Boom or bubble

From CNBC:

Here’s why experts believe the U.S. is in a housing boom and not a bubble

The U.S. housing market has been an unlikely beneficiary from the Covid-19 pandemic.

During the pandemic, home prices have climbed at a record pace. The median price for an existing home reached over $363,000 in June 2021, a 23.4% year-over-year increase.

“You can see in just basically the last 15 months or so, we’ve seen a dramatic acceleration in home price growth to levels we haven’t seen in decades,” CoreLogic chief economist Frank Nothaft said.

However, according to most experts, the market is shaping up to look more like a boom rather than a bubble.

“We say bubble because we can’t believe how much prices have gone up,” CNBC real estate correspondent Diana Olick said. “A bubble tends to be something that’s inflated that could burst at any minute and change and that’s not really the case here.”

This entry was posted in Housing Bubble, National Real Estate, New Development. Bookmark the permalink.

381 Responses to Boom or bubble

  1. dentss dunnigan says:

    first……no bubble it’s a boom…

  2. Juice Box says:

    There is no speculation driving home prices, it’s all natural demand from Millennials and will continue for the next 20 years or death whichever comes first for you.

    The Pandemic played no part in home prices rising 23.6 percent Year over Year. There was no pandemic buying, it is all driven by natural supply and demand economics.

    The lowest rates for mortgages recorded in over 2000 years have nothing to do with the housing boom. People would have bought these homes regardless of the interest rate.

    You will die before this housing boom ends. Buy now or be priced out forever.

  3. Out of the Ashes says:

    /s

  4. Ex says:

    hOw dAre a bLack mAn sUpPort rePaRaTiOns
    fOr sLaVE oWnErs

  5. 3b says:

    It’s a bubble!

  6. Fast Eddie says:

    “A bubble tends to be something that’s inflated that could burst at any minute and change and that’s not really the case here.”

    Why? Explain? She states something and then no explanation.

  7. 3b says:

    Fast: How anyone can look at an almost 25 percent increase in prices in a year and insist with a straight face that it is not a bubble is staggering in my mind.

  8. Ex says:

    nOt iN mY bAcK bUbBle!!!

  9. 40+ year realtor says:

    I am not sold on this market being a bubble in North Jersey. Values in most price ranges other than luxury homes have run up, but that doesn’t mean the market will collapse. Don’t get me wrong, I am not saying the run up continues. Still believe in the possibility of a soft landing in NJ real estate prices. Pandemic is not over and there is too much uncertainty to make accurate predictions.

  10. Juice Box says:

    Look there is no BUBBLE.

    If you paid $304, 000 for a single family home in New Jersey 10 years ago it’s now worth about $495,000 dollars. That is a CAGR (Compound Annual Growth Rate) of only 5%.

    So what if most of it came in the last year? Look we are owned this money, the millennials owe us, they need to pay to get their hands on our garden state palaces, they need to fund our retirements it is simple as that. They were too busy for the last decade building wealth in NYC and now they need to move here to New Jersey and spread the wealth in our state now and take our wonderful New Jersey Transit Trains and Buses for average ride of anywhere from 3 to 5 hours a day to NYC to work and pay taxes. That is how it is done around there. The formula = high taxes+tolls+fees = wonderful transit in New Jersey. There is no other way it works. If necessary our Governor said you should move out of New Jersey if you don’t like it, preferrably before the election.

    And I don’t want any talk of disruption…. There will be no DISRUPTION to the New Jersey way of life, when it comes to taxes, tolls, fees and our wonderful quick and easy transit to NYC for work.

  11. JCer says:

    It depends, all markets are very localized and different. There certainly are some crazy things going on in housing markets and NJ is far from the craziest. A lot depends on what happens in the broader economy. Americans are monthly payment driven and the pandemic did 2 big things, 3 if you count almost 0% interest rates.

    First it derailed a good portion of people’s spending habits thus allowing a wave of cash to go into things like consumer goods, cars, housing renovations, and housing. Second it put fear of death into people which causes them to go after what they want, when other other circumstances they might be more tempered. Where as after the spanish flu we had the roaring 20’s, what we see now is irrational exuberance in housing and as bad as you think it is in primary NJ markets look at second vacation homes to really see crazy runs ups.

  12. 3b says:

    40 As always I respect your opinion as real estate is your livelihood, and refreshingly you have never been a rah rah real estate never goes down shrill. But when I see a bungalow on a busy street sell for 500k , that looks like a bubble to me, or an undormered cape with an ask price of 600k that looks like a bubble to me. Even with low interest rates, and typical millennial salaries, just doing napkin numbers one salary will go entirely to paying the mortgage, perhaps more, throw in student loans, child care, car expenses, and just general living, not a whole lot left of any for 401 contributions . I don’t see how this is sustainable, and how some people think prices will continue to rise.

  13. Libturd says:

    “You’ve probably touched a lot of children.”

    Coffee everywhere.

    I don’t think housing is in a bubble either, though I would not expect anything more than price stagnation over the next few to five years as the market digests stupid time.

    Speaking of flips, on Friday a slightly older, but maintained cape on the Montclair portion of my block existed. Yesterday, we noticed it was completely missing. Bought for 280K (somehow).
    https://goo.gl/maps/VcSfnUYE6zDmxKxFA

    24 Stephen Street was purchased for 440K in 2019 https://goo.gl/maps/3GojGvz87o1EXWnPA

    and sold for a cool million in 2020
    https://www.realtor.com/realestateandhomes-detail/24-Stephen-St_Montclair_NJ_07042_M61197-92450#photo1

  14. Libturd, sticking to the topic says:

    Grim,

    Flips not happening post stuck in moderation with fun pictures. Please unmod if you can.

  15. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    Esx, get with the program. The Texas abortion law is the leftist outrage machine topic du jour. You can pivot back to the racial hatred agenda when this has run its course.

  16. Out of the Ashes says:

    Article someone posted yesterday from Bloomberg, More Cooks, less Pediatricians.

    Hope these cooks are making good bucks if they want to pay this amount that boomer wants.

    Low incomes, high prices. Sounds like a bubble to me.

  17. 3b says:

    Out: I posted that article. It’s a sobering read for what the job market may look like for the rest of the decade.

  18. BRT says:

    Gottlieb was on talking about vaccinating children. He says, people should talk to their pediatrician as the might only want to do 1 shot or wait for a low dose option. It’s nice to see them talking about dosing as I’ve maintained that I think it’s too high, at least for the second shot.

    Given the most recent data for 12-17 year olds, the second shot is a problem. So both number of shots, shot spacing and dosing needs to be discussed.

  19. Out of the Ashes says:

    Sorry Texas,
    White women aren’t producing enough children to keep America White Again.

    Birth rate is controlled by women and women only. They decide if they want to do the act, they decide if they want to keep the child, abort it, give it up for adoption, or just about anything else they damn well please with it. The fathers of America have very little rights, with those rights easily taken away with an allegation or an inability to pay for an attorney and a court system that will extract every last drop of blood from you.

    Hate to tell you Texas, but you aren’t going to be able to legislate morality into a completely corrupt America. And Whites are going to be a minority in the future. McMansions, granite countertops, vacations to Aruba, shoes, jewelry, and plain old cash > children to the white American female.

    Sorry folks, but — It Ain’t Happenin’

  20. Out of the Ashes says:

    Oh, sorry

    It’s MAWA. Make America White Again.

  21. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    3b,
    Thought it was you.

  22. Libturd, sticking to the topic says:

    “You’ve probably touched a lot of children.”

    Coffee everywhere.

    I don’t think housing is in a bubble either, though I would not expect anything more than price stagnation over the next few to five years as the market digests stupid time.

    Speaking of flips, on Friday a slightly older, but maintained cape on the Montclair portion of my block existed. Yesterday, we noticed it was completely missing. Bought for 280K (somehow).
    https://goo.gl/maps/VcSfnUYE6zDmxKxFA

  23. Libturd says:

    24 Stephen Street was purchased for 440K in 2019 https://goo.gl/maps/3GojGvz87o1EXWnPA

  24. chicagofinance says:

    I agree. However, it is a bubble, but it is also unlikely to have an immediate collapse. Real estate simply doesn’t work that way around here. Also, the main source of fuel (low interest mortgages) is going to be in place for the foreseeable future. People have no ability to calculate, regulate or conceptualize finance. So inflating bubbles make all the sense in the world. The main strategy is to avoid participating, or else cash out if that suits your financial situation.

    40+ year realtor says:
    September 13, 2021 at 8:50 am
    I am not sold on this market being a bubble in North Jersey. Values in most price ranges other than luxury homes have run up, but that doesn’t mean the market will collapse. Don’t get me wrong, I am not saying the run up continues. Still believe in the possibility of a soft landing in NJ real estate prices. Pandemic is not over and there is too much uncertainty to make accurate predictions.

  25. Hold my beer says:

    It’s really depressing how ugly, dated, and expensive NJ houses are. Slap on a 1 hour commute each way and cramming 15 hours of work into a 12 hour day I’m surprised NJ isn’t the meth capital of the world.

  26. Fast Eddie says:

    True to my word, I have not watched one play of any NFL game this season. We were avid Giants fans… season tiks for years going back to Yankee Stadium, then the Yale Bowl, then all my viewing days at Giants Stadium in the Meadowlands.

    As Out of the Ashes stated above, the white population is dwindling rapidly so I wonder who’s going to pay for the 10yr/$250 million NFL plan to combat (ahem…) systemic rac1sm and other soc1et1es ills apparently caused by… white males? Who else started the so-called fire? Gotta blame somebody, can’t blame individuals, goes against the narrative. Anyway, the billionaire owners know where the butter for their bread comes from and that’s their right to protect their assets and grow their product by using… um… practicing their business model as they see fit.

    It was a glorious time when the game was just that… when players and fans stood proudly for the Anthem, when players were contrite, humble, worked and enjoyed their craft that Americans admired. That’s light years away now and the NFL has declared that they will use whatever method possible to protect their revenue. They should heed warning though, the NBA tried such tactics and like 99% of progressive causes, symbolic gestures lead to failure and waste.

  27. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    It used to take one income to buy a home in NJ.
    Then it used to take two.

    I think we can skip three and go directly to four.

  28. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Have a friend told me a disturbing story the other day, nice guy, pro-American, regular Joe type.

    Cop pointed a gun in his face for no reason. Story shocked everyone who heard it and that knows him.

    White guy, so no racial angle. He is forever changed.

  29. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    Bubbles are everywhere and if they crash will probably crash together.

    The fixer upper across the street sold for 2x what the guy paid in 2015. The guy who sold probably laughed his a$$ off.

    I thought the buyers were fools until they told me they cashed out of a high end town. Who knows maybe they sold to someone who sold Tesla stock or Bitcoin or some other inflated paper asset.

  30. The Great Pumpkin says:

    It was for a free gift card on their facebook page. If you think that’s easy to figure out… you just don’t get it. It was 7517 and I put down 7700. I was able to figure out how many shells they use for their two businesses to almost a tee, but no, that’s nothing special. You are so miserable.

    leftwing says:
    September 12, 2021 at 6:54 pm
    “JCer says: Dude Apple vs. Tesla are totally different animals.”

    You are debating someone who said it may be a ‘waste of his precious time’ that he is not running his own business because….he almost guessed the number of taco shells used by a local joint….

    Read that twice and let that sink in…..

  31. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I don’t think some people on here understand what a bubble is. They just see a new high price and automatically go bubble. They see a 100k price increase and assume bubble. You just don’t understand it. Not being rude or mean either with this post, so don’t take it in a negative way.

    We are clearly in a housing boom that I called years out. It’s only going to grow based on supply/demand fundamentals in this housing market.

  32. Libturdio says:

    Tu boca es como un gran taco. En el momento en que lo abres, todo se desmorona.

  33. BRT says:

    It was for a free gift card on their facebook page. If you think that’s easy to figure out… you just don’t get it. It was 7517 and I put down 7700. I was able to figure out how many shells they use for their two businesses to almost a tee, but no, that’s nothing special. You are so miserable.

    Run us through your methodology and calculations as to how you came up with 7700 taco shells. We are all interested.

  34. Juice Box says:

    re:”the main source of fuel (low interest mortgages) is going to be in place for the foreseeable future.”

    Some wisdom here. Housing is NOT the Bubble, it is only a symptom of the larger picture…..Government spending and Central Bank buying of Debt.

    Debt to GDP is now at 125% and with more more massive spending bills coming.

    Investors dumped their holdings of US Treasuries at the secondary market with the Federal Reserve, in what’s tantamount to back-door debt monetization. It’s low rates and monetization for the next two decades. Who cares if the cows ever come home?

    Now go out and by the second home down in LBI. The prices are cheap and there won’t be any sea level rise….

    5/6/2021 Listed for sale $1,195,000 (+77%)$1,940/sqft
    4/2/2020 Sold $675,000 (+17.4%)$1,096/sqft

    https://www.zillow.com/homedetails/5-E-Louisiana-Ave-Brant-Beach-NJ-08008/39658966_zpid/

  35. Libturd says:

    I once guessed the number of the jellybeans in a very large glass jug at the local fair. I was immediately offered a full time position at the Princeton Plasma Physics Lab, but I turned it down. They wouldn’t allow me to eat at my desk, and I never would have been able to finish all of those jellybeans.

  36. Fast Eddie says:

    I understand there’s a few billboards in Central PA with this “wonderful” slogan:

    https://www.trendsmap.com/twitter/tweet/1436315386199355442

    Gotta love this one in Wilmington NC:

    https://www.instagram.com/p/CSsufeWjSRP/?utm_source=ig_embed&ig_rid=be019b5d-b94d-4c46-a5f4-a63e6a0bcd4a

  37. 3b says:

    So if no bubble and I respectfully disagree with the posters here whose opinions I value are stating, then we continue on, or even just stagnation, and the young people get angrier, and so the leftist/ Soci@list agenda looks better and better; I can’t blame them from their perspective. Speaking of geographically agnostic, my Brothers firm just filled a position that 2 years ago would have been NYC based, now remote. The hire lives in Albany.

  38. grim says:

    May not be a bubble, but the scaffolding holding a lot of this up in the area looks pretty god damned shaky.

  39. 3b says:

    Lib: I used to do this science and math parents/kids things with my guys when they were little. We one all the jellybean/ Kisses in the jars guess how many. And we also won the build a platform and see how many reams of copy
    Paper it would hold before it collapsed. All sorts of fancy/ artistic creations that were construed. We built tripods, simple and basic and we always won those too. Based on that I would say I am a brilliant Mathematician and Engineer!

  40. BRT says:

    Well, one things for sure, I see tons of townhomes going up in the historically undesirable lands of the towns I drive through. There’s still demand coming in from New Yorkers getting their Snake Pliskin on.

  41. grim says:

    Looks like we’re down to around 6k first-time doses a day last week in NJ.

    Last two weeks showed substantial declines in new vaccinations. The upward trend is clearly gone, and we’re going back down now.

    The impact of authorization, and the mandates, seems to have been very short lived. Did the booster discussion kill the momentum? Are we just running out of people to vaccinate?

  42. 3b says:

    MarketWatch article Buyers getting tired of bidding wars; they have fallen to their lowest levels in a year.

  43. BRT says:

    You know, a lot of authentic joints use 2 corn tortillas per taco, that would have to factor in right?

  44. Libturd says:

    Economy wise, I see it this way. We still haven’t paid for 2007. You can make fun of Costa Rica’s (or many other 2nd world country) debt to GDP ratio, but 68% is nothing compared to our 106%. And that’s with out GDP juiced by non-stop quantitative easing, stimulus, large scale asset purchasing, etc. We all think debt doesn’t matter, until it does.

    It also just doesn’t feel like the US has the competitive advantage it used to have. All we have is a stock market that seems like it is running on fumes and an awful lot of leverage. The wealthy are no longer sharing and they are wealthier than ever now.

    This all feels a lot like a recipe for a lot of pain.

    The concept that we can just keep printing money until oblivion to get us out of any future woes simply doesn’t pass the sniff test. And the length of this bull market is simply astounding.

