From HousingWire:
A nation of renters? Not so, delinquent borrowers say.
Report after report suggests that Americans have become wary of homeownership and prefer the lack of commitment that often accompanies renting.
These reports leave readers with the distinct impression that the future of America is one where citizens embrace the nomad lifestyle, with uncertain urban dwellers moving from apartment-to-apartment with backpacks filled with Ramen noodles in tow. (Okay, so the economy did revive many of these fears).
But one group who should be rather wary of homeownership says this just isn’t the case.
Fannie Mae’s recent survey of delinquent borrowers – a group who should be rather pessimistic about homeownership right now – finds that individuals in this group are still committed to the idea of homeownership despite recent difficulties.
The report put together by Steve Deggendorf, director of business strategy and economic and strategic research at Fannie Mae, found that in the past year delinquent borrowers have become much more positive about housing.
As they watch home prices rise, they begin to believe that what they’re fighting for is a long-term investment.
Although there have been plenty of reports doubting whether homeownership is a highly profitable investment tool in the long run (like this one from the Reason Foundation), the American Dream remains, the Fannie Mae report suggests. Back in 2011, a report from Pew Research still showed homeownership as a solid investment choice.
The study says most delinquent borrowers surveyed still believe in the financial and lifestyle benefits of homeownership.
The reality is delinquent borrowers do still feel somewhat less strongly on the ideals of owning a home when comparing their scores to the general population of borrowers, but they remain confident regardless.
From Zillow:
Sept. Case-Shiller Expected to Continue Showing Eye-Popping Annual Appreciation
The Case-Shiller data for August came out this morning, and based on this information and the September 2013 Zillow Home Value Index (ZHVI, released Oct. 17), we predict that next month’s Case-Shiller data (September 2013) will show that both the non-seasonally adjusted (NSA) 20-City Composite Home Price Index and the NSA 10-City Composite Home Price Index increased 13.2 percent on a year-over-year basis. The seasonally adjusted (SA) month-over-month change from August to September will be 0.8 percent for both the 20-City Composite and the 10-City Composite Home Price Indices (SA).
From National Mortgage Professional:
Foreclosures Dip 39 Percent Year-Over-Year in September
CoreLogic has released its September National Foreclosure Report which provides data on completed U.S. foreclosures and the national foreclosure inventory finding that in September, there were 51,000 completed foreclosures in the U.S., down from 84,000 in September 2012, a year-over-year decrease of 39 percent. On a month-over-month basis, completed foreclosures were virtually unchanged, decreasing 0.7 percent, from 51,000 reported in August.
As a basis of comparison, prior to the decline in the housing market in 2007, completed foreclosures averaged 21,000 per month nationwide between 2000 and 2006. Completed foreclosures are an indication of the total number of homes actually lost to foreclosure. Since the financial crisis began in September 2008, there have been approximately 4.6 million completed foreclosures across the country.
“The foreclosure inventory continues to decline, now standing at an early 2009 level,” said Mark Fleming, chief economist for CoreLogic. “Just over 900,000 properties remain in the inventory, two thirds of them in judicial states where the foreclosure process is typically slower. Consequently, the pace of overall improvement in the inventory will slow down and distressed assets will cast a long shadow over housing markets in states with judicial foreclosure.”
To discuss home ownership and affordability in our area without including property taxes in the equation is nothing more than a sales pitch.
From Time:
Obamacare Early Enrollment Numbers Embarrassingly Small
The Obamacare website has been plagued with glitches and coding problems, but at least the site is popular. The administration boasted over 4.7 million unique visits in the website’s first 24 hours.
It forgot to mention another number, however: the number of users who actually enrolled in Obamacare in the first 24 hours. It was six.
CBS obtained exclusive notes from the first few war room meetings following the Obamacare website launch, and has learned that the number of enrollments in the days following the launch were tiny.
The website launched on Tuesday, October 1st, and by Wednesday morning six people had enrolled. By that afternoon the enrollment numbers had reached 100, and by Wednesday night, 248 people had enrolled.
…
Obamacare needs 39,000 enrollments per day in order to reach its goal of 7 million by March 1st.
fukc you Maestro. just like your standard high-school-punk, Greenspan will not take any responsibility. and isn’t him also a big fan of that fiction writer A Rand? wasn’t he so admired for making his speeches on finance so incoherent and incomprehensible, just like chifi’s postings on finance? fukc you Maestro, fukc you chifi, fukc Greenspan. btw, who was the Prez in 1987?
“Regrets? The Maestro Has None”
Being Fed chairman apparently means never having to say you’re sorry.
In his media rounds plugging his new book, The Map and the Territory, former Federal Reserve chief Alan Greenspan admitted last week that he didn’t see the crisis of 2007-08 coming, but he refused to apologize for that. “I missed certain forecasts,” he admitted on Bloomberg TV. “You don’t apologize for that,” he said, adding that he isn’t omniscient and is a mere human being.
So why did things go so wrong, leading to the worst financial and economic meltdown since the Great Depression? Greenspan traces this to what he admits was a misplaced faith that banks and financial institutions would be better stewards of their own capital and act as self-regulators in a largely deregulated world.
But, in perhaps the most revelatory interview—with Jon Stewart on Comedy Central’s Daily Show—he confessed that, nonetheless, on Wall Street people sometimes “do screwy things.” “You just learned this?” Stewart replied in mock amazement to the ex-Fed boss, 87.”
Under the former Fed chief, the central bank provided insurance to investors in risky assets, such as stocks, through massive liquidity infusions, first after the 1987 crash and later following the failure of giant hedge fund Long-Term Capital Management in September 1998. After the dot-com bust, the Fed also eased aggressively, bringing short-term interest rates down to then-record lows.
easing eventually was followed by bubbles in commercial real estate and junk-bond-fueled leveraged buyouts. In reaction to the mild recession that followed, the Greenspan Fed took short-term interest rates down to levels not seen in generations: 3%. After the 1998 LTCM debacle, the Fed eased again, inflating the Internet bubble. And when that burst, the central bank took rates to still lower lows, 1% this time.”
So Bush 1 nominated Greenspan. so what? Carter nominated Volcker.
Had to change handle. Left Delaware earlier in week.
