From the Star Ledger:
Study: N.J. wealthy flourishing, gap between rich and poor is largest since Great Depression
The rich really did get richer in New Jersey over the past 10 years, and the gulf between the wealthiest and poorest residents is the widest it’s been since the Great Depression, a new study has found.
And as most New Jerseyans were hit hard during a decade that ended in recession — with hundreds of thousands out of work, take-home pay sapped and lifestyles curbed for the poor and middle class — the bad times barely touched the wealthiest Garden Staters, the Legal Services of New Jersey study concluded.
In its first in-depth look at the widening gap between the haves and have-nots, the group’s Poverty Research Institute found:
• New Jersey’s top 20 percent saw their average income rise by 22 percent from 2000 to 2009;
• Those earning less than $34,300 — about 3 million people — took home even smaller average paychecks by decade’s end;
• The top 1 percent — the 75,000 New Jerseyans earning at least $570,000 — accounted for more than a quarter of the new wealth generated in the state during the decade;
• Most of those in the middle didn’t share in the gains, and households led by women and minorities lost ground on both ends of the economic spectrum.
“As the middle class shrinks and the number of people living in poverty or near-poverty increases, their chance of climbing the ladder of economic success is likely to diminish,” the report concludes. “That, in turn, increases the likelihood that not only they but their children in the future will have diminished lives.”
…
The report found that more than three-quarters of all the new income generated in New Jersey during the decade was earned by the top 20 percent: households earning $132,000 and more. Drop down a few brackets and the picture is different: Families earning $53,231 to $85,500 took home only 11 percent of the decade’s new income.
From the WSJ:
How Forgiveness Fits in Housing-Fix Toolkit
Policy makers are wrestling with a dilemma about the overhang of mortgage debt from the housing bust: to forgive or not to forgive?
With prices down by one-third from their 2006 peak, more than 11 million homeowners are underwater, or owe more than their homes are worth. That is about 24% of all homeowners with a mortgage, according to data firm CoreLogic.
The massive debt overhang—totaling almost $700 billion—is troubling not only because it leaves homeowners more exposed to foreclosure, which further erodes property values. It also weighs on the economy, making homeowners less likely to spruce up their properties and unable to tap equity to start businesses or pay for things like college tuition.
Housing demand also suffers. Without equity, young families are less likely to trade up to bigger places while empty-nesters may be unable to downsize. Perversely, in some of the hardest-hit markets, home prices appear to be stabilizing because there aren’t enough homes for sale—in part because so many homeowners are frozen in place.
…
That is reviving calls for policy makers to embrace principal forgiveness. One problem is deciding who deserves help and who doesn’t—and who will absorb the losses: taxpayers or mortgage investors. Often the two are the same because taxpayer-supported entities like Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac back about 60% of all mortgages.
Economists are split. “There’s no question that in many cases, [principal forgiveness] is the only way to assure people will stay in the house,” says Kenneth Rosen of the University of California, Berkeley.
Others say what really matters to borrowers is an affordable monthly payment. “If people have a huge debt burden but the mortgage is not the problem, why are we reducing the mortgage?” asks Thomas Lawler, an independent housing economist in Leesburg, Va.
Say what you want, but SOMEONE is getting mortgages. I have not yet run into a competing offer that is cash, like mine is. It is very tough to bid with cash against someone who is bidding with a mortgage, because they are bidding a monthly payment. Price increases to them are only a few dollars more/month. Very tough to bid against when you are assessing (or trying to assess) “real” value.
Yes, but either way it’s still cash at closing to the seller. Your offer is only as strong as someone qualified enough to get a mortgage … and no more. I’ve actually seen a situation where the seller wouldn’t negotiate on price due to the fact that the buyer was coming in all cash, “if he has the cash to pay X, he can afford to pay asking,” so go figure. The property subsequently sold for less.
That said, bid price has been the important number for every buyer I’ve ever worked with, never heard anyone talk (or think) about it in terms of monthly payment.
Tenafly Comp Killer
10 Richard St, Tenafly NJ
Country club area, 0.25 acres
Custom-designed colonial, built 2008
5 br, 4 1/2 baths, 4,200 sqft
NJMLS #1102204
Purchase price: $1,435,000 (1/2008)
Original list price: $1,548,000
Last list price: $1,195,000
Sale price: $1,050,000 (7/25/2012)
Days on market: 512
Tax assessment: $1,101,200 (2011)
Still better to be rich than poor in NJ – Shocker!
Breaking News: Still better to *not* be a multiple amputee in NJ.
Nom – from a couple days ago, been bothering me. So you pay off the note, own your house in the Brig free and clear, rent it out, and *only* receive $2k/month free cash flow? So Rent – Taxes – (Maintenance + Repairs) = $2K? I would have thought more with 100% equity.
As a contingency plan, we had our broker run a list of rental comps in the Brig. There are surprisingly few rentals here for houses in our size and the rents are far higher than I expected.
I know being a landlord sucks, but I can see about 2k per month free cash flow if we paid off the note and became landlords.
[7] Wait a minute, maybe $2k positive cash flow on your tax return, wink, wink, nudge, nudge?
[7] expat,
My taxes are just over 13K. Assuming I can get $3200-3500 per month (a fair figure based on what I’ve seen), taxes eat about $1125 of that per month and then you have to figure insurance, maint., repairs, etc. I’d say I’d be lucky to net $2K a month. Factoring in these considerations, and allowing for empty months, I think I’d be lucky to net half that.
[lead story]
I took CLEs at LSNJ and owe them a pro bono commitment. Haven’t seen their report but my first instinct is to wonder why a pro bono legal service organization is beating the rostrum about wealth inequality.
That’s before you consider the political bent of those working there. Generally nice people that make Obama look like W when it comes to their politics. They joked about having me as the token conservative. And they didn’t try to convert me, which I appreciated.
Interestingly, the oft-stated theme throughout the CLE series I took was “help your clients screw the creditors (banks, auto lenders, landlords, utilities, etc.). Okay, this isn’t a direct quote but it isn’t a departure when it comes to tone. In fact, I took to calling their offices in Edison, Sherwood Forest.
One nice thing was that they walked the walk for a nonprofit. True to their egalitarian nature, they didn’t charge for the CLEs; They ask only for a commitment to take a case and a $15 donation each meeting to cover morning continental breakfast and lunch, which was well worth the price.
Identical thought process for academia…..the term is “adverse selection” and though those who are sensitive will assume the term is a pejorative, there is no insult intended….it is an objective statement…..
Comrade Nom Deplume says:
July 29, 2012 at 10:15 pm
Haven’t seen their report but my first instinct is to wonder why a pro bono legal service organization is beating the rostrum about wealth inequality.
That’s before you consider the political bent of those working there.
Time for another episode of FabMax: (Faux/Delusional) Ad Hominem Attack…..
Alrighty then……so to all you Obamunists who just found the whole “Trayvon could be my son” quote so inspiring and Presidential……let us see our fair leader come forth with some unsolicited comments regarding this interesting current event….
http://www.nypost.com/p/news/local/manhattan/drunken_group_of_girls_stabs_year_Mxkmq3rBFRjefHQkYROvQP
[9] Nom – I’ve been out of the rental game (on the paying side) for a long time now, I figured rents were way higher now. Back in ’96-’97 us on North Shore LI and my best friend in Mamaroneck were both renting with our SO’s in 3BR houses with no kids and were paying near $3K back then in rent. I figured blue-ribbony houses now in the Tri-State area were well over $4500+ per month, especially after you stated you were (pleasantly?) surprised at the rents were in your area. I was actually renting my house from an attorney who relocated his family to Arizona in late ’96 but was having trouble selling his LI house before he left. Apparently his wife was making so much in the title insurance game that she was moving out there for greener pastures and he wasn’t even going to take the bar out there, he was just going to lay back and relax and figure out something else to do. I wonder how that worked out.
My taxes are just over 13K. Assuming I can get $3200-3500 per month (a fair figure based on what I’ve seen), taxes eat about $1125 of that per month and then you have to figure insurance, maint., repairs, etc. I’d say I’d be lucky to net $2K a month. Factoring in these considerations, and allowing for empty months, I think I’d be lucky to net half that.
