Do or die time

From NJBIZ:

NJ’s challenged suburban economy is now in crisis courtesy of Congress

New Jersey is the most suburban state in the nation, which means plenty of malls and office parks. Not too long ago these properties helped make New Jersey the most prosperous of the 50 states.

That is no longer the case and is made far worse by Congress final tax deal which would allow taxpayers to choose a property tax deduction or a deduction for state and local income taxes, up to $10,000 in either case, according to media reports Wednesday.

This creates an existential crisis for many suburban communities that too many elected officials are not prepared to remedy. In fact, dozens of New Jersey suburban towns are now facing a perfect storm that will likely lead to significant property tax increases and reduced property values at the same, time unless mayors and state leaders take action soon.

Here’s the reality of New Jersey’s pending stagflation: Rapidly emptying suburban office parks are going the way of dinosaurs unless they are reimagined. Left unchanged, each of these formerly hefty taxpayers are going to win tax appeals that will have to be absorbed by homeowners. At the same time, thanks to Congressional Republicans, what homeowners are able to deduct will shrink meaning significantly higher federal and local tax payments.

Take a couple living in a suburban home valued at $650,000. Right now, they are paying about $16,500 in property tax, which they can fully deduct. However, the town’s largest taxpayer — an office park — is facing huge vacancies and wants to reimagine the property into a live, work and play environment. Approvals have not been forthcoming which means a successful tax appeal is inevitable. Once obtained to maintain existing services, the town’s governing body will need to increase taxes on other properties, primarily homeowners, so the couple’s property tax would increase to about $18,500. Without the ability to deduct they are now losing tax benefits of $8,500, possibly making their home unaffordable. And that will go for everyone on their block and everyone in their town.

New Jersey already has the largest outmigration of any state. With so many people looking to leave their town — and many other suburban towns with similar issues — what will that due to property values? The answer is obvious.

If ever there was a time for bold leadership in Trenton this is it. As New Jerseyans, we all want to help Gov.-elect Phil Murphy’s administration find a statewide zoning solution to allow office parks to be reimagined. It might be the only way to maintain property values and avoid a draining stagflation tragically unique to our state.

This entry was posted in Demographics, Economics, Employment, New Development, New Jersey Real Estate, Property Taxes. Bookmark the permalink.

107 Responses to Do or die time

  1. grim says:

    joyce says:
    December 15, 2017 at 12:15 am
    How does that work?

    grim says:
    December 14, 2017 at 8:01 pm
    Prediction for the next 5 years.

    Neighborhood wireless mesh networking will become the hottest area of networking growth as neighborhoods band together to gain direct access to the internet, completely bypassing traditional ISPs.

    When we are talking about net neutrality, we’re talking about what’s largely a last-mile issue. The backbone of the internet is so distributed, that you can’t apply these kinds of selective rules there, it doesn’t work. There could be thousands of routes from point A to point B, that traverse hundreds of different carriers. This is the whole point of the “internet”.

    But, when you control the pipe between a house and the internet, ISPs are now free to selectively do whatever they like to that pipe.

    Cable companies have become the defacto ISPs. Their whole model is predicated on charging you for access to someone elses content. It’s completely obvious, like you had to pay for HBO previously, they want you to pay for Netflix today.

    Cable companies are also defacto monopolies or duopolies across about 75% of the US. So of course they can play this game, because you have no other choice.

    High speed wireless mesh networking will allow people to piece together entirely new networks in neighborhoods, without wires, without poles. In fact, you don’t even need what would be the equivalent of a cell phone tower, assuming you have enough mesh nodes in an area. The way mesh works is that every node connects to every other node that it can find. This creates a way to not only distribute load across the network, but creates an incredibly resilient network if the density is high enough.

    Get enough nodes together, and you have a sizable local network. Once you reach some scale, getting a few fiber connections to the internet in place isn’t a complicated matter. Some of the nodes, call them the key nodes, are connected directly to the internet, the others simply provide the mesh around it.

    You basically have a community mesh network, that can easily share the cost of those fiber connections, enjoy direct, unfettered access to the internet, FAST access. And you don’t need to pay Optimum, AT&T, Cox, etc.

    I suspect someone will come up with a model for communities to easily deploy mesh networks, including all of the management overhead like access control, billing control, etc. This way the community doesn’t need to worry about all the management headaches.

    Why do we need the cable companies at all? Why do we need wires on poles anymore?

    Also, keep in mind the fact that since these mesh devices are located on private property, and that they are generally unobtrusive, it would be impossible to legislate against them.

    You don’t need permission, and you don’t need the poles.

  2. grim says:

    There are dozens of grass roots mesh networks in place today around the US, starting to push the limits of the technology.

  3. D-FENS says:

    Seems like that only works in densely populated areas.

  4. grim says:

    In one of the op-ed’s this week, read one writer that made a brilliant suggestion.

    Before Christie leaves office, he should make the full pension contribution.

    Deliver on Murphy’s campaign promise.

    This is absolute genius. Would blow a $2 billion hole in the budget, nearly impossible to resolve. Pretty sure Murphy would cry bloody murder, exposing his nonsensical campaign promise.

  5. grim says:

    Seems like that only works in densely populated areas.

    It’s been successfully deployed in non-urban areas, but becomes more complex as it requires directional antennae with precision positioning.

