Bend Over NJ

From Bloomberg:

Christie’s Cuts May Push N.J. Property Tax Up 8%

New Jersey property tax bills, the highest in the U.S., may rise an average of $600 to make up for Governor Chris Christie’s proposed cuts in school and municipal aid, the state Senate budget committee chairman said.

Towns and schools may boost taxes as much as 8.2 percent as they seek to replace lost funding, Senator Paul Sarlo, a Democrat from Wood-Ridge, said at a hearing in Trenton today. The average property levy was $7,281 last year, according to state data.

“This is going to be a seismic shift onto property taxes,” Sarlo said in an interview. “They are being asked to shoulder a larger burden this year.”

Christie, 47, a Republican who took office Jan. 19, seeks to close a $10.7 billion deficit without raising taxes. His $29.3 billion spending plan would lower state aid to education by $820 million and trim municipal aid by $445 million.

Sarlo’s projected increase may exceed a 4 percent cap on school- and municipal-tax growth enacted in 2007, he said. That law contained a provision allowing schools and towns to go beyond the limit to replace state aid cuts. Christie has said he’d make dollar-for-dollar reductions in funding to towns that go over the cutoff.

Governments will need to be creative and find savings by firing workers, eliminating programs and sharing or consolidating services, Lori Grifa, acting commissioner of the Department of Community Affairs, told Sarlo’s committee.

“We’re asking these entities to control their spending just because the state’s not in a position to send the monies that we have in the past,” Grifa said.

New Jersey’s tax bills went up an average of 3.3 percent last year, the smallest jump since 1999, Grifa’s agency said in February. Property taxes are New Jersey’s primary source of funds for schools and local government.

Christie plans to seek a constitutional amendment to cap future property tax increases at 2.5 percent, with little or no room for exemptions, Drewniak said.

This entry was posted in New Jersey Real Estate, Property Taxes. Bookmark the permalink.

540 Responses to Bend Over NJ

  1. Nomad says:

    1st? TGIF

  2. grim says:

    From the Philly Inquirer:

    Last day for home buyer tax credits

    Friday is “C” Day, the last day home buyers can sign sales agreements to qualify for the federal tax credits.

    As the clock ticked – Prudential Fox & Roach’s Web site actually has a digital timepiece counting down the hours, minutes, and seconds to midnight – it was clear the push toward the deadline has been feverish.

    “The last few weeks have been astounding,” said Prudential Fox & Roach agent Jeff Block, and sales have been booming because buyers assume that the credits will not be renewed. “We advise our buyers to use the credit if they find the right home.”

    Builder Marshal Granor, a principal in Granor Price Homes, said the company’s “Let’s Make A Deal” weekends this month, scheduled to coincide with the credit deadline, boosted sales at its communities in Royersford and Bensalem.

    “The concept worked,” Granor said. “Of course, I would have liked to sell out entirely, but we created the buzz we wanted.”

    What is virtually certain as the government incentive winds down is that these tax credits will be the last.

    “There will be no others,” said Moody’s chief economist Mark Zandi. “Even the National Association of Realtors is not advocating an extension.”

    One reason, economists agree, is that the credits are costing the government billions in lost revenue and further deepening the deficit.

  3. Final Doom says:

    Meh. The housing market is DOA. All this is a drop in the bucket.

    The forty years in the wilderness has begun.

    First stop, oblivion.

  4. Final Doom says:

    In about another year, there will be four giant mortgage lenders in Amerika. All the correspondents and brokers will be forced out.

    Take your pick, victims: BAC, WFC, JPM or C. Prepare for about 4-5 points that need to be embedded in your loan- even if you have a 680+ FICO- and get ready to document everything short of your breathing patterns.

  5. 30 year realtor says:

    Simple equation: Anything that causes PITI to go up will cause prices to go down! Property taxes and interest rates are only headed up! Prices can only be going DOWN!

  6. safeashouses says:

    WE talk about how the tax credit brought demand forward, but how much inventory did it bring forward as well?

  7. Final Doom says:

    safe (6)-

    Crank up those bulldozers.

    However, you can also expect a massive, new housing stim by 1/1/11. When they see how hard the market crashes after the current stim expires (especially with a November election to get through), no amount of giveaway will seem too great to TPTB.

    Remember, in “responsible” Australia, there are places where you can get up to 40K of stim for buying a house. Don’t think Kongress won’t point to that when they jam the next program through.

  8. Final Doom says:

    Market crash after the stim expires? Hell, it’s crashed now.

  9. safeashouses says:

    #7 Doom,

    What’s funny is that Australia also loosened up its rules to make it easier for foreigners to purchase homes. It seems that Chinese form Hong Kong and Mainland China are buying places for cash, but not moving to Australia and letting the places sit vacant.

  10. whatcrash says:

    It is 2005 all over again. Proof:MLS#: 2767109

  11. safeashouses says:

    I was at an open house 3 weeks ago. The agent told me if i had any interest I had to make an offer because they were expecting to get multiple offers that day Well I guess those offers didn’t work out cause I just got an email showing the list price dropped 10k. The house is now down 50k from it’s original list in January, plus has had about 10k of work done because it fell out of contract because it needed a bit of work.

    tick tock

    Only 17 hours and 38 minutes left for the credit.

  12. whatcrash says:

    11 house
    I was told the same thing many times. Often the agent wasn’t lying.

  13. Final Doom says:

    Meh. Multiple offers on a place that’s dropped 35-40% from peak pricing isn’t impressive. It’s just a sign that the vast majority of NJ’s inventory is priced to fantasy.

    It’s actually not difficult to sell a house that’s properly priced to market…even in this environment. The problem is that virtually no seller is willing to price properly.

  14. Final Doom says:

    One lesson not taught in NJ schools:

    Your first loss is your best loss.

  15. Yikes says:

    bunch of pu$$ies in Arizona

    One change to the bill strengthens restrictions against using race or ethnicity as the basis for questioning and inserts those same restrictions in other parts of the law.

    Changes to the bill language will actually remove the word “solely” from the sentence, “The attorney general or county attorney shall not investigate complaints that are based solely on race, color or national origin.”

    Another change replaces the phrase “lawful contact” with “lawful stop, detention or arrest” to apparently clarify that officers don’t need to question a victim or witness about their legal status.

    A third change specifies that police contact over violations for local civil ordinances can trigger questioning on immigration status.

  16. Confused in NJ says:

    LONDON – Men in Iceland and women in Cyprus have the lowest risk of dying worldwide, a new study says.

    In a survey from 1970 to 2010, researchers found a widening gap between countries with the highest and lowest premature death rates in adults aged 15 to 60. The study was published Friday in the medical journal, Lancet.

    The findings are in contrast to the trends in child and maternal mortality, where rates are mostly dropping worldwide. Health officials have long thought if child deaths were decreasing and health systems were improving, adult deaths would similarly decline. But that’s not what researchers found.

    “The new analysis challenges the common theories,” wrote Ai Koyanagi and Kenji Shibuya of the department of global health policy at the University of Tokyo, in an accompanying commentary. They were not linked to the study. Koyanagi and Shibuya said it wasn’t clear why there were such major differences among countries in adult deaths.

    Researchers in Australia and the U.S. calculated death rates in 187 countries using records from government registries, censuses, household surveys and other sources. It was paid for by the Bill & Melinda Gates Foundation.

    Only a few countries have cut death rates by more than 2 percent per year in the last 40 years: Australia, Italy, South Korea, Chile, Tunisia and Algeria. The U.S. lagged significantly behind, dropping to 49th in the rankings for women and 45th for men. That puts it behind all of Western Europe as well as countries including Peru, Chile and Libya.

    “The U.S. is definitely on the wrong trajectory,” said Chris Murray, director of the Institute for Health Metrics at the University of Washington, one of the study’s authors. “(The US) spends the most on health out of all countries, but (it) is apparently spending on the wrong things.”

    Murray said they weren’t sure why some countries — like Australia and South Korea — were particularly successful in reducing death rates, but guessed better policies on things like tobacco control and road accidents might be responsible.

    Death rates were highest for men in Swaziland and for women in Zambia. Researchers also found death rates jumped in eastern Europe, perhaps because health systems fell apart after the collapse of the Soviet Union and widespread smoking. In sub-Saharan Africa, deaths have fallen, possibly due to the rollout of lifesaving AIDS drugs.

    Murray said adult deaths have largely been neglected by the U.N., except for AIDS and tuberculosis programs. “We need to recognize just how bad things are getting in some parts of the world,” he said.

  17. meter says:

    I’m taking a long position in cat food as realtors come to the hard realization that the fatted $8000 calf has been slaughtered.

  18. JJ says:

    Funny realtor called me on a home that is now back to 1998 pricing. However, town has how assessed at 2006 prices with sky high taxes so guy still can’t sell and now is short selling it. Guy bought it in 1997 and took a big home equity loan in 2006 to remodel it.

    Amazing a guy buys a home in 1997, only refinances to remodel home and is losing house 13 years later.

    Best part house is for sale at one million. Assessed for taxes at 1.9 million. Oh yea town has set taxes already for 2010,2011, 2012 and 2013 so if you win your grievance your taxes fall in 2014. At 35K a year, the four years of taxes alone are 140K IF you win. Talk about a dog.

  19. homeboken says:

    Last year NJ taxes increased 3.3%, the smallest increase since 1999???? Jesus, I don’t think I ever want to own in this state.

  20. Anon E. Moose says:


    even if you have a 680+ FICO- and get ready to document everything short of your breathing patterns.

    Probably not what you’re looking for, but AMEN!

    Would you like the number for Truck Masters? (For your employees, of course…)

  21. frank says:

    Looking to rent for free??

    House Democrats Introduce Right-to-Rent Bill for Borrowers Facing Foreclosure

  22. safeashouses says:

    #12 whatcrash

    I’ve seen lots of bidding wars. Places that have been HGTV’d seem to fly, no matter if they are in a flood plain or have structural issues. I’ll take a house with 1982 decor that is structurally sound over a bling bling house with a crumbling foundation, the yard is in a flood zone, sagging roof, attic door doesn’t close, etc.

    In my neighborhood, a small 3 bedroom bling bling house that appears to be structurally sound attracted 10 offers the first weekend it was on the market.

  23. Anon E. Moose says:


    …attracted 10 offers the first weekend it was on the market.

    I’m confident that each and every house listed on the MLS grabs at least 3-5 true lowballs sight-unseen from professional all-cash investors at 35-50% under current market value regardless of ask. Its a numbers game to them, and it doesn’t cost them anything but a fax to make the offer and they have zero investment in any one offer.

    So when their used house sales flack says ‘we’ve got multiple offers’ they want you to believe its a a full fire bidding war when (as is so often the case) that would be a lie.

    Let the owner pack up the house on their backs and take it to Florida with them if its worth so much. And let their ramen-eating mouthpiece go back on the pole.

  24. meter says:

    Got Fancy Feast?

  25. Mr Hyde says:


    from last night
    Where can I get one of those black riot police outfits along with a helmet?

    try US Calvary

  26. Final Doom says:

    Steve Lies-man, pouring it on thick over the GDP numbers.

    What a whore.

  27. House Whine says:

    24- Fancy Feast is too expensive. Meow Mix dry cat food I can afford.

  28. Mr Hyde says:


    GDP growth less government spending has not exceeded 2% since 2001. GDP growth less government spending is currently below -10%. The formal definition for a depression is a drop in GDP of 10% or greater.

    Prior to 2001 GDP less government spending was regularly between 2% – 6%

    Since 2001 government spending has bee the major contributor that has kept GDP in the “normal” range. At this point any withdrawal of government spending means pretty much instant depression.

    I wonder how they withdraw the government spending support of GDP when They continually increasing the size of the government sector while decreasing the size of the private sector. Without private sector job growth there is no way for them to pull back government spending.

    Have some more hopium!

  29. All "H-Train" Hype says:

    Doom 26:

    Liesman is perfect for CNBC. He has some knowledge for minimal credibility but really just parrots what he is told.

    Seriously, my mother now knows that the increase in spending is directly related to the fact that people are no longer required to pay their mortgages.

  30. #29 – Buy a home now, before rates go up.

    You know, there’s an implication to asset pricing in your statement that I’m not sure you understand.

  31. Mr Hyde says:


    Dont worry a few of my pharma clients source their raw materials exclusively from china.

  32. Shore Guy says:

    “I’ll take a house with 1982 decor that is structurally sound over a bling bling house with a crumbling foundation, the yard is in a flood zone, sagging roof, attic door doesn’t close, etc.”


    For Pete’s sake. Please, knock it off. Get with the program and focus on what is important. People like you are inflicting unnecessary amounts of logic and it is hurting RE agents everywhere.

    Stop thinking of them as hpuses that flood, and start thinking of them as having thr added feature of a seasonal moat.

  33. NJGator says:

    Safe – Here’s one house that didn’t sell in GR last weekend. Here’s the nice little love note I got from the listing agent…

    Dear XXXX;
    Thank you for stopping by my Open House at 163 Carteret St, Glen Ridge last Sunday April 25th.

    If you have any questions about this house please feel free to contact me at any time.

    I would also like to invite to come again to see the house or show it to someone you know that might be willing to buy or sell a house. I’ll be hosting another open house this next Sunday from 2-4pm at the same property.

    Best regards,


  34. Mr Hyde says:

    Now we know where NJ gets its play book from:

    <i.Union officials told Reuters on Thursday the International Monetary Fund had asked Athens to raise sales taxes, scrap bonuses amounting to two extra months of pay in the public sector, and accept a three-year pay freeze.

    Other measures in the 24 billion euro package include raising the retirement age from an average of 53 to 67, the FT said in its Friday edition.

