From Newsroom New Jersey:
New Jersey has most expensive ZIP code in country
Beverly Hills 90210? Forget about it.
Honolulu? The leafy suburbs of Westchester County and Connecticut? Great places to live, and hardly cheap, but they lack the distinction of ZIP code 07620, where the median asking price of a home is $4.14 million.
Sure, that’s a lot, but if you move in, your neighbors will include sports superstar Patrick Ewing, comic Chris Rock, and music mogul Sean Combs, as well as Stevie Wonder and Mary J. Blige.
It’s the most expensive ZIP code in the country, and it’s in New Jersey, nbcnewyork.com reports.
The tiny Bergen County community of Alpine tops Forbes’ annual list of America’s 100 priciest ZIP codes. But not even Alpine is immune to the effects of the economic downturn, Forbes.com reports.
That steep median asking price is down a whopping 23 percent from last year, making real estate in Alpine a steal if you have a few million to spend.
…
Farther down the list of the top 100 are several other New Jersey ZIP codes. New Vernon places 57th; Mantoloking is 76th; Far Hills, 84th and Saddle River, 85th.
From Fortune:
The housing recovery mirage
Is the housing bust over?
Shares of Toll Brothers (TOL), Hovnanian (HOV) and KB Home (KBH) and other builders have surged. The exchange-traded fund that tracks the group has nearly doubled since March.
Home starts have risen for five straight months, while sales of new homes recently hit their highest level since last September. Prices are up as well: the Case-Shiller index of national house prices rose 2.9% in the second quarter, ending a three-year decline.
These signs — as well as anecdotal reports about house shoppers growing more willing to write a deposit check — have executives at homebuilding firms declaring the worst is over.
…
But housing boosters have forecast turnarounds repeatedly since the market peaked in 2006, only to be proved wrong by plunging prices. And skeptics say they’re wrong again now.
They argue that a deeply indebted consumer, a weak job market, expiring incentives and rising foreclosures spell a quick end to any housing rebound.
“We’re entering the phase where the homeowner has to earn his way out of this mess,” said Mark Hanson, who runs a California real estate research firm. “This summer is shaping up as the gateway into the next move down.”
From the Press of Atlantic City:
Indicators raise hope for state’s economy: Sign of expansion first in 16 months
The Federal Reserve Bank of Philadelphia’s forecasting gauge for New Jersey turned positive in July after 16 straight negative months.
July’s improvment – from -0.7 to 1.1 – suggests the state’s economy will expand moderately in the second quarter of 2010, the report said.
The turnaround comes three months after that of a similar forecasting gauge for the nation published by the Conference Board.
Richard Perniciaro, director of the Center for Regional and Business Research at Atlantic Cape Community College in Mays Landing, said the upturn is good news for New Jersey, but the state’s recovery likely will lag behind the nation’s – and southern New Jersey’s will come after the state’s.
Beginning with the 1991 recession and again in the 2000 recession, he said, jobs in southern New Jersey took longer to bounce back than in the state and nation. The reason: The region had become a predominantly service economy by then, one that is more dependent on discretionary consumer spending.
…
“It’s hard to see where locally things could level out and start moving upward incrementally,” Perniciaro said.
The business research center’s forecasting gauge for southern New Jersey has yet to turn positive, Perniciaro said. When that happens, it will indicate how long the region’s recovery will lag behind the state’s.
Pennsylvania’s leading index improved from -4 in June to -1.2, while Delaware’s rose from -6.1 to -3.4 in July.
From CNBC:
Madoff’s Long Island Beach Getaway Put Up for Sale
Those who see Bernard Madoff as an evil purveyor of excess might be disappointed by his beach house: It’s not that palatial.
At 3,014 square feet, the home is cottage-size by superrich standards. Its faded furnishings look as old as Madoff’s epic fraud. There’s no garage. Not even a walk-in closet.
But the 1.2-acre lot sits closer to the surf than larger neighboring homes on the southeastern tip of Long Island. And the house features a grand, columned porch with stunning views — undeniable selling points on display during a recent tour offered to The Associated Press.
The U.S. Marshals Service, which seized the property just east of the Hamptons on July 1, will put the property on the market this week as part of an ongoing effort to pay back investors burned by Madoff’s epic fraud.
They also plan to soon enlist brokers to find buyers for a Manhattan apartment and a Palm Beach, Fla., estate once owned by the financier-turned-felon.
In estimates federal regulators filed last year, Madoff himself valued his Manhattan apartment at $7 million and the Florida property at $11 million. He said the Montauk beach house, which he bought in 1979, was worth $3 million.
Federal authorities believe the seaside property could bring closer to $8 million. Whether Madoff’s notoriety hurts or helps remains to be seen.
From the Star Ledger NJ Voices Blog:
Tax rebates look sillier every year
I won’t be getting a property tax rebate this year. But I did get a rebate application in the mail for some reason.
“Filing Deadline: September 1, 2009” said the big letters on the back.
That’s today. So over the weekend, I decided I’d pull out my tax records and give the form a good read just in case I was missing something.
I was indeed missing something: Tax relief. So are you, if you’re part of a typical middle-class family.
The annual income ceiling for rebate eligibility has been lowered to a mere $75,000.
That’s bad enough. Worse, we middle-class homeowners don’t get much else in the way of property tax relief. The typical suburban homeowner is supporting his own town through his property taxes and also supporting the cities through his income taxes.
If we wish to correct this, we must first correct a misconception about the nature of the income tax. And that misconception is that the income tax goes to pay the costs of running the state, i.e. state trooper salaries, aid to state colleges, etc.
Not at all. Every cent of the income tax, and one-half cent of the sales tax, is constitutionally dedicated to the property tax relief fund. The purpose of the income tax is to serve as a substitute for the property tax. Period.
There’s plenty of money in that property tax relief fund, more than
$10 billion. So why are property taxes still so high?
From Forbes:
Ahead of the Bell: Pending Home Sales
An index that tracks pending U.S. home sales is forecast to rise in July for the sixth straight month, providing more evidence that the housing market is climbing back after a dismal three years.
The National Association of Realtors’ report on pending home resales is scheduled to be released Tuesday at 10 a.m. EDT.
The index is expected to come in at 96.5, according to economists surveyed by Thomson Reuters. June’s reading was 94.6.
The report tracks signed contracts to purchase previously occupied homes and is considered a barometer for future home sales. Typically there is a one- to two- month lag between a sales contract and a completed deal.
grim (5)-
Good to see Forbes is doing its job of sucking more potential buyers into the abyss.
Wonder what the ratio of short sale/REO/foreclosure homes vs total sales is now?
4 – wasnt the homestead rebate deadline extended to november? makes me think if corzine wins he won’t need to pay out.
You want extra Spam and canned olives in that paella?
“Eastern Europe, Spain and Ireland are now all experiencing the beginning of deflation. We believe that we will see much more deflation to come, which will have broad ramifications across the European banking sector. The periphery countries are net debtors, and the rest of Europe is the net creditor. When a debtor can’t pay, the creditor suffers. Germany, France and others will need to cope with recapitalizing the periphery and Spain. In the words of Plautus, “I am a rich man as long as I don’t pay my creditors.” A deflationary spiral means that most of the debt will need to be written off, and the creditors will have to absorb the losses.”
http://globaleconomicanalysis.blogspot.com/2009/09/deflation-is-bitch.html
Quick, transfuse that zombie!
“In a surprising turn of credit “looseness”, total seasonally adjusted depository reserves increased by $84 billion compared to two weeks ago, and are now at $856 billion, the highest level since the end of May. It appears that contrary to all rhetoric to the contrary, banks are still unable and/or unwilling to lend or otherwise dispose of the ever increasing duffel bags full of cash in the basement.”
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/bank-depository-reserves-hits-3-month-high-banks-retrench
Would the same apply to NYC?
From Bloomberg:
Finance Jobs Won’t Return Before 2013, Report Says
Employment levels at British, French and German financial services firms won’t return to last year’s figure before 2013, according to a study by the City of London.
The U.K. will be worst affected by the job cuts and will have 10,000 fewer roles in banking, insurance and fund management in four years’ time than it did in 2008, said the report, commissioned by the municipality running the U.K.’s main financial district. Any resurgence in hiring depends on economic growth, said Stuart Fraser, the City of London’s policy chief.
“We’ll have slow growth for the next few years, and that takes us to 2013 to 2014,” he said in a telephone interview. “Hopefully by then we’ll be in a better balanced position to accelerate growth.”
grim (11)-
According to Pret, no.
“Would the same apply to NYC?”
Then again, I think Pret tried to squeegee my windshield outside the Holland Tunnel last week.
Sl previous thread
I’d love to come down. I have nothing to do today.
Pat previous thread
You didn’t lose the argument. She gave up. I don’t hear anything in that conversation that would suggest to me that you need to speak to a counselor.
First the Miss America Pagent, now this…
“A.C. antiques show a victim of economy.”
http://www.courierpostonline.com/article/20090901/NEWS01/909010342&referrer=FRONTPAGECAROUSEL
Will be back looking at houses mid-Oct with a buyers agent in Montco PA. If we like the area and find a house that fits our needs, maybe we’ll get lucky. If not, plan is to move to Italy for a year and return to PA once a quarter or so. (I think it was all the talk about Italian food yesterday.)
Pat – Tell Sis to f&ck off and raise her own kids. As for taking meds when you feel depressed, just cry a lot. It is nature’s way of relieving stress.
Some people call it depression but I call it crying – Then…I eventually get over it.
Ah, lost, thanks for the kind words, but I don’t think the phrases I typed were the ones that made her tell me to see a counselor.
It maybe was the colorful gary-type language peppered throughout my rant about parents who allow such things, and how such parents are much of the cause of my stress in life over taxes, etc.
Cindy, isn’t it funny how we forget that, and caring family members do everything in their power to get you to stop crying when that’s what you need?
We bid aggresively on that house last week. 17k below ask.
The sellers responded that our bid is low and tell us they are holding out for a better offer. Meanwhile there is no other inventory in the town so i dont blame them.
I dont know who is crazier, us for bidding in high season just before prices are about to commmence another leg down or them for not realizing how stupid we are being.
Mutual funds, pensions and endowments unloading US consumer stocks at fastest pace in 14 years. Insider selling at highest level since 2004 (TrimTabs). Who’s buying?
I can never take Forbes seriously. Malcom Forbes was a big time flamer. Back in the 1980’s when he was already creepy old he used to go to places like the kit kat klub in his leather vest and hat and pull up on sidewalk in his Harley with a different young boy toy on his back each time.
