elicit a huge sigh of relief from Wall Street and Washington.
But it would not take much – a further clampdown by private lenders or a meltdown at the mortgage finance companies Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac – to push home prices down much more severely, perhaps more than 20 percent.
“That’s how you could quickly get into this darker scenario,” said Mark Zandi, chief economist with Moody’s Economy.com.
If banks tighten lending standards further, denying loans to borrowers with good credit histories, affordability will not be enough to keep people buying homes. And a sharper housing bust would leave deep scars in consumer sentiment, which would likely lead to a deep recession.
Analysts at Credit Suisse estimate that the S&P Case-Shiller index of house prices in 20 major cities must fall by another 14 percent for houses to become affordable again, assuming the typical mortgage rate stays around 6.32 percent. The index was down 15.8 percent from a year earlier in May.
From the NY Journal News:
More overdue loans hit Lower Hudson Valley banks
Past-due and nonperforming loans are up at most of the banks headquartered in the Lower Hudson Valley, a reflection of a slowing economy and more trouble in the residential mortgage market.
Six of the nine banks that are based regionally saw troubled loans increase as a percentage of their total loan portfolio, according to an analysis of quarterly reports that the banks must file with the Federal Deposit Insurance Corp.
The increases occurred in the first quarter of 2008, year over year, the last quarter for which comparable reports for all nine banks were available. Two of the local banks saw a drop in their share of problem loans, and one bank was virtually flat.
From the WSJ:
Fannie, Freddie Woes Vex Experts
And Leave U.S. Hard Choices
By SUDEEP REDDY
August 25, 2008; Page A2
SOME OF THE nation’s top economists figure the government’s response to Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac has come to a critical turning point: They expect Treasury will be forced to inject funds into the two firms, but they’re not sure whether pulling the trigger will be enough to bolster the sagging economy.
The woes of the two mortgage-lending giants were the talk of the Federal Reserve Bank of Kansas City’s annual mountainside conference here in Jackson Hole, Wyo. When the central bankers, academics and Wall Street economists met a year ago, the housing-market troubles had just begun to deepen global-credit problems.
Since then, government officials around the world have repeatedly intervened by injecting liquidity into markets. Their actions may have prevented a much deeper financial meltdown, but they haven’t ended the crisis.
The fundamental problem: Home prices continue to decline sharply. That is leading to more homeowner defaults and foreclosures, which further knock down real-estate values. The price declines are hitting banks that hold mortgage-related securities, ultimately restraining credit and slowing the overall economy.
“It’s simply not clear — at least not clear to me — what will stop this self-reinforcing process,” Harvard economist Martin Feldstein told conference participants.
Clotpoll, Sybarite,
From the last thread… thank you! Thank you for having the insight to realize exactly what I’m trying to say through my perverse writing.
(4) I referenced this article by James Quinn yesterday because he is so passionate about the economic problems this country faces. The article is a bit amateurish (don’t ask me what the symbols in the education section represent) and he tries to cover too much in each article but he does research the subject and I believe, is trying to help solve the problem by exposing more and more people to undeniable facts.
That said, he is short-sighted in the defense area and adds too much politics for my taste. But he shows an America at war with itself..unable to reconcile the constant battle over power and money. (Lobbies/ no term limits.)
He basically asks the question: Aren’t there 535 honest people who care about America that can get us back on the right track? (100 senators/435 representatives.)
I’m sorry you didn’t like it reinvestor but Quinn sees those in denial as part of the problem.
NJMLS Data for Bergen County
Year AvgList AvgSold Med Sold U/C
1991 $264,284 $259,092 $200,000 850 692
1992 $267,495 $245,035 $203,000 905 728
1993 $261,938 $243,886 $205,000 898 856
1994 $276,675 $258,822 $213,500 973 788
1995 $266,559 $229,172 $205,000 450 598
1996 $285,657 $269,956 $218,000 890 741
1997 $276,288 $265,457 $218,000 1014 826
1998 $290,818 $282,631 $222,500 1101 878
1999 $330,717 $321,389 $250,000 1093 850
2000 $331,712 $324,754 $260,000 986 842
2001 $393,582 $381,572 $300,000 1059 855
2002 $423,124 $416,943 $335,000 1069 893
2003 $484,231 $469,366 $380,000 1130 1138
2004 $625,260 $608,696 $455,000 1282 967
2005 $600,208 $588,485 $480,000 1082 944
2006 $646,553 $607,437 $490,000 904 750
2007 $671,673 $628,673 $505,000 899 842
2008 $670,293 $607,707 $467,000 675 693
FYI: Above data for July!!!
I posted this to the previous entry but i’m guessing I should be posting it here too for people to see….
What worries me is the 2.3% number in Bergen County. I’m not sure how they came up with that.
I’ve seen houses listed for quite a bit less than their 2006 prices and what banks are willing to let go at auction is significantly less.
I have a feeling from my quick look that the homes that are being sold are more expensive and that’s skewing the numbers. It’s not that the median house price hasn’t fallen, it’s that lower priced homes aren’t selling. The article seems to confirm that.
Anyone with MLS access able to do some more digging?
“The Danish central bank said Monday it has taken over the country’s eighth largest bank after it was hit by the subprime housing crisis.”
http://www.cnbc.com/id/26388395
Wasn’t CNBC pumping the decoupling theory a few months back?
I think we’re going to see a lot of bank mergers coming up so that there are only like 12 big banks left in the world. That way the news won’t sound so bad when the headline reads “Only 2 banks failed in 2009”.
forgot to add the :)
4…..how can you tell….you shills all sound the same.
Marisol Perez :2
Her situation, while tragic, is not truly a housing problem. It’s more of a social problem.
“When Perez and her fiancé bought in Dover two years ago, foreclosure was the furthest thing from their minds. They put down $4,000 on a $245,000 home and took out two fixed-rate loans, one at 7 percent interest, the other at 9 percent.”
When you need 2 loans to buy a POS, when you can only put $4K down (less than 2%)….you probably should be renting. Who convinced this family that buying at these terms was the social norm?
And then her “fiance” leaves her with 3 kids? Where’s that social norm??
And now a new loan with a 40 year term!?!?!?! She’ll pay $500K in interest alone! And she’ll be underwater forever. Lady…can you find Nemo down there??
“Who convinced this family that buying at these terms was the social norm?”
That was the social norm. That was the banking norm. It was incredibly stupid but it was normal to be incredibly stupid on both sides.
She’s saving money in interest overall though but I’m not sure if the payment included the escrow payments or not. I posted more about this foreclosures story earlier today.
$4,000 is more like something you would put down when buying a car.
Perez-
“Then Perez said she and her fiancé broke up, he insisting she buy out his portion of the house”
His “Portion” was half of thier down payment…$2K. What a Family Guy!! Leave your woman and 3 kids (were they all his kids?) and demand $2K.
No 40 year loan will save you money over a 30 year loan. She won’t start chipping away at principal for the first 10 years.
“$4,000 is more like something you would put down when buying a car.”
With some of the deals lenders were making to get people to keep buying houses as things started to slow, $4,000 down isn’t so bad. Some people walked away from the closing with a few grand extra in their pockets.
“No 40 year loan will save you money over a 30 year loan.”
It will since they also cut the interest rate in half from 10% to 5%.
Yeah, but if you can only put down 4k, as someone already pointed out, you lack the dicipline to save, thus not making you financially ready or responsible enough to buy a house
Uh oh. Looks like Friday’s rally fueled by the potential Korean buyout of Lehman Brother is about to be reversed. It appears they don’t think Lehman is worth it.
Frank? Didn’t you say on Friday that nothing is wrong with the economy since Lehman found more funding?
Dolt!
Existing home sales report at 10am.
“$4,000 is more like something you would put down when buying a car.”
IRA.
Indiana Sues Countrywide Over Lending Practices. The investigation found that “homeowners were misled when they were told one thing about their loans while signing contracts that indicated other terms,” the release said.
http://www.cnbc.com/id/26386015
Assuming she could afford it, does Ms Perez have a law suit?
tbw,
You’d think that was obvious, but all the execs from ivy league schools at the big banks didn’t see how stupid it was to lend money to people that couldn’t pay it back indefinately.
Sure you drive up housing prices and rake in tons of money in fees, interest and through foreclosures. But they took it way too far.
Hoboken comp killer Mls 80004076
Date Book Page Price
Purchased: 09/06/05 7684 52 $1,125,000
2406sq feet.
Sold this week $1,045,000.
$80,000 loss, 3 years later
Cut the crap. What you’re trying to say and do is gloat over the misfortune of others. Like I said, you have no intention of buying a house, but want to “flip the bird” at sellers and realtors. I suggest that you find another form of “entertainment”
<I/gary Says:
August 25th, 2008 at 7:31 am
Clotpoll, Sybarite,
From the last thread… thank you! Thank you for having the insight to realize exactly what I’m trying to say through my perverse writing.
#11 Rich In NNJ
Interesting to note that the top of the bubble was 2007.
Pure anecdote, no fact or substance. I have noticed that in the past two months, the towns I am watching, have added very little inventory. There was a huge surge at the start of the year into May. Since the end of July, there has been very few new listing and the numbers on the market, are steadily dropping. I think many people realized what happened, listed the property, now that they haven’t sold, the listings are expiring and not being renewed.
#28 Tom: Do you have any additional details on this foreclosure.
#762470 Sale Date 08/15/08 265 Monroe Avenue River Edge $100 (sold back to the bank) Sovereign Bank C/O The Servicer.
Sold in Aougust of 2005 for 500K. The former owners were trying to sell it for 449K.
#31 PGC: I have been trying to determine when the top of the bubble actually was. I have seen it lsited anywhere from late 2005, into early 2006. I thought 2007 was post bubble.
#1
Poconos people, cry me a river. You should have thought of that before moving there. Why would you buy a place knowing you would spend 5 hours a more a day commuting.
Is a mcmansion worth the wear and tear on your bodies and the lost time with your kids? What values are you teaching your children?
you would have been better off in Charlotte or Austin.
Either stop whining or seek alternatives.
this board talk about savings, savings, and savings every day. here is the role model for savings: after working in U.S. senate for over 30 years, his net worth is only $150K. what a loser!
http://papastraighttalk.blogspot.com/2008/08/joe-bidens-net-worth.html
From CNNMoney.com
Houses in sub-prime shape lead house charge down…
http://tinyurl.com/632fso
What’s scary is, there are several houses I’ve seen in sub-prime shape that are asking for top dollar with the owners feeling perfectly justified.
1) It’s on the side of a mountain.
2) 3/4ths of the yard (if you want to call it that) is the driveway.
3) You have to pay a mandatory monthly fee of a few hundred bucks because it’s in a Country Club community (whatever the f*ck that means)
4) Notice where the 20″ TV is stuffed into a corner because there’s no place to put one.
5) I’m not sure if you can get a bed into one of the so-called bedrooms.
I have a half dozen other things you would love but don’t have the notes with me in work. The realtor had to explain numerous things in detail why certain things were skewed and how they can be “easily” fixed. You know, like knocking out whole walls and such (sarcasm off). This one is “priced to move fast” according to the realtor. It all looks pretty in the pictures, doesn’t it?
http://www.realtor.com/realestate/ramsey-nj-07446-1101710057/
#34 barien: i ahd a family member that comuted form the Poconos 15 years ago. 110 miles each way to Water St in lower Manhattan. @ buses at night, the 5:30, or the 7:15. Bad weatehr was spent living at th in laws.
One winter he must of spent tmost of the time during th week at his in laws. He did if for 10 years. Eventually moved back to NJ.
3b,
You can view the foreclosure info that I have.
Judgment was $416,761.48
There also seems to be an irs lien of around $16k.