  35. safeashouses says:

    #35 Shore Guy,

    My bad. I was in a house a few weeks ago and during a brief rain storm I got to see the crawl space turn into a waterfall. So pretty.

  36. All "H-Train" Hype says:

    Shiny just hit $1178.

  37. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “The problem is that virtually no seller is willing to price properly.”

    Am i wrong for thinking that half the problem is that sellers are purposely being misinformed by the agents who are doing everything they can to keep the diluision alive?

    90% of the realtors out there have no shame in the toxicity that comes pouring out of their pie holes. The sad thing is that i probably would believe it myself if i didnt spend 30% of my waking day tuned into an informative re blog. We cant expect the avg person to read through the bs. For this reason, RE Agency needs serious regulation reforms.

    Ive said before, a stock broker would be arrested for saying half the stuff that comes out of the avg realtors mouth every day. I’m appalled they have taken no blame and instead continue to cry out for more manipulation. By this measure, as an industry, they are not less arrogant or blatant than GS.

  38. JJ says:

    Overpriced bond of the day.

    Fifth Third Bank, FITB 8.2500 03/01/38 NOTES 8.25% DTD 03/04/2008 MTY 03/01/2038

    BTW ChiFI rated this bond a sell ten months ago at 79, I disagreed, but even I never thought it would be at 112 in under one year. This bond bull market is long in the tooth by at least three months.

  39. safeashouses says:

    #36 gator,’s

    Tell her if she’s serving cookies and German beer I might drop by.

  40. WTF says:

    H.R.5168 – To amend the Internal Revenue Code of 1986 to extend the first-time homebuyer tax credit through December 31, 2010, and for other purposes.

  41. NJGator says:

    It’s quite a deal Safe. Only $569k….and just steps away from a former Superfund site.

    When you click on the link below, there is a link to “View Facility Information”. You can then zoom in on streets and click on the green and yellow dots to get street addresses. Fun stuff.

  42. Final Doom says:

    hyde (31)-

    Watch the withdrawal spasms of our junkie economy when the housing tax stim ends. That will be a good tell on how well the junkie will continue to function as the methadone doses get ratcheted down.

    By 1/1/11, the junkie will be back to mainlining.

  43. Kitty says:

    Here’s a question. Why list your home 5% higher than what you paid for it in 2006? Public records show what you paid at the height of the market? To boot, no updating was done. The Linoleum floor is still ugly.

    What is wrong with realtors. I regularly see home prices reduced by 75k. Realtors are the problem. You can move a home if it is priced properly.

  44. joyce says:

    What are your thoughts on someone buying in a market like Florida where certain areas have either bottomed or pretty damn close? If you can get a 3-4bed new-ish house for 80-100k… would you still say avoid it? because in 20-40 years it will be cheaper, at relatively?

  45. joyce says:

    at LEAST relatively

  46. Final Doom says:

    gator (36)-

    You should send that agent a nice note back & let her know that she should spend her Sundays doing something that makes money.

  47. Cindy says:

    Here is Denniger’s take on the GDP #s and he isn’t happy.

  48. safeashouses says:

    #45 gator

    That site is so cool.

    Since when is radium bad for you? It’s all natural isn’t it? So what if it’s half life is 1602 years and it decays into radon gas.

  49. safeashouses says:

    #50 Doom,

    don’t most agents use open houses to land new buying clients?

  50. Final Doom says:

    joyce (48)-

    I’d say any of the sand state markets that dropped fast and hard should be at or near their bottoms.

    Without being an expert in any of those markets, I’d issue a guarded “buy”, on the condition that:

    -the local gubmints aren’t complete toast
    -the local property tax structure hasn’t completely imploded
    -insurance rates haven’t gone parabolic (big problem in FL)
    -cash investors haven’t crowded out the owner-occ buying market
    -the property you want to buy isn’t part of a PUD or condo that’s insolvent or in pitched legal battles with the developer

    I could probably pull another 10 caveats, but you get the drift. A low price does not necessarily constitute a deal.

    Caveat emptor.

  51. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    The ‘Duration’ of home prices changes to int rate changes is roughly 10-20%.

    So, expect home prices to get slammed 15% for every 1 percentage point rise in mortgage rates.

    Higher taxes will only multiply this effect.

    In summary, prepare to buy homes for a dollar.

  52. NJGator says:

    Safe 53 – Thanks. I have a friend who is a safety engineer. The minute she heard we were looking in Glen Ridge, she forwarded it to me.

  53. Final Doom says:

    veto (56)-

    Historically, the duration rate is closer to 10% in the NE.

  54. joyce says:

    appreciate it thanks

  55. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    ok doom, we go with that assumption then.

    What is the duration of prop taxes doubling every year for a decade in NE?

  56. Shore Guy says:

    Right to Rent, the perfect solution for reducing downward pressure on home prices.

    Buyer B is interested in a house and finds one offered by seller S. B offers S top dollar, thus squeezing out other potential purchasers, maybe even offers more than the listing price. B obtains a loan with the least possible amount down, then either never makes a payment or stops after a short time. Lender L sends B a FK notice and B says, “convert it to a rental.”

    We all have observed how rental prices are far less than purchase prices in so many areas, so, under this Bill, a third party will look at market rents and set a rental fee based on market conditions. This will likely be far less than the mortgage amount.

    Except for the bagholder tax payers, everyone is happy.

  57. Mr Hyde says:

    Safe 53

    as a VERY rough rule of thumb, the shorter the half-life the worse the radiation, as it tends to be more energetic.

    Remember the radium girls? google it, SFW

  58. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    does anyone know if ppt is open today?
    I need to know whether to buy or sell stocks.

  59. Shore Guy says:

    “radium girls?”

    I saw them opening for the Runaways many years ago an again opening for the B-52s a few years later.

  60. Mr Hyde says:

    Gator , safe

    Also realize that companies only report a fraction of their real emissions/spills. I know this first hand.

  61. Shore Guy says:


    PUD? What is this?

  62. Shore Guy says:


    The same is true of off-shore oil platform accidents. Unless required to disclose, thecompanies tend not to in order to avoid negative market responses.

  63. safeashouses says:

    #63 hyde

    Radium girls. Give it a licken and you stop ticken.

    I thought something similar happened in Switzerland also?

  64. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “Historically, the duration rate is closer to 10% in the NE.”

    Doom, actually im glad you mentioned this, it brings up the effects of Convexity which i originally didnt want to get into.

    In the real world, the price changes to interest rate changes are not linear, like duration suggests, so we need to talk about price changes as if they are curvelinear.

    Which basically says that prices will fall way harder when rates move from 5 to 7% than they will when rates move from 15% to 17%.

    thats prob why there is such a wide variety of price change forecasts in relation to rate changes (10-20%).

    But lets stick with the 10% for NE and forget about convexity altogether. I always like a more conservative approach and this is just a rough estimate anyway.

  65. Shore Guy says:


    Did you catch the Bloom County links I posted yesterday? One was a link to the “Pear pimples for hairy fishnuts” strip. Another was a Carmen Mirandized Opus.

  66. Final Doom says:

    Shore (67)-

    Planned unit development.

  67. Shore Guy says:

    Ahhhh. I hate that kind of place. No PUDs for me.

  68. Final Doom says:

    veto (70)-

    I think the convexity has much more to do with the relative health of the economy at the time and with good, old-fashioned human fight/flight behavior.

    IMO, you can’t model for what’s about to happen.

  69. Final Doom says:

    How do you model housing in an environment in which default is not only an option, but an option which is both prudent and viable?

  70. Mr Hyde says:


    people would be shocked what and how much gets dumped down the drain straight to the municipal sewers. or for that matter how much active pharmaceutical ingredients get tossed into municipal garbage instead of destroyed.

    Now consider that most of these products are designed to be highly bioactive at very low levels.

  71. Shore Guy says:

    In mod, no bad words.

  72. yo'me says:

    #55 I could probably pull another 10 caveats, but you get the drift. A low price does not necessarily constitute a deal.

    Best advice I heard from you!

  73. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “How do you model housing in an environment in which default is not only an option, but an option which is both prudent and viable?”

    Well, we can model to an asymetric bell curve that sets the expected return to zero, giving us a 50% chance that prices will go negative.

    Would that get us in the ball park?

  74. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Doom, if we adjust the level of significance enough, we can back into the assumption that prices staying anywhere over zero within ten years time is considered an extremely unlikely outlier event with a probability less than .01%.

    This is what i call ‘modeling for doom’.

  75. Final Doom says:

    veets (79)-

    You’re the math guy. I just deal with deadbeats and banks all day.

  76. Final Doom says:

    veets (80)-

    I started modeling for doom three years ago.

    In the ensuing time, I have seen nothing to convince me to change my prediction.

  77. Jamal Van Jones says:

    If you think real estate in NJ is expensive, see what $6K in rent per month gets you in Mumbai –

  78. Painhrtz says:

    Shore had the same problem this morning gave up

  79. Alap says:


    That Cap One 10.25% sucker you had as your bond of the day few months back, its up to 120.

    Thanks for that one :-)

  80. Painhrtz says:

    hyde all the oestrogens in the surface and ground water make girly men, and girls becoming fully developed by 12. I would hate to be 18 and dating these days you need to ask for a birth certificate and two proofs of identity or else your going to end up in jail

  81. Mr Hyde says:

    Pain 86

    I already proposed the solution. Engineer some standard bacteria to produce testosterone and release them into the wild. problem solved. Plus the hair removal industry will see a big boom a few years after initial release.

  82. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    82 – yeah well unfortunately you’ve called a lot of pretty accurate stuff so far prob using more reliable methods than quants.

    thats prob what scares me most about your predictions.
    Even if you’re half wrong, we are still royally fcked.

  83. meter says:

    India is going to come crashing down like a ton of bricks as US companies start understanding and quantifying the true cost of running their businesses from offshore worker labor.

    My company invested a sh!t-ton in opening a very large offshore branch in India, only to realize a year or so later that the lower productivity, lags in getting products to market, language barriers, etc. weren’t worth the trouble – especially as salaries and expectations there started increasing exponentially.

    If used in the right situations and if locations are chosen carefully though, offshoring can be a net positive.

  84. House Hunter says:

    NJ Coast on Bush, sounds Bilderberg-ish to me

  85. Mr Hyde says:


    Give me a college level bio lab 2 or 3 lab guys and i bet we could have a full scale release prepared within 3-4 months.

    The real challenge is ensuring the modified bacteria testosterone production is genetically stable.

  86. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “as US companies start understanding and quantifying the true cost of running their businesses from offshore”

    Meter, yeah outsourcing made more sense when the avg american could find a $75k job with no more than a ged.

    In this new economy of lower, more sustainable growth and higher ue, the everage us worker is willing to work 30% harder for 40% less money.

  87. Mr Hyde says:


    I’m thinking S. Aureus could be a good candidate, how about you?

  88. Shore Guy says:

    “Bend Over, NJ”
    It could be a town name.

    Which brings me to another thought: Perhaps NJ towns should sell naming rights.

    We could have the Borough of Life B0y, the City of McD0n@lds, the Town of N@ir, the Summer$ Eve Regional School District
    Heck, we sold the naming rights to Gl@ssboro College to a HVAC company. It may be time to extend the concept.

    “Today the NJ Supreme Court, brought to you by Pil$bury, issued a decision in…”

    Rivers, creeks, and Bays could all be up for grabs. Hate someone? Find a fetid pond and name it after them.

    It could be a gold mine.

  89. Painhrtz says:

    hyde don’t even want to get back on that disussion we know how it went last time. Anybody interested use the search function for testosterone

  90. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    I thought this was significant.

    Although we’ve seen some certain signs of stability in recent months we’re also beginning to see some signals that could be forecasting the next leg down in the housing market. The following chart shows the housing loan performance index compared to the Case Shiller data. Loan performance has already started to turn south and Case Shiller data is only just beginning to show continued signs of weakness.

  91. Painhrtz says:

    S. aureus has been shown to be a easily modified bacterium, but I think using gm’d fungus, mold or algae would probably be more effective in moist and aquatiic environments. the problem is you have to come up with an environmental agonist to halt the effects when you reach the desired level of action.

    See bearded ladies looking like East German Olympians from researched thread

  92. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    In our 2010 outlook I said the government’s stimulus programs would continue to bolster asset prices (including equities). But with the housing tax credit coming to a close in the next few days it’s finally time to take a look at these markets for what they really are and not what the government has been making them out to be. In other words, the laws of supply and demand will come back to some semblance of reality.

  93. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    We’ve seen an incredible surge in lumber prices over the last year as builders have ramped up demand and supply has remained tight. The index (below, click to enlarge) has risen almost 50% in 2010 alone. Demand for housing starts has remained quite strong and the homebuilders have been eager to continue adding supply to the market as they attempt to remain afloat. The surge in lumber prices is consistent with the high levels of supply in the market. The builders are making the problems worse. While this has been viewed as a near-term positive it is likely contributing to the long-term structural problems in housing as supply remains far too high.

  94. Shore Guy says:

    “signs of weakness”

    Music to the ears of every prudent person out there who is looking for a house. Until people who should not have bought places that they did downsize and find a place to live that is within their means, the nation’s economy will not get moving. We are diverting so many resources, both time and money, on keeping people in places they have no right being, and preventing banks from taking losses they earned, that we are distracting ourselves from being productive.

  95. Shore Guy says:

    The motto of Gambino, NJ.

    We are all family here, so don’t even think of cheating on your taxes. Bad things happen to people who don’t pay up.

  96. Mr Hyde says:


    No problem, and good points. We can go with an algae and insert a terminator gene, thereby necessitating an occasional re-release and acting as a built in control. You also design the organism to produce at low levels. Dont forget that the testosterone is environmentally unstable and doesnt tend to be persistent at high levels.

