Subprime deals “falling apart”

From Newsday:

Not prime time to buy

Bay Shore resident Thomas Vitti is getting over the threshold just under the wire: If he and his wife don’t close on their new home in Islip Terrace by the end of the month, they won’t be able to buy it at all.

That’s because the crisis in the market for subprime mortgages – loans that have less favorable terms that have until now been readily available to people with spotty credit histories – is changing products and standards so rapidly that the mortgage he’s been offered won’t be available in April.

Once we were close to getting our mortgage, a few weeks ago, the market took a dive and I was like, ‘This isn’t good for the mortgage rates’ – and I was right,” Vitti said.

Vitti’s credit slipped late last year after a couple of late payments. He managed to secure a two-year, adjustable-rate mortgage, but only because family members helped him pull together a $30,000 down payment on the new house.

Realtors and mortgage brokers across the Island are reporting that 100 percent financing, through which home buyers were able to close on homes without any down payments, is a thing of the past. And following the disappearance of subprime loans like those, more and more deals are falling apart at the closing table as lenders back out or require that terms be adjusted to reflect the new, more stringent financing market.

“It’s absolutely true that deals are falling apart,” said Ed Munteanu, whose Islandia-based New World Capital does 60 percent of its lending to people with poor credit histories. He said that in the past six weeks, 30 to 35 percent of the subprime loans he has handled have fallen through as lenders and investors have tightened their guidelines.

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72 Responses to Subprime deals “falling apart”

  1. James Bednar says:

    From the NY Post:


    In a dramatic reversal, Morgan Stanley is in the process of holding an auction for $2.48 billion in mortgages from subprime lender New Century.

    The loans represent the collateral given to Morgan for a $2.5 billion credit line the firm extended to New Century. As the Irvine, Calif. -based company sank deeper into dire straits earlier this month, Morgan assured the market that the loans and repurchase agreements it had made to the company were in order.

    It appears that Morgan has less confidence in the health of this collateral now that it had two weeks ago. Now, Morgan does not want to draw attention to the sale: It announced the sale of the 13,200 loans in a small public auction notice in a print ad Friday.

  2. James Bednar says:

    From Reuters:

    Investor Sees Subprime Woes Spreading – Barron’s

    Sy Jacobs, veteran investor and head of Jacobs Asset Management, said woes in the subprime mortgage industry will spread, creating problems for some companies but also some market opportunities, Barron’s reported in its latest issue.

    “The problems in subprime are not self-contained. It is a pinprick to a larger problem,” Jacobs said in an interview with the weekly financial news magazine.

    Subprime lending was more than 20 percent of overall mortgage lending volume last year, he said, which indicates it was growing rapidly as a portion of the broader mortgage industry. Wall Street firms have contended the problem will be contained and only represents 12 percent of the market.

    Problems seen among subprime lenders will spread to other areas by impacting housing sales and as more borrowers struggle to keep up with floating-rate loans obtained in 2004 and 2005, he said. Already, subprime woes have had an impact on secondary loan markets, where credit spreads have widened.

    Jacobs nearly two years ago predicted subprime lenders would suffer as risky borrowers defaulted on loans they couldn’t afford, the magazine said.

  3. Clotpoll says:

    Have already seen a couple of deals die at the last moment when the lender pulls the commitment. There will be more.

  4. SG says:

    Nice blog site, Interesting story.

  5. metroplexual says:


    Not for nothing but Casey Serin has been around for months. He has been in the USAToday and in the recent Economist. The Kid is a trainwreck.

  6. curiousd says:

    Casey Serin’s story is a better example of media hype than of faulty lending practices. This guy is getting so much play time it makes me think those realtors have the right to cry ‘media driven panic’.

    ok, not really… but almost…

  7. curiousd says:

    ok, not at all… just feeling empathetic this monday.

  8. James Bednar says:

    From Bloomberg:

    Flipped in Florida — Selling in a Housing Bust

    There’s something about Florida residential real estate that attracts speculators like an alligator to an easy meal.