Cyclonic Action Vacuum says:
September 1, 2009 at 6:38 am
grim (5)-
Good to see Forbes is doing its job of sucking more potential buyers into the abyss.
“If not, plan is to move to Italy”
I heard the food sucks there.
Prior Actual
Store Sales – W/W change 0.6 % -0.5 %
Store Sales – Y/Y -0.2 % -0.7 %
Highlights
August chain-store sales ended up being a disappointment, according to ICSC-Goldman’s same-store tally which fell 0.5 percent in the Aug. 29 week for a minus 0.7 percent year-on-year rate. The report down plays the impact of back-to-school calendar shifts and stresses the overall trend which it said is not improving. The report isn’t making a call for month-to-month sales. Redbook is up next.
17 Pat
I’m sure you didn’t type what you told her. However, your point was valid. But since you don’t think like everyone else, its obviously you who needs the help. Gotta love people.
I thought Kit Kat was a lesbian club.
Oh am I in mod? Oh jeez. For the L word?
BC (20)-
All the stiffs have been jammed into the party room. Too bad the instigators have taken all the top-shelf drinks into the VIP.
Just about time for somebody to yell “fire”.
lost-
Will call you later today.
So much for back-to-school saving retail.
grim unmod
anti-pipi wall
Pat:
Better to not say anything. My brother (who is broke) is enrolling both of his sons(age 4 and 5) in hockey this week.
28 Clot
OK. I should be around.
Is there a downside to leaving to wifi on all of the time on your Blackberry?
The end is nigh….
NY Post does it again….
Say It Ain’t Ho!
http://www.nypost.com/seven/09012009/news/regionalnews/you_cant_keep_a_bad_man_down_187551.htm
Nothing against ice hockey BTW. I would just like to see him on better footing before he dumps a ton of money into youth sports.
Grim,
I’ve been saying it all along. The recession ain’t really over until the consumer comes back to the table. So far, all we’ve seen is government spending and increased earnings due to layoffs and productivity gains from those lucky enough to have stayed employed. Anyone want to guess how many quarters of recovery we have prior to reentering the next leg of this secular bear market? My guess is one.
Chi #33-
Everybody pays for it in one way or another…
Redbook not looking much better either.
Prior Actual
Store Sales Y/Y change -4.4 % -4.1 %
re: #32 – yes testicular cancer
Can someone recommend a good home inspector to me? I don’t want to rely upon my realtor’s list. I’m looking at a house 7 years old.
Should I also get a home inspection done on my current house prior to listing?
FU Lula. Must be spending too much time with Chavez? It’s been a great run in Rio. Time to call in the chips. See ya.
Nom,
For now, erase Brazil off your list.
Stu,
How can “consumers” come back to the table prior to these same people returning to profitable production of useful goods and services?
Despite the modern economists’ protestations to the contrary, Say’s Law hasn’t been repealed. Government programs are just letting people out on parole.
Bruce Springsteen’s ‘Born to Run’ house is for sale in Long Branch
http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2009/09/bruce_springsteens_born_to_run.html
$299k for an 828 sq. ft. house? Must be trying to extract a “Bruce” premium. Supposidly been on the marekt for a few months.
“Stu,
How can “consumers” come back to the table prior to these same people returning to profitable production of useful goods and services?”
Absolutely.
Renting (42):
I could see how that house could inspire “Born to Run.”
[40] BC
Given their well-known anti-american attitudes, it was never on the list.
18 -Pat – Totally. My daughters call some days – just to cry – it is a release valve. I listen, we are always laughing about something by the end of the conversation.
Have a great day all.
Oh, district budget meeting last night. We are to do a one-time cut of $9 million this year besides the $16 million already called for. We are approximately back to 05 levels of $5,200. per pupil.
[38] sean
Geez. Guess what just came off my belt?
Stu [44],
Absolutely.
Baby this town rips the bones from your back
Its a death trap, its a suicide rap
We gotta get out while were young
`cause tramps like us, baby we were born to run
Nom [45],
It was a great run, long real/short dollar. Goodbye Lula.
@ A. West, #39:
If you’re in northern NJ:
Willy Dittmar
http://www.dicoinspection.com/
He makes real estate agents nervous, mainly because he’s incredibly thorough. My wife and I hired him to inspect two houses in Montclair. He helped us avoid an expensive mistake in the one case. He’s also more expensive than the checkmark-report guys. You get what you pay for.
[33] chi fi
Client No. 9 for Governor?
I’d support him; he’s good for NJ.
The Steamroller has burned a lot of bridges in Lower Manhattan, and a future Gov. Christie, if he was foresighted, would ream Spitzer out by convincing firms to add jobs in NJ instead of NYC, or even luring firms across the river, just like Rendell has been doing to Corzine for years now. Just the mere threat of a Gov. Spitzer will give businesses pause about being in NY (not that Patterson hasn’t given them enough reasons to bolt).
Hard to imagine a governor that could make NJ look good by comparison, but Spitzer may just be the guy.
ah, good to be back to the site. after a short vaca and business travel i thought i wanted to buy a house. what i miss?
La Fire Pics, pretty awesome.
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-bigpicturefire,0,5985825.htmlstory
September 1, 2009 – Corzine Losing Battle Of Attack Ads In New Jersey, Quinnipiac University Poll Finds; Democrat Trails Christie By 10 Points
Democratic incumbent Gov. Jon Corzine is losing the battle of the attack ads in his campaign for reelection and now trails Republican challenger Christopher Christie 47 – 37 percent among likely voters, with 9 percent for independent candidate Christopher Daggett, according to a Quinnipiac University poll released today.
This compares to a 46 – 40 percent Christie lead, with 7 percent for Daggett, in an August 11 survey by the independent Quinnipiac (KWIN-uh-pe-ack) University.
Corzine leads 74 – 15 percent among Democratic likely voters, with 7 percent for Daggett. Christie leads 86 – 8 percent among Republicans, with 4 percent for Daggett, and 46 – 30 percent among independent voters, with 16 percent for Daggett.
Of the 77 percent of New Jersey likely voters who have seen Corzine ads criticizing Christie for giving contracts to people with ties to former President George W. Bush, 56 percent say the ads are an unfair attack, while 36 percent say they are a legitimate campaign issue. Independent voters say 59 – 34 percent the ads are unfair. Among those who know of other charges, claims or attacks, voter verdicts are:
Split verdict 47 – 47 percent for Christie ads attacking Corzine for failing to guard against economic collapse;
Unfair 49 – 43 percent for Corzine attacks on Christie for giving a loan to a former associate in the U.S. Attorney’s office;
Unfair 47 – 45 percent for criticism of Corzine’s personal relationship with a former labor leader.
“Just about everyone has seen Gov. Jon Corzine’s TV ads knocking Christopher Christie’s ties to the Bush team, but most question whether it’s a legitimate issue. ‘Unfair,’ they say,” said Maurice Carroll, director of the Quinnipiac University Polling Institute.
“The Democratic attacks about Christie’s loan to his former co-worker score a little higher,” Carroll added. “Christie gets a split on his ads criticizing Corzine for failing to protect New Jersey against the economic downturn.
“But New Jersey is hardened to in-your-face politics. Is the Corzine v Christie slugfest just regular campaign stuff or nasty even by New Jersey’s rugged standards? Standard stuff, voters say 63 – 31 percent.
“Christie wins on many questions and he is pulling away from Corzine in a three-way matchup, with a double-digit lead. Daggett’s candidacy is just chipping away at the edges as he fails to climb out of single digits.”
New Jersey voters disapprove 60 – 34 percent of the job Corzine is doing, compared to his 58 – 36 percent disapproval August 11. By a 57 – 34 percent margin, they have an unfavorable opinion of the Governor, compared to a 41 – 30 percent favorable opinion of Christie. For Daggett, 87 percent don’t know enough about him to form an opinion.
A total of 96 percent of New Jersey voters say government corruption is a “somewhat serious” or “very serious” problem and 50 percent associate Democrats more with corruption, while 16 percent point to Republicans, with 34 percent undecided. Independent voters blame Democrats more than Republicans 51 – 16 percent. Even 29 percent of Democrats blame their own party more, while 26 percent blame Republicans, with 45 percent undecided.
Voters also say 46 – 40 percent they would rather have the Republican Party in control of the State Legislature after the November election.
“Voters, by a narrow 38 – 36 percent margin, would sooner go to a Meadowlands football game with Christie. To see the ‘New Jersey’ Giants? Hey, look at the map; East Rutherford isn’t in New York,” Carroll said.
New Jersey voters approve 51 – 43 percent of the job President Barack Obama is doing.
http://www.quinnipiac.edu/x1299.xml?ReleaseID=1370
52
I’ll sell you mine. Like new, we’ve only lived in it four days so far. Comes with a great dog, a wife, two kids under 16 months, and Stone Brewery IPA’s in the fridge. It’s partially moved into, and needs to be painted top to bottom.
You can have eveything but the beer.
With all of the news about the economy turning the corner and things looking up, I can’t help but feel that we are ready to drive off the cliff.
Of course, similar to RE in 2005, if one expresses such thoughts in public one runs the risk of being tarred and feathered.
Heading out to the midwest to look at some farmland. Will report back next week.
hugh,
clearly, you’re not a motivated seller if the beer is not included.
Shore [56],
For you;
Sept. 1 (Bloomberg) — Paul Tudor Jones, the billionaire hedge-fund manager who outperformed peers last year, is wagering that Goldman Sachs Group Inc. and Morgan Stanley got it wrong in declaring the start of an economic recovery.
“If we have a recovery at all, it isn’t sustainable,” Kevin Harrington, managing director at Clarium, said in an interview at the firm’s New York offices. “This is more likely a ski-jump recession, with short-term stimulus creating a bump that will ultimately lead to a more precipitous decline later.”
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=auGWGWlnohNo
Shore [56],
For you;
“Sept. 1 (Bloomberg) — Paul Tudor Jones, the billionaire hedge-fund manager who outperformed peers last year, is wagering that Goldman Sachs Group Inc. and Morgan Stanley got it wrong in declaring the start of an economic recovery.”
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=newsarchive&sid=auGWGWlnohNo
Re; LA
A friend of mine was in from LA over the weekend. He says in certain areas it’s raining ash. He says when he leaves his home, he can smell the fire. I hope the fire hasn’t gotten too close to his house.
Shore – Madoff’s beach house is for sale…
Madoff’s Long Island beach getaway up for sale
Sale of Manhattan apartment, Palm Beach estate to follow soon
MONTAUK, N.Y. – Those who see Bernard Madoff as an evil purveyor of excess might be disappointed by his beach house: It’s not that palatial.
