From the Record:
Residential property taxes in New Jersey rose by just 3.7 percent last year but topped $7,000 for the first time, a new state report says.
The increase in property taxes is the lowest in at least a decade, and is below Gov. Jon Corzine’s 4 percent cap instituted through a special session on property tax reforms in 2006.
The data released by the state Department of Community Affairs, covering every municipality in the state, shows the average property tax bill rose $249, to $7,045.
In budget documents released today, the Corzine administration showcased the 3.7 percent increase, saying it shows “the stabilizing effect of the governor’s policies” after increases as high as 6.8 percent in 2006.
If the rate had remained the same as the past five years, the documents say, “last year’s statewide average tax bill would have been $193 higher.” There were 266 towns last year in which average bills rose 4 percent or less, according to the budget summaries released today by the Treasury Department.
Still, New Jersey property taxes have now increased by 55 percent since 2000, according to the latest data. Republicans were unimpressed by the new figures, which come amid a fiery debate over the property tax plans in Corzine’s proposed budget for next year.
first
yee!
SAS
“Obama Wants Vets to Pay For Service Related Injuries”
http://edition.cnn.com/2009/POLITICS/03/10/veterans.health.insurance/index.html
From the WSJ:
S&P: Home-Loan Delinquencies Grow In January
Standard & Poor’s said delinquencies of home-related loans climbed in January, with the rate surging in particular from December for home-equity lines of credit and prime-rated jumbo mortgages.
oh.. Grim… you are such a kill joy.
who cares about property taxes, so boring.
hey, who wants to eat pizza while we watch American Idol.
SAS
From the AP:
Fed reports record fall in household net worth
The net worth of American households fell by the largest amount in more than a half-century of record keeping during the fourth quarter of last year.
The Federal Reserve said Thursday that household net worth dropped by a record 9 percent from the level in the third quarter.
The decline was the sixth straight quarterly drop in net worth and underscored the battering that U.S. families are undergoing in the midst of a steep recession with unemployment surging and the value of their homes and investments plunging.
Net worth represents total assets such as homes and checking accounts minus liabilities like mortgages and credit card debt.
Family net worth had hit an all-time high of $64.36 trillion in the April-June quarter of 2007 but has fallen in every quarter since that time.
The record 9 percent drop in the fourth quarter pushed total net worth down to $51.48 trillion, a level that is 20 percent below the third quarter 2007 peak.
The increase in property taxes is the lowest in at least a decade, and is below Gov. Jon Corzine’s 4 percent cap instituted through a special session on property tax reforms in 2006.
…
Still, New Jersey property taxes have now increased by 55 percent since 2000, according to the latest data.
It took 9 years for property taxes to go up 55%, yet 3.7% is something to be happy about?
An annual increase of 3.7% will mean that property taxes will go up another 55% over the next 12 years.
At this rate, in 9/10 years, the average property taxes will be $10k.
“Workers’ Health Benefits Eyed for Taxation”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/03/11/AR2009031103827.html
-President Obama’s plan to tax the rich to pay for health care facing deep skepticism on Capitol Hill, key lawmakers are pressing a different way to raise money: taxing the health benefits workers receive from their employers
#5 The net worth of American households fell by the largest amount in more than a half-century of record keeping during the fourth quarter of last year.
So what? Prices are just not going to fall here. It was all explained to us today. We are insulated, just don’t know how or what that means, but we are.
Oh and all those wall st people will keep prices high (who cares if many are being laid off). So there.(sarcasm off)
#6 grim: In my town the increases have been averaging 7% over the last few years.
#7 sas: taxing the health benefits workers receive from their employers.
Just one more reason why house prices won’t go down in this area.
“Standard & Poor’s said delinquencies of home-related loans climbed in January”
Doh, I guess Ken Lewis didn’t get the memo
200k from prev thread: “The only people that are immune to being laid off are state workers thanks to Corzine.”
Well, that (and other welfare recipients) is about 75% of NJ population.
#11 he he:Standard & Poor’s said delinquencies of home-related loans climbed in January”
Yes we have rising deliquencies in a recession, but we also have rising home prices. Mr. lewis explained it to us.
SAS [4],
I only eat pizza from Dominos and only watch Amerikan Idle on a 56 inch flat screen TV.
This week’s rally got an extra dose of adrenaline after an accounting board told Congress Thursday it may recommend a let-up in financial reporting rules for troubled banks in three weeks.