    I am sticking to my strategy and will risk some future gains to save past gains. I can afford to be wrong. I saw what happened the last time the FED tried to turn the spigot. It was not pretty. It will be worse this team.

  45. BRT says:

    grim, I said it before. Any immunity discussions should have included recovered people as immune. The fact that they refuse to acknowledge it or collect data on it, we can only take guesses.

  46. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Locust boomers at the trough getting fatter and fatter.

    There will be hell to pay.

  47. Juice Box says:

    Look 1 Trillon, 2 Trillion, 4 Trillion or 8 Trillion what is a few Trillion between friends and countrymen?

    Here is a chart to swallow and it starts on Sept 15th 2008, the date of the bankruptcy of Lehman Brothers…

    https://fred.stlouisfed.org/graph/fredgraph.png?g=GKWI

  48. 3b says:

    Lib: And if the Fed can’t turn off the spigot then it all collapses on itself?

  49. Libturd says:

    3B,

    When we lose reserve currency status to the Renminbi, I wouldn’t want to be in the selfish country any longer.

    And I know the rich cannot make the poor into the middle class. I get that. But would it be so difficult to build a library, pool, museum, bridge or tunnel with one of your excess millions or trillions? Nah. Graydon needs a 4th Lambo.

  50. Libturd says:

    Better to take government subsidies and use them to drop a car in outer space.

  51. Juice Box says:

    3b – Cannot and will not be allowed to collapse. We are turning Japanese…234 percent of Debt to GDP….Decades lost….. Go become a grass eater if you want off the merry go round…

  52. Juice Box says:

    Or Billions of taxpayer money to fly one of the worlds richest men to space for 12 minutes on a dick shaped rocket.

    Speaking of Space…Musk’s 3 day orbital flight an all civilian flight crew is going up Wednesday…

    https://www.reuters.com/lifestyle/science/spacex-gets-ready-launch-first-all-civilian-crew-orbit-2021-09-12/

    The man himself will not be going on this one or the next one either..

  53. Juice Box says:

    Better hope the toilet does not clog..

  54. Libturd says:

    Japan is our only path forward. Hence my position in the market. Better find a good job because you will not be able to depend on Wall Street for your gains going forward.

    And now we know how a useless string of characters is selling for $44K.

  55. Libturd says:

    How great would it be if that pen1s rocket flew into a black hole?

  56. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Hey America Superpower,

    Can you please make some chips so I can find a car to buy?

    In my whole life living here I have never had a problem getting a car to buy.

    We used to make cars here. What went wrong? We have rich guys flying on phallus shaped rockets into outer space, and although this is entertaining, it should not supersede the ability to make a car so us down here on terra firma can get to work driving to your sweatshop robot factory.

    Thank you.

  57. Libturd says:

    Anecdotally,

    The markets are lower today than the day that Powell announced that tapering would begin before the end of the year (August 27th). Just imagine how the market will perform when they actually do it!

  58. Phoenix says:

    Rachel Ray’s new product on Amazon in the future:

    https://youtu.be/Zp_EhjlLGkQ?t=18

  59. 3b says:

    Juice: We go Japanese, then we will eventually become extinct. Japanese both rate less than zero, Japanese men don’t want to get married, cost of living etc. in addition apparently their sexx dolls have gotten much more life like and they can be programmed for whatever one might be interested in. Japan does not allow immigration, so theoretically at least they will become extinct. The white middle/ upper middle class may go the same way here.

  60. Libturd says:

    My kid has been saving like a mofo for a beater. I broke the news to him that I will not allow him to buy one at least until next year, but realistically, not until there is a glut of inventory.

    On the flip side, his investment in Apple has finally turned his Robin Hood account positive. It was a very valuable lesson. He is not satisfied with his 10% gain. I told him to add a few zeroes to understand how great of a return that is. He is starting to the concept of risk.

  61. SmallGovConservative says:

    grim says:
    September 13, 2021 at 12:47 pm
    “May not be a bubble…”

    Use whatever term you like — bubble, froth, foam, fizz, etc — anyone over the age of 35 that doesn’t recognize that something is ‘wrong’ with the housing market has their head in the sand. And ultimately, what’s wrong with the housing market, as with other markets, is government intervention — the reason that housing costs are high, just like it’s the reason that college costs are high. If banks, credit unions, S&L’s and the like were making loans for either purpose that they had to keep and make a profitable return on, there would be far more diligence and the markets would be much simpler and healthier. Ah, the good old days…

  62. 3b says:

    Out: We have politicians like our current President, fossils thAt have been around for decades, like Biden almost 50 years! They sat back and watched and were paid off while our patriotic CEO s sent manufacturing overseas. Of course Joe is going to Build It Back Better!

  63. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    “The main reason they have for staying single is wanting to use their money on themselves. There is a common perception that for men, marriage means having their freedom to use money restricted. This is in direct opposition to women listing ‘financial security’ as one of the benefits of getting married.”

    And there you have it. White women here are the same, interested in money, can’t wait to put their kid on the bus and be rid of them.

    https://www.flashpack.com/us/travel/why-japanese-men-choosing-single-life-japan/

  64. 40+ year realtor says:

    Lib,

    We have discussed that Glen Ridge house before. Sold at sheriff sale. I was outbid on that one. The house was effectively a new construction on existing foundation with huge addition.

  65. JCer says:

    100% price increases in 2 years are more than a bit alarming, even 30% yoy is disturbing. It is a sign of a problem, call it whatever you want but it isn’t a “healthy” market.

    On autos and chips, it isn’t that we cannot make the chips it is all about profitability. There was no money in these chips so what happened was consolidation at the corporate level until you had only one company making these types of chips and then consolidation at the Fab level so they migrated the business to basically one fab on 300nm wafers to maximize output and minimize price. The economics are the tricky part, hard to justify the initial investment for the profit levels. Economics fails here as normally constrained supply results in increased prices, which results in increased supply. Here it doesn’t work as there is a precipitous cost of entry, you need to layout the chips and then produce en-masse even to recover initial setup costs let alone the capital investment in the fab. Add this to the fact that the supply chain is partners deep i.e there is the fab, the chip company who owns the design, the automative supplier making the component and finally the automaker. The automaker cannot easily change their supplier, their supplier is beholden to the chip manufacturer, any different chips would require engineering, and the chip manufacturer depends on a contracted fab, it’s too integrated changing what they are doing to address a temporary shortage is not palatable. Arguably it highlights shortcomings in the design of automotive/industrial computing, the design could be light years better and standardized components could be used based on standards but things are very much byzantine among the automakers

  66. Fast Eddie says:

    And I know the rich cannot make the poor into the middle class. I get that. But would it be so difficult to build a library, pool, museum, bridge or tunnel with one of your excess millions or trillions? Nah. Graydon needs a 4th Lambo.

    I’d have no issue watching the dick-shaped rocket go up Bezo’s @ss. I’m sure he does some charity and philanthropic ventures as well s Musk and the others but the private sector and their billions are not their responsibility to build things for public use. Your federal government is the one that needs to stop funding favored arts, giving contracts to the friends of wives and paying “consultants” for irrelevant nonsense. They need to use raw money for raw infrastructure projects. The Republicans are not exempt either but the democrats bring graft and waste to another level.

  67. 40+ year realtor says:

    NFL didn’t start playing the national anthem with players on the field until 2009. But let’s not allow that to get in the way of the “glory”.

  68. JCer says:

    Phoenix, on chips you can see we do have production capabilities in the US, so it’s not that we cannot make the chips it’s the particular components were not contracted to US based fabs and the fabs generally run at 100% capacity so it’s not like they could shift..there is no idle fab ready to porduce the needed chips even if the chip manufacturer was open to using a new fab. You can see what goes into restarting production to understand how a fire in asingle plat had such ramifications.

    https://www.nxp.com/company/blog/through-the-storm-the-complex-process-of-restarting-a-semiconductor-facility:BL-RESTARTING-SEMICONDUCTOR-FACILITY

  69. Fast Eddie says:

    NFL didn’t start playing the national anthem with players on the field until 2009. But let’s not allow that to get in the way of the “glory”.

    Bullshit. I’ve been to hundreds of games since the 70s. They weren’t paper cutouts standing on the sidelines. F.uck O’Biden and f.uck the progressives.

  70. Fast Eddie says:

    In 1968, Pete Rozelle, the NFL Commissioner, announced that players had to hold their helmets in their left hands and salute the American flag during the anthem. This was in response to the raised black-gloved fists during the national anthem at the 1968 Summer Games in Mexico City. The Vietnam War was going on and despite the protests of the war, Rozelle wanted discipline. The players didn’t all like it but they did it.

  71. Fast Eddie says:

    Bullshit again. I was there, for countless games. Required or not, the teams were on the field. Prior to 2009, they weren’t required but they were out there and they stood while the anthem played, with helmets off and lined-up. Yet another attempt by the left to twist the argument in their favor.

  72. Fast Eddie says:

    Oh lookie here! It’s the ’85 Bears standing for the Anthem:

    https://tinyurl.com/ymaak4fs

  73. Fast Eddie says:

    What?? Hand over the heart, standing at attention??

    https://tinyurl.com/3z6sazsb

  74. Libturd says:

    Phoenix,

    I tried to explain that episode to my son a few weeks ago. He thought it was stupid. Dumb teenagers.

  75. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Eddie,
    Define patriotic to me. Why should someone be patriotic? Is it patriotic to outsource a job? Is it unpatriotic to not want to support a war you don’t believe in?

    Then there is the legal system. It’s against the law to loot, so we don’t like those people, OTOH, when there is a law to wear a mask, it’s okay to break that law because we don’t agree with it?

    And these muppets that make the laws- when they are bought and paid for by corporations- are those laws really legal- well, we know they can and are enforced, but did they pass the smell test being made?

    Personally, I like football and will continue to watch the games. I respect your right to not watch, and I respect your right to not wear a mask should you choose not to.

    It’s all good.

  76. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Lib,
    Awesome episode. The ending was classic.

    And here is a tune from one of my favorite movies, Dr. Strangelove. A good divorce song.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HsM_VmN6ytk

  77. Fast Eddie says:

    Rule by force rather than govern by leadership… it’s the founding principle of the progressive left. Failure is success, irrational thought is logic and no better demonstration of it was this past week during President Placeholder’s “malaise” speech to all those unvaccinated Americans for letting HIM down. Now you’ll pay!! By the way, for all you illegals flooding the border, you don’t have to get the vaccine because no life is illegal. I read that on a neighbor’s sign on the lawn… the same neighbor who has security signs posted all over despite the fact that love is love.. except for those bad people of color, you stay away and don’t touch my rainbow banner!!

  78. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Hey, gotta profit. 💲💲💲

    https://bit.ly/3Cdd5wx

    https://bit.ly/2XpMrS9

  79. A Home Buyer says:

    Just curious,

    Is there a reason NASA spending billions to advance numerous technologies is a good noble thing for tax payer money to be spent on, but Bezos’s (or others) spending billions of their own money (and risking his own life to do it) to also advance numerous technologies is met with

    “eh, we have rich guys flying on phallus shaped rockets into outer space.”

  80. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Well, it was public defense money spent on ARPANET that allowed Bezos and his clan to benefit without having them pay one thin dime from it.

    Also, the airwaves should not belong to anyone. It should all be leased.

  81. leftwing says:

    God, that 24 Stephens street new knockdown is ugly as fcuk on the outside….Inside? Empty white box, except for the few contractor grade items screwed or glued on the walls…Good luck to those buyers….

  82. leftwing says:

    “I was able to figure out how many shells they use for their two businesses to almost a tee, but no, that’s nothing special.”

    Dude, go to Intel’s page. If you can guess how many transistors on a wafer they make you COO!

    What amazes me isn’t how idiotic you are, but how you double down on the idiocy explaining your…uhm….logic.

    Oh, and we do have agreement….you are most certainly special.

  83. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:
  84. leftwing says:

    OMG…the most politically incorrect thing I’ve seen in a while…LMFAO and feeling hugely guilty….

  85. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Lw,
    Look up the lullaby song. It’s his divorce song.

  86. Libturd says:

    That 24 Stephen Street House is a travesty of a million dollars. The house layout is a mess. There are two pretty much unusable rooms. Then there are stairs all over the place. I can’t even figure out why some of them exist. Every room is the wrong size. And finally, there are those blue tiles that would only please a mermaid. From the outside, not only is it ugly as fukc, but it’s completely out of style with the rest of the block.

  87. leftwing says:

    LOL, when I saw those blue tiles I figured it was an homage to the bathroom’s past….probably had the same color shag carpet (!) and toilet seat, straight out of the 70s….

  88. BRT says:

    Looks like the academic community is gaining the balls to finally challenge the CDC & Fauci on natural immunity.

    Aaron Kheriaty, MD
    @akheriaty
    My response to the following claim: “Okay, yes, natural immunity is superior to vaccine immunity, but perhaps still vaccinating the Covid-recovered anyway can improve their immunity a bit more.”
    The Iargest population-based study comparing natural immunity and vaccine immunity actually analyzed this situation: giving a one-dose Pfizer vaccine booster to those previously infected and comparing these individuals to unvaccinated previously infected individuals.
    The previously infected went from 99.74% immunity before vaccination to 99.86% after vaccination, including *asymptomatic* reinfections. The differences here before and after vaccination are negligible and have no clinical relevance whatsoever.
    The same analysis for *symptomatic* Covid reinfections found no statistically significant differences. When the efficacy of natural immunity is already extremely high, vaccination—or other interventions for that matter—cannot change it much.
    And vaccinations always involve some risk of adverse events, however small. Such risks are warranted only where there are potentially meaningful clinical benefits.
    To make this very concrete, consider the number needed to treat (NNT) to prevent one *asymptomatic* reinfection in those with natural immunity vs. the number needed to harm (NNH) by causing a vaccine adverse event.
    We’d need to vaccinate 833 Covid-recovered people to prevent 1 *asymptomatic* reinfection (NNT=833). We cannot even calculate the number of necessary vaccinations to prevent 1 *symptomatic* infection…
    …because the data shows no differences before and after vaccination for symptomatic infections, hospitalizations, or deaths.
    According to data from the U.K. of vaccination for previously infected, the number needed to cause an additional clinically significant adverse event was 11 (NNH=11), with the most common adverse events being fever, fatigue, myalgia-arthralgia and lymphadenopathy.
    In short: to prevent one case of *asymptomatic* reinfection, we would cause over 75 cases of clinically significant adverse events (NNT/NNH = 833/11). The number of people harmed to prevent one case of *symptomatic* reinfection would be even higher—too high to calculate with our current data.

  89. 3b says:

    Lib: And what’s with the windows? Especially the two over the garage. The house is hideous all around.

  90. Juice Box says:

    I like the my $1,195,000 dollar flip in LBI better, it was not knocked down, has not been updated and has the smell of pall malls and sea salt and will be underwater for REAL in a few short years.

    This place screams 1959…just look at the panel walls…

    https://photos.zillowstatic.com/fp/47d3bde09a9fe1ec09b1c7da360a3f21-uncropped_scaled_within_1536_1152.webp

  91. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Reminds me of a joke.

    Man 1: Wow your wife is beautiful

    Man 2: You think so? You should have met my first wife.

    Man 1: Really, is she stunning?

    Man 2: No, she is an optometrist

  92. Ex says:

    I dunno. Suppose it’s either age… or dislocation.
    The only control one has over this is their ability to weather
    change and take it in stride. There are no seasons here. It hasn’t
    rained since last “winter” holy crap. This is a great place to lose your f’in mind.

  93. Yo! says:

    Housing prices being driven by surging household net worth. Parents’ wealth helping kids pay for homes using investment accounts and real estate equity. In addition, Millennials who saved and invested have piles of cash.

    According to Redfin, 30% of home sales are all cash, highest since records began 20 years ago with exception of unique 2011-2014 period when huge investment funds and many smaller investors bought houses using all cash, intending to rent them.

    Tedfin doesn’t break out the New Jersey data, however reported the more than 50% of sales there this year are all cash. Nassau is comparable to North Jersey suburbs and wouldn’t be surprised to similar all-cash levels here.

  94. 40 + year realtor says:

    Eddie,

    In the big scheme of things I couldn’t give a flying f#uck about the national anthem, NFL, the Black national anthem or any of that, but it sure is fun getting you excited!