    Choose a non prolific strain, because as monsanto has show GMO’s tend to spread regardless of what safeties you put in place.

  97. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Veto 96 Noticed that chart also. They track almost dead on since 2001. (don’t know about prior to)If they continue to trend the same & I see no reason they should not, well you know.

  98. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “I see no reason they should not, well you know…”

    mike, what? crash down to the bottom of the lake of fire?
    yeah i agree.

  99. Painhrtz says:

    Hyde encapsulated testosterone would be the only way you could get it to work as free range. Getting it to be free range with an effective MOA is difficult at best. Remember to have a high medicinal effect testosterones and there derivatives are best taken subcutaneously.

    OK – get enough science at work.

  100. relo says:

    75: In addition to prudent and viable, it’s being encouraged i.e. post 21 and the FHA, etc. reduction in lending standards.

    And here I thought our best option was to relocate and get a job w/ prospects. I could have just stayed in the house, stopped paying and followed John’s tips w/ the “savings”. With the tax environment here, probably would have been a net win over 5-10 yrs.

  101. Anon E. Moose says:


    AMEN. Where can I send a donation to that church?

  102. Mikeinwaiting says:

    “mike, what? crash down to the bottom of the lake of fire?”

    Around here I’d say that is about right.
    The world is ending go in peace. Well maybe not if Hyde & Pain can get that testosterone thing worked out & implemented.

  103. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:

    Gold is 1180. Got Federal Reserve Notes?

    I read an article this morning saying China gets the hint about currency revaulation. It also mentioned a G20 meeting. Cant find the dam article anymore. Anyone read it on Reuters?

  104. Juice Box says:

    Seems the MSM did not report on yesterday’s rally downtown.

  105. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:

    In mod, forgot to edit “shoulder fired”

  106. Bystander says:

    30 year realtor,

    In a year, houses will follow the air filter model. Give away the core system for practically nothing..but the parts and service will kill ya.

  107. relo says:

    This couldn’t have found it’s way into the healthcare bill here?

  108. Final Doom says:

    shore (100)-

    Classic definition of malinvestment.

  109. Bystander says:

    Booya, reality finally strikes one seller in the Connecticut town I am looking in. I have been waiting for one, freaking asking price deduction in two months for houses in 600K range. The house is next to MLK blvd and sellers finally dropped the price 20G after 5 months of no price adjustments. Too bad I not living next to MLK blvd for $500K. Good luck pal.

  110. Final Doom says:

    al (110)-

    Did those Chinese kids stop laughing at Eraserhead yet?

    “I read an article this morning saying China gets the hint about currency revaulation.”

    The only thing the Chinese understand is that they must be more furtive in their actions.

  111. zieba says:

    GS PR campaign in full swing:

    They posted a chronological case outline of we were not net short the country during the bubble on their web page. Also up are internal email threads.

  112. meter says:

    Re: gold discussion yesterday. The point wasn’t to get into a p!ssing match posting daily gold prices whether up or down.

    It was already acknowledged that as a short-term play it’s probably a good wager.

  113. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    Tax News of the Day:

    Obama tells us a fee is not a tax.

    Until it applies to the feds.

    “D.C. ‘Impervious Surface’ Fee to Fund
    Storm Water Control Project Irks Feds

    Two federal agencies have indicated that they do not intend to pay a new fee imposed by the District of Columbia on landowners’ impervious surfaces, a fee intended to fund construction of a court-mandated $2.6 billion storm water disposal system.

    With the prospect of their agencies having to pay the fee starting in 2011, the Defense Department and the Government Accountability Office told the D.C. Water and Sewer Authority that their agencies will not do so because it is a tax, not a fee for services rendered. State and local governments may not impose taxes on the federal government.

    WASA assessed the fee for the first time in water bills due in May 2009 for district property owners other than the biggest one, the federal government. WASA and the federal government operate on two-year contracts, and the next one opens Jan. 1, 2011.

    WASA Calls Direct Fee for Service

    WASA Director George Hawkins told BNA April 27 that he is confident that he can persuade the agencies that the fee is in fact a charge for services, not a tax. Fee revenue will be used exclusively to build infrastructure to handle storm water coming off owners’ properties, with the charges proportional to the impervious surface owned by the fee payer, he said.
    Capturing the storm water is a service as much as capturing sewage, he suggested. “This is simply not a tax.” . . .”


    “impervious surface fee?” Coming to a NJ municipality near you?

  114. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [111] juice

    Huh? I saw it covered on MSM. You think they would miss that opportunity?

  115. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [71] shore

    Yes, I caught them. And I have some Bloom County books at home, as well as a stuffed Opus packed away somewhere.

    I lost my Steve Dallas shirt though. That really ticked me off.

  116. Simply Ravishing HEHEHE says:

    I had a Bill The Cat shirt

  117. MSP says:

    I’ve been giving some thought to the downsizing effect going on in some of the higher end markets. Seems like there are an awful lot of cash buyers out there (no way to prove this) who are truly keeping a floor under prices in the $500K to $750K market. For example, sell big, paid off house in the very high end part of town and buy a smaller, yet nice house in the less high end part of town with cash. Thoughts?

  118. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [126] HEHEHE

    I still do.

  119. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    Damn, the secret’s out . . .

    “A lawyer reportedly helping Goldman Sachs executives prepare for a Senate hearing today revealed his usual strategy for congressional hearings in an interview last year.

    O’Melveny & Myers partner K. Lee Blalack II told the American Lawyer last March that a congressional hearing room is not a forum for divining the truth, according to The BLT: The Blog of Legal Times. The goal, he said, is minimal damage to reputation.

    “Long, thoughtful pauses followed by rambling nonresponsive answers can easily devour half of a member’s allotted questioning time,” Blalack told the American Lawyer. . . . “

  120. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    More on the edjumacation bubble; if the folks in this program cannot see that they are getting hosed, they don’t deserve to be lawyers. Fortunately, natural selection applies.

    “New Hampshire legislators have approved a new two-year college that is designed as a path to law school for community college students who were onetime underachievers.

    The founder and dean of the new college is Lawrence Velvel, the dean of the Massachusetts School of Law, the Concord Monitor reports. Velvel decided to open his new school in New Hampshire after learning that Massachusetts doesn’t permit colleges that offer only junior- and senior-level classes.

    Velvel hopes the new school will give students from lower economic backgrounds a way to gain entrance to law school.

    “A lot of people think that they cannot go to law school, that there is no way they will be admitted,” Velvel told the Concord Monitor. “It gives a chance to people who otherwise academically wouldn’t have the chance.”

    The name of the new school—the American College of History and Legal Studies—reflects its limited mission; it will award a bachelor’s degree in only history and legal studies, the story says. Tuition is $10,000, lowered to $5,000 for those on a scholarship, and classes will be held only three evenings a week.

    Those who earn good grades can combine their final year at the college with their first year at Massachusetts School of Law. . . .”

    Full disclosure: I did NOT attend MSL.

  121. Fergus says:

    Don’t worry folks, fattie will save you!

  122. Shore Guy says:

    “a stuffed Opus packed away ”

    Packed away? Packed away!

    In the words of P. Opus, “Pffffftttttt!”

    Since the Reagan Administration, I have had an Opus in my office.

  123. Shore Guy says:

    To paraphrase, by updating the numbers by adding another zero, an Opus poster from the latter 80s, “Never trust anyone under $300,000.”

  124. Shore Guy says:


    How is the fingerpicking going?

  125. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “reality finally strikes one seller.”

    reality will finally strike sellers and agents when allows for a comment blog under each and every listing.

  126. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    I have a Bill The Cat doll. Its not cute. This was back during the Garfield rivalry.

  127. A.West says:

    Looks like we’ll be closing on our house next week. Got multiple offers at/near list in our first week, but that’s because we actually focused on what selling prices have been, not what unrealistic list prices have been. And, the house was in good condition, thanks to the tens of thousands of dollars we spent updating/maintaining it over the past 10 yrs. Still, we are basically just getting back our 2000 purchase plus maintenance expense spending upon sale. Dumb neighbors are just letting their For Sale sign rot in their front yard, waiting for 2006 prices.

  128. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [137] barbara

    “Its not cute.”

    That was the idea.

  129. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    Re: Its The Realtors Fault…

    Realtors know that everyone is under water. If they told clients that their properties were worth X amount under the 2005-06 price they paid they would never get listing because not one of thesepeople have 100k to bring to the closing table to even up with the lender and if they DID, they would sooner walk the hell away than just give up 100k out of pocket. And the vast majority of listing that I am interested in are houses that were sold at peak, no bought in 1988 “going to retire now, thanks” houses out there. And for those that bough in say, 2002…they cashed out all equity in 06, so same difference.

    Most of the prudent here will NOT buy a house in a straight forward transaction, it will be a short sale or an auction. So its not the realtor’s fault, its the fault of the banks for holding short properties and not selling them. That’s your “floor.” Realtors just want listings, they are going to say what they need to say to get them.

  130. A.West says:

    I haven’t seen that dynamic. Hard to imagine downsizing in-state and in-town, unless it is going from a house to a rental. Retirees are the natural downsizers, and if I was retiring, I’d get the heck out of NJ, and buy a much less expensive house elsewhere.

  131. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    sorry for those typos

  132. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [132] shore

    “Packed away? Packed away!

    In the words of P. Opus, “Pffffftttttt!”

    So sue me. I never unpacked all my stuffed animals after I moved, except the ones I either ditched because they came from ex-girlfriends or gave to my daughter because I am a grown man and don’t need a freakin’ roomful of stuffed animals.

    I did keep Opus, but he is in a box with a lot of other memorabilia. Ironically, when he does get unpacked, he will likely end up on a shelf with all my shark toys (don’t ask—funny story that everyone perpetuates by giving me shark-themed toys, mugs, keychains and other items).

  133. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “Realtors just want listings, they are going to say what they need to say to get them.”

    Barb, This is a problem.

  134. sas says:

    “We’ve seen an incredible surge in lumber prices over the last year as builders have ramped up demand and supply has remained tight.”

    ha ha.

    i wish that was true.


  135. Funny Guy says:

    This isn’t a big step towards profiling. If your involved in a crime officers already ask for identification. As American citizen do you think officers shouldn’t be able to ask for identification ever?

  136. chicagofinance says:

    Fergus says:
    April 30, 2010 at 1:20 pm
    Don’t worry folks, fattie will save you!

  137. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    144. veto,
    if the same difference. If they told them the truth, they would likely cut and run and the bank would be the ones holding their house in limbo, or they would just stay put. Either way, results are the same, we can’t buy a house at a reasonable market value.

  138. BlueNDGold says:

    Re: 146.

    “This isn’t a big step towards profiling. If your involved in a crime officers already ask for identification. As American citizen do you think officers shouldn’t be able to ask for identification ever?”

    The problem is that it is unlikely officers will ask white suspects for their proof of legal status, which is ground for racial profiling.

  139. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    if = its

  140. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    barb – thats probably true, but boy id just love to see the smirks get wiped off the ‘dream teams’.
    Ya know?

  141. BlueNDGold says:

    By the way, identification is not the same as proof of legal status. It is possible for an illegal immigrant to be in possession of a legal and valid Driver’s License.

  142. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    I wonder if every time these cheese puffs get the brilliant idea to name themselves “The Dream Team!” (catchy!), they do a group high five. I’d like to think that they do.

  143. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    omg, the tax credit deadline didnt even pass yet and i am already witnessing one extremely motivated seller drop his drawers right there on realtor .com.

    this is awesome.

    I dont want to share the link because i may actually make an offer.

  144. Painhrtz says:

    Not to sound like a completely insensitive pig but it is racial profiling because gasp most illegals arre from Mexico and South America.

    Listen if they were spilling over our northern border I would have no problems being pulled over because I was drinking a Molson, wearing a hockey sweater and a toque.

    If the no nothings that lead this failed state had done something about our southern border, flying spaghetti monster knows we have the technology, we wouldn’t be in this predicament.

  145. Shore Guy says:

    “There are 3 bedrooms, 2 full baths and a FROG which expands the living area. ”

    Can anyone explain this to me?

  146. Shore Guy says:

    “It is possible for an illegal immigrant to be in possession of a legal and valid Driver’s License.”

    I know that this is true, but it is so very wrong.

  147. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    haha. Bye the way Barb you got full credit for coining the satirical “Dream Team©” denigration, which was definately one of the funniest posts i have read here.

    You can pretty much sum up the whole industry with those “Dream Team©” adverts.

  148. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    I think its dicey because lets face it, geographically, Arizona has been home to a large population of indigenous people for thousands of years. The crazy crackers that move down there forget this. I’d be pretty concerned of I was raising my 5th generation pueblo children in AZ, ya know?

  149. Final Doom says:

    barb (153)-

    The best are the “American Dream Teams” that will plant a little flag (with business card attached) in your yard on a national holiday…or on the 9/11 anniversary.

    I actually had an agent do this in 2003. When I received the first complaint from a homeowner, I fired the agent on the spot. The agent had no idea he’d done something inappropriate.

    Guy is probably working the bereavement market now, a la Cadillac Man.

  150. Shore Guy says:

    Does anyone here have a good feel for SC near the ocean?

  151. Final Doom says:

    All you crazy bastards, still trying to buy houses.

    Better you stock up on food, water, ammo and gold.

    It’s all turning to shit, gang.

  152. Final Doom says:

    Shore (161)-

    You mean, Detroit-by-the-Sea?

  153. Final Doom says:

    Anybody see the move in .vix today?

    Risk on.