Amazing!
be ready for Global Poverty Act. Doling out extra $845 billion to the UN. Pretty soon we are talking about real money.
“The Candidate of Hope is hoping that while he caterwauls about our lost billions [in Iraq], you won’t notice that he has already proposed the most jaw-dropping transfer of wealth in American history: taking nearly a trillion dollars out of the pockets of American taxpayers and doling it out to the world’s worst regimes through its most corrupt intermediary, the U.N.”
“The GPA is a monstrosity. Thanks to Obama’s praetorian guards in the mainstream media, it is a better kept secret than most covert intelligence programs. But Accuracy in Media’s Cliff Kincaid has been digging (see here). If the GPA became law, the United States would be required to fork up for foreign aid 0.7 percent of its gross national product through 2015. That is, Obama would skyrocket U.S. largesse from its current annual level of about $21 billion (the world’s most generous) to — you’ll want to be sitting down for this — $85 billion per year. ”
“The price tag by 2015 for Obama’s international trough is estimated at about $845 billion. And that, you can be sure, is just the start. Harvard’s Jeffrey Sachs, who advises the U.N., anticipates that the funds needed “to put real resources in support of our hopes” would be raised by “a global tax on carbon-emitting fossil fuels.””
I am officially a douche bag….
chicagofinance,
Ok, spill it… what did you do to earn that illustrious title.
7.sas says:
March 12, 2009 at 5:23 pm
“Workers’ Health Benefits Eyed for Taxation”
http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2009/03/11/AR2009031103827.html
-President Obama’s plan to tax the rich to pay for health care facing deep skepticism on Capitol Hill, key lawmakers are pressing a different way to raise money: taxing the health benefits workers receive from their employers
The funny part of this i the Gold Plated Health Plans they reference, no longer exist in the Private Sector. Many company’s like AT&T adopted the Bush 2004 High Deductible Garbage Plan. If they want to find Gold Plated Plans they need to tax State & Federal workers. Either the members of Congress are stupid or the real thrust is Socialized Medicine as Private Employer Plans cease to exist.
Guys-
Home prices up and down
NEW YORK. Housing prices are falling in the city, but the boom that just ended saw homes go for 250 percent higher than 30 years ago. It wasn’t a smooth ride up. A new study by NYU’s Furman Center for Real Estate tracked the city’s cycles of boom and bust over three decades and found you can’t predict the future.
Nice chart here…
http://www.metro.us/us/article/2009/03/12/05/4429-82/index.xml
Here’s my little theory, you could probably take the price drop from the last cylce and drop Manhattan and get the range for NJ price drops over the next seven years. Just my $.02.
Erratum-
cycle, not cylce
also meant to cite, that’s from the Metro paper. I know pop journo-lite, but FREE!
confused: “the real thrust is Socialized Medicine as Private Employer Plans cease to exist.”
bingo.
O’s main goals (100 day start) is to
1) destroy the economy and private sector, and
2) destroy private health care
In Canada it was a crime for a doctor to treat a patient outside Government facilities (this was eventually overturned by Supreme Court 2 years ago). Yes, doctors were sent to jail if they had private practice. This is the only way to achieve even remotely something like “universal health care”.
gary/14-
nice, i would have to put that tv sideways to fit it in my little hovel.
Clotpoll says:
March 12, 2009 at 8:03 am
sas (30)-
The dump cycle this time around triggers the Black/capitulation market event.
This is my bold call.
Dow 4,500 here we come.
i know you have nailed everything to date, but bud, i really, really hope you’re wrong here.
seriously.
chicagofinance says:
March 12, 2009 at 6:07 pm
I am officially a douche bag….
I moved…
chifi/25- where to?
[25] chi fi
Colt’s Neck, right? Why is that any more of a douchebag town than any other?
From my perspective, I identify the douchebag by the car. If the plates are yellow . . .
(OMG, I just changed over to NJ registrations. I’m now a douchebag too!!!!!!!)
#25
chicagofinance says:
“I am officially a douche bag….”
Is that the first step on the road to recovery?
[22] jamil,
Get with the program, Jamil. It isn’t destroying, it’s “changing.” As in changing our economy, changing our health care system, changing our definition of “property,” changing our definition of fairness, etc.
Got it, comrade? Or do we have to re-educate you by locking you in a room with Chris Matthews until your loins get “tingly” at the thought of our president, just like Matthew’s does?