    Abundant sunshine has been known to distort investors’ perception of the laws of economics from the 1890s to the present. With tens of thousands of properties languishing on the market, the quick profits seem to have evaporated.

    The experience of Beth and Fabrizio Faieta, who have bought five homes in the Fort Myers-Naples area over the past few years, provides a tale of what happens when home prices sour.

    The Faietas aren’t your typical Florida “flippers” who had hoped to buy and sell properties within six months of purchase, though. They said their holdings were intended to be long-term investments. Yet as the market stalled, buyers were scarce and expenses rose, and they were forced to sell.

  9. njrebear says:

    New Jersey –
    4,448 properties in some stage of foreclosure.
    1 in 744 homes in some stage of foreclosure.
    35% increase from same time last year.

  10. Clotpoll says:

    Casey Serin is a poster child for nothing other than his own idiocy. He also happens to be a criminal and a publicity-grubbing maggot.

  11. James Bednar says:

    From the Record:

    Englewood’s small homes face hefty tax hike

    Homeowners in the city’s modest neighborhoods are likely to face huge tax hikes this year while those in wealthier areas get a break following the first property revaluation in more than a decade.

    Houses that had previously been valued at less than $120,000 — about one-fifth of all homes in Englewood — have almost tripled in value since the last citywide assessment in 1994. Those owners could end up paying $1,000 more in taxes this year. For some, the increase could be even more.

    “I’m not happy at all,” said Richard Friedman, whose taxes could jump about $2,100 this year, according to an analysis of the revaluation by The Record. His one-bedroom home on Brook Avenue in the 3rd Ward, previously valued at $113,500, is now assessed at $382,000. The possible 45 percent tax increase leaves Friedman feeling “ripped off.”

    Another 3rd Ward resident, Shirley Green, may have to fork over $1,600 more in 2007 if the city’s overall tax burden grows at the same rate it did in 2006. “Wow,” the 79-year-old retired schoolteacher said. “That’s a lot of money. I’m still on a fixed income.”

  12. James Bednar says:

    From the same link.

    Is your town next?
    The following North Jersey towns have upcoming revaluations:


    East Rutherford, Fair Lawn, Franklin Lakes, Hackensack, Teaneck


    * * *

    Bogota, Carlstadt, Edgewater, Englewood Cliffs, Fairview, Garfield, Leonia, Mahwah, Maywood, North Arlington, Norwood, Oradell, Palisades Park, Ridgefield Park, Ridgewood, River Vale, Rochelle Park, Saddle Brook, South Hackensack, Wallington

    Boonton town

  13. MrsP says:

    Speaking of tax relief, parents in Highlands want the town to foot the bill for a full time police officer due to a rumor from last October. I think they would be better served to take up a collection and pay for tutors since the school has a record setting 22% “classified” students. Not even the abbott districts can approach this and that means that 1 in 5 students isn’t even competent in English and that’s in a school where less than 1% list “Non-English” as the primary language.

  14. MrsP says:

    One other thing on the tax front, Highlands had a revaluation a few years back and while our taxes dropped because the house was newer we’ve seen a 14% increase in 3 years. So you may come out ahead on a revaluation but that is only temporary.

  15. NJGal says:

    “He also happens to be a criminal and a publicity-grubbing maggot.”

    Seriously, why hasn’t he been arrested yet? He’s a CRIMINAL. He has admittedly committed fraud. I don’t really care about his personal circumstances or the woe is me real estate investor story. Commit a crime, go to jail, end of story.

  16. James Bednar says:

    New Home Sales due out at 10:00am EST.


  17. James Bednar says:

    From the Washington Post:

    Foreclosure Wave Bears Down on Immigrants

    Immigrants are emerging as among the first victims of a growing wave of home foreclosures in the Washington area as mortgage lending problems multiply locally and across the country.