At 3,014 square feet, the home is cottage-size by superrich standards. Its faded furnishings look as old as Madoff’s epic fraud. There’s no garage. Not even a walk-in closet.
But the 1.2-acre lot sits closer to the surf than larger neighboring homes on the southeastern tip of Long Island. And the house features a grand, columned porch with stunning views — undeniable selling points on display during a recent tour offered to The Associated Press.
The U.S. Marshals Service, which seized the property just east of the Hamptons on July 1, will put the property on the market this week as part of an ongoing effort to pay back burned investors.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/32640353/ns/business-real_estate/
Lost 60 – It is all so sad. Stu used to play hockey up in La Canada when he lived out there and I have many happy memories of that place.
61, Gator
“might be disappointed by his beach house: It’s not that palatial.”
Seems to be a common theme, at least according to his former mistress…he’s not “palatial” in a lot of ways…
sl
who you guys are into hockey? I knew you guys took a few balls across the nose but never thought you were into pucks.
When I say “Can we agree to disagree?” it means that I don’t want to have a disagreement escalate into a fight and I wish to preserve the relationship.
Lost – You’ve got mail!
[54] gator,
I have to agree with those who say that no matter who wins, little will change. This state is nearly ungovernable, and only radical surgery will save it, surgery that most sheeple have no taste for.
This is an election where the loser gets to be governor.
SL 63 – I also read that many of his acquaintances were shocked that he could pull off this big of a scam since he was generally considered the dumbest guy they knew. He used to wear 5 different watches to keep track of times in other time zones. It seems he was too dumb to add 5 to the current time to figure out what time it was in London. There are apparently quite a few SEC football players with better match skills than Madoff.
68 – oops match should be math
Nom 67 – I have moved firmly into the Clot camp for this election. I will not be voting, or will just write someone else in. I cannot bear to vote for either of these guys.
Manufacturing expands after an 18 month slump…
bwahahahaha!!!! What do we manufacture besides electronic dollars?
A.West says:
September 1, 2009 at 9:07 am
Can someone recommend a good home inspector to me? I don’t want to rely upon my realtor’s list. I’m looking at a house 7 years old.
Should I also get a home inspection done on my current house prior to listing?
West: I don’t know whether he would come as far north as you are. Really earnest guy in Little Silver who went to Colgate actually.
http://www.afullhouseinspectionco.com/
John,
I’m a hockey player and a big fan. Why you ask? Do you play?
BC,
Thanks. At least there is someone I can look to in support of my gut feeling that we have more pain to come. Maybe I am just overly negative in outlook but — given American’s indebtedness, income stagnation, and economic dependance on consumer spending — things do not seem all that rosey to me, notwithstanding any run-up in share prices. Heck, as with RE prices, share prices can tank overnight — or even in a few hours.
Politico reports that we can expect a flood of goons from out of state this fall. Wonder if that will help stimulate the local economy?
“Organized labor is betting big in Virginia and New Jersey, where two critical off-year gubernatorial races are taking place in November.
In New Jersey, where Democratic Gov. Jon Corzine trails Republican Chris Christie in the polls, the AFL-CIO earlier this month unveiled a web site slamming Christie for promoting an “economic agenda threatens the middle class.” The New Jersey Laborers’ Union, another Corzine backer, is set to open an on-the-ground offensive that will include assistance from affiliates in other states as well. . . .”
[68] gator
“There are apparently quite a few SEC football players with better match skills than Madoff.”
Any of them play for Florida???
(Ha. Sorry, couldn’t resist ;-))
RE: “But housing boosters have forecast turnarounds repeatedly since the market peaked in 2006, only to be proved wrong by plunging prices.”
It’s amazing that this sentence appeared in a mainstream publication. An editor’s mistake?
qwerty (77)-
I think some of the media is beginning to figure out that we’ve been duped and robbed blind. Too bad it’s way too late to do any good.
[70] gator
Pennsy got pretty far with a campaign a few years back with a TEA party style grassroots campaign that encouraged supporters to simply vote against the incumbent, regardless of party.
Some “safe” incumbents went down, and one surprising upshot was that in judicial elections, one Supreme Court judge was unelected, and another nearly so (judges are not opposed–voters vote to retain or not). In fairness, this was not simply collateral damage as the judges were also targeted, but no one thought they would not be retained. Unlike muni candidates, state court level judges rarely, if ever, advertised.
That sent shock waves through Harrisburg as that sort of thing almost never happens, and Rendell had to do one of his famous 180’s to start kissing the behind of the large inflated pig on the state house lawn (metaphorically, of course).
Gator,
Bernie’s beach house is much closer to what I would want than most of the tract-homes-o-the-beach that have been thrown up all along the eastern seaboard. I love the dining area, the porches, and how the house sits on its lot. If it were about 2/3 its size, and in a different location, it would be ideal for the Shores.
I found the OBX to be a bust. Duck and Southern Shores have potential but, for a variety of factors, did not make me want to take out the check book and drop a deposit.
Shore, what didn’t you like about the Delmarva Peninsula?
Weekend at Bernie’s…
Maybe when Madoff is on his cancerous deathbed, they will let him out to die in his beach house among family members?
Nom 76 – Yes ex-Gator Percy Harvin for one. Tested positive for pot at the NFL combines (with a first round draft spot on the line) as well as a pathetic 12/50 on the Wonderlic intelligence test. But he is lightning fast and is a member of Stu’s fantasy football team this fall.
Just a few weeks ago, Florida wide receiver Percy Harvin seemed to have everything going for him. He’d just had a killer workout in front of the NFL coaches and scouts in The Swamp and his draft stock seemed to be soaring. There was talk he was moving up into the top 15 in the draft.
Now, there is growing speculation that Harvin could actually fall to the second round.
Harvin took his first hit shortly after UF’s Pro Day, when it leaked out that he scored a 12 on the Wonderlic intelligence test at the NFL Combine in Indianapolis in February. A 12 is considered almost embarrassingly low, and it probably had some teams thinking twice aboutHarvin.
The second, and even bigger, hit came earlier this week, when the word started leaking out that Harvin had tested positive for marijuana at the Combine. Citing sources in the NFL, NFLDraftBible.com reported that Harvin was one of at least four prospects to test positive in Indianapolis. The others, the Site said, were Illinois cornerback Vontae Davis, UTEP kicker Jose Martinez, Boston College defensive tackle B.J. Raji. Sports Illustrated also reported Thursday that Raji had tested positive.
http://www.gainesville.com/article/20090403/ARTICLES/904039944?Title=Blog-Harvin-in-free-fall-
Gator…Don’t make me look bad. Harvin is my 4th WR. I doubt he will see my starting roster this year.
Stu, Delmarva, I can give you my opinions. The beach is not as nice as most jersey beaches reminds me of Asbury or point pleasant, its no Manoloking, LBI, Longport, Cape May beach. The sand is a funny color as is the water. Ocean City is over developed and trashier than the Jersey Shore. Looking for quaint, they don’t got it, good restaurants…hmm…nope. Do you like boating….inlet, intercostal and facilities are not as good as most areas on the jersey shore. It’s not a bad area, the beaches are nice, just IMHO not as nice as the jersey shore. The fishing is better though.
I honestly think that LBI, especially north of the causeway, is the best beach on the east coast. Not too crowded, no John-types and no boardwalk. It’s also close to AC if you want to party. Beaches are clean and beautiful and plenty for kids to do. Relatively cheap as well.
gator (83)-
Can’t a bro smoke a little chronic?
The bid under today’s market seems to be dissipating.
I think we’ll be headed back toward the center of the earth by 9/15.
87 Clot – Sure he can. But the universe’s karmic retribution for that is to send him to Minnesota.
“The bid under today’s market seems to be dissipating.’
Clot,
Day traders retreating from the 4 Horseman?
You know, if only we had someone who spend a lot of money to advertise “none of the above” like in Brewster’s millions.
Shore Guy – was Bernie’s house the short sale you mentioned a week or so ago (just kidding). Totally agree on your reaction to it, though. I found it really nice!
Shore Guy :80
Regarding OBX….how far south did you go on the island ??
In my experience, the area around Atlantic Beach is better for a variety of reasons. The restaurants are good, the beach is clean. Just the way the Gulf Stream comes closer to shore in that area.
When will people learn… I know a friend of a friend that promises to double your money in 3 months..
Mormons Become Victims in $50 Million Scam to Sell Gold Bullion
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601109&sid=an7Pm3hkmauw
Just in for a second,
Stu, I will get back to you on Delmarva, just no time to do it justice right now. Cambridge seemed like it had possibilities, Chincoteague also had a certain charm.
In the OBX did not make it down to Emerald Isle and Atlantic Beach area on this trip. FRom what I have seen and from the topo maps I have consulted it may be in the running.
Gator,
As for the Wonderlic intelligence test anf the NFL, a number of my team mates either went to camp or played in the NFL, and the three things that always came up were: How much stronger NFL players are than NCAA players, how much faster everyone is, and just how mental the game is in the NFL and how one must have an ability to absorb vast quantities of data in short periods in order to succeed there.
FYI:
Sample Wonderlic test:
http://freepdfhosting.com/a4dc569a1e.pdf
Shore 95 – When Stu told me that he drafted Harvin, I did say “You do know that he is dumb. I mean REALLY dumb. Don’t you?”. We’ll see if Harvin gets suspended for a positive drug test or gets injured first.
“Plain fact is that the Fed and Treasury spent all the available liquidity propping up Wall Street’s toxic asset waste pile and the banks that created it, so now Main Street employers and private investors, and the relatively smaller banks that support them both, must go begging for capital and liquidity in a market where government is the only player left. The notion that the Fed can even contemplate reversing the massive bailout for the OTC markets, this to restore normalcy to the monetary models that supposedly inform the central bank’s deliberations, is ridiculous in view of the capital shortfall in the banking sector and the private sector economy more generally.”
“Likewise C is one of the banks rated “F” in our stress test survey and one of the zombie girls still rocking out at the House Bernanke dance party. You have to wonder why serious, smart people we know on the Buy Side see value in what remains of C — even before the resolution process is complete. Keep in mind that unlike your mere TARP bank, C is halfway in the grave via the loss sharing agreement with the FDIC.”
http://www.ritholtz.com/blog/2009/09/q2-2009-bank-stress-test-results-the-zombie-dance-party-rocks-on/#more-37242
Can it happen here???