[25] chi fi
Will reserve judgment in your case, but most UC grads I know earned that sobriquet when the dean read them something in latin and said “I now confer upon you the degree of . . . “
[25] chi
But on a lighter note, are you not now a douchbag in a much nicer location for roughly the same money??? I’d take the title and the money, thanks.
Fitch downgrades Berkshire
#32 – That’s something I never thought I’d see while Warren was alive.
Maybe Clot was correct on his BRK wariness.
“Obama Wants Vets to Pay For Service Related Injuries”
No?! No way! Really?
Why stop there? Maybe they can next start charging for replacement ammo during firefights. Warfighters would likely pay any price, under those conditions. Maybe charge submariners for “excess” oxygen use.
This just in . . .
“ABC News: Leading Deputy Treasury Secretary candidate H. Rodgin Cohen withdrew from consideration Thursday.
(Problems allegedly arose in the final stages of the vetting.”‘
To my thinking, the “problems” may be that Rodgin is the pre-eminent banking attorney in the U.S., and is one of a very small fraternity of guys that had his hands in virtually every major transaction for every institution that is now under withering scrutiny.
But, given his physical statute, he won’t overshadow timmay!
“This is my bold call.
Dow 4,500”
Wow. That is 300 points below my guess for a market bottom.
“Workers Health Benefits Eyed for Taxation”
Finally! A tax provision from B.O. that does not cost me any money — since Mrs. Shore and I already pay our own health insurance.
I almost feel left out.
“At this rate, in 9/10 years, the average property taxes will be $10k.”
Grim. We should be so lucky. Once the bills come due for the pension debt, and God knows what else, $10k will seem like a bargain.
HE (11)-
That’s why BAC holds Countryfried off the balance sheet. Didn’t you get the memo?
Do you guys actually bother to verify the story about the vet health benefits cuts? This story did not pass the smell test and a cursory search led to this note on the Reserve Officers Association from Sen Joe Lieberman to one of his constituents.
http://www.roa.org/site/PageServer?pagename=advocate
“The source of these stories is a report issued by the Congressional Budget Office (CBO), entitled Budget Options Volume 1: Heath Care, released in December 2008.
Before jumping to conclusions about the report itself, however, it is important to know exactly what the CBO is. CBO is a nonpartisan federal agency, tasked with providing Congress with cost estimates for the many legislative proposals considered each year. It also periodically offers Congress suggestions for adjusting federal spending. CBO is an information gathering body for Members of Congress. Its recommendations about the budget are completely non binding; and its officers do not draft actual policy, legislation, or law.
The Budget Options report in question offers a total of 115 options for reducing (or, in some cases, increasing) federal spending on health care, only three of which relate to TRICARE. These options are merely suggestions, not policy statements or actual legislation. Reports such as this one are routine, and very few options or recommendations made by CBO are typically acted upon.”
gary (14)-
Don’t forget to wash it down with a gallon of mercury and benzene-laced soda.
I love Paula Abdul. She’s so sweet.
I will now go vomit in the sink.
“… very few options or recommendations made by CBO are typically acted upon.'”
So of course we spend money on it.
We must be the last family in America where not one of the members has seen that show.
tosh-
Your #33 to yikes’ #24. Dow 4,500 is in sight. A bank that gets free money handed to it, then lends it out and claims they are making money/all is well/all will be quickly repaid is my idea of the mark of the beast. The endtimes are right here, right now.
Something’s stinky in Denmark.
Shore (36)-
You gotta account for the overshoot. :)
vic (40)-
I just assume anything Jamil posts is a lie.
Clot –
It is easy to see how BAC/C make profits when you consider their business model.
Step 1: Get hundreds of billions of $ from the taxpayer
Step 2: Suspend mark to market
Step 3: Profit!
37.Shore Guy says:
March 12, 2009 at 7:44 pm
“Workers Health Benefits Eyed for Taxation”
Finally! A tax provision from B.O. that does not cost me any money — since Mrs. Shore and I already pay our own health insurance.
I almost feel left out.
Like Self Employed Social Security, the Self Employed will pay “O” twice the tax, Employer & Employee. Welcome to the Club.
#44 – Something’s stinky in Denmark.
That’s just the French, anywho…
At this point I wouldn’t place a Dow of 4500 in the range of the impossible. I thought some of the calls for DJI @ 7500 that were being made a year ago alarmist, they proved me wrong.