Don’t know if this link will work but its damn funny
https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=581438005243702&set=a.548934898494013.1073741829.311190048935167&type=1&ref=nf
LONDON (Reuters) – High levels of home ownership are strongly linked to subsequent rises in unemployment because labor mobility becomes reduced, according to new research.
Using data going back to 1950 across all U.S. states except Alaska and Hawaii, Warwick University economics professor Andrew Oswald finds that the lag from ownership levels to unemployment rates can take up to five years to show up.
But he said the linkage, established using data on millions of randomly sampled Americans, was extraordinarily robust.
Doubling home ownership in a state can lead to more than a doubling of the jobless rate.
“I have become convinced that by boosting home ownership we have ruined our labor market,” Oswald said.
He conducted his research with David Blanchflower, a professor of economics at Dartmouth College, New Hampshire, who used to be a member of the Bank of England’s Monetary Policy Committee.
Oswald said the research may go some way to explaining why Spain, with a home ownership rate of 80 percent, has unemployment above 25 percent, whereas Switzerland, with a 30 percent ownership rate, has a jobless rate of just 3 percent.
Germany, another nation of renters rather than home owners, also has relatively low unemployment.
Studies carried out independently by a Finnish researcher produced similar findings for the Nordic nation, Oswald said.
Home ownership unwittingly impairs the labor market by deterring people from moving in search of work, a process that is time-consuming and expensive; long commuting times might also discourage a householder from taking a particular job, his research suggests.
Another theory is that home owners are opposed to new businesses opening up in their neighborhoods – a phenomenon known in Britain as NIMBY, or Not In My Back Yard.
“This suggests that, without politicians being aware of it, high home ownership may slowly erode a country’s industrial base,” Oswald wrote in a paper for Warwick University and Chatham House, a London think tank.
He said his statistical correlations should be deeply worrying for politicians in those countries that have promoted home ownership through tax breaks and subsidized mortgages.
Britain is due to expand one such home-loan scheme, called Help to Buy, at the start of next year.
“In Britain we have incredibly cheap mortgages and we’re giving help-to-buy inducements on top of that in a world where house prices are already rising far above the rate of inflation that the Bank of England says it wants. It’s unbelievably illogical,” Oswald told Reuters.
It’s so funny when anon speaks to absolutely no point whatsoever.
It does not bode well for the media when one of the best interview takedowns of the financial criminal Greenspan gets done by a comedian.
I want a 911 GT3 maybe I can get the federal government to support my Porche ownership gap?
“The study says most delinquent borrowers surveyed still believe in the financial and lifestyle benefits of homeownership.”
Obamahomes?
[4] grim,
Hey, we found out who the six people were who enrolled in Obamacare!
http://money.cnn.com/2013/11/01/smallbusiness/sex-workers-obamacare/index.html
The jokes just write themselves.
Now, if Detroit needs a new mayor, this guy is experienced, lives just across the lake, and by all accounts is well versed in Detroit culture.
http://www.cnn.com/2013/10/31/world/americas/canada-toronto-mayor-crack/
http://www.philly.com/philly/news/new_jersey/Sea_levels_to_swamp_many_NJ_towns.html
http://www.philly.com/philly/blogs/trending/School-shuts-down-because-of-too-much-Axe-Body-Spray.html
It seems like a lot of Dems are getting nervous and putting some space between themselves and the King. Hey, everyone is expendable when it comes to getting re-elected. The bleeding heart charalatans don’t just toss people under the bus, they tie them to the tracks and run a locomotive over them a dozen times.
Uggh, no wonder anon is a mirrors reflection.
http://www.politico.com/story/2013/11/president-obama-off-the-record-99180_Page2.html
Gary (18):
The democrats who voted for it and are trying to distance themselves have nowhere to hide. This is what happens when one votes for a bill to see what is inside it. Their opponents will crucify them in the elections next year. Don’t get me wrong, if you are a representative in Loony California, Illinois, New York City, New Jersey and Florida you can get away with it. Everywhere else will be a problem.
[20] pain
You are confused. This is the most transparent presidency in history. Or to put it another way:
“You are a slow learner, Winston.”
“How can I help it? How can I help but see what is in front of my eyes? Two and two are four.”
“Sometimes, Winston. Sometimes they are five. Sometimes they are three. Sometimes they are all of them at once. You must try harder. It is not easy to become sane.”
All Hype,
What really amazes me is that we may never see a republican majority in the house, senate and WH in our lifetimes again. Not that I’m defending the repubs, it’s just that we’ve turned the corner of ign0rance and stup1dity in this country at such a rapid pace that I don’t think we can reverse the damage or so much as return to an optimistic message. Self-sufficiency and privatization seem to have become vicious words.
Gary (22):
I totally agree with you but remember the USA went bust in 2008. All decisions made since then have been to infuse the dead patient with more blood and shocks to get an apparent heartbeat. All that is going on right now is just the gubbint using their status as the world’s reserve currency to paper over the insolvency here and in the EU. Moral hazard is gone and all that is left is for the majority of people to rely on the gubbmint to stay afloat. Sadly, most of these people never job or coping skills to begin with. They are losers for life. All they can do is ensure the monthly check via continued voting for their own selfish interest and not for the future of the country.
Nom truly, Orwell had the year wrong
Eddie that is why the shutdown fiasco was so Quixotic, you have this opportunity to have your opponents put their head in the noose and jump off the platform you let them do it. The stupid party may have won the battle with their constituents but may have squandered an opportunity to win the war with independents. Teh repubs don’t have a messaging problem they have a strategy one. the thing that has passed them by is that the majority of independents are fiscally conservative and socially liberal. they tend to vote for democrats because they were historically seen to be the more permissive of the two parties. In 8 years chairman O has pretty much destroyed that perception rahter than snatch victory the beltway leadership continues to sell a failed message (conservative mores, more foreign adventurism, lip service to small government) when the tea leaves really point to a ea change amongst a good number of the constituents. What O care will cause people to do is look at the repubs for answers they will read it the wrong way, and it will be an ensconsed law further bringing this country to its ultimate end.
“Moral hazard is gone and all that is left is for the majority of people to rely on the gubbmint to stay afloat.”
Yup!
Someone in one of the comments sections of an online article made an interesting comparison. What they said was that in the time we were attacked at Pearl Harbor to the day Germany surrendered is almost the exact same time period that was spent on creating that healthcare site.