    Do you know Clifton? Years back, for shits and giggles, I used two yagis and wifi bridges to create a wifi link from down in Athenia to the top of the cliff at Rifle Camp Park. Approximately 3 miles as the crow flies. The bigger challenge, line of sight.

  6. grim says:

    I used 18db Yagis and high-power wifi radios on both sides, so technically I was breaking the law.

  7. Libturd, AKA Dr. Howie Feltersnatch says:

    “Also, keep in mind the fact that since these mesh devices are located on private property, and that they are generally unobtrusive, it would be impossible to legislate against them.”

    Take it one step further Grim. You could charge Amazon to sell to you. Want Netflix? Negotiate a price.

  8. grim says:

    Realistically though, the FCC would want to regulate these as carriers. Which means they would need to work completely distributed, with no legal control over them (like bitcoin, for example). To make this work, the internet connected mesh nodes would need to exist pro bono.

    For example, a major data center that permitted a mesh node to be installed on the roof, at no charge, with no restrictions.

  9. Libturd, AKA Dr. Howie Feltersnatch says:

    Grim,

    When I was studying at Montclair State, I did an independent study in Fiber Optics and Laser Light Communications. I needed one more credit to fulfill my Technology Education degree and I figured this would be good to know. My project ended up being designing a laser which shot music (from a Sony Discman-remember them?) converted into pulses of light from the bell tower of College Hall to a receiver that was in a first floor window inside the Student Center. The distance was about 1/3rd of a mile. The receiver had a large amplified speaker which played the music. Every time a student walked in front of the laser light, the music would stop. It was actually pretty cool, though extremely simple since it was nothing more than a couple of D/A convertors on each end. Building the transmitter and receiver was a piece of cake.
    Your line of sight comment prompted this memory.

  10. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Praying this does not pass. How is destroying a state’s economy and its citizens a good thing? Republicans have no morals or ethics. Such losers.

  11. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Good piece by Michael Bloomberg on this bs reform. Hopefully, this tax plan will lead to the extinction of the Republican Party when they ruin everything with this.

    “Last month a Wall Street Journal editor asked a room full of CEOs to raise their hands if the corporate tax cut being considered in Congress would lead them to invest more. Very few hands went up. Attending was Gary Cohn, President Donald Trump’s economic adviser and a friend of mine. He asked: “Why aren’t the other hands up?”

    Allow me to answer that: We don’t need the money.

    Corporations are sitting on a record amount of cash reserves: nearly $2.3 trillion. That figure has been climbing steadily since the recession ended in 2009, and it’s now double what it was in 2001. The reason CEOs aren’t investing more of their liquid assets has little to do with the tax rate.”

    https://www.bloomberg.com/view/articles/2017-12-15/this-tax-bill-is-a-trillion-dollar-blunder

  12. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Bloomberg is on point. Can’t wait to even pay more for health insurance and then listen to Republicans blame Obama. Suck di:ks!

    “In addition, by eliminating the requirement that individuals buy health insurance, many young and healthy people will drop out of the marketplace, causing health insurance premiums to rise for everyone else. This is nothing more than a backdoor tax increase on health care for millions of middle-class families that will leave them with less disposable income for savings, investment and spending.”

  13. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Yup….republicans are a joke!

    “INEQUALITY: If Congress wanted to raise real wages and reward work, there is a simple and proven way to do it: expand the earned income tax credit. Instead, it seems to believe that lower corporate tax rates will magically lead to higher wages, which fundamentally misunderstands how labor markets work.”

  14. chicagofinance says:

    I disagree…… cable companies are the BEST choice (by a lot), but not the only choice…..

    grim says:
    December 15, 2017 at 6:08 am
    Cable companies are also defacto monopolies or duopolies across about 75% of the US. So of course they can play this game, because you have no other choice.

  15. chicagofinance says:

    Also, for what people receive, high speed internet is stunningly inexpensive…….

  16. D-FENS says:

    Why not? He now just suddenly agreed to fund the Gateway tunnel.

    http://www.njbiz.com/article/20171214/NJBIZ01/171219915/nj-ny-reach-agreement-for-gateway-tunnel-funding

    Most other articles focused on the fare hikes…

    But isn’t this what they demanded the last 8 years?

    grim says:
    December 15, 2017 at 7:49 am
    In one of the op-ed’s this week, read one writer that made a brilliant suggestion.

    Before Christie leaves office, he should make the full pension contribution.

    Deliver on Murphy’s campaign promise.

    This is absolute genius. Would blow a $2 billion hole in the budget, nearly impossible to resolve. Pretty sure Murphy would cry bloody murder, exposing his nonsensical campaign promise.

  17. grim says:

    Look at the cost side of managing physical wireline infrastructure.

    Look at the cost side of managing a mesh network.

    Look at the resiliency of mesh networks compared to traditional wireline.

    Look at the flexibility from not requiring access to right-of-way, poles, public infrastructure.

    No rolling trucks, ever. Trucks? What trucks?

    This will be a game changer. In 15 years we will scratch our heads over the archaic nature of a coax cable hung from wooden poles.

  18. grim says:

    There is a ton of dark fiber infrastructure in the US that is salivating over the prospect of being the internet backhaul for all of this.

  19. 3b says:

    Or it might be a way to make houses more affordable for the younger generation that might chose to live there. And it might force towns to consolidate and regionalize to reduce expenses. Just saying.