  154. Painhrtz says:

    When I think Dream Team I’m thinking bad 80’s movie

    Volvo boxy but good

  155. Final Doom says:

    Counting down to the PPT entry…

  156. Painhrtz says:

    Barb, I my brother lives in Phoenix and I know the whole history of the southwest, bu there is one hell of a gang problem out there and it isn’t from the indigenous folks.

  157. Shore Guy says:


    You are a fan I see. What are your specific impressions?

  158. RU says:

    #149. The officer will still need to be able to articulate reasonable suspicion why they asked someone if they are in the US legally. Here’s a good Op-ed piece from the NYT:

    Why Arizona Drew a Line
    Kansas City, Kan.

    ON Friday, Gov. Jan Brewer of Arizona signed a law — SB 1070 — that prohibits the harboring of illegal aliens and makes it a state crime for an alien to commit certain federal immigration crimes. It also requires police officers who, in the course of a traffic stop or other law-enforcement action, come to a “reasonable suspicion” that a person is an illegal alien verify the person’s immigration status with the federal government.

    Predictably, groups that favor relaxed enforcement of immigration laws, including the American Civil Liberties Union and the Mexican American Legal Defense and Education Fund, insist the law is unconstitutional. Less predictably, President Obama declared it “misguided” and said the Justice Department would take a look.

    Presumably, the government lawyers who do so will actually read the law, something its critics don’t seem to have done. The arguments we’ve heard against it either misrepresent its text or are otherwise inaccurate. As someone who helped draft the statute, I will rebut the major criticisms individually:

    It is unfair to demand that aliens carry their documents with them. It is true that the Arizona law makes it a misdemeanor for an alien to fail to carry certain documents. “Now, suddenly, if you don’t have your papers … you’re going to be harassed,” the president said. “That’s not the right way to go.” But since 1940, it has been a federal crime for aliens to fail to keep such registration documents with them. The Arizona law simply adds a state penalty to what was already a federal crime. Moreover, as anyone who has traveled abroad knows, other nations have similar documentation requirements.

    “Reasonable suspicion” is a meaningless term that will permit police misconduct. Over the past four decades, federal courts have issued hundreds of opinions defining those two words. The Arizona law didn’t invent the concept: Precedents list the factors that can contribute to reasonable suspicion; when several are combined, the “totality of circumstances” that results may create reasonable suspicion that a crime has been committed.

    For example, the Arizona law is most likely to come into play after a traffic stop. A police officer pulls a minivan over for speeding. A dozen passengers are crammed in. None has identification. The highway is a known alien-smuggling corridor. The driver is acting evasively. Those factors combine to create reasonable suspicion that the occupants are not in the country legally.

    The law will allow police to engage in racial profiling. Actually, Section 2 provides that a law enforcement official “may not solely consider race, color or national origin” in making any stops or determining immigration status. In addition, all normal Fourth Amendment protections against profiling will continue to apply. In fact, the Arizona law actually reduces the likelihood of race-based harassment by compelling police officers to contact the federal government as soon as is practicable when they suspect a person is an illegal alien, as opposed to letting them make arrests on their own assessment.

    It is unfair to demand that people carry a driver’s license. Arizona’s law does not require anyone, alien or otherwise, to carry a driver’s license. Rather, it gives any alien with a license a free pass if his immigration status is in doubt. Because Arizona allows only lawful residents to obtain licenses, an officer must presume that someone who produces one is legally in the country.

    State governments aren’t allowed to get involved in immigration, which is a federal matter. While it is true that Washington holds primary authority in immigration, the Supreme Court since 1976 has recognized that states may enact laws to discourage illegal immigration without being pre-empted by federal law. As long as Congress hasn’t expressly forbidden the state law in question, the statute doesn’t conflict with federal law and Congress has not displaced all state laws from the field, it is permitted. That’s why Arizona’s 2007 law making it illegal to knowingly employ unauthorized aliens was sustained by the United States Court of Appeals for the Ninth Circuit.

    In sum, the Arizona law hardly creates a police state. It takes a measured, reasonable step to give Arizona police officers another tool when they come into contact with illegal aliens during their normal law enforcement duties.

    And it’s very necessary: Arizona is the ground zero of illegal immigration. Phoenix is the hub of human smuggling and the kidnapping capital of America, with more than 240 incidents reported in 2008. It’s no surprise that Arizona’s police associations favored the bill, along with 70 percent of Arizonans.

    President Obama and the Beltway crowd feel these problems can be taken care of with “comprehensive immigration reform” — meaning amnesty and a few other new laws. But we already have plenty of federal immigration laws on the books, and the typical illegal alien is guilty of breaking many of them. What we need is for the executive branch to enforce the laws that we already have.

    Unfortunately, the Obama administration has scaled back work-site enforcement and otherwise shown it does not consider immigration laws to be a high priority. Is it any wonder the Arizona Legislature, at the front line of the immigration issue, sees things differently?

  159. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    If this house would be marked to market, the askig price would begin with a 1.

    On a side note, the agent clearly smokes more than a pack of ciggarettes with her morning coffee.

  160. Mr Hyde says:

    Pain, Barb

    if the federal government refuses to secure the border then what do you expect to happen? Border states have few palatable options if the Feds wont secure the border.

  161. Mr Hyde says:

    Veto 170

    ROFLMAO!!!!! thanks for the laugh!

  162. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Hyde, i cant tell if the agent or price is funnier…

  163. safeashouses says:

    #156 Shore Guy,

    Is FROG Family Room Over Garage?

  164. Simply Ravishing HEHEHE says:

    How can the stock market go down on negative news? Am I missing something?

  165. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:

    Where the f#ck is the PPT?

    Im done with this casino gulag crap.

    Im going to make love to my gold coins and AR-15.

  166. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    Pain and Hyde,
    I’m generally supportive and understand the gang problem because I live near it myself. However, this week AZ also passed a bill in their house (I think) that would require all national candidates for the Presidency to register an original birth certficate or whatever the hell these Birthers think is bonafide. A lot of Azzholes in AZ and its clouding a legit action and need.

  167. Final Doom says:

    Shore (168)-

    Disaster. And getting worse.

  168. Final Doom says:

    This is a state that elected Mark Sanford gubnor.

  169. relo says:


    Spot on as usual. Having spent some of my formative years there and still having relatives there, AZ is still in a lot of respects the A**hole of the country, backwards and redneck.

    That said, the older I get the closer I become to agreeing at least in principle.

  170. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    I might be in love with this house.
    270 years old. Sweet. The structure will prob last 1,000 years.

  171. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    driving through SC is like The Heart Of Darkness…rest stops off 1-95 at 2am…oysh. Do not recommend.

  172. relo says:

    Gap up open on Monday!

    Disclaimer – I am a contrarian indicator.

  173. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    181 veto,
    We deserve no less! Nice bones – I’d crowbar the kitchen.

  174. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:


    Ive noticed you have become awfully cynical of late. It appears you have woken up.

    What is your weapon of choice?


  175. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    Hmmm…I’ve been cynical since kindergarten. I like that house,just hate the kitchen.

  176. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “Gap up open on Monday!”

    Markets will have such strong earning news and positive economic indicators in next couple months. It’s going to becomr comical.

  177. Shore Guy says:

    Thanks for the SC input. I am rapidly running out of places to buy. I am disinclined to buy anything in a state where the budgets and debt are out of control, for fear of runaway tax increases, yet we very much want another place. It has to have water and views. So much the better to be a short walk from an ocean beach, although a nice place with 30+ acres on a hill overlooking a nice lake (and with some ponds) has a certain appeal.

  178. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:


    Its a charming house but 1.5 mil? I would wait it out. Better off buying a piece of farmland on the cheap now as a hedge.

    The 1 million + market near me is declining by 150k chunks. Anything good under 500k is selling.

    Oh, and make sure there were no deaths in the house. Those 100 year old homes tend to have paranormal stuff going on.

  179. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “It appears you have woken up.”

    Al, Given the opportunty, Barb would probably slam you in the face with that crowbar.

  180. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:

    By the way Ill trade you 1 gold eagle for that painting on the wall in picture 3.

  181. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Yeah im sure the ghost of christmas past is raiding the fridge in that house every night.

    The unique thing with you is you are able to seemlessly blend r/e and economics discussions with science fiction. With that talent and creativity, you would make a decent realtor.

  182. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:


    “Given the opportunty, Barb would probably slam you in the face with that

    You couldnt get within 50 yards of me with a crowbar manchild. Spider senses.

    Now go back to work and watch the casino gulag meltdown. Argentina here we come.

  183. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Al, thats funny but i bet you im older than you.
    I remember the cuban missile crisis. How about you?

  184. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    as I have said before,I pay extra for ghosts. But not azzhole ghosts, preferably ghosts of historical interest, please. I’m not going to put up with the ghost of Uncle Fred, circa 1974 – family kid toucher and Jack Nicholas fan.
    Perhaps I’ve said too much…

  185. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    my dad was on one of the blockade boats. 18 yrs old and very scared.

  186. Doyle says:


    You often go off on the reno’d kitchens in these older homes. What do you think they should have, or what did they originally have?


  187. Mr Hyde says:


    Az is an interesting situation. What do you do when the Feds refuse to enforce existing laws and are having major issues develop as a result?

    Dont ask me, I’m just a janitor

  188. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:



    The deep pockets that I work with are of the same mindset. Farmland on a lake.

    I think its a great idea if you are looking to get out of cash.

  189. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “I’m not going to put up with the ghost of Uncle Fred”

    Haha. As long as the ghost is not a child or religious figure, i can pretty much party with anything.

    But the crypt keeper wearing a habit while walking past me in the hallway is where i draw the line.

  190. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    kitchens are the checkpoint charlie of good taste and bad. For that house…if you really want to know…I’ll leave out structural changes and just list finishes.
    Solid wood painted warm white custom cabinets with a frame design. White marble countertops for the walls, soapstone for the island or butlers pantry. Chromed silver or darkened bronze pulls. Mercury glass accent lights. Floor, either a hardwood that matches the rest of the house or real lino (the kind made out of actual linseed oil) cut into a vintage (1920-30s ish) pattern. Subway tiles on the backsplash in white or semi transluscent white glass. SS farm sink, six burner SS oven range with a swing arm faucet. Yeah, that’s what I would do in that house.

  191. njescapee says:

    Shore, slowed down a little on the guitar playing due to the nice weather. It’s just a great time of year to be outdoors in the Keys. I pick it up maybe 3 times a week just to make the dogs howl. :-)

  192. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [194] veto

    “I remember the cuban missile crisis. How about you?”

    Nope. I was one. Guess I will be holding the door for you at a GTG.

  193. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Nom, I remember that day well.
    The first time i saw it on tv, it was already in technicolor.

  194. Doyle says:

    Ha, thanks Barb, I see you have a problem with specifics. That’s the problem we are running into in a lot of old homes we like. They put additions on and put hardwood in that doesn’t match the rest of the house in the least. The additions are beautiful, but why not try to make them match. I just don’t get it.

    Oh well.

  195. meter says:

    @188, Shore:

    I think you’re going to have to look beyond US borders. Thought about Panama, Belize, thereabouts?

  196. Shore Guy says:

    We love Greneda, Belize, Dominica, BVI, and have considered them but, when it comes down to it, while we trust the British and are okay with BVI, we have doubts about buying in places that are outside the protection of the US Constitution.

  197. jp says:

    does the expiration of the first time home buyer credit signal an inflection point in home prices? If so, when would you call the bottom?

  198. Mr hyde says:


    any favorite villas in the BVI?

  199. chicagofinance says:

    jp says:
    April 30, 2010 at 4:57 pm
    does the expiration of the first time home buyer credit signal an inflection point in home prices? If so, when would you call the bottom?

    jp: at this point it is senseless to try and micromanage your outcome….if you have the dp & financing lined up…then figure out what you want and look….just worry about where the rubber hits the road….

    based on what I see here, there is basically pure crap out there, so just keep an open mind and play the game…..

  200. chicagofinance says:

    The end is nigh….

    I was going to attend this conference and just in the last couple of days they announced the keynote speakers…..

  201. Shore Guy says:


    No. The BVI and USVI expert here is NJC. I would ask her.

  202. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [204] veto

    My earliest childhood memories of significance were the moon landings. I had posters of astronauts, made a Saturn V rocket model, and used to run around in a toy space helmet.

    Some days, I feel like doing that all over again.

    Maybe this weekend, I will play Barbies with my older daughter.

  203. Has anyone even bothered to read the new law instead of repeating what they heard?

  204. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    my earliest memories are of Watergate, and my Dad writing the phrase “Tricky Dick” in various blank pages of my Republican grandmom’s 5 inch thick telephone msg note pad. She pretty much had to be reminded of the whole thing for the next 10 years of telephone msgs.

  205. jamil says:

    129 comrade:
    Damn, secret leaked..I have succesfully applied said strategy in depositions. Works even better there, as long pauses are not reflected in written version.
    Adding totally irrelevant nonsense is fine too if done carefully..sometimes risky (may come back to haunt you if called to testify)

  206. meter says:

    @212 –

    I would have sworn that calling up that link would land me on a photo of Sarah “Goober” Palin.

    Corzine’s almost as bad. Definitely worse if you were in it for the looks.

  207. safeashouses says:

    #212 Chifi

    What does Corzine’s MF stand for? Mother F…..?

  208. yo'me says:

    This is an article from Seeking Alpha from April 2009.None of it’s analization
    came to view

    How times have changed! With the U.S. now hopelessly insolvent, it’s imperative for the U.S. government to convince the world that demand for its debt remains strong. Should the foreign creditors who hold a mortgage over the U.S. economy see such demand evaporate, this would cause interest rates to immediately soar – followed shortly by a downgrade to the U.S.’s national credit rating, which still holds the same farcical “AAA” rating as trillions of dollars of Wall Street scam-products.