    Nationally, 375,000 high-interest-rate loans were made to Hispanics in 2005, and nearly 73,000 of them are likely to go into foreclosure, said Aracely Panameno, director of Latino affairs for the Center for Responsible Lending. About 1.1 million homes in the United States are expected to go into foreclosure in the next six years, and many native-born Americans are likely to be stuck with burdensome loans. But immigrants are getting hit first in part because their incomes tend to be lower and many have lost construction jobs.

    Homeownership rates among immigrants surged in the first half of the decade, making their prosperity an economic success story. Now it is becoming apparent that many people managed to buy homes in an inflated real estate market by turning to unusual new mortgages only now receiving scrutiny from regulators and legislators. Many of these loans start with attractive low “teaser” rates but feature payments that can suddenly increase.

  18. InvestorDavid says:


    JB, I have a commercial building in Teaneck and re-evaluation was done last year. The property value went up around 80% according to the new assessment. Waiting to find out how much rate adjustment they are planning to make.

  19. James Bednar says:

    From Reuters:

    U.S. subprime crisis exposes mortgage scams

    Gabriellee Cunningham had fallen behind on the mortgage on her modest suburban Miami home and was mired in debt when she was approached in June by a door-to-door “mortgage lender” who promised to help her.

    Nine months later, her $89,000 mortgage has ballooned into a $234,000 loan, her monthly payments have doubled and she faces foreclosure on a house she no longer owns.

    Housing officials call Cunningham the victim of one of the worst cases of predatory lending they’ve ever seen and warn, as the U.S. subprime mortgage crisis grows, of a rising tide of scams in which homeowners are being cheated out of their home equity.

  20. Seneca says:

    Citigroup may layoff 15,000…

    njrebear – maybe the investment bankers they are referring to in the article are based in Jersey City. So you know, NOT NY jobs. Right.

    “Beyond attrition, Prince has pointed to excessive layers of management, specifically within Citigroup’s investment bank, as a target of possible cuts, The Journal said.”

  21. InvestorDavid says:


    JB, I have a very close friend living in Englewood Cliff. During the reign of previous mayor, the property tax stayed relatively low. For the similiar houses in Englewood Cliff, they were paying 40% less in tax compare to Demarest, Closter and Tenafly since they don’t have a high school.

    From what I understand, the mayor passed away and his son took over the mayor job. He wasn’t doing a good job. In addition, there was a property a bank wanted. It was turned down by the Planning Board but a bit later, a new bank was being built which the new mayor had financial interest in. Not sure there is an investigation or not.

    Anyway, my friend is very worried about new property tax hike in Englewood Cliff – big budget problem now at Englewood Cliff.

  22. 2008 Buyer says:

    That’s a prime example of what’s wrong in the RE industry. They HAVE to close by the end of the month? Worried about interest rates? They are getting a 2 year ARM, probably the only loan they could get that would get them into the house. Probably agreed to list price because they HAD to have that house.

    They should not be buying a house period!

  23. RentinginNJ says:

    …The following North Jersey towns have upcoming revaluations:…

    Reevaluations will hit smallish starter homes the hardest. The bottom end of the market has seen the greatest appreciation over the last few years. Many starter capes have tripled in value in the last 10 years, going from $150k to $450k. Most higher end homes didn’t see the same rate of appreciation (“only” doubling in value).

    I went to an open house in Fair Lawn for a nicer that average starter cape (just looking around, not looking to buy), where the agent (an honest guy) told me the taxes were about $5,500, but to expect a major increase when the house gets reevaluated.

  24. James Bednar says:

    I thought Wall Street was the center of the universe.. What happened?

    U.K. Traders’ Earnings Beat U.S. Peers’, Survey Says

    London traders are raking in salaries and bonuses as much as 50 percent higher than their counterparts in the U.S., according to a study by Napier Scott Executive Search Ltd.

    U.K. traders’ earnings increased as much as 22 percent, while U.S. salaries and bonuses rose as much as 15 percent last year, according to the survey published by the London recruitment firm today.