[12] chi,
I can safely predict that you will get called a racist before tomorrow is out.
[13] expat,
I’ve seen rents as high as $4800 for s 4 bed in the brig but the average is around 3500.
[13] Nom – rents (cont’d) – Going by Zillow(can’t think of what else to use for quick estimates) I guess you’re right, $3200-$3500 looks to be the sweet spot on your house. Interestingly I looked up my old rental in Centerport, NY and the rent estimate is only $2900, but my friend’s old rental in Mamaroneck has a rent estimate of $4200. My old rental has a sale estimate of $440K, my friends old rental is at $600K. I guess rents are funny.
Nom – Hopefully you go under contract, but if you do rent here’s something you might work into the lease like my attorney landlord did – stipulate that a particular landscaper maintain the property at the renter’s expense. When I my landlord requested that, I asked how much it ran per month, he said something like $150-$175 which I thought was a bargain because it was a big, well maintained yard with lots of landscaping and I didn’t want to do it. Might help you separate the wheat from the chaff.
Dollar is coming home
Until about four months ago, JKMilne Asset Management invested at least half the money in its global fund outside the U.S. No more. With Europe’s debt crisis intensifying, the Fort Meyers, Florida-based firm with $1.8 billion under management has all its money in dollars.
“It’s been a winning strategy,” John Milne, chief executive officer, said July 26 in a telephone interview. “Given the magnitude of the problem, there was the realization that there was a contagion possibility.”
Milne has plenty of company. U.S. investors repatriated $48.9 billion from December to May, the first time they brought assets home during a six-month stretch since the period following the failure of Lehman Brothers Holdings Inc. in 2008, according to Treasury Department data compiled by Bloomberg. The flows are among the biggest since 1999, after the collapse of hedge fund Long-Term Capital Management LP boosted the dollar as funds retreated from all but the world’s safest assets.
IntercontinentalExchange Inc.’s Dollar Index has risen 3.1 percent this year as investors moved cash into funds that focus on U.S. bonds. Inflows more than doubled to $157 billion in the first six months from $65 billion during the same period a year earlier, while international bond investments were unchanged, according to TrimTabs Investment Research.
Fleeing Asia
This year, dollar gains are being fueled by money coming home from all over the world.
The majority of selling by funds in the five months ended May 31 had been assets of Asian countries, as traders exited bets that saw the Bloomberg-JPMorgan Asian Currency Index gain 19 percent from March 2009 through August 2011. The gauge, which measures the dollar’s performance against major Asian currencies excluding the yen, has since slipped more than 4 percent.
U.S. investors dumped $15.8 billion in assets from Asia this year, according to Treasury data.
“The period when there was heavy diversification into foreign markets between 2005 and 2007 and then after 2009, those flows were to Asia so that’s why we’re getting the most repatriation from there,” Derek Halpenny, European head of currency research at Bank of Tokyo-Mitsubishi in London, said in a July 24 interview.
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2012-07-29/dollar-repatriation-first-since-lehman-evokes-post-ltcm-rally.html
From HousingWire:
Rental vacancies at lowest rate since 2002
The national residential rental vacancy rate in the second quarter was at 8.6% from 8.8% in the first quarter, the lowest second quarter reading since 2002, the Department of Commerce Census Bureau reported on Friday.
While the diminishing supply is bad news for the multitudes of former homeowners now looking to rent.
The asking rent for the quarter was at $716, slightly cheaper than the first quarter’s $721 but above 2Q 2011’s $684.
While homeowners may face higher rent given the diminishing vacancy rate, Capital Economics said in a statement that the below-trend-level vacancy rate of single-family rental homes is “likely to come as welcome news to the growing number of institutional investors who are building portfolios of single-family rental properties.”
According to the Commerce Department, the rental vacancy rate was the lowest in the Northeast at 6.7%, and highest in the South at 11%.
From the Real Deal:
Listings down, but ‘shadow inventory’ looms
Though many home shoppers who assume they are still in a buyer’s market find it hard to believe, one of the sobering fundamentals shaping real estate this summer is shrinking inventory: The supply of houses for sale is down significantly in most areas compared with a year ago, sometimes dramatically so. And that is having important side impacts — raising prices and homeowners’ equity stakes, and reducing total sales.
In major metropolitan markets from the mid-Atlantic to the West Coast, the stock of homes listed for purchase is down by sometimes extraordinary amounts — 50 percent or more below year-ago levels in several areas of California, according to industry studies. In Washington, D.C., and its nearby suburbs, listings are down by 28 percent, reports Redfin, a national online realty brokerage. In Los Angeles, available inventory is 49 percent lower than it was last summer, San Diego by 53 percent. In Seattle, listings are off by 41 percent. According to the National Association of Realtors, total houses listed for sale across the country in June were 24 percent lower than a year earlier. The dearth of listings is often more intense in the lower- to mid-price ranges, less so in the upper brackets.
…
Where’s this all headed? Stan Humphries, chief economist for Zillow, says the likely trend is for more of the same: Constricted supplies will lead to price increases, especially in segments of local markets where demand is strongest. Longer term, price increases will gradually rewind the cycle, increasing owners’ equities and convincing more of them to list and sell. This, in turn, should put a brake on price increases, especially under today’s super-strict mortgage underwriting and appraisal practices.
chi (12)-
Where’s Bernie Goetz when you really need him?
Looking for someone to finish our basement… any referrals or suggestions? Yes we’re getting permits but im not afraid to list myself as contractor and use different specialists if it works out that way. Price is important. 800sq ft and we dont want to pay over $10k including carpet and paint. No bathrooms needed. Thanks!
[17] expat,
Good point, Thx. I actually have a few wrinkles I’ve thought of over the years if now I would have to make sure they are legal. You’d be amazed at what governments say two contracting parties can’t do because of policies designed to homogenize things like residential leases and prevent marketing to the most desirable tenants. I could easily make the argument that the landscaping provision is a civil rights violation. May be okay, may not be but a court is the final arbiter. BTW, credit checks were attacked on the same grounds.
Also, best part about this weekend was learning that previous owners planted running bamboo in our backyard and neighbors are pissed. I think ive been bamboozled on this one…
Any suggestions how to kill running bamboo roots for good?
24 – Bulldozer, Napalm, something of this sort. I’d recommend agent orange too, but some of the vietnam vets I know say it’s ineffective. You’ll need to kill everything within like 10 feet of the bamboo to even attempt to control it, likewise, I think you need to excavate almost two feet or so to remove the rhizomes. Check with your local commercial fertilizer supply and see if they can recommend something that might still be legal in NJ (I think most of the effective herbicides are banned). After you do all this, lay down thick black plastic over the wide area and cover with mulch. Leave it covered for the next year or so.
People who plant this stuff should be arrested for environmental terrorism.
[23] Credit checks by landlords are suddenly politically incorrect? I wonder what reinvestor101 would have to say about that.
“unable to tap equity to start businesses or pay for things ”
Let me understand this, folks who recklessly overpaid/overborrowed and who got bitten by Mr. Market should have loan principal forgiven so that they can then go out and borrow against whatever equity they obtain as part of the forgiveness?
“Any suggestions how to kill running bamboo roots for good?”
Unlike Grim, I advocate an ecologically friendly approach: import some pandas.
I have found buyers give a crap about cash. Realtors, by me are demanding a credit check and pre-approval on mortgage. They actually do a credit check run by realtor just to submit an offer. Also amount of ernest money is important.
Someone who has an 800 credit score, pre-approved from chase, shows you proof of funds for 20% downpayment and puts up ernest money why does seller really care about cash other than maybe 1k or 2k cheaper as quicker easier close. But problem is he hired a realtor so it is mainly making realtors life easier and he is paying for it.
24 –
My Uncle and My Father found some bamboo growing on the side of rt. 287 and thought it would be a good idea to plant it in their yards. It nearly overtook my uncle’s backyard. I remember visiting them and seeing shoots coming out of the cement surrounding his pool. Very invasive. Shoots would be 4′-6′ in a day (no exageration) My mother, however, was angry at my father for bringing it home and made every attempt at sabotaging it. I think she secretly poured amonia on it day after day. It’s still there if you know where to look but, for the most part, the surrounding forsithya bushes seem to have overtaken it.