There’s a typo in the bank name, should be Sovereign Bank. The judgment was awarded on 2/21/2007.
That’s about all I know. If you’re interested in purchasing it you have to find out who the contact person is at Soverign for their REO dept.
#33 3b
Don’t forget that “Real Estate is Local” and so is the bubble. I think nationally, 2005 was the high, BC i think held out until 2007.
#39 Tom: The judgement wa awarded in Feb of 2007, and th epeople just moved out at the begining of this August? does that make sense?
Do you know how I would go about trying to find the contact person at Sovereign?
Why McCain should be distancing himself from Phil Gramm:
Treasury for Dummies
As a director of Swiss banking giant UBS AG, Phil Gramm, a former U.S. senator from Texas, oversaw careless lending activities that culminated in a massive $43 billion in writedowns on U.S. subprime loans — so far, the biggest hit any European bank has taken in the collapse of the U.S. housing bubble. And on August 8, U.S. federal authorities extracted an agreement from UBS to repurchase $19 billion worth of so-called auction-rate securities.
Like subprimes, these are loans with interest that “resets” at higher rates over time — a feature often not disclosed or properly explained to buyers.
This interesting take on corporate governance is something of a family affair. Wendy Gramm, former head of the Commodities Futures Trading Commission and wife of the former powerful senator, had a long stint on the board of Enron Corp. as it drifted toward an iceberg field (and has since paid back some of her director’s fees to settle a class-action lawsuit).
In the U.S. Senate, Gramm was the prime cheerleader for the fiscally ruinous “supply-side economics” policies by which Ronald Reagan and George H.W. Bush bequeathed a record-sized federal deficit to Bill Clinton.
None of which would hold much interest for us save that Gramm, who recently said Americans are merely imagining the poor economic conditions afflicting the country, is John McCain’s most influential economic adviser and a long-time close friend. And while he formally quit the McCain campaign last month after burping out his views on the psychosomatic downturn, Gramm is heavily favoured as treasury secretary in a McCain administration.
http://www.thestar.com/Business/article/484802
Grimm unmod 42:)
#40 Understood.
#38 3b
I commuted to NYC for 5 years from metropark and metuchen. My last day before I moved to Australia I was planning on making a speech on the train about being the luckiest man on the face of the earth since I would no longer have to take the NE corridor. Unfortunately the gods ruined my plan by having that big blackout the day before. Took me hours to get home. And my speech was cancelled.
Can anyone with MLS access for Monmouth County tell me what happened to the listing on Monument Street in Freehold? It was on the market for awhile, but now it is gone. I am curious if it is UC or Sold or Withdrawn?
Thanks
Long article, follow the link.
It’s more than Fannie and Freddie
http://www.frontlinethoughts.com/
A few weeks ago when I was in Maine, I met Chris Whalen. Chris is the managing director of a service called Institutional Risk Analytics, whose primary business is analyzing the health of banks and financial institutions.
What they have done is come up with various metrics which compare how well-capitalized a bank is, how much risk it is taking, and what kind of losses (or profits) it can expect. It is a one of a kind firm, and the data gives Chris a very special perspective on the US banking system.
And what he sees is not pretty. There is a crisis brewing. He expects 100 banks to fail between now and July of 2009. Most of them will be small, but there will be a few large banks. The total assets of those banks he estimates to be $850 billion (not a typo!). Those are the assets the FDIC is going to have to cover when they take over the banks….
The FDIC has about $50 billion. These reserves have been built up over the years from deposit insurance paid by banks that are part of the program. They are going to need an estimated $20 billion just to cover the failure of Indy Mac. The FDIC will have to cover only a small percentage of the $850 billion, as some of those assets will surely be good.
But if they have to cover 10%, then the FDIC would need another $50 billion. Does that sound like a lot? Chris thinks a more conservative number for planning purposes would be 20-25% potential losses, and you hope it does not get there…..
Sober-minded analysis from the IMF suggests that the total write-offs by all banks may be $1 trillion. Dr. Nouriel Roubini is much more alarmed and puts the potential losses at closer to $2 trillion. That means that banks over time are going to have to increase their loan loss provisions, hitting both earnings and capital. And that means they will have to raise more investment capital and equity at a time when their stock prices are low.
It is a vicious spiral. Banks have less capital, so they are able to lend less to the very businesses that need the money; and without said money the businesses will be less capable of paying their current loans, which means that banks have less capital. Rinse and repeat.
CAN YOU SAY DEFLATION??? such a spiral is a perfect example of deflation triggered and driven by credit contraction. This is essentially what caused the “Great Depression” of the 30’s. A freezing of the credit system.
Kettle1 (46): “It’s more than Fannie and Freddie”
This is exactly how I see it breaking down as well.
I am truly surprised that the entire system is holding up as well as it has. If we have a cold winter driving up energy costs. Oh my!
Therapist helping builders copping with markets
http://www.ajc.com/business/content/business/stories/2008/08/25/builders_therapists.html
Tony Soprano!
3b,
“The judgement wa awarded in Feb of 2007, and th epeople just moved out at the begining of this August? does that make sense?”
Makes perfect sense. Until the foreclosure auction the owners are under no obligation to move out. In fact, in NJ the buyer at the auction can not take possession of the property until the 10 day redemption period is over. If the previous owner hasn’t left, you would have to go to court to evict them.
That they left in the beginning of August might indicate that there was a cash for keys deal where the bank gave them money to move out.
“Do you know how I would go about trying to find the contact person at Sovereign?”
Call them up and ask for the REO dept. Most REO’s in NJ are listed in MLS so you could also check to see if it’s listed.
I turned on Good Morning America this morning, and an ODrama surrogate explained why Hillary was not considered by making the comment “ODrama will need Hillary in the Senate”. To me, that sounded a lot like “We can’t promote Judy to a manager postion because we need her to remain as a secretary and answer the phone.”
#49 Tom: Thanks.
#9 gary
I went to an open house last year that was a contractor rebuild. The place was gorgeous. The guy had taken an old cape on 2 acres on a main road out of town. He kept the footprint, but built it out to commercial grade so that he could market it as a home office or doctors office if needed. It had beautiful landscaping and done so well, that the disabled access was not noticeable. The problem was that he was looking $600K. He bought for $250 and put in about $100K. My pricing put the place at about $450-480.
When I started discussing this with the realtor over the next few days she came out with the line, “maybe I can show you something more suited to your price range”.
This is the one comment that really sets me off. It shows how much out of touch she was. My reply back to here was that is was that the asking price was in my price range, but that did not mean that the property was worth it’s asking price.
I learnt many years ago to never make assumptions on peoples wealth or lack of. There are many millionaires driving around in a sub $30K/10yo car and many paupers with a car lease and bling on Layaway.
kettle1,
“It’s more than Fannie and Freddie”
I’ve said this before and I’ll say it again. Last year Fannie and Freddie bought a hole bunch or bad debt from other banks. We’ve seen charts showing just how bad the debt was.
They couldn’t buy all of it but I think it was an attempt to delay the problems at other banks hoping that some miracle would happen. One of the attempts is dropping the discount rate down to 2.25 from 5.75 a year ago. Mortgage rates haven’t fallen accordingly.
Kettle 46
That’s exactly what will happen if the Fed’s and Washington don’t interfere.
And we all know they will. My monrey is that Ben and Co will continue to print securities and exchange them through the window for treasuries which it will print.
Print treasuries until our AAA ratings goes through the window and then dollars from all over the world hit the FX and whalla hyper inflation.
Ben, a student of the Great sdepression will not allow for the credits markets to stop at any cost.
Just look at how he’s been handling things so far. Print, Print, Print.
From MarketWatch:
U.S. July inventory of existing homes at record high
U.S. July existing home sales rise 3.1% to 5.0 million pace
U.S. existing home sales down 13.2% in past year
BI:
For someone who doesn’t like flip-floppers, you seem to be one yourself.
First you complain that O is an elitist cause he made so much cash off of his book. Now you point out that his veep is piss poor so not fit to lead.
Make up your mind. Oh wait, one can’t make up their mind if one’s mind does not exist in the first place!
And nice job last Friday with your ultra-accurate political reporting on who O was going to choose for veep.
The only thing that you appear to be consistent with is being wrong.
I hope you had a nice weekend.
37#, stu, find out where i said this.
as a matter of fact, i think this is one of his greatest acchivements in his life.
the funny thing is many of his supporters even cannot name one or two of his achievements when asked on TV.
>First you complain that O is an elitist cause he made so much cash off of his book
“U.S. July existing home sales rise 3.1% to 5.0 million pace”
Any minute now, I expect Frank and BI to call a bottom in housing ;)
All I know is Oh Bama! is for big govt and raising taxes. Two things I severely oppose. Socalized healthcare too. I can’t vote for that.
The residents and commuters of northeast Pennsylvania are hurting. We are not able to afford the rising cost of the bus fare to New York on a daily basis.
Does no one care about the residents in the area? We are hurting. We need help
The moral of the story is that “there is no such thing as a free lunch”.
You wanted a new construction McMansions for $275,000 but keep your NYC salary. Didn’t that sound too good to be true?
#53 PGC,
I take it you are not using that re agent? :)
I had an agent in Summit say to me “Perhaps you are not ready to buy”. Like her lame line was going to make me man up and put my family in financial stress. Told her I wasn’t ready to be a bagholder. Guess what, looks like the ask in Summit for the type of house we are interested in is down at least 20% since then. I’m hoping next year would put it at 30% to 35% off peak and the PITI would be about the same as renting.
From MarketWatch:
U.S. July existing home sales up 3.1%, inventories rise
Resales of U.S. single-family homes and condos rose 3.1% in July to a seasonally adjusted annual rate of 5.0 million, the National Association of Realtors reported Monday. Resales have sunk 13.2% in the past year. The gain was stronger than expected. Economists surveyed by MarketWatch expected sales to rise to 4.91 million. Despite the increase in sales, the inventory of unsold homes on the market rose 3.9% to 4.67 million, an 11.2 month supply at the current sales pace. The median sales prices fell 7.1% in the past year to $212,400.
“All I know is Oh Bama! is for big govt and raising taxes.”
And how is this not better than the current administration’s policies of big gov’t and lowering taxes other than the next generation will have to pay for it?
Gotta take baby steps in the right direction.
#62 barien: Yeah but if you rent there will meth labs next door, and kondom wrapprs on the street.
And you will not be able to make any family memories, and you won’t be able to paint the white walls a different color? Are you aware of all of this? (sarcams off)
And give me an ‘M’ achievement. As much as I respect that he crashed planes over Vietnam for our freedom, being locked up in a North Vietnamese prison camp and tortured for 6 years hardly makes one a foreign policy expert.
So besides finishing at the bottom of his class in the naval academy where he was only able to get in due to dad’s credentials and besides getting into the pilots seat also due to his dad’s credentials and after committing adultery and making lies after lies throughout his campaign, not to mention that all of his wealth comes from his wife who has the honorable distinction of being the queen of beer distribution due to a family inheritance, you will still pull the lever for this old coot who appears to make a senile Ronald R look like a memory master.
The similarities between our current buffoon in command and M are shocking. Can’t wait for 4 more years of the same BS. Costa Rica here I come!
tbw :46
Can you tell me the house number on Monument St?
Is it #21, which seems to have a long and sordid history of Expired and Unconditionally Withdrawn Listings over the last few years………..
And for those fooled by the Republican’s pledges of lower taxes. You better be making 400K or more a year cause otherwise you are screwed.
GWB doubled the deficit in 7 years. BC actually created a surplus. For all the talk of Dems and big government, the tale of the tape speaks otherwise. Stop believing the Republican propaganda and seek the facts for a change.