    Bonuses for traders in the City, London’s main financial district, climbed as hedge funds drew more investments and after the value of European mergers jumped 54 percent to about $1.7 trillion, equaling the value of deals in the U.S., according to data compiled by Bloomberg. The value of deals in the U.S. increased 31 percent from a year earlier.

    “London clearly has supremacy as a financial center” over New York, Shaun Springer, London-based chief executive officer of Napier Scott, said in an interview. There is an “ever growing size and appetite of financial institutions based in the U.K. and Europe,” he said in a statement.

  25. RentinginNJ says:

    The new Realtor® mantra for Spring 2007….

    “You’d better buy now before lending standards change and you’re disqualified forever!!!”

  26. James Bednar says:


    I know you say that tongue-in-cheek, but believe me when I say that it is happening.


  27. bergenbubbleburst says:

    I am wondering how sub-prime is affecting the market, in north Jersey.

    Sicne the Fall, the drum beat of bad news for housing (good news for us) continued to get louder, and inventory in my town grew, and got stale.

    Than all of a sudden houses seemed to be flylying off the shelf in my area (River Edge) Rich in NNJ , and tbw confirmed what I had suspected , 16 houses closed so far in 2007, and 22 are currently under contract.

    This burst of activity for houses going UC seems to have occurred in late Feb, into March, just as all the negative news about sub-prime started coming to light. So I am not quite sure what to make of all of this, are people rushing ou now to buy, so they can get their laons approved no?

    Does that make ansy sense? To me it does not, as I would think that people would step back and say hey if lending standards are tightening, and inevntory is growwing, prices will come down.

    I cannot figure out why people are out rushing to buy now. Maybe thats our problem on this site, we think too much.

    So what happens from here, 22 houses UC, how many will ultimately close, since these all wentt UC after all the negative news abotu sub-prime came out.

    Was this the early Spring burst of activity, and then it dies as we head into April and beyond, I do nto know. Quite frankly I am just scratching my head right now;I don’t get it.

  28. investorDavid says:

    A friend of mine, a mortgage banker, saw 18 deals fell apart last month. She is crying poverty now. Half of them were due to Sub Prime lending institutions going under and the rest of them? Their loans are about to reset and/or their monthly payment went up and they are a couple of payments deliquent: thus, their credit rating went down and couldn’t qualify for new loans.

    It’s just the beginning.

  29. investorDavid says:

    #29: BergenBubbleBurst:

    I was wondering the similar thing: I was watching the Closter market for a while. Last Summer, there were up to 148 houses on sale. Now, it’s only 82. I have no idea all those houses were sold or just withdrawn. But the listing (NJMLS) has been sitting around 80 for the past 2 or 3 months. Interesting, isn’t it?

  30. gary says:


    You almost read my mind. I was just about to ask what the percentage of sub-prime mortgages are in towns in Northern Bergen, Western Essex, Morris, Hunterdon and Somerset counties. These are the most desirable areas and I would suspect that these are exempt from the sub-prime nonsense affecting the rest of the nation.

    As everyone around me keeps telling me, Northern New Jersey is insulated and until I see otherwise, I’m beginning to believe them. North Jersey is very, very competitive and we don’t live in Tuscaloosa, Alabama. Enough people apparently have “bucks” and this is the way it is. If you want “that” house, your (meaning all of us) going to have to pay. I thought the current equity in my house with our savings was going to allow us to trade up. Apparently not.

    My wife keeps telling me to get it out of my head and maybe in another 18 months or so, we’ll have enough to pay down the huge down payment. As I’ve said, prices here are not going to drop much, if at all for a desirable area. It s*cks, I hate it but that’s the way it is.

  31. BC Bob says:

    JB [26],

    Fact. Those that deny it, just don’t want to believe it. On the day that bonuses were received in New York, Mack was at the Canary Wharf office personally handing out bonuses.

  32. lisoosh says:

    The early spring bounce… this is where it is going…

  33. BC Bob says:

    lisoosh [34],

    Super Bowl is out, Grey Cup is in.