In that time, we mobilized millions, built tens of thousands of tanks, planes, jeeps, subs, cruisers, destroyers, torpedoes, millions upon millions of guns, bombs, ammo, etc. We turned the tide in North Africa, invaded Italy, D-Day, Battle of the Bulge, Race to Berlin – all while we were also fighting the Japanese in the Pacific!
All this in the same amount of time almost to the day.
To me, it confirms what my eyes see and intuition tells me: We have become a dumpy, lumpy, whiny, stup1d, complacent bunch of d0lts who cannot fight, defend, work or persevere with any consistency, patience, endurance or resilience.
http://online.wsj.com/news/articles/SB10001424052702304799404579157900285752782?KEYWORDS=rate+lock
Lenders Extend the Clock on the Lock
By
AnnaMaria Andriotis
Oct. 31, 2013 8:06 p.m. ET
Wealthy borrowers these days want lenders who aren’t afraid of commitment.
Jumbo-mortgage applicants are demanding long-term rate “locks” while they close on their homes. And rather than settle for the standard lock of a month or two, they’re asking lenders for commitments of half a year—or longer.
The upside for borrowers is that rate locks provide protection and peace of mind in a rising-rate environment. Without one, they risk being stuck with a higher rate than they were initially quoted and a mortgage costing hundreds of thousands of dollars more over the life of the loan. A jump in mortgage rates can also shrink the total dollar amount available to borrowers.
The downside: Long-term locks are rarely free. Borrowers who want a rate lock beyond 60 days typically have to pay a deposit. Also, borrowers often aren’t locking the current market rate but rather that rate plus a fraction of a percentage point or more.
Rate locks don’t typically happen automatically. In most cases, mortgage applicants have to put in the request with the lender, a trend that has been on the rise.
Locked mortgages make up roughly 60% of the total pending mortgage pipeline at New Penn Financial, a mortgage lender based in Plymouth Meeting, Pa., and subsidiary of Shellpoint Partners. That is up from 45% in May before mortgage rates started climbing, the company says. EverBank, EVER 0.00% a national lender, cites a roughly 10% increase in jumbo mortgage applicants locking in rates since June. And Wells Fargo WFC +0.77% says more of its jumbo applicants are signing up for rate locks earlier in the application process.
Mortgage-rate volatility is pushing borrowers to lock. Rates on 30-year fixed-rate jumbos averaged 3.82% in the beginning of May—the lowest this year—and hit a peak of 4.88% by mid-September, before dropping again, according to mortgage info website HSH.com. They are currently hovering around 4.4%.
Most rate locks last for 30 days to 90 days, but some lenders are extending those periods. In September, New Penn Financial, which provides mortgages of up to $2.5 million, lengthened its rate lock to up to 360 days, from a previous maximum of 60 days. EverBank increased its maximum lock period to 270 days beginning in August, up from 90 days, mostly for borrowers waiting for construction on their new homes to end.
Still, a rate lock alone won’t suffice for many affluent borrowers. While rates have been rising, there have been brief pullbacks. As a result, some borrowers have turned to a so-called float-down option—which is essentially the best of both worlds: protection from rising rates and the ability to break the lock if mortgage rates decline by at least an eighth to a quarter of a percentage point. Borrowers typically have to pay a fee to have this option, which often equals around a quarter of a percentage point of the total dollar amount of the loan, says Keith Gumbinger, vice president at HSH.com.
In a sign that home buyers are gaining more leverage in the mortgage market, lenders are once again introducing so-called lock-and-shop rate locks, which allow buyers to lock in a rate for several months while they shop for a home. (Locks were traditionally available only to buyers whose offer on a home had been accepted.) New Penn, which is preparing to roll out this option, will give buyers 45 days to shop for a home while guaranteeing them their locked rate. EverBank says it will soon introduce this feature for buyers for up to three months.
A hypothetical example shows why locks could be appealing to more luxury home buyers:
Someone who locked in a $1.5 million, 30-year, fixed-rate jumbo mortgage at 4.34% for the week ending June 7and closed on the loan three months later, would have ended up with a monthly payment that is roughly $466 lower than if he had received a 4.86% average rate for the week ending Sept. 6. Over the life of the loan, the lock would have saved more than $167,000 in interest payments. (The average weekly rates are from HSH.com; an eighth of a percentage point was added as a cost to lock the June rate, although that could differ depending on the lender.)
The costs for a lock often include two elements. First, there is a markup, usually adding one-eighth to as much as 1.5 percentage points to the market rate at the time of the lock. Second, lenders could require a deposit, which is typically applied toward closing costs, that ranges from an eighth to 1.5 percentage points of the total dollar amount of the loan. The longer the lock, the bigger the markup or the deposit.
Other issues to consider:
Missing from the fine print: Many lenders don’t say they offer rate locks or float downs but will make them available to borrowers who ask.
Free extensions: Ask lenders about flexible deadlines. Some lenders will give an extension for free if borrowers need a few more days to close.
Not for ARMs: Locks are mostly available for fixed-rate mortgages rather than adjustable-rate mortgages whose initial rates tend to be less volatile.
ACA will not bring this country to its end. That’s the Republican Party speaking. The majority of workers in this country, 61% (down from 68% in 2,000 but mostly attributable to greater unemployment) have company sponsored insurance. Then there’s Medicare for the elderly, leaving a pretty small percentage of the population uninsured. Much of this small group causes a ton of money to cover since they end up flooding hospital emergency rooms instead of clinics and doctors offices since they have no place else to go. By insuring them and allowing a little bit of preventative care, it should save money in the end, or perhaps even cost us a little more than it does now. But it’s not the end of America. That’s just silly.
Bloomberg radio this morning: Only 18% of Americans have a piece of their investments in equities. A small percentage are holding some case but all in all, the majority of Americans are living paycheck to paycheck.
case = cash
But but, I was told the stock market = the economy?
Fast Eddie says:
November 1, 2013 at 10:33 am
Bloomberg radio this morning: Only 18% of Americans have a piece of their investments in equities. A small percentage are holding some case but all in all, the majority of Americans are living paycheck to paycheck.
Eddie,
That’s because they lack any kind of financial education. Whose fault is that?