Hire mexican gardners, eventually they will kill everything in yard.
Shore Guy says:
July 30, 2012 at 8:13 am
“Any suggestions how to kill running bamboo roots for good?”
Unlike Grim, I advocate an ecologically friendly approach: import some pandas.
Sold in The Fly (original purchase price of $800K in 2006):
Last LP: $788,000 ML#: 1209850
Addr: 42 LAWRENCE PKWY
Twn: TENAFLY Zip: 07670
Orig LP: $788,000
Sold: $721,000
SD: 7/26/2012 UCD: 4/20/2012 DOM: 33
Still better to be rich than poor.
When will the middle class stop voting against their own best interest?
Romney, as “poor” a candidate as he is, with his herky jerky body language, jittery laughter, grimacing instead of smiling, discomfort among people, lack of specifics, and promise of a return of the neo cons that got us into this mess, could very easily win.
If he does, it will be even better to be rich!
(Hilarious, the opposition accuses O of inaction on the economy when they throw up all the roadblocks.)
Sheesh… the last thing i needed in my life was a multi-year war with bamboo… these people who owned this place before us were absolute hippies. Youd think theyd at least have to disclose it.
Most of the middle class are lazy. There I said it. In fact 99% of them are lazy. If you work hard you move to upper middle class or rich. Tragedy happens, spouse dies, you go bk, get a major injury, lose home in a flood etc. You are poor. The middle class are perfectly healthy people who just decided to float through life, working just hard enough but not too hard.
Shore I second importing pandas, or just backhoe out the entire backyard. The only real way to get rid of bamboo is to nuke it from orbit. It is the only way to be sure.
Gasoline pretty much kills all forms of vegetation, grass included.
Note: Some Government Agencies and Environmental Groups tend to disapprove of this method, and to my knowledge has never been tried on Bamboo, so fool be warned.
32 – a few months back i wrote about visiting that house and a conversation with the Realtor that went something like this:
“i see that this house was bought for $800K a few years back. is there a reason why you think it can be sold now for a 1.5% discount to that price after the market crashed and all RE is down 10-30% all over.”
the response was “blah, blah…it will sell for whatever someone is willing to pay.” my guess was $725K. It went for $721K.
As a mope who talks to people all day about their lives……this one is JJ calling it for what it is……unvarnished…..everyone focuses on the poor…..
raging bull jj says:
July 30, 2012 at 9:06 am
Most of the middle class are lazy. There I said it. In fact 99% of them are lazy. If you work hard you move to upper middle class or rich. Tragedy happens, spouse dies, you go bk, get a major injury, lose home in a flood etc. You are poor. The middle class are perfectly healthy people who just decided to float through life, working just hard enough but not too hard.
Just to add to JJ…..then they get whacked from their job between ages 45 and 55 and think that they have been wronged……
A Home Buyer says:
July 30, 2012 at 9:19 am
Gasoline pretty much kills all forms of vegetation, grass included.
Note: Some Government Agencies and Environmental Groups tend to disapprove of this method, and to my knowledge has never been tried on Bamboo, so fool be warned.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G9BIX9akkh4
chifi #12: And these girls are related to Trayvon Martin….exactly how? Do tell.
You used to be a nice young man. WTF happened to you?
Pour used motor oil on vegetation and boom. Also gasoline, for a few days let it really soak in and then on day 3-5 pour some more and light it up.
Grim wasn’t kidding. It seems Bamboo requires building an underground wall to stop it from spreading.
http://www.gardensalive.com/article.asp?ai=468
[26] expat,
They were always politically incorrect. HUD would love to stop that practice but they also are sensitive to regulating that you have to rent to dead beats. But be advised that they would keep a very close eye on using credit checks as a potential ECOA violation.
Caljn is proof positive that Tytler was right.
[35]JJ- I have something to say about this statement…right after my nap.
Most of the middle class are lazy. There I said it. In fact 99% of them are lazy. If you work hard you move to upper middle class or rich. Tragedy happens, spouse dies, you go bk, get a major injury, lose home in a flood etc. You are poor. The middle class are perfectly healthy people who just decided to float through life, working just hard enough but not too hard.
Do Key Money. When I was looking for apts years ago, the better neighborhoods to keep rif raft out would make you lets on a 1,500 a month apt pay 6k “key money” plus deposit and then charge only 1k rent for rest of year. You paid up front a lot of key money that was a net/net to renter. However, key month makes it difficult for welfare momas to move in.
Comrade Nom Deplume says:
July 30, 2012 at 9:35 am
[26] expat,
They were always politically incorrect. HUD would love to stop that practice but they also are sensitive to regulating that you have to rent to dead beats. But be advised that they would keep a very close eye on using credit checks as a potential ECOA violation.
Make sure you finish your beer before you pass out so it does not spill on you.
The Original NJ ExPat says:
July 30, 2012 at 9:37 am
[35]JJ- I have something to say about this statement…right after my nap.
Most of the middle class are lazy. There I said it. In fact 99% of them are lazy. If you work hard you move to upper middle class or rich. Tragedy happens, spouse dies, you go bk, get a major injury, lose home in a flood etc. You are poor. The middle class are perfectly healthy people who just decided to float through life, working just hard enough but not too hard.
Wow bamboo wars in the morning what’s next!
[45] Thinking to myself…“ECOA? Was that that Clarence Thomas thing? No that was EEOC. Better Google it.” I’m amazed how little I know, considering I knew everything when I was 25.
But be advised that they would keep a very close eye on using credit checks as a potential ECOA violation.
[49] JJ – sounds like sage advice acquired through personal experience, perhaps? Bottoms up Julie.
Make sure you finish your beer before you pass out so it does not spill on you.
JJ and Chi – I have seen plenty of 45-55 execs get canned over the years. Even if you are the hardest working workaholic on the planet you still can get canned when you work for big business. Those that align themselves on the wrong team are usually the the same ones that that claim they did not see it coming, and then they are the ones that tend to sue. They are simply in denial.
My next job will be a life coach. I will charge $800 and hour to give people advise that can be found in a Tony Robbins book. Wall St for example is no place for old men or women simply because you are at war whether you realize it or not and war is for the young.
Was in BC a few days back and passed a corner property that looked like they recently planted running bamboo along the fence lines (east and south facing, front and side of house) to act as a privacy barrier. I guess arbs were too expensive compared to the bamboo. God help them, it looked like at least 150 feet of it. Hope they like it, they’ll never get rid of it without tearing out the sidewalks and fence. Who tells people to do this kind of idiotic stuff? It took my FIL over 3 years to get rid of it from a neighbors back yard. Could have gotten small arbs or juniper off craigslist for 20 bucks a plant and in 3 years they would have had a nice privacy barrier.
That is why I used a realtor, let them do this dirty work. Lucky for me when I sell I dont like my neighbors. I am hopping the high offer are child beating son of sam devil worshiping crack heads.
The Original NJ ExPat says:
July 30, 2012 at 9:43 am
[45] Thinking to myself…“ECOA? Was that that Clarence Thomas thing? No that was EEOC. Better Google it.” I’m amazed how little I know, considering I knew everything when I was 25.
But be advised that they would keep a very close eye on using credit checks as a potential ECOA violation.
35 Right. All middle class people are lazy.
46 I know you are but what am I.
#48-NJ Landlord/Tenant law will not allow a Landlord to acept any more that 1.5 x the monthly rent as security, no matter how it is disguised, i.e. “key money”. You can, in most cases, charge any rent you want, and simply offer a “discount” to the fair rent if it is paid in full.
Privacy barriers are illegal if they are higher than the permitted fence height. For instance you are a corner house zoned for a four foot fence. You cannot legally plant bushes in a row higher than four feet, you cannot construct a living fence. My idiot neighbor blocked my driveway by planting 6 foot plus trees in a row one morning, dope paid for bushes, hire a pro to install, cost a fortune and now he has to move them. Usually, towns and neighbors turn a blind eye, but when it is a busy traffic intersection or you block neighbors driveway usually someone calls it in.