I thought this was interesting that she showed the other side of a foreclosure. someone winds up owning in the long run anyway. this seems to be missed by the pols masterminding the bailouts.
http://www.strausnews.com/articles/2009/03/12/sparta_independent/news/4.txt
confused (15)-
1977- “Wh!p Inflation Now”
2009- “Keep the Lie Alive”
vic (47)-
I think the instructions for Chia pets also have three steps.
22. forget the simplistic jingoism and ask yourself a simple question. Do you want to live in a country where healthcare is based entirely on employment. Do you want to be the only country in the industrialized world where one health calamity can cost a family their entire savings, home, assets, and lives? I don’t.
SAS,
Saw this on MSNBC and thought of you.
http://www.alternet.org/rights/131153/seymour_hersh:_%22executive_assassination_ring%22_answered_to_cheney,_had_no_congressional_oversight/
x-roads (50)-
Too bad that by “stabilizing” housing prices, the gubmint will actually be able to turn BOTH the foreclosed bubble buyer AND today’s buyer into losers.
SAS was right. You can’t view any asset’s trading patterns as market behavior anymore. It’s economic warfare.
And, in the case of housing, it’s the gubmint and banks vs. us.
43 shore– we haven’t either. :) (but then, we don’t have a television… so we’re just uber-freaks. ) …but we have a really fine flat screen monitor and dvd player, so we still get plenty of circus with our organic bread.
51.Clotpoll says:
March 12, 2009 at 8:22 pm
confused (15)-
1977- “Wh!p Inflation Now”
2009- “Keep the Lie Alive”
Sad but True.
Ouch, this hurts.
From the Star Ledger:
N.J.-based Roche shedding over 1,500 jobs in Genentech merger
Swiss drugmaker Roche, which has run its U.S. operations from a campus in Nutley for 80 years, plans to shed more than 1,500 jobs in New Jersey and relocate major operations to California as part of a $46.8 billion deal to take over the biotech powerhouse Genentech.
Roche will keep the heart of its business — some 1,600 researchers and scientists — in Nutley to work on new medicines to treat cancer and metabolic disorders such as diabetes and obesity. A contingent of scientists who are studying treatments for inflammatory diseases at Roche laboratories in Palo Alto, Calif., also will eventually be moved to Nutley.
“Roche is changing the nature of the Nutley campus,” spokesman Al Wasilewski said today. “We don’t see it as leaving.”
Most of the 1,500 job cuts will be in commercial operations, largely sales and marketing personnel, he said.
Nice, we can now mix in a little corruption with cheating on taxes as a pre-requisite for joining the cabinet. Good god, are there no honest people left?
F.B.I. Raids Obama Official’s Former Office
The FBI raided the former office of Obama administration official Vivek Kundra and arrested two people in a corruption probe on Thursday, but Kundra is not a target of the investigation, a spokeswoman for Washington’s mayor said.
The FBI searched the offices of the District of Columbia’s chief technology officer, a post formerly held by Kundra, as part of an investigation into employee corruption there, spokeswoman Mafara Hobson said.
According to the documents, they allegedly took part in a variety of schemes, including billing for so-called “ghost employees,” that involved stealing money from the government of the District of Columbia.
http://www.nytimes.com/reuters/2009/03/12/washington/news-us-obama-kundra-raid.html?_r=1&hp
Hmm. Citi refuses bailout money.
(As did most red states).
Well, I’m sure dems can spend the trillion or two for something..
“WASHINGTON (Pravda) – Citigroup Inc Chairman Richard Parsons said on Thursday that the bank does not need any more capital injections from the government and expressed confidence that Citi would remain in private hands.”
53.Essex says:
March 12, 2009 at 8:23 pm
22. forget the simplistic jingoism and ask yourself a simple question. Do you want to live in a country where health care is based entirely on employment. Do you want to be the only country in the industrialized world where one health calamity can cost a family their entire savings, home, assets, and lives? I don’t.
I would prefer a Health care System that is actually dedicated to Health care rather then Profit Care. One where the doctor actually listens to the patient and try to help, versus treatment based upon achieving third party numbers from Lab Work, that have little correlation with how the patient feels. I would prefer a Health care system that doesn’t prescribe Asthma Drugs with side effect like Asthma Related Death. A Health-care system that doesn’t even consider causes of diseases, rather just treats symptoms. A Health care System that doesn’t increase the cost of Drugs by 50% to support Media Advertising. Universal Health care doesn’t mean Good Health Care. I am tired of researching every condition, to protect myself from Modern Medicine Ignorance.