I’m thinking about starting an investment club for local kids. I was lucky enough to have parents who made me fill out my own taxes and to have taught me about simple financial issues such as interest rates, using credit, investing in equities, CDs, etc. I simply want to pass this knowledge onto the next generation so they can have the same advantages that I had. The masses are @sses. Just look at Anon.
joyce,
Are you talking about the U.S. economy or the global economy? :)
Lib for me I don’t see ACA being the thing that brings us down totally, but we have a growing class of people so dependent on the government for answers, that soon it will be the only place for answers because they will not now any better. Do I see the productive going Galt? Not entirely, there always those whose productivity and skill cause them to rise above the hurdles in front of them. What I see is a reduction in opportunity and sloth that will mirror Europes.
It it could all come crashing down or we just bounce along the bottom like the British for the last hundred years
And in other news, you can buy gas in Wayne for $2.89. Keep on printing.
We just bounce along the bottom. Yup. That how’s I see us going forward. On the bright side, we really do still have a lot of ingenuity and creativity embedded in our culture that should provide us some competitive balance on the global scene. I’ve dealt with many internationals over the years and they’re close-mindedness (like Anon’s) is simply sickening. My biggest issue with the management of my team in Chennai is that they struggle so much with grey areas. They truly need everything to be black and white. It drives me up a wall.
[139 from yesterday] “Those who do not support choice must be first in line to adopt unwanted babies, and should be prepared to take that responsibility several times over…….note: choice is not pro-abortion….”
No, it doesn’t work that way. My opposition to Bebo drowning his newborn in the bathtub doesn’t put me on the hook to adopt said newborn.
In any case, it’s a moot point as the waiting list for adopting a newborn baby in the U.S. is already years-long and growing.
#35…what is the relationship between current gas prices and Fed purchases of MBS that are being held on their books? I think if you want to say that current purchases of MBS by the Fed has increased bond prices and thus reduced rates people are paying on mortgages, that makes sense.
I was trying to make a backwards point about the dilution of our dollar and how it does not seem to be affecting gas prices, which you would think would go up as our dollar loses value against world currencies. That’s all. Don’t read too deeply into it.
[23] hype,
Some quotable quotes:
“A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the people discover they can vote themselves largess out of the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits from the public treasury, with the result that democracy always collapses over a loose fiscal policy–to be followed by a dictatorship.” Alexander Fraser Tytler, Year unknown.
“Democracy never lasts long. It soon wastes, exhausts and murders itself. There was never a democracy that did not commit suicide.” John Adams, year unknown.
“A Republic, if you can keep it.” Benjamin Franklin, 1787
“A democracy is nothing more than mob rule, where 51 percent of the people may take away the rights of the other 49.” attributed to Thomas Jefferson, year unknown.
“Democracy means simply the bludgeoning of the people by the people for the people.” Oscar Wilde, year unknown.
“A democratic government is the only one in which those who vote for a tax can escape the obligation to pay it.” Alexis de Tocqueville, year unknown.
““Moral hazard is gone and all that is left is for the majority of people to rely on the gubbmint to stay afloat.” All Hype, 2013
At least those who identify themselves as Republicans should face up to all the entitlements and benefits they accept willingly from the gov’t. Are they in denial? When unemployment benefits ran as long as 1 1/2 yrs during height of recession I saw those on both sides of the fence enjoy their checks without lifting a finger to get a job. When a Republican friend’s relative needed mental health counseling and shelter she was the first one to turn to the gov’t. It’s so easy to bad mouth those “free loaders” but harder to look oneself in the mirror and admit you might be one of them. We really aren’t all that different from one another. Too much stereotyping on both sides of the fence.
[26] eddie,
“To me, it confirms what my eyes see and intuition tells me: We have become a dumpy, lumpy, whiny, stup1d, complacent bunch of d0lts who cannot fight, defend, work or persevere with any consistency, patience, endurance or resilience.”
But at least some of us can repost tweets.
Just saw a Barbara buono commercial. Why is that dusty old rag trying to look like Nancy Pelosi? it’s not a look to aspire too. You see the problem with libtards are their childlike reasoning skills. They base decisions off of emotion not data. It’s a shame that they are scared of their own shadow.
To correct this mental retardation i suggest forcing them to fire off a hundred rounds of 223 by their 18th birthday.
Where’s the world condemnation of Israel after they attacked Syria three times last night? That’s right, we can rip the Zionist apart in the liberal press, but when push comes to shove, we are grateful for their existence and willingness to get their military hands dirty.
You just cannot make this stuff up . . . .
From CNN (hardly a Tea Party site):
“In September 2010, Senate Republicans brought a resolution to the floor to block implementation of the grandfather rule, warning that it would result in canceled policies and violate President Barack Obama’s promise that people could keep their insurance if they liked it.
“The District of Columbia is an island surrounded by reality. Only in the District of Columbia could you get away with telling the people if you like what you have you can keep it, and then pass regulations six months later that do just the opposite and figure that people are going to ignore it. But common sense is eventually going to prevail in this town and common sense is going to have to prevail on this piece of legislation as well,” Iowa Sen. Chuck Grassley said at the time.
“The administration’s own regulations prove this is not the case. Under the grandfathering regulation, according to the White House’s own economic impact analysis, as many as 69 percent of businesses will lose their grandfathered status by 2013 and be forced to buy government-approved plans,” the Iowa Republican said.
On a party line vote, Democrats killed the resolution. . . “
[41] “At least those who identify themselves as Republicans should face up to all the entitlements and benefits they accept willingly from the gov’t. Are they in denial? When unemployment benefits ran as long as 1 1/2 yrs during height of recession I saw those on both sides of the fence enjoy their checks without lifting a finger to get a job.”
It is entirely rational to say, “I don’t think I or anyone else should be taxed at the point of a gun to pay for [insert entitlement here] and I will vote and argue against it. But while I am being forced to pay for this [entitlement] program, the rational decision is for me to receive benefits from it, if the law says I can. At least that way perhaps I can minimize how much the government is stealing from me to pay for this program.”
best description of our current democracy i could come up with
“It comes from a very ancient democracy, you see….”
“You mean, it comes from a world of lizards?”
“No,” said Ford, who by this time was a little more rational and coherent than he had been, having finally had the coffee forced down him, “nothing so simple. Nothing anything like so straightforward. On its world, the people are people. The leaders are lizards. The people hate the lizards and the lizards rule the people.”