One idiot put a huge privacy screen on a busy intersection on long island, a drunk coming from a bar slams into another car at night. Driver sues drunk, drunk sues homeowner claiming his bushes caused accident and had nothing to do with his drinking. Homeowner almost lost house, dealt with legal fees and eventually won and owed nothing. Putting a large privacy screen on a corner house or blocking neighbors driveway you should not bother paying mortgage, first accident you are losing house. FYI, if they drunk was sober that owner would have lost house.
grim says:
July 30, 2012 at 9:55 am
Was in BC a few days back and passed a corner property that looked like they recently planted running bamboo along the fence lines (east and south facing, front and side of house) to act as a privacy barrier. I guess arbs were too expensive compared to the bamboo. God help them, it looked like at least 150 feet of it. Hope they like it, they’ll never get rid of it without tearing out the sidewalks and fence. Who tells people to do this kind of idiotic stuff? It took my FIL over 3 years to get rid of it from a neighbors back yard. Could have gotten small arbs or juniper off craigslist for 20 bucks a plant and in 3 years they would have had a nice privacy barrier.
Lucky for me, I am less lazy than most lazy people.
caljn says:
July 30, 2012 at 9:58 am
35 Right. All middle class people are lazy.
46 I know you are but what am I.
[51]. Expat,
I wouldn’t expect many people to know that. I do, but as seif will remind you, I’m a highfalutin lawyer.
Actually, I never heard of ECOA until I went to work as a bank reg lawyer. There us just so much law and regulation, too much to really know. That’s why lawyers “practice”; we haven’t mastered it yet.
It depends on the township. I checked local laws in my town and asked the lady in the town office when I applied for my fence permit. If you are on a corner lot, you just can’t have anything blocking the view of the zone called the “sight triangle” at the corner of the lot. So, in my case, if I planted privacy bushes in a square along the property line, I would have to shave off the corner where the intersection is so that people at the stop sign could still see oncoming traffic.
58.raging bull jj says:
July 30, 2012 at 10:03 am
Privacy barriers are illegal if they are higher than the permitted fence height. For instance you are a corner house zoned for a four foot fence. You cannot legally plant bushes in a row higher than four feet, you cannot construct a living fence. My idiot neighbor blocked my driveway by planting 6 foot plus trees in a row one morning, dope paid for bushes, hire a pro to install, cost a fortune and now he has to move them. Usually, towns and neighbors turn a blind eye, but when it is a busy traffic intersection or you block neighbors driveway usually someone calls it in.
One idiot put a huge privacy screen on a busy intersection on long island, a drunk coming from a bar slams into another car at night. Driver sues drunk, drunk sues homeowner claiming his bushes caused accident and had nothing to do with his drinking. Homeowner almost lost house, dealt with legal fees and eventually won and owed nothing. Putting a large privacy screen on a corner house or blocking neighbors driveway you should not bother paying mortgage, first accident you are losing house. FYI, if they drunk was sober that owner would have lost house.
You should tell that to the middle class contractor that put on my addition. He would probably punch you in the teeth.
Goddam. You finance guys are so out of touch with reality….
35.raging bull jj says:
July 30, 2012 at 9:06 am
Most of the middle class are lazy. There I said it. In fact 99% of them are lazy. If you work hard you move to upper middle class or rich. Tragedy happens, spouse dies, you go bk, get a major injury, lose home in a flood etc. You are poor. The middle class are perfectly healthy people who just decided to float through life, working just hard enough but not too hard.
[57]. Keystone. That was similar to one of my legal ideas. The problem there however is marketing. People will not want to pay money up front on the promise of getting it back. so the trick is to ask for a rent which is high market and provide for a rebate mechanism that has objective criteria.
JJ you sound like the neighbor from hell. When my brother moved into his prestigious Blue Ribbon Bergen County train town the first thing he did was to install a white 6ft high vinyl fence in the backyard to keep the dog in. Neighbor came over to complain. I answered the door since I was there working on the house spackling and painting. My brother and I look alike, he mistakes me for my brother and he goes on about how he could no longer yell over to the neighbor two yards away while he was outback smoking and enjoying his nightly beers etc and how I did not ask for his permission etc. I told him we put it up because we are Republican, and shut the door. To this day my brother does not understand why his neighbor gives him dirty looks and won’t even say hello.
[53] juice,
I long ago concluded that the way to get rich was to write books on how to get rich.
[59] caljn,
Great comeback. I can see that you really worked the grey matter. I’m dazzled by your scintillating repartee.
To answer your question, I cannot say for sure but I’m going with frustrated and lazy.
Survey says …?
Damn, used cross reference to jjs post. Guess I’m lazy too.
#12. Only an idiot plays librarian on a NYC subway train with a gang; male, female, transgender or otherwise.
If his fence was legal and in backyard I am all for it. I have my backyard fully fenced in with a six foot high fence. I love it. I dont want to see any of my neighbors in my backyard.
I am talking about a side corner yard facing a busy intersection, not a back yard that is zoned for a max of a four foot high see though fence, like a picket fence. Even for picket fence you need a permit. This guy has a backyard, has no kids, just decided if he fenced in the sideyard illegally he could have a second yard.
Anyhow lots of people put in higher fences on corner houses and no one complains, however, usually they leave at least one to two foot from sidewalk and a cut-out around neighbors driveway so he can back out. Still illegal but if done like that and nieghbor is ok no problem. I would be ok with that too.
What my new neighbor did, who I never met, was hire a crew of people to arrive at 4am on Sunday and instructed them to use hand shovels only. He planted 25 almost 7 foot high bushes/trees down entire length of my driveway and down lenght of sidewalk. My driveway goes right up to property line. Unlike Jersey my sidewalk is heavily used. I would say during the day maybe every 60 seconds someone walks by my house. I cant back up. Even if I back into driveway I have to stick nose out. I cant even look down sidewalk and then jump in car as kids on bikes come up quick. I asked him to move some bushes for me to see out and he said absolutely no way, I dont need permission from no one to plant stuff on my own property. I then said so why did you do it behind my back at 4am on a Sunday? with that no answer, so I will let the town deal with it. Legally, I was forced to report him. I am 100% liable to a major lawsuit if backing out I hit someone. I at the least need to file a formal complaint and put it on the record. Even if he bribes the zoning guy and gets a variance I want no part of it. My neighbors driveway to left of me also goes up to propery line. I would never fence in his driveway, first of all not nice, second of all dangerous some kid will get run over and third of all illegal.
Juice Box says:
July 30, 2012 at 10:23 am
JJ you sound like the neighbor from hell. When my brother moved into his prestigious Blue Ribbon Bergen County train town the first thing he did was to install a white 6ft high vinyl fence in the backyard to keep the dog in. Neighbor came over to complain. I answered the door since I was there working on the house spackling and painting. My brother and I look alike, he mistakes me for my brother and he goes on about how he could no longer yell over to the neighbor two yards away while he was outback smoking and enjoying his nightly beers etc and how I did not ask for his permission etc. I told him we put it up because we are Republican, and shut the door. To this day my brother does not understand why his neighbor gives him dirty looks and won’t even say hello.
66 Do I really have to explain?
64 While self righteous sociopathic tendencies are typically the marks of a good Republican, it doesn’t work in dense, suburban communities where the consult and approval of neighbors is required prior to construction of what can be perceived as eyesores.
You’re wrong on this one.
BTW your brother was wrong. He should have told neighborfirst. People are touch about fences. I have an odd backyard that touches four neighbors backyards. I told all four, one screamed at me. One had fence on property line and forced me to put my fence on the other side, giving him a few extra feet. One was cool about it, and one did not respond to my letter or follow-up call.
The one screaming at me mistakingly was told by realtor it was his fence and it was there since he bought house in 1984. Neighbor on right told me it was 100% my fence. When pool was put in my yard in 1982 he was there when it went up, you can check pool permit, and he gave me name and number or original owner. I calmed neighbor down on that side who admitted he had no proof it was his fence. I took down that eyesore. I could not imagine dealing with four sets of nieghbors on day of without advance notice. BTW my fence was 100% legal with permits. The idiot new neighbor dissed me once by being sneaky, if he was a man and came over and said blah blah blah planning on having kid, nephews come over, or some other sad sack story I would have went go ahead just give me a little triangle cut out so I can see and move them a few inches back so they dont overgrow my driveway. Instead he went the sissy way which most texting, facebooking kids do cause they have no human interaction skills.