  95. RafaelNex says:

    Certainly. So happens.
    п»ї[url=https://zeenite.com/]zeenite[/url]

  96. 40 + year realtor says:

    A successful flip doesn’t always have anything to do with how nice the house is. My impression is that the Stephen’s house had a slim profit margin. Paid too much at the sheriff sale. Certainly didn’t spend a dime more than necessary on the construction.

  97. 3b says:

    Yo: So Parents are giving down payments for houses, but yet so many millennials have student loans? They are taking money out of their investment accounts yet the dollar amounts in 401ks the median not the average are weak. I don’t doubt some parents are giving their children down payments, all of it and some may be buying the houses out right, but theses are the exception, certainly not the rule. The way the article is written it makes it sound like this is the norm. As for the pandemic and savings I saw an article done months back said the same thing. They interviewed one couple who moved back home saved their money, including money that should have gone to pay their student loans. Not to bright in my mind.

  98. Juice Box says:

    Nice storm blowing through..

    BTW – as real estate hobbyist there are many knock down flips down here in Monmouth County with weird architecture.. One home is all BLACK and window treatments or glass etc is smoked…

    Several other oversized monster s being build are not a brick or fake brick façade no longer, not even cedar shakes or fake vinyl, walls are some kind of flat material, not stucco either, not really sure.. I am tempted to poke it and see if it dents with a medium force like a kid tossing a rock.

    You cannot design taste, my place has 11 mighty white columns makes Pumps place look like a someone slapped up a WT faux porch. I have a real hardwood porch to go with my faux column too with outdoor furniture and all but no lazyboy foam filled recliner YET. Makes a great place to smoke a cigar when the weather is bad. I think porches were designed for men…..

    I should just ring the register and go rent for all I care….but hey it’s not a bubble folks….

  99. grim says:

    Not sure I’d waste any time or money prepping the “mega sites” for covid boosters.

    Given the split in timing by manufacturer, the wide availability, and the timing restrictions, I suspect we’re not at all going to see a big run on vaccines. This is something that’ll be spread over months, with many opting out of the 3rd shot.

  100. Juice Box says:

    No sign of a pandemic here. Restaurants, stores, ice crème shops in town were all jumping last night, very busy for a Monday night. All the practice fields were full of families and kids soccer, playing in the playgrounds. The JV football team played a nearby town, none of the kids wore masks on the bus when I saw them leaving or anywhere near each other. Over in NYC the MET Gala had throngs of mask less gawkers and protesters kettled in by the NYPD to gawk at the glitterati.

  101. grim says:

    Heading downtown tomorrow, anybody around?

  102. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    Pretty epic rant by Breuer. The healthcare industrial complex has complete control of the narrative using fear and inducements.

    Why are we’re focusing 99% on an ineffective perpetual vaccine program when alternatives including actually curing covid are showing equal promise. It says it all.

  103. Libturd says:

    Breuer cancelled his show at the Wellmont since proof of vaccination or tests were necessary to enter. Just saying.

  104. Libturd says:

    “ineffective perpetual vaccine program”

    I’d prefer my research be performed by scientists rather than comedians. Both have the same profit motive.

  105. BRT says:

    I’d prefer my research be performed by scientists rather than comedians. Both have the same profit motive.

    Even the ones that have been wrong on numerous occasions, who’ve lied on numerous occasions, and those who refuse to acknowledge data that doesn’t align with their message?

  106. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    Scientists like Tony fauci who funded gain of function research at the Wuhan virology lab. Really credible people.

    And of course the HIC will eventually change their position on therapeutics but not until after they have patented products. Likely products that mimic existing anti virals.

  107. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    There is no other plausible explanation for why the science deniers fail to acknowledge that natural immunity is superior to the vaccines except to protect the vaccine revenue stream. They’ve sold +100 million doses that were unnecessary.

  108. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    Not sure how canceling shows because you reject a mandate is motivated by profit. Seems the opposite to me.

  109. Nomad says:

    Add TugBoats to the automation craze. Maybe the cranes that offload containers are next?

    https://www.engadget.com/machine-odyssey-tugboat-set-to-embark-on-an-1150-mile-autonomous-voyage-130023425.html

  110. Libturd says:

    Maybe it’s an excuse, maybe it’s not. But telling people that getting Covid is better than getting the vaccination is not the right move. I agree, there is something fishy about them not putting any focus on antibodies, but perhaps it’s because the focus has always been on getting as many people vaccinated as quickly as possible.

    But don’t claim the vaccination is not effective when it is saving lives.

  111. Libturd says:

    Nomad,

    Even AI won’t be able to overpower the mob that controls the longshoreman’s union. Unless they bring RoboCop with them.

  112. BRT says:

    Actually Lib, if you look at the data from 12-17, it appears to be actually the case with regard to the 2nd shot on an mRNA vaccine.

    You’ll get a worse outcome in the population double jabbing every young kid, especially the ones that were already infected. The reality is, maybe reducing children down to a single shot or lower doses is probably better than the virus, and they need to act accordingly on that. Moreover, they should be working on getting the adenovirus vaccine for children ready. That one is likely to be the safest.

    People are incapable of thinking between the two extremes “Vax is evil” vs. “Just get the vax already”.

    mRNA vaccine makes perfect sense for those uninfected or at risk. Even a 3rd jab for some. Given the current data, it makes zero sense for my children given their status as recovered from positive infection.

  113. BRT says:

    https://news.yahoo.com/taco-bell-testing-taco-subscription-193109119.html

    Taco Bell is testing a new 30-day taco subscription, the chain announced on Monday.

    Any customer who can get their hands on one of the Taco Lover’s Passes, which run for anywhere from $5 to $10 depending on location, is eligible for a free taco daily for 30 days.

  114. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    No one said that getting COVID is better than getting a vaccine. I don’t know anyone who got COVID purposely. But getting COVID and then getting a vaccine for COVID is asinine.

    We have a Vice President who’s said the reason for the mandate is to protect the vaccinated. It’s incoherent babble. We have the ACLU telling us that mandates protect people’s rights.

    With a cadaver for President weve ushered in an era of a cult of idiocy. Willful stupidity. The lobbyists must be laughing their asses off.

  115. BRT says:

    For a number of individuals, getting Covid does make them less sick than the vaccine. Moreover, they gain better immunity. The problem is, we don’t have any way to predict who those people are prior to infection, so it makes sense for everyone that wasn’t infected to get vaccinated on some level. My issue with the rollout for children is that it should be smarter than what we did for adults. They have to seriously consider number of shots and dosing because the reality is, it’s too close and too high…and was set that way for logistical reasons.

  116. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    Hard to say without studying both long term.

  117. Fabius Maximus says:

    Here is my view on this. My fully vaccinated mother tested positive over the weekend. Heavy flu symptoms and then loss of taste/smell and a positive rapid test. We have had a few days of no better, but more importantly no worse and she made it out of bed today to take a shower. So I am cautiously optimistic that she should be able to ride this out and recover.

    Now my step brother caught it back in March 2020. He ended up on a ventilator and was was lucky that he made it off it. A healthy mid 50s now has a limp, breathing issues and a few other problems. I don’t think he is fit enough to survive another infection.

    We know effacy falls off with time, so when the boosters become available, my family will be waiting in the queue.

  118. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    We know effacy falls off with time, so when the boosters become available, my family will be waiting in the queue.

    Fab,
    Sounds reasonable.

  119. Fabius Maximus says:

    Interested what peoples thoughts are on this. Senate looking to cap Retirement accounts at $10M. I dont think it will affect me ….. :*)

    https://twitter.com/MichaelMechanic/status/1437492599477006337

  120. BRT says:

    Fab, glad your brother came out on top. The likelihood of him getting another infection like that from sars-cov-2 is essentially zero. The very small percentage that have been reinfected have nearly all been asymptomatic.

  121. Fabius Maximus says:

    AOC goes to the Met Ball, makes a statement with a dress and the right lose it.

    https://twitter.com/jameelajamil/status/1437773442950918145
    #FTW

  122. Libturd says:

    As for all of your tiresome politics GOAT, Trump funded that Wuhan lab just as much as Fauci did.

    As for your choice? You THINK you have the choice, but you yield that right the moment you take a hospital bed away from someone who is not a selfish prick. Just too many stories like this.

    https://foxsanantonio.com/news/local/texas-war-hero-dies-waiting-for-icu-bed-doctor-fought-to-find-opening-at-us-hospital

    It’s not politics. It’s people’s lives your WRONG decisions keep messing with.

  123. Fabius Maximus says:

    BRT, but not Zero. A lot of talk is around the odds of being asymptomatic. Run the numbers the other way and the booster shot gives him a better shot at survival.

  124. Libturd says:

    BRT,

    I 100% agree and if my kid had gotten Covid (like so many dumb ones did) I would not vaccinate him.

    There are two issues that are being purposely conflated for political (not societal) gain. The RIGHT so badly wants to find these vaccines dangerous. Why? Who the fukc knows, but a large swath of our nation believes they are and it is still causing unnecessary deaths and illnesses that could have easily been prevented. The second issue, that those with antibodies from fighting off Covid itself should not be vaccinated, should be promoted. My BEST GUESS is that this too is stupidly politically motivated. Why? Because you can’t allow the Right to ever appear right. Though I’m sure there is some interest in Pfiser and J & J and Moderna making more profit (heck that’s a bi-partisan issue since they all have been caught acting on inside information). I don’t think it’s the driver of the missing information.

    As I’ve always said. They are all the same! Except for Trump. He was was the worst politician ever.

  125. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Just accept the fact that you and your love ones are going to die. It takes all of the stress away.

    You don’t have to worry about illegal immigrants. Or global warming. Or Spotted Lanternflies. Your retirement or your swimming pool.

    Consider it a relief from all that ails you.

  126. Libturd says:

    FAB, sorry to hear about your families illnesses. Sadly, you can bet your ass that the long term effects will be problematic as well. Good luck with them.

    You know what I really wish? That politics would not get in the way of what’s truly best for society. A lot of people are going to pay the price with their lives and their health ion the name of politics.

  127. Libturd says:

    Phoenix,

    Or just set a goal. Like Pura Vida in the next five years.

  128. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:
  129. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Lib,
    You will die there too. There is no eternity in Costa Rica.

    They haven’t cured cancer. Or heart disease.

    And then you will end up just like a carcass on the side of a highway. Next time you see that dead deer or squirrel just remember it’s your future. For everyone.

  130. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    “A lot of people are going to pay the price with their lives and their health ion the name of politics.”

    Including soldiers and those deemed as “collateral damage.”

    It’s game over.

  131. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    How many of those icu beds were filled with selfish people who eat too much, drink too much, drive too fast, smoke, don’t exercise, etc. my guess a lot.

    We live in a free country for now, making our personal health choices is a right.

    And freedom never gets old but unaccountable bureaucrats breaking the law being the scenes and seeking political cover does.

  132. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Ding ding…we have a winner.

    Remember, only 60% of the population are homeowners. The economy has done well for the top 50%, esp the top 30%. These are the families driving the market, not the renting class. So I see almost not chance that this is a bubble, but maybe I’m wrong. A lot of people making money out there.. but do not apply that to the entire population.

    Yo! says:
    September 13, 2021 at 9:34 pm
    Housing prices being driven by surging household net worth. Parents’ wealth helping kids pay for homes using investment accounts and real estate equity. In addition, Millennials who saved and invested have piles of cash.

    According to Redfin, 30% of home sales are all cash, highest since records began 20 years ago with exception of unique 2011-2014 period when huge investment funds and many smaller investors bought houses using all cash, intending to rent them.

    Tedfin doesn’t break out the New Jersey data, however reported the more than 50% of sales there this year are all cash. Nassau is comparable to North Jersey suburbs and wouldn’t be surprised to similar all-cash levels here.

  133. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    It’s already been studied. Progressives love the covid lockdown era and don’t want to let it go. It empowers their collectivist politicians and smooths the road for all of their leftist policies to be implemented.

  134. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    “Freedoms just another word for, nothing left to lose.” JJ

    Plenty of logic in that statement.

    “And freedom never gets old but unaccountable bureaucrats breaking the law being the scenes and seeking political cover does.”

    All politicians break the law. Many individuals break the laws that they don’t “like.”
    But then both complain about others that break laws.

    Just let it be a free for all already. Admit that America is full of sleaze bags that skirt the laws every day knowing they are never going to get prosecuted as those whose job it is to do it are lazier than the criminals themselves.

    America is a cesspool bought and paid for by corporations. Now, not saying this is a “perfect” government, but here is an example of one that at least tries to help it’s constituents.

    https://www.engadget.com/germany-phone-makers-7-years-security-updates-163601435.html

  135. Fabius Maximus says:

    Lib, I have always seen you jump on any advantage against the house regardless how small it was. At this point it all we have are the numbers, the downside of being on the wrong side of them given the stakes is big.

  136. Libturd says:

    “We live in a free country for now, making our personal health choices is a right”

    We don’t live in a free country. It’s a nice lyric in a song. But we are very far from living in a free country.

    If this was a free country, poor Texan women would have control over their own bodies. We are very far from living in a free country.

  137. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Pumps,
    Are the walls on your house white from the ejaculate emissions you pump on them each day while chanting “I am a homeowner I am a God?”

    My guess is if you turned on a fluorescent lamp in there that’s exactly what would be glowing in every room on every wall.

  138. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    “We don’t live in a free country. It’s a nice lyric in a song. But we are very far from living in a free country.”

    Very true, yet variable depending on the state you live in. And NJ is one of the worst.

    “If this was a free country, poor Texan women would have control over their own bodies.”

    Roe vs Wade is never going to get bounced. All women have to do is accuse every single male with some sort of sexual assault and it’s game over. In fact I’m surprised it hasn’t happened already.

  139. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Hell if I were a woman and some guy stole my parking spot I would call the police and claim he exposed himself. No downside, no proof required, just plain lie. One ahole down.

    Do that a hundred times and no man will even go to that mall ever again.

  140. Fast Eddie says:

    We don’t live in a free country. It’s a nice lyric in a song. But we are very far from living in a free country.

    How true. The left1st democrats want to tax, mandate, command, decree, regulate, charge, instruct, order, dictate and extort any and all movement they can to drive their perverse and corrupt agendas.

  141. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I agree. That’s why I’m in Ark next decade. You have to chase high growth disruptive tech companies to make money this decade.

    Libturd says:
    September 13, 2021 at 1:38 pm
    Japan is our only path forward. Hence my position in the market. Better find a good job because you will not be able to depend on Wall Street for your gains going forward.

    And now we know how a useless string of characters is selling for $44K.

  142. grim says:

    Seems far more profitable to have people infected with covid, then it is profitable to prevent it. How much is the vax and mask outrage being stoked by the hospitals, which are making money hand over fist? Hospitals are loving antivaxxers. Historically, Republican politicians have been in bed with healthcare, so the narrative isn’t a shock. Never have local politicians had so much power to influence healthcare revenue.

    https://www.cnn.com/2021/09/14/health/unvaccinated-covid-patients-treatment-cost/index.html

    A new analysis published Tuesday estimates that preventable costs for treating hospitalized, unvaccinated Covid-19 patients reached $5.7 billion over the last three months.

    This most recent data takes into account the surge in hospitalizations seen in August, which study authors estimate accounted for $3.7 billion of preventable spending alone.

    The data analysis from the Kaiser Family Foundation found, using data from the Centers for Medicare and Medicaid Services, as well as studies on health care costs, that each preventable Covid-19 hospitalization costs about $20,000.

  143. Libturd says:

    See? You Republicans are bankrupting America through your Covid hospitalization costs!

  144. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    See? You Boomers are bankrupting America through your Covid hospitalization costs!

  145. grim says:

    Follow the money, how many politicians are benefitting from hospital profitability?

  146. leftwing says:

    “t’s not politics. It’s people’s lives your WRONG decisions keep messing with.”

    I’m saddened someone died, especially of an acute attack.

    Perhaps some fat fcuks with no self control in for heart procedures and smokers hooked up to oxygen should yield their ICU beds first.