“Florida’s Bust Propels Muni Default Spike: By Joe Mysak
Sept. 1 (Bloomberg) — No other state comes close to Florida in defaulted municipal bonds.
Of the 126 bonds that are in default in 2009, 70 were sold in Florida.
Blame it on the collapse of the real estate market in general and, in particular, on Community Development Districts, which sell bonds to pay for infrastructure to support new real estate developments. Florida has 600 such districts, and 105 have gone into default on a total of $3.2 billion in bonds.
Asked how the so-called dirt district defaults in Florida compared with similar meltdowns in Colorado in the 1980s, Texas in the late 1980s and early 1990s and California in the 1990s, Richard Lehmann, publisher of the newsletter, said, “It’s worse than all three combined.” He also observed that some California defaults are still being worked out a decade after they occurred. Lehmann has launched a Web site devoted to this, http://www.floridacddreport.com.
“The death of Florida real estate has been reported and greatly exaggerated,” said Terry O’Grady, senior vice president of municipal trading at FMSBonds Inc. in North Miami Beach, which makes a market in Florida CDD bonds. “If you have time to do the research properly, and can figure out which districts are going to be built out, this is a good buying opportunity.”
After Florida, Ohio is second-largest with eight defaults and Illinois is third with five. The record year for municipal defaults was 2008, when 151 municipalities violated covenants on $7.9 billion in bonds.”
“Subsidized and tax-deductible mortgage interest rates as well as a ‘see no evil, speak no evil’ regulatory response to government agencies FNMA and FHLMC promoted a long-term housing boom and now a significant housing bust,” wrote Gross, Pimco’s co-chief investment officer. “Housing cannot lead us out of this big-R recession no matter what the recent Case-Shiller home price numbers suggest.” FNMA is mortgage company Fannie Mae, and FHLMC is the Federal Home Loan Mortgage Corp.
The S&P/Case-Shiller home-price index fell 15.4 percent in June from a year earlier, a report showed Aug. 25, less than the 16.4 percent decline forecast in a Bloomberg News survey, leading to speculation that housing declines bottomed.
Home ownership is declining, and the “new normal” in ownership is 65 percent of American households, down from 69 percent, Gross wrote.
Wouldn’t be surprised to see the mortgage interest deduction drastically cut back for high earners, esp if health care passes and cap and trade does not.
“Wouldn’t be surprised to see the mortgage interest deduction drastically cut back for high earners”
Slam dunk.
And high earners will be defined at some absurdly-low income level and will NOT be indexed to inflation.
Skep:
Health Care won’t pass. Cap and trade, unlikely as well, but a bit more likely than health care.
It all depends on the size of the lobby and how well organized they are to defeat the reformers. Mortgage interest rate deduction? They’ll probably add this to the list of deductions not allowed if you are in the AMT zone.
The government is not FOR the people. It is for the corporate big wigs. The behavior exhibited by Paulson, Geithner and Bernanke have made this all too clear. It’s been this way since at least the late 70’s and probably a lot earlier as well.
Go ahead and vote. You are simply deciding which politicians will get the greasiest palms. No more, no less.
killing the mortgage deduction will knock 20% off home prices. Yippiee Kiyaae cowboys.
Remember BO basically granted us the Bush Tax cuts for now, they all expire 12-31-2010. Unless killed earlier. Either way we will see a slew of in your face and stealth tax hikes in 2011. McMansions only make any sense all all for high earners as you can deduct up to a one million dollar mortgage. Wait till the mortgage amount is lowered or the deduction is AMT’d to death. Say Goodbye to Alpine home prices.
He said 250K and now it is 200K forget to index it to inflation and burger flippers in 2030 will be in that tax range
Shore Guy says:
September 1, 2009 at 1:20 pm
And high earners will be defined at some absurdly-low income level and will NOT be indexed to inflation.
“Either way we will see a slew of in your face and stealth tax hikes in 2011.”
J,
Yes, the new bull market.
A new super preferred Debt class has just been announced.
The “Reservation Special, FU for for bringing Influenza on the Mayflower, good luck suing us for the default” class.
http://www.wfsb.com/money/20657421/detail.html
“Last week, the chairman of the tribe, Michael Thomas, reportedly indicated that the tribal government would be paid before bankers or bondholders.”
“The government is not FOR the people. It is for the corporate big wigs. The behavior exhibited by Paulson, Geithner and Bernanke have made this all too clear.”
Stu,
Been this way since 1913. The message to main street;
http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_H2DePAZe2gA/Spy4oOH5XgI/AAAAAAAAJuE/y9SpC_iO6Tk/s1600-h/fortunecookie.jpg
Even crazier Fidlity for the first time ever has tribal bonds for sale in the secondary market. Talk about an inappropriate thing to be selling to investors on line with no further informaton.
PGC says:
September 1, 2009 at 1:41 pm
A new super preferred Debt class has just been announced.
The “Reservation Special, FU for for bringing Influenza on the Mayflower, good luck suing us for the default” class.
http://www.wfsb.com/money/20657421/detail.html
“Last week, the chairman of the tribe, Michael Thomas, reportedly indicated that the tribal government would be paid before bankers or bondholders.”
[102,103] BC, Shore
Taxes, and tax hikes in particular, cause “distortion” in behavior. Distortion is one reason you have “deadweight loss” or the propensity for a higher tax to bring in less revenue.
This is where broadening the base comes in. I posit that lowering the definition of “rich” would actually prevent much of the distortion at the lower income levels since it won’t cost enough to justify additional steps and costs (higher income levels are not sufficiently affected, unless rates go so high, you see a lot of expatriation). You would see the most distortion in the middle of the cohort, but that would occur anyway. Thus, by lowering the definition of “rich” to 150K or 200K, you bring in more revenue.
The only reason for governments to oppose it is political backlash. Certainly, much of this directly affected cohort supported Chairman O, however they are not so numerous as to pose a political threat. Rather, the true threat comes from those who are not hit with the tax.
Why? As the tax redistributes income from upper earners, it means less for upper earners to spend directly on employees or in the economy. Thus, a broad-based tax hike hurts growth, thus putting people out of work (no effect on revenues since these folks paid little tax anyway). With the economy in the tank, regardless of whether the voter attributes it to the tax hikes, the political party in power suffers.
Second, there is the perception of a creeping tax line coming toward them. Once Obama crosses the Rubicon and breaks his most inviolate tax pledge, the as-yet unaffected are left to wonder when the tax man will come for them, especially since their jobs are leaving and the money taken in taxes isn’t being spent on them.
[111]
I have no idea why I penned that screed.
Getting back to work now.
#110 Strawman
But you clip the coupons on those bonds for a $5 free bet and all you can eat crab legs or $10 off a carton of 200.
Comrade I agree with your theory if I my taxes were hiked I would have to fire my mexican gardeners and they would have less money to redistibute to Mexico, however since they no longer will be pooping on my lawn they can redisribute their fecal matter when they are back in Tijuana and since fecal matter is the equivalent worth of a single peso it in a way would still be a redistribution of wealth.
But Nom,
What about the income gap? It appears that those who make upwards of 200K per year seem to have actually been growing their nest eggs over the last 30 years and especially since ‘W’ got into office. Those making under 200K per year have been taking it up the rear. I’m saying that this is a justification for a tax increase, but what I am saying is that, if you leave things the same and don’t adjust for the income gap, then we’ll become Argentina even faster than we already are.
Of course, we all know that the rules are made to benefit the upper classes. They are the real campaign contributors.
The problem with the O plan is that 250K or even 200K is rapidly becoming the middle class. Especially in high cost states such as North Jersey.
however since they no longer will be pooping on my lawn…
I wouldn’t count on that….
I also wouldn’t walk on your lawn barefoot.
Man that was some poor english, even by by my terrible standards. Too busy at work today unfortunately.
Stu 200K is garbage picker class in NJ if you are raising a family with 3 or more kids and a stay at home wife and own a home with sky high property taxes and a supersized 2004-2008 bubble era mortgage.
Why is it that the Japanese make Americans take off our shoes when we go to their house so we don’t get their floors dirty but when they come to an American’s house they leave their shoes on and trample their dirt accross the floor?
Are they still mad they lost WWII?
toshiro_mifune says:
September 1, 2009 at 2:17 pm
however since they no longer will be pooping on my lawn…
I wouldn’t count on that….
I also wouldn’t walk on your lawn barefoot.
#119 – Many are so dazed by the lack of punctuation in your posts they don’t realize they are doing so. The others just don’t like you.
#115 Stu
As I see it, the problem with the whole income gap contention is that the government has taken over so much of the financial responsibility for those in the lower income brackets that the gap isn’t as large as it seems.
In NJ, a family of six like mine can take home (net) 2367 per month and still get close to a 1000 a month assistance to buy food. And take a look at the CHiP eligibility guidelines. http://www.njfamilycare.org/pages/whatItCosts.html
And keep in mind that families with an AGI over 160k (or so, haven’t looked lately) can’t even deduct an IRA contribution. Throw in the AMT most HENRY’s have to pay and I’ll bet the income gap between families earning under 200k and families earning 50k is a lot smaller than most people think.
gator (97)-
This is a guy that in about 15 years, the CBS pregame show will do a feature on him living under a bridge.
Nom,
Did you see the post I directed towards you the other day about the taxation of partnerships that have as few as one partner in NY?
Comrade Nom Deplume says:
September 1, 2009 at 1:51 pm
[102,103] BC, Shore Taxes, and tax hikes in particular, cause “distortion” in behavior. Distortion is one reason you have “deadweight loss” or the propensity for a higher tax to bring in less revenue.
Nom: Isn’t dead weight loss more the argument that there will less economic value created in the distorted market? Less revenue is a possibility, but not a certainty. It depends on the new quantity supplied/demanded under the new conditions.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deadweight_loss
121.
Ellen, and don’t forget NJ Kidcare, and “affordable housing” which a family earning 60k can even qualify for a low interest mortgage on a townhouse in an “affordbale housing” development. I experienced it in my own family. “Poor” relative does a lot of traveling, playing around. Lots of freed up pocket money and a pretty nice quality of life.
We have a few generations in the country that have never PAID for the roof over their heads. Its an unknown concept and they truly believe that people who pay for a mortgage are crazy rich.
I guess it is whatever is your definition of revenue…
Oh, and the other great scam, the one that has lead to polygamy going mainstream: Don’t marry your baby daddy so you can claim only your income and qualify for free housing and food.
Guy I bought my current residence had a tenant who was sec 8 with 2 kids and a full time job. She was “single” but baby daddy lived under the same roof and worked too.