  34. njrebear says:


    from the report –

    “Chief Operating Officer Robert Druskin, who is due to report his recommendations internally by the end of the week, is examining 150 to 200 areas for possible cuts, looking for approximately a 5% reduction in Citigroup’s global workforce”

    Citigroup’s investment bank will take a bigger hit but the other areas will also see cuts.

  35. RentinginNJ says:

    This burst of activity for houses going UC seems to have occurred in late Feb, into March, just as all the negative news about sub-prime started coming to light. So I am not quite sure what to make of all of this

    I think this has to do with a combination two factors:
    1)A class of sellers who are realistic about the future market and its continued deterioration. They are modestly cutting prices to get their house sold.
    2)A class of buyers who believes the NAR party line about a spring recovery, higher interest rate… bla bla bla. They believe that they are getting a great deal because prices have come off their peak. It’s like houses are “on-sale”. They think they are savvy because they didn’t buy at the top.

    If you check out Itulip’s description of a housing bubble burst, this actually fits quite well with the concept of a falling housing market as a series of self-reinforcing deflationary waves.

    – Prices go up
    – Sales drop
    – Inventory goes up
    – Sellers capitulate
    – Sales increase
    – Repeat Cycle

    Each cycle brings a peak that is lower than the previous peak and a new low.

  36. BC Bob says:

    “New-home sales fall to 7-year low in February”

    WASHINGTON (MarketWatch) – Sales of new-homes unexpectedly slowed again in February, falling 3.9% to a seasonally adjusted annual rate of 848,000, the lowest since June 2000, the Commerce Department reported Monday. Economists surveyed by MarketWatch were expecting an increase in February to about 1.00 million units. Sales were down 18.3% compared with February 2006. Inventories of unsold homes rose 1.5% to 546,000, representing an 8.1-month supply, the largest inventory in relation to sales since January 1991. The inventory is up 26.6% in the past 12 months. The median price of a new home was $250,000, down 0.3% compared with February 2006.

  37. bergenbubbleburst says:

    #32 Gary: I do not have the stats, but I do know that sub-prime has to play a factor here, it explains how people could continue to pay the ridiculous prices. (teaser rates, I/O no-money down) I do not for one minuite buy the nosnense that we are somehow immune from all the nonsense of sub=prime.

    I have a friend who does real estate closings, and in the last 3.5 years has said they have never done a deal where the buyer put 10 or 20% down.

    The majortiy were all no money down. when there were down payments the $ amounts down were no more than 5%,and that was rare. he does closings throughout Bergen County, from Hackensack to Sadlle River, and all towns in between.

    And I have argued fo the longest time against the myth,that everybody in North Jersey has big bucks, and we are all immune from any down turn.

    And the sillienss about being close to NY, and Wall St bonus money, all a myth. The over whelming majortiy of people who live in north Jersey work in Jersey.

    I lived through the last down turn, and all the arguments from back then, the same as now, immune, big bucks close to NYC, Wall St, sophisicated highly educated populace, and yet the down turn happened.

    I am confused as to why it appears to be taking so long, and perhaps the easy availabity and access to credit now, is enabling people to hang on longer. I do not know, but I have no doubt it will happen,although I am frustrated that it is taking so long.

    And lets not get me started on bailouts.

  38. BC Bob says:

    bbb [39],

    You have it nailed. However, Chinese water tortue on price declines. Maybe 5-7 years with small yoy price declines,plodding. From peak to trough it will be quite significant. I hope I’m wrong, but I don’t see huge overall price declines in any given year. How about something like 4-6% avg over the above mentioned time frame. That said, I’m sure there will be certain situations with whirlwind declines.

  39. chicagofinance says:

    gary & BBB: patience

  40. BC Bob says:

    that’s avg per year.

  41. gary says:


    By all means, prove me wrong. I wish to believe it is not “different” now but I can’t until I see a real shakeout. I’m very skeptical.