  209. Shore Guy says:


    If you go to the Jost, just be sure to bring many soggy dollars.

  210. Outofstater says:

    Shore – How about somewhere on the Great Lakes? The winters can be tricky though.

  211. Shore Guy says:


    We have given that some thought but lean way against it right now. IL has nothing on the shore, northern IN and OH are flat as boards. MI has an economic mess on its hands and goodness knows what is going to happen to taxes there. WI has some beautiful spots and could work, absent the whole weather thing, plus it is Big Ten country. MN is getting a bit far afield. Of them WI is the best fit, but awfully far from the ocean. I lived in the Midwest for several years and learned how important the ocean is to me.

    ME and NH have some potential. I had hoped thw NC might work, and I suppose it still could. DELMARVA is flat and has vast swaths of severe poverty, but it also has some potential for a place. The same is true of the Finger Lakes, but one has to be wary of the NY legislature’s history of raising taxes and I have seen properties up there, in pretty rural places, with taxes that make Monmouth County seem cheap.

  212. Shore Guy says:

    VA has somevery nice places, but its proximity to the national capitol forces up prices.

  213. veto that - Lawrence Yun 'The Panda', 'Next Fall' says:

    221, yome, i have a feeling we are going to look back on some of these posts and mishe articles in five years and laugh hysterically.

  214. veto that - Lawrence Yun 'The Panda', 'Next Fall' says:

    Shore, if price crash, just snag some beachfront on LBI for 50% discount.
    Deep down in there somewhere, you love NJ with your whole heart.

  215. Shore Guy says:


    NJ is one of my favorite places, actually. Long Beach Island has some nice places, although, I prefer Bay Head and Mantoloking. I am also a big fan of Avon and Sea Girt.

  216. Shore Guy says:

    Right now, it looks like we are torn between a winter beach place or a place with significant acreage on or overlooking a lake (and within a reasonable drive of the coast).

  217. Shore Guy says:

    Egads! (From an ASCAp newsletter)

    “When he first heard the iFart, Tim Yewchuck was inspired. Many people thought the “app” that produces indelicate noises on iPhones was juvenile or funny (or both), but Yewchuck sensed a business opportunity. The iFart phenomenon was part of what started the gold rush in the app world,” he says. “We had dollar signs in our eyes. We thought there was money to be made.” Plenty of people do.

  218. Shore Guy says:

    ASCAP, even

  219. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    “It was already acknowledged that as a short-term play it’s probably a good wager.”


    Depends on one’s defintion of short term. It’s been a hell of a short term, 9 year trade. Just wait until the big run, when the treasury bubble blows up.

  220. Shore Guy says:

    Bank Closing Information – April 30, 2010
    These links contain useful information for the customers and vendors of these closed banks.

    Frontier Bank, Everett, WA
    BC National Banks, Butler, MO
    Champion Bank, Creve Coeur, MO
    CF Bancorp, Port Huron, MI
    Westernbank Puerto Rico, Mayaquez, PR – [En Español]
    R-G Premier Bank of Puerto Rico, Hato Rey, PR – [En Español]
    Eurobank, San Juan, PR – [En Español]

  221. cobbler says:

    I wouldn’t have thought these busted Puerto Rico banks are so huge. These 3 plus Frontier Bank make some big dent in what’s left of FDIC funds…

  222. Shore Guy says:

    From Forbes, via:

    Tomorrow’s Real Estate Trouble Spots
    by Francesca Levy
    Wednesday, April 28, 2010

    In these cities, the housing crisis is expected to worsen.

    Since the late 1970s casino-rich Atlantic City, N.J., has been a beachfront escape for poker aficionados and Keno-loving retirees from Philadelphia, Northern New Jersey and New York.

    Today, buying a home in Atlantic City is a gamble. Of 315 cities measured by Local Market Monitor, a Cary, N.C.-based real estate research firm, the Atlantic City metro is expected to experience the largest drop in home value over the next 12 months. A pocket of Northwestern cities where restrictions on building have artificially inflated prices, and smaller metros whose housing markets have benefited from internal migration, join Atlantic City on our list of real estate trouble spots.

    Like cities in California, Florida, Nevada and Arizona, Atlantic City saw a dramatic run-up in prices during the housing boom due, in part, to speculative purchases of second homes; Atlantic County includes popular beachfront spots such as Margate. But while those bubble markets have already burst, Atlantic City still has significant price depreciation ahead; Local Market Monitor predicts the metro’s median home price will fall 9% in the next year.

    “We have not seen the bottom in that market,” says Jeffrey Otteau, president of East Brunswick, New Jersey-based Otteau Valuation Group, who says the city is still saddled with 12 months of unsold housing inventory.


  223. safeashouses says:

    Very few new listings in our price range showed up this week. The new listings volume seems to be down 75% in some towns. Is this a blip, or did the 8k tax credit pull inventory forward, leaving lots of future buyers with fewer purchasing choices?

  224. safeashouses says:

    Happy first day in the wilderness people.

    All we need now is 7% interest rates and lending standards from 1998 and housing will be affordable again.

  225. Final Doom says:

    Get used to oblivion, folks.

    Once you relax and let go, it’s fine.

  226. yo'me says:

    How many rooms can you put on 320 sq ft?How about 20?

  227. Cindy says:

    Stu – I know you told me not to read “faux news” but what do you make of this 1099 for $600. spent by businesses added to the health care bill?

    Real? Faux News?

  228. gary says:

    “Kristen and Chuck Dvorscak of Midland Park, N.J., need to sell their 1929 three-bedroom Colonial now. The couple just had a second child, so the Dvorscaks, 33, want to upgrade to a bigger home nearby. Trouble is, their house’s value has plummeted about 7 percent from the $535,000 they paid four years ago. They’re resigned to taking a loss, but hope to save the traditional 6 percent real estate broker’s commission by having Kristen market the house herself. (Asking price: $499,900.)”

    Tick… tick… tick… tick…

  229. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:

    Good Morning America – 25% of ABC Staff Fired

    This is great news for humanity. They are filling the void by hiring digital journalists which will force the alternative internet news to the forefront. The beginning of the end for mainstream media and their indoctrination agenda.

  230. Stu says:


    You can read Faux news, as long you form a fair and balanced opinion by also reading the Enquirer.

    I’m with you on the health-care bill. The second we got away from single payer was the second we knew there wouldn’t be any reform. As long as private insurers will continue to exist, any chance for reform is dead in the water.

    We are living in a corporatocry. Don’t forget that!

  231. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:

    BC Bob,

    What are your thoughts on Palladium?

  232. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:


    There will never be a single payer. In case you havent noticed the whole world is collapsing under debt.

    Every single person dependent on government services is going to be completely screwed.

    Joe “tit sucking” Public is going to get knocked out by the clown shoe. Dont worry America has lots of land. Im sure those welfare queens can pick lettuce as good as any Mexican.

  233. Cindy says:

    247 – Stu

    Well if it is true, they are looking at an IRS nightmare. No wonder they need to hire more employees. Filing a 1099 every time a business spends $600 – yikes!

  234. afe says:

    Good Morning!

    Has anyone dealt with a condominium/cooperative right of termination in a lease? Although the property in question is a SFH and not part of a cooperative, the leasing agent has added this clause to the agreement. Basically it says that if the owner sells the property during the lease term the tenancy is terminated within 60 days…..are we going to see more of these as underwater owners try to rent out their properties to keep their heads above water?

  235. Shore Guy says:

    ” IRS nightmare.”

    Scr-ew the IRS nightmare. It is going to be a bloody disaster for business. What, whenever I go to Staples and buy a bunch of stuff I now need tp collect a 1099 ffom the register clerk? Worse yet is having to track every payment to every individual entity throughout they year.

    I trust that the twits who came up with this idea have never run a business or created a single job.

  236. Cindy says:

    “New Jersey’s “Just Say No” Debt Plan”

    From Barrons…

    “This stance could make New Jersey a test case for the rest of the country…”

  237. Cindy says:

    253 – Shore – So is it true?

    It seems like the most ridiculous idea I can think up….it will hobble small business. Why on Earth would they do such a thing?

    What is it doing in a health care bill?

  238. Nomad says:

    #221 –

    My guess is that interest rates start to pop in Sept. What I am having trouble understanding is that many people who seem to have more knowledge and are likely a lot smarter than I belive that interest rates will remain low for some time.

    To me it is simple supply and demand with an adjustment for risk thrown in that equates to rising rates which I do believe will be the nail in the coffin.

    Can anyone convince me that aggressive inflation is not coming to our country in the next 24-36 mos?

  239. Cindy says:

    Calculated Risk –

    “96.5% of Mortgages Backed by Government Entities in Q1”

    Is that as close as you can get to 100% or what.

  240. MSP says:

    How far does everyone really think prices will fall from here? From my perspective, we’re nearly back to 2003 prices. If prices fall by another 5% or 10% once interest rates rise, what is the real difference from a cash flow perspective. Affordability on a monthly basis remains unchanged if interest rates and prices move in opposite directions, right? I’m probably over simplifying this, so would appreciate your thoughts.

  241. gary says:

    Oblama said in a speech the other day that he thinks there’s a point where someone makes too much money. Was he referring to Oprah Winfrey’s income last year of $223,000,000? Just curious.

    And did this administration really do nothing for 7 days as oil was (is) gushing into the gulf threatening the ecosystem and a $1,800,000,000 fishing industry? Can we blame it on Dick Cheney and Haliburton?

    Oh, and for all those kids that are protesting the NJ budget cuts for schools; I agree with you. There’s no reason for your education to be jeopardized. So, I propose that you go to your parents and ask them to write a check to your school district to make up the shortfall. Tell them it’s for the children.

  242. Nomad says:

    #258: If in theory your monthly payment remains the same because interest rates go up and the price of the house goes down, you are better off as interest is tax deductable.

    The numbers will never be that clean but it’s one perspective.

    If you create some type of graph that plots interest rates and housing prices, there is some optimal point where the lines intersect. Your never going to hit it perfectly but at least it’s a target. Non economic factor as always is if you like the home and the enjoyment you receive from it.

  243. Final Doom says:

    Shore (253)-

    The least discussed topic in this whole economic debacle is the emergence of the concept of too small to succeed.

  244. safeashouses says:

    #259 gary,

    Drill baby drill!!!!!!

    I think the same government guys that contained subprime have transferred their skills to natural resources.

  245. Final Doom says:

    And, we can lay the blame for the whole emergence of too small to succeed at the feet of the collectivists who desire for all of us to be enslaved by either (or both) our giant corporate masters or the all-encompassing gubmint.

    Wake me up when it’s time to start shooting.

    That is, if anyone at that point still has the cojones or initiative to even bother.

  246. Final Doom says:

    Helluva job you’re doing there, Brownie.

  247. Ben says:

    “What are your thoughts on Palladium?”

    Palladium is purely an industrial play. It differs from other precious metals in that it was never historically been a symbol of value like Gold, Silver, or Platinum. That being said, Palladium, like Rhodium/Platinum as an industrial catalyst will never be replaced. As a chemist, I can tell you that these three metals possess catalytic properties that there will likely never be substitutes for. Palladium’s price swings have been volatile because of hedging and stockpiling from Russia but long term (and by this I mean decades), all precious metals have solid fundamentals because the reality is, we are approaching the peak levels of mining for all of these metals while the demand for them based on their industrial applications continues to grow. In the next 20 to 30 years, we will have sever supply squeezes on these natural resources which will lead to price spikes. We already saw this happen in the case of Rhodium where it went from $300 an ounce to $10000 an ounce this decade.

    That being said, I don’t own any palladium and I don’t plan to buy any at all. Personally, I believe Silver to be the best long term play on all the metals. It has a history of holding monetary value and absent that, it’s industrial value is much more important. That, and it just happens to be a fraction of the cost of Palladium.

  248. Ben says:

    “Depends on one’s defintion of short term. It’s been a hell of a short term, 9 year trade. Just wait until the big run, when the treasury bubble blows up.”

    Heh, exactly. Gold is not a short term play at all. It’s a play on inflation and the US has been hopelessly addicted to inflating the currency for 10 years straight. Until the US can eliminate it’s budget deficit, national debt, and trade deficit, the proper play is to be long gold. As of now, the US has shown no signs of reversing any of those three major inflationary pressures. In fact, they just keep getting worse and worse.

  249. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:

    HOUSTON, April 30 (Reuters) – The U.S. Coast Guard said Friday it was responding to another oil drilling rig accident near Morgan City, Louisiana.

    The “mobile inland drilling unit” overturned in the Charenton navigational channel south of U.S. Highway 90 at Morgan City. (Reporting by Bruce Nichols)

  250. NJCoast says:


    Glad to hear you’ll keep your job.

    I read the article and the ad on the side- 3 Hass avocados for 99 cents they’re 2 for $3.00 here in Jersey!

  251. Cindy says:

    NJCoast 269 –


  252. When Shakira stated “that I am pretty much undocumented” is absolutely ridiculous. She came to our country with documents. When entering into the United States legitimately you must show your passport, which Shakira certainly did. By challenging Arpaio to come and get her because she left her passport at her 5 star hotel clearly indicates Shakira does not understand the Arizona Senate Bill 1070. By Shakria not carrying her passport or identification does not mean she will be arrested. One must engage in illegal activity to be arrested and asked for identification, which most likely Shakira will not be engaging in illegal activity. For someone to rally other individuals without fully understanding the SB 1070 is irresponsible. People (including Shakira) need to take the time to fully understand the law before grand standing to an audience who expects her to be informed. Shakira should respect the United State’s freedom of speech and should be fully educated on the law before leading an emotional charged crowd. This law is not new, it is enforcing what is already in place by the Federal Government. It is a Federal crime to be an illegal alien thus the term “illegal alien.” Crime has become an increasing problem in Arizona. The law is designed to punish criminals for being criminals not for being illegal immigrants. Which all members of our community should embrace. If the Federal Government would take illegal immigration seriously there could be alternatives for this law. But the Federal Government ignored Arizona’s immigration problem and decided they could not rely on the Federal Government for help. Arizona’s actions are directed against the members of the immigrant community that are criminals. Anyone, citizen or non-citizen, should agree that the increased violence around our boarders needs to be addressed. Immigrants and citizens need to work together to reduce crime. Shame on you Shakria for further inflaming a passionate subject that should be addressed rationally. Shame on you everyone else for not educating yourself on the SB 1070. For those of you that want to be educated you can read the full law here

  253. Fergus says:

    What a nice day!