Those FL teachers better develop a taste for Friskies, ’cause their pensions just took a 250mm (total) loss on Stuy Town:
“Stuy Town, which as Zero Hedge wrote about several days ago is in dire straits and a few months away from default, has claimed its first casualty in the face of the Florida pension fund, aka State Board Administration which has disclosed a full loss on its $250 million investment. Next question: is Blackrock still carrying Stuy Town at 100 cents on the dollar for its own LP appeasement purposes (PEs heart FASB looseness)? This piece of information will likely get as much coverage on GE’s propaganda central subsidiary as Chrysler missing August sales estimates by almost 20%.”
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/stuy-town-which-verge-default-costs-floridas-pension-fund-entire-250-million-investment
hey shore re: OBX
I just got back from OBX, loved the place (with my family), seemed like it had all the charm of the shore without all the hassle/a-holes/price gouging. We rented a nice house in Corolla, last town to the North before the Dunes (where the wild ponies are). Seemed to be a great place for the family.
Then again, I was not looking for nightlife/resaurants/art galleries. Just a quiet place to enjoy life with the family. The worst part of it all was the 10 hour ride.
Nom:
“As the tax redistributes income from upper earners, it means less for upper earners to spend directly on employees or in the economy.”
What about some of the idle rich that just keep on hoarding wealth — and getting favors such as estate tax exemption from W’s ilk?
S
Anybody know about the rumor that Banco Santander has failed?
so the answer is you guys are still mad about WWII.
toshiro_mifune says:
September 1, 2009 at 2:30 pm
#119 – Many are so dazed by the lack of punctuation in your posts they don’t realize they are doing so. The others just don’t like you.
They are one of the strongest banks in the world. No way.
Clotpoll says:
September 1, 2009 at 3:08 pm
Anybody know about the rumor that Banco Santander has failed?
John:
“Stu 200K is garbage picker class in NJ if you are raising a family with 3 or more kids and a stay at home wife and own a home with sky high property taxes and a supersized 2004-2008 bubble era mortgage”
A lot of “if’s”… Well, any amount is small if one lives well beyond one’s needs — and invests/gambles with huge sums of borrowed money.
200k is nothing to sneer at, especially if it is a single income, not much day care expenses — even with three kids (personally, I think three is on the higher side — one or two seems more typical).
S
http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=conewsstory&tkr=STD%3AUS&sid=a2jqqBoixqE0
STD just didn’t call some bonds, DB did same thing a few weeks ago. Unusual but nothing to care about.
Clot they stopped publishing NJ Pension Funds returns (losses). No Update for July or August, must be election season.
http://www.nj.gov/treasury/doinvest/
Re: 134…
of one lives well beyond one’s *income*… (not “needs”, more important with all the “O is a commie” cr@p going on).
Hat tip to the first person here to use the phrase “Schumpeterian Depression” correctly in a sentence.
And no, John, we don’t want to hear your Schumpeter- 3 AM- Queens Blvd story.
My beloved ProShares product rising from the dead.
Don’t blame me – I voted for Kodos.
so the answer is you guys are still mad about WWII.
This may come as a surprise, but Toshiro Mifune is a nom de post. I’m not really Japanese.
142. Aw man.
Clot 122 – I love how you can find the positive in everything.
“This is a guy that in about 15 years, the CBS pregame show will do a feature on him living under a bridge.”
Don’t worry John. The way your heroes are delaying the inevitable, we’ll all be Japanese soon enough.
If you have three kids saving for college and maybe helping out on a few weddings is almost a one million dollar commitment given inflation alone. 200K is only 180K after you cover 401k and Flex account, then of that 180K they take like 40% leaving you with 108. Now you are supposed to save for your retirement and your kids college out of that and with 3 kids you should put away around 30K a year. Now RE taxes and Car insurance is around 15K, Now we are at 63k. Add in a 2K mortgage and around 600 a month to carry two cars and pay NJ transist and we are at around 32K. Cost of living, food and heat, etc eats up around 62.9 of that leaving you with around 100 bucks a year in mad money.
sastry says:
September 1, 2009 at 3:11 pm
John:
“Stu 200K is garbage picker class in NJ if you are raising a family with 3 or more kids and a stay at home wife and own a home with sky high property taxes and a supersized 2004-2008 bubble era mortgage”
A lot of “if’s”… Well, any amount is small if one lives well beyond one’s needs — and invests/gambles with huge sums of borrowed money.
200k is nothing to sneer at, especially if it is a single income, not much day care expenses — even with three kids (personally, I think three is on the higher side — one or two seems more typical).
S
#127 Barbara –
While there are abuses (and no doubt a lot of them), I don’t begrudge low wage earners a leg up. For the most part they really need assistance. It’s expensive to live in this part of the country. (Although the only way a family of six could spend 1k every month on food stamp eligible items would be to buy all their food at the local bodega, but that’s another story).
It’s just that whenver I hear someone talking about the wage gap, the first thing I think is yeah, but, those high wage earning families are paying their own way and the low wage earners aren’t. I think two parent families earning under 50k even qualify for the EITC which means they’re getting some (all?) of their SS deduction back too.
#143 – :(
I do try to be as seriously awesome as my namesake though.
http://www.gentlemanscorner.com/2009/08/craft-on-the-net-nom-de-guerre.html
very manly nom de post, love your sweater
#138.
Frank and John elope to San Francisco and decide to stay and buy a house using no money down and negative amortization on Castro. Frank then says, ” What Schumterian Depression?”.
200k is nothing to sneer at, especially if it is a single income, not much day care expenses — even with three kids (personally, I think three is on the higher side — one or two seems more typical).
True enough. But how many of those 200k families would have more than 1 or 2 if they could afford it?
#131 Clot, wasn’t Santander rumored to buy Citi earlier this year?
Re: 130 – Sastry
What about some of the idle rich that just keep on hoarding wealth — and getting favors such as estate tax exemption from W’s ilk?
Even if we taxed the “idle rich” at 50%, how much is that really? In my experience, trust fund babies who don’t work for a living are by and large liberal Dems, which makes me think if you have enough money, there are probably still ways to avoid paying taxes.
But the vast majority of us in the six figure income bracket did not inherit our wealth and the AMT is making sure we’re paying more than our fair share in taxes. Heck, the government under Clinton and Bush 2 thought we were so rich we couldn’t even deduct our six figure student loans.
Test
John,
Your numbers are a bit off. The taxes would be well below 40% since only the top portion gets taxed at that level. Likewise, 2k mortgage (not including taxes) seems a bit high — it must be about 400k loan at 5%. Two new cars. Pretty high property taxes too. Then the option of reducing the 10k per child per year to a little lesser in order to get some breathing room.
That is a “above comfortable” lifestyle. Small adjustments leave plenty of room to breathe.
S
danzud (150)-
Sorry, you’re disqualified. You misspelled Schumpeter.
danzud (150)-
Good usage, though.
Ellen #153. You have a valid point wrt the amount of money saved by taxing idle rich [irrespective of whether they are dems or repubs]. However, that money is probably orders of magnitude more than what’s lost due to abuses at the lower income levels.
S
Sep 1 and volume. Perfect together.
BC Bob, please accept my belated condolences.
S
Geez, GM’s sales declined %20 in Aug. How crappy do you have to be to have lost sales during cash-for-clunkers?
Hyundai and Kia both had big jumps…
200k is comfortable middle class for a family of 4 in NJ. Not the highlife that many people seemed to be living the past 5 years. Which begs the question, how are people funding their lifestyles… incomes are not that high. The vast majority do not earn that, especially now.
october should be interesting for the markets. Holidays will further cement the concept that the consumer economy for all intents and purposes is dead.
200K = Comfortable,high life, dogs salary etc etc is all relative.
Bottom line, if you save more than you earn, overtime, you will have a sizable nest egg.
how can one save more than they earn?
Sastry,
Thanks.
#165 Long afternoon..yawn..
I meant to say, If you save a lot of your income and spend less…
So for those in the $150k range with 2 kids, the mortgage, cars, etc., what are the towns in NJ that you can live in without your kids having to join a gang?
167. Zack
I thought you were onto something. Oh well, back to the belt tightening :)
Danzud are you NYC reliant?
#155 Sastry
The 40 percent is probably pretty accurate. There are state and local taxes, like the Philly city wage, and don’t forget the social security tax, which many of us will never see back once they start means testing it in a few years.
Danzud, et al.:
Every time I see another empty office here at work (call it furloughed, excessed… whatever), or I get another ‘productivity’ talk from one of my bosses when no one is particularly productive in this environment..
When any of that happens I simply check the balance of my very liquid (now laughably named, still hideously oversized) “house savings fund”, and think to myself ‘at least I’m not like that poor bastard down the hall with the ’08 vintage $500k mortgage, $50k down plus another $35k sunk just to make the place habitable. That would really give me agita.
John must have dusted off an old copy of “Rich Dad Poor Dad” on his stay-cation while hiding from the wife in his basement. He could no longer get any TV free over the air on Rabbit ears, so he started digging through old boxes and found Kiyosaki’s book.
John “Rich Dad Poor Dad” is so 2003.
The 2009 version is “Got a job Dad?”
Sastry, with all due respect, I think the estimates on the monthly budget were conservative (and probably too conservative). Regarding income taxes, while only the top portion gets taxed at federal marginal rate, there are also state and local taxes. Additionally, there is the AMT, which eliminates several deductions and puts the overall “effective” federal rate much higher. Regarding property taxes, there are several houses in NJ and NY with property taxes alone well above 15k, with home insurance another few hundred per month and car insurance above that. Moreover, a 400k mortgage at 5 percent is a relatively modest house in a “middle class” suburb like Cranford (and would have been even more modest if you purchased a few years ago during the bubble).
172. Anon
“When any of that happens I simply check the balance of my very liquid (now laughably named, still hideously oversized) “house savings fund””
I have one of these too. The bank always asks me whats going on. Same story for 4 years now. “Its for a house.”
Barb (175)-
You might want to throw a few quid at some selected shorting of banks, RE, HBs and retailers.
Full disclaimer: what the hell do I know?
#170 For now, my wife is upper east side.
BC (159)-
Just add .vix, and boom!
Barbara how can you afford to keep that much money in a savings account for four years? My house fund is in munis, investment grade, a little junk and CDs I bought last year that have not yet matured. Yea it is a little less liquid but if I have to put down a little less while I liquidate the less liquid bonds over a year or two so what. I have my 25% in the more liquid stuff and I only need 25% down to get a good rate. Why didn’t you at least do 1-5 year T-bills back in 2006 to mid 2008 when rates were high. They are very liquid. Remember Barbara the other fence sitters who locked in 7% on their 200K downpayment are moving forard at a 14K a month clip without even adding more.