    I’d be all for stopping a procedure dead in its tracks for someone who checks both boxes. Wheel them into the hall and let him bleed out, pull in the acute case.

    If we are going to ‘blame’ people making choices, let’s make sure everyone is under the big tent.

    BMI and smoking have killed more and cost multiples more than COVID.

  147. Bystander says:

    GOAT talking about fat people driving up costs but the fattest, unhealthiest states are also the reddest states. There is no logic with red hat dolts.

  148. leftwing says:

    “If this was a free country, poor Texan women would have control over their own bodies.”

    Nooooo….if this were a free country I wouldn’t be bound to pay for someone else’s elective medical procedure, regardless of whether it aligned with my beliefs or not.

    TX women want to bang without protection and then change their minds after an inevitable result? Get a fcuking job that gives you the privilege to pay to get your dumpster fire of a vag hosed out. Oh and BTW, I’m not picking up the tab for the STD treatment either.

  149. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    If someone is saying that you shouldn’t get the vaccine without qualifying it then it should be viewed suspiciously.

    It’s the mandate for low risk, recovered people, special circumstances that becomes corrupt.

  150. 3b says:

    Bystander: NJ adult obesity rate, at 27 percent is slightly lower than US at 30 percent. For children 10 to 17 it’s 14 percent ranking NJ 28 out of the 50 states. Lower than red states, but I would have expected better.

  151. 3b says:

    NY has lowest obesity rate followed ironically by Florida at number 2. Mississippi has the highest obesity rates.

  152. 3b says:

    Bystander: Doing a little more looking and the numbers I posted appear to be off. Different sources giving different percentages. But you are right the red states or more specifically southern states have the highest obesity rates.

  153. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    Yeah, unrelated to my point which was lost on bystander but MS had the lowest life expectancy. It shouldn’t come as a surprise that they climbed the covid mortality chart.

    NY had the highest life expectancy and is also near the top of the covid mortality chart. All the seniors who were expendable to King Como.

  154. BRT says:

    Funny how Elizabeth Warren wants to break up Wells Fargo with their laundry list of misdeeds while she sits completely silent, and therefore complicit on banks like JPMorgan Chase and their bigger list of misdeeds.

  155. BRT says:

    I know people that have moved here from midwestern states. They said they had no idea you didn’t have to eat foods that clog your arteries and they end up losing 30 pounds just on dietary changes alone. The idea was foreign to them.

  156. chicagofinance says:

    Does not fit narrative….. must suppress….
    Just to be clear……. the system costs $30,000, of which $15,000 is handed to the purchaser. The usable life of this crap is 15-17 years, but they don’t tell you that it becomes inert. Also the environmental cost of fabrication on the front side and disposal on the back side……

    “It came down to cost and the environment,” said Josh Rudin, a 34-year-old real-estate attorney who took out a 10-year loan from Solar Mosaic to install solar panels on the house his family bought in Woodbury, N.Y., this year. “We just started a week ago, and even with the bad weather, the system is producing 82% of our electricity.”

    The solar panels cut the cost of his electricity purchases from the grid by 95% and qualify him for about $15,000 in federal and state tax credits. Even after accounting for loan payments, his monthly power expenditure will fall, saving him about $8,500 over the life of the loan, according to EmPower Solar, the company that sold him the equipment. Payments on the loan will remain fixed, and when the panels produce more electricity than he uses, Mr. Rudin can sell the excess to his local power grid, he said.

    Demand for the loans is accelerating this year amid more violent and unpredictable weather patterns, said Tanguy Serra, president of GoodLeap LLC, the largest issuer of solar bonds. “The wildfires in California, the Texas winter, the outages in Louisiana, they’re all large-scale advertising for the product,” he said.

    Hurricane Ida cut power to roughly one million customers in New Orleans and Mississippi and 200,000 people in New York, New Jersey and Pennsylvania this past week.

    Solar energy systems can cost $30,000 or more, and until recently, most homeowners had two choices when purchasing them: pay cash or sign a lease. Over the past five years, solar financing companies scaled up operations by borrowing money from banks and credit unions, then lending it out to customers of panel vendors like EmPower.

    The companies use algorithms to rapidly assess and approve borrowers, collect fees on the loans and then sell them to fund managers. Loans accounted for 63% of solar financing in 2020, up from 21% in 2015, Mosaic Chief Executive Billy Parish said.

    Increased government support is playing a part in the industry’s growth, said Bryan White, a solar analyst at market research firm Wood Mackenzie. The 26% federal investment tax credit on residential solar panels is slated to expire fully in 2024, but the Biden administration and Democrats in Congress are working on extending that by as much as eight years through the current budget reconciliation process, he said.

    “It’s a great day for solar today,” Mr. Rudin said on Thursday as blue skies replaced Ida’s torrential downpour. “I’m exporting five kilowatts to the grid and it’s only 9 a.m.”

  157. Fast Eddie says:

    BRT,

    I know people that have moved here from midwestern states. They said they had no idea you didn’t have to eat foods that clog your arteries and they end up losing 30 pounds just on dietary changes alone. The idea was foreign to them.

    They had no idea that cupcakes and hot dogs are not a balanced diet? The idea of eating healthy was foreign to them? Why do I find this so silly? Did their parents tie them up, shelter them from the outside world and feed them mac and cheese and fluffernutter sandwiches on Wonder bread?

  158. Bystander says:

    3b,

    I can understand confusion..NJ has alot of Italians. When you eat a whole bowl of pasta as a pre-meal then you may live in NJ..hah

  159. D-FENS says:

    I guess…but that doesn’t explain the low vaccination rate among the black community. It’s not because of availability either. They’re refusing it.

    American Blacks are certainly not aligned with Republicans…are they?

    grim says:
    September 14, 2021 at 12:50 pm
    Seems far more profitable to have people infected with covid, then it is profitable to prevent it. How much is the vax and mask outrage being stoked by the hospitals, which are making money hand over fist? Hospitals are loving antivaxxers. Historically, Republican politicians have been in bed with healthcare, so the narrative isn’t a shock. Never have local politicians had so much power to influence healthcare revenue.

  160. 3b says:

    BRT: Those people sound pretty stupid to me.

  161. SmallGovConservative says:

    Eddie,

    I know you’re boycotting the NFL and don’t blame you for tuning out the flag-haters, but if/when you decide to give them another shot, I highly recommend catching one of the upcoming Monday night games via Peyton and Eli’s simulcast on ESPN2 — very entertaining.

    https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/nfl/columnist/nate-davis/2021/09/14/peyton-eli-manning-brothers-mnf-simulcast-raiders-ravens/8328684002/

  162. Bystander says:

    Wow, RIP Norm MacDonald..I had no idea he has cancer. One of funniest comedians of all time.

  163. Fast Eddie says:

    SmallGov,

    I caught a headline about the Mannings doing this simulcast. I have both their jerseys; Eli’s, of course, and Peyton’s Colts jersey. I doubt I’ll catch it even though they are\were everything that was good about the league. Consummate pros and guys to root for. I may return one day to the game if discipline, respect and integrity returns.

  164. Fast Eddie says:

    By the way, AOC wore a “Tax the rich” gown at a gala last night. Wasn’t that a $30,000 a plate event?

  165. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Eddie

    Do you really think a female is going to miss something like that over a few bucks? They love money.

  166. JUICE BOX says:

    Eddie- comped.. stars are given invites to be on the FREE guest list by Anna Wintour, the Editor-in-Chief of Vogue who runs it, people who pay are sponsors etc.

    BTW there was another NY congresswoman there Democrat Carolyn Maloney who actually represents that part of Manhattan, few pics of her in the Media as it does not SELL nearly as many ADs.

    https://people.com/style/congresswoman-carolyn-maloney-wears-suffragette-themed-met-gala-dress/

  167. Juice Box says:

    AOC does not even know it but Anna Wintour and the fashion world will make money off her, they seem to give her lots of stylings and clothing that sells for $$$. They are now in the process of capturing her….

    Bernie Sanders would have never gone to this….

  168. BRT says:

    3b, it’s all they ever knew. BBQ, cornbread, coleslaw, grits loaded with cheese.

  169. BRT says:

    Norm was the best. He was a legend. No one else like him. And, in a way different than anyone else is. He would not hesitate to piss off his bosses and make their lives difficult for them by going out of bounds on things they would rather avoid. Ultimately, they blacklisted him from a lot of forms of entertainment for it.

  170. Juice Box says:

    CHI – usable life? High grade panels maintain 93% output after 25 years. Low grade a bit less about 82% output.. These are not the same panels made 30 years ago chemistry and finishing process is way better. There are now 415 watt panels and 500 watt ones on the way meaning about 1/3 less panels for needed for a 7000 watt system. Tesla’s solar roof tiles are neat but way too expensive still, it might take a few more evolutions for it to become common…

  171. Juice Box says:

    Norm was the best saw him down in A/C he killed it with a you have to attack the heart back jokes…

  172. 3b says:

    Grim Please unmod.

  173. 3b says:

    BRT: I understand, but it’s not like they live under a rock and had no idea other choices were out there.

  174. 3b says:

    AOC moved to Westchester Co when she was 5 ; she was not a Bronx girl.

  175. 40+ year realtor says:

    Beginning this week NJ sheriff’s departments begin selling occupied properties again at sheriff sales. Removals are not scheduled to commence until 1/1/21 and eviction moratorium for tenants is scheduled to end this year. Both dates could be extended if there is a severe covid outbreak. Curious how my competition will handle this unknown situation in calculating their bids. No announcements were made by the subject regarding this subject prior to Passaic County sale today.

  176. Libturd says:

    My favorite comedian ever is still Rodney Dangerfield. Shame he got no respect until he was an old man. His performances on the Late Show are unbelievable.

    My wife suggested we quit smoking. I agreed. I said we would only smoke a cigarette after sex. I haven’t had a cigarette in years. My wife? She’s up to a pack-a-day.

  177. 40+ year realtor says:

    Should proof read my comments.

    No announcements were made by the Passaic County Sheriff’s office regarding the status of evictions prior to the sale.

    Let the buyer beware!

  178. Libturd says:

    You don’t want to see the insides of the places where tenants stopped paying 40year. They are not pretty. And of course, their security is long gone too. Some of the pictures I have seen in the Landlord forums on Facebook are depressing.

  179. Libturd says:

    FYI. Sold off some of my high P/E gainers today. About 10% of my overall portfolio. Add this to the 7 or 8 percent I had sold back at the end of July and my IRAs are now about 80/20 long/stable. Haven’t touched my 401K yet, but might to match.

  180. grim says:

    3b – can’t find your post to unmod

  181. grim says:

    Non-hispanic White, Hispanic, and Black vaccination rates continue to converge, and there are now states where the Black vaccination rates are higher than White.

    Now only a 4 point gap between Non-Hispanic White and White, and a 9 point gap between Black and White. Given the flatlined White vaccination rate, it’s only a matter of a few months before we all hit parity.

    Where we aren’t seeing ANY material improvement in Hesitant Republican Middle Aged White Males, especially the less educated and lower income.

    US Asians are kicking our ass wrt vax rates, no surprise there, 68%

  182. Libturd says:

    “Hesitant Republican Middle Aged White Males, especially the less educated and lower income”

    The Trump wheelhouse.

    Here’s an idea. We have Trump organize another insurrection. Then, when all of these loonies are in the rotunda, we shoot them all with Pfizer-laced air darts. We’ll just tell them that it’s horse dewormer and they can all go home happy.

  183. 3b says:

    grim: No worries. Might have hit delete on my end.

  184. BRT says:

    3b they did once they ventured out. One got stationed in Hawaii and instantly ate healthy by default

  185. Juice Box says:

    Stop picking on the hicks in the sticks.

    What matters is where we live..

    Vaccination rates in NYC lag….

    1 dose

    18 to 44 Asian/NHPI 92%
    18 to 44 Black 41%
    18 to 44 White 59%
    18 to 44 Hispanic/Latino 68%

    BTW 13 to 17 Asian/NHPI is reporting 100%

    Link scroll down to vaccination by Boro…

    https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data-vaccines.page

    https://www1.nyc.gov/site/doh/covid/covid-19-data-vaccines.page

  186. Juice Box says:

    the numbers are however improving a month ago NYT reported the rate for the Black community was 28%

    Perhaps the Trillion dollars on informercial like TV ads are helping.

  187. Grim says:

    In the global rankings we are starting to look like a third world country.

  188. The Great Pumpkin says:

    It’s a bubble they say. I don’t know how.

    “America is short more than 5 million homes, and builders can’t make up the difference”

    https://www.cnbc.com/2021/09/14/america-is-short-more-than-5-million-homes-study-says.html

  189. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Bang that pumpkin drum. Been saying this for years.

    “The pandemic has certainly exacerbated the U.S. housing shortage, but data shows household formations outpaced new construction long before Covid. Put simply, new construction supply hasn’t been meeting demand over the last five years,” said Realtor.com chief economist Danielle Hale. “Millennials, many of whom are now in their 30s and even 40s, have debunked the industry’s ‘renter generation’ expectations.”

  190. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I remember when 3b was telling me they would all rent. I tried telling him otherwise, but he kept doubling down that I was lost in the woods and only supported my position because i owned housing.

  191. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Priceless, kid, priceless. Just when I lost faith in America someone (of course not a boomer) steps up to the plate and hits a home run!

    https://bit.ly/2VI7z5r

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  193. Fast Eddie says:

    Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix,

    The way that girl quit is unacceptable. Totally. Just quit. I can’t tell you how many shit jobs in warehouses, heavy construction and as gas jockey that made me felt like I was being pounded into the ground. It’s been this way since the beginning of time accept s0cial med1a didn’t exist to feed the muppets into making it acceptable. For anyone that doesn’t like it, move to a different job, learn new skills, start your own business or move to a place where work is an afterthought.

  194. Grim says:

    Nobody in the city today? Disappointing.

    Tells you all you need to know I guess.

  195. Juice Box says:

    Subway ridership still down by half.. Buses and trains from LIRR and Metro north still down just as much.

    Monday, 9/13/21 2,767,385 -51.2% Change From Pre-Pandemic Equivalent Day

  196. Fast Eddie says:

    “Higher taxes are necessary to invest and compete globally: US Commerce Secretary”

    https://www.yahoo.com/finance/news/higher-taxes-are-necessary-to-invest-and-compete-globally-us-commerce-secretary-194600790.html

    Yes, that will finally do away with outsourcing and will ramp up full time hiring here at home!! Right? I said, right?

  197. 3b says:

    Pumps: You go Girl!!

  198. BRT says:

    Wait, they couldn’t make those investments with their near multitrillion dollar spending binge?

  199. chicagofinance says:

    I’m with Fast Eddie…… this is a disgrace. Pointless and pathetic.

    Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:
    September 15, 2021 at 1:19 am
    Priceless, kid, priceless. Just when I lost faith in America someone (of course not a boomer) steps up to the plate and hits a home run!

  200. chicagofinance says:

    Question about diamond appraisals.

    I was updating home insurance and endorsements. I suddenly realized that my appraial on an engagement ring was from 2004. For reference purposes, I used an online appraisal just to ballpark how off the number was and how exposed I potentially was. The number went backward by about a 1/3 haircut. I don’t care from an investment perspective, only from a replacement cost point. However, is this experience in line with other people? I know that synthetics have become much more prevalent in the last 20 years and styles change.

  201. 3b says:

    Fast: Everyone knows higher taxes leads to greater investment. The fact they can state this with a straight face is just unbelievable.

  202. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Eddie and Chi.

    If what she said was a lie, then I would agree with you.

    If what she said was true, everything that she described should be investigated. And now it will.

    Your way, the abuse continues unabated. I’m glad the youth is doing this. Maybe if someone at Boeing did this on the loudspeaker there would be some people alive today.
    Instead they were splattered on the inside of the fuselage. I’m sure if you asked them if they wished someone spoke up they would say yes.

  203. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    The result will be Walmart will hire less cashiers. Instead you will be the cashiers. Now be quiet, stand in line like good employees, and wait your turn to work for the privilege of shopping there. And don’t complain when your scanner rings up something incorrectly. Just quietly overpay and walk out.