  20. grim says:

    There are probably 250,000 field technicians that would be made completely unnecessary by mesh.

  21. grim says:

    I am a little pie-in-the-sky about public mesh, but it’s not out of the realm of feasibility that a mesh player who can be successful in a market like NYC, LA, Chicago, would be able to easily buy up major players across the US simply to gain the subscriber base, completely shutter nearly all physical assets of the acquired company and provide everyone with a mesh device.

    Traditional wired telco/cable companies will not survive the next 15 years. Elimination of net neutrality is the result of their last gasp for survival.

  22. grim says:

    By the way, people looking at the rise in bitcoin as a sign of it’s success as a currency are idiots.

    Bitcoin’s hyper-deflation and extreme volatility means it’s absolutely inappropriate as a currency.

    It’s pure speculation.

    Not to mention the core problem with bitcoin. The point at which it becomes uneconomical to mine bitcoin (process blockchain, mine new bitcoin), the entire thing falls apart.

  23. Libturd, AKA Dr. Howie Feltersnatch says:

    Who is paying the massive amount they will go over budget which is certain to occur under this new tunnel deal?

  24. The Great Pumpkin says:

    They finally get it.

    “In the end, the trend toward inequality amounts to capitalist suicide, Spriggs argues. Companies need demand, which requires rising wages so that workers can afford goods and services. “Businesses can’t create themselves, they respond to general growth in income,” he said. “Inequality chokes off business development.”

    Support for that kind of argument is surfacing in unlikely quarters.

    The International Monetary Fund used to be so entwined with American government thinking that its preferred market-friendly recipe was known as the Washington Consensus. Now, the Fund is cautiously backing redistributive measures — falling foul of the Trump administration in the process.

    In October, the IMF said rich countries can share their prosperity more evenly, without sacrificing growth, by shifting more of the tax burden onto high earners. It warned that “excessive inequality can erode social cohesion, lead to political polarization, and ultimately lower economic growth.”“

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-12-15/how-america-s-inequality-machine-is-firing-the-dow-into-orbit

  25. JCer says:

    exactly grim it’s all but useless for conducting legitimate business because of the volatility, and the conversion risk it adds. Unless all your employees, suppliers, and vendors are accepting bitcoin as payment there is simply too much currency risk for it to work.

  26. Juice Box says:

    re: “getting a few fiber connections to the internet”

    Grim I am surprised at you. It is extremely expensive. Your neighborhood WIFI Mesh club won’t be getting access that way. Right now we all get our internet from Tier 3 ISPs, the last mile providers. We don’t see the Tier 1 and Tier 2 monopolies and won’t be able to connect to them perhaps ever unless the local and state governments get involved and fund it with money for laying fiber and (perhaps changes in the law depending on the State) to force access to tier 1. Every Tier 3 ISP needs to buy some amount of transit to be able to interconnect with the entire world, and to achieve resilience, an ISP must choose multiple transit providers. There is no way a Wifi network club or association could ever afford it.

    Tier 1 examples (companies you may have never heard of)

    Cogent
    Global Telecom
    TeliaSonera
    NTT
    Tata
    Telecom Italia

    Here is the best example of a town achieving their own ISP. It was done with taxpayer-backed bonding and a grant from the state.

    Greenfield Mass Tier 2 provider (run by the town)

    Story

    https://www.carouselindustries.com/blog/build-will-come-creating-towns-internet-service/

  27. Fabius Maximus says:

    I have a lot of friends big into MESH networks. They have built one locally throughout Bergen and Passaic and I think they have also stretched it over the Hudson to NYC, via a node in Alpine. It sits on the side of the 2.4GHz and 5.4GHz spectrum and a lot of 3.4GHz which is outside the public spectrum

    A lot of it is line of sight as the power restrictions so low. They have a node in Willam Patterson that is allowing them to continue on westwards.

    There are some big MESH networks in places like Texas. Big flat expanses are great to traverse.

    The next game changer will be 5G, my big concern is that the freq is so high, the EMF safety issues will be a problem.

  28. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Wtf? Jesus, now he agrees? The other tunnel project would have been almost completed by now. Oh well, at least something is finally being done.

    D-FENS says:
    December 15, 2017 at 8:48 am
    Why not? He now just suddenly agreed to fund the Gateway tunnel.

    http://www.njbiz.com/article/20171214/NJBIZ01/171219915/nj-ny-reach-agreement-for-gateway-tunnel-funding

    Most other articles focused on the fare hikes…

    But isn’t this what they demanded the last 8 years?

  29. Libturd, AKA Dr. Howie Feltersnatch says:

    Maybe Drop Trow Murphy will cancel the tunnel and use the money to pay for the pensions and weed dispensaries?

  30. Juice Box says:

    Lol – Christie just drained the The Port Authority budget and NJ Transit’s budget.

  31. Juice Box says:

    Fab – Tier 2 node in Alpine? Don’t think so….

    Aren’t your friends still hobbyists using Tier 3 to get on the internet?

  32. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Best part of new tunnel project, costs us twice as much as the one he canceled. Really can’t make this sh!t up. Ideological partisan based politics will be the death of this nation.

  33. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    LOL!!

    Before Christie leaves office, he should make the full pension contribution.

    Deliver on Murphy’s campaign promise.