  254. scribe says:


    Your link to US Cavalry …

    What is your wardrobe like? :)

  255. yo'me says:


    “Workers unite! No more layoffs!” Rally organizer Bayu Ajie said a free-trade agreement with China had cost jobs, decreased wages and encouraged corruption. President Susilo Bambang Yudhoyono promised to create safer working conditions and improve job prospects if the workers maintained political and economic stability.

  256. Mr hyde says:


    I used that site to order equipment/gear when I was in the military. My wardrobe isn’t that exciting

  257. Cindy says:

    274 yo’me

    Reading comments @ TBP, they were discussing the 99ers here in CA (nearly 100,000 who are still looking for work but can no longer draw an unemployment check.)

    One suggested this for the 99ers’ anthem:

  258. njescapee says:

    E Street Band member makes news in the Keys.

    Winn-Dixie corporate lawyers could never have imagined Bruce Springsteen’s right-hand man getting involved when it sent an eviction letter to Brass Monkey Lounge owner Judy Sorenson a week and a half ago.

    But longtime E Street Band saxophone player Clarence Clemons, who’s been visiting Marathon for years, jams at local bars including the Monkey and recently bought a home here, says he was ready to picket the Marathon grocery on Sunday alongside hundreds of other Marathon residents.

  259. Stu says:

    Garden turned and planted. 9 tomato plants, 3 cucumbers, 12 peas, 6 sweet peppers, 3 jalapenos, 3 broccoli and 3 spinach plants. Mowed the lawn too. I need to replace about 6 slats on my fence, went to Home Depot and worker sold me an 8 foot length with a few damaged slats for $14. Will take them apart tomorrow and will have enough slats to last me till the mortgage is up. Man those storms did a job on my fence. Now off to a derby party.

  260. cobbler says:

    This is the advantage of staying in Montclair: 10-15 miles to the West you’d see absolutely nothing of your plantings left by the harvest time unless you build a raptor-style cage around them (don’t know about jalapenos though – maybe our wildlife doesn’t like them).

  261. Nomad says:

    Arizona SB1070

    Read for yourself and decide if AZ has gone too far or not pertaining to handling illegal aliens.

  262. Maylook1day says:

    Any comments on the board re: Booya’s comments on the Today show, he believes that in 1-2 years there will be a housing shortage? Clearly he thinks Uncle Sam is going to pump this bubble back up.

  263. NJGator says:

    Doom -drinking a knob creek mint julep and thinking of you. happy derby day folks!

  264. Shore Guy says:

    “too small to succeed.”

    More like too small to be allowed to succeed.

  265. Shore Guy says:

    “What is it doing in a health care bill?”

    It is about finding hidden income and healthcare was going to pass by anymeans necessary, thus it gets attached.

  266. Mr hyde says:


    the healthcare bill was not about healthcare, but tax revenue generation. Tax reciepts ate falling through the floor and obama’s spending/ programs are in danger along with the governments ability to fund stimulus spending.

    If the government had tried to straight up raise taxes to cover the current massive stimulus and general deficit spending you would have seem a tax revolt from both partied.

    As a result they called their tax increase “healthcare” and as a result they begin recieveing tax revenue immediatly and don’t have to actually implement any serious healthcare changes for 2 years.

    From this perspective the 1099 provision you asked about should make perfect sense.

    The governments current spending is like a coke addict using meth and patting himself on the back for getting off coke

  267. Cindy says:

    NJCoast – When does the darn race start? I switched over from golf (Woods didn’t even make the cut) but just folks talking the whole time. When are the horsies gunna run?

    Avacados where I shop were 2 for 99 cents today. Dang.

  268. Cindy says:


    Anyone looking for work better hustle over to an IRS office. Those folks are going to need plenty of new em-ploy-eeeees.

  269. Rusty Trombone says:

    It was Johnny Hopkins, and Sloan Kettering, and they were blazin that shit up everyday.

  270. cobbler says:

    Theoretically, the new 1099 requirement should reduce tax evasion by the small businesses which is rampant; fwiw, Bush administration tried to push for it earlier in 2000s. In practice, I think, IRS will be overwhelmed by the number of the filings with all the requited errors (wrong taxpayer ID #, etc.) to do any serious enforcement. OTOH, the requirement may scare some into a better compliance.

  271. Cindy says:

    289 – Cobbler

    Better tax compliance makes sense but anything that hinders or impedes employment right now seems foolhardy.

    This country needs jobs.

    Business folk are already waiting with bated breath re: added expenses for health care, cap and trade and VAT.

    I wish the government would lay off the business folk for now – that’s all.

  272. Cindy says:

    I’m taking Devil May Care #11 @ 10 to 1.

  273. Pat says:

    Stu and Gator, I flicked through ABC news just now and what do I see?

    People’s Republic of Montklair. The children deserve the best possible teachers, you know.

  274. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    “E Street Band member makes news in the keys”

    Escapee (277).

    “When the change was made uptown
    And the Big Man joined the band
    From the coastline to the city
    All the little pretties raise their hands
    I’m gonna sit back right easy and laugh
    When Scooter and the Big Man bust this city in half
    With a Tenth Avenue freeze-out, Tenth Avenue freeze-out
    Tenth Avenue freeze-out…”

  275. Cindy says:

    “Growth would have to be 5% for a full year to drive the unemployment rate down by 1 percentage point.”

    3.2 pfft

  276. Pat says:

    I park my Civic between Cavemakers.
    Will I live through one more blind back up?
    My 8 year old will be hit first.
    She sits in back.

    We live lean and efficiently.
    Small house
    Small cars
    Small choices
    It’s not easy being small.

    Others use Others expend others threaten us I’ve never seen the Gulf but I once had a pen pal from the Gulf when I was in sixth grade.

    Where is our credit. Where is the man with the fix it credit.

  277. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    Al Gore,

    Someone, on this site, stated a long, long time ago that it would be a great race to the bottom for paper. It’s QE to infinity. Greece, Portugal, Spain? Just the opening act, a freaking side-show. Wait ubtil the vigilantes take on Timmy. Make no mistake about it, there will be contagion. There will be one winner in the great race to the bottom.

    By the way, how about buying a pos, borrowing in yen with a 7 year balloon payment in gold. Oh sheet, that won’t work, some crackerjack, on this blog, said you can’t buy anything with gold?

  278. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    “Small house
    Small cars
    Small choices
    It’s not easy being small.”


    Been listening to the song, short people, all weekend. Just starting to get in the mood.

  279. Mr hyde says:

    Wantanopoul 296

    oh you mean that bc bob clown who liked gold?


  280. Mr hyde says:

    TsIT’s not like bc bob called the implosion of AIG or anything

  281. Stu says:

    Pat…Tell me more ’bout what you seen on ABC.

  282. Stu says:

    May 4, 2010
    WHEREAS, for more than a century, the bicycle has been an important part of the lives
    of many Americans, and today residents of all ages throughout New Jersey engage in bicycling
    because it is a viable and environmentally sound form of transportation, an excellent form of
    fitness and provides quality family recreation; and
    WHEREAS, the Township of Montclair was the first municipality in New Jersey to
    adopt a “Complete Streets” policy for the design and operation of its roadways to enable safe
    access for pedestrians, bicyclists, transit users, motorists and all users; and
    WHEREAS, the Township of Montclair was one of the first 34 New Jersey
    municipalities awarded Sustainable Jersey Community certification for its efforts to be more
    environmentally-friendly; and
    WHEREAS, riding a bicycle is a feasible alternative to driving a car especially for short
    trips which are the most polluting (i.e. to work, transit stations, schools, or shopping); and
    WHEREAS, the education of cyclists and motorists as to the proper and safe operation
    of bicycles is important to ensure the safety and comfort of all users of Township streets; and
    WHEREAS, the League of American Bicyclists, a national non-profit bicycling safety
    and education association, has declared the month of May to be National Bike Month for each of
    the last fifty-four (54) years, and has done so again in 2010; and
    WHEREAS, “Bike & Walk Montclair”, together with advocacy groups throughout the
    state, are promoting greater public awareness of bicycle operation and safety education in an
    effort to reduce accidents, injuries and fatalities for all; and
    WHEREAS, it is important to emphasize safe bicycle use, including the use of helmets,
    and strict observance of traffic laws; and
    WHEREAS, National Bike Month provides an opportunity to increase public awareness
    of the many benefits of bicycling, to promote bicycle safety, and to encourage bicycle riding
    through organized activities such as Montclair’s annual Tour de Montclair, Bike-to-Work events,
    club rides, family rides, and bike rodeos for children; now therefore
    BE IT RESOLVED by the Council of the Township of Montclair, in the County of
    Essex, that the month of May is hereby proclaimed NATIONAL BIKE MONTH in the
    Township of Montclair and the Council urges all residents to recognize the importance of bicycle
    safety and to be more aware of cyclists on our streets and highways.

  283. Stu says:

    I need to see if I can get a proclamation on the agenda to declare June, bend over month Montclair.

  284. cobbler says:

    cindy [290]
    When the small businesses think someone wants to buy their products, whatever they are, they will hire and expand. No paperwork issue will be a problem. Right now, this demand is absent, and no tax benefit will make them hire.

  285. gary says:

    17% unemployment? Ecological disaster? F*ck that sh1t, this is what really matters:

  286. Pat says:

    Stu, for the first time tonight, I got no argument from my sister, a retired teacher, when the subject of public employee benefits came up.

    I guess now that she’s got her pension, everybody else can eat dirt. Maybe the boomer public employees will just throw the young’uns to the wolves. I think that is the direction we’re headed, so all you complainers can relax. Nature will take care of things.

    Years ago, when I was crawling up the ladder, getting laid off, finding new jobs, crawling, getting laid…whatever…her reasoning was always that it’s obviously a private system problem and if we all just had unions, we would have pensions, too.

    As she approached retirement, she sometimes admitted that she could see that there was a lot of unfairness. Obviously, I worked more hours with no overtime, less vacation, no summers off with my kid, late nights, lots of weekends, etc. But she had worked hard for what she was promised and if I wanted those things I should’ve been a teacher, too.

    She didn’t quite get it that it’s just not realistic for every person who is capable of being a teacher to actually be a teacher. There just aren’t enough parking spaces.

    Anyway, the grazing land is getting sparse. They know it, and it will be interesting to watch the economics of survival for the public sector.

  287. jamil says:

    290 cindy
    Re country needing jobs.
    Luckily, nationalized hc, IRS, obama jugend and all those Big Gov and big brother positions provide millions of jobs.
    100% of them in public sector, of course.

  288. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:


    Its gonna be a blood bath.

    Put your couch out on the front lawn and enjoy the view of smoke on the horizon. Pay no attention to those funny looking clouds either. They are there for your benefit.

    Biggest fraud in the history of mankind. Gotta respect the balls of some of these guys.

    Careful with your triggers gentlemen. Brick armory had another accidental shooting. High caliber rifle dropped and went off shooting another guy in the leg.

    Peoples trigger fingers are getting a little itchy.

  289. Cindy says:

    303 Cobbler

    “…demand is absent…” True. Of course you are right. – I feel frustrated. As the report says @ 294 – Getting the unemployment rate down is going to take years.

  290. Shore Guy says:


    Whew. At least one government is focusing on what is important. All those pesky people looking at distracting things like budgets just don’t get it.

  291. Cindy says:

    Pat 305/306

    The new hires being laid off across the country are the coaches and activities directors, the technology gurus…those who know the latest techniques for working with students with learning disabilities….no, it isn’t right.

    I have never worked for a union (Oregon school was non-union as well) so I don’t know what to say. The tenured teachers at union schools do want layoffs. It is happening all around me. I guess it is a union mentality because they could vote to cut pay instead of lay off teachers.

    About the pension – I do understand how fortunate I am. It will be a small amount but something every month. I worked under a tiered system in Oregon where they adapted the retirement age and terms as times became more challenging. CA needs to do something soon.

    If it all falls apart, the market crashes etc. etc., there will be no pension system anyway. I think the brief glimpse of the Lehman collapse convinced me of that.

    These are as hard a times as I have ever seen for folks. The lack of security is wearing on everyone. I’m exhausted…I read tirelessly looking for solutions. I am getting nowhere by the way.

  292. Juice Box says:

    It’s a bad time to buy

    writing in from Ireland with a bit of insomnia

  293. SG says:

    Fed prez cited rates for bubble

    The president of the Federal Reserve Bank of Atlanta told fellow policy makers in 2004 that the central bank’s low interest rates may be contributing to surging home prices, according to transcripts of their meetings.

    “The substantial run-up in house prices, which we have followed in Florida and also see in the populous Northeast and West Coast of the United States, may be at least partially attributable to unusually low mortgage rates influenced by our very accommodative policy,” then-Fed Bank of Atlanta President Jack Guynn told the Federal Open Market Committee on Dec. 14, 2004, according to transcripts released yesterday.