Juice Box says:
July 30, 2012 at 10:23 am
JJ you sound like the neighbor from hell. When my brother moved into his prestigious Blue Ribbon Bergen County train town the first thing he did was to install a white 6ft high vinyl fence in the backyard to keep the dog in. Neighbor came over to complain.
We told our neighbors we were putting up a fence to be nice, if we were still in Garfield it would have included razor wire and I would not have told anyone
[64] Juice – Supposedly my Dad was regularly kicked out of bars in Kearney NJ when he was young because he looked so much like his brother who was already black-listed from various establishments.
This is a nice-enough condo, on theinlet in Boca, but, who the heck designs a “luxury” condo building overlooking the ocean and the intercoastal waterway where the master bedroom lacks a balcony?
http://www.onethousandocean.com/pdf/floorplans/208fpinsert.pdf
We have a black president, can we get rid of the terms Master Bedroom and Landlord. Both are pretty racist.
[70] caljn,
In your own mind, haven’t you already answered that question.
Come on, humor this poor, misguided, intellectually inferior mope and enlighten me.
[75] JJ,
Rofl. Lest we forget, old lawbooks refer to employment cases under the heading “master and servant”. Pretty racist, don’t you think?
And although I am envious of JJ’s renowned prowess at everything, I am glad I get along with my neighbors.
Just learned another house going up for sale in the brig. Friends of ours relocating to Mass., not far from where I grew up. I pointed out to them that he will have a hellacious commute (Andover to Lexington). At least I can fix traffic tickets for him in the right towns.
Well, as shore used to say, off to the salt mines.
JJ – I don’t even like those white vinly fences, I think they are ugly. My brother lived with mom until the day he got married, he had no idea what a pain in the arse a fixer upper is or etiquette for dealing with the neighbors. When they bought the house it was rush, rush get it fixed up so they could start living there after the Honeymoon and not have to live with mother. I was being nice working on his house for free along with his other brothers and brothers in laws in a mad rush to get the place ready. I took a few jabs at my brother about the house during my best man speech asking why they rushed to move into their fixer upper and I pointed to him and asked him the question “you do know you aren’t going home to moms house tonight” followed up with “how proud I would be in 9 months to be an uncle.” It was one of my finest jabs at him besides getting his nosy neighbor mad at him. These days his wife owns his nuts and he isn’t around much but I still can make fun of his broke arse for buying that fixer upper when I see him a the latest family gathering. Blue Ribbonny train town LOL, I am not moving anywhere near WT Bergen County.
I got what you intend, appreciate it for putting up.Woh I am happy to find this website through google. “Food is the most primitive form of comfort.” by Sheila Graham.
veets (24)-
24 DT, mixed with gasoline.
Once again, jj gives me a new handle.
“..ernest money is important.”
I get along with most of neighbors. One I have never spoken too, one I live next to 11 years spoke to twice, have annoying harmless kind of guy on one side I humour, a little annoying. The fourth neighbor was a slob but kept to himself and him and his wife both worked full time, once a year said hello. It is fourth new neighbor, who only reason I am annoyed with is he blocked my driveway, he could devil worship over there for all I care, only other neighbor I ever got into it with is idiot across street, for some reason he had two sons, even though he is a child himself, anyhow he leaves and entire bag of golf balls out and goes in drinking, son has friend overs and starts hitting golf balls with baseball bat, I start hearing pings, I have my three month old daughter in my yard and a golf ball from over 200 feet away hit over 30 feet in air clears my roof and almost hits the kid. I went over and yelled at guy who got mad at me that I took offense to his precious son hitting golf balls. A few months later I put in a sidewalk and his kids start kicking soccer balls at it on dads instructions. I still did not get into it with this guy, he is unemployed and home all day, pretty much he can slash your tires set your house on fired. But new neighbor is some snot nosed 20 something kid who bought the home with help from his mommy, he drew first blood. But funny he had some other project to put in a massive other thing that would have blocked other neighbors driveway which I see he stopped midstream. Sadly I get heat and nieghbor around corner gets benefit.
Good news guy who owner house two owners before was a manic, he pissed off everyone in town, including building inspectors, zoning, tax greivances, neighbors, workers, that home address is toxic. to this day it pays 4k extra in taxes. The new owner does not realize this, wait till he deals with town. I swear some houses are cursed.
Comrade Nom Deplume says:
July 30, 2012 at 11:30 am
And although I am envious of JJ’s renowned prowess at everything, I am glad I get along with my neighbors.
seif (38)-
You want us to give you some kind of props for this, jerkoff?
“the response was “blah, blah…it will sell for whatever someone is willing to pay.” my guess was $725K. It went for $721K.”
When it was time to put in our built-in pool, we had backyard neighbors that my wife didn’t care for. We fenced in the entire backyard. We had nice looking aluminum fencing put in on all sides except the rear. The rear portion of the fence was placed in back of a 350′ line of trees we had planted 10 years prior. Those Norway spruces were already twenty feet tall and hid the entire rear fence from our view. BTW, we chose the cheapest, ugliest fence, 6′ high that we could find for that section. just enough to meet code. It’s all blackened now, showing only on the neighbors side.
Hmmm.Those same neighbors put up an inground pool right after us. The idiots on that whole other street including them play keep up with the Joneses. We laugh as half are doctors/professional types and yet don’t seem to have minds of their own.
Maybe that’s why those neighbors sold and moved to Brigadoon a year or two later. That lady liked that town. I just smiled and told my wife be careful of what you wish because…Because the new neighbors who bought that house have young bratty noisy kids. Especially when they are in their pool. That’s ok. You can hear them, but can’t see them.
I’m surprised seif doesn’t understand the concept that sellers in this market “deserve” to get their price and just forks up the asking to live in a prestigious BC town.
Does Home Depot sell vinyl fencing with a top course of razor wire?
Then again, I think this would address my privacy concerns in a much more effective way.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K2Qn_LkOhGg
That should prolly fix a bamboo problem, too.
Funny, I have a loud pool pump. I have a neighbor with trees that hang over pool which means I cant put pool on an automatic schedule, if leaves get caught pump burns out. So I run it while kids are in pool. Kids make noise so pump drowns out noise anyhow.
So idiot neighbor with tree asks me if I am buying new pump as it annoys him. Told him I would buy a new pump if he trimmed his tree back as the sap and leaves would ruin new pump plus without my old louder pump running when kids are in pool you will hear three screaming kids instead. I then ask which do you want to do. He then said maybe put a mat under the old pump or something and left. The old be careful what you wish for.
BTW I have a trampoline by fence with annoying neighbor. The pool pump is by fence of second most annoying neighbor. The two quiet neighbors I avoid their fence, and tell kids to be quiet when they are out. Actually in one respect the new neighbor saves me trouble of having one more neighbor to tell kids to be quiet. Lucky for him, I have lots of activities on the weekend. It is during week it is loud out there in summer.
xolepa says:
What if neighbor got mad about cheap fence and ratted you out for the privacy screen of trees.Most towns have permit requirements for trees. My town is $150 per tree being planted plus they cant be above a certain height. I am always amazed at how many people plant trees or cut down trees without a permit. I had two trees in front of my house I waited three years for town to plant. If I did it myself I am legally liable and had to pay a tree planting fee. Since town did it I can call them to trim.
xolepa says:
July 30, 2012 at 11:53 am
When it was time to put in our built-in pool, we had backyard neighbors that my wife didn’t care for. We fenced in the entire backyard. We had nice looking aluminum fencing put in on all sides except the rear. The rear portion of the fence was placed in back of a 350′ line of trees we had planted 10 years prior. Those Norway spruces were already twenty feet tall and hid the entire rear fence from our view. BTW, we chose the cheapest, ugliest fence, 6′ high that we could find for that section. just enough to meet code. It’s all blackened now, showing only on the neighbors side.
92 – Too bad you don’t live in NJ. I think You are allowed to remove branches of your neighbor’s tree that hang over your property line here.
http://www.ehow.com/facts_7888573_law-neighbors-tree-new-jersey.html
“Most towns have permit requirements for trees. My town is $150 per tree being planted plus they cant be above a certain height.”