  204. Libturd says:

    Phoenix,
    Among my plethora of jobs in high school, I worked in the automotive department at K-Mart. At the time, K-Mart had a terrible stigma (still does actually). As we all know, teenagers have a tendency to worry way too much about how their peers judge them, mainly by appearance (fortunately mine tries hard to fight this). Well, when a mom would drag their kid into K-Mart to shop and I noticed them in the store, I would always embarrass them by getting on the PA and announcing their name. Watching the mom’s reaction and then their child’s was priceless. “Joe Smith, please report to the Jewelry department. Your pinkie ring is ready.”

  205. Libturd says:

    I have no clue ChiFi, but Gator’s diamond was appraised for over 10K and we dropped our umbrella policy on it years ago. Once I realized how much we were paying for it, I could just buy her a new ring every ten to fifteen years and it would have been cheaper than the policy.

    I know this isn’t what you were looking for, but something to be aware of.

    Also, I learned something the hard way recently. If you have a flood policy for your basement, it does not cover contents besides the major appliances and the circuit box even if you pay for contents coverage. At ground elevation or above, it covers nearly everything. We were fortunate that we didn’t lose much of value besides my movie theatre seats and a pullout sofa. But I was expecting the big payday, and instead will have to be satisfied with new appliances. In the grand scheme, we won nicely as our Utica boiler is probably 25-30 years old and we will be receiving a new one to go with a new water heater, fridge and washer and dryer. But I was really hoping to get paid for everything. You live and learn.

  206. chicagofinance says:

    I been getting feedback from clients. More money coming today into people bank accounts? WTF? This stimulus stuff is very uncomfortable and makes me queasy. This mimics the stuff that took down Argentina and Greece. Don’t these people understand the distortions that are being created? After running some errands with my son last night, we stopped at Chipotle at his request…… sign on the door that they are closing at 6:45PM due to staff shortages? This is given even though they are a stones throw from Monmouth University and on the footprint of a big mall…..

  207. 3b says:

    I agree with Phoenix. If what she said was true, then good for her to stand up and say something. Lots of crap used to go on back in the day, including sexual harassment, and we all kept our heads down. The younger generation won’t tolerate this , and they have no problem speaking up.

  208. JCer says:

    Walmart is already going “there” as is everyone else. Fewer employees, machines don’t complain, show up late, get sick, or make nearly as many mistakes. The reality is there will be fewer and fewer employees and they will need to do more and be more competent in the future, hopefully wages will be better as well. The retail space works on insanely thin margins and the rise of online shopping hasn’t helped. Even the model of a big store seems highly inefficient, I imagine the way box stores look will change in the future with technology, I’d imagine box stores turning into something like a showroom with a micro fulfillment center attached that is fully automated, you can see the goods and have your order “fulfilled” on the spot, they can accept returns, and handle same day e-commerce.

    Given how Walmart seems to be handling e-commerce I imagine their piece of the pie is shrinking going forward. Ordering from Walmart vs Amazon or even Target is like having a lobotomy. We just did it for school supplies as they were way cheaper but it was a painful experience, the darn site says everything was available for delivery only to force you to pick up a bunch of items because one item could not be delivered so I had to add the items back one by one to see which one they really didn’t have. Although I wasn’t thrilled with my last amazon order where they lost the package and then cancelled the 8 items because 1 was not available for reship, I guess impossibly cheap comes at a price.

  209. NJGator says:

    Late to the party, but confused about the Stephen Street discussion. Neither of those homes were sheriffs sales.

    24 was a family sale after the owner went into a nursing home.

    16 was an estate sale back in 2019.

    Re 24, the previous owners were amazing folks. They had lived on the block for over 60 years. During the 50’s or 60’s when the “servants” (i.e. African Americans) at the Glen Ridge Country Club started moving into houses on Gray Street (the street north of Stephen), the realtors in Montclair tried to scare the white folks into selling by telling them their property values would go down. Lauretta told people if they didn’t sell that wouldn’t happen. She convinced folks to stay. She started our neighborhood block party to create a community. That block party exists to this day (was actually held last weekend). Stephen Street was once described in the NYT as the most integrated street in America.

    Lauretta founded the Montclair Coop and produced a show for seniors on the local TV34 channel. When COVID started spreading in her nursing home she was organizing the residents to try and get more communication from the facility. She passed from COVID-19 in March of last year in her late 90s. She was one of a kind and a true gem.

    https://www.northjersey.com/story/news/essex/montclair/2020/05/27/lauretta-freeman-montclair-nj-died-coronavirus-97/5107183002/

  210. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    Lol. Biden now gets the David Crosby treatment. Once his grip on reality starts to slip, the handlers just cut the mic. How presidential.

  211. Libturd says:

    JCer,

    Walmart+ is the bomb. Walmart regular is trash.

  212. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Boomers complain how hard it was in the “old days” working retail.
    Brain dead old goats never competed with a computer, but will tell you how hard they had it working 7-3. Boomers were never late, didn’t complain, never got sick and never made mistakes. They are the absolute model of perfection and should be kneeled before like Grecian Gods.

    “Walmart is already going “there” as is everyone else. Fewer employees, machines don’t complain, show up late, get sick, or make nearly as many mistakes. The reality is there will be fewer and fewer employees and they will need to do more and be more competent in the future,”

  213. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Gen Z is in love with the world you created for them with your greed boomer. /s

  214. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Are we done with HairSniffingBiden and FlopHairOrangeface Trump already? Could Boomers have picked any two worse candidates? Could have done better choosing a dog from a shelter and calling it President, letting it make decisions by using its paws.

    Boomer wanted both of them and got it. Time already to let this disease run its course so America can finally move forward.

  215. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Joe Biden had a doctors visit, and Jill came with him.
    The doctor asked Joe a question, Joe just looked confused.
    The doctor said to Jill, “please tell Joe I need a Urine, Stool, and Semen Sample.”

    Jill said, “Joe, please take off your underwear and give them to the good doctor.”

  216. Fast Eddie says:

    The millennials and Gen Z’s kids are going to face the same crap as the boomers and previous generations faced when it comes to working for a living. Let them “investigate” all they want for the poor, so-called practice and behavior of management on any and every level. Corporations exist to make money, not to become therapists. Most of us ate shit on a lot of jobs. It happened 100 years ago and will happen in 100 years from now.
    Again, move on silently and find another gig that doesn’t consume you.

  217. BRT says:

    This stimulus stuff is very uncomfortable and makes me queasy. This mimics the stuff that took down Argentina and Greece

    In 2002 or 3? People flipped out about Bush mailing out $300 checks for one time. In 2008, people were flabbergasted by the magnitude of the TARP. These days, average TARP every month. Extrapolating out, 10 years from now, stimulus spending will be 10 trillion a shot.

    I wrote this in an Op Ed in 2009

    Last week the Congressional Budget Office marked down its estimates yet again. Just two years ago, you may remember, the C.B.O. was projecting a 10-year surplus of $5.6 trillion. Now it projects a 10-year deficit of $1.8 trillion. -Krugman 2001

    In 2009, the deficit projection is now $9 trillion. That’s a $14 trillion swing from the projected $5.6 trillion surplus eight years ago. We should do ourselves a favor and stop acting like any of their projections are realistic. If Vegas were taking bets, the point spread would be another $7 trillion. As far as the CBO goes, Mr. Krugman says himself,

    the Congressional Budget Office operates under ground rules that force it to wear rose-colored lenses.

    We are royally screwed when a $9 trillion budget deficit is the rose-colored version. Maybe we should be preparing for a $16 trillion deficit.

    I tossed that number out as a complete sarcastic joke 12 years ago but we are well past those numbers.

  218. 3b says:

    Phoenix: I agree . Trump and Biden, sad that these were the choices. If Joe steps down we get Harris, whose campaign for President exploded before the Iowa primary, and had minimal support . She is totally unimpressive. And she appears to have disappeared. I don’t think the power brokers in the Democratic Party will choose her as the 2024 candidate. Meanwhile over in Republican land , Trump is still out being Trump and wants to run again and making everything all about him. No one on the horizon in either party that is appealing.

    Over at the Fed, Jerome is doing his thing and destroying the economy, cause debt just don’t matter. Keep the rates low, So starter houses can sell for $1,000,000.00. And of course employers will pay the salaries to support those prices, as they are patriotic Americans. And then of course we have all the self absorbed celebrities that have something to say, as if we care. Yes, we truly are a nation in rapid decline.

  219. Libturd says:

    Really Goat?

    I just watched the three supposed cut-offs. This is completely made up. Not only that, at the one time the mic did cut off, he was talking about fighting forest fires. Hardly a topic where one would worry about what he was going to say. But go on with your lies and cochamamey conspiracies that pass as news on the right. Quite frankly, you are simply embarrassing yourself with this nonsense.

    Here is the slickly produced video for all to see how baseless your lies are.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bHPTdvk79dI

    And yes, I agree his ability to synthesise sentences is getting worse by the day. But claiming someone is cutting off his mic and then having Republican leadership turn this baseless conspiracy into a public narrative is disrespectful and sophomoric. Exactly how the base of illiterate morons like it.

  220. BRT says:

    Being a child of boomers was an uphill battle. At least my own experience. My parents didn’t take much interest in our personal success and it shows with the results from my siblings. They’ve also squandered everything they own to the point that my father, who is still a practicing doctor, calls me up to try to “borrow” money.

    I can only imagine the uphill battle my kids are going to have in this society. That’s why we painstakingly work on their education daily and probably will have to make sure we at least leave them or their own kids something to get a head start.

  221. 3b says:

    Fast: Millennials and Gen Z have it tougher than the Boomers. One income could support a family in most cases when I was starting out, not the case today. Same POS only 30 years older is twice the price or more with a 12 to 15k tax bill. My health care costs back when I was at GS for family coverage was under a hundred bucks a month, and for great coverage. 30 years ago there were pensions in corporate America, pretty much gone now, and some had pensions and 401ks. 30 years ago outsourcing of jobs overseas was not really an issue, today it is. There are more examples, but you get the picture. Boomers had the best of everything , and that is simply not the case for the younger generations today. We are going backwards not forwards.

  222. 3b says:

    BRT: I have seen both sides, the example of what you mention in your family, and then the parents that did all the right things for their children and still the results were not good. I have all seen kids that knew from a young age they were on their own and worked hard to succeed and did. Others who came from messed up backgrounds and they are messed up as well. Sometimes one can argue it’s just luck.

  223. Libturd says:

    3b,

    We have been saying it since the early 2000s. Our standard of living is dropping and it’s clear as day.

    Until we hold our bought and paid for politicians to some semblance of morality, this will continue unabated. This is non-partisan. Guys like Barney Frank and Phil Gramm should spend the rest of their lives in prison. Though Barney would probably like that too much.

    Howard Stern, who tended to steer clear of partisan politics for most of his career is on to something very important lately. For those who haven’t listened to him in a while, he is much closer to Charlie Rose these days than Fartman. With that said, he has hit upon the issue of how in too many situations, the minority is making huge decisions that impact the majority that don’t want it. This can only happen when politicians behave irrationally and no longer offer compromise as a solution. He’s pretty spot on.

  224. BRT says:

    Lib, Charlie Rose became fartman! But I haven’t listened to Stern since Artie went off the deep end. He got me through my commutes in the late 90s early 2000s. Never liked the potty garbage. Just the news. And I love when Gilbert was on.

  225. ex says:

    Another pathetic learning-disabled GOP candidate suffers defeat in CA.

    Quite trying fools. This state is BLUE.

    F UUUuuu

  226. BRT says:

    3b, you aren’t going to change the way a person is. But my siblings all could have been successful. They were just given no guidance or support. Next thing you know, they are all approaching 40.

  227. Libturd says:

    3b,

    I hope it’s not luck because I am following BRT’s example. Though I am being careful not to let the boys know. They are aware that they are on their own once they go off to college. Especially, since I’m paying for 75% of it. They managed to pay for 25% of it through their 529. Though, like my parents always told me, if I fall on hard times, they’ll help me out. But they would be extremely disappointed if it came to this.

  228. ex says:

    “Being a child of boomers was an uphill battle.”

    Amen, appearances matter more than reality was the thinking there.

  229. Libturd says:

    Ex,

    Forget the state. It’s the Trump style of populism that will never allow them to gain ground. Even with a president who can’t utter a complete sentence. Because the majority is still made up of good people who want a better life who know that scapegoating and xenophobia and bullying is the pathway to hell.

  230. Libturd says:

    Nice job with the recall. What a supreme waste of time and money. Though keep the failed efforts coming. My company makes a fortune on it.

  231. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    That was the Whitehouse feed. He was cut off mid sentence.

    And now what he has to say was irrelevant so cut him off? Like the Senator said, who decides that and presses the button? We deserve to know.

    If you don’t think there is a concerted effort going back to the campaign to hide Joe Biden then you’re kidding. Whether there was a precedent for this or not it’s a running joke at the administrations expense.

  232. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Your quote Eddie.

    ” Corporations exist to make money, not to become therapists.”

    Remember you said this when the insurance company denies your claim for an MRI, therapy or a surgical procedure.

    Mark my words, it’s in your future.

  233. Fast Eddie says:

    3b,

    One income supporting a family has been gone a long time ago. Not for everyone, though. I’m your age, maybe a few years older and I was able to be the sole provider for a while until the young ones were fulltime in school. The house was smaller, the budget was tighter until the spouse starting working again. Yeah, I get it, the young generation is facing a different battle, not a bigger battle. Houses are going like crazy, the money is coming from somewhere. They have advantages we didn’t; we had advantages they didn’t. We could parse it all day long, create spreadsheets, pivot tables and analysis to see who wins, who loses and I could tell you, in the end, debits and credits will all equal out.

  234. Libturd says:

    Really Goat?

    Perhaps it was time for a commercial? All of his responses were off the cuff. All of a sudden they end the program while the president is still speaking and it’s a conspiracy? Fire the producer of the segment. Fire the network. Fire Fauci. Bring in Mr. Pillow. He knows how to end the pandemic. Embarrassing. Really. Take my advice on this.

    Sure he fukced up the Afghanstan exist. But this? Grow up!

  235. Fast Eddie says:

    Remember you said this when the insurance company denies your claim for an MRI, therapy or a surgical procedure.

    If it’s life or death, I guess I’ll be dead. And if a loved one needs a life-saving surgery and isn’t covered, I guess I’ll sell the house and assets and pay as much upfront as possible. If it comes to this, then we’re all f.ucked.

  236. 40+ year realtor says:

    NJ Gator,

    24 Stephens was sold at sheriff sale in 2019. I was there and bid on the house.

  237. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Eddie,
    How much you think your life is worth to a corporation or an insurance company?

    I’d wager its millions less than you would think.

  238. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Eddie,
    If I were a corporation I would avoid spending one dime on you. If you died it would even be better.

    It’s just business, right? Business is not about saving you, it’s about making money.

  239. Fast Eddie says:

    How much you think your life is worth to a corporation or an insurance company?

    Probably around 36 cents.

  240. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    You don’t like it and want to pretend it away. I get it. But Biden’s senility is a rolling punchline. And it’s a problem for us all.

  241. Libturd says:

    40 year.

    It’s amazing the lies (for no good reason, accept perhaps to protect the dwellers reputation) that are spread.

  242. Libturd says:

    I’m with you on Biden’s inability to speak a coherent sentence. That’s embarrassing too. Wish he would step down, much like I wished Trump would. At some point, he might have to. But the Dems are no smarter than the Republicans.

  243. 3b says:

    Fast: We lived on one income while my kids were young for years. We were comfortable, not extravagant, but certainly comfortable. My wife started part time when kids were older and then eventually full time. I am probably older than you, but I am going back to late 80s early 90s so not that long ago in the scheme of things. We can go back and forth but I still feel on a whole my generation had it easier. I can’t imagine prior to WFH what a pain it was to get kids up everyday rush them to daycare, take the crappy commute into NYC, put in a full day rush home and hope for no delays on the train to get to daycare in time. Feed them, bathe them, check homework for the older ones and then throw them into bed . Rinse and repeat for 5 days a week. Miserable quality of life in my mind. As for where the money is coming from, I don’t know some are getting help from parents, some wedding money perhaps others disciplined saving. I read in the WSJ of one couple who moved in with parents and the rent and student loan payments money they used to save a down payment. My wife tells me there are still plenty of buyers putting 10 percent down and she has seen 5 percent down too, and this is in Northern Bergen Co. I have done back of the envelope calculations different scenarios, and have determine it in many cases takes one while salary to pay the monthly mortgage. I was able to pay my mortgage and all other expenses and still save all on one income. So as I say I think we are going backwards not forwards.