  42. gary says:


    Six years and counting on the patience scale… I’m ripping the eight remaining hairs out of my head. :)

  43. bergenbubbleburst says:

    #40 BC Bob: So we are looking at anywhere from 8 to 12% off prices come March of 09, assuming prices drop this year.

    Last tiem around peak in 88/89. depths of despair(large price decliens by 91/92)

    Assuming the peak was 05, and prices in Bergen were flat last year, than the earlies we see any significant decline would be this time 09?

    If that si the case, than that brings me back to a point I made last week, is it even worth buying.

    And if sub-prime is collapsing etc, just who is going to be able to pay these prices over the next 2 years;it does nto make sense to me.

  44. investorDavid says:

    I know quite a few people who bought houses in Northern Bergen County last 7 years.

    This is what most of them did.

    Put down between 10-40% down on a million dollar house. Then pay Interest Only payment and/or using ARM.

    Most of them wanted to sell their houses before their ARM or IO reset in 3 or 5 years.

    But many of them are stuck since the market is so slow. Many of them have enough cash reserve or equity line to pay the increased mortgage but time is running out, but not as fast as you would think.

  45. James Bednar says:


    If you were sincerely looking 6 years ago, why didn’t you buy?

    Nobody was ringing alarm bells in 2001. While prices were ticking up from the 1996-1997 period, affordability was generally high, and prices didn’t stand out as being high. In fact, prices were only then beginning to crest over previous bubble prices (1987-1988) when inflation adjusted.


  46. investorDavid says:

    Rich in NNJ or JB or anyone else who has an access to NJMLS database,

    Can you do me a favor? Can you run that NJMLS history/analysis on these two houses? Very similiar houses on the same circle.

    NJMLS: 2701147
    NJMLS: 2709909

    I personally think that both of them are out of their minds.

  47. gary says:


    We did buy. I’m in my current house for six years now. It was a private deal after we went through 2 different bidding wars. Open houses were insane back in 2000/2001. Realtors were telling us to stay in line as we entered the open houses and asked us to submit our highest bid on the way out as the house would be sold that day. There were lines to get in the houses!!!

    My wifes cousin miraculously hooked us up with friends of theirs who were selling. It was a small house that we didn’t really want in an area we didn’t really want but had no choice. And we had to pay asking price or they were going to list publicly. Every time we found something we liked, there were multiple bids above asking… usually within the same day the house went on the market. Now you can see why I’m so antsy. LOL!

  48. BC Bob says:


    JMO, I was estimating from the peak, we can debate when the actual top was formed. I use 4th quarter 2005. It’s just a guideline based on past history. It may be a total waste of time comparing this charade to past history. Also, the speed of information today may accelerate this process. When all is said and done, I do expect approx 30-40% off peak. If I’m wrong, so be it. Won’t be the first time nor the last.

  49. investorDavid says:


    I looked at my current house December 1999. There were 3 bids including mine. I offered $75K below the asking price and eventually settled for $50K below the asking price (the previous owner took my bid even though my bid wasn’t the highest but I was putting close to 60% down. He had problems with previous bidders since they couldn’t get the loans/finance and couldn’t close).

    In 2002, I bought an investment condo in Fort Lee. There were 2 other competing bids and I offered the listing price. I ended up paying $5K more than the asking price.

  50. investorDavid says:

    BC Bob,

    According to my calculation based upon “normal” appreciation with inflation counted, I expect 25-28% off the Summer peak price of 2005.

  51. bergenbubbleburst says:

    #50 BC Bob, I understand, I hope (and belive it will be quicker) I ahve given myself until the Fall/Winter of 08, and even until this time in 09.

    If ti does not look like I can purchase at a much more reasonable (although still high) price, than it will be time to reevalutate the whole thing, and it brings up the question is it even worth it?

    I have owned in the past, and would really love to have my own place again, (for a lot of reasons), but will not risk financial suicide.

    Not to mention I think the country is in sad sad shape form top to bottom, and than of course the absolute dismal state of affairs in NJ.