Most towns? Really? I don’t think I’ve even heard of that before.
In Texas, if your neighbor’s tree encroaches on your yard, you can shoot him.
Look it up, nearly every town for trees about a certain height or width you need permission to plan or cut down. Some charge fees others do not.
Also rules distance distance from street if you are on a snow emergency route or a corner house or on strip of grass between sidewalk and curb. .
Bagholder Brian says:
July 30, 2012 at 12:16 pm
“Most towns have permit requirements for trees. My town is $150 per tree being planted plus they cant be above a certain height.”
Most towns? Really? I don’t think I’ve even heard of that before.
I am allowed to do that as long as I dont kill tree on purpose.
Bagholder Brian says:
July 30, 2012 at 12:13 pm
92 – Too bad you don’t live in NJ. I think You are allowed to remove branches of your neighbor’s tree that hang over your property line here.
http://www.ehow.com/facts_7888573_law-neighbors-tree-new-jersey.html
http://www.tenaflynj.org/content/7628/7798/7949.aspx
tenefly tree rules
Jill: FabMax happened to me……he is so fabulously special
Jill says:
July 30, 2012 at 9:29 am
chifi #12: And these girls are related to Trayvon Martin….exactly how? Do tell.
You used to be a nice young man. WTF happened to you?
re: fences
Rules differ by town, zoning type, property type, property location, and the types of roads the property borders. Ask your town for a fence diagram describing it. They’ll hand you a drawing that looks like a map a kid would probably draw, it’ll have each property type documented. Properties that border busy roads tend to have less restrictive fence options than properties that don’t, and corner properties have different rules than non-corner properties. Most towns will also restrict not only the heights, but also the amount of open space, and fence type (chain link (aka cyclone) restrictions are becoming very common).
Also, many towns are restricting fence to fence borders, my town explicitly forbids it. You can’t run a fence parallel with another. So, if you think your neighbors fence is ugly and want to put something else up, you need to get them to give you permission to tear theirs down.
Also, fence disputes (on or near property line) are generally resolved by the direction that the “good side” faces. So, for chain link, the side with the post generally considered the fence owner.
Concerning permits for planting trees, I don’t think it exists anywhere in Hunterdon county. There are ordinances against cutting of trees in whole and any tree overhanging into your yard is fair game for you to trim back. I have an issue like that in one of my rentals. As for my town, they of course want you to plant more trees. Part and parcel of raising the minimum building lot size to 8 acres. Those trees keep the riff-raff away.
Oddly in some towns, fences right on property line even if you paid for them are considered joint ownership and you need neighbors permission to tear down your own fence.
Also, fence disputes (on or near property line) are generally resolved by the direction that the “good side” faces. So, for chain link, the side with the post generally considered the fence owner.
No permit to plant trees here. My town has their municipal code online. There is a permit required to cut them down (which I didn’t know about) but I’ve never heard of a permit to plant one. Are you in some sort of historic district or something?
97.raging bull jj says:
July 30, 2012 at 12:23 pm
Look it up, nearly every town for trees about a certain height or width you need permission to plan or cut down. Some charge fees others do not.
Also rules distance distance from street if you are on a snow emergency route or a corner house or on strip of grass between sidewalk and curb. .
Im totally against turning my yard into a toxic waste dump to kill off the bamboo. I ripped up all small plants and ivy this weekend and will deal with the bamboo sprouts one at a time so that its never successful at getting any sun light. Ive heard that it eventually rots away at the roots if you are patient and persistent.
Speaking of invasive plant species and trees….
After hurricant Irene, I cut down a huge 60+ year old Locust tree that hit my house. I hated to get rid of it because it provided us a lot of shade but it was messy and hitting the house was the last straw…. So, I went away on vacation last week, and I haven’t been mowing the lawn in the back much since we haven’t had a lot of rain, and there’s like dozens of little Locust trees shooting up out of the roots about 2′-3′ high! Broke the weedwacker trying to mow them all down. Damn tree just won’t die!
(101) Fence swaps as described should not be utilized when either fence is intended to shield individuals from restricted sites, e.g.., those that contain swimming pools, hot-tubs, etc. If the fence has horizontal supports and it faces away from the enclosed area, you may be in for a lawsuit if something nasty happens.
Permit is only cause idiots plant them by sidewalks, near curb on snow emergency street, under power wires, above pools etc.
Bagholder Brian says:
July 30, 2012 at 12:50 pm
No permit to plant trees here. My town has their municipal code online. There is a permit required to cut them down (which I didn’t know about) but I’ve never heard of a permit to plant one. Are you in some sort of historic district or something?
We have laws forbidding idiots. We don’t bother outlawing plants and trees.
108.raging bull jj says:
July 30, 2012 at 1:08 pm
Permit is only cause idiots plant them by sidewalks, near curb on snow emergency street, under power wires, above pools etc.
Further clarify, town right of way areas only you need a permit. Like front grass on sidewalk or near sidewalk.Not back yard.
How I yearn for the days of Bush/Cheney. You couldn’t ask for a better president/vice president combo of rock ribbed Americans ready to kick some ass and take some damn names unlike the effete wuss that’s in office now. I’d vote for Cheney to be president in a damn heartbeat. I’m so glad that he’s overcome his heart problems and didn’t die like the stinking liberals wanted him to. Rock ribbed Americans live forever. Boy, I really admire this man:
http://news.yahoo.com/blogs/newsmakers/dick-cheney-on-his-heart-pump-and-obama-s-record-20120730.html
We tired that in NY but it did not work, until we can make the GWB, Lincoln and Holland tunnels one way only to NJ we will be stuck with these extra rules.
Bagholder Brian says:
July 30, 2012 at 1:10 pm
We have laws forbidding idiots. We don’t bother outlawing plants and trees.
108.raging bull jj says:
July 30, 2012 at 1:08 pm
Permit is only cause idiots plant them by sidewalks, near curb on snow emergency street, under power wires, above pools etc.
#112, thats for sure, no one is moving east…..
On the topic of bamboo…
This is a great article on getting rid of running bamboo. There really are three options for removing bamboo that are effective each requiring more time, effort, or destructive power.
http://www.gardensalive.com/article.asp?ai=468
You can mow it frequently, very frequently, eventually starving the entire root system of energy. You want the shoots tall enough so that they deficit as much energy as possible before you cut them down. Don’t let the shoots get tall enough to harvest a lot of light energy. As soon as you can see leaves unfurl then cut (4 inches perhaps?).
You can cover it for a long time by placing boards over top of the root system and starving it from light. This process can take a year or longer depending on the size of the bamboo patch. In the mean time your yard is covered with a huge amount of boards, mulch etc.
Or you can raise the acidity of the soil to burn out the root system (you will kill all other plants in the area) then neutralize the acid afterward. This perhaps takes 1-2 months.
Good luck.
111
Oh…I get it. Satire, right?
re101 is just someone’s parody of a dumb houseflipper who is also a parody of a dumb republican. An online phenomenon called a strawman sock puppet.
Democratic Party to add gay marriage to platform. Interesting Harry Reid, I wonder if “O” will impose a Tax Penalty on all Hetrosexuals who refuse to be Sodomized? Maybe Harry will sodomize “O” on Oprah to rally the troops?
NOTREES, TEXAS
http://www.texasescapes.com/WestTexasTowns/NotreesTexas/NotreesTx.htm
116 – how dare you? who the hell do you think you are spewing that commie nonsense? someone’s parody? i’m the “real america” that sarah palin so eloquently waxes poetic about! you have probably been intimate with plenty of sock puppets in your day!! besides, “dumb house flipper” and “dumb republican” are redundant.
[112] JJ – I’ve heard some real New Yorkers say the same thing about east side crossings to Lon Guyland. If it weren’t for the influence of Sands Point, it’d be done already.
We tired that in NY but it did not work, until we can make the GWB, Lincoln and Holland tunnels one way only to NJ we will be stuck with these extra rules.
Confused #117: Oh come on now, just because something is permitted doesn’t mean it’s mandatory. Jeez.