64#, 60#, under bush admin and democrat congress, government spending has been increased over 60% from 8 years ago. that is the problem next president should attack. but from mr.o’s economic plan, there is no sign for that. instead, there will be more spending projects such as universal healthcare. in last sunday’s chicago sun time, there was a very interesting article on how his top advisers and his wife tied together running such kind of stuff – this is prelude of future universal healthcare system.
“4: the number of houses Sen. John McCain’s campaign initially guessed that he owned (as opposed to his answer, “I can’t tell”). The actual number, according to news reports, is seven. Zero is the amount that Sen. Barack Obama paid for his garden, which The Times U.K. notes was sold for $625,000 to a political ally. The Senator reportedly paid $300,000 less than asking for his house. The next time I want to move, remind me to become a senator/presidential candidate first.”
http://www.inman.com/buyers-sellers/columnists/alisonrogers/real-estate-numbers
“Gotta take baby steps in the right direction.”
Having a D pres w/ a D congress is not a step in the right direction if your concern is the growth of government (think NJ on the national scale). It is the recipe for financial diaster. Think back to the years of W and an R congress, with The One we are going to get that type of nonsense times 4. Divided government is our only hope.
#65 3b
Don’t forget I’m “putting my life on hold”. And the “upfront costs for a rental are the same as buying with the 1.5 month deposit, first months rent, and commission, so you might as well buy.” So what if owning costs $1,500 a month more than renting.
Guess what? I’m on my second rental since we moved back and we have paid 1.5 weeks rent in total commission. First landlord split the commission, second one paid in full. Both rentals were at least 1k a month cheaper to rent than buy, not even factoring in time value of money and repairs.
You talk about universal healthcare as if it’s something akin to killing babies.
If implemented correctly, universal healthcare can be a good thing. From what I’ve seen most of the proposals seem to just be mandatory insurance enrollment for the uninsured.
If you think BC “created” a surplus you are more delusional that I give you credit for.
In football, when a running back intends to cut to the left, he often first fakes right. This move is designed to make the defense commit their resources in the wrong direction. It is my experience that markets often follow a similar path. Just prior to a major move in one direction, markets often make a sharp move in the opposite direction first. With respect to the dollar, gold, oil and other commodities, many on Wall Street have bought into the head fake, and will soon be watching in amazement as the runner sprints to the end zone.
Over the last few months, as the dollar rose more than 10% against a basket of other currencies, and as gold and oil sank to multi-month lows, many investors concluded that a threshold had been crossed, and that the bearish trend for the dollar and the bullish trends for commodities had finally come to an end. But rather than representing a sea change, these counter trend moves more likely signify that the established trends are about to kick it into a whole new gear. My take is that if you thought you had seen a bear market in the dollar and bull market in gold, oil, and other commodities, well, “you ain’t seen nothing yet”.
peter schiff’s newsletter. He really gets it.
All I know is that more and more of my paycheck goes for healthcare that is crappier and crappier. I used to have no copay, now I pay $20. My drugs used to be free, now they are $20 on average. And each year I am contributed more and more out of each pay check for worse and worse coverage. I’m at the point now where I just go to the clinic with the local Mexicans since the service is better and I don’t need an appointment. What a joke our health-care system has become. I’ll take universal health care in a heart beat.
I’d have to agree that one party rule leads to massive overspending.
#62 Barian
She was hard to shake off. When I told her we were under contract for a BC REO, she was straight into a pitch on how she used to work in the area, she has great contacts and we should really have talked to her before committing. If it does not go through she would have some new listings ready for us. It was like canceling AOL or a gym membership. She would not accept no. She smelt the down payment and the prospect of a sale.
Funny thing was that the listing expired and the builder listed it for rent. He was looking for $2500 which was at or about the market average. Using the 15yr return model, that put the value at $450K.
JBJB: “If you think BC “created” a surplus you are more delusional that I give you credit for.”
I like how you back up your posts with such clear facts.
I suppose years of taking Republicans at their word (also rarely backed by facts) have set the precedent for your line of thinking.
Shore Guy– care to elaborate where you’re looking at lake houses? are they in reasonable driving distance from NYC?
Can paulson and friends hold back the next implosion until after november???
Charting stressed banks
It is routine to weight the risk of a major bank defaulting by looking at the relevant CDS prices.
But here’s an alternative measure increasingly used by asset managers – the spread between the yield on Tier 1 paper and “lower” Tier 2 securities.
SEE CHART:
http://ftalphaville.ft.com/blog/2008/08/22/15308/charting-stressed-banks/
Make,
I’d have to agree with Schiff. Nothing’s changed over the course of the past month or so to justify the action in the dollar/commodities. Nothing. No new stability in the financial markets. No new major oil discovery/alternative energy developments. No new geopolitcal improvements (if anything they’ve gotten worse). Bunch of lemmings running off the cliff is all I can see.
Stuey
Why would I need to post anything to back up that claim? The idea that BC himslef created a surplus is so absurd it stands for itself (and I voted for him, twice). The fact is any particular pres has very little impact on macro economic events. BC had balanced budgets becuase he had an opposition party fighting him all the way, which is the way it should be.
#69 – most of us are more afraid of losing our current health insurance than we are of a “universal” plan. Remember, Obama’s plan is not “socialized”, it still involves insurance companies.
I’m at the point now where I just go to the clinic with the local Mexicans since the service is better and I don’t need an appointment. What a joke our health-care system has become. I’ll take universal health care in a heart beat.
Service is better at the Clinics?? Which one?
Universal healthcare cheaper and better? Where?
People from all over the world come here to cure themselves or undergo complex surgeries cause our hospitals(on the east side) are the best in the world.
We are the Benzes and the BMW of healthcare and just cause we produce some a Daewoo or two, we should change the whole system?
because my hard earned moneygets better medical services then the bum on welthfare we should have everyone get the same mediocre healthcare?
It’s like everything else in life the more you spend the better customer you are and better service you will receive.
We have Medicare and Medicaid to help poor people receive treatment and they can not be denied services in hospitals.
What more do they want for free?
I was in Barnes & Noble last Thursday, picked up Fleckenstein and Morris books. Anyway some realtor jerkoff is in the business section talking all manic on his cellphone “Well is Fannie fails it will only affect the shareholders…people will still be able to get mortgages…I tell my clients that you’ve been waiting for five years for a buyers market now you have one it’s time to pull the trigger…do you want to wait for them to raise interest rates, you are better off paying a higher purchase price than a point higher”. I should have bought him a copy of each book.
“I used to have no copay, now I pay $20. My drugs used to be free, now they are $20 on average.”
Wow, I can’t imagine how you manage to get by. The fact that you spend your day persuing a real estate blog in an effort to root out any anti-The One talk makes me think you aren’t doing to bad.
Fiddy Cents on the Dollar:
Yes, 21 Monument
make Money 55
So far it hasnt been up to bernanke. he can print all he wants. But unless the banks and companies are willing to extend credit then we have a depression.
bernanke cannot force banks and companies to extend credit and so far all they have done is hoard whatever cash they can acquire and lock down credit.
What we are seeing is a self propagating event. If the government had let things fall then they would have hit hard but they would have hit and been done. Instead no one trust the system and everyone is battening the hatches. It is a self fulfilling event. Business needs credit to cover costs or they fail and banks are cutting credit lines because borrowers may default.
All that is a distraction (if a very serious one) the core issue is that we built an empire (housing wealth) on an unsustainable base. Now that housing is going down there is no industry to take its place. We are consumers not producers (uh-oh). Add to that the atmospheric degree of leverage involved and berneke cannot win.
Bernanke faces a Pyrrhic victory. if he defeats deflation he will cause hyperinflation. Banks and businesses WILL NOT pass credit to borrows as they see a lose-lose choice in front of them. A smart business will hoard money and try to survive the tsunami.
That Charles Morris book “Trillion Dollar Meltdown” is a real eye-opener, isn’t it?? I don’t think he’s exaggerating either!!
I borrowed mine from the local library and had to return it….it was scarier than any Steven King novel.
#83 make money
Singapore is considered to have one of the best health care systems in the world. I think Taiwan’s healthcare is superior to the US as well. It only costs about $3 US for a copay in Taiwan. and you can be seen by a Dr trained at Harvard or Johns Hopkins.
Australia has a sever Dr. shortage which is why they are importing Dr’s from Russia and India. . The private hospitals are defintely superior to the public universal care ones. I think the low pay and amount of hours required casuse Aussies to find easier ways to make a buck.
Off of Ritholtz’s Blog, funny:
http://bigpicture.typepad.com/photos/uncategorized/2008/08/12/pawn_shop.gif
Stu: Universal healthcare…who do you think will be paying for it? Doctors arent working for free. Drug companies will still charge high prices for medication. Govt will only screw it up more. What has govt done right? Say goodbye to your paychecks
I am almost done with the Fleckenstein book, start the Morris one next.
85 – JBJB
“Wow, I can’t imagine how you manage to get by. The fact that you spend your day persuing a real estate blog in an effort to root out any anti-The One talk makes me think you aren’t doing to bad.”
Present facts and then we could be persuaded. This is a very juvenile way of presenting your argument.
As far as i can understand, the choices in front of us are – spend money in the U.S or spend money on wars. I would think that it would be easy to make a choice.
“Comparison of the Two Plans
If enacted, the Obama and McCain tax plans would have radically different effects on the distribution of tax burdens in the United States. The Obama tax plan would make the tax system significantly more progressive by providing large tax breaks to those at the bottom of the income scale and raising taxes significantly on upper-income earners. The McCain tax plan would make the tax system more regressive, even compared with a system in which the 2001–06 tax cuts are made permanent. It would do so by providing relatively little tax relief to those at the bottom of the income scale while providing huge tax cuts to households at the very top of the income distribution.”
http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2008/08/obamas-dueling-views-on-economy.html
tbw
21 Monument was Unconditionally Withdrawn on 8/19/08.
It’s been on the market since 12/2006 with 4 different realtors (starting with Foxtons, remember them?). Original price was $949K, last price was $849K. Taxes are said to be over $10K.
There’s only been 1 sale over $600K in Freehold Boro…ever. That was 15 Monument in July of 2003.
Criminals don’t even want the dollar:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20080822/wl_canada_afp/canadauseucrimemoney_080822212441
regarding Universal health care:
I am usually against government involvement in my life. However, i do believe in a government run central healthcare system that guarantees a basic minimum level of healthcare while still allowing private health plans to be purchased by private indiviuals (not companies).
The core issue is that there is an inherent conflict of interest in running healthcare as a for profit business that is responsible to outside share holders for profit margins.
A for profit business in in business only to make money , as much as possible, in the most efficient manner possible. This is an exact antithiem to what healthcare should be.
The point of healthcare should be to provide the best care possible within the resources available. This will not make anyone wealthy, but can be done in a manner which is self supporting.
89#, barien, do these countries have as many mexican illegals as we have here?
do these contries have as many inner city ghettos as we have in newark, chicago, detroit and etc.?
Having a D pres w/ a D congress is not a step in the right direction if your concern is the growth of government (think NJ on the national scale).
Although on a positive note, at least maybe it helps puts NJ on a more even competitive footing with the rest of the country (labor policies, greenhouse gas regulation etc.). Unfortunately, I think NJ’s policy decisions right now are not driven by what is best for NJ, but rather anti Bush Administration activism.
A Democratic administration on a national level might help NJ focus on its own problems since the easy, yet politically popular, strategy of attacking Bush will no longer be an option.
FDIC’s IndyMac Borrower Aid Is ‘Dangerous’ for Bonds
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601087&sid=arnIbjO.7i4g&refer=home
The Federal Deposit Insurance Corp.’s plan to have IndyMac Federal Bank FSB rework mortgages for troubled homeowners is “dangerous” for bondholders, according to Barclays Capital.