  52. BC Bob says:


    I’ll take that.

    My calculations were based on a retracement to 2001, with normal inflation gains. However, when I looked at it further, I feel we will overshoot on the downside, like all markets, possibly back to 1998.

  53. BC Bob says:


    I’ll take that.

    My calculations were based on a retracement to 2001, with normal inflation gains. However, when I looked at it further, I feel we will overshoot on the downside, like all markets, possibly back to 1998.

  54. investorDavid says:


    Yes, the country is going down real fast and NJ is leading the downfall.

    Fall of Empire.

    Waiting for my kids to go to college. Then getting the H*ll out of NJ.

    Probably moving to Arizona. :)

  55. gary says:

    Why do you think I have such vehemence about this whole housing thing? This is why I get “wacky” over this!! LOL! You could’ve had a nice Center Hall Colonial in the low 300’s just seven years ago somewhere in Morris or Bergen county! Why do you think I talk about being de-sensitized and brain washed? My wife and I have been through this whole charade to cover two lifetimes! My first home was a brand new house in the Toms River Area in the late 90’s. We paid $185,000 for it. Can you believe that? LOL!! The thing was huge!! I didn’t want to do the commute so we moved back North. That’s when the sh*t hit the fan.

    We had realtors tell us to “keep bidding” if we were interested in a house but would show fangs if we asked what the highest bid was. We’d find a house and we could’ve bid twice the asking for all we’d know. We made three f*cking bids on a house in Fair Lawn and the realtor said “keep going”. Do you catch my drift?

    I feel for you first time buyers. I don’t know how you keep your shorts on. I’d be in a revolt right now. All we want to do is trade up to a slighter bigger home in a slightly quieter area but I refuse to squeeze every penny from every asset just to survive. It’s nuts. The people selling are nuts and the people buying, IMO, are even more nuts. 500K plus for a decent starter?? Think about that, it’s insane.

  56. bergenbubbleburst says:

    #58 Gary Youa re absolutely righ 500K for a decent starter house is insane, and it cannot continue, and the economic fundamentals do not justify it.

    It is for these reasons that this is going to end badly, its just taking too bloody long in my opinion.

  57. Rich In NNJ says:


    2701147 / 4bdr-2bth-2halfbth
    ACT $479,000 3/20/1997
    PCH $474,900 5/7/1997
    PCH $469,000 7/7/1997
    PCH $459,000 9/9/1997
    EXT $459,000 9/9/1997
    U/C $459,000 1/5/1998
    SLD $447,000 3/6/1998

    ACT $557,000 4/19/1999
    ACT* $557,000 5/11/1999
    U/C $557,000 5/25/1999
    SLD $530,000 6/30/1999

    ACT $899,000 6/28/2004
    ACT* $899,000 8/3/2004
    ARR $899,000 8/17/2004
    W-T $899,000 8/18/2004
    EXP $899,000 12/28/2004

    ACT $1,000,000 11/18/2004
    PCH $969,000 1/19/2005
    ACT* $969,000 3/21/2005
    ARR $969,000 4/11/2005
    PCH $938,800 5/6/2005
    EXT $938,800 5/18/2005
    EXP $938,800 5/22/2005

    ACT $944,900 5/26/2005 (New broker)
    PCH $915,000 6/27/2005
    ACT* $915,000 7/5/2005
    U/C $915,000 8/1/2005
    SLD $920,000 8/24/2005

    ACT $1,079,000 6/15/2006
    W-U $1,079,000 11/10/2006
    ACT $1,079,000 1/9/2007 (Relist w/same broker)
    PCH $1,069,000 3/6/2007

    2709909 / 5bdr-3bth
    ACT $479,000 11/18/1996
    U/C $479,000 12/22/1996
    SLD $470,000 5/7/1997

    ACT $550,000 12/3/1999
    ACT* $575,000 1/26/2000
    PCH* $550,000 1/26/2000
    ACT* $550,000 2/8/2000
    U/C $550,000 4/12/2000
    SLD $550,000 4/26/2000