I once dropped off a girl in Sands Point, who was a guest in my house, hung over like a bastard, unshaven, suntanned, sunglasses on, kinda Californication looking in my 67 Firebird convt. Girl was also sunburnt, hungover, in a bikini with a long teeshirt and flip flops, she told me it was port wash, anyhow she goes least I can do is get you something to drink, we walk into this mansion in Sandspoint around 6pm on a Sunday and Dad who is President of Time Warner at time for some reason assumes I am her boyfriend. Anyhow he is having a pool party with guests, I am being show around the grounds as if I was to inherit this all one day. Girl was pretty stupid, even for me. She introduced me as the guy who she stayed at his hamptons house for the weekend and I was driving her home. Rather then I barely know him, but he was driving to Great Neck by himself so I bummed a ride home off him. Sands point is very impressive. If it was not for fact I was juggling three girls and I was broke I could of added her to my fleet. I quickly realized I need to dump my three girls, to make this work. I was a mere child of 27 so I ran like hell from that house. Well after I shook a few hands and told them I work on wall st, own a estate in the Hamptons, an estate in Great Neck, love fast cars and dating the President of Time Warners daughter. Luckily, I left quickly before the lies became untangled. Lucky for me my bathing suit was not that loose so I did not need to brag about my manhood as the lizard king was in display for all to see.
Gator and I spent the morning in beautiful East Orange attempting to fight our Montclair property taxes down. As par usual, Gates did a fantastic job representing. All was normal until she questioned the fairness of the townwide reassessment where the combined sum of all of the assessments on usable sales in 2012 were valued at 90% of sales price, but everyone who didn’t purchase in 2011 was assessed at 100%. After that it seemed the hippie town lawyer and the appraisal company wanted us out of there as soon as possible. We’ll know in a few weeks if we wasted our morning. Either way, watching the various levels of preparation and understanding of the process by the numerous residents appealing is really quite entertaining. As is the sign at the entrance of the building which forbids one from carrying heroine in the building besides various more common incendiaries.
Com Nom,
What are your thoughts on leaving your home vacant as you try to rent it out after reading this? Unreal!
http://consumerist.com/2012/07/squatters-file-bankruptcy-to-keep-homeowners-out-of-their-own-house.html
The joys of home ownership continue to kick my rear.
Grim, called your shower door guy and here is the report. I ended up going with ABC. ABC was at my home within 48 hours of my phone call, showing me options and sent me a spec for 3 bathrooms worth of work (mirrors in kids baths) 48 hours after that. Craig didn’t get back to me for two weeks and when he did finally show, he took another week to send me the quote. Personality wise, I really liked the guy, no nonsense and made some good points about not using beveled (+$300) mirror in one spot because no one would see it to appreciate it. But I just got nervous about how long it would take if I used him so when the big ABC operation dropped their price on the mirrors (their shower door package was only about $40 more) to something competitive I went with them. Thanks for the referral though, I was glad to at least have two bids to compare.
The amazing thing was that I called another 2 places and they took my info and no one EVER got back to me. I realize it wasn’t a whole house but two large mirrors plus shower set up? It wasn’t chump change either. These places are just so busy with the top 1%-ers, they don’t need to call lowly folks like me back I guess.
Next on the list is reliable pest control (no known issues but is it worth getting a tri-annual service?) and landscaping. I wish I could hire an intern getting their degree in landscaping to plan out my front and back yards.
Anyone here have success using bone meal to keep rabbits out of their yard? My front and back yard look like litter pans for all those bunnies. Its illegal to shot at them right?
Meant to say usable sales in 2011. The County Taxation Board is located in the same building as the Dept. of Welfare and various other social services. Needless to say, listening in on the conversations going on around us while waiting in line to get through security reminded me of the Jerry Springer show.
124 – try dried cows blood, your local garden store should have it
I won my grievance third year in a row. Got results last week for a 9% reduction. Last year I got 10%. My favorite one is it asks if anytime in last 12 months have you had your home listed for sale, if so what price and did it sell.
I listed my home for sale for 320K, for a period of five minutes and after five minutes no one offered me 320K so I pulled listing. Therefore I said I can say my home is worth less than 320 with absolute certainty. The town concurred and gave me a value of 313K. Last year I used the adjacent to commercial property tactic, year before estate sale tactic. I found a few where homes were moved kids named prior to owner passing away for estate planning purposes, they do not show up as estate sales. I also won with my Billy Joel strategy when I first bought house. Billy Joel claimed his house was worth half as much as he paid for it shortly after he bought it, everyone knows Billy Joel is a bad businessman and he won. I got my house reaccessed at less than I paid for it as I obviously as a first time home buyer overpaid. Other one was my “this is more of a Mercury Neighborhood than a Mercedes Neighborhood” strategy. Pulled old beat up Mercury Sable train car stationwagon in driveway and took a few unflattering pictures of house with piece of junk in driveway. The assessor laughed at me. Literlly, he gave me a really. Best is there is a smoke stack one mile away. I managed to lean over deck in dead of winter use 10x zoom and managed to move smokestack 10x closer to house. That also was not well taken. So I am at four wins and one loss in tax grienvance, that sting of that one loss still hurts. The latest win was icing on the cake. I am going for four in a row next year. Latest one is the fence blocking my driveway had knocked at least 50K off my house plus mental anguish has caused me to stop maintaining house. Or I might just least it for sale, hey anyone want my house for 270K, too late I closed listing already. .
Libtard in the City says:
July 30, 2012 at 2:51 pm
Gator and I spent the morning in beautiful East Orange attempting to fight our Montclair property taxes down. As par usual, Gates did a fantastic job representing. All was normal until she questioned the fairness of the townwide reassessment where the combined sum of all of the assessments on usable sales in 2012 were valued at 90% of sales price, but everyone who didn’t purchase in 2011 was assessed at 100%. After that it seemed the hippie town lawyer and the appraisal company wanted us out of there as soon as possible. We’ll know in a few weeks if we wasted our morning. Either way, watching the various levels of preparation and understanding of the process by the numerous residents appealing is really quite entertaining. As is the sign at the entrance of the building which forbids one from carrying heroine in the building besides various more common incendiaries.
Well the process is obviously different out there. We’ve had a pretty amazing track record as well. I would say we only had one loss as well. That is when we went to hearing at the county the last time. Regardless of the excellent and valid (honestly) case brought, the county appears to be in bed with the town (any size) so you lose anyway. The only way to win is to negotiate a settlement with the town to avoid the hearing. This year, Montclair has sent everyone to hearing as the appraisal company the town hired has to defend the town for free. When the town has to hire extra council to represent the town, they tend to settle prior to hearing. If we lose this hearing, we will file at the state since realty appraisal won’t be respresenting there and we will most likely settle prior to hearing.
Libtard,
While enjoying East Orange’s bureaucratic home, how many times did you overhear someone who has allegedly been speaking English their whole lives say they were “axing” a question?
Can PBS create a sort of adult Sesame Street for people on welfare and low end jobs to help them speak proper English? Perhaps include some lines from Poor Richard’s Almanack, like “early to bed, early to rise”?
I just went to my first property tax hearing. The town questioned one of my comps, but did not officially submit at the hearing any of the comps from the list they sent me in the mail (which were much nicer homes than mine but sold at my current assessed value). Does that mean they will lower my assessment to the range of comps I provided? We were told it would take 2 months before we hear anything back.
Steve. You are at the mercy of the commissioner. You can turn wine into blood right in front of him, but he can still deem you a false prophet. Just wait and see and appeal to the state and settle before the hearing. If it goes to hearing, just bail and take the last offer.
[124] 250k
My thoughts?
baseball bat, duct tape, ropes, cinder blocks, a tarp for the trunk, and a friend with a boat.
“it eventually rots away at the roots if you are patient and persistent.”
The same is true of mighty powers that borrow too much money.
#124 “Next on the list is reliable pest control (no known issues but is it worth getting a tri-annual service?)”
As someone with extensive knowledge on effects of pesticides on human health (cancer, neurological effects, etc), please don’t get pesticide applications either inside or outside unless there is an absolute reason for it. If you have a specific problem inside your house, consider using IPM (Integrated Pest Management) with a firm that can do “least toxic pest control” such as Cooper Pest Control or Western Pest Control (but ask for least toxic IPM). Consider going organic on your exterior lawns.