I think we have found new candidate for Treasury Dept, to replace Cohen, or maybe Chief of Ethics?
NY Slimes: “Representative Maxine Waters, Democrat of California, requested the September meeting on behalf of executives at OneUnited, one of the nation’s largest black-owned banks. Ms. Water’s husband, Sidney Williams, had served on the bank’s board of directors until early last year and has owned at least $250,000 in stock in the institution. Treasury officials said the session with nearly a dozen senior banking regulators had been intended to allow minority-owned banks and their trade association to discuss the losses they had incurred from the federal takeover of Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac. But Kevin Cohee, OneUnited’s chief executive, instead seized the opportunity to plead for special assistance for his bank, federal officials said.”
Just remember: This is the most ethical congress in history.
The purpose of the US healthcare system is to maintain the population at a controllable baseline of illness that will allow for the maximum overprescription of expensive drugs that don’t do anything.
The thread-the-needle trick is to keep people just sick and overweight enough to think they need the drugs, but not push people so far that they actually die too young to absorb the maximum amount of drugs possible.
anyone care to briefly offer an opinion on the muni bond situation in 2009?
we’ve got a large chunk in one that is doing well so far this year – i’m more than content to be up 3.5 % – and just wonder if others have found success in the field this year.
our idea is to pull it out in late 2010 (when we likely will be down to one salary due to childbirth, if all goes well)
#21 bklyn:you could probably take the price drop from the last cylce and drop Manhattan and get the range for NJ price drops over the next seven years. Just my $.02.
Exceptt the last cycle did not have this tupe of recession, and a financial crisis, and people drowning in debt.
O’s plan is working. Increased economic activity is a fact (not just gun sales and advertising revenue for CNBC and Rush L). Unfortunately, it is mainly in Switzerland as US corporations are moving there in order to escape Socia-lism.
“Yet a wave of energy companies has in the last few months announced plans to move to Switzerland — mainly for its appeal as a low-tax corporate domicile that looks relatively likely to stay out of reach of Barack Obama’s tax-seeking administration.”
“For example in Zug, corporate tax is about 16 percent but can fall as low as 9.5 percent for companies that do most of their business outside Switzerland. That compares with an average global corporate tax rate of 25.9 percent, according to consultancy KPMG.”
http://www.reuters.com/article/rbssEnergyNews/idUSL312427120090312?feedType=RSS&feedName=rbssEnergyNews&rpc=22
61. decisions on healthcare are made by insurance companies.
#66… Jamil… this “threatened migration out of US” is a bluff by companies…
Why would low taxes in a different country be tempting for companies in the US? Big companies (including Microsoft) have been paying virtually zero taxes due to a lot of loopholes in the US tax system.
In fact, the US is paying taxes to companies like AIG, Citi, etc. Please, let those companies move to Switzerland… it may be a good thing for regular folks in the US.
S
Before bashing O, don’t forget that taxing employer-sponsored health benefits was a McCain idea. If it brings about the end of the employer-based health insurance system, a WW2-era relic designed to retain employees in a time when wages were frozen due the to war effort, I’m all for it. I’d love to take on a consulting gig, but I need the big company benefits.
sastry: bluff?
It is happening every day.
Yes, MS has been using R&D credits, deferred taxes and stock option scheme but it only goes so far. I’m pretty sure MS has been paying a lot of taxes during the years. MS can also afford to bribe senators and congressmen.
Anyway, there are a lot of companies that are selling stuff mainly outside of US and have no MS baggage and can escape easily.
Factories will also be increasingly moved out of US once the Jimmy Hoffa led union thug 2.0 has been passed in the next few weeks. How many employees are not going to sign once Jimmy Hoffa and his “friends” show up in the middle of the night asking for the signature?
Whole country is one big Detroit.
Sastry (68) –
Jamil usually does not post links to his “news”, and now we know why.
From the article, the companies are moving from…wait for it… BERMUDA to Switzerland..
“”One trend that we see is that particularly Bermuda-based companies are now moving to Switzerland,” said Martin Frey, a partner at law company Baker & McKenzie. “That may only partly be obviously for tax reasons, but also for security reasons and the fact that the Obama administration may go after them.””
Jamil is tedious and annoying; but hey, he’s ours.
Seems like he could run a fair-to-middling disinformation campaign, too. Could be handy at some point in the future.