  244. Fast Eddie says:

    Californians have spoken: Blackouts, suffocating taxes, dehydration and defecation are here to stay!! Yay!!

  245. 3b says:

    Lib: Of course it isn’t luck in most situations, with how kids turn out but unfortunately in some it is. At the end of the day you have done all the right things and they still don’t turn out well, then you will have no guilt that you did not do what you were supposed to do.

  246. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I try not to be negative and instead try to focus on being an optimist. It’s getting very difficult to continue being an optimist. Nothing is normal in this economy unless this is the new normal. You can’t even open up a small business because you can’t find workers. I’m slowly starting to see the light that “there will be blood.” I just hope I can navigate it safely for myself and my family. Might be a great depression 2.0 come 2030’s. If housing crashes later this decade, the economy is f/ed. It will take down the entire economy with it just like if commercial real estate crashes. The economy can’t support itself without either one.

    chicagofinance says:
    September 15, 2021 at 9:52 am
    I been getting feedback from clients. More money coming today into people bank accounts? WTF? This stimulus stuff is very uncomfortable and makes me queasy. This mimics the stuff that took down Argentina and Greece. Don’t these people understand the distortions that are being created? After running some errands with my son last night, we stopped at Chipotle at his request…… sign on the door that they are closing at 6:45PM due to staff shortages? This is given even though they are a stones throw from Monmouth University and on the footprint of a big mall…..

  247. 3b says:

    Lib: I would wholeheartedly agree with Howard Sterns analysis. We are on a speeding train heading for destruction, and no one seems to care.

  248. Bystander says:

    Ed,

    Just take the debt load alone- previous gens had none. Now, people in 30s and 40s are taking on tremendous loads, regardless what dips%its like Blumpy saying rich parents will save them. The vast majority are wishful thinking and leveraging up.

    Corps got free trillions galore via Trump admin and you claim samo, samo? If you got this money then you owe it to hire and pay US citizens. That patriotism that matters, not the black national anthem controversy. Right now, you have Dimons of the world looking to expand thousands in India and elswehere. Why? Again, the issue is slack in white collar US labor market. I see it all the time. There is no real push to hire unless on their salary terms. Also, current companies see issues with two incomes and people needing time to deal with kids/parents etc. Problem is they keep adding to that side, giving more days off for family leave, maternity etc but they keep salary increases at a minimum bc of these extra ‘benefits’. Lots of us can’t use them and have no benefit. I would rather get paid.

  249. Fabius Maximus says:

    Bidens senility is right up there with Hillary’s brain tumor.

  250. 3b says:

    Fab: Away from the partisanship and just being honest there are legitimate concerns regarding Biden’s mental capacity.

  251. Fast Eddie says:

    Bystander,

    Can’t disagree really with anything you said.

  252. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    The Cheshire Cat grin. It’s the narcissist look. With a heaping of condescending attitude baked into the caked on makeup.

    https://bit.ly/3zdvDe6

  253. 3b says:

    Bystander: Lets not forget Obama bailing out the banks. They should have been broken up and there should have been jail sentences. That of course did not happen. And Dems and Repubs have sat back and got paid by corps and watched millions of jobs being shipped overseas. Both parties are bought and paid for.

  254. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    “Just take the debt load alone- previous gens had none. Now, people in 30s and 40s are taking on tremendous loads, regardless what dips%its like Blumpy saying rich parents will save them. The vast majority are wishful thinking and leveraging up.”

    So your choices are to go to college (take on debt) or work for Walmart being abused by pervert Jared. I think debt is the way to go on that one.

    Live in your mommies basement and be mocked by Karen the boomer, or take out a massive loan to pay off Boomer’s retirement by buying his smegma smelling house? Well, it might take a while to get rid of the smegma and beer smell, but at least you aren’t dealing with a creepy landlord like Jared.

    Nothing like the smell of smegma in the morning.

  255. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    3b,
    Obama was a criminal just like the rest.

  256. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Boomer got more of a financial boost here as well. Just like their tax breaks and discounts at theaters and federal parks”

    Researchers at the U.S. Centers for Disease Control and Prevention looked at the cost of COVID-19 care to the Medicare program, which covers Americans aged 65 and up.

    On average, the investigators found, the program spent almost $22,000 for each patient hospitalized between April and December 2020.

    But those figures were much higher for some patients, including those severely ill enough to need a ventilator. Their costs approached $50,000, on average.

    Of almost 2,700 Medicare Advantage patients hospitalized for COVID-19, half received a bill — for provider or ambulance charges, for example. Those bills were often fairly small, averaging just under $300.

    More troubling were the costs to the few patients whose plans offered no waivers. They averaged over $1,500 in out-of-pocket costs. Younger patients with private insurance averaged over $3,800, the study found.

    According to the Kaiser Family Foundation, patients in traditional Medicare who were hospitalized for COVID-19 were subject to a standard deductible of $1,408. (That’s the amount beneficiaries must pay toward their medical care before their benefits kicked in.)

    Things were different for Americans with Medicare Advantage or private insurance. Last year, Chua said, many plans voluntarily waived “cost-sharing” for people hospitalized with COVID-19.

    The specifics varied by plan, though, and it appears patients often ended up with a bill.

  257. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    50k sure sounds light for someone in the ICU on a ventilator. The govt itself gets one hell of a discount.

    No wonder the hospitals cannot find enough staff anymore. Just become a lawyer and charge 500/hr with no risk of being sued. Plus you can Zoom at home right into the courtroom. You might even get to meet Bu tt f u 3000. The video speaks for itself.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yH3Y_4wc0Ng

  258. BRT says:

    The judge in that video is one to talk. Look at his friggin hair.

  259. Fast Eddie says:

    Per Washington’s Metro Weekly, the Gay Men’s Chorus of Washington and LGBTQ marching band DC’s Different Drummers will perform at the game.

    As I said, an organization needs to do what it feels it must do for it’s survival. I don’t know what, where or why p0litics and soc1al issues needs to be a part of the NFL, but that’s their choice. And it’s my choice to not have to hear or see someone’s p0l1tics when all I want to do is watch football.. which is why I have found alternatives.

    https://www.yahoo.com/sports/copy-of-washington-football-team-to-host-rare-nfl-pride-night-vs-giants-on-thursday-232314560.html

  260. Bystander says:

    I agree. It goes beyond presidency or party. The Federal Reserve is now our govt and exist to keep the country alive. We have to ensure money is printed given to wealthy corps with the hope that they have a plan to hire and sufficiently pay Americans, no strings attached. In the mean time, we will have to keep creating trillions in liquidy for housing bubble, subsidies for big businesses, payouts to lower class, eviction moratoriums, deferrment plans etc as economy / stocks will tank otherwise. We also can’t raise taxes as political hot potato and blame game. We are F-ed.

  261. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    BRT,
    You are in contempt of court. Bailiff, take him away.

    Don’t you ever make fun of a judges hair, or anything else. Haha.

    But in real life you would be finished at that point. Don’t underestimate the power of a judge or a police officer. They can take your life, your kids, your money, or anything else they want at any time.

  262. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    Eddie they might as well go all in and become the rainbows with matching uniforms to boot.

  263. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    ” And it’s my choice to not have to hear or see someone’s p0l1tics when all I want to do is watch football”

    Go to your local field and watch high school football.

    Oooh, sorry, then you have to hear and see the parents politics in your town.

    Oh well. At least you can check out all the single mothers during the game. Plenty where I live.

  264. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    “Eddie they might as well go all in and become the rainbows with matching uniforms to boot.”

    I wonder what would happen if you said that in front of the Baltimore Ravens in a dark alley.

    My guess is the only thing they would find left of you would be a smudge on the ground.

  265. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Bystander.

    Good post. It ain’t going to end well.

    https://youtu.be/ps0Ad5hFw4w?t=24

  266. Fast Eddie says:

    Eddie they might as well go all in and become the rainbows with matching uniforms to boot.

    Don’t worry, it’s coming. Along with applied points spreads due to an unbalanced number of transgender players on one side or the other. Think of something outlandish and something you never would’ve thought would become reality and the progressives will somehow weasel through until they get their way. Perception becomes reality very quickly. We are now Ancient Rome, on the downside.

  267. BRT says:

    I’ve said this before. We have too many 80 year olds in high places of power. Would any of you honestly get in the car if Pelosi, McConnell, or Biden was driving?

  268. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    I suggest we have the last supper at Grim’s place.

  269. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    In NJ, the most over regulated state in the nation they would hire all three as bus drivers to save money. Just like the old goat that crashed on 80 in Mount Olive.

    Well, in other states they are so cheap they are using the National Guard as bus drivers. How long before they will be your new waiter, or Walmart check out person?

    https://taskandpurpose.com/news/national-guard-jobs-bus-driver/

  270. 3b says:

    Bystander: Great post!!

  271. 3b says:

    BRT: The Boomers just won’t exit the stage! Biden pushing 80, Pelosi north of 80, Mc Connell almost 80, Schumer the baby at 70!! They need to all retire.

  272. 3b says:

    Bill Maher must be getting old and more cranky, even he is saying the woke Left is out of control!

  273. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    That bus driver was a real winner. Driving a 40 ft long school bus filled with children horizontally across a major highway that is 36 feet wide in front of a loaded dump truck.

    Now if the boomer taxpayers in that town would have ponied up a few more pennies- like the cost of an iced mocha latte with a shot of expresso – they could have hired someone who would have got those children safe to their destination.

    But that latte. MMM sooo good. It’s to die for!

  274. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    California Dianne Feinstein Democratic 87 6/22/33
    Iowa Chuck Grassley Republican 87 9/17/33
    Alabama Richard Shelby Republican 86 5/6/34
    Oklahoma Jim Inhofe Republican 86 11/17/34
    Vermont Patrick Leahy Democratic 80 3/31/40
    Vermont Bernie Sanders Independent – Dem Caucus 79 9/8/41
    Kentucky Mitch McConnell Republican 78 2/20/42
    Idaho Jim Risch Republican 77 5/3/43
    Maryland Ben Cardin Democratic 77 10/5/43
    Maine Angus King Independent – Dem Caucus 76 3/31/44
    Illinois Dick Durbin Democratic 76 11/21/44
    Connecticut Richard Blumenthal Democratic 74 2/13/46
    Massachusetts Ed Markey Democratic 74 7/11/46
    Delaware Tom Carper Democratic 74 1/23/47
    New Hampshire Jeanne Shaheen Democratic 74 1/28/47
    Utah Mitt Romney Republican 73 3/12/47
    West Virginia Joe Manchin Democratic 73 8/24/47
    Hawaii Mazie Hirono Democratic 73 11/3/47
    Oregon Ron Wyden Democratic 71 5/3/49
    Massachusetts Elizabeth Warren Democratic 71 6/22/49
    Rhode Island Jack Reed Democratic 71 11/12/49
    Missouri Roy Blunt Republican 71 1/10/50
    Michigan Debbie Stabenow Democratic 70 4/29/50
    Washington Patty Murray Democratic 70 10/11/50
    New York Chuck Schumer Democratic 70 11/23/50
    Arkansas John Boozman Republican 70 12/10/50
    Nebraska Deb Fischer Republican 69 3/1/51
    Idaho Mike Crapo Republican 69 5/20/51
    Mississippi Roger Wicker Republican 69 7/5/51
    Louisiana John Kennedy Republican 69 11/21/51
    Texas John Cornyn Republican 69 2/2/52
    Colorado John Hickenlooper Democratic 68 2/7/52
    Tennessee Marsha Blackburn Republican 68 6/6/52
    Wyoming John Barrasso Republican 68 7/21/52
    Ohio Sherrod Brown Democratic 68 11/9/52
    Florida Rick Scott Republican 68 12/1/52
    Maine Susan Collins Republican 68 12/7/52
    West Virginia Shelley Moore Capito Republican 67 11/26/53
    New Jersey Bob Menendez Democratic 67

  275. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    I stopped at 67. Of course the old goats could have retired much younger at that time, before they raised the retirement age.

    Anyone born today will probably be eligible for retirement at maybe, I don’t know 101 or 102.

    That’s one way of never having to pay out any benefits.

  276. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    “We are now Ancient Rome, on the downside.”

    You are right Eddie.

    Thanks boomer for all of your hard work getting us here!

    A description: Locusts have chewing mouthparts that enable them to chew and consume almost all or any part of a plant that is above ground.

  277. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    Agree Eddie. Using a football game to celebrate your s3xueal preference seems bizarre to me. Who would even show up for that?

    Or is it just for the team to say they did it? See how woke we are…

  278. 3b says:

    Phoenix: A bunch of old geezers! They all need to retire.

  279. 3b says:

    Fast: Ancient Rome on the down side good way to describe it.

  280. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Feinstein’s job in Ca must be so good. Imagine having a job so great that at the tender age of 87 that the thought of retirement isn’t even on the horizon.

    I mean, really. That’s incredible. This list. How many of the posters here think they would want to report to their job at 87 years old.

    No wonder AOC is trying to climb this ladder. Imagine work is putting on a 1 million dollar dress designed by Aurora James and prancing around like a Disney Princess. God that must be so empowering. And to think she can strive to do that for the next 60 years. Boy that beats working as an office temp I would imagine. Her career sounds really tough.

    “AOC’s Met Gala dress designer is worth approximately $1 million.”

    https://www.hitc.com/en-gb/2021/09/14/aurora-james-designer/

  281. JCer says:

    40yr are you sure on 24 Stephen, the sale in 2019 isn’t flagged as non-usable. In any event they made out well buying at 425k and selling for 1.1m with a horrendous renovation that likely cost less than 200k(any more than that they should have just knocked it down and started all over), it’s all builder grade garbage. Even figuring transaction and carry costs they made at least 400k after 10 months.

  282. Bystander says:

    Not that Ed or Goat will watch it but there was a documentary a couple of years ago called Gay Chorus Deep South. It is about SF Gay Choir that goes around MS, AL, TN etc trying to find churches who will let them perform. They are quite good and lead female singer is amazing. Of course they did it as response to Trump’s election so right will never watch it. It is gut-punch sad how these people have basically been shunned from families. Many now middle age dor senior came from South and try to reconnect in the various South areas yet still shunned. The choir is now only family they have. There are also heart-warming moments where southern churches allow them in and whole congreagation shows up to watch. You have no soul if you can watch that and not feel human pain, nor the joy of some acceptance for these people, many whom are religious and gay.

  283. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    No wonder they are going to prosecute every one that showed up at the Capitol that day.

    Democrat or Republican, they don’t care. It’s absolutely heaven on earth working at that place. It’s better than being at your own home palace (they are all gazillionaires) so not living in a smelly cape in Clifton.

    The UK has one Queen and one King. America has a whole hive of them.

  284. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Jcer

    Some lender must have had that abortion appraised, right, or no loan?

    Either that or a huge trunk of cash as a downpayment.

  285. JCer says:

    Yes way too many lifer politicians over the age of 70 in both parties. People like Biden, McConnell, Feinstein, Pelosi, Schumer, etc are in cognitive decline and have no business determining policy.

    The recall in CA was disappointing, the voters there have no b@lls. After Newsom’s shenanigans they should have voted him out just to make a point, now they’ll be stuck with him in 2023. The victory will just ensure he remains the nominee for the next election. It seems he’s a limousine liberal of the worst order but he might not be as bad as Murphy who my wife refers to as a helicopter liberal because that’s how he used to commute to gs. These people have no idea how their “liberal” policy failures actually impact the middle and upper middle classes, we are the ones who live with it and do a large portion of the work and we are the forgotten when it comes to politics. The democrats are for the poor?or some subset of the filthy rich and the republicans for the filthy rich. No politician in either party is at all concerned with what is important to 85%. It’s just seemingly in practice when democrat policies are put in place bad results follow(IL, NY, NJ, CA,CT), the wealthiest most productive places in the country are in a state of failure as a direct result of poor governance(so the fix must be expanding said bad government with more hard earned tax dollars).