  34. Three Secret GEDs says:

    Pumps – go do your homework, don’t leave it until Sunday night.

  35. D-FENS says:

    Rubio’s stance on the Child Tax Credit…is he right? What do you guys think. I’ve been following him and he’s been saying it for a while…Frankly I can’t believe they didn’t include his amendment in the first place.

    Their stance originally was that they didn’t want to let the corporate tax rate to go up to 21% instead of 20% to pay for it…but now here we are with the proposed rate at 21% anyway.

  36. No One says:

    Rubio wants his revenge for “little Rubio”
    Anyone remember that Chris Christie was Trump’s lead attack dog against Rubio in that debate, which essentially took out the last semi-moderate Republican challenger to Trump, leaving Repubs with two unpopular choices Trump vs Ted Cruz.
    So in some respects, Trump can be blamed on CC. Had he been able to hang in with Trump, he might have tried to protect the state, but probably not. It’s only the wealthy top quartile earners getting hit after all.

  37. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Bitcoin is such a waste of resources. All this energy spent on what? Talk about idiocracy.

  38. The Great Pumpkin says:

    The consumption power of 159 countries to facilitate pure bs, the transfer of money.

  39. The Great Pumpkin says:

    “The energy-consumption is insane,” said de Vries, who started the Digiconomist blog to show the potential pitfalls in cryptocurrency. “If we start using this on a global scale, it will kill the planet.”

    https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-12-15/turning-coal-into-bitcoin-dirty-secret-of-2017-s-hottest-market

  40. Fabius Maximus says:

    Juice,

    Its a a mesh, if they want to connect to the internet, they can just fire up a gateway node either a tier 3 connection or a cell card. They could hook to a tier 2, but that’s not really what they built it for. Its mainly running video streaming and VOIP. They use it for Emergency Communications. The permanent sites are the backbone. The real fun is when they deploy the mobile sites. They send a mobile unit to a Red Cross shelter and the shelter can have phones and video within the location and if another shelter is on the network between the shelters.

  41. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Great example of how inefficient profit driven capitalism is with our valuable resources.

  42. D-FENS says:

    It worked.

    @WSJ
    GOP changes tax bill in last-minute concession to Rubio and Lee, making more of the child tax credit refundable

  43. Blue Ribbon Teacher says:

    Great example of how inefficient profit driven capitalism is with our valuable resources.

    Wait, are no longer of the idea that consumption drives the economy?

  44. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Ahh, so you agree these resources should instead be used to help people struggling instead?

    Blue Ribbon Teacher says:
    December 15, 2017 at 12:14 pm
    Great example of how inefficient profit driven capitalism is with our valuable resources.

    Wait, are no longer of the idea that consumption drives the economy?

  45. leftwing says:

    “Take it one step further Grim. You could charge Amazon to sell to you. Want Netflix? Negotiate a price.”

    No joke. Read the book Chaos Monkeys when it came out a couple years ago. Provided me an understanding of internet ad sales models. My first thought as I was understanding that dynamic pricing was why the hell am I allowing google, facebook, etc to make a ton of money off of my eyes? They’re my freaking eyes, not theirs.

    If I had the initiative and the time I am sure there is a business plan in there somewhere having people pro-actively opt out of mass, low value click bait while opting in to specific, highly targeted advertising. While you would not be able to clear the crap off your screen currently think of it this way…..

    Form a large consumer based organization whose members are committed to a specific action in a timeframe, and de-commit to any related click-bait actions. The value of those eyes goes up for the action, down for everything else. The consumer org with that super high value, smaller pre-screened group can now capture a much higher per capita ‘ad’ spend. Instead of keeping those dollars as ad spend, the org would distribute it amongst its members as a discount.

    Example….rather than Ford spending a dime over 15 million people a small number of whom *may* purchase a vehicle some time in the future, wouldn’t they rather have a self selected group of 1,500 who are actively in the market for a vehicle right now? They could take that random $1.5m ad spend and convert it into $1500 off a vehicle for the 1,500 members. Same cost, assuming 1000 members (66%) take them up on it. That’s vs a 1% hit ratio on the screen clickbait. And $1500 cash off your best deal on the new car.

    The consumer org takes a small vig off the top on each transaction for its revenue. The basic theses are (i) my eyes, should be my money and (ii) advertisers pay same gross spend for a much smaller but super highly screened of in-the-market consumers.

    Thoughts? Probably already exists out there somewhere.

  46. Three Secret GEDs says:

    I’m guessing Dems are scared sh1tless over the tax plan.

    What is their future platform going to be? Maybe, “Put us back in power and we promise we’ll screw those red states right back into poverty where they belong!”?

  47. Fabius Maximus says:

    My friends also do a lot of work with the Marathon. They are not part of this, but its representative of what can be achieved. Central Park is a big challenge as the cell coverage is useless as there are just too many people in range.
    https://www.athleticbusiness.com/recreation-outdoor-security/how-the-nyc-marathon-manages-crowd-and-runner-safety.html

  48. Three Secret GEDs says:

    I also imagine any f.ucktard GOP Senator who’s thinking about pulling a McCain will be equally scared sh1tless of tanking the stock market and becoming the economic equivalent of Al Franken complete with photo-shopped pictures of the deviant groping the Dow and Nasdaq while it sleeps.