“Odd,” said Arthur, “I thought you said it was a democracy.”
“I did,” said Ford. “It is.”
“So,” said Arthur, hoping he wasn’t sounding ridiculously obtuse, “why don’t the people get rid of the lizards?”
“It honestly doesn’t occur to them,” said Ford. “They’ve all got the vote, so they all pretty much assume that the government they’ve voted in more or less approximates to the government they want.”
“You mean they actually vote for the lizards?”
“Oh yes,” said Ford with a shrug, “of course.”
“But,” said Arthur, going for the big one again, “why?”
“Because if they didn’t vote for a lizard,” said Ford, “the wrong lizard might get in.”
Douglas Adams, in So Long, And Thanks For All The Fish (1984) Ch. 36.
46. Eh, maybe. Sounds like a way of rationalizing one’s behavior to oneself to me. It doesn’t make it right for them to have accepted unemployment benefits and not actually try to find a job. No excuse for that.
[48] “It doesn’t make it right for them to have accepted unemployment benefits and not actually try to find a job. No excuse for that.”
More to the point: There is no excuse for the law that allows people to accept benefits without actually trying to find a job (or being put to work doing something — anything), much less a law that funds such a program by taxing working people at the point of a gun to pay for it.
Fix the law — don’t complain about individual people playing for Team Red or Team Blue who are taking advantage of it.
Speaking of entitlements, I heard a crazy statistic this morning. Approximately 20% of food stamps benefits are spent at Walmart, to the tune of ~ $15 billion.
Don’t blame me i voted for kodos
At least those who identify themselves as Republicans should face up to all the entitlements and benefits they accept willingly from the gov’t. Are they in denial?
It’s a miniscule percentage compared to the muffin top and tat crowd who prefer to s.uck on government t1ts for a living. And those who identify themselves as bleeding heart l1berals should contribute at least 10% of their income to those causes to aid the meek and less fortunate. After all, it is the compassionate thing to do. Right?
The worst offenders are the seniors, most of whom are overwhelming members of the red team (since the Republicans have been wooing them for years). They are so adamantly against single-payer that it may be the most obvious hypocritical position I’ve ever seen a voting group take ever. I’m not taking sides here as both sides are hypnotized sheep. But this particular position has bothered me since day one. And sadly, I favor single payer over what we currently have, which is the insurance companies lobbying for the largest piece of the pie.
[41] whine,
Not only will I accept every benefit that I paid for, I’ll go you one further and posit that because I paid MORE than you, I should get more benefit. As it stands, I pay a lot more and get a lot less.
Now, since you want to talk about justification, here’s one that should be easy for you:
Justify progressive taxation (in general, not its various forms) in a way that doesn’t use the irreducible core rationalization that its okay to tax the makers more because they have it.
that’s a great idea. instead of contributors to society, what we need is more Wall St. speculators. have them go into real estate. show them that only fools actually make something with their hands. make sure to charge them a fee and become a maggot like chifi.
Libturd (the good one) says:
November 1, 2013 at 10:38 am
Eddie,
I’m thinking about starting an investment club for local kids.
#44
It’s called apathy. Why should anyone in the US give a shlt what goes on in Syria?
Your first statement has to be hedged by your profession / job(s) over the years.
I agree with you that there is no moral justification for progressive taxation. I could even make the argument that a fixed % is also wrong. A flat amount is the epitome of fair.
Comrade Nom Deplume, Guardian of the Realm says:
November 1, 2013 at 12:17 pm
[41] whine,
Not only will I accept every benefit that I paid for, I’ll go you one further and posit that because I paid MORE than you, I should get more benefit. As it stands, I pay a lot more and get a lot less.
Now, since you want to talk about justification, here’s one that should be easy for you:
Justify progressive taxation (in general, not its various forms) in a way that doesn’t use the irreducible core rationalization that its okay to tax the makers more because they have it.
What are you a welder?
anon (the good one) says:
November 1, 2013 at 12:19 pm
that’s a great idea. instead of contributors to society, what we need is more Wall St. speculators. have them go into real estate. show them that only fools actually make something with their hands. make sure to charge them a fee and become a maggot like chifi.
[56] “It’s called apathy. Why should anyone in the US give a shlt what goes on in Syria?”
I think the argument goes . . .
Because Team Israel wants peace and Team Islam wants to destroy Team Israel. And definitely, definitely neither team wants to maintain the militaristic status quo of endless war. In other words — baa! baa! (Because we’re all so smug.)
[55] anon
“instead of contributors to society, what we need is more Wall St. speculators. ”
Water seeks its own level. Noodle on that and explain to me how you would encourage contributors and discourage speculators.
I’ve got all day.
[57] joyce,
Actually, I would say that moral justification is one of the stronger ones, but ATEOTD, it can be still be boiled down to “We need it, you have it” as one OWS type said.
Personally, I like the justification “It’s the price you pay for peace (meaning we won’t riot and take all your wealth if you pay us enough not to)” It is also a justification that is as old as mankind itself (e.g., barbarians exacting “tribute” from the Western Roman Empire) and can simply be summed up as the Law of the Jungle.
My point is that there is no inherent “right” here, no “truth” that supports progressive taxation. We have it only because there are more votes for it than against. Period.
Comrade,
To clarify, I mean no one whether its one on one or through an intermediary (govt) has the right to rob someone… no matter how noble others may claim it is. I know we agree, just making sure we’re not getting caught up on the word moral.
Hughes International News Update for Friday Mid-Day November 1st:
http://pagesix.com/2013/11/01/honey-boo-boo-and-family-dress-as-the-kardashians-for-halloween/?_ga=1.149158837.2037947440.1368809669
You’ve heard about the controversies within the bill, the process about the bill, one or the other. But I don’t know if you have heard that it is legislation for the future, not just about health care for America, but about a healthier America, where preventive care is not something that you have to pay a deductible for or out of pocket. Prevention, prevention, prevention—it’s about diet, not diabetes. It’s going to be very, very exciting. But we have to pass the bill so that you can find out what is in it, away from the fog of the controversy.
#59
Right, we’re all humanitarians now. We have to stop the civil war.
Baa baa.