  286. Ex says:

    JCer you are delusional.

  287. 3b says:

    Phoenix: Was that a million before or after she defaced it with her tax the rich message. She looked like she was enjoying herself while sending her so called message. It’s a long way from the Bronx AOC, or should I say the bucolic tranquility of Yorktown Heights, in Westchester Co.

  288. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    This would be a good guideline for politicians.

    In the case of pilots, the International Civil Aviation Authority, ICAO for short, has set a maximum retirement age of 65 years old. This has also since been taken in by the FAA as one of their requirements.

  289. Libturd says:

    I would pay to watch the LBTQXR* Drum Corps play football vs. The DC Gay Chorus

  290. 3b says:

    All politicians should retire at 65, mandatory. Let the next generation in.

  291. JCer says:

    Phoenix, I said it years ago America is going the way of Italy. The politicians are hopelessly corrupt feeding at the public coffers. They will not retire for fear of prosecution. Being in clowngress is a great job why would they give it up? Bad policy and bad governance is the way of life. At least in Italy the citizenry could actually cover the entire country’s debt(both government and private sector), that is not the case in the US. I mean Trump and Berlusconi are basically the same guy, billionaire real estate developers with questionable ties to mobsters, bad hair, 14 ex-wives, bad fake tans, and ridiculous (generally offensive)statements.

    So anytime policy is suggested look to see if they did it in Italy, however it turned out is likely how it turns out here. Our government runs like theirs, our private sector is considerably better than the Italian private sector but from a government perspective we run more like Italy/Greece than Germany or a Nordic country.

  292. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Here you go Lib.
    No payment necessary.

    https://youtu.be/2OKwRsnWO84?t=11

  293. BidenIsTheGOAT says:

    What does it have to do with Trump?

  294. JCer says:

    Ex if you think the governance in Ca is in anyway acceptable it is you who is delusional…

    Failing schools, extortionate taxes, out of control housing costs, increased crime, so many policy failures I cannot even count them all. You had a democratic state senator endorse republican Larry Elder. What you saw yesterday is a symptom of everything wrong in politics. Instead of justifying his decisions and policies he blitzed the voters with rhetoric associating Elder to Trump and somehow painted him as a “White Supremacist”. FYI all democratic electoral policy features vote harvesting, that is where the money goes, that is how Biden won, that is where Zuckerberg’s 400m went.

  295. Ex says:

    Guess what a guy who advocates reparations for slave “owners”…?! Is not going to have the capacity to turn any one of those long-standing problems around.

  296. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Boomers in Jersey would have loved this:

    As a result of Proposition 13, there are obvious distortions in the real estate marketplace. For example, in 2003 financier Warren Buffett announced that he pays property taxes of $14,410, or 2.9 percent, on his $500,000 home in Omaha, Nebraska, but pays only $2,264, or 0.056 percent, on his $4 million home in California. Although Buffet is known as an astute investor, the low property taxes on his California home are not attributable to his investment prowess, but rather to Proposition 13.

    https://www.nber.org/digest/apr05/lock-effect-californias-proposition-13

  297. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Failing schools, extortionate taxes, out of control housing costs, increased crime, so many policy failures I cannot even count them all.

    Well, when so many boomers pay peanuts in taxes and refuse to fund the schools, this is what you get. It all makes sense.

  298. SmallGovConservative says:

    JCer says:
    September 15, 2021 at 1:56 pm
    “The politicians are hopelessly corrupt feeding at the public coffers. They will not retire …”

    Wouldn’t this also be known as ‘the swamp’? Isn’t it all the more reason we should welcome and support outsiders when they decide to run for office — even crude guys like T? We all know how NYC prospered as a result of Bloomberg’s good governance (following Giuliani’s successful restoration of law and order), but the woke dopes couldn’t wait to turn the city back to a useless and corrupt party hack like DeBlasio — if anyone wants to know first hand how that’s worked out just take a walk along 40th St between 7th and Broadway. Those same woke dopes were also perfectly happy that the 2020 sham election put DC back in the hands of Calamity Joe — the ultimate swamp dweller. We all know how that’s turned out.

  299. Bystander says:

    Phoenix,

    Maybe not..welcome to the future. This is now thought of exec boards. Well, we don’t want to pay for your college degree now that you got it. Hey, this 19 year old HS grad just completed a Coursera and will take 50% less than you. Worth a shot.

    That led IBM to eliminate the degree requirement for over 50% of its jobs, LaMoreaux said, as the company is taking a “skills-only approach to recruiting and hiring.”

    “It doesn’t matter how you got the skill, or where you got it from, as long as you have it,” LaMoreaux said.

    The company has also looked to focus on the skill set of its existing workers, putting more emphasis on training, skilling and retraining

  300. Bystander says:

    Also, follow up with what I posted above and start applying for jobs then watch how many skills tests and personality tests you will be forced to take, particuarly for jobs which should not need them. You will never hear back nor no what they were looking for. I guess I failed mine at Interactive Brokers. I even had a ex-co worker following up as reference and still got reject.

  301. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Bystander,
    Seems like some are thinking about it, but not actually doing it in practice. Time will tell.

    Employers Open to Ditching Degree Requirements When Hiring
    But research finds degree inflation steadily increasing

    https://www.shrm.org/resourcesandtools/hr-topics/talent-acquisition/pages/eliminating-degree-requirements-hiring-ibm-penguin.aspx

  302. Ex says:

    2:18 the old timers laugh while their homes skyrocket in value and their taxes stay very very low. Check out a listing sometime on a multi-million dollar home that has stayed in the family for decades and hasn’t “reset” yet. It’s laughable and a great deal for the boomers.

  303. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    How many good employees are eliminated with “computerized” AI interviewers?

    Boomer hadn’t faced that until now. For the youth it’s the norm.

  304. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Ex,
    Yet they claim they are broke, cry like they are victims, and brag about how hard they worked vs the younger generation.

    It’s all bull served on a plate steaming and hot.

  305. Bystander says:

    Pretty old article Phoenix. Alot of exec mindsets have changed in 3 years and when they see labor costs rising, they will look for ways to offer people who will suffice for now and take less salary. I see it everyday. My IB wants to make due with bare minimum skill rather than start paying top dollar for good talent. We can’t hire BPM at all. Lost entire team and now they want us to pay lower Java developers and train them up rather than pay current market price.

  306. JCer says:

    Bystander it’s all about creating wage pressure. It doesn’t matter whether or not the person can do the job, lower the standards, lower the wages, the educated fool will have to take less money as he competes with someone who received online training from the university of phoenix or has a 3 year degree from DIFT, the Dhaka Institute of Fashion & Technologies. Yes you read that right you can learn t-shirt assembly techniques and computer science at the same school!

  307. JCer says:

    Bystander once they start paying more that everyone needs to be paid more, the offshore folks all share salary info it’s not like the US where someone can be dreadfully underpaid and not know it for years.

  308. 3b says:

    Phoenix: if they do it, in my mind it will be temporary, and going forward for the ones they do hire, promotions will be difficult without the 4 year degree. If community college becomes free the 4 year degree will become even more important as the value of a community college degree will be deemed as inferior due to it being free and open to people who perhaps should not be there academic wise. Watered down etc

  309. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Bystander,

    It’s why every day you read about a new computer hack. Corporate only thinks about money.
    Americans have embraced this mindset. “Our” government is bought and paid for.

    You can only knock so many blocks out of a foundation until it collapses. We get closer each day.

    It’s all fun until the morbid obese lady sings.

  310. Bystander says:

    JCer,

    Yep. It is wild-fire there. The minute somone gets offer they all know market rate. It is so smart for them. We had brutal call with absolutely mission critical tech lead today. She has shouldered so much yet getting no help from our exec mgt team. The turnover chaos/pressure is getting to her. She was absolutely blunt like never before. My guess is she has an offer and no giving some back. We are toast when she leaves as critical end of life project due in two months and behind.

  311. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Wow, this will end badly. Getting a college degree shows you have grit and can commit to something over a period of time. They are going to attract a bunch of hacks always looking for the easy way out. Can’t fix stupid.

    Bystander says:
    September 15, 2021 at 2:31 pm
    Phoenix,

    Maybe not..welcome to the future. This is now thought of exec boards. Well, we don’t want to pay for your college degree now that you got it. Hey, this 19 year old HS grad just completed a Coursera and will take 50% less than you. Worth a shot.

    That led IBM to eliminate the degree requirement for over 50% of its jobs, LaMoreaux said, as the company is taking a “skills-only approach to recruiting and hiring.”

    “It doesn’t matter how you got the skill, or where you got it from, as long as you have it,” LaMoreaux said.

    The company has also looked to focus on the skill set of its existing workers, putting more emphasis on training, skilling and retraining

  312. JCer says:

    I knew Americans at your firm who were laid off after working there for 12 years only to realize it was a “good thing” when they got to take off a few months and were able to get 150% of what they were being paid and oh yeah 40 weeks of severance. Your employer is so incompetent they didn’t realize you do not layoff underpaid people who are skill-wise above replacement value.

    My Indian friends, even those who have been here for 20 years and are very americanized literally tell you their salary, benefits, etc because they want to know if they are getting a good deal, they get a good picture of what the market is for their skills because they know what all of their friends and family are paid. Americans do not discuss their salary so freely, my wife and I have discussed how growing up we never knew how much money our parents made. The average Indian teen probably knows the details of his parents dental plan and 401k match.

  313. Bystander says:

    The social contract is broken because our government refused to tell higher education that we are not funding asburd tuition hikes for nearly 20 years now. We also allowed every crooked shytser to get into education business while backing the whole thing. Now, corp america will shun these people as skill-less in favor or lower wage “earn and learn” people. It is in IBM policy now. This is the scariest sh&t I have read in a long time.

    https://www.ibm.com/policy/education-skills/

  314. JCer says:

    Pumps that’s how it has been running for years. What happens is they hire some cheap bozos, mess everything up and then either hire other cheap bozos to replace it or bring in expertise to fix what they have. I know people who have made a career out of fixing the subpar junk that was built by low cost engineers. Effectively the offshore resources, a good number do not have anything approaching what we’d consider formal training in the US, if anything this is opening the same bad opportunities to people state side.

    In any event I started coding when I was 9 or 10 by the time I was 16 or 17 I totally had the skills to be a mid level developer and probably do it better than someone who went to college for computer science. I learned a lot of interesting stuff in college and it was a worthwhile experience but from an economic standpoint it cost 100k and didn’t leave me with any jobs skills I currently use. From an entirely practical standpoint it made me poorer as I missed out on 4 years of income plus having to pay for school, I figure based on entry developer salaries and the cost of tuition my education cost me 350k.

    What a degree indicates is how intelligent a person is(you cannot be a total dolt and get into a name school) and it indicates work ethic(at least in engineering you can’t pass without working relatively hard, liberal arts classes were a joke you didn’t even have to show up to get an A). It is a reasonable indicator of how someone will perform on the job where hiring someone without a degree is a cr@pshoot, they could be lazy or even worse a dolt and the probability is higher than someone who has a degree.

  315. 3b says:

    Jcer: So what about someone who gets a degree in computer science?

  316. Bystander says:

    Actually, you can JCer. Even Columbia has non-traditional students path for kids, 19 and up. Most of the Ivies do, I would assume. Same courses and degrees but catch is there is no real endowment money. You pay full freight cost, probably 70k a year.

    https://gs.columbia.edu/

    (You cannot be a total dolt and get into a name school)

  317. JCer says:

    3b, I have a CS/CE degree, there is not much focus on actual practical programming in CS, lots of theory not a lot of practical application, lots of CS grads cannot code well, a lot of coding done in CS programs is done languages not used in industry using concepts not used in industry. For example a CS major might use Haskell or do ARM assembly code but not know Java or SQL or Python. Doing what is done in most companies does not require the degree.

    Bystander my comment on schools was really with regards to engineering, also non-traditional students are identified by not following typical schooling patterns. I assure you you cannot graduate with decent grades from a well regarded engineering program without being somewhat intelligent and hard working I saw plenty of reasonably intelligent people wash out of the College of Engineering(if you’re not maintaining a B average they tend to push for you to leave and forget it if your gpa is 2.5 they just kick you out) and go on to have very good grades in liberal arts.

  318. JCer says:

    BY, I’d also argue that while some of those folks may not be the best and brightest people I’d still bet they are relatively intelligent if they can successfully complete the program.

  319. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    What happens is they hire some cheap bozos, mess everything up and then either hire other cheap bozos to replace it or bring in expertise to fix what they have.

    A good example of this was Boeing. 737 Max.

    When keeping it real goes very wrong.

  320. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Hmm,
    Then how did Bush graduate from Harvard? He had a hard time reading “My Pet Goat.”

  321. BRT says:

    George Bush, Al Gore, the list probably goes on and on

  322. JCer says:

    Yes Phoenix, I was shocked to find out these corps use the same cost cutting approach for things keeping airplanes in the sky as they do for a client portal for an insurance company. The 737 Max is exactly what happens when you eliminate you in house talent, there were so many things that could have been done differently but it is exactly the same thought process in terms of design, something unexpected happens and the software $hits the bed, I see it all the time with random website errors but it is unfathomable that the software encounters an improbable or even impossible sensor reading which forces the plane to the ground! The MCAS system should be dependent on redundant sensors and should be disabled if the sensors fail or at least indicate there is an issue and offer manual control, pilots should have been aware of the system and the possibility it could fail, they should have been trained on manual flying(it seems the US pilots that encountered the issue knew how to disable MCAS and manually fly the plane). Besides that building an inherently unstable aircraft to avoid regulatory red tape shows that maybe we have a regulatory problem, the regulatory regime resulted in increased risk rather than decreased risk. So many issues to unpack there but it was avoidable on many levels and was driven by greed.

  323. JCer says:

    The rich have different rules first off and second you probably haven’t dealt with too many dolts, I’d doubt Gore, Bush, et al are that stupid(Bush did a LOT of coke and drinking so he is somewhat burnt out), probably average intelligence or higher but your average student in an ivy league school probably has an iq north of 130.

  324. Ex says:

    The Best and the Brightest (1972) is an account by journalist David Halberstam of the origins of the Vietnam War published by Random House. The focus of the book is on the foreign policy crafted by academics and intellectuals who were in President John F. Kennedy’s administration, and the consequences of those policies in Vietnam. The title referred to Kennedy’s “whiz kids”—leaders of industry and academia brought into the administration—whom Halberstam characterized as insisting on “brilliant policies that defied common sense” in Vietnam, often against the advice of career U.S. Department of State employees

  325. No One says:

    I think the LGBTQ+-/X crowd may find better musical opportunities in Christian Rock. Chorus music I find universally dull boring, mixing it with Church music makes it even worse, and maximizes COVID spread. Look at what Faith +1 did to make Christian Rock more LGBTQ accepting:
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jFpTyem-xOY

  326. 3b says:

    Jcer: So are you saying a CS degree not relevant today?

  327. 3b says:

    A good friend of mine I grew up with graduated from Harvard Law, she said she had some brilliant class mates in school, who would have done well anywhere, but Harvard nurtures further. And, she also said there were some totally unimpressive students and downright morons as well. Lots of legacy students were there for only that reason.

  328. 3b says:

    George Bush not in the category of best and brightest. One of the worst Presidents in modern times in my opinion.

  329. JCer says:

    Intelligence and common sense are mutually exclusive. There is a lot academics are wholly incapable of doing. My sister “the doctor, who received an ivy league undergrad degree with honors in 3 years” can perform surgery but navigating buying insurance or having repairs done at her house is an impossible task for her and she’ll do downright stupid things like putting a credit cards, cash and her license in her pocket while she’s on vacation in a foreign country. Using her infallible logic she didn’t want to carry a wallet or a bag but those of us with common sense know you will either get pick pocketed or lose your stuff somehow and thats a very bad thing in foreign country far from home. Lots of book smarts, but very little common sense, I really think it is tied to how perceptive the person is it is almost as if they cannot learn from experience but can parse information from a book and think critically about it.