  49. Three Secret GEDs says:

    Here’s my New Year’s prediction: Mueller quickly closes out his investigation with an exoneration of the Trump administration (and no malfeasance found in the Obama holdovers except for a couple fall guys like Strzok and Ohr).

  50. Three Secret GEDs says:

    Rubio just announced he will vote yes. I told you.

  51. Libturd, AKA Dr. Howie Feltersnatch says:

    Left.

    Some of that ultra-targeted marketing IS happening already. I am already mystified by how well companies are using browsing data to steer consumers. At times, it is scary beyond what I would have ever expected. I don’t remember all the details, but a few days ago, my son asked me a question about something science related. He wanted to know whether Chlorine was a gas or a solid. I googled it and read him the answer. The next day, I sh1t you not, there were sponsored ads (designed to look like new stories) on investing in chlorine for the future of clean water through DOW. Then I go to Amazon to buy a new beard trimmer and there are pictures of chlorine tablets. Then in my email, spam from a local pool servicing company (which could have been coincidence, but I’m not sure).

    I’m in the variable print business and they are already changing the ads that appear in magazines to meet the subscribers tastes. You’ll see this in high end publications like Arch Digest, Black Ink and Elite traveler. XML baby.

  52. Libturd, AKA Dr. Howie Feltersnatch says:

    GEDs—think he posted a #metoo?

  53. grim says:

    I’m not talking about 10 mesh nodes, I’m talking about 30,000 mesh nodes. At $50 per node per month, fiber is easily had with nominal scale.

  54. Not Three Secret GED's says:

    No what them dems will say is;

    – You are 70, you are a boomer, and the GOP took away your Medicare b0n3r p!ll
    – Your mother and grandmother, just moved in with you because their nursing home closed down. GOP took away their Medicaid.
    – All your grandkids are signing up for the minimum wage pay of the Army and going to fight for the Koch Brother’s Coal in Walla-Walla Land, the Wall Street ruler’s in the Middle East, and North Korea.

    Look no matter what your politics are. What is happening now is a foolish destruction of the country and is people to prove right the Corporate State ideology. One that will be put down hard and fast by the Chinese Communist Party or other Hegemon to be, because the good old USA will be to weak and poor to do anything about it – because we had to prove that R6ndians were right.

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  56. Juice Box says:

    Grim – re: :I’m talking about 30,000 mesh nodes”

    It exists already whttps://www.imeshyou.com/

    The Internet is already a network of independent nodes with all the same features as a “mesh network.” They are literally the same technology. A “mesh network” just has a bunch of extra fragile and spotty WiFi, Bluetooth, and wired links between your IP address and the internet compared to what we are used to, which is reliable networks. Mesh just adds tons of hops and latency and packet loss.

    The high-capacity fiber Tier 2 and Tier 1 connections will never be free, and are just as vulnerable to being censored and metered whether they are being connected via a traditional ISP or a wireless mesh. The only reliability increase for Mesh is if if a tree falls on the last-mile between you and the first node on the Tier 3 provider network.

    The price point of Mesh will need to be very very cheap….I already get gig fiber from FIOS for $70 a month. Will FIOS meter Netflix? Sure thing they will. There is probably a guy sitting in a data center right now waiting for a call from management to start putting the screws to them if they don’t pay up…

  57. Juice Box says:

    Disney Death Star…..

    Everybody Should Be Very Afraid of the Disney Death Star
    The first episode of the Streaming Wars is over. The rebels won. Now the empire strikes back.

    https://www.theatlantic.com/business/archive/2017/12/disney-21st-century-fox/548492/

  58. joyce says:

    Not Not Not,
    What the f does Ayn Rand have to do with any of this garbage? People always have to have a boogeyman (or woman I suppose). What corporate subsidies and other corporate welfare masquerading as welfare for individuals that we have in place today did she support?

    Ps. Never read her books.

  59. Not secret 3 GEd says:

    Here is my counter prediction;

    -Mueller finds smoking gun of money laundering, tax evasion and under influence of foreign power.
    -GOP prefer party over country. Refuses to impeach.
    -The Feds and NY State specifically will indict, pursue trial of people.
    -Trump will pardon everyone and himself on federal charges, but State charges will still bite.
    -The Feds and State will pursue asset forfeiture. Trump and family end very much like the Duke brothers of Trading Places. This is actually a better punishment for him and family than any jail time or impeachment. President – but poor.

  60. Not Joyceeee says:

    Joyce,

    Rand was consider a nut job in her days, because at heart what she talks about is very close to you know who had a mustache. Is about being “special” and having special right over the commoners.

    The reasons she matters is that a lot of the billionaire class funding the debacle in this country love her, because they think they are the “special” class and should be allowed to run their “special” class leadership skills thru their corporate hood rough shot over every person alive.

    They always forget, that eventually they will meet their doom. Because to enforce their ways, they will need tough warriors. Eventually, there is always a tough smart warrior that outsmarts them and kills off their Mr.Burns geriatric behind. History is littered with Plutocracies that become Authoritarian under a darker warrior that outsmarts the original plutocrats and controls them. Latest example is Putin and the 5 Oligarchs that put him in power.

  61. No One says:

    joyce,
    Leftists hate Ayn Rand and they have spent years creating a strawman version of her that they use to attach to and smear their enemies with. Conservatives mostly hate her too, and most of the ones who say they like her don’t actually understand her. Reason, individualism, individual rights. The lefty collectivists hate her, the religious conservatives hate her, and the middle of the roaders hate her for favoring principles over deal-making.