Apparently that extensive knowledge doesn’t extend to sentence structure.
Westjoker is that all you have to show for a wasted liberal arts education?
>>>reinvestor102.7 says:
July 30, 2012 at 2:31 pm
116 – how dare you? who the hell do you think you are spewing that commie nonsense? someone’s parody? i’m the “real america” that sarah palin so eloquently waxes poetic about! you have probably been intimate with plenty of sock puppets in your day!! besides, “dumb house flipper” and “dumb republican” are redundant.<<<
Let's get something damn straight–there's only one reinvestor and don't accept any damn imitations or knockoffs. There's a joker on this damn board who thinks he's funny. Get your own damn handle punk and stop trying to steal my damn thunder.
Now where the hell was I? Oh yeah, the RINO Awest called me a sock puppet. Let's get something damn straight AWest. People like you and Shoreguy make me want to throw the hell up. You sully our party with this damn RINO crap trying to pass yourself off as some type of damn intellectual and looking down on your damn noses at people like me acting like you're better than me. That's bullspit. You ain't better than me and you damn sure ain't as smart as you think you are. Tell you what punk, this damn party ain't got no more room for people like you and you have the nerve to call me a damn sock puppet as if I'm not the real damn face of the republican party. It's people like you that is the result of Romney being at the top of the damn ticket rather than one of our T-Party darlings and I don't like that one damn bit. Yeah, you get me all hot and bothered at the mid-terms and now you expect people like me to go the hell away and hide. Let me tell you something punk, I'd rather strap some C-4 on my ass and swan dive into the hell before I let you stinking RINO's take over this damn party. I got your sock puppet you RINO punk.
Stu, I think East Orange should give you free smack for life if you’re unfortunate enough to end up living there.
Re: Property Tax appeals
Couldn’t one argue that the price at which a property changed hands (sold) in the last few months be the true fair market value of the property? A straight conventional transaction (i.e. not a short sale, foreclosure, etc.). What better pricing mechanism than an arms length transaction in the open market? (Setting aside the arguments of whether the RE is truly an efficient or open market in its form, etc.) If I buy a stock at $20 – that is the fair market value of the share at that time and becomes my cost basis; no matter what the analysts may say or how much they argue that the share is worth more or less. (Again, aside from the argument that the stock market maybe more “efficient”; valuation methods; etc., etc.) What say the experts on going to the appeal with just this justification alone? What else (perhaps besides a couple of comps) should I have in my back pocket? Worth a shot or are they going to ask me to make sure the door doesn’t hit my @ss on the way out?
22: Veets,
I will get you a name. We did ours a couple years ago, @ 500 sq ft for @ $5k if memory serves.
[124 & 132} Nom and 250K – My thoughts:
Strike while the iron is hot and set up 3 businesses in Littleton:
Publicly with lots of Marketing:
1. AAA Discount House Sitters & Security, LLC
On the Down-Low:
2. AAA Short Term Rentals, LLC
3. AAA Have Your Party Here, LLC
Another sign of our sure descent into the Third World sinkhole:
Who is Jamie Dimon?
New York Banker: 14%
Texas Congressman: 9%
X-Games Skateboarder: 7%
Daredevil Motorcyclist: 4%
Don’t Know: 66%
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/who-jamie-dimon
[124 & 132 & 141] Kind of crappy presentation by the Consumerist.com. If you watch the video, only then do you realize that a suspended realtor was apparently selling (on the surface) or complicit (not stated) with transfers for money of bogus “adverse possession” deeds. What crap.
[143] Alternative to Nom’s Sicilian solution (like I used to tell an old roommate, your heritage is showing), in hindsight would the rightful owners be better served to just wait until the squatting family was all out of the house and re-occupy, quickly change the locks and then call the cops when the squatting family tried to re-enter? Maybe stash all the squatters trash in the basement too?
[100] Chifi
I seem to recall you were there a few years ago at the GTG in Hoboken when FabMax thought I was gonna go postal on him, and you were reassuring him that I was (reasonably) sane. I also seem to recall you had no major disagreements (neither did I as we were too busy stuffing steak into our pieholes to argue).
[144] expat,
Sicilian??? How dare you! I’m insulted.
I learned from a sicilian girl I knew that mainland Italians and Sicilians view each other with a great deal of disdain. As she put it, Italians consider Sicilians the n****rs of Italy. Also, Northern Italians look down on Southern Italians. So it really isn’t any different than here.
[146] redux,
And as a lawyer, I cannot advise the so-called Sicilian Solution. But if you decide to use it, I don’t wanna know nuthin. You got me? Nuthin!
[146] Same deal for Cantonese and Mandarin Chinese, oil and water. Turks and Greeks, obviously, too. I learned about both those cultural divides in first hand confrontations during my mid 20’s and both took me by surprise. Had to ask WTF questions afterward for clarification.
I’m trying to figure out “ernest money.” It’s either Clot/Meat or Essex/Bocephus, but I can’t tell.
I’m going with clot/meat. Will tune in tomorrow for the poll results.
[147] That sounds a little like the German solution with a slightly different dialect, or at least as aped by Sgt. Schultz;-)
My brother deals with deadbeats and squatters via the Oklahoma Eviction method.
[148] Expat,
Those don’t bug me. The real important rivalries are
Mass. vs. New Hampshire
UMass vs. BC,
and of course, the grandaddy of rivalries:
Boston vs. New York.
Really do have to go. Peace out, peeps.
[151] C’mon Chip, that’s down South where you have to make the frequent monetary calculation between the worth of human life, property, and the cost of ammo. And it’s a rapidly fluctuating and volatile market. I’ll give you, though, those folks aren’t always top notch with their cipherin’ skills;-)
[152] I love being a NJ-born NY fan in Boston. It seems that mostly Boston fans respect your allegiance if you’re respectful to theirs. Also I never gloat, I let them bring it up and I’m self-deprecating when the NY teams get spanked (like the last two nights).
And I don’t give a rat’s ass about hockey. Sorry. When the conversation switches to Bruins this, Beanpot that, Stanley Saucer, etc. my eyes just kind of glaze over and I daydream about White Castle and Taylor Ham.
pat (153)-
A deadbeat is a deadbeat, north or south.
I didn’t realize at the time what a grinding hypocrite he was…..I can’t help it, I have certain pet peeves; and foreign national denigrating the U.S. system on our soil, while taking advantage is just putrid……adding to the fact that Western Europeans view us all as a bunch of mongrels…..
Comrade Nom Deplume says:
July 30, 2012 at 6:25 pm
[100] Chifi I seem to recall you were there a few years ago at the GTG in Hoboken when FabMax thought I was gonna go postal on him, and you were reassuring him that I was (reasonably) sane. I also seem to recall you had no major disagreements (neither did I as we were too busy stuffing steak into our pieholes to argue).
[157] chi,
Gotta get some thicker skin. His is just one opinion, and the euros have no reason to be smug.
re 142: obviously, Jamie Dimon is a porn star…right?
140 thanks relo…
Cooking up some squirrel for Ted Nugent’s aftershow meal.
#42 Jill
I was struggling trying to make that connection as well. It’s funny, he used to only have these hissy fits when someone criticized Ivy educations, but with me it seems to have really started when I pointed out some of the more laughable statements he made. For instance, my second favorite of this year:
“We don’t have a healthcare problem, we have a tort reform need.”
#53 Juice
So true. I have seen lots of people let go with no reason. If you don’t realise you are expendable, you have the wrong mindset. There are two ways to hold on, who you know and what you do. Even with that, be ready to get canned any day of the week and always have more than just a plan B. Your planning should make it through to a plan Z.
NJC,
En Croute? What is the proper wine pairing for squirrel?
#100 Chi
“he is so fabulously special”
I think you must have read my last 360 review.
#145
It was a simple calculation, there was no chance you would go postal as you had too much to lose.
Yawn…Monday.
#157 Chi
Do you want to elaborate on “grinding hypocrite” or is that another one of those sweeping generalization?
You ought to participate in a contest for among the most effective blogs on the internet. I will suggest this site! 600390