Anon,
Way to judge that of which you are hopelessly ignorant of. Personal finance does not equate to Wall Street and their financial shenanigans. But you wouldn’t know that. All you know is what your blue masters spoon feed you. You have a very dangerous mind. One that is far to easily manipulated. Do you click your heals before you begin walking?
leech not maggot……silly rabbit, Trix are for kids…..
anon (the good one) says:
November 1, 2013 at 12:19 pm
that’s a great idea. instead of contributors to society, what we need is more Wall St. speculators. have them go into real estate. show them that only fools actually make something with their hands. make sure to charge them a fee and become a maggot like chifi.
joyce says: “What are you a welder?”
Don’t give him that much credit. I’m guessing Anon works (I use that word lightly) in one of those public sector jobs that the government created as part of a job creation program with the excuse that it’s cheaper than having to pay Anon’s unemployment or welfare checks.
Gym teacher? Seems to smart even for that
My guess is that Anon works at a place like the Sierra Club or NJPIRG. He is probably the treasurer or something like that.
Anon, seriously, putting together an investment club is a good thing. Financial common sense is what separates those who can survive on their own versus those who will be dependent on Uncle Barak. Is that really such a bad thing? If yes then you are really a hopeless dolt.
I think most of us know right from wrong. If the law already states that you are supposed to be job hunting and you aren’t being chased around to ensure that you are, that makes it right that you aren’t job hunting? I thought Republicans were all about taking personal responsibility.
Life under an anon administration:
http://homes.yahoo.com/photos/haunting-photos-of-abandoned-castles-1383173519-slideshow/
53. I don’t know if the seniors are the worst offenders. I do recall one patient who was 90+ yrs. old and who receives frequent “procedures” done where I work, all on Medicare’s dime. She has received these expensive procedures for years. She brought up Obamacare and wouldn’t stop complaining about it, even while she signed all the papers for her very generous benefits under Medicare.
Oh, speaking of NJPIRG, my sister worked for them during the summers when she was in college. The workers there were straight up communists. She even dated one. It was great when he would try to talk politics with my Russian dad and uncles. Haha!!! FYI… Stalin threw my great-grandfather and great uncle in the gulag for 3 years for having a windmill. They also stole, errr, I mean redistributed food off of their farm yearly until WWII started.
No joke, my family was going to pay the commie off to stop dating my sister!! They were going to offer 15k!!! LOL!!!
re # 75 – Pay him off? Why not scare him off, isn’t there a Boris in the family that does that?
This cracked me up:
“The democrats who voted for it and are trying to distance themselves have nowhere to hide. This is what happens when one votes for a bill to see what is inside it. Their opponents will crucify them in the elections next year. Don’t get me wrong, if you are a representative in Loony California, Illinois, New York City, New Jersey and Florida you can get away with it. Everywhere else will be a problem.”
So basically everybody who lives in California, New York City, New Jersey is a loonies? You do realize those happen to be the most affluent/desired/internationally recognized places to live in the United States?
Have fun with your overall wearing representative from [insert flyover state name here].
ag (43)-
Why waste hundreds of perfectly good rounds of .223 when somebody can just put one between Buono’s eyes?
Trying to look like Pelosi is like trying to look like Phyllis Diller. OTOH, at least Diller was funny.
“To correct this mental retardation i suggest forcing them to fire off a hundred rounds of 223 by their 18th birthday.”
stu (44)-
I’m just sad the Mossad hasn’t seen fit to whack Assad.
TSA agent gone postal?
“So basically everybody who lives in California, New York City, New Jersey is a loonies?”
No, just a majority of the voting public. I was born and raised here in NJ and I can honestly say NJ has done a 180 degree turn to lunacy in the past 25 years. I lived in blue collar h@ll growing up in South River but back in the good old late 70s and 80s people had opportunities for jobs in places like J&J, Dupont, Hercules, Merck, Schering Plough, etc, etc. The liberal tax loonies took over and the economy has totally imploded. People like me and a few other here are the last of a dying breed; financially solvent with an ability to find meaningful employment. Lunacy has turned the state into a quasi 3rd world banana republic.
I don’t know if it’s “too” good, but most seniors that I know are living pretty large.
For the most part, they have pensions, SS, Medicare and their portfolios are flush. Any cash flow they have is spent on traveling since it doesn’t make a lot of sense for them to invest it now.
I’m sure there are some out there living completely on fixed income who are hurting but anyone with means during their working lives are doing well.
Holy damn we’re idiots..
State gives American Dream project in Meadowlands $390 million grant
The state Economic Development Authority yesterday approved a $390 million grant – largest in the agency’s history — for the developers of the American Dream Meadowlands project in East Rutherford. The grant surpasses the $240 million awarded to the Revel Casino in Atlantic City.
The project, formerly called Xanadu, was also approved for $800 million in tax-exempt bonds from East Rutherford and the Bergen County Improvement Authority on Thursday.
A spokesman for Triple Five, the developer, said yesterday’s vote by the EDA marked “the end of the beginning.”
“This completes our capitalization of the project,” said spokesman Alan Marcus. He said the company would begin selling the bonds early next year. The bonds are backed by Goldman Sachs.
We’ve identified the issue surrounding the delay of the opening of the mall … they forgot the water park!
Dummies, how could they forget the water park!
We’re so f*cked
Stop fighting, and let the feelings of oblivion wash over you…
Democracy is two wolves and one sheep voting on what’s for dinner.
Stay tuned . . .
http://washingtonexaminer.com/article/2538263
[76] ccb
“So basically everybody who lives in California, New York City, New Jersey is a loonies?”
I’m sorry, was that really a question?
[85] expat.
. . . . and liberty is a well-armed sheep contesting the vote.
(this was attributed to Ben Franklin but there has been an effort as of late to debunk that).
Best quote from grim’s $390M EDA article……
“There is no public risk,” Marcus said, as the bonds and grant are “paid back by funds generated by the project.”
[79] juice
Doesn’t look that way. He supposedly asked someone if they were TSA. An agent would have known otherwise. Still premature but obviously someone with an axe to grind against TSA as they were pretty clearly targeted.
Xanadú has had a few victims already. Mills Corp, Colony Capital, heck even Lehman Bros. The latest bonds are based on estimates of 55 million visitors a year. That is allot of cars clogging up the highways. Even if it has some train service I doubt people in NYC will trudge there to shop unless they extend the Urban Enterprise Zone to this location for 3.5% sales tax. Plus doesn’t Bergen County’s Blue Laws extend to this location? Closed on Sunday?