    ACT $735,000 5/29/2002
    ACT* $735,000 6/14/2002
    U/C $735,000 7/18/2002
    SLD $730,000 8/22/2002

    ACT $949,000 1/15/2005
    ACT* $949,000 2/21/2005
    ARR $949,000 2/23/2005
    ACT* $949,000 3/4/2005
    U/C $949,000 3/21/2005
    SLD $930,000 5/5/2005

    ACT $1,290,000 3/13/2007

  58. gary says:


    Oh yeah, I don’t think people realize any of this until they go through it. It’s a f*cking war, man! This thing is distorted beyond belief and I just can’t figure out how it has sustained itself. Better yet, I can’t believe people are actually buying!! That’s why I said maybe I’m out of touch.

    People have been getting raked for years now and we got in by a miracle. It’s like everyone is in a daze or has a really, really short memory.

  59. Lincoln78 says:

    Question for the crew:

    My dad told me yesterday that he went to one of those Trump lectures featuring Donald Jr. I asked him what they talked about and, while he was focused on what they said about family trusts, he did mention the RE part of it. Then he got a copy of Trump’s book.

    Has anyone ever gone to one of these things? Should I worry that my dad is going to go out and start flipping properties?


  60. bergenbubbleburst says:

    #57 Investor: and the sad thing is, most people in NJ ar really clueless.

    It is one of the things that really bugs, me when I read something about how smart spohisicates, and well educated so many people in NJ are. The fact is most are clueless;they believe what they are instructed to believe.

  61. bergenbubbleburst says:

    #64 it is peoples own fault that they are getting raked.

  62. rhymingrealtor says:

    **People have been getting raked for years now and we got in by a miracle**


    I am glad you realize the truth, most people who bought at beginning or right b4 this madness don’t think it was lucky, they think they are financial genusius’ ( can’t spell)


  63. investorDavid says:


    I never thought myself as a financial genius. My first house I bought in 1999 where I am still living, I bought it because a famous “fortune teller” told me around November 1999, “If you don’t buy a house before the snow melts, it will be another 10 years before you can buy a house.”

    I never thought that house price will go up. I just thought that, maybe my business might not do well so I might lose the cash I have? so I bought it. Nope, I am not a fiancial genius. I just got lucky.

  64. Clotpoll says:

    Lincoln (62)-

    Worry that his time is being wasted.

  65. investorDavid says:

    Rich in NJ,

    thanks once again. You is a Genius or a genie in a bottle.


  66. d2b says:

    Lincoln #62-

    I’m so tired of the whole Trump family. A few months ago I’m traveling and flipping from channel to channel when I come across the end of ‘The Apprentice’. This woman is quitting because she didn’t sign up to live in a tent. Donald and his brats are chastising this lady for giving up.

    It was a bit condescending since Donald has run two companies into the ground. He would be selling insurance if it wasn’t for his father. And what have those brats ever done on their own?

  67. investorDavid says:


    I am not sure this is correct info or not but from what I hear, D. Trump’s dad made the money. How? During old days, in Manhattan, you can buy an abandoned building cheap from the City — probably bribe the right people. Donald Trump’s dad made sure the buildings he wanted are “abandoned” by hiring thugs to beat up old people and poor people living in lower east side.

    Then he buys the building cheap and build a new building and sell them.

    American way to make money – by stealing it from the poor. Right? Scum bags.

  68. jerseygirl says:

    Hi need some expert realtors to give me your opinion. I am thinking about making an offer on a nice town with great schools. The home is a 1960’s house that needs lots of work and smells like urine. sorry to say poor old man cant help it.
    anyway the house has been on the market for 5 months and OLP was 689,000, dropped to 649,000. I am thinking of offering 520,000 and will settle at 550,000. Then plan on fixing it added another 150,000. Anyway does this seem like too much of a low ball offer?

    Thanks for any input


  69. James Bednar says:


    Impossible to say given the details you’ve provided.


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