Sean ever since I watched an eposoide of My two dads back in the 80s with Greg Evigan and Paul Reiser I don’t trust people with two dads, plus Greg Evigan did BJ and the Bear and My Two Dads which adds to my mistrust.
Danzud 168 – What a retarded question.
@PGC [108]:
The real joke is that they’re mostly no more “native-american” than I am – I think the “Tribal Leader” was 1/16 blood at most back in the 80’s when they sued for recognition. They’ve made out well since, however. MGM/Mirage just spent billions there building a new hotel and casino floor, and they are following it up with lots of promotion and headline acts. I’ll report back from my next trip this month.
Sync #181 – Oh really? There’s some nice houses in Clifton/West Orange but the high schools? Child, please
John,
if I knew then that it would sit for 4 years (some of it was in CDs) I would have handled it differently. For example, 6 years ago i wanted to be almost all cash, little mortgage. Thats all changed, I’m going to qualify for the max amount and keep as much cash as possible. Also, extensive renos in the 150k range were always part of the plan so I needed to stay liquid just in case something popped up.
Oh well, I’m not nearly as savvy as you all but I often read your posts and others and google and learn.
Clotpoll says:
September 1, 2009 at 3:20 pm
Hat tip to the first person here to use the phrase “Schumpeterian Depression” correctly in a sentence.
Chip Hughes openly prays for a Schumpeterian Depression that would leave even the youngest of his children groveling for a menial minimum wage job after graduating from college in the next decade.
In reality, the idea that such an occurrence would necessitate apprenticing his kids into his real estate practice makes him shudder to the core.
At bottom, he is resigned to living out his days muttering in his basement while poisoning his liver with Knob Creek, and pretending to be a chef while sweating over a pot of boiling water on a hot plate.
In an alcohol induce rage he concusses himself by impaling his head into a makeshift Bobby Flay dartboard he erected on a brick wall.
Barbara well think of all the taxes you are saving by not having too much interest income. I am a little suprised how slow this housing train wreck is. It is like a five year plus bottom.
I can’t believe he never unmoderated this post!
chicagofinance says:
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
September 1, 2009 at 8:53 am
Yesterday…Italy…today…France
WSJ
PAGE ONE
SEPTEMBER 1, 2009
In Paris, Behavior Brigade Battles To Make Oui-Oui a Non-Non
Even the Sanisettes Don’t Stem the Flow; Mr. Rebete Is a Whiz at Catching Offenders
By SUSANA FERREIRA
PARIS — Hidden behind dark sunglasses, Jean-Pierre Rebete follows his target into a narrow Paris alley.
“We’ve got one,” he whispers to his partner, who bolts to block off the other end of the street.
The man in the alley zips up his jeans and turns away from the wall. Busted. Mr. Rebete hands him a ticket and informs him of his rights.
Mr. Rebete is a special agent in Paris’s war on public ur-nation. Part of an elite, 88-member force called the Brigade des Incivilités, or Bad Behavior Brigade, Mr. Rebete scours the streets for all sorts of boorish offenders. Dressed in civilian clothes and driving an unmarked car, he tickets everyone from litterbugs to people handing out unauthorized flyers to Parisians who don’t pick up after their dog.
But what the French call ur-ne sauvage, which translates to “wild ur-ne,” is the hardest to crack. While France’s capital has campaigned with some success to have Parisians pick up after their pets, the city is still struggling with the presence of pipi.
Ur-ne is hard to escape in certain parts of the city, be it on the street, in the Metro or in parks.
Members of the Brigade say there is no high season for urinary offenses, but summertime heat heightens the stench.
City hygiene workers scrub down and spray tens of thousands of square meters of walls and sidewalks every month. But according to Mr. Rebete, a former sanitation worker himself, the products they use — a combination of disinfectant and deodorizer, blasted through a hose with hot water — are no match for the streams that seep into the city’s stone streets.
“It just masks the smell,” he says. “It doesn’t wash it away.”
Paris has tried to stem the flow. Some 400 public restrooms — self-cleaning gray pods called Sanisettes — are scattered throughout the city and have been free to use since 2006. The Sanisettes are being upgraded, and the newest models include skylights and an eco-friendly design, including reservoirs that store rainwater for use in the toilet.
Yet offenders are undeterred, says Etienne Vanderpooten, an architect with the City of Paris who has tried to crack the puzzle. In 2005, Mr. Vanderpooten unveiled a design for an anti-pipi wall, a jagged surface that splashes urine back onto the unzipped offender. The prototype was attached to a wall in one of the most affected areas at the time — a street called the Cour des Petites Ecuries on Paris’ Right Bank. Mr. Vanderpooten says he often goes by to check on his experiment: “The people who used to pee there don’t pee in the same place anymore.” The city has no immediate plans to er-ct more of the walls.
Whether in small towns or big cities, public urination is a global phenomenon. Under former Mayor Rudolph Giuliani, the New York City Police Department began a major crackdown on “quality of life” offenses — including passing water in public. This year alone, the city has handed out more than 18,500 summonses for public ur-nation, according to the NYPD.
Paris has taken a more gradual approach to tackling the problem. Starting in the early 1960s, the office in charge of keeping the city clean — the Centre d’Action pour la Propreté de Paris, or CAPP — released informational brochures, subway posters and a series of short films about hygiene and air quality. Then in 1986, realizing that the CAPP needed more teeth in its fight against uncivilized behavior, the mayor’s office transferred jurisdiction from the police to the new Bad Behavior Brigade.
Active enforcement by the Brigade, combined with aggressive advertising, managed to eliminate the dog-droppings problem rather quickly, city officials say. Erick Orblin, CAPP director, says he has noticed a decline in the Parisian dog population since the crackdown began. Some residents would now prefer to own an indoor cat or a fish than have to stoop and scoop on the sidewalk, he says.
But the urine problem is a different matter. Of the 20,000 total infractions the Brigade records every year, one quarter involve people and dogs caught illegally relieving themselves in public. In 2007, the Brigade handed out 1,200 tickets to adults for public urination. In 2008, that number rose to 1,800. By the end of June this year, the Brigade had already handed out 1,100 tickets. City officials say it is hard to determine whether the rising number is due to a growing problem or to the crackdown by Mr. Rebete and his colleagues.
There are other challenges. Brigade members don’t target homeless people, travelers, or people without documentation. That is because, without identification or a Paris address, offenders have no way of receiving court documents in the mail. Fines can be as high as €450 ($644), but will be reduced to a maximum of €35 starting next year.
For Mr. Rebete, the 53-year-old Brigade agent, public hygiene is about basic civic values. From his slim, neatly pressed tan slacks to his perfectly trimmed nails and the small, gleaming stud in his left earlobe, everything about Mr. Rebete suggests a sense of well-scrubbed order. In 1982, Mr. Rebete joined France’s civil-servant corps and worked his way through various municipal units, including the Department of Cleanliness and Water. He spent some years as a Paris street cleaner and garbage-disposal worker before joining the Brigade last year.
“There’s a lack of civility,” said Mr. Rebete, frowning at a puddle on a sidewalk. “I remember walking around with my grandfather 40 years ago, and you’d pick up every bit of paper that fell to the street.”
The Brigade works in shifts from 6 a.m. to 11 p.m., and agents always go out in teams of two. Violent resistance from offenders, though not common, is sometimes possible, Mr. Rebete said.
On their recent afternoon shift, Mr. Rebete and his partner had just begun patrolling the streets in their compact Citroen car when they spotted the first offense of the day: illegal trash dumping. Mr. Rebete jumped out, slid on a pair of latex gloves and ripped open the stray trash bag. Inside, he found what he was looking for: a sheet of paper with the name and address of a nearby business, the likely guilty party.
When he is surveying for other offenses, Mr. Rebete’s strategy is to blend in. He puts on his shades, pretends he is waiting for the bus or a friend, and sneaks up on people after the act. “We don’t interrupt them,” says Mr. Rebete, adding that he can generally spot offenses even before they occur.
Minutes after Mr. Rebete ticketed the urinator he caught in the alley, another suspect headed the same way. Like the previous offender, the man stepped off to the left, leaned close to the wall and unzipped.
Mr. Rebete smiled and walked quietly toward him, fishing for the book of tickets tucked into his belt.
unmod?
Barb [175]:
I’m suprized to hear your bank asks. Mine is quite content to assume I’m happy leaving it there at <1%. If I too had considered that in 2005 when I had the funds ready to buy and started this process that I’d enter 2010 not owning the house I lived in, then I would have parked it elsewhere.
chicagofinance says:
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
September 1, 2009 at 5:15 pm
I can’t believe he never unmoderated this post!
chicagofinance says:
Your comment is awaiting moderation.
September 1, 2009 at 8:53 am
Yesterday…Italy…today…France
WSJ
PAGE ONE
SEPTEMBER 1, 2009
In Paris, Behavior Brigade Battles To Make Oui-Oui a Non-Non
Even the Sanisettes Don’t Stem the Flow; Mr. Rebete Is a Whiz at Catching Offenders
By SUSANA FERREIRA
PARIS — Hidden behind dark sunglasses, Jean-Pierre Rebete follows his target into a narrow Paris alley.
“We’ve got one,” he whispers to his partner, who bolts to block off the other end of the street.
The man in the alley zips up his jeans and turns away from the wall. Busted. Mr. Rebete hands him a ticket and informs him of his rights.
Mr. Rebete is a special agent in Paris’s war on public ur-nation. Part of an elite, 88-member force called the Brigade des Incivilités, or Bad Behavior Brigade, Mr. Rebete scours the streets for all sorts of boorish offenders. Dressed in civilian clothes and driving an unmarked car, he tickets everyone from litterbugs to people handing out unauthorized flyers to Parisians who don’t pick up after their dog.
But what the French call ur-ne sauvage, which translates to “wild ur-ne,” is the hardest to crack. While France’s capital has campaigned with some success to have Parisians pick up after their pets, the city is still struggling with the presence of pipi.
Ur-ne is hard to escape in certain parts of the city, be it on the street, in the Metro or in parks.
Members of the Brigade say there is no high season for urinary offenses, but summertime heat heightens the stench.
City hygiene workers scrub down and spray tens of thousands of square meters of walls and sidewalks every month. But according to Mr. Rebete, a former sanitation worker himself, the products they use — a combination of disinfectant and deodorizer, blasted through a hose with hot water — are no match for the streams that seep into the city’s stone streets.