    I’m surprised you haven’t read her books, I think you would agree with some of her positions.

  62. No One says:

    (see “Not Joyce” above for an example of the ignorant strawman creation with no connection to anything Rand actually wrote or advocated)

  63. The Great Pumpkin says:

    No One,

    This is you.

    “The reasons she matters is that a lot of the billionaire class funding the debacle in this country love her, because they think they are the “special” class and should be allowed to run their “special” class leadership skills thru their corporate hood rough shot over every person alive.”

  64. Juice Box says:

    SALT is back with a 10k cap?

  65. Juice Box says:

    Top bracket was lowered from a million to 600000 and for top 37% income tax rate.

  66. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Humans are like ants, we are a collective bunch. You think one ant is responsible for everything? It takes a group effort. Too bad we have a bunch of queens walking around giving themselves way too much credit in the history books.

    You think human society was developed by individuals, which is just plain crazy. We are no different than ants or elephants….we can not survive alone. No matter how great you think you are.

  67. No One says:

    You definitely have an ant-sized intellect. Stop inflicting it on others.

  68. the great dumkin says:

    Obama already proved you wrong ….in his mind anyway ….

  69. joyce says:

    That was what I was implying, by all means criticize the current state of affairs, but why do you need to try to attribute it to one author?

  70. joyce says:

    No One,
    I do own a copy of Atlas Shrugged but for some reason never found the time.

  71. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Truth hurts. Your philosophy based on the mighty individual to save the day is nothing more than a mirage to feed your ego. You did well in life, we get it, but you had lots of help along the way ( that you seem to blow off in an attempt to protect your ego).

  72. Grab them by the puzzy says:

    @ezraklein

    The best explanation of GOP behavior right now is they’ve become fatalistic about massive electoral losses and so are simply doing what they believe/trying to please the donors and lobbyists who can give them jobs after they’re voted out

  73. Grab them by the puzzy says:

    @SethAbramson

    In the same way every family must have a fire escape plan for their home, every American must have a plan for the peaceful and legal actions you’ll take when Congress shuts down its probe of Trump’s illicit ties to Russia—and begins the process of firing Special Counsel Mueller.

  74. chicagofinance says:

    Not Joyceeee says:
    December 15, 2017 at 3:24 pm
    The reasons she matters is that a lot of the billionaire class funding the debacle in this country love her, because they think they are the “special” class and should be allowed to run their “special” class leadership skills thru their corporate hood rough shot over every person alive.

    They always forget, that eventually they will meet their doom. Because to enforce their ways, they will need tough warriors. Eventually, there is always a tough smart warrior that outsmarts them and kills off their Mr.Burns geriatric behind. History is littered with Plutocracies that become Authoritarian under a darker warrior that outsmarts the original plutocrats and controls them. Latest example is Putin and the 5 Oligarchs that put him in power.

    https://youtu.be/Ip7GGf2_b6Y?t=24s

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  76. Joe says:

    If the trump tax plan is approved next week, does that mean when I file taxes in Feb 2018, it applies?
    Or does it apply the following year when I file taxes in Feb 2019?

  77. Fabius Maximus says:

    Shame he didn’t run. Would like to see Mike for 2020, but I don’t think the GOP would let him run and he can’t win as an Independent.
    http://verifiedpolitics.com/billionaire-michael-bloomberg-just-exposed-trumps-evil-secret-behind-tax-heist/

  78. chicagofinance says:

    You expect to be taken seriously when the link you posted has the following tagline?
    “Add your name to millions demanding Congress take action on the President’s crimes. IMPEACH TRUMP & PENCE!”

    What about passing the Affordable Care Act in 2009 when the country was desperately needing a comprehensive and thoughtful stimulus plan? What did Bloomberg say at that point? Bloomberg is a plutocrat….. 70% of the country’s economy is source in small businesses…..

  79. ExJerky says:

    70 percent of the economy is consumer driven. Putting people into the poorhouse over medical care is stupid economics and immoral.

  80. joyce says:

    “70 percent of the economy is consumer driven”

    People repeat that line so often they don’t even realize what they’re saying. 70% of the economy being consumer driven IS NOT A GOOD THING. Think balance of payments. 70% consumer driven for decades means perpetual debt, does that sound like a country you know?

  81. Fabius Maximus says:

    “What about passing the Affordable Care Act in 2009 when the country was desperately needing a comprehensive and thoughtful stimulus plan? What did Bloomberg say at that point? ”

    When the 2009 Stimulus package passed ….
    Michael Bloomberg, the New York mayor, said “the money could save 14,000 jobs for teachers and 1,000 jobs for police officers, as well as expand the subway system and prevent hospital closures.”
    Governors, including Republican ones, argued in favour of spending much more than the $787bn.

    Maybe its time to stop spiking your Egg Nog!

  82. Fabius Maximus says:

    70% of the economy being consumer driven IS NOT A GOOD THING.

    I agree, and that is what St Ronnie and his move to the Service Based Economy gave us.
    The down side, is the reality that, the 70% drives the main economy. Any impact to that will have massive consequences. as there is no Manufacturing Sector left to fall back on.