Clotpoll says:
March 12, 2009 at 7:57 pm
gary (14)- Don’t forget to wash it down with a gallon of mercury and benzene-laced soda.
clot: is that the process by which caffeine is removed from coffee to make decaf?
I stand behind my declaration that Depeche Mode SOTU is the soundtrack for 2009….
vic: Yeah, you are so right. Companies are not escaping the US. No worries..
For example..(you can also google for all those oil and gas companies that moved to middle east)
http://www.highbeam.com/doc/1G1-146647528.html
NEW YORK – In a sweeping consolidation of operations at Tommy Hilfiger Corp., the $1.7 billion apparel firm cut 230 people last week as it outlined a new organizational structure and worldwide leadership team. As part of the restructuring, the brand’s corporate headquarters will relocate to Amsterdam, while its New York offices will, in effect, become a satellite unit.
Not all the news out there is bad. Christie now leas Corzine by 15. Is it possible the sheeple have had enough? Corzine even trails Lonegan.
“Just nine percent (9%) have a Very Favorable opinion of the governor while 32% hold a Very Unfavorable opinion. Eight percent (8%) Strongly Approve of the way he’s performing his job and 42% Strongly Disapprove. Overall, 33% of New Jersey voters at least somewhat approve of the job Corzine is doing while 66% disapprove.”
http://www.rasmussenreports.com/public_content/politics/election_2009/new_jersey/election_2009_new_jersey_governor
I am sitting in an empty room with no light on a stack of my wife’s college art history books.
#2 SAS – “Obama Wants Vets to Pay For Service Related Injuries”
This has a fishy smell. Anyone from Chicago would know that dissin’ the soldiers will never sell in CONgress. My guess is that it’s a false flag; everyone will freak, then Obama’s team will say “Oh of course we were never planning to do /that/!” While everyone is sighing with relief, they’ll introduce something that is bad, but not *quite* as bad, and it’ll sail through.
vic is so right. let’s just raise corporate tax rate. it is after all what – 3rd highest in the world?
before you start babbling about loopholes and credits, keep in mind that other countries have those too. and system that relies on loopholes is sick. Why not getting rid of loopholes and lowering tax rate?
heck, even neo-marxist Alec Baldwin is demanding lower tax rates (for his industry, naturally everybody else should pay more according to Alec)
“Not all the news out there is bad. Christie now leas Corzine by 15. Is it possible ”
What’s the point? ACORN buses 100.000 new “voters” and Hudson county generates once again 300% voter turnout.
Besides, legislature is controlled by the union parasites so governor can only block or delay some things (not sure if legislature can actually override governor like in MA)
Nothing can save NJ.
“Seems like he could run a fair-to-middling disinformation campaign, too”
Yes, I actually admire his ability to weave an anti-dem angle into everything he posts. Okay, back on ignore. Feeding him tends to make him more tedious and annoying.
“so governor can only block or delay some things”
That is surely a few order of magnitude better than what we are living with now.
Wouldn’t you like to meet one of the 8% that “strongly approve” of Corzine? Does he have a lot of cousins?
JBJB: If NJ legislature lacks veto override powers, then Governor could actually change things.
Unfortunately, the amount of welfare parasites and clueless “taxes are not that high, let’s raise them!” liberals is hopeless. Eventually these liberals move to PA – and bring their voting patterns with them and then are shocked that taxes are getting high there too. Liberalism is like cancer. It spreads and infects healthy carriers.
See CA, NJ, MA. I rest my case.
“That One was fishy from day one. This is the kind of liberal that makes me gag. How comes none of the good guys I like ever get a chance to run for office? I think Rush Limbaugh, Bill O’Reilly or Shawn Hannity would make excellent candidates for political office. They all have the right stuff.
Let me tell you something, after these damn liberal get done with this country, we’re going to lurch very hard to the right and stay there. That will restore all the stuff that the libs are trying to take and will make the stock and real estate market boom again. That’s why everyone should be trying to get as much of this stuff while they can. You doom and gloomers will find yourself once again in the position of your noses pressed up against the window looking at me making some damn money. You can’t consider yourself an investor when all you do is sit around wringing your damn hands and crying woe is me.
Let me tell you something, I’m fearless when it comes to investing. I’m not about to let a stock or real estate market swoon scare the shlt out of me.