Investors in mortgage-backed securities may be worse off if enough loans default after they’re modified because recoveries may be lower as home prices decline, analyst Sharon Greenberg wrote yesterday in a report. Loan changes also cost bondholders by reducing borrower payments, their collateral or both.
95#, kettle, as a matter of fact, U.S. government currently DOES provide pretty good healthcare coverage for low-income and elderlies. they have very low copay in medicaid. even if you are illegal, you can still get assistance from hospitals. i don’t healthcare is a high priority economic issue at this juncation.
What’s a juncation?
Is that like a staycation in a trailer?
How can I Find a competent realtor in New Jersey when it seems none are left?
http://www.trulia.com/voices/Home_Buying/How_can_I_Find_a_competent_realtor_in_New_Jersey_w-54669–
Rent
The point I was trying to make is that what we have here in NJ is essentially single party rule which has led to massive corruption, taxation, and over spending to supporty an ever expanding welfare state at the expense of our productive tax base (both people and corporations). Not to mention a citizenry that is compliant as long as their handouts keep coming. This cycle can not be supported as the productive will leave but the welfare recipients wont. The downfall of NJ itself is not such a big deal (to most the US) but why on earth would you wanto to traslate this horrible model to the national level?
Seems that some people are having a hard time finding good RE agents in NJ.
Stu,
Sorry, I usually agree with you, however on the copay subject, they should not be free. You should have to pay to go to the doctor, the people with the extremely low copays are there for the sniffles, it is hard to make a plan work for all when there will be healthy people not using and sick people using all the time-or chronic doctor visitors- copays are a way of pay as you need. The healthy people are paying the insurance for the sick, and not using the services- if they can pay less and have higher co-pays it’s better. Nobody should get $5.00 copays for a doctor visit. The doctor should be $30.00 min. We pay $5.00 for a cup of coffee.
KL
#99 bi
“even if you are illegal, you can still get assistance from hospitals”
They do a great free taxi service to the local clinic.
Unless you require critical care, most hospitals will shunt people who can’t pay on.
#96 bi,
Australia has ghettoes.
Companies being forced to provide health benefits in the US are another reason jobs are being offshored and are manufacturing base is dwindling. The big 3 automakers have to spend at least $1,500 a car on benefits for employees and retirees. There is somethingg like 1 UAW worker for every 2.5 in retirement. Japanese automakers don’t have to deal with that.
If you add the cost ou you private health insurance to what you pay in taxes, you’ll discover you are paying more in taxes than people in comparable income brackets pay in Europe and Australia pay in taxes.
When I was working in Sydney I was making less there than in NYC, but because I didn’t have to pay for soc Security, Medicare, much lower cost of commuting, I had more in my pocket every paycheck than when I was working in NYC, plus the employer paiud another 15% of my gross pay into a retirement account for me.
The US is a bad combination of high taxes and low services.
HEHEHE Says:
August 25th, 2008 at 10:38 am
Make, I’d have to agree with Schiff. Nothing’s changed over the course of the past month or so to justify the action in the dollar/commodities. Nothing. No new stability in the financial markets. No new major oil discovery/alternative energy developments. No new geopolitcal improvements (if anything they’ve gotten worse). Bunch of lemmings running off the cliff is all I can see.
HEHEHE: You cannot compare apples and oranges. If you want to perform fundamental analysis, then your stated observations support your conclusion. However, you are referencing markets that are being run by technicians. As a result, what you should review are the behavior and conditions that the technicians are displaying, and not reference empirical analysis.
Chi,
Just saying the money flows out they all follow one another. The money flows in they all follow one another. In that aspect the technicals are all self-fulfilling. It’s that type of market right now. Seems like little investing going on but a whole lot of trading.
108 in mod Grim
Bi 99
medicare/medicade
Have seen the $$$$ liability that we are facing for these programs?!?!? the medicare medicade programs alone could bankrupt us. These programs were never meant to be universal healthcare or anything close to that.
110#, i agree that it may be better off to address currrent medicare/medicaid issue rather than adding another government run program called universal healthcare.
>Bi 99
medicare/medicade
Have seen the $$$$ liability that we are facing for these programs?!?!? the medicare medicade programs alone could bankrupt us. These programs were never meant to be universal healthcare or anything close to that.
109- HEHE
I would have to disagree on the commodities. We are beginning to see contraction on a global scale. Hence, demand for commodities has to drop.
I do not know enough about gold to comment. From what i have read, gold is an insurance policy and not an investment vehicle.
My dad’s a physician. I used to do billing for him. When you get a medicare or medicaid patient, you get paid like 10 cents on the dollar. You make virtually no money on them. The more we expand it, the less these programs can pay out, which means doctors must raise their prices even more. It’s a vicious cycle that’s gotten way out of control. Of course, everyone not on those two programs gets stiffed.
here is a question i have not seen asked in public….
Cuomo has fined the investment banks for fraudulently selling securities to investors. The fines amount to 1-2% of the values involved.
If i committed fraud i can be fined significantly more then 1% and WILL be going to jail. These banks should be forfeiting 100% of profits on the deals and the execs should be in court!!!!
When will someone in public have the balls to ask the question????
For that matter any bank that receives a government bailout should be forced to first cover the amount equal to the total bonuses paid out for the last 2-3 years. Oh i forgot, we privatize gains and socialize losses here in the free market USA
Kettle1…I was thinking the same exact thing about the penalty amounts. It’s like with Michael Milken. Two years served and he has an estimated net worth of around $2.1 billion as of 2007, he is ranked by Forbes magazine as the 458th richest person in the world.
Pennsylvania Gov. Ed Rendell was supposed to give “closing remarks” during this afternoon’s Shorenstein Center-sponsored panel discussion with all three Sunday show moderators — NBC’s Tom Brokaw, ABC’s George Stephanopoulous and CBS’s Bob Schieffer — but instead, he opened up a can of worms about bias in 2008 election coverage
“Ladies and gentleman, the coverage of Barack ODrama was embarrassing,” said Rendell, in the ballroom at Denver’s Brown Palace Hotel. “It was embarrassing.”
http://bitsblog.florack.us/?p=11136
On Healthcare,
Does anyone has any experience with MinuteClinic’s inside CVS stores in NJ. Here is the list of stores.
http://www.minuteclinic.com/en/USA/NJ/Clinics.aspx
Singapore is considered to have one of the best health care systems in the world. I think Taiwan’s healthcare is superior to the US as well. It only costs about $3 US for a copay in Taiwan. and you can be seen by a Dr trained at Harvard or Johns Hopkins.
Bairen
Source?
#116 bi,
This farce we call a presidential election is embarassing.
Candidates traveling around the world to make speeches, adulterers yapping about family values, everyone making promises yet no real plan on how to accomplish them. Whenever they are pressed give vagure responses nad show they are both equally clueless.
112 Vic,
Gold is a currency.
It’s “real” money.
That’s all.
Make: I can’t provide a source, but remember reading the same info Bairen provided. I have also read that a lot of middle class Americans fly to Asia for affordable major surgery. I’ve noticed that those that come to the states from overseas are usually part of the ruling class of their country.
#118 multiple sources.
Most recent one I saw was from Jim Rodgers saying that as well.
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/fortune/fortune_archive/2007/12/24/101935724/index.htm
Also personal anectdotes from people we knew who lived in US, Singapore, and Australia. All raved about how superior Singapore’s system was.
Want to fix health care here in the states….
TORT REFORM
not to worry folks…Oh Bama! will win because he:
* Is young/energetic and “hip”
* Good Looking
* Endorsed by Comedy Central
unfortunately, that is all voters care about in the end. Last election, neither candidate was charasmatic.
#118 make money
Also my wife is from Taiwan. Co pays are $100 NT, roughly $3 US. My wife’s friend went to Harvard Medical school, same friend’s sister and brother-in-law went to Johns Hopkins. All 3 told me Taiwan’s hospitals are loaded with Taiwanese who got MDS from IVY league schools or UK equivalent. My roommate in school was also from Taiwan. His sister got an MD from a big school in Paris.
Would you rather pay $3 to see someone who went to Harvard or whatever you are paying now to see a quack your HMO or managed care would force you to see?
I agree with Make re commodities/oil. Even with a global slowdown there’s still not enough oil for demand. And gold is money when people lose faith in the paper stuff otherwise governments wouldn’t prevent holding it when the paper stuff cans.
Yeah but don’t you get a caning for throwing your bubble gum on the ground in Singapore?
It’s starting to sound like a populist liberal echo chamber in here.
I don’t disagree that the marketers of the ARS got off easily with no criminal charges, but how does getting 100% reimbursement from the brokers for tens of thousands of mom and pop investors smack of ‘privatizing gains and socializing losses’?
Milken was the textbook political lynching of a financier – plain and simple. The charges he pled to were technical reporting violations to the SEC which he did not directly oversee but were the responsibility of underlings who reported to him. Hundreds of these forms (13Ds) are misfiled each year. For that he got real jail time and paid 600 million dollars. We got ‘America’s mayor’ (woo-hoo!) and the playbook for subsequent hypocritical cretins with eyes on the Presidency to use the AG/DA offices for their own ends by dredging up obscure laws and applying them to the financial sector (see Elliot Spitzer). Had Williams (his lead attorney) not died and the scumbag Giulliani threaten Milken’s family with indictment, Milken would have fought the charges and probably prevailed, a la Grasso.
Stu Says:
August 25th, 2008 at 11:42 am
Kettle1…I was thinking the same exact thing about the penalty amounts. It’s like with Michael Milken. Two years served and he has an estimated net worth of around $2.1 billion as of 2007, he is ranked by Forbes magazine as the 458th richest person in the world.
DJIA down 225 points.
Bairen{125}
Was that a John inpersonation post?
usuually, the poll will jump about 5 pts after favorable running mate announcement. but it went down 5 pts. seems a bad choice.
http://www.cnn.com/2008/POLITICS/08/24/election.2008.poll/index.html
leftwing 128…
you must be new here.
Me liberal????? you might want to google some of my posts. I am probably on half a dozen government watch lists for my comments on this blog!
the main principle i want to see implemented is responsibility for ones actions. You make bad decisions you go out of business. you commit fraud you get treated no different then joe schmoe on the street.
#130,
No. Just sounded like one. :)
All the Taiwanese I knew who went to school at Rutgers were shocked at how expensive US health care was, how lousy it was, and the amount of time you had to wait to get an appointment.
Future comp killer?
Hoboken: mls#80010218
listing price 519,000
under contract this week
purchased 2006
Date Book Page Price
07/31/06 7979 37 545000
JBJB – one party rule
Like we did really well w/ McGreevy as gov. (sarcasm)
Kettle
Been around for a few months, just started posting. Good board here.
Wholeheartedly agree with your call for personal responsibility. The way the thread was going though I was anticipating someone to stand up and start preaching about ‘crosses of gold’.
Also, I just noticed the irony in my handle – it’s hockey, not politics. Politically, I’m to the right of Attila the Hun fiscally and libertarian on social issues.
now i am making a bold prediction about the night of nov. 4th: at least 100 death no matter odrama wins or loses. riots in mjor cities such as chicago, LA and detroit.
Bairen,
My personal view on things is less gov’t works.
If it was up tyo me we would abolish Medicare and Medicaid all together.
We would keep who’s on now and stop enrollment.
You want healthcare services you should pay for them. Period. Watch competition drive down prices.
If I’m poor. I have to pay for a Mechanic to change my oil and fix my flat $100 but I don’t have to pay for a triple by pass surgery?
my view is to let the market decide.
kettle1 – penalties
Wall St doesn’t make huge % sums of bond deals. On a equity underwriting they’ll get about 6%, on a bond about 2%. So that 1-2% charge is a pretty big hit.
re: Fannie/Freddie bailout.
perhaps this has already been mentioned, but I read over the weekend that wiping out all equity has attendant problems due to the fact that many small banks and S&Ls hold a lot of Fannie/Freddie preferred. Wiping out this preferred would further damage these institutions capital ratios, which could put further stress on the FDIC. just one further example of the house of cards
Philly GTG?