  83. Fabius Maximus says:

    “”I’m not talking about 10 mesh nodes, I’m talking about 30,000 mesh nodes. At $50 per node per month, fiber is easily had with nominal scale.”

    Don’t know where to start with this one outside of “OK, 30,000 nodes in your network, how do you manage bandwidth, how are you handling throughput.” When you solve those issues, the Telecoms will happily buy the solution from you.

  84. joyce says:

    “I agree, and that is what St Ronnie and his move to the Service Based Economy gave us.”
    He must have been busy doing all that on his own.

    “The down side, is the reality that, the 70% drives the main economy. ”
    I don’t know what’s worse – your understanding of the meaning of words or simple math.

  85. ExJerky says:

    Wtf Joyce. You a goddam noble laureate tonight. Jughead

  86. joyce says:

    Just post song lyrics or nothing at all. Your original thoughts are barely above that of the resident re-tweeter.

  87. Fabius Maximus says:

    Joyce

    “He must have been busy doing all that on his own.”

    Truman pointed out where the buck stopped!

  88. Fabius Maximus says:

    I don’t know what’s worse – your understanding of the meaning of words or simple math.

    Point it out, in excruciating detail if you must. Show me where I’m wrong.

  89. grim says:

    I didn’t claim to be able to build it.

    But I know it will happen.

    This is the essence of disruption.

    The fact that you are a technologist with specific knowledge of the field, telling me I’m wrong, simply provides me with more confidence that my prediction will be correct.

    There is a point at which this decentralized mesh network simply becomes the internet.

  90. leftwing says:

    Fabs going all twofer again, bad facts and logic.

    “70% of the economy being consumer driven IS NOT A GOOD THING.”

    C+I+G+X = GDP

    Since the end of WW2 the C (consumer) component of GDP has never been below 60%. G (government spending) has been 20% like clockwork. I (business invesment) has been between 10-20%. “Blame” a slight rise in C beginning in the early 80s to a flat 70% at the “expense” of I on what you want but fact of the matter is I was going down, dramatically, anyway (think all the shuttered factories in the Rust Belt and flyover country beginning in the 70s). Bottom line, since I and G are smaller deriviatives of C (you won’t have taxes and business investment without consumer activity) C will always be very large relative to I and G unless….

    We go full blown communist with five year plans and government control of everything like the old USSR, in which case G will be 80% and people and private companies (if any) will have a paltry 20% in their pockets -OR- we have an all out world wide conflict requiring massive amounts of materiel and armaments purchases by G (G actually spiked to nearly 50% when the US entered WW2).

    On Bloomberg, he is a Democrat in everything but name. The Republican ticket in NYC de facto IS the Independent ticket as a true Republican has an immeasurably small chance of winning there. Bloomberg is also accomplished and wealthy. He would scare the pants off me if he were to top the D ticket nationally in 2020. Despite his religion and far left gun views he would have an excellent chance picking up light red states and would solidify light blue. Thankfully, the Democrats visceral hate of others’ accomplishments and wealth will prevent them from every nominating him, although they will gladly continue to take his money lol. Republicans would never touch him politically, nationally. He wears the blue team jersey off the home field.

  91. chicagofinance says:

    #1 leftwing – excellent post, really well structured and concise

    #2 my comment “70% of the country’s economy is source[d] in small businesses…..” is instantaneously morphed into consumers…….WTF? I was talking about small businesses…… this part from WaPo
    “Pass through” companies get a 20 percent reduction: Most American businesses are organized as “pass through” companies in which the income from the business is “passed through” to the business owner’s individual tax return. S corporations, LLCs, partnerships and sole proprietorships are all examples of pass-through businesses. In the final GOP bill, the majority of these companies get to deduct 20 percent of their income tax-free, a large reduction that mirrors what was in the Senate bill. The changes, however, expire after 2025. The National Federation of Independent Business initially opposed the House version, arguing that it didn’t do enough for small businesses. But the NFIB later endorsed the House and Senate plans. Service businesses such as law firms, doctor’s offices and investment offices can take only the 20 percent deduction if they make up to $315,000 (for married couples).”

    OK….. and Bloomberg doesn’t deal on this level because it is beneath him……this part matters….. a lot….. to a lot of people….. and THIS PART IS WHERE THE RUBBER HITS THE ROAD AND JOBS ARE CREATED….

    jobs => demand for labor => wage inflation => inflation

    thank you….

  92. leftwing says:

    When I first read Chaos Monkeys two years ago I suggested it here. It got panned a bit in reviews by news orgs as a hit-and-run by the author after less than stellar employee performances by him at google and facebook (true). It does delve into those two companies history, efforts, and decision making on internet ad sale models. Pick it up for the holidays, good social and tech read with some color.

    The below response and book summary is for Stu. You guys are much more tech savvy than I, so I’m sure the below is rife with errors. I particularly feel on real thin ice as I venture into grim’sdomain of marketing, but here goes. Apologies in advance for glaring errors due to lack of knowledge or early onset Alzheimers:

    Originally, internet ad sales were totally random and bundled. It’s why you received popups for birth control, and women for ED products. They were the electronic equivalent of the old stuff-in retail flyers in your Sunday paper and had the same bad hit ratio of low single digits.

    The model changed to identifying users. If internet advertisers could distinguish between, say, males and females they mathematically double their hit ratios for the above products by eliminating the incorrect genders from their advertising. Mid double digit hit ratios.