THe blue law change is off the ballot again. Governor Christie promised to deliver the mall with cash, bonds and no Blue Law restrictions. I doubt he call bully his way out of this one.
http://www.nj.com/bergen/index.ssf/2013/10/its_official_blue_law_question_left_off_bergen_county_ballots.html
Here is a missive from Triple 5 the latest builder to attempt to complete this project.
“When this is lit up — alive and glowing — everyone in Manhattan is going to look and go, ‘Wow, what’s going on over there?’ and they’re going to make that trip because it’s going to be that exciting”
Sure they will I say…
Juice you have seen all the ny plates at garden state plaza, riverside square, and Paramus park on Saturdays. To save a perceived few bucks on taxes they will instead spend it on gas and tolls.
If it ever opens they were always banking on the stupidity of perceived value and proximity to trains.
neutron bomb that mf’er
Do the lefties say that people in the Soviet gulag were hypocritical to complain? After all they were getting free government lodging, healthcare, and maggoty food. The moment you get your first government benefit, you’re slave to society for life, right?
That’s why they love the neonatal programs so much. Born owing government their life and a duty to follow state orders.
re # 92- Just saying that is allot of foot traffic. 150k a day with Sunday open and 175 k a day closed.
[93] spine,
A neutron bomb might leave it standing. Instead it would kill off Rutherford and Secaucus from radiation. As much as an evil part of my subconscious relishes the idea of millions of dead Jets/Giants fans, a neutron bomb wouldn’t solve your problem.
I suggest several well-placed Daisy Cutters instead.
Apparently the Xanadú Ferris wheel is still on, however Staten Island wasn’t to one up the one in NJ.
http://ny.curbed.com/archives/2013/11/01/ferris_wheel_approval_energizes_staten_islands_development.php
This is how desensitized to violence I’ve become:
1. Worked straight through lunch today, didn’t really talk to anybody so I left the office at 3PM
2. Stopped at this little dive bar in Waltham that makes great hamburgers, bartender works the grill right behind the bar himself, he’s the only employee.
3. Watched Fox News intently at the bar, first I heard of the LAX shooting. Forty-five minutes, two beers and one burger later I left.
4. Drove home, forgot completely about it until I read a mention here minutes ago.
And so it begins…
The man suspected of opening fire has been identified as 23-year-old Paul Ciancia, according to a U.S. Congresswoman.
Apparently Paul joined FB 30 minutes ago:
https://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=100007008666451&fref=ts
Product of Pennsville, NJ. Shocker.
http://www.heavy.com/news/2013/11/paul-anthony-ciancia-lax-shooter-suspect/
Corzine Personally Liable?
http://www.nj.com/business/index.ssf/2013/11/corzine_cant_use_mf_global_cre.html#incart_river_default
The only source of utility for the ferris wheel at Xan\xdu is that it blocks some of the priciest views of NYC from the PRM….
Juice Box says:
November 1, 2013 at 4:24 pm
Apparently the Xanadú Ferris wheel is still on, however Staten Island wasn’t to one up the one in NJ.
If the LAX shooter is so anti-gubmint, why didn’t he take out a few congresscritters?
I miss Slick Willie…..
WASHINGTON – Bill Clinton trotted out a crude anatomical joke about President Obama, saying “he’s luckier than a dog with two dicks” to describe his comeback in last year’s presidential election, according to a new book.
Clinton made the dirty canine quip “again and again” to friends, according to “Double Down,” the latest campaign book by Mark Halperin and John Heilemann.
The book, which like its predecessor “Game Change” about the 2008 election, appears to have heavy sourcing from within the Clinton camp, describes lingering tensions between Obama and Clinton.
“MOBILE, Ala. — With only days to go before a special Republican primary runoff for Congress here in South Alabama, the national business lobby is going all in.
In the first test of its post-government-shutdown effort to derail Tea Party candidates, the U.S. Chamber of Commerce put on a rally on Tuesday in the warehouse of an aluminum plant to show its support for Bradley Byrne, a lawyer and former Republican officeholder.
Companies as diverse as Caterpillar and AT&T have also sent in a last-minute flurry of donations. The goal, backers of Mr. Byrne said, is to elect not just a Republican, but the right kind of pro-business one.
Dean Young, the Tea Party-backed businessman who is running against Mr. Byrne, seems only to be reveling in his opponent’s establishment, big-money support, repeatedly praising Senator Ted Cruz of Texas for leading the way to the government shutdown and saying that if he wins it will be in the face of “the entire Republican establishment.”
“I’ve got an army of people that care about this nation,” said Mr. Young, a tall, brawny man with a shaved head and a stern delivery, after a debate on Wednesday night. “We’re on our own, but that’s O.K., because when we win, it sends a bigger message.”
Despite Mr. Byrne’s substantial advantage in campaign money and endorsements, Republican consultants and voters here say that the zeal of Mr. Young’s Christian conservative supporters puts the outcome of the runoff at even odds, suggesting that the fight over control of the Republican Party is likely to be long, hard and unpredictable.
It is a reality that has some of the Washington lobbyists and political consultants who are helping orchestrate the anti-Tea Party push concerned, particularly given that extreme conservatives tend to be more reliable voters. “
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#18 Fast Eddie
Who’s getting nervous, or is that just another talking point pulled from a website. What I have noticed up her in Republican He11 AKA Northern Bergen county is that, for the second election cycle, the Repubs are not putting their party affiliation on their campaign literature. I say they are running more scared.
Interesting poll. I had this discussion with Jamil back in the day. He kept trotting out the line “Most of the country are opposed to Obamacare” I had to point out that his numbers included 15% of the people who though it didn’t go far enough. It seems that number is up to 20%.
What the Polls Say on Obamacare: Mend It, Don’t End It
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/frame_game/2013/10/obamacare_polls_americans_want_to_reform_the_affordable_care_act_not_repeal.html?wpisrc=burger_bar
[108] Caligula
For me, Obamacare and this administrations efforts to reshape the HEW and retirement regimes in this country is the gift that keeps on giving. In fact, Obama is the cause of 80% of my billable work over the past three years and close to half over the past five.