“This has a fishy smell. Anyone from Chicago would know that dissin’ the soldiers will never sell in CONgress. My guess is that it’s a false flag; everyone will freak, then Obama’s team will say “Oh of course we were never planning to do /that/!” While everyone is sighing with relief, they’ll introduce something that is bad, but not *quite* as bad, and it’ll sail through”
Too much politics, I don’t even like reading the blog anymore.
Jon Stewart is rolling over Cramer.
Priceless
Veto
from earlier today
veto says:
March 12, 2009 at 4:56 pm
ket, another random question.
Figure 1, prices ran up from 63 to 83 in the 2.5 years 1987-1989 and then we busted but we only busted to a still elevated price of 76 and stayed there for a long time, which makes me wonder (1) if that will happen again this time or (2) if that is partially the result of inflation pushing the median price to a higher level over those 8 years, since i think inflation was pretty high in mid late 80s.
veto says:
March 12, 2009 at 5:20 pm
kettle, yep, take your time, the questions have me scratching my own head.
i will also research more but even if med price shifts up with inflation, thats only half the answer since we still cant ignore that this crisis is significantly bigger than the S&L, and therefore would require a more severe correction. although, we should consider that gov programs aimed to keep prices up might offset some of that or at leeast delay it.
looking forward to hearing your final thoughts on it.
Look at the charts linked below. There are 2 charts, with second 1 being a zoomed in version of the first one.
Your original question was ” does case-schiller account for inflation”. the answer is no.
The way the case-schiller methodology is set up a direct comparison between it ad inflation adjusted information could be misleading.
My short response to both of your questions is that we will go back to 1999 as a best case scenario. In the charts i linked notice the sudden upswing around 1985. My opinion is that the money that caused that run up was the expansion of the banking industry as they began to “innovate”. At the same time and as a related matter debt expansion had already begun. Look at figure 8 in my US Real Estate, Look Out Below document. you will see that debt expansion began to rapidly accelerate in the early 80’s.
A large % of the growth since then has been predicated on debt expansion and this includes home prices. All the while incomes stayed flat!!!!
As we go through this deflationary debt destruction cycle, the question is how far back do we go. the debt level up to the early 80’s were sustainable, but after that its highly questionable.
Ask yourself, if income wasnt going up then how were the values of homes going up? people started by leveraging more and more of their income to buy a home (i.e. 2X, then 3X then 4X) until they had no more money to leverage and then we saw the NINJA’s and Pick-A-Payment loans appear.
Also note that the data i used was HOUSEHOLD income, so an expansion of women in the workplace actually did not increase average incomes.
Consider that from a historical perspective, a home loan more then 2,5X household income was not sustainable. If the modern fiat/debt system fully collapses and financial institutions cannot or refuse to leverage debt then we will go back to about 2.5X which suggests an average home price of about 130K.
That sounds extreme, but if incomes are not increasing and debt is not being expanded then how can you NOT go back to a home price that is sustainable based on actual household earnings.
From a historical standpoint you only go over 2.5-3X by leveraging debt. How many banks or families are going to try that with RE anytime soon?
In regards to the government stopping the drop, they cant! They can slow it, but theycannot stop it. As many on the blog have pointed out, if Obama gives every ome owner 100K then any buyers would automatically discount the home price by that!
No government in history has been able to stop the market. I am not a market fanatic, but unless obama nationalizes the entire housing industry (which would only cost about 15-30 trillion) then market forces are at play and like water, will seek the lowest stable level.
http://www.scribd.com/doc/13232900/Binder-1
Cramer kicked Stewart’s ass. Good, serves that dirtbag right
I bet that dirtbag Stewart will think long and hard before he takes on Cramer again
jim cramer’s credibility is completely shot. he had a nice run but jon stewart killed him tonight. done.
cramer’s a giant fraud just like the CEOs he “covers”
some great, great Big east hoops the last three games today.
march is the greatest time of the year for sports.
the only even that tops the tournament is the world cup
I would like to know what version of the daily show reinvestor101 watched?
You people are shameless in your attempts to spin what everyone saw with his own eyes. Stop it.
RemainCalmAllisWell says:
March 12, 2009 at 11:36 pm
I would like to know what version of the daily show reinvestor101 watched?
reinvestor101: Really? Really? I am shameless? More like speechless at your take on that interview. The man was on the verge of tears. his voice. but whatever you say 101. he really laid it on him.
You people. <>
What?? You’re a shameless spinmeister. He wasn’t crying. Stop it. “That One” has conspired to get Cramer.