    As internet companies became better at collecting your demographic data from your searches and – note this – third party sources they made demographic bundles to sell to advertisers. They could now offer, say, Group A which would be a smaller user set comprised of certain specific demographic markers such as family size, ages, housing type and cost, location, politics, etc. Not marketing baby clothes to single men any more, and only to families with young children? Ad hit ratio moves even higher.

    Now, and the situation the book addresses, is the current google and facebook model of internet ad auctions. Each of us has a long alphanumeric personal identifying number at these companies. For the most part they have tied it specifically to our identity and they are continually adding to it.

    Here’s the huge change that data and the current technology enables….now, when you initiate an internet search, you don’t get random advertising but instead advertisers are bidding for space on your screen based on the real time search. So when you type ‘new car’ or ‘bad transmission’ into google that data goes into the search algorithm to produce your results but also – concurrently – goes to their ad auction servers where bids are made and accepted real time to return in the same fraction of a second the ads you will see.

    Basically, as an example, the car makers have a standing bid for you (your demographic proxy) and your search. Toyota will pay a certain amount for those two searches by people identified by a certain demographic profile; Range Rover will likely pay more for those searches by people with a slightly different (higher) demographic profile. This bidding and sale of the ad you will see on your screen when your results are returned all occurs in the same fraction of a second your search is being processed. Truly amazing technological accomplishment if you think about it.

    The upshot is this personal identifier and technology has now refined the population group of qualified consumers for specific ads even further, and hit ratios go up again. Every time hit ratios go up, advertisers pay more for that advertising. It’s a bonus that it is occurring real time (actionability).

    My view is we have hit the saturation point of utility of data. You are no more likely to invest in a clean water company than I am to go back to Italy because of internet ad. But your search, and google’s facial and location recognition software of me in San Marco Square from old vacation photos uploaded to google pictures, prompt that (wasted) advertising.

    My investment thesis is that future returns are going to be based on deriving the near term actionability of that data, which is the next step in driving ad hit ratios up for these behemoths and substantial incremental revenue and value.

    Apologies for the long post. Even as a non-techie I find this fascination, and moreso given my libertarian leanings. Recommend the book even with its noted flaws.

    Now out to shovel and tackle that writhing mass of humanity known as NJ for holiday shopping. Good day all.

  93. leftwing says:

    Chi thanks on the compliment and LOL on the ‘concise’ comment.

    Paid you back with the monster post above.

  94. Fabius Maximus says:

    “The fact that you are a technologist with specific knowledge of the field, telling me I’m wrong, simply provides me with more confidence that my prediction will be correct.”

    Think of it this way, you are not changing the laws of physics. The car engine was invented back in the 1800’s. The design hasn’t really changed in a hundred years. Its gets refined boosted etc, but for the most part does not change.

    Now you may invent new fuels, electric motors, but nothing beats the efficiency coupled with the economies of scale of the basic car engine.

    Is there a market for something else? Yes, rural uses would love a choice over Satellite. But it won’t be cheap.

  95. joyce says:

    “The down side, is the reality that, the 70% drives the main economy”

    Why the heck do I have to point out what’s wrong with this statement? Would I have to point out what’s wrong if you said 2+2= lemon.

  96. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Joyce,

    The statement holds true. Everything a business does revolves around the consumption of the consumer. Put it this way, consumer stops spending and economy comes to a crawl. So how exactly does the consumer not drive the economy? Investment is almost as equally important, but the bottom line, no consumption, no economy. If the consumer is tapped out, are you going to invest more in your business to address this lack of demand? No, you cut your labor costs and pull back because the consumer and their spending ability drives your business decisions. So when capital gets too consolidated at the top, it actually hurts economic activity because investment is feeding off a sickly thin consumer who does not provide much of a return on the feeding. Much better when investment can feed on a consumer with some meat on it to provide a return on the energy used to feed.

  97. Grim says:

    I’m sorry, what are the physics limitations to distributed wireless mesh networks?

    This isn’t technology that doesn’t exist because of some physical limitation, this is technology that doesn’t yet exist because the way in which we do things doesn’t require it to exist.

    What are you saying? Wireless isn’t fast enough and will never be? The mathematics behind multipath and best path routing simply is not scalable linearly?

  98. No One says:

    I wonder why it’s so hard for consumers in Uganda to create a world class economy. Must be a bunch of cheap-ass bosses there. Pumpkin should join the World Bank, go there, and cure their ills with his ant-brained insights.

  99. Grim says:

    Guifi in Spain has eclipsed 30,000 nodes.

  100. ExJerky says:

    12:13 how bout this one-

    Joyce is a jugheadddddd
    A jugheaddd is Joyce.
    Gawd I hate the sound of her voice.

  101. Juice Box says:

    Grim – A dedicated line protects you against latency, that is what you get with fiber, you aren’t competing for bandwidth and to end to end fiber from Netflix’s data center to your home means no latency to speak of because you aren’t sharing. That isn’t the case with mesh or ever cable internet. Fiber multiplexing has amazing performance.

    There may be a better way to deliver the data with wired or wireless mesh if the packets were truly distributed to increase delivery throughput but that isn’t the case yet.

  102. Three Secret GEDs says:

    Men need their own hashtag #mentoo . #straightwhitementoo ?

    GEDs—think he posted a #metoo?

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