Robert J. Shiller in Philadelphia Sept. 11
http://libwww.freelibrary.org/calendar/calbydate.c fm?type=2
better link here:
http://libwww.library.phila.gov/calsearch/calbydate.cfm?ID=19917
Now a big job is waiting for junior bush:
President George H.W. Bush spoke to the nation, denouncing “random terror and lawlessness”, summarizing his discussions with Mayor Bradley and Governor Wilson, and outlining the federal assistance he was making available to local authorities. Citing the “urgent need to restore order”, he warned that the “brutality of a mob” would not be tolerated, and he would “use whatever force is necessary”. He then turned to the Rodney King case and a more moderate tone, describing talking to his own grandchildren and pointing to the reaction of “good and decent policemen” as well as civil rights leaders. He said he had already directed the Justice Department to begin its own investigation, saying that “grand jury action is underway today” and that justice would prevail.[18]
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1992_Los_Angeles_riots
Left wing,
Welcome to the debacle that is NJREReport! it can be a very educational place, whether you agree with the view points or not.
I would say the blog regulars agree on fiscal responsibility in general, with many following yuor atilla then hun standard and a mixed view on social issues. By theh way i may have to borrow that line “I’m to the right of Attila the Hun fiscally and libertarian on social issues” enjoy! and dont be afraid to jump in.
Secondary Market Says:
August 25th, 2008 at 12:34 pm
Philly GTG?
Robert J. Shiller in Philadelphia Sept. 11
SM: every knows it’s spelled Chiller….
kettle1 Says:
August 25th, 2008 at 11:37 am
here is a question i have not seen asked in public…. Cuomo has fined the investment banks for fraudulently selling securities to investors. The fines amount to 1-2% of the values involved.
Stu Says:
August 25th, 2008 at 11:42 am
Kettle1…I was thinking the same exact thing about the penalty amounts.
So basically you advocate to pi$$ off some of the most important tax revenue generators (by exponential amounts) that are domiciled in Cuomo’s employer?
ChiFi
Everyone knows Chiller sucks now.
chiller is really a sucker if he wants to make extra bucks on 9/11.
kettle
thx. it’s been educational and entertaining so far…
Secondary Market Says:
August 25th, 2008 at 12:38 pm
better link here:
http://libwww.library.phila.gov/calsearch/calbydate.cfm?ID=19917
Gosh darn it….I need to be in Stamford at 9AM on Friday.
If you guys go, meet here….a place very near and dear to me….
http://www.rosetattoocafe.com/homepage.html
Secondary Market Says:
August 25th, 2008 at 12:38 pm
better link here:
library.phila.gov/calsearch/calbydate.cfm?ID=19917
Gosh darn it….I need to be in Stamford at 9AM on Friday.
If you guys go, meet here….a place very near and dear to me….
http://www.rosetattoocafe.com/homepage.html
Trulia’s New iPhone House Finder
House hunting? Forget the listing agents and classified ads. Now you can find homes for sale with a few taps on a smartphone.
Trulia, one of the Web’s most visited home listing sites, on Aug. 25 is introducing a tool available on Apple’s (AAPL) iPhone that can locate all the listings and open houses in a user’s vicinity.
The free software application uses navigation technology to summon data and displays the results on an interactive map. It lets users call up such information as price, photos, square footage, and number of bedrooms. Another tap of the screen sends a call or e-mail directly to the listing agent. “It’s all about convenience,” says Trulia CEO Pete Flint.
“These days, hammering a For Sale sign in the front yard of a home must feel a bit like driving a stake into the rotting corpse of a vampire; fear mixed with incredulity and the foggy notion that this unnatural gesture may not, in fact, work. ”
http://www.minyanville.com/articles/socionomics-fear-homes-unemployment/index/a/18655
on the Fannie/Freddie preferred issue, see below:
http://www.ft.com/cms/s/0/47938146-70ae-11dd-b514-0000779fd18c.html?nclick_check=1
Say, what exactly were Attila the Hun’s fiscal policies anyway. Conquest, confiscation, tribute, these are “right” fiscal principles?
Real nice fantasy Bi. Should probably talk to a psychologist about your violent thoughts.
Tom,
Did you do any analysis on
145 Heather Hill Road, Cresskill, NJ
The sales price went from 575K to 1.2M in under a year. Looks like there was a first for $931K.
I must be missing something.
If the median household income for Summit is 118k, how come the cheapest decent house for sale is listed at 339k? The median income with 20% down can barely afford the cheapest non tear down in Summit?
I think we still have a long ways to go in this bust.
Attn Bucks County residents/soon to be residents.
I’d like to take a drive down tomorrow to see it for myself. Can anyone suggest where to go or stay away from? I spoke to a friend yesterday who swears you can still buy a couple of acres and build inexpensively (compared to NY/NNJ). Any truth to that? Any help would be appreciated. Get my email from Grim if necessary.
Thanks!
I was just thinking that I can’t believe I have been on the sidelines for close to 4 years now. I have bidded on places in the past, but just gave up and decided to move into an apt in the city. Living in somewhat tight quarters with two young kids, but still doable. I in no way feel like I’ve held up my life waiting to buy a place, just living it differently than most homeowners. With Labor Day right around the corner, the selling season is done. So prices should soften further into the fall and set a base for next springs prices. With declining prices, softening employment, less credit availability and increasing resets on ARM’s to the peak of loan issuance it should make for another volatile mix in the real estate market next year. For those who have made the jump to homeownership, enjoy for many years. Make sure it’s a long term decision you are making. For those looking to sell, good luck, don’t be emotional about selling, take what the market gives you. If you plan on waiting it out to get 2005/6 prices, remember the real estate cycle is a very long cycle. We have only just past the peak. Looking forward to a good Labor Day weekend.
I would pay big bucks to get a recording of BI with a shrink!
#164
“With Labor Day right around the corner, the selling season is done. So prices should soften further into the fall and set a base for next springs prices. With declining prices, softening employment, less credit availability and increasing resets on ARM’s to the peak of loan issuance it should make for another volatile mix in the real estate market next year.”
Agree. We will be down 10% YoY by the end of this year. Expect to see at least that much down in 2009. If credit becomes even tighter due to problems with Fannie/Freddie, all bets are off. Could drop 20% in one year. Right now, there is absolutely nothing standing in the way of further major price drops.
cnn says O & M are in a dead heat. Sounds right since they are 2 sides of the same coin.
165- Stu
I think the shrink would pay you big bucks for referring Bi to him. All that he learned in textbooks built into one single package.
168 – that should be learnt – aaarrgghh!
“Right now, there is absolutely nothing standing in the way of further major price drops.”
– There is. ReInvestor X.
leftwing
Hey, I like this new guy. Welcome aboard!
Maybe you better throw a Left Winger into your handle. Elias? Sean Avery?
“To the right of Atilla the Hun”…..I like the cut of your jib!
Leftwing,
Can we rename you “10c Wings” in honor of the team from Detroit and the Housing Market there.
what is “Uncle Tom” meant?
DENVER (AP) – A black delegate for Hillary Rodham Clinton says she was called an “Uncle Tom” by Illinois Senate President Emil Jones, one of Barack Obama’s political mentors.
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D92PDQ0O0&show_article=1
Hoboken Preforeclosure Listing
http://www.forsalebyowner.com/listing/42BAD
DENVER (AP) – A black delegate for Hillary Rodham Clinton says she was called an “Uncle Tom” by Illinois Senate President Emil Jones, one of Barack Odrama’s political mentors.
http://www.breitbart.com/article.php?id=D92PDQ0O0&show_article=1
#164 hardplace:If you plan on waiting it out to get 2005/6 prices, remember the real estate cycle is a very long.
Yes it is. If the buyers want 2005/06 prices, and the real estate bust is anything like the last one, and I believe it is, only worse, than sellers, can get those 05/06 prices in 2015 or 16.
#83/85/91/96 Universal healthcare – living in France, I have to agree that the heathcare system here is vastly superior to what I hear all my friends and family tell me about in the US (including NYC). Many people living in the US can’t even imagine how well people live outside the US. Doctors live well and the government negotiates drugs costs with big pharma to control prices. I have to say also that I don’t agree with the gov’t bashing – the gov’t, which is you and me in a democracy, does a whole lot of things well – and all this tearing down of government is just anarchism by another name.
Still looking on the shore – agree that losts of listings are just coming off the market rather than being sold.
biden and media keep saying odrama was raised by a single mom. she was remarried in less than 2 years after separating with his birth father.
http://www.newsweek.com/id/155173
bi:
You never give up! Nobody really cares about your character assassinations. I suppose this is all that you can do since you can’t find anything substantial on either of them. Or perhaps, bi is short for Bidan and you are just having fun at our expense.
“…grim Says:
August 25th, 2008 at 7:00 am
From the Home News Tribune:
Drug industry jobs disappearing in N.J.
One of several people at the Dover unemployment office last week from the pharmaceutical industry, David Stern worked for a small company when layoffs hit a few months ago and a manager called him into an office.
“You get that sinking feeling,” Stern, 56, of Rockaway, said.
…
Some pharmaceutical and health care companies with ties to Morris County, such as Pfizer, Novartis and Wyeth, are among those that have announced planned work force reductions. It remains unclear how much impact will be felt in Morris County. But, based on notices sent to the state this year, Morris will lose hundreds of pharmaceutical and health care product jobs over the next few months….”
Commanderbobnj sez:
YEP !!—-Just like I have been saying for several years; NJ is steadily losing it’s LAST good-paying industry: –PHARMA–The obscene high taxes on ALL levels has finally got that good-paying industry to finally see the light and they is a’pullin’ up stakes and are a leav-ing’ !— Seems like that wonder-boy corzine and the rest of the democrat machine such as that bartender look-alike, cody just can’t do their job correctly and help keep our LAST legimate industry here…..When one is beholden to the NJ big boy super-unions and the wacko-environmentalist lobby (etc.),the public (middle class) get’s put-back once again on the back burner and SCREWED !!
The only difference this time around compared to times past is that those Ba$tards can’t really quite raise the taxes anymore on the state level for their ever increasing “entitlement” (welfare) programs. If they did it would be (finally) outright rebellion by the general public !…The poor municipal-saps get that privledge to raise the local property taxes for the BLOATED government schools and police costs on that local level;– This way the multi-billion dollar-sukking “poverty” cities can go about their usual subsidized-living costs paid for by the rest of the NJ taxpayers. The hundreds of thousands of guaranteed welfare votes can continue to (safely) go to the democrat machine in those districts. and ‘VOILA’ !—-democrat puppets forever in place !!!
Commanderbob
the Home News Tribune Commanderbob?
They are completely right wing fluff. Oh wait…wrong paper.
179#, tell me which sentance is qualified as “character assassinations”. i feel you have tendancy to throw out labels when you cannot win by arguments. i was simply pointing out media bias and some facts wich did not reported by major media. for example, i was first citing jone edwards story from national enquier many days before all msm.
Give me something substantial BI. One little thing that is actually newsworthy. We don’t care that he gave his brother the AIDS or that he eats breakfast for dinner and lunch for breakfast.
If you think BC “created” a surplus you are more delusional that I give you credit for.
Those pesky facts getting in the way of your deeply-held beliefs…
Dead Banks Walking?
http://www.minyanville.com/articles/fnm-fre-MER-LEH-ms-bac/index/a/18657
“If you think BC “created” a surplus you are more delusional that I give you credit for.”