“It just masks the smell,” he says. “It doesn’t wash it away.”
Paris has tried to stem the flow. Some 400 public restrooms — self-cleaning gray pods called Sanisettes — are scattered throughout the city and have been free to use since 2006. The Sanisettes are being upgraded, and the newest models include skylights and an eco-friendly design, including reservoirs that store rainwater for use in the toilet.
Yet offenders are undeterred, says Etienne Vanderpooten, an architect with the City of Paris who has tried to crack the puzzle. In 2005, Mr. Vanderpooten unveiled a design for an anti-pipi wall, a jagged surface that splashes urine back onto the unzipped offender. The prototype was attached to a wall in one of the most affected areas at the time — a street called the Cour des Petites Ecuries on Paris’ Right Bank. Mr. Vanderpooten says he often goes by to check on his experiment: “The people who used to pee there don’t pee in the same place anymore.” The city has no immediate plans to er-ct more of the walls.
Whether in small towns or big cities, public urination is a global phenomenon. Under former Mayor Rudolph Giuliani, the New York City Police Department began a major crackdown on “quality of life” offenses — including passing water in public. This year alone, the city has handed out more than 18,500 summonses for public ur-nation, according to the NYPD.
Paris has taken a more gradual approach to tackling the problem. Starting in the early 1960s, the office in charge of keeping the city clean — the Centre d’Action pour la Propreté de Paris, or CAPP — released informational brochures, subway posters and a series of short films about hygiene and air quality. Then in 1986, realizing that the CAPP needed more teeth in its fight against uncivilized behavior, the mayor’s office transferred jurisdiction from the police to the new Bad Behavior Brigade.
Active enforcement by the Brigade, combined with aggressive advertising, managed to eliminate the dog-droppings problem rather quickly, city officials say. Erick Orblin, CAPP director, says he has noticed a decline in the Parisian dog population since the crackdown began. Some residents would now prefer to own an indoor cat or a fish than have to stoop and scoop on the sidewalk, he says.
But the urine problem is a different matter. Of the 20,000 total infractions the Brigade records every year, one quarter involve people and dogs caught illegally relieving themselves in public. In 2007, the Brigade handed out 1,200 tickets to adults for public urination. In 2008, that number rose to 1,800. By the end of June this year, the Brigade had already handed out 1,100 tickets. City officials say it is hard to determine whether the rising number is due to a growing problem or to the crackdown by Mr. Rebete and his colleagues.
There are other challenges. Brigade members don’t target homeless people, travelers, or people without documentation. That is because, without identification or a Paris address, offenders have no way of receiving court documents in the mail. Fines can be as high as €450 ($644), but will be reduced to a maximum of €35 starting next year.
For Mr. Rebete, the 53-year-old Brigade agent, public hygiene is about basic civic values. From his slim, neatly pressed tan slacks to his perfectly trimmed nails and the small, gleaming stud in his left earlobe, everything about Mr. Rebete suggests a sense of well-scrubbed order. In 1982, Mr. Rebete joined France’s civil-servant corps and worked his way through various municipal units, including the Department of Cleanliness and Water. He spent some years as a Paris street cleaner and garbage-disposal worker before joining the Brigade last year.
“There’s a lack of civility,” said Mr. Rebete, frowning at a puddle on a sidewalk. “I remember walking around with my grandfather 40 years ago, and you’d pick up every bit of paper that fell to the street.”
The Brigade works in shifts from 6 a.m. to 11 p.m., and agents always go out in teams of two. Violent resistance from offenders, though not common, is sometimes possible, Mr. Rebete said.
On their recent afternoon shift, Mr. Rebete and his partner had just begun patrolling the streets in their compact Citroen car when they spotted the first offense of the day: illegal trash dumping. Mr. Rebete jumped out, slid on a pair of latex gloves and ripped open the stray trash bag. Inside, he found what he was looking for: a sheet of paper with the name and address of a nearby business, the likely guilty party.
When he is surveying for other offenses, Mr. Rebete’s strategy is to blend in. He puts on his shades, pretends he is waiting for the bus or a friend, and sneaks up on people after the act. “We don’t interrupt them,” says Mr. Rebete, adding that he can generally spot offenses even before they occur.
Minutes after Mr. Rebete ticketed the ur-nator he caught in the alley, another suspect headed the same way. Like the previous offender, the man stepped off to the left, leaned close to the wall and unzipped.
Mr. Rebete smiled and walked quietly toward him, fishing for the book of tickets tucked into his belt.
cripes…I give up
chi (185)-
We have a winner.
However, in a true Schumpeterian Depression, there will be no minimum wage jobs. The minimum wage will collapse.
Cyclonic Action Vacuum says:
September 1, 2009 at 5:19 pm
However, in a true Schumpeterian Depression, there will be no minimum wage jobs. The minimum wage will collapse.
In a true Schumpeterian Depression, Knob Creek would cease to exist, and you would be drunk on beer and gewurztraminer…but why sweat the details?
chi (193)-
In my vision of the future, I’ll be distilling potatoes in my bathtub.
[123] shore
Didn’t see it.
[124] chifi,
the term is also used in tax policy and is the same concept. As for revenue, I mean tax collections.
[130] sastry,
I guess I need to know what you mean by “idle.” Some unearned income is taxed at dividend/cap gain rates or not at all (muni). I suppose you could hike taxes on that, with the attendant consequences. You could also impose new wealth taxes (think an estate tax that is assessed each year), again with the attendant consequences. Provided the voters are willing to live with those consequences, then they can implement the taxes.
As for me, if I were one of the “idle rich” and I saw those taxes being proposed, I would sell my home, move my money overseas, walk into the nearest consulate, find a consular officer, and advise him that I renounce my U.S. citizenship. I hear the golf courses and beaches outside of the US are nice too.
As for your view of estate taxes, if you consider the government’s taking of over well over half (up to 55% estate tax, and income taxes on the income accumlated) of all you have worked for and earned in your lifetime to be “fair,” well, we don’t necessarily agree.
Citi Home Depot Rewards card closes October 1st. And the banks keep on lending.
In an alcohol induce rage he concusses himself by impaling his head into a makeshift Bobby Flay dartboard he erected on a brick wall.
at which point the local EMS crew transports him to a local hospital that due to the recent O’brahman health policy mandates we allow him to die.
Based on the formula derived from the Health Care Policy mandate:
anticipated state and federal income tax < life support, resuscitation, nightly nurse sponge bathings, chronic feeding tube Knob Creek = withdrawal of life support.
ASFIT < LS/R/B&D/KC = WLS
Unless of course he ends up in my PIT.
:)
sl
[168] Danzud: I get your point, but I think you’re overstating how bad some of the middle-of-the-road towns are. I don’t think your kids would need to join a gang in Clark, Woodbridge, Rahway, Edison … not the nicest places, but not Newark either.
Ok, you guys can give me crap for the job I just started. I’m officially a high school teacher. It was either that or work for Department of Homeland security.
[130] sastry
Oh, and to add insult to injury, not only will I be investing my idle wealth overseas and not paying US income tax, I can invest in debt in the U.S. (like Treasuries) and still pay zero US income tax.
Naturally, the Congress could repeal the portfolio interest exemption and our tax treaties, but I don’t think you would like the result.
[199] Ben
“I’m officially a high school teacher.” Not sure there is much difference between that and Homeland Security.
Word of advice — never touch a student except to defend yourself. No slaps on the back, no handshakes, no high-fives.
Also, never allow yourself to be in a room alone with a student. Student wants to have an after-school conference, make sure another adult is present. And document anything that sounds even remotely like a threat.
IMHO, you have taken on more risk than there is reward, but hey, someone has to do it.
Ben, Tread carefully till your tenure :)
Nom, I doubt that a large number of people would leave the US if the estate tax breaks given by W are repealed or not renewed. There’s more than taxes that people use to decide on where to live (e.g. living in Texas vs living in NJ).
S
Ben: My Physics teacher in high school had a PhD.
Whatever else happens with estate tax, I can guarantee you it will not be reinstated until Ted Kennedy’s estate has settled.
Ellen #204:
Ill informed, low net worth conservatives support lower taxes even though it will hurt them…
Well informed rich liberals support higher taxes because they know they can use the loopholes very well…
Therefore, taxes should be higher with loopholes closed, so that the rich liberal cannot exploit the poor conservative :)
S
#205 Sastry –
I’ll go with closing loopholes, because then the rich liberals will start voting in liberals.
But I fear tax imposing libs will always find a way around their oppressive policies. http://www.cltg.org/cltg/clt2009/09-09-01_cross-border_rep.htm
#206 oops. start should be STOP
Matthew [198]
Dude, you just gave me the best laugh of the day with this one:
“… I don’t think your kids would need to join a gang in Clark, Woodbridge, Rahway, Edison … not the nicest places, but not Newark either.”
I am sure the residents of Clark would love to know that they are being lumped into a list of “not the nicest places” along with their neighbor Rahway. Those two towns are like night and day, if you know what I mean.
Not sure I would have grouped them as you have but Bravo! I wish you had posted this on the nj.com Clark forum.
[202] sastry
There is a saying about not letting the tax tail wag the dog, but all things being equal, such a scenario would cause expatriation of wealthy americans. Maybe Bill Gates and Warren Buffett would stick around, but I can easily foresee some billionaires beating feet if it means saving millions in taxes each year.
In real numbers, very few people. But if only the top 1/10 of a percent of our population left, it would blow a large hole in revenue projections. Suppose the second 100 richest persons in the US left (Numbers 101-200)? That would cause a huge revenue hit.
Further, I spoke only of the idle rich. Folks like me (who are rich by congressional definition) still have to work else we would quickly be unrich, and in fact, poor. So we cannot expatriate. Folks with lots of wealth (regardless of whether they have a high-paying job) can easily move the money overseas.
Finally, what loopholes are you talking about? Many were closed in 1986 as the trade-off for lowering marginal rates (the idea was to have neutral changes).
How about curbing deductions for charitable contributions, or preventing the wealthy from establishing private foundations? That would certainly raise revenues (and the burdens of government), while decimating the nonprofit sector. Other loopholes? These typically don’t inure to individuals so I have to ask for more specificity.
How about taxing corporations more? We can certainly do that. Eliminate loopholes like the foreign subsidiary expense deductions, or tax the unrepatriated income. That’s a sure way to make a US co. with an Irish subsidiary into an Irish co. with a U.S. subsidiary. But it could be done, no doubt.