    Economists have said that low interest rates under former Fed Chairman Alan Greenspan helped fuel the housing boom and bust that precipitated the recession. Ben Bernanke, the current chairman and a Fed governor in 2004, has disagreed, saying in a January speech that the central bank’s policy of maintaining a low target rate shouldn’t be blamed for the housing bubble.

    In March 2004, Guynn, who retired in 2006, also warned of speculative excess in housing, saying, “A number of folks are expressing growing concern about potential overbuilding and worrisome speculation in the real estate markets, especially in Florida.”

  294. Confused in NJ says:

    306.Pat says:
    May 1, 2010 at 10:12 pm
    Stu, for the first time tonight, I got no argument from my sister, a retired teacher, when the subject of public employee benefits came up.

    I guess now that she’s got her pension, everybody else can eat dirt.

    Unions basically are “Closed Clubs” and and only survive by adhering to the philosophy that anyone not in the Club “Can Eat Dirt”.

  295. SG says:

    Transcripts Show Fed’s Debate Over Rate Rises

    Some economists today argue that signal of a slow, steady path of rate increases helped to fuel the credit boom by giving lenders and buyers too much certainty about the outlook. The intense 2004 Fed debate behind that decision, revealed in transcripts of meetings released by the central bank Friday, is doubly important today because the Fed could be on course to repeat it.

    In May 2004, the Fed was about to begin raising interest rates from 1% and was torn about whether to signal to the market that rates would rise at a “measured pace,” a not-so-subtle signal that they were likely to go up in quarter-point increments. Several officials fought hard against sending the signal, arguing it could handcuff the central bank if it needed to raise rates more aggressively.

    “I just wonder whether we’re generating another problem by adding ‘measured,'” said Anthony Santomero, former president of the Federal Reserve Bank of Philadelphia. “I, too, am still in the camp that would prefer not have a commitment in the statement,” said Susan Bies, a Fed governor.

    Their arguments were overruled by former Fed Chairman Alan Greenspan, with the support of Mr. Bernanke. “The new wording will serve the very useful function of reducing the chance of an overreaction in the bond market that would damage both the markets and the economy,” Mr. Bernanke argued. Also on board was Timothy Geithner, the Treasury secretary who was then president of the Federal Reserve Bank of New York.

    The Fed proceeded on a path of small, predictable interest rate increases between June 2004 and June 2006, when it raised the federal funds rate 17 consecutive times in quarter-percentage-point increments.

  296. Final Doom says:

    Shore (207)-

    Then what the hell are you doing here?

    “…we have doubts about buying in places that are outside the protection of the US Constitution.”

  297. SG says:

    Mortgage expert: Foreclosures will hurt housing for 3-5 years

    The U.S. housing market won’t recover for three to five years as mounting foreclosures hold down prices, according to mortgage-bond pioneer Lewis Ranieri.

    “There’s another big leg down and the question is how long does it stay,” Ranieri, chairman of Ranieri Partners LLC, said during a panel discussion today at the Milken Institute Global Conference in Beverly Hills, California. “You can’t have much of a rally when you’ve got this big overhang.”

    Home foreclosures probably will reach a record this year with more than 1 million properties seized by banks, according to data seller RealtyTrac Inc. Unemployment was 9.7 percent in March, unchanged for a third month, according to the Labor Department, and a fifth of mortgaged U.S. homes were worth less than their loans in the fourth quarter, reported.

    Home prices in 20 U.S. metro areas rose 0.6 percent in February from a year earlier, the first gain since December 2006, according to the S&P/Case-Shiller index. Eleven of the cities showed year-over-year declines, led by a 15 percent drop in Las Vegas and a 6 percent drop in Tampa, Florida.

    “These data point to a risk that home prices could decline further before experiencing any sustained gains,” David Blitzer, chairman of the S&P index committee, said yesterday. “It is too early to say that the housing market is recovering.”

    At least 3 million new properties will join 5 million already in a “cloud” of distress in the next 18 months, Ranieri said.

    Ranieri, 63, helped turn New York-based Salomon Brothers into Wall Street’s most-profitable firm in the 1980s by being one of the first to package mortgages and sell them as securities.

  298. Shore Guy says:


    I miss your point. I may need more coffee before I get it.

  299. Confused in NJ says:

    WASHINGTON – President Barack Obama awaited a firsthand update Sunday on the Gulf Coast oil spill and efforts to contain the environmental damage, and two members of his Cabinet hit the talk show circuit as the administration tried to counter criticism it had reacted slowly to the disaster.

    Obama planned to fly to Louisiana for briefings on the underwater spill, which remained unstopped and impossible to measure, raising fears it could be pouring more oil into the Gulf than earlier believed.

    The Coast Guard estimated that at least 1.6 million gallons of oil have spilled since the April 20 explosion that killed 11 workers on an offshore rig. In the Exxon Valdez disaster, an oil tanker spilled 11 million gallons off Alaska’s shores in 1989.

    Obama has said his administration will do all that it can to battle the spill, which came from a BP oil company exploratory rig. The spill is already the worst in U.S. waters in decades.

    Obama has relied on reports from agency chiefs and Coast Guard officials since the magnitude of the spill became clear late Wednesday. Aides report he’s been getting regular updates.

    Interior Secretary Ken Salazar and Homeland Security Secretary Janet Napolitano scheduled appearances across the Sunday morning talk shows to detail the administration’s efforts in dealing with the environmental disaster. Joining them was the commandant of the Coast Guard, Adm. Thad Allen.

    Obama has said no new offshore oil drilling leases will be issued unless rigs have new safeguards to prevent a repeat of the explosion that unleashed the massive spill.

    The spill came just weeks after Obama announced plans to open up large areas of the Eastern Seaboard and a part of the Gulf for possible future oil drilling. And it’s led to increasing calls to reconsider that initiative by environmentalists and coastal state lawmakers.

    So, “O” is going to watch the oil spill ruin the US economy. Better if he put his Cabinet in frogman suits and told them to swim down and stop the leak. Amazing, we put a man on the moon and can’t stop a leak. Maybe he’ll hold up the other drilling leases until someone figures out how to stop a leak. We got change alright, from BushKatrina to Obamaggedon. The incompetence multiplies geometrically.

  300. Final Doom says:

    gator (282)-

    Thanks for thinking of me.

    However, my new drink of choice is antifreeze.

  301. yo'me says:

    However, my new drink of choice is antifreeze.

    It has anti-corrosion properties too.I think I am done with alcohol too.I need more hallucinogen

  302. NJGator says:

    Clot 320 – That may just need to be our official National Bike Bike Month drink here in Montclair.

  303. Final Doom says:

    Pat (306)-

    That’s how you know teacher unions are giant Ponzis.

    First in? Screw the latecomers, and get the hell out with max bennies.

  304. Mr hyde says:


    I don’t think O can realistically be criticized for this oil spill. The rig was using cutting edge tech to drill in extreme conditions. The industry standard safeguards were in place.

    When you perferm on the cutting edge in extreme conditions shit happens. There are 1 or 2 additional steps BP could have taken but so far this doesn’t appear to be a case of regulatory failure or operator ineptitude.

    BP is responable fir this in the end but there is a difference between negligence and performing in extreme enviroments at risk

  305. Final Doom says:


    I’m practicing firing my Tec-9 from a moving bicycle.

    I’ve found you have to go for “spray coverage” more than accuracy.

  306. Final Doom says:

    Cindy (311)-

    There are solutions. Unfortunately, they all involve honesty and hard work.

    Therefore, effective solutions will not be employed.

  307. Final Doom says:

    And wait until you see the solutions that the bond vigilantes impose.

    This WILL happen. It always does.

    Yield must be paid.

  308. Mr hyde says:


    they probably won’t be able to stop the spill for another 1-3 months due to the depth at which they were drilling. They are currently constructing a device to capture the oil, but once again the extreme depth requires custom construction which doesn’t happen overnight

    it’s highly likely this spill exceeds exxon valdez when it’s said and done

  309. Confused in NJ says:

    324.Mr hyde says:
    May 2, 2010 at 8:37 am

    I don’t think O can realistically be criticized for this oil spill. The rig was using cutting edge tech to drill in extreme conditions. The industry standard safeguards were in place.

    When you perferm on the cutting edge in extreme conditions shit happens. There are 1 or 2 additional steps BP could have taken but so far this doesn’t appear to be a case of regulatory failure or operator ineptitude.

    BP is responable fir this in the end but there is a difference between negligence and performing in extreme enviroments at risk

    The Fish Stinks from the Head, “O” assumed responsibility when he became President. “Not Me” doesn’t cut it. As Harry Truman said, the “Buck Stops Here”. “O” was already issuing new Leases with no capability to stop leaks. If you are going to jeopardize the Country on this scale, you need your own Government solution. Outsourcing responsibility is B.S.

  310. whatcrash says:

    239 Safe

    $16000 home buyer credit is more likely than 7% mortgage rate.
    BTW, we made an offer on a house came up on market a week ago. Our offer is 8% off asking. The agent said they had many good offers and will be under contract soon. They didn’t bother to counter. A week later, they are having another open house today. I wonder what happened to those good offers.

  311. Yikes says:

    how much damage could this have done if it detonated?

    Investigators removed three propane tanks, fireworks, two filled 5-gallon gasoline containers, and two clocks with batteries, electrical wire and other components from the back of the Nissan Pathfinder, Police Commissioner Raymond Kelly said. A black metal box resembling a gun locker was also recovered and will be detonated off site, he said.

  312. whatcrash says:

    271 Arizona Citizen

    Violation of the law is not necessarily crime.

  313. safeashouses says:

    #331 whatcrash,

    We made an offer for 2% over ask at a weekday open house for a house in the neighborhood we are renting in. Our agent calls their agent and the guy claims he can’t get a hold of his clients. Next day he’s still claiming that. The clients are his son and daughter-in-law. Our agent tells him that is bs. Listing agent admitted they were still showing the house and planning an open house for Sunday.

    Meanwhile I bumped into the DIL who is selling the house. I overheard her telling one of her friends everything that is wrong with the house. And how everyone wants to close right away. I thought bs, we offered with a mid June close, and allowing you to rent it to mid August. Listing agent asked us to come back with out best and final offer. We countered with a big zero and withdrew our offer.

  314. chicagofinance says:

    Documentary on ’74-75 Flyers hits mark

    Last Updated: 5:53 AM, May 2, 2010

    Posted: 2:08 AM, May 2, 2010

    I’m not suggesting that you had to be there to grasp what went on. But it would help. To that end, HBO does a strong job trying to place us all there. See for yourself. “Broad Street Bullies,” about the 1974 and ’75 Stanley Cup champion Philadelphia Flyers, debuts Tuesday at 10 p.m.

    It also might help to know what it was like to be an entry-level hockey fan in New York, a nine-year-old stuck rooting for the Rangers in the early 1960s. In a six-team NHL — first four make the playoffs — the big race, every season, was between the Rangers and Bruins for fifth and sixth.

    Before Red Sox-Yankees became a holy war mostly waged between quality sides, the NHL’s Boston-New York rivalry was fought over which team would finish last, like rooting for the other side to have a larger rash. Rangers fans and Bruins fans did not get along.

    Then, in 1968, the NHL became a 12-team league. By 1973, the expansion Flyers had become a very good team, in great part due to very bad reasons. The Flyers were so down, dirty, dastardly, despicable, demonized and detested, Bruins and Rangers fans found common ground, bound by their visceral hatred for the Flyers.

    Understand, the Flyers had some terrific players. Bernie Parent in goal. Bobby Clarke, his stick carried head-high — he skated protected by bodyguards — could make goals from anywhere, like a middle-class Wayne Gretzky. Winger Rick MacLeish would shoot, score. Gary Dornhoefer was an accomplished “garbage man,” set up in front of opposing goalies. Bill Barber made and scored goals.

    But the Flyers were loaded with unassailable beasts, bullies and brawlers who, as stand-alone acts, were not as effective as when they played together as Flyers. It seemed that at no time did the Flyers not have on the ice at least one professional intimidator. Shift after shift, four straight seasons, the Flyers scared the hell out of the NHL.

    Dave “The Hammer” Schultz, Andre “Moose” Dupont, Bob “Hound Dog” Kelly, Don “Big Bird” Saleski, Ed Van Impe (who looked eerily like Lee Harvey Oswald’s assassin, Jack Ruby), “Cowboy” Bill Flett and Simon Nolet comprised the core of the hardcore.

    Every shift included a Flyer eager to start a fight and at least one even more eager to finish it. Throughout North America, if you were a hockey fan who wasn’t a Flyers fan, you despised the Flyers.

    Thirty-five years later, that animosity among fans of 11 of the 12 teams, so help me, lingers. Even today to see a Flyers jersey is to, at first glance, think mayhem.

    HBO’s “Broad Street Bullies” is a good (?) look back, an explanation and examination of the unforgettable and often unforgivable. Eyewitness testimonies include those of Post colleague Jay Greenberg, who covered the Flyers for the Philadelphia Bulletin. And Van Impe, today, still looks like Jack Ruby.

    Unlike some HBO documentaries, this one presents mostly straight-ahead story-telling, a solid show-and-tell with little attempt to attach time-coded and time-coated socio-political significance to the tale of a hockey team. That’s good, because the Flyers were what they were.

    Every May, for the last dozen years, I’ve attended a charity event in Central Jersey, a fundraising golf event that draws Flyers from “those” teams — brother defensemen Joe and Jim Watson, center Orest Kindrachuk, Kelly.

    It disturbs me that they seem like very nice guys. I was hoping for far worse, which would have been much better.

    And, around tables and over drinks after golf — and because I can’t help it — I ask if they realize how much, outside of Philly, their team was hated. And their response is roughly the same: A thin smile, knowing nods and, finally, an unapologetic, “Yes.” Apparently, outside of Philly, those Flyers are asked that a lot.