And how do you explain GWB’s spending the last 4 years?
re 181
bye appears to be incapable of contributing anything of value to the discussion regardless of the subject.
[179]
The fact that pharma is leaving is really half the story. But since most NJ voters think innovative drugs should be free there is no sense in bellyaching.
The worse part of the story is that NJ was set up perfectly to be a hub for biotech R&D and manufacturing, but alas this ship has sailed as no one in their right mind would bring a new business to NJ. It’s much easier to convince the highly trained pharma employees to move to Boston, San Diego, or RTP. Instead we got the moronic stem cell initiative which was nothing more than a political boondoggle, props to the electorate for sniffing that one out.
That is why I don’t get that incessant whining about Bush 300 miles away in DC when the gang 50 miles away in Trenton has had a much more deleterious effect on their personal livelihood and standard of living. Yet they the sheeple go right back to elect the same incompetents.
I just figured out how much a two income family of four needs to bring home a month to pay 339k for a house with 20% down. I’m gussing at least 140k
Which would put you in the top 60% of household income to buy the cheapest livable house in Summit. These prices are irrational. I wish Gary was here to explain this to me.
#188 That’s 140k a year gross.
“And how do you explain GWB’s spending the last 4 years?”
W has the same nagging problem that many liberals have – he thinks governments can actually help people despite two centuries of data indicating the opposite.
#184 – HEHEHE – Great link, thanks.
Board’s not as busy without BC Bob, Nom, Clot, and njpatitent.
NJpatient is like Kobe Bryant. Can put up 50 anytime he feels like it.
We can all stop worrying now. Go buy aouse and run up the credit cars. Nothing to see here.
/sarcasm off
Fischer is a former vice chairman of Citigroup Inc. and an official with the International Monetary Fund. As a professor at the Massachusetts Institute of Technology, he advised now-Fed Chairman Ben S. Bernanke on his doctoral thesis in the 1970s.
Bernanke said yesterday in the symposium’s opening speech that “the financial storm that reached gale force” last year “has not yet subsided, and its effects on the broader economy are becoming apparent in the form of softening economic activity and rising unemployment.” Jean-Claude Trichet, president of the European Central Bank, said today in a comment from the audience that “we still are in a market correction.”
The financial crisis has revealed ways to “to listen better and filter warnings better in the future,” Fischer said. The turmoil was “widely expected,” he said, citing economists including Nouriel Roubini, a former Treasury official known for his bearish views. “Nouriel was only off actually by a year and a half or so,” Fischer said.
While the crisis may be the worst since the Great Depression, “in real terms we’re not looking at anything exceptional,” he said. “We’re not even looking at anything very serious relative to recessions of the past.”
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601068&sid=akIdXrxrSB2c&refer=economy
HEHEHE – Hoboken preforeclosure
Any idea what the $/sqft was at the peak for this type of unit? Only asking was back in the day bid on some places, but got blocked out of Hoboken.
skep-tic, (Fannie & Freddie),
The current loan environment is the new paradigm. Banks have to rebuild and preserve there capital base. Loose money for several years caused the runup in prices, tighter money will cause the decline in prices. We are just in the first year and a half of tight money.
From the Star Ledger:
Seems a Franklin Borough family had their house burn down and under the new COAH rules that is considered a demolition, which COAH assumes takes an affordable housing unit off the market, and thus means the family must pay a fee of 2.5% of assessed value on rebuilding.
http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2008/08/legislator_says_affordable_hou.html
The fee is technically payable by the municipality which they are passing on to the homeowner. Any data on how other towns have handled the fees to COAH for demolitions?
I’m trying to get a view on how low new housing starts may go in our town (it’s built out so you basically need to knock down). Between cost inflation on the materials and fees and surcharges like these the costs of building a new house is actually rising year over year while the value of the existing stock continues to decline. Would seem new building would come to near halt as this spread continues to widen, no?
3b –
Yes it is. If the buyers want 2005/06 prices, and the real estate bust is anything like the last one, and I believe it is, only worse, than sellers, can get those 05/06 prices in 2015 or 16.
When/if we ever get back to those price in 2015/2016 that is probably only nominal prices and not real “inflation adjusted” prices.
#196
Hard Place– I don’t disagree, but how long do you think the tight money paradigm will last? Bankers seem to have pretty short memories.
#198 Of course!! And quite frankly, I think 2015/16 is wildly optimistic.
bairen, crapboxes…
I just figured out how much a two income family of four needs to bring home a month to pay 339k for a house with 20% down. I’m gussing at least 140k
Which would put you in the top 60% of household income to buy the cheapest livable house in Summit.
I make a decent living along with my wife’s combined income, but not outstanding. We should be able to afford a decent house in a town like Summit. There is no way I should buy the prementioned crapbox in your example. That is why I rent. They only way you get me to buy a crapbox, is if I was paying more in rent for one.
#200 3b,
I think it’s too optimistic also. I’m leaning more towards 2020, especially if the decline goes on till 2010 or 2011. I thought it normally takes about a decade from the trough to reach the previous peak?
Re: Summit:
1. Can you really find a SFH for under $350k there?
2. what is the median household income for Summit?
Re 195,
Right now they are still listing most places at $550-500 a sq ft in Hoboken which personally I think is a frigging pipe dream, especially the stuff on the back side.
That place is listed around $390 which is about $50 sq ft more what me and my ex paid for our last place back in 2003.
skeptic,
Let’s use the S&L crisis as an example. That was a fairly bad financial situation. It happened in 1990-91. A bit of a WAG, but I think RE lending was fairly tight until ’96-98, than they let anyone through the door after ’02.
All indicators are pointing to a situation, just as, if not worse than the S&L crisis. I did a paper on the S&L crisis in college. This to me looks worse. What I wonder is will there be some sacrificial lamb, who they will send to jail to quell the crazed public. I feel sorry for that guy/gal.
3b Of course!! And quite frankly, I think 2015/16 is wildly optimistic
I knew you were drinking some Kool-Aid…
#201 Hard Place
That’s why we are renting also.
I guess you and me are “putting our lives on hold” “throwing money away on rent” “living in squalor”
My squalor has granite, stainless appliances, Italian tiles in the bathrooms. And is $1,500 a month less then buying a pos that smells like mold and sits in the shadow of a transformer or has the train running through the backyard.
#202 barien: Just for point of reference, I purchased my first house at the peak in 1987, sold it 10 years later for $2500 less that I paid for it, and that of course did not include improvements.
Regarding our already “socialized” medical programs, it’s a big crock. They’ve already been privaticed in part.
If you have a retired parent or relative that you helped with their paperwork, you’ll know that medicare is administered by third party insurers that sometimes deny claims that otherwise should be approved. Defending medicare claims is a popular niche for some attorneys. I believe the same is true for medicaid.
Just like the medicare prescription drug plans that are administered more openly by insurers.
Even if you are someone else that can’t pay, there are plenty for profit companies that any nitwit can start that help match patients with programs to pay off medical bills and take a bit off for them.
The problem I see with healthcare is that there are too many people trying to get in the money stream to grab their share before it reaches the medical professionals. Even when it comes to the “socialized” medical programs. Just how so many different people grab a slice of mortgages originated through large banks.
These people only have their own financial interest at heart. Which is fine, but it increases the cost of these programs. In the case of something like medicare, it’s not a free system. The elderly pay monthly premiums, even if it’s just a deduction from their SS check, which is also not free money.
What we need to do is cut off a lot of the people feeding on the health care money streams and the costs of healthcare can go down and doctors won’t complain about how little they actually see.
3b, this bubble was far bigger than the one you bought into.
#203 skep-tic
1. Here’s 1 http://www.realtor.com/search/listingdetail.aspx?ctid=89707&mxp=26&bd=4&typ=7&sid=0dc9175772f04b95bfa6f6cc2a2dcf51&lid=1101028231&lsn=2&srcnt=2#Detail
2. realtor.com claims 117k is median household income.
skeptic –
Ques 1 – No, they are all crap.
Ques 2 – $106,666 median.
http://realestate.nytimes.com/Community/profiles/Union-Summit.asp
I should be able to afford a median house in Summit. I can’t because it’s overpriced.
207#, realistically, you should avoid “high scale” town such as summit if you are buying your first home. why? because you will be paying high eductional premium for other families who have school age kids. just my opinion.
bairen –
1. Here’s 1
Hmmmm…
That’s actually not too bad. I’ve been ignoring anything with less than 2 baths so never picked this up in my screen.
Won’t be moving, but if I was looking for a place w/ 1.5 baths that would peak my interest. It’s definitely less than my rent.
this median income/home price debate have been popped up on this board from time to time. if you bought it in summit 20 years ago you don’t need 100K to live there but i would suggest you find some where else to reduce your pos cape mentality if you make under $200K a year.
#210 Tom: Yes it was,and back then you had to qualify for a mtg, including in msot cases a 20% down pymt. If you could noto sell, you toughed it out;simple as that.
We were not a bunch of cry babies like these clowns screaming today, that they need help. There was no help for us;we survived.
#208 3b,
I was in college during the last bust. I wound up unloading trucks for a year when I graduated. Most of my friends wound up with nothing or working at the mall, no matter what their degree was. That expereince made me conservative fiscally (my wife says cheap)
I think this time may be worse. Like buying a condo at the peak at the last bust. My parents had a neighbor that bought a townhouse in 87, took till 2001 before the same townhouse was back to what he paid for it. My parents bought the same model in 92 at 40% off the peak and it dropped another 10% before bottoming.
HEHEHE Says:
August 25th, 2008 at 3:36 pm
Re 195, Right now they are still listing most places at $550-500 a sq ft in Hoboken which personally I think is a frigging pipe dream, especially the stuff on the back side.
That place is listed around $390 which is about $50 sq ft more what me and my ex paid for our last place back in 2003.
He: Looking at prices is a little deceiving back there. My wife and I were poking around there in 2001/02 when they were reconfiguring H-G from a rental building to condos. This time was concurrent with the whole 101 Marshall/SkycLUB mess underwritten by Sandy Weiss before he sold out to Toll. Basically you had the strip mall on Newark with the Dunkin’ Donuts and a bunch of empty lots dirt lots being used for parking. EVERY ONE OF THOSE LOTS IS NOW CONDOS. In addition, 700 Grove didn’t exist, all the stuff on Jackson was under construction and 789 Marin/Zephyr was an empty skeleton…..we knew the neighborhood would build out to it, but it wasn’t worth the wait. Now you actually have that completed construction, so the comparison of a 2003 H-G purchase is not the same as 2008 H-G with different environs….
the analogy to the S&L crisis is interesting because, as I understand it, the current crisis from mortgages similarly sprung from the fact that mortgages (like S&Ls in the 1980s) were mostly regulated at the state level, which is to say it was mostly a free-for-all.
I have to think that a nationalization of Fannie/Freddie, when it comes, will be accompanied by a wholesale federal takeover of the regulation of mortgage lending. It seems to me that this would create uncertainty in the near term, resulting in tighter credit beyond that which is already resulting from balance sheet issues, but in the longer run, it may create a more clear cut and less risky lending environment than the one we are currently experiencing.
If, for example, new federal mortgage regs approximate the securities laws, there might be a more reliable, standard apparatus for assessing the creditworthiness of borrowers that could reduce transaction costs and bring down the cost of credit overall.
#214 Hard Place,
It looks nice, a bit small. I think that house is in walking distance of the train and downtown as well.
#217 barien: In my town one bedroom coops that were selling for 125k at the peak could be had for 25k.
I know a lot of people that for various reasons had to sell, such as job relocation, and they were selling condos for 50 to 60% off peak prices.
In our case we tried to sell, and had we accepted the best price we could have gotten at the time, we would have been looking at a 35% decline.