RemainCalmAllisWell says:
March 12, 2009 at 11:44 pm
reinvestor101: Really? Really? I am shameless? More like speechless at your take on that interview. The man was on the verge of tears. his voice. but whatever you say 101. he really laid it on him.
You people.
#90 Cramer tells Stewart my show is an “entertainmnet business show”.
No lie there, just like all of CNBC,its pure entertainment.
What a sad, sorry country we are. It has come to debating who won a pissing match between two media buffoons like Cramer and Stewart. Do people in this country do anything other than watch TV?
#
Clotpoll says:
March 12, 2009 at 5:25 pm
200K (322)-
What company are you with? Is it publicly traded?
If it is, I want to short it.
#
Clotpoll says:
March 12, 2009 at 5:26 pm
Dunder-Mifflin?
killer stuff.
Grim re: Taxes in NJ.
During the Great Depression overall tax revenues fell 49% in 1933. I am betting they fall at least 20% this year versus last, and that may wind up being optimistic.
After the election cycle is over Corzine and the 550+ fiefdoms in NJ will be left with no choice but to throw the gov’t workers who will get them re-elected this year(check the proposed budget, little jobs cuts only furloughs) under the bus.
“New Jersey’s attorney general has filed civil lawsuits against two Camden County companies accused of preying on homeowners facing foreclosures.
The companies billed themselves as loan-modification services that could negotiate with lenders to prevent foreclosures.
The companies took payments up-front from customers, then did nothing to help them, Attorney General Anne Milgram said yesterday.
One company, in Cherry Hill, used the name Hope Now Financial. The second company, in Bellmawr, is called New Hope Modifications.
“These names are not by accident,” said Steven Goldman, commissioner of the state Department of Banking and Insurance.
Loan modifications can be negotiated only by licensed debt adjusters, he said. Neither company was licensed to do so, he said.”
http://www.philly.com/inquirer/home_region/20090313_N_J__sues_over_mortgage-fixing_pitches.html
Say goodbye to defined benefit plans.
“Although cost-of-living increases for pensioners would theoretically still be possible with Nutter’s legislation, “for all practical purposes this would abolish cost-of-living increases,” said City Controller Alan Butkovitz…”
http://www.philly.com/inquirer/home_region/20090313_Nutter_proposes_pension_changes.html
“March 12 (Bloomberg) — Americans battered by the biggest slump in home prices on record are facing higher property taxes as local governments struggle to plug budget deficits.
Municipal finance officers budgeted for a 3.6 percent drop in revenue from residential taxes this fiscal year, a survey by the U.S. League of Cities in September shows. With home prices down 12.4 percent in the fourth quarter from a year earlier, the most ever for an index compiled by the National Association of Realtors, cities and counties are compensating with higher tax rates or appraisals, even where laws cap property-tax growth.”
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601213&sid=aWSD3gPg9s7o&refer=home
Like paying tax on cap gains even in down years.
“They’re maintaining a housing-tax bubble even though values are falling,” Purves said from Vienna, Virginia. “If spending hadn’t increased faster than population growth, there wouldn’t be a budget crisis now.”
From the same Bloomberg article:
“In New York City, where revenues are projected to lag expenses by $4 billion over the next 18 months, property tax rates were raised 7 percent in December. That’s even as Manhattan apartment sellers cut prices 4.1 percent in 2008, the most in five years, appraiser Miller Samuel Inc. and broker Prudential Douglas Elliman said on March 3.”
The increase in property taxes is the lowest in at least a decade, and is below Gov. Jon Corzine’s 4 percent cap instituted through a special session on property tax reforms in 2006.
Does the 4 percent cap apply to individual home property taxes increase?
Corzine gets away with anything because people in NJ are SHEEP! Nobody cares as long as they have their jobs.
We have teachers complaining they have it rough and they don’t get paid enough.
Then all the stupid sheep starts agreeing and saying it’s all for the children.
Don’t they understand that teachers don’t work during summers, gets FREE HEALTHCARE and PENSIONS for the rest of their life? Do the SHEEP even understand what pensions mean? It means they don’t have 401(k)s. Yes that money you put aside on every paycheck, well the teachers don’t have to worry about that. They’re guaranteed to get their pension after they retire.
So boo hoo hoo.
Most people don’t even realize the kinds of waste that Corzine allows. If you listen to NJ 101.5 to and from work everyday you’d understand.