  315. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:



    Im waiting for Soros and the MFA to show up on our shores again as well. Heres a little tidbit from Greece that should open some eyes.

    “THIS IS A BREAKING NEWS UPDATE. Check back soon for further information. AP’s earlier story is below.

    ATHENS, Greece (AP) — Greece reached agreement with the European Union and the International Monetary Fund on rescue loans to keep Athens from defaulting on its debts, a deal that will impose harsh cuts on the county’s 11 million people for years.

    The first ever bailout of one of the 16 countries using the euro will require tax increases and salary and pension cuts for civil servants to cut the deficit to within EU limits by 2014, the Greek finance minister said Sunday.”

  316. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:


    Im guessing this oil rig in the gulf is turning out to be a bigger disaster than expected.

    So if I understand it correctly. They were drilling in 5000 feet of water then drilled 30k more feet. They tapped into oil under extreme pressure blowing out all the safety valves thereby sinking the oil rig. The oil rig is laying on top of the whole spewing oil and it would take years to move the rig.

    So only a nuclear bomb could plug the hole in the ocean floor and we are currently spewing 1 million gallons of oil into the ocean a week.

    Stinks like a false flag to me.

  317. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:

    Doesnt look like the Greeks like the IMF plan too much.

    May day riots turn violent

  318. Final Doom says:

    yikes (332)-

    Precursor to false flag ops.

  319. Final Doom says:

    safe (334)-

    Why even bother looking in this market of dumbasses?

  320. Final Doom says:

    al (338)-

    If you just went from getting paid for 14 months for every 12 months of “work” you do to just getting a day’s pay for a day of work, would you be happy?

    Remember, also, that these are people who have never had any incentive to actually work from the day they were born.

  321. Rusty Trombone says:

    Eat my bird, it’s only a swallow.

  322. SysAdmin says:

    Wondering about UE rate…

    If an unemployed person is not actively looking for a job and is not counted as unemployed can an employeed person, looking for a job be counted as not employed (unemployed)?

    In that case UE could be more close to 50% or more maybe.

  323. yo'me says:

    As defined by the International Labour Organization, “unemployed workers” are those who are currently not working but are willing and able to work for pay, currently available to work, and have actively searched for work.[44] Individuals who are actively seeking job placement must make the effort to: be in contact with an employer, have job interviews, contact job placement agencies, send out resumes, submit applications, respond to advertisements, or some other means of active job searching within the prior four weeks. Simply looking at advertisements and not responding will not count as actively seeking job placement

    All the people that are still getting Unemployment check (State and Federal)are still counted in the U3.Reason being;there is a question if you are actively looking for employment.To get benefits you have to say YES.Almost 2 years UE Benefits,Federal UE extension is going 1.5 years and 6 months for State.
    Being most people still being counted from the beginning of the crisis as U3,U6 estimate of 20% is flawed.

  324. Stu says:

    Drill Baby Drill!


  325. yo'me says:

    Does anybody have a figure, the amount the Fed bought in treasuries?It is considered debt but we pay interest to us and being destroyed as it is getting paid.

  326. Nomad says:

    More of what you already know from Housing Wire –

    why on earth a bank does not go after someone who can pay their mtg but chooses not to is beyond me. I put in 55+ hrs a week to get my a$$ taxed off to pay for these and a whole slew of free loading parasites.

    Wonder if any citizens are going to get so fed up they flat out stop paying taxes. This is beyond ridiculous.

    Strategic Defaults on Mortgages are Rising, But by How Much?

    More and more defaults are considered “strategic” — where borrowers choose to walk away from underwater mortgage obligations regardless of their ability to pay –although to what extent is still up for debate as two studies, one from academia and one from an investment bank, find differing levels of homeowners walking away.

  327. SysAdmin says:

    Regarding the increased 1099 burden in healthcare bill…

    Maybe that is the first step towards VATing. In which case, begs the question.. would it be a good decision to convert to RothIRA?

  328. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:


    80% of all treasury debt was purchased by the Fed Reserve in 2009.

  329. yo'me says:

    349 Basically,we borrowed from us.Interest being payed on that 80% debt since 2009 becomes an asset of the USA and principal is being destroyed.

  330. yo'me says:


  331. meter says:

    @349 – Al:

    What could possibly go wrong?

  332. yo'me says:

    Monetization or printing money will create inflation,if not destroyed in time.

  333. Final Doom says:

    Yo’me, it’s all going to black. Why fight it? Strategic default and being a smart deadbeat are actually the prudent paths to take, thanks to the morally bankrupt US gubmint. All the current idiocies are actually being encouraged, so that even more egregious privations can be visited upon people who still have a shred of pride and ambition. Remember, a collectivist state needs a core class of hard workers to support the deadwood. It’s a real thread-the-needle job to keep that class both hardworking and brainwashed as to their grim reality.

    When I finally default on everything, it’s gonna be spectacular.

  334. yo'me says:

    I am with you!If they can do just that, without bringing down the house of card,I am sure that would have been the choice they took.
    I am guessing,they are buying another 10 to 15 years before another crisis.

    That is just me.We all believed the house of cards was going down until they showed they got something under that sleeve.I believe they got alot more as long as the Dollar is a dominant trading currency.

  335. Mr hyde says:


    false flag? I would lean towards not. This type of drilling is cutting edge and known to be risky.

    They are currently building a dome to lower over the well and capture the leaking oil, which will then be piped to proceeding facilities. Due to the depth of the water a custom dome must be built and existing ones don’t work at that depth.

    The deepwater projects are inherently risky. Look at the north sea.

    One possible cause is that BP may have been using titanium piping or a thicker steel piping due to the extreme depths and as such the emergency blowout preventor, a device which essentially crushes the pipe closed, was not powerfully enough to fully crush the pipe.

    Drilling at these depths is still in a learning curve and there are bound to be “bugs” along the way. This may have been a very large and costly “bug”.

    Also consider that the formation they were drilling in is known to be VERY high pressure and temperature.

  336. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    the new family taboo will be that ” aunt and uncle so and so haven’t paid their mortage in five years”
    With this thing in the gulf, its going to get bad. Banks won’t even bother with evictions.

  337. Mr hyde says:


    Any well planned false flag needs a number of messy civilian deaths that are well publicized. The rig workers who died don’t fit that role ad they were pros in thierry field and knew the risks. There aren’t any pretty pictures of gore for the MSM.

  338. Shore Guy says:

    “Drill Baby Drill”

    Oil is too valuable to burn.

  339. Mr hyde says:


    the are doing “controlled” burns of the surface oil slicks in the gulf to try and minimize what comes ashore

  340. njescapee says:

    Been cycling and just taking in the beauty of the beaches and waterviews in Key West. It will be a tragedy of unnimaginable proportions if the oil moves into the gulstream. It will just devastate south Florida.

  341. Shore Guy says:


    They should have strted those days ago. It is a shame though. Before long we need to switch to other sources of energy and here we are burning up this incredible long-chsined hydrocrbon, from which we can make anything. I would rather we save a bunch of it for future genertions to make all sorts of useful things, like nylon stockings.

  342. Final Doom says:

    You can strangle somebody with a nylon stocking, right?

  343. safeashouses says:

    Drill baby drill.

    I bet the teabaggers who want limited government will cry out for fed intervention, while the pro giant government will be silent on this mother of all drilling accidents.

  344. safeashouses says:

    At least people who bought beach front property in the gulf at the peak will soon be in the black.

  345. Mr Hyde says:


    I believe they started control burns within 48 hrs

  346. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:

    “Yannos Papantoniou, a former finance minister from the Greek Socialist party, said Greek patience with the cost-cutting measures could run out, in particular, if the large population of poor Greeks were hit hard, if recession did not give way to growth and if already high unemployment increased.”

    Where does the growth come from if everyone has an overstaffed, idle, and guaranteed civil service job?

    Productive people of the world unite! Lets throw off the parasitic class through economic triage once and for all.

  347. Mr Hyde says:

    Anyone wondering which European countries countries owe each other and how much see the following graphic

  348. yo'me says:

    the new family taboo will be that ” aunt and uncle so and so haven’t paid their mortage in five years”
    With this thing in the gulf, its going to get bad. Banks won’t even bother with evictions.

    My theory is ;The gubmint is letting people that can’t afford their mortgages stop paying and negotiate for a fair price with the bank.The Fed bought most of those toxic loans from the banks through Fannie,Freddie and FHA to Isolate the sector w/o bringing down the house of cards by monetizing.Just like what Doom is saying they are going to dump this GSE’s at .50 to a dollar and the tax payers did not really loose any money coz it was the feds that borrowed it.Worthless paper is worthless.

    Its just like saying Social Security has 2 trillion surplus but they will not pay it.

  349. Confused in NJ says:

    VENICE, La. – No remedy in sight, President Barack Obama on Sunday warned of a “massive and potentially unprecedented environmental disaster” as a badly damaged oil well a mile deep in the Gulf of Mexico spewed a widening and deadly slick toward delicate wetlands and wildlife. He said it could take many days to stop.

    Obama rushed to southern Louisiana to inspect forces arrayed against the oil gusher as Cabinet members said the situation was grave and insisted the administration was doing everything it could.

    Mindful of the political damage suffered by President George W. Bush for a slow response after Hurricane Katrina ravaged the same region, Obama defended his administration’s actions, saying it had been preparing for the worst from “day one” even as it had “hoped for the best.”

    The president vowed that the administration, while doing all it could to mitigate the environmental and economic disaster, would require well-owner BP America to bear all costs.

    “BP is responsible for this leak. BP will be paying the bill,” Obama, with rain dripping from his face, said in Venice, a Gulf Coast community serving as a staging area for the response.

  350. Shore Guy says:


    I was under the impression that the first week was given over to trying to disperse the slick and that burning did not start until after that, when it was xlear that the coast wasgoing to be hit if they did not, and likely would still be hit even if they did burn.

  351. Shore Guy says:

    “The president vowed that the administration, while doing all it could to mitigate the environmental and economic disaster, would require well-owner BP America to bear all costs”

    Meanwhile, today BP America announced plans to become a bank holding company and is asking the Fed to pick up the costs of the cleanup as well as all future exploration costs. Asked about these developments the Fed Chair said, “It makes as much sense as anything else we have done the past two years so, sure, why not.”

  352. Confused in NJ says:

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  353. Al "The Thermostat" Gore says:

    Any state pensioneers here?

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    While your pension promises are destroyed rest assured the US taxpayer will be paying some Greek bum to sit in an office all day doing nothing.

    That shadow on the horizon is the IMF. Soros and his friends are coming and they will be riding a pale horse trained by the IMF.

  354. house hunter says:

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  355. yo'me says:

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    Friday, 30 Apr 2010 12:40 PM

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  358. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    “Anyone wondering which European countries countries owe each other and how much see the following graphic”

    Hyde [370],

    One giant piece of the puzzle missing; no tentacles crossing the pond to fedco? All bailouts are led by the IMF. Who’s funding the IMF? Thank you John Q. Any question why the fed is fighting transparency? The fed’s swap line’s to ECB’s and the IMF are buzzing. Who cares if Greece, Portugal, Spain, etc.., can’t print? The sheeple in the US will bail out the world. It’s QE to infinity. Hard to pathom why anybody, with a pea for a brain, would continue to hold paper?

    AG (376),


  359. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    The country bumpkin, who has been swimming naked, is approx 3 years behind this site.

    Thank you Warren. However, we have been placing odds, on the great race to the bottom, since 2007.

    “OMAHA , Neb. (MarketWatch) — Warren Buffett said Saturday that he’s bearish about the ability of all currencies to hold their value over time because of massive deficits being run up by governments in the wake of the global financial crisis.”

    Cutting edge;

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  360. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    just know the nuke lobby is either licking their chops or sh#tting bricks right now. How the public will view their “clean, safe” propaganda could go either way after this mess.

  361. Final Doom says:

    The rider of that pale horse on the horizon isn’t Soros; it’s the Grim Reaper.

  362. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:


  363. Shore Guy says:

    Tom Petty tunes appropriate for the housing decline:

    Free Falling
    Running down a Dream
    (and if things get really bad) Refuge.

  364. Shore Guy says:


  365. Mr Wantanapolous says:


    What about Dead Man Walkin?

    “There’s a pale horse comin’
    I’m gonna ride it
    I’ll rise in the morning
    My fate decided
    I’m a dead man walkin’
    I’m a dead man walkin'”

    Then again;

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    Gonna be a long walk home
    Hey pretty Darling, don’t wait up for me
    Gonna be a long walk home
    It’s gonna be a long walk home

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  366. Confused in NJ says:

    VENICE, La. – Federal officials shut down fishing from the Mississippi River to the Florida Panhandle on Sunday because of the uncontrolled gusher spewing massive amounts of oil into the Gulf of Mexico, and the environmental disaster is still expected to take at least a week to cut off.

    Even that toxic scenario may be too rosy because it depends on a low-tech strategy that has never been attempted before in deep water.

    The plan: to lower 74-ton, concrete-and-metal boxes into the gulf to capture the oil and siphon it to a barge waiting at the surface. Whether that will work for a leak 5,000 feet below the surface is anyone’s guess; the method has previously worked only in shallower waters.

    If it doesn’t, and efforts to activate a shutoff mechanism called a blowout preventer continue to prove fruitless, the oil probably will keep gushing for months until a second well can be dug to cut off the first. Oil giant BP PLC’s latest plan will take six to eight days because welders have to assemble the boxes.

    President Barack Obama toured the region Sunday, deflecting criticism that his administration was too slow to respond and did too little to stave off the catastrophe.

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