And this week Treasury just announced another change that affects my clients–personally I think they had questionable legal grounds but no one is going to sue to stop it. So I’ll be putting out the feelers for more legal work here.
Fanius,
Something occurred to me. If you hate the US so much, and long for the culture, politics, and economy of the British isles so much that you want to see the US become more like the UK, why are you here? Wouldn’t you be so much happier back across the pond where there are no gun nuts, no conservatives, and no cold, weak beer?
[103] spine,
Turns out LAX shooter went to a catholic school near my younger daughters school in Wilmington. I drove by it whenever I had dropoff duty. Funny thing is that it is a hike from NJ, even from across the river. Methinks this kid had issues even back then.
“When the last tree has been cut down, the last fish caught, the last river poisoned; only then we will realize that one cannot eat money.”
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Jose Mujica: ‘I earn more than I need’
Last updated: 26 October 2013
The man described as the world’s ‘poorest president’ discusses Uruguay’s move to legalise marijuana.
President Jose Mujica, the world’s ‘poorest’ president, has surprised the world by making Uruguay the first country to entirely legalise marijuana.
Magpies shove it up Mourinho’s arse, 2-0!
@HarvardBiz: “It’s time to move beyond the myth that US healthcare is costly because of exceptional quality” http://t.co/7sBDW1coaG via @washingtonpost
Idiot time again at NJRER, I see.
[115] spine,
This team mystifies me.
Now I want to see the Reds drop the Gooners. I thought about joining the Reds fan group for the game, just so I get a chance to haul off on a gooner.
I think the Arsenal will go down with a whimper. Chelsea blew pretty much their first unit off the field midweek. Lots of Arsenal passing to nowhere and poor defending.
@pourmecoffee: Remember to set your clocks back an hour tonight because Obama is redistributing time.
Well…you know….the taxes are lower here, access to high quality healthcare is easier for those rich enough to afford it, and most importantly, the job market is more capitalistic allowing people with sought after skills to be fully compensated in a competitive and less restricted environment…….but other than those advantages, this country totally sucks moose c0ck….
Comrade Nom Deplume, a.k.a Captain Justice says:
November 2, 2013 at 9:27 am
Fanius, Something occurred to me. If you hate the US so much, and long for the culture, politics, and economy of the British isles so much that you want to see the US become more like the UK, why are you here? Wouldn’t you be so much happier back across the pond where there are no gun nuts, no conservatives, and no cold, weak beer?
restrictive
Minor fender bender….
http://nypost.com/2013/11/02/oops-truck-backs-up-runs-over-295k-ferrari/
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[121] chifi
“the taxes are lower here, access to high quality healthcare is easier for those rich enough to afford it, and most importantly, the job market is more capitalistic allowing people with sought after skills to be fully compensated in a competitive and less restricted environment”
But those are all things Fabius hates about the US.
Nice try, health care reform and Obamacare are not synonymous. People want health care reform, not this POS amalgamation of special interests. And when Obamacare ultimately fails and is reformed drastically, it will no longer be Obamacare.
Fabius Maximus says:
November 2, 2013 at 8:50 am
Interesting poll. I had this discussion with Jamil back in the day. He kept trotting out the line “Most of the country are opposed to Obamacare” I had to point out that his numbers included 15% of the people who though it didn’t go far enough. It seems that number is up to 20%.
What the Polls Say on Obamacare: Mend It, Don’t End It
http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/frame_game/2013/10/obamacare_polls_americans_want_to_reform_the_affordable_care_act_not_repeal.html?wpisrc=burger_bar
BC just upset VT. I was sitting at my desk and heard a huge roar from the stadium about 1/2 mile away. It seemed alarmingly loud for the windows being closed. Turned on the TV and saw BC had just gone up by by two TDs 34-20 with 4 minutes to play. VT got one touchdown back quickly and then forced a BC 4-and-out. VT got the ball back with about 2 minutes left but BC’s coverage caused two incomplete passes and then forced a fumble after VT’s Logan Thomas got flushed from the pocket. BC might be the only Boston team I don’t mind winning a game.
grim et other shills
Obviously we are going for a new bottom
Sept. Pending Sales… the largest MoM drop since Sept 2001… not 2011… yes, 2001.
–US Pendings Fell 21.1% MoM on an NSA basis (down more not including last month’s revision), the most on record for any Sept since Sept 2001…that’s a terrible period to comp against.
–YoY, Northeast & West Pendings down YoY by 3.1% and 5.2% respectively…the first YoY drop since after the 2010 sunset of the Homebuyer Tax Credit.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-11-02/oh-crap-moment-housing-now-can
No surprise here. The rigged-up game that is residential real estate is about to shit the bed again. Listen for the gnashing of teeth in a few weeks.
Housing is dead money for the next 50-100 years. Don’t get sucked into this fool’s game.
Nobody cares what you think. Head back to Patrick.net if you want a circle jerk.
unbelievable says:
November 2, 2013 at 6:04 pm
grim et other shills
Obviously we are going for a new bottom
Sept. Pending Sales… the largest MoM drop since Sept 2001… not 2011… yes, 2001.
–US Pendings Fell 21.1% MoM on an NSA basis (down more not including last month’s revision), the most on record for any Sept since Sept 2001…that’s a terrible period to comp against.
–YoY, Northeast & West Pendings down YoY by 3.1% and 5.2% respectively…the first YoY drop since after the 2010 sunset of the Homebuyer Tax Credit.
http://www.zerohedge.com/news/2013-11-02/oh-crap-moment-housing-now-can
Banksy, my favorite artist ever, just finished his NY residency without the NYPD catching him.
Take a moment to check out the pieces.
http://www.banksy.co.uk/
And you can buy a tee-shirt, to support 5pointz
http://teespring.com/banksyny
#131 redux
And I think Oct 21 gets a special shout out to JJ and the rest of the South Bronx Boyz!
http://www.banksy.co.uk/2013/10/21/south-bronx
#115 Clot
Thank You, if we win the league from Chelsea by 2 points, I’ll even buy you a beer.
#121 Chi
When you a make and assumption like that you have to remember.
ASSUME = You are a total ASS if U think you know ME!
#121 Redux
When you refer to “this country totally sucks moose c0ck…. ” are you referring to Eddie Ray and his obsession with Teddy Roosevelt and his Bull Moose (the ultimate Progressives!) party?
Just Checking!