Remember one thing–when it comes to tax, the power to tax is near limitless. But as the wise man said, the power to tax is the power to destroy.
sl (197)-
Some people have a DNR order in their living wills. I have a DNWKC (Do Not Withhold Knob Creek).
“Unless of course he ends up in my PIT.”
Nom,
“You cannot legislate the poor into prosperity by legislating the wealthy out of prosperity. What one person receives without working for, another person must work for without receiving. The government cannot give to anybody anything that the government does not first take from somebody else. When half of the people get the idea that they do not have to work because the other half is going to take care of them, and when the other half gets the idea that it does no good to work because somebody else is going to get what they work for, that my dear friend, is the beginning of the end of any nation.. You cannot multiply wealth by dividing it.”*
Adrian Rogers, 1931
Sometimes this place feels like group therapy….
sl
I know I keep coming back to the income gap and don’t think that more taxes on the rich are the way to solve it, but something has to be done with the gross compensation and benefits that have become commonplace in the corporate world. It’s one thing to not want to have to pay for the lazy do nothing ghetto dweller, but to rob a decent existence from your coworkers who are very much responsible for your well being is despicable. It’s sort of like the great benefits that the public sector enjoys. They used to defend it by saying that it makes up for the lack of salary as compared to people in their private sector counterparts. This has been proven to be no longer the case. One of my first posts here years ago was about investing in companies that produce barbed wire. I really do believe that Argentina is coming and a lot sooner than you think.
Ricky,
I did not get to Corolla. During my trip through southern shores and duck thew highway was like the indy 500 — made rt 35 traffic (in a single lane) seem like a country road. I liked southere shores and the south-western part of duck. after the point in duck where the sound came into view on the main drag, it seemed to flatten out quite a bit. I would love to hear more about corolla so feel free to get my e-mail from Grim.
“while only the top portion gets taxed at federal marginal rate, there are also state and local taxes. ”
In NY the legislature did away with the progressive nature of the “rich tax” and if one reaches the income level for the top rate or two, one’s entire income, back to the first dollar, get taxed at the maximum rate.
duck, though
oy i can’t type before wine, let alone after
Nom,
Check out the Metropolitan Commuter Transportation Mobility Tax (the “Mobility Tax”). NY passed it earlier this year. The tax is intended to support NYC’s subway and bus system. The way the law is drafted, however, all individual partners of any business with a location in NYC must pay the tax — whether those partners live or work in NYC or not, or in the US or not.
shore… 214 WTF???
Maybe I need to go drink more…
sl
http://www.tax.state.ny.us/sbc/mta.htm
The metropolitan commuter transportation mobility tax (MCTMT) is a new tax imposed on certain employers and self-employed individuals engaging in business within the metropolitan commuter transportation district (MCTD). This department administers the tax for the Metropolitan Transportation Authority. (The MCTD includes the counties of New York (Manhattan), Bronx, Kings (Brooklyn), Queens, Richmond (Staten Island), Rockland, Nassau, Suffolk, Orange, Putnam, Dutchess, and Westchester.)
sl,
I saw a te shirt recently that said: I work hard because millions on welfare are depending on me.
I supose one could substitute a rafdt of programs for “welfare” and hit the target.
Shore 217
“the way the law is drafted, however, all individual partners of any business with a location in NYC
WTF is this??? If my company is based in NJ (corporate office) and we staff ERs in NY…. do all of us (including those of us who only work in NJ) get whacked with this too? Most of us are partners in the company and each year the “only NJ” folks fill out a group tax form that the company files…. We are incorporated in NJ and NY though as far as our corporate structure goes.
WTF??? I gotta call our in house financial guy and find out what’s up.
sl
Seneca [208] Glad I gave you a laugh. I must admit I only knew Clark from driving through it, and was just pointing out towns in that general area that aren’t towns people think of as “nice” or “desireable” but that aren’t gang-infested rat holes either. I suppose there are shades of difference between the towns I mentioned, but still the general point stands — none of them are really that bad.
OT for debate or input by anybody with an “in” with Miss Manners.
Couple lives together through a pregnancy and birth of beautiful child. They undergo a legal marriage for insurance purposes. Baby is now walking and talking. Mom uses married name on Facebook, and for all other purposes.
“Marriage” is announced. Shower for “bride-to-be” is planned, listing bride’s maiden name and including registry info. “Wedding” will be held in December.
Note by my quotes that I’m not fully buying in to the process. Do they just assume that nobody cares? Do they not care if anybody cares? Is this not even important?
Can the resident Ann Landers tell me if I need happy pills?
stu,
if this healthcare thing falls through and nothing gets done, those same people screaming at the town halls will be the first to start throwing rocks. And they’ll never make the connection.
If your company is a partnership and has even a single partner in ny every partner, regardless of where they live, work, get their income, is on the hook to NY for the commuter tax. Imagine how national and international law firms, accounting firms, and the like who have anhy ny presence are getting hammered by this. Partners in London, Chicago, etc. are all now being taxed to reduce transit fees in NY.
220, Shore,
That’s awesome! I was pissing and moaning today about the increase in “self pay” medicaid and charity care we are seeing… it works out to between 30%-40% of all ER patients…
Days like this I am eternally grateful for my ancestors great sense of humor….now where did I put that f’in bottle of scotch….
sl
sl,
I would consult some competent tax attorneys who know this law.
sl,
It almost makes success worth it, huh?
read up, and enjoy:
http://www.tax.state.ny.us/wt/mta_partner.htm
Which politician’s picture do I get to hang on my target for my next “Bullet Hole” outing for this ass f*cking?
I really, really need a drink now.
Dare I ask what the percentage is on this tax??
sl
223.
there is legal marriage which people may have to do quickly for reasons like you stated. Then, there is the ceremony, vows and celebration with family and friends. I’m betting they shelled out a lot over the years for wedding prezzies and shower gifts. Why be so pedantic?
Well, F*ck me.
I need a cash business NOW.
sl
sl,
it is less than 1/2 percent. To which we should be grateful I suppose. Of course, who is to say it won’t be a greater percentage “for the rich” before long.
Have a drink.
Barbara, I’m just wondering why the same celebration and gift giving could not be accomplished by having a two year anniversary party with a vow renewal ceremony?
Question for the board – my inlaws received the following letter from their mortgage company. They spoke to their broker and he said they could get a fixed rate of 5%, but they were curious if they should take the adjustable terms anyways. any advice/explanation appreciated…btw – they owe more on the house now than when they originally bought in ’86…drives my wife nuts.
INTEREST RATE CHANGE NOTICE
Effective with your 11-01-09 payment, the interest rate on your adjustable rate mortgage will change from 5.000% to 3.250%.
The interest rate adjustment is the result of a change in the current index which is the 1 YEAR WEEKLY AVERAGE TREASURY SECURITY, available 45 days prior to the interest change date. Since your interest is paid in arrears on your loan, your interest rate is effective one month prior to the payment date shown above. Your present interest rate was based on an index value of 2.23000 and the new interest rate was based on an index value of 0.47000, which was published 08-17-09.
Your new interest rate was calculated by adding the new index to the margin of 2.75000, then rounding to the nearest .12500% (if applicable). Your loan may have an interest cap provision limiting your new interest to 3.25000%
PRINCIPAL AND INTEREST PAYMENT CHANGE NOTICE
Effective with your 11-01-09 payment, your new principal and interest payment will be $xxx. Please note: This amount excludes deposits for taxes and insurance. Additionally, if your loan has an interest only period that has not expired, your new payment reflects your interest only amount and does not include principal.
The new principal and interest payment in determined by computing the amount necessary to repay the projected principal balance of $XXX (assuming all payments due prior to that date have been made) over the remaining term of 288 months at the new interest rate.
still_lookimg:
You are pretty wound up tonite. Hope everything is OK.
237.shaw212 says:
September 1, 2009 at 10:37 pm
shaw: With the amount of info you gave, it is the equivalent of saying….I’m driving 60 mph…should I speed up or slow down? Answer: not enough info
anytime i hear that the rate is going to be 3.25% I get a little suspicious
Sharing Queen Elizabeth’s deafness
The Queen’s financial portfolio shot up in the boom, yet she never asked whether this was justified or sustainable. Only after her portfolio lost $135 million did she ask why nobody had predicted the downturn. She typifies the millions of suckers who asked no questions when blinded by euphoria in the boom, and then indignantly demanded explanations in the subsequent bust.
223- You just described my situation.
We anticipate at some point to have a church wedding and the big party. Personally, I’m not of the sort to expect any gifts because the party is so that all our guests know that we consider them family and want to celebrate with them. I consider registries conveniences for brides/moms to be etc so that they don’t have to go through a lot of returns- not mandates for guests. I guess that’s not even the question though.
If you’re getting a meal and free booze, someone’s paying and if you like them at all you throw them a few bucks. I’m not Miss Manners material though.
Barbara said it better then me.
AH, 236
I’m okay. I just feel like most of the folks here who recognize how f’d up things are in our state/country.
I am seeing more and more family and friends who are getting reamed by this economy.
The latest casualty is our cousin who is unemployed. Divorcing. and now probably has to sell his house as he can’t afford it. Just found this out tonight. He’s in construction, like my husband, and unlikely to find work in the near future.
I have a heap of other smaller miseries that are just wearing on me as well.
But, thanks for asking. I’m just longing for the days when my life was simple and uncomplicated.
sl
240.shawn212 says:
September 1, 2009 at 10:53 pm
anytime i hear that the rate is going to be 3.25% I get a little suspicious
shawn: completely legit..but subject to change as per the contrace…hence the value of the 5% if appropriate in context
Still- I got a call from our Chicago Office about this tax today. It doesn’t even make sense. There are 4 of us in NYC. There are 30 in Chicago. I got the impression that they have to pay the tax based on all of us.
contrace = contract
“I need a cash business NOW”
the call car service pays well.
but, believe it or not, the gay male service pays out 2-3x.
no taxes. low overhead. but, need to find a safe & dependable driver.
free markets still exist…somewhere.
SAS
“call girl”
so, if you have a cute 20 year old, whom all of a sudden seems to have extra cash. best check the adult section on the CL.
SAS
then again, if you are feeling good..
there is always a good black market on tires & timber in the middle east.
that was always a fun gig.
SAS
Seems like everybody drinking heavily these days…………
I can’t wait to see the posts here when your Great Hope Chris Christie acts like the other Christie and borrows-and-spends us into complete oblivion, then takes a job in the Palin administration and leaves the mess for someone else to clean up.