We decided not to, and bite the bullet and stayed.
#221 3b
ironically, this time it is different. since many buyers put zero down they can do things like buy and bail, or simply stop paying the mortgage and live for a year with no payments before getting kicked out.
Chi,
So are you saying it’s more or less of a discount? I live back there now and I agree with you there’s many more new buildings but there’s still no amenities other than a couple dry cleaners unless you count that J&D Provisions dump. They still haven’t opened a restaurant or deli in that Sky Club.
Tom hit it on the head. There are so many people grabbing the money in the healthcare system along the way that it only leads to higher prices.
On a side note: I know of at least 5 cases in Monmouth County where the doctors purposely keep the patient longer than necessary and do a lot of unnecessary tests. They end up taking in around 600k in additional money each year and they get away with it. If I were you, I wouldn’t have your babies delivered at certain hospitals in the Lakewood/Toms River area, if you catch my drift.
Side note: they have developed an ugly habit of not saving babies with their incompetent staff.
on the median income issue, I’ve noticed that even the wealthiest towns in the tri-state area rarely have median household income above $150,000. If you use the 3X rule, then median house prices in the top towns should be no more than $450k. However, I think 4X is more realistic for this area, because as Pretorious used to argue, people will pay more for proximity to high paying jobs and the “sea of wealth.” So while I agree that median income and median house price should roughly line up, I do think prices in certain towns might remain slightly out of reach of the median income family (if you are being conservative with your finances).
I went to a condo a few weeks ago. It was about 350 square feet. It was “priced to sell” at 225k.
make (75)-
Schiff had better get it. If he doesn’t, I’m toast. :)
“Resales of U.S. single-family homes and condos rose 3.1% in July to a seasonally adjusted annual rate of 5.0 million”
So let me get this right, homes sold at 5 million annual rate and we have a problem?
This is a good as it gets in my opinion.
Sales dropped 13.2% in past year. Where’s the problem? I would think the sales would be at 0 annual rate by reading this blog.
bairen – yeah, a bit smaller than i would like and it looks to be a fairly busy street. Buyer paid 325k in 2/05. So going by the market it should be sold at slightly under 300k.
One of the main reasons we’re returning to NJ is for the medical care. There may be better ways to finance health care, I’ll leave that to the policy experts, but from the perspective of improving your chances of surviving a life threatening illness, the U.S. has the European socalized systems beat. In the UK you will probably die from cancer before you get to see an oncologist. Many cancer drugs available in the U.S. are not available under the national run systems in Europe. German doctors view patients as profit centers and try to maximize billable procedures without regard to healing. You can get a dozen referals without a diagnosis as long as new tests can be run. Then there’s the dirty little secret of systems where the government rations health care: older people are “allowed” to die. In France they still talk about the summer of 2003 when it is estimated 15,000 died of heat related causes and they couldn’t get the doctors to come back from their August vacations. Europeans essentially have a two class health insurance system that gives preferential treatment to privately insured patients at the expense of those under national health care. In theory single payer health care sounds good but I suspect it is impossible to implement in practice without sacrificing efficiency and doctor-patient relationships. Sorry for the rambling post.
bi – logic
this median income/home price debate have been popped up on this board from time to time. if you bought it in summit 20 years ago you don’t need 100K to live there but i would suggest you find some where else to reduce your pos cape mentality if you make under $200K a year.
Logic would say that if I make a median income, I should be able to afford a median home. If that is not the case one thing has to be wrong. Either houses are overpriced or I am underpaid. Knowing that I’m going into my bosses office and demand a raise…
Oh wait, I forgot… you don’t use logic.
#229 Hard Place,
I think that house used was listed at 369k in the Spring. Could be wrong. There’s a lot of that type of house in Summit.
If we’re still in NJ when prices go back to 2001/2 I’ll get a lot more interested. I refuse to stretch to pay for a house. Would rather rent and be able to have cable TV, pizza night, take a vacation then sitting in the housing eating PB&J sandwiches, ramen, and buying dented cans. But hey, at least we would own in Summit!!
#222 barien:or simply stop paying the mortgage and live for a year with no payments before getting kicked out.
Yep!! What a recket!!
Parents refrigerator saga updated:
It’s a GE that’s 4 years old. Turns out the computer motherboard went. The service contract covered it. They got the part, the repair person didn’t know what he was doing and installed it incorrectly. They now have to wait for the repair person who does know what he’s doing to see them on Friday. This is how many weeks without a refrigerator? 2 or 3 I believe. Excellent. I love GE.
skeptic – So while I agree that median income and median house price should roughly line up, I do think prices in certain towns might remain slightly out of reach of the median income family (if you are being conservative with your finances).
I agree for now because some have overleveraged to get what they want, thus making the price to income ratio quite high. If and it’s a big if, the employment scenario changes, I would strongly disagree. I’m putting my money on the latter. That’s why I rent.
#231 Hard Place,
How about logic says on median income you should be able to afford at least a starter home, but you can’t unless you are single or a dink. If you’re on median income and go from a dink to having a Clayton or Nastia congratulations, you are now an FB. You will slowly go broke.
bairen,
I think a good strategy would be to rent a house you like. If the owner wants to sell in this market, chances are they’ll come to you first and might be more willing to negotiate.
If they need to sell, you could possibly negotiate a sweet short sale with the bank.
If you’re renting from someone that purchased during the bubble, I’d keep an eye out for foreclosure activity on the property from time to time just in case.
#228 frank: If being in denial works for you frank, who are we to say otherwise. But forget about getting your 2005 price any time soon.
That is not happening, deny everything else if you need to in order to cope, but plan on staying where you are for a looooong, loooong,loooong time.
#228 frank,
Did you notice the part about how rapidly inventory expanded and how much prices fell?
#239,
Who cares about inventory? Homes are still selling and prices are not dropping much around NYC.
Hard Place– I don’t think it’s only overlevering that caused the median income /median price decoupling. I think it’s also changing demographics. Many of the high income towns have older than average median ages. A significant percentage of the families in these towns bought houses when the single income household was the norm. I think these households distort the income to price relationship’s relevance to more recent buyers.
#240 Frank,
Do you work for the Clinton hedge funds?
older homeowners also bought in an environment where many of their other costs were lower (e.g., corporate pensions were more likely, college and healthcare were cheaper, cheaper energy and food, etc). so again, I think the presence of large numbers of these households diminishes the relevance of the relationship.
bi (142)-
“now i am making a bold prediction about the night of nov. 4th:…”
Grim, I now think you can truly claim to have a fully-formed online community here. You’ve got one of everything…including an idiot savant.
#240 frank:and prices are not dropping much around NYC.
Whatever you say frank, but kiss your 2005 purchase price good by.
#230, I think the generalizations on the “European” system are not accurate. I think the idea that the deaths in France were due to doctors not coming back from vacation is also grossly oversimplified.
Bradley Beach house – any info on MLS 20807850? Couldn’t find it on the OPRS site either.
Many thanks.
what a joke!
Senator Steven Oroho, a member of the Senate Budget and Appropriations Committee issued the following statement after learning that the Ferraro family of Franklin, Sussex County, must pay thousands of dollars in “affordable housing” fees before they can rebuild their home after a tragic fire:
“Only the Trenton Democrats would come up with a scheme for ‘affordable’ housing that makes it more expensive for a family to rebuild a home after a fire. This is not a redevelopment or a demolition; the Ferraro family is simply trying to rebuild their lives after a fire destroyed their home and killed their dog.
“Apparently, the new regulations permit restoration work on the Ferraro’s home to be classified as a demolition, triggering a required affordable housing fee. The new regulations state that, ‘[D]demolitions are a source of secondary housing demand, as they eliminate housing opportunities for low- and moderate-income households.’ (5:93-2.9 Demolitions)
“These new rules have confused and burdened communities throughout the state with absurd requirements and tens of billions of dollars in unfunded mandates. It’s no wonder that badly needed economic development projects have been stopped dead in their tracks. Now an anguished family apparently will have to pay the government thousands of dollars to recover from a terrible tragedy. This absurd and cruel practice must be stopped.
“The house wasn’t vacant and the house wasn’t demolished. The house burned to the ground. This was an act of God. I hope that the intent of the affordable housing law wasn’t to punish those who suffered a tragedy. Sadly, these regulations were drafted in such a manner to do exactly that.
“Legislators should immediately overturn these ill-conceived and onerous rules. New Jersey can pass affordable housing laws that actually make housing more affordable, not more expensive.”
http://www.senatenj.com/index.php/oroho/oroho-new-coah-regs-burn-family-rebuilding-after-fire/929
Lostinny,
We recently moved to Bucks Co. from NNJ. We are currently in Yardley (Lower Makefield) and it’s very nice. Quiet, green, out of the way but not remote.
Bucks County is pretty big, so I’m not exactly sure where inside you want to be.
In the eastern area, Yardley (Lower Makefield), Newtown, Doylestown, and New Hope are all great places to be. Yardley and Newtown are NJ commutable with big caveats.
You can get my email from grim if you want to talk more.
244#, only this time, i wish my prediction will not come true.
It caused about 50 death in 1992 LA roits. 100 death will not be an over estimation if some un-predicatable things happens.
but i hope:
1) law inforcement agencies should be prepared for such kind of thing happens;
2) media should not keep hyping the significance of “first black president” so that some communities will not be overly excited/disappointed;
3) clinton supports should make their minds on supporting mccane or odrama before the end of september to avoid be labeld as “white conspiracy” in case Odrama loses the election.
“Do you work for the Clinton hedge funds?” No
“Whatever you say frank, but kiss your 2005 purchase price good by.”
Homes are selling for 2005 + 10% in my town.
skep-tic,
A lot of the higher income people you’re talking about also paid more in relation to their income than they should have under starndard price to income ratios for the area from what I’ve seen.
Many of those were basing decisions on their incomes that were supported by the bubble economy. As their incomes drop, they’re hitting hard times. Not just those in the banking and RE industries. A lot of companies saw an increase in revenues due to the bubble. Some of these people are facing foreclosure now. I was just talking to a friend the other day about her sister who lost her home to foreclosure after she lsot her job as a mortgage processor. I see RE agents, doctors, restauranteurs, small business owners’ homes being scheduled for foreclosure on a regular basis. These were people that were making a lot of money but didn’t recognize their money was based on an inflated economy.
As the recession worsens we’ll see more.
DL 230,
If its healthcare you want go to boston. My son was born in boston recently and we have unfortunately used the services of some local hospitals ( NNJ) recently.
The boston area hospitals have significantly better service and apparently better educated medical staff. I dont mean where they got their degree, but whether they are up on the latest info and procedures. Boston is also WAY ahead in medical acre being a jpint venture between a patient and the doctor, not just the doctor ordering things willy nilly ( NON emergency case)
Tom 237
i looked into foreclosure law regarding renters in NJ. NJ law requires banks to honor the rental contract IN FULL. So a foreclosure is generally a non-event for renters except for not having are-new option at the end of the lease.
Note, i am not an attorney this is not legal advice.
well, ultimately, almost everyone purchases a house expecting the economy will continue to function at a healthy level. I don’t think people who had good jobs who purchased houses that they could reasonably afford were shortsighted because they expected they would continue to be employed.
I am simply commenting on the fact that that there was a major demographic shift over the last 20-30 yrs or so that had, I think, permanent relevance in terms of pricing residential RE. I think it makes sense to back out households who purchased prior to this shift taking place when assessing how affordable/unaffordable housing is relative to income.
#250 Frank:Homes are selling for 2005 + 10% in my town.
Do you live in Brigadoon too!! There is only one (Westfield).
I will simply say that you are delusional, I do not think that there is any where in the NYC metro area where prices are selling for 10% more than 2005. (save for some Manhahtan trophy properties, perhaps)
But if it helps you feel better, whatever you say.
regarding the 2.5X income rule for mortgages.
