“We’re just not going to recover if the jobs don’t come back”

From the Daily Journal:

Real estate market not out of woods yet

VINELAND — Residential real estate still struggles in communities in Cumberland County and western Atlantic County, especially in the high-value end of the market.

Federal tax credit incentives for new and existing homebuyers were some help over the past 12 months, local real estate professional say.

But those credits, which expired April 30, weren’t nearly enough to counteract what ails the market:

* A continuing lack of credit.

* High unemployment.

* General consumer jitters over the future.

Vineland broker William Jannarone said the size of the unemployment rolls is equal or greater than any other problem in the market.

“We’re just not going to recover if the jobs don’t come back — and they’ve got to come strongly,” Jannarone said. “That should be the issue we’re focused on. What do we do about creating jobs?”

The real estate market’s condition recently led Millville-based agent George Pangburn to retire.

“We went from 43 agents at G.R. Pangburn to 12, and those agents weren’t doing anything,” Pangburn said. “At 74, I didn’t need to do that.”

There were 846 homes sold in the area between April 2009 and March 2010. That’s a respectable 11 percent increase compared to the preceding 12-month period.

In addition, the total dollar value of all those sales rose from about $124.3 million to about $132.7 million, a positive difference of about $8.4 million.

Behind those facts though, the average sales price went down for the area as a whole.

# In Vineland, there was a roughly $6 million increase in sales value over the past 12 months compared to the preceding year. That’s about a 12 percent increase. But the average price dropped almost 6 percent.

# In Millville, sales volume went up about $2.4 million for the same periods. That’s about a 9 percent increase. The average price for a sale was down almost 6 percent, though.

This entry was posted in Economics, Housing Bubble, South Jersey Real Estate. Bookmark the permalink.

322 Responses to “We’re just not going to recover if the jobs don’t come back”

  1. grim says:

    From the Daily Record:

    Governor to unveil property tax cap, other reforms Monday

    Gov. Chris Christie plans to unveil a 33-bill package Monday making up his long-anticipated “tool kit” of systemic reforms, including lower, stricter limits on property tax increases and a host of changes to rules that govern civil service, collective bargaining and public employees’ salaries and benefits.

    According to administration briefing details obtained Saturday by Gannett New Jersey, the legislative package contains a mix of ideas that Christie rolled out in his March budget proposal and a host of new wrinkles. Christie’s overall plan is also expected to include changes that can be achieved through executive orders or other adjustments within administrative agencies.

    The memo also hints at other changes that may be examined further by state Treasurer Andrew Sidamon-Eristoff and other Cabinet members, such as cutting cost-of-living adjustments to pensions, having public employees pay more toward their pensions and health care, raising the retirement age to 65, making current employees contribute toward their health care when they’re retired, eliminating all state-run health plans and closing the traditional pension plan for new hires.

  2. grim says:

    From MarketWatch:

    Single women outpace single men in real-estate market

    For Mother’s Day, flowers and chocolate are nice, but watching your single daughter take the lead in the real-estate market may be even nicer.

    Unmarried women accounted for 21% of home purchases in 2009, while unwed males were 10% of the buyers, according to a National Association of Realtors report in November. It’s a dramatic shift from 1981, the first year the numbers were tracked, when single women and men each accounted for 10% of home sales.

    Still, some industry professionals have been slow to take note of females’ robust activity. Single women have held steady at the 20 % mark for more than five years, yet when the Urban Land Institute hosted its annual real-estate conference in late April, analysts had to remind the audience to expect big numbers from young, single female buyers.

    “I’ve given some of my [home-building] clients lessons on how to be gender friendly,” said Brooke Warrick, president of the market research firm American Lives. He reminded sellers to treat young women as viable buyers, not bystanders, by doing something as simple as handing them a brochure when they enter a for-sale home.

    His advice to real-estate developers: “Make sure to pay enough attention to these women. You want these women.”

  3. grim says:

    From the WSJ:

    Mortgage Paid. A Dozen Debts to Go.

    After months of negotiations, Wells Fargo & Co. agreed in February to reduce Cynthia Mason’s mortgage payments by about $300 a month.

    But the 49-year-old resident of Volente, Texas, a former school secretary who is unemployed and battling cancer, says her income still falls short of what she needs for medical and legal bills, health insurance, credit cards, a car loan—and the mortgage.

    “I think the whole process is a sham,” Ms. Mason said, angry that the San Francisco bank didn’t do more to help reduce her debt load. A Wells Fargo spokeswoman declined to comment on her situation.

    As the Obama administration prods banks to rev up mortgage modifications for millions of households, an obstacle is emerging: Many people’s debt woes go far deeper than theirhome loans. Rewriting their mortgages is little more than a bandage on a gaping financial wound.

    Mike Thompson, director of the Iowa Mediation Service, which counsels borrowers facing foreclosure, said 25% to 30% of borrowers who got mortgage modifications last year are now coming back for more help because they are struggling with their remaining debt payments.

    Debt counselors say some borrowers got into trouble because of overspending, while others are wallowing in debt because of such things as illness, divorce or unemployment.

  4. grim says:

    From the WSJ:

    Real Estate’s Far Reach to Continue to Pinch

    Highflying property prices drove the most-recent economic boom, and a collapse in real-estate values hammered it back down. Now, as the economy struggles to regain strength, real estate is expected to continue to act as a brake, rather than an accelerator.

    Despite clear signs of revival in the larger economy, including upturns in manufacturing and consumer spending, the nation’s market for homes and office buildings remains mired in foreclosures and oversupply. That imbalance will be worked out over time, but in the meantime, it is slowing the recovery in myriad ways.

    Less construction means fewer jobs.

    Home owners who once felt rich are feeling poorer.

    Small businesses aren’t borrowing as much.

    Lower real-estate values translate into lower property taxes, crimping government spending.

  5. grim says:

    From the NYT:

    Ignoring the Elephant in the Bailout

    If you blinked, you might have missed the ugly first-quarter report last week from Freddie Mac, the mortgage finance giant that, along with its sister Fannie Mae, soldiers on as one of the financial world’s biggest wards of the state.

    Freddie — already propped up with $52 billion in taxpayer funds used to rescue the company from its own mistakes — recorded a loss of $6.7 billion and said it would require an additional $10.6 billion from taxpayers to shore up its financial position.

    The news caused nary a ripple in the placid Washington scene. Perhaps that’s because many lawmakers, especially those who once assured us that Fannie and Freddie would never cost taxpayers a dime, hope that their constituents don’t notice the burgeoning money pit these mortgage monsters represent. Some $130 billion in federal money had already been larded on both companies before Freddie’s latest request.

    But taxpayers should examine Freddie’s first-quarter numbers not only because the losses are our responsibility. Since they also include details on Freddie’s delinquent mortgages, the company’s sales of foreclosed properties and losses on those sales, the results provide a telling snapshot of the current state of the housing market.

    That picture isn’t pretty. Serious delinquencies in Freddie’s single-family conventional loan portfolio — those more than 90 days late — came in at 4.13 percent, up from 2.41 percent for the period a year earlier. Delinquencies in the company’s Alt-A book, one step up from subprime loans, totaled 12.84 percent, while delinquencies on interest-only mortgages were 18.5 percent. Delinquencies on its small portfolio of option-adjustable rate loans totaled 19.8 percent.

    The company’s inventory of foreclosed properties rose from 29,145 units at the end of March 2009 to almost 54,000 units this year. Perhaps most troubling