  330. BRT says:

    Gwb is the worst of all time. 2 wars, domestic spying, dismantling of every factory through unfavorable trade agreements.

  331. BRT says:

    Oh forgot, he presided over housing bubblemania followed by financial crisis

  332. 3b says:

    NYS Ethics committee votes to allow Cuomo to keep his 5 million dollars from his Covid book deal. The former Lt. Governor, now Governor is on the committee and voted yes as well. Corrupt top to bottom all of them both parties.

  333. 3b says:

    BRT Agree on GWB all around absolutely awful! And I believe he had Daddy issues.

  334. JCer says:

    3b no, I’m saying there are a lot of “technology” jobs where it is not required. For some things CS education would be critical, anything involving AI, video/audio, signal processing, compression, operating systems, robotics, data science, robotics, etc.

    The vast majority of Technology jobs in our area having nothing to do with these fields, lots of technologies and practices that are far removed from CS education. Even if you are working in a bank on a system with critical design value, like a high volume trading system, only a portion of the work requires the expertise a lot of it is just the plumbing.

    Pretty much everything we offshore(my experience, limited to the finance industry) could be done by someone who took a high school programming class. I will say this, you will not be paid for it that’s for sure, “real engineering” pays less than slinging code for a bank, retailer, or internet company. Most of what runs these companies is so bad they’ll pay a lot of money for a programmer who can “fix it”.

  335. 3b says:

    Jcer: So how does the IBM thing fit into the discussion?

  336. JCer says:

    I thought GWB was an absolutely horrid president, but all that aside he was probably of average or above average intelligence before all the drinking and drugs. Also even the legacy “morons” at the Ivy league school are of above average intelligence. We can pin a lot on Bush but I think him and Biden are similar in that others are driving the administration, he was just the face, doing what his paymasters wanted. I think it was KRS-one who described Obama as the “manager of a burger king”, nominally in charge, the face of the government but not really behind the major decisions.

  337. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    On the topic of GWB,

    Does anyone remember which word he had trouble reading? Was it my, or pet, or goat?
    I know it’s one of the three.

  338. 3b says:

    Phoenix: I just remember GWB at a press conference or address to the nation stating that being President is hard work, and he said it an almost surprised like manner like he was not expecting it to be.

  339. JCer says:

    3b, I think it can be positive to open up careers to those without traditional education. But if I were the hiring manager I’d want the guy with the CS degree from a good program. I’d totally support hiring and training and building out of local teams instead of offshoring to India though.

    My fear is that this is not what this is about, this is about replacing onshore people with cheaper resources because they are doing most of the work offshore. The hard skills become less important when the majority of the work happens overseas. The key distinction between the onshore vs. offshore developer is their physical location, their proximity to the users, they don’t need to be great engineers they are ferrying the work to a low cost location and supporting the systems during local business hours.

    Or it’s just to support wokeness, the number of black engineers or women for that matter is minuscule. By reducing the educational requirement they could increase the minority hiring in the technology field by taking less qualified individuals. I’ve worked with 2 developers who had no college education, they both were ok skill wise but were the laziest individuals I’ve ever worked with and that was likely why they did not go to college.

  340. 3b says:

    Jcer I would agree with the Bush/ Biden comparison although in the case of Biden his age is diminishing his mental capacity. Quite frankly I think his wife and family should have urged him not to run. As for Obama, definitely an intellectual, not particularly informed on any subject matter. No real voting record. In short an empty suit.

  341. 3b says:

    Jcer: I understand what you are driving at now.

  342. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Offshoring to India or anywhere else- how is this patriotic? Explain to me how doing this vs using American labor makes you a patriot? Does it just make you a capitalist? And does that alone make you a “real” American Patriot?

  343. 3b says:

    Phoenix: It does not make you a Patriot, however you define the word. And for the corprotoracy whether they define themselves as liberal or not, just as guilty .

  344. Ex says:

    Any time you diminish the prospects of one field or another you damage the livelihood of thousands even millions of workers. The problem we have is that the government in their wisdom likes to pick winners and losers in the economy.

  345. JCer says:

    Management doesn’t care about Merica. When I asked to keep my developers years ago my boss(a boomer of course) responded with “why would we do that the people in India will do the same job for a lot less money”. These were people who had been with the company for 12 years and had shown a willingness to work hard, they wanted to be retained by the company and we tossed them on to the street to save a few bucks. To make matters even worse we gave these people a year and then kept extending as the project deadlines slipped and their India replacements didn’t quite pan out. My management was totally heartless they laid someone off who had a child with cancer who was on our health plan, just to save a few bucks(80-90k). They have no loyalty to anyone or anything, if you are making them money great, if someone can do your job cheaper you’re done. America, they don’t care law taxes and high profits please.

  346. Ex says:

    JCer that’s why a Unionized workforce is key.

  347. 3b says:

    Ez: That ship has sailed, and ain’t coming back; just like corporate pensions.

  348. Ex says:

    To our collective detriment I may add.

  349. Ex says:

    Unions are the only thing that kept the Captains of industry from ass-raping the populace during the post-war boom.

  350. Libturd says:

    The word GWB couldn’t pronounce was nuclear. He pronounced it nuke-you-ler.

  351. BRT says:

    GWB’s greatest hits. He was really stupid.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Ux3DKxxFoM

  352. Libturd says:

    Unions were useful until either the mob or the greedy union leaders corrupted them.

    I still think there could be power in a union. But not without government reform which makes it impossible to purchase government favor.

    I’m not sure what was the more detrimental act to the future of our country. The removal of Glass-Steagall or the supreme court ruling (banana republic) which made it both possible for corporations to invest in PACs as well as to do it anonymously. We might have once been a great country, but like all countries, the greed of our leadership is bringing on our demise.

  353. leftwing says:

    There has long been discussion, here included, about the need for an apprenticeship model in the US. Usually occurs around the uselessness of certain college degrees, especially relative to the actual and opportunity costs of attending, and whether such areas of study at certain institutions actually provide any benefit to future earnings.

    Basically, we need to elevate and focus the trades where well trained individuals can make very good livings. the German model.

    Have not certain areas of IT simply become trades?

    Why shouldn’t we encourage and perfect this level of training?

    “…lots of technologies and practices that are far removed from CS education. Even if you are working in a bank on a system with critical design value, like a high volume trading system, only a portion of the work requires the expertise a lot of it is just the plumbing. Pretty much everything we offshore(my experience, limited to the finance industry) could be done by someone who took a high school programming class.”

  354. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    “Basically, we need to elevate and focus the trades where well trained individuals can make very good livings. the German model.”

    American businesses are never going to pay German type wages- they need to exploit those who wave and fly the flag like a bunch of sheep. Like everything else it no longer means anything once corporate takes over.

    So, please once again, tell me why we should be patriots?

  355. leftwing says:

    Separately, was knocking around upstate. Help wanted signs offering $15/hr everywhere. Fast food. Waitresses. Cashiers.

    Two person household, each just making only that minimum wage yields $60k annually.

    Did some googling…..$60k in the area places that family at the 70 percentile of earnings.

    Median home sale price was $130k. That’s just 2.2x gross income.

    Employers can’t fill these slots…..

  356. leftwing says:

    “American businesses are never going to pay German type wages…”

    Not with NAFTA….I was in banking when maquilladores came about….it was crazy, anybody and everybody was throwing books around looking to finance Mexican factories.

    Bottom line, the German government wouldn’t sign a ‘trade treaty’ that encouraged their corporates to move production miles away where labor is 80% cheaper and import tariff free….

    Corporates aren’t the issue here, your government is…..

  357. Ex says:

    8:29 true, we need some major workplace reform.
    At this point you vote with your feet. We need a structural reform
    But the economy being so driven by small business will make any true
    Gains impossible. Public firms though? Hold those f-Ckers to some standards.
    You take public money? Then you tie the goddam line.

  358. Grim says:

    SpaceX and the inspiration 4 crew made it up.

    First real civilian trip to space.

    They are now orbiting far beyond the ISS and even Hubble. Real space. 360 miles. None of this 50 miles bs. Been a while since we’ve been out this far, the shuttles didn’t even orbit this far.

    Not quite Gemini mission orbits (moon launch territory), but damn.

  359. JCer says:

    left there are quite a few IT jobs that are more like trades. I’d make the argument that actually we have under qualified people and poor processes for software development outside of the tech companies. Quite literally 90% of applications I see produced by major American and International companies are subpar, this includes the most elite banks. Billions are spent building these things, our government too is quite bad at technology, Obamacare enrollment site. Lots of things built with exceedingly poor architectures. The biggest issue is brain power, it requires a significant level of intelligence to design a platform that covers all the use cases, covers all performance requirements and security needs. The dearth is not of technical people but of smart people and the distribution of these smart people and how teams are assembled. I personally have seen that most of the people I started with in I-Banking technology who were worth their salt have moved to google or other tech companies(MS and GS were basically like tech cos, and now no one wants to work for them, not enough pay or fun). The bank or banks could have retained these people, they are not building the search engine, rather they own or are building small parts of products or apps not terribly different from what they were doing in banks. These types of people tend to be the difference between a successful project and a boondoggle.

    Ideally these smart people could be few and inserted in projects at key times but this doesn’t work, without ownership things go to sh*t, there is a huge motivation to build something good and resilient if you own it and will be on the hook when there are problems and unhappy customers, one person or group of people cannot “own” 30 applications. I even see it myself I am in a position where I won’t own my application after it goes live so I just don’t really care and will take short cuts, it’s being built entirely offshore and it is a giant turd, I cannot fix it nor influence anyone to change how it is being done, management is happy with the progress and the perceived quality so that is good enough so what happens a year after it goes live isn’t important to me.

    I think companies need to get serious about technical leadership, internal capabilities, and training. Technical staff is tremendously important going forward, if you are not building out capabilities and training you are dead in the water. So yes treating some aspects like a trade are important, I think local talent is important as working closely with people who know how to do the job is key. Take the brilliant technologist and give them a team to work with, that is surprisingly rare, it’s hard to find a place that will give you a sizable domestic team. No one is developing talent, the drive in corporate America is to commoditize. An alarming percentage of high spent IT projects are failures and no one is concerned with that. I do think hiring the youth and training them is the most viable solution but every where I go it’s $12 developers in a developing country.

  360. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Lw,
    And if you are single? Or get a woman pregnant- any benefits? What happens when she hops off your member and onto the next and you get a CS bill?

    Yeah, I get the “two income” thing, but that requires cooperation, and not everyone cooperates.

  361. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    Anyone in America should be prepared to go it alone at anytime. Unless you are a hot looking woman, then a few swipes on Tinder and you have another producer in the household.

  362. 3b says:

    Left: Corporate America wanted NAFTA and the government complied. Perot warmed against it back in the early 90s. The banks wanted Glass Stegall removed ostensibly to be able to compete with the European Banks ( that of course never materialized) and the government complied. It could have and should have been reinstated after the financial crisis , but of course it was not.

  363. JCer says:

    Grim SpaceX is a perfect example of what happens when a team of brilliant engineers is assembled and given the leeway free of the typical politics to build something, free from the constraints of “doing it the way we always have…”

    This is why China does not innovate, their system does not allow for it.

  364. JCer says:

    3b right on all counts, the banks write the regulation. NAFTA isn’t the half of it though, trade with China is absolutely the killer. Most of what is produces in Mexico ostensibly would not be produced in the US, we are facing an existential crisis as china has moved from trinkets into high value goods.

  365. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    America can’t build a car right now. That’s messed up.

    The end.

  366. Ex says:

    Going it alone is just another word for free agency.

  367. Ex says:

    10:33 cars are unbelievably good right now.
    Gasoline engines are more reliable and powerful
    than ever, cars are safer and last longer than ever.
    Even American cars.

  368. BRT says:

    Still can’t believe how savage Norm was. Just listened to a 35 minute reel of nonstop jokes targeting OJ prior to the verdict

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6pCH_Ab6SIE

  369. Out of the Ashes goes the Phoenix says:

    The heroes hard at work. I know what it’s like to tell the police and not have them act. They choose a side, and if it’s not yours, it’s game over.

    “Simone Biles and three fellow gymnasts offered gut-wrenching testimony to Congress on Wednesday, describing the abuse they suffered at the hands of doctor Larry Nassar and charging the FBI “turned a blind eye” as he molested young female patients.”

    And yeah, America can’t build a car. No chips, no cars.
    Good job Bean Counters of America.

  370. leftwing says:

    Phoenix, preaching to the choir brother.

    JCer, nice writeup. Funny, I’ve noticed bad software much more frequently recently. Partly as a result of you guys on here, partly as my kid is in SD now.

    Some systems are abysmal and even with my limited knowledge I can only imagine what the underlying code is and how tenuously it is all held together…My main trading platform is Schwab SSE…historical artifact, I was with the old optionsexpress when they bought them.

    Schwab today has the SSE platform, their best and most interactive in at least three iterations. Of course, futures were never on SSE and Schwab never attempted to integrate them (probably a good thing, L0rd only knows where that plumbing runs) so to trade futures I need both their SSE and main platforms open. Schwab acquired TD Ameritrade late last year which has ThinkorSwim as their main trading platform. I maintain an account there just for their data and analytics, top shelf, but an entirely different interface. So when I trade I have three platforms open – all owned by one broker – where I only need one.

    Plus, Schwab has spent the better part of the last two years shutting down their SSE off hours (when I often do research) to upgrade.

    So how the fcuk do you even begin to address that mess, LOL? You can’t shut either of the platforms down, there would mass defections striking at the rationale for the acquisition. And Schwab wasn’t even able to integrate their own futures and options platforms, how are they going to do that with a third party platform?

    Not to mention these are client facing apps….if the customer facing platforms are sketchy the internal systems….I don’t even want to imagine.

    At some point it almost seems building a parallel new platform from the ground up would be better…when it’s done and thoroughly tested just shut the other stuff down…

  371. leftwing says:

    “Corporate America wanted NAFTA and the government complied.”

    Agreed. But that still puts it on the government….

    My kids at various ages wanted ice cream for dinner, to skip school, to stay up until 2am, to have blow out keggers, and a brand new Ford Raptor.

    They got none.

    ‘NO’ is a viable option…..

  372. JCer says:

    ThinkOrSwim is a good platform I knew some folks who worked on it while they were building it. Integration is very tough, most of these firms who merged haven’t even been able to integrate their authentication and entitlement systems which should be low hanging fruit. Most firms simply lack the will to do what it would take to integrate. Realistically they would need to “modernize”/rewrite/rationalize a large amount of the backends and probably completely rewrite the frontends, maintaining almost identical look and feel because to really integrate them they’d need to be built on the same platform/stack. The firm I work at has applications they’ve “assembled” out of things we’ve acquired and it is jarring, different part of the application simply behave differently and it’s awkward. The back office stuff is really bad, even the modern apps are ugly. All these firms have pulled back on tech spend which makes it even worse and there of course is a big push to buy solutions if at all possible rather than build, most firms have come to the realization that they do not know how to make software.

    Scariest place was Cantor Fitzgerald where for a while I was the only person in the NY office who could support the interface to Phase3 for clearing, which was written in C using RogueWave libraries sometime in the late 90’s, the guy working on it before me a didn’t really know C and also introduced tons of bugs trying to fix problems. The original coders were all in WTC on Sept 11th. They hired me and another guy to rewrite it and then a month later canceled the rewrite, I guess making it reliable caused them to reprioritize. They then proceeded to lay off some other developers and had us doing regulatory projects on old junk. The lesson was clear, don’t ever work at Cantor, it’s like a company without an IT department or really any kind of department, we didn’t really have QA, our code releases had a 60% rollback rate, we maintained 64 different branches of one of applications every desk had a different version, they don’t pay their vendors in a timely fashion, and people just used whatever random technology/language/platform they wanted so you’d just come across the weirdest defunct no longer used technology. Lutnick clearly didn’t learn anything from Sept 11th they had no BCP plans, hurricane sandy was ridiculous they were scrambling like idiots sending people in taxi cabs between flooded out office to get equipment, and oh yeah most of their data centers are in the flood plain around NYC.

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