My understanding is that the 2.5-3X annual income was what banks have historically found to be a “safe” mortgage level. Assuming that this is the case, then saying a town should be 3.5-4X is simply saying that a bank should be willing to take a higher risk or charge a higher risk premium for such a mortgage.
NNJ healthcare,
I will never set foot in another NJ hospital again, unless it is an emergency situation. I was an hour away from having a neurosurgeon drill into my skull at St. Barnabas because they were convinced I was having an aneurysm, before I received a second opinion from a doctor at Columbia Presbyterian in NYC. He said “Don’t let them drill!!!”. Doctors at teaching hospitals see so much more than regular doctors that for unique situations, definitely have them give you a second opinion. I won’t go into the details, but I ended up being absolutely fine w/ a month of bedrest to let my body do the healing. I was back to work after 2 months.
Daddyo
Thank you. I will drop you a note.
Clot{227}
I can’t believe me and you after all are on the same financial boat. Which means we see the next 5 or 6 years the same way.
I have everything riding on this one.
“Assuming that this is the case, then saying a town should be 3.5-4X is simply saying that a bank should be willing to take a higher risk or charge a higher risk premium for such a mortgage.”
two points on this. first, it is easier to afford a higher multiple as your income goes up (other relatively fixed costs such as food, energy, etc become a lower percentage of your income). We live in a high income area, so generally, buyers should be more able to afford a higher multiple.
Second, the median price to median income ratio may be high even though the majority of current buyers pay a reasonable multiple. This can happen if you assume incomes of recent buyers have been more in line with higher prices (and there are significant numbers of lower income relics who bought when prices were fundamentally lower).
Frank,
What town? I have a bridge to sell the recent buyers of those homes!
I view the US healthcare situation as market failure. The employer-based insurance system is going away, yet the market has not provided an alternative to it. I’d hate to see the government meddle, but government healthcare is better than none at all for the day when my employer decides that it’s no longer in the business of providing health insurance for rank and file employees.
HUD Secratary Steve Preston doesn’t see housing rebounding before 2009.
beachbum :246
218 Evergreen ave, bradley beach
Expired 04/28/08 after only 60 days on market, missed most of the selling season. I wonder what happened to take it off market????
skep-tic,
Generally, the more money you make, the less of a multiple you pay. At least that’s what’s been going on based on this chart.
Probably how higher income groups were able to build their wealth and not just spend it all on housing and hummers (the car or the alley activity, take your pick).
Low and medium income groups started deviating from the norm while the higher income brackets actually dropped their ratio.
I think what we’re seeing is people not understanding their own financial position and spending too much money on housing and it’s going to bite them eventually.
Frank, maybe you can call Steve Preston and tell him about those houses in your neighborhood, maybe it might give him a smile to know there is a magical oasis in this desert.
No idea – but the crazy thing is the asking price – 950,000. Looks like uninhabited. Saw on Trulia a foreclosure for 600,417 (but I’m not subscribed) on the second block of Evergreen. Can’t tell if it is the same house.
Clotpoll Says:
August 25th, 2008 at 4:31 pm
Grim, I now think you can truly claim to have a fully-formed online community here. You’ve got one of everything…including an idiot savant.
Time to shut it down…..
beach-
You saw on the Tax Records that Cohen is an absentee owner from Brooklyn, right?
Agent notes in listing say “Make me an offer” and then it expires in 60 days.
That close to the ocean, there are some Million Dollar homes along there.
Looks like Corzine will be bailing to join Obama’s cabinet, per FOX.
Fiddy, wasn’t able to get into the tax records – I’ll look it up again. There’s also a house on Trulia for 949K three blks from the ocean, completely redone with a renta
Oops, a rental apt in the back (312 5th). These prices do seem to go all over the place in this area.
#265
Tom– that chart is interesting (would be curious to know what the underlying date is). Still, you must note that your chart shows the ratio of price to income rising substantially across all income groups in recent years. Part of this was unsustainable (esp among the lower income group), but I am not convinced that all of the multiple expansion was unjustified. The income gains of the very top have accelerated in recent years and many of this group live in our area. I think a certain subset of the population increasingly tends to move to a few cities in search of the highest paying jobs (NYC area being one of these centers). I am not saying this trend justifies the entire multuple expansion, but perhaps some of it was justified.
beach-
A lot of it depends on the distance to the ocean. Each successive block further away there’s a subsequent drop in price.
And a big factor is condition. Most of these homes are 60 – 80 years old. What kind of upgrades have been done. Craftsman or Wood Butchers?? Or will it need all new capital items at your expense?
This particular one has got me curious. There were 2 other expired listings starting May ’07 (bad timing) for $1.05M.
Why don’t you cold call the old listing agent and get a story?? Richard Simonsen 732-237-5596. These guys are always eager to tell the tale.
Good idea – thanks. Is there any way to see if this is the one in foreclosure on Realty Trac?
skep-tic,
“Still, you must note that your chart shows the ratio of price to income rising substantially across all income groups in recent years.”
It absolutely does not. The high income group actually dipped and then returned to the normal level.
The chart is from a 2005 HUD housing affordability report.
There aren’t very many of the very rich. Mostly people who consider themselves upper middle class who are paying more for housing than they should.
I’ve talked to a few people that are buying houses now. Good credit, good finances but they’re looking to save on the small discounts now because they couldn’t buy during the bubble. So buying a 600k house at 4 times their income is much better than buying the same house for 700k a couple of years ago.
It’s very bad to spend that much money on something that might not return a profit if you want to continue to build your wealth.
Not unless you’re a subscriber.
Looking at the mortgage history, it doesn’t appear to be over-levered. I think ol’ Morris Cohen from Brooklyn just decided to sell (about 6 months too late).
If you call the agent, please post the results of your conversation.
No problem. Thanks for the input.
Tom– there aren’t many of the very rich nationally, but locally (and esp in certain towns), they are the majority. Also, I looked at your chart again, and there is a clear trend of multiple expansion (at least from the point of the cycle low) across all income groups.
Regardless, my point remains that there were fundamental reasons for people to pay more to live in proximity to the areas, such as ours, that would give them access to greater long term opportunity. There was certainly an abundance of optimism in this regard, but it does not seem to me that it was totally unjustified.
Clot:
‘idiot savant.’
A savant is good at something.
“Also, I looked at your chart again, and there is a clear trend of multiple expansion (at least from the point of the cycle low) across all income groups.”
uhm, maybe you’re not looking at the right chart. Let me post the link again. The price to income ratio for the high income groups actually fell between 1999-2001 and then in 2003 went back to normal. Normal being around just over 1.0 compared to the middle and high income groups that have significantly higher ratios.
Are you mixing up the middle income groups with the high income groups. A lot of people in the middle class seem to do the same.
#248 Daddyo, do you have kids in the Pensbury district? if so what is your opinions on the schools?
I’m jealous of all those that bought in 1987 and apparently did ok!
I paid $132,000 in 1987 and sold for $92,000 in 1999…my wife and I had our own “depression” those years…..
define ‘inexpensive’
there definitely is a ton of land out here. i should be more specific – newtown and washington crossing. however, in our search, we are avoiding houses that might be too close to a main road … 20 years from now if the area expands (as it did in the DC suburb i grew up in). I know that’s silly to think about because we might not live in the same house for 20 years … but who knows.
so far, i really like bucks. i obviously miss NYC, but we completely ruled out NJ due to the tax situation. it’s such a joke. you can get the same house in Bucks County for cheaper, and half the taxes.
we’re renting a 3/2.5 right now for 1700 a month, which is cheaper than what we paid in nyc. also, it’s 1900 sq ft compared to about 800 in nyc.
# 1 “The bus fare was recently increased to $500 for one month’s commuter ride.”
And someone the other day was saying that $700 a month for an easy commute on the ferry from Highlands to Manhattan was a bit pricy.
#283 And like me and so many others, you were not crying asking for a hand out.
284 Laughing
Friend (who may be grossly misinformed) said he found info where one an buy 2 acres for 70K then build on it. I don’t know where in Bucks he was talking about. I just got off the phone with a cousin who used to live in Doylestown and she doesn’t know where the non-built up areas are. She thought maybe in Upper Bucks.
I think you’re right to think about possible expansion and congestion. No one thought about that where I live and now the congestion is just out of control.
What part of Bucks are you in?
Confused (270)-
“Looks like Corzine will be bailing to join Obama’s cabinet, per FOX.”
Great. Now he can butt-pirate the entire US.
wamu has a big bond maturing tonight 8-25-08> should be interesting. most companies do the bankruptcy right before.
Define “much”
And have you missed all of Rich in NJ’s zillion comp killers? You’re hopeless, man.
folks it is mediam income of home buyers not all people who live in a town. adding in homeless, mentally retarded, unemployed and welfare moms makes your income seem high next to mediam. but it should be times the average college educated midcareer persons salary not the trader joe check out people.
Re: Bi, Frank
These types stick around because people acknowledge their presence. Starve them, and they go away.
Links? proof? What town?
you’re a fraud
NJ Douchebag Report
1. Bi
2. Frank
3. Reinvestor X
Frank (250),
What town is that?
Rich
re: Pennsbury School district
One thing i did (we dont have kids yet) is look at the # of students in 9-12, just to get an idea of how many kids are going to be in each classroom.
Yardley HS – 9-12, 3800 students.
I went to a massive HS in VA, and had 600 people in my graduating class. at Yardley, that’s about 900 kids per class. Based on those #’s, some of the kids will be shoved into classes with over 30 students. I’m not keen on that.
The council rock schools (mostly for folks who live in newtown) were split to North and South a few years back, and have many fewer students.
(Is this sad that I’m looking at this at least 15 years before our kids enter HS? You’re damn right.)
I’ve sort of inquired about expansion and possible congestion, but some folks keep talking about how the land ‘can’t’ be built on because it is owned by the County.
We can officially begin our search in earnest after Labor day – the in-laws aren’t going to do the in-law suite, which is all we were waiting for – so I will find out more about what this means.
As for 70k for two acres … i got no idea where that is, but i’d be interested to hear more, for sure
Can we keep BI around? I need him for stock picking. REtard and Frank, they can be disposed of or ignored as they lack any value whatsoever.
If he would stick to retarded stock picks, that’d be one thing. But the constant political propaganda is tiresome and is leading to my “pg dn” key getting worn out.
Bairen, #138
All the Taiwanese I knew who went to school at Rutgers were shocked at how expensive US health care was, how lousy it was, and the amount of time you had to wait to get an appointment.
Is this a fair statement? I stopped going to Hurtado Health Center because the service was poor, the staff was mean & unsympathetic, the costs were high, and the experience was a general misery. I’d go home on the weekend to see my general practitioner, who loved his work so much he kept weekend hours.
#270 Confused In NJ
Will he fair better than Christine Todd Whitman. What moron takes the EPA job from a president with so many ties to the Saudis and big oil.
Yes. Whitman, like so many other GWB appointees quit due to disagreement with the bozo in chief. Worst president ever. Made Carter even look OK.
My husband and I are looking to buy in Morris county, specifically in Hanover or Florham Park. We already sold our home in Rutherford, and are a bit worried now that we might overpay considering home prices are still falling.
We found a nice home in Hanover – 4 bed / 2.5 baths – about .5 acre on a dead end street. Schools are good, property is listed at 610K, and the condition is pretty good overall – we wouldn’t have to change/replace anything right away. Would 570K be an appropriate amount to offer?
And either way, if we can swing it or ride out this horrible economy right now – does it matter. We are not looking for a home to sell in a few years, but rather a permanent place to move and have our kids grow up.
Every morning as people wake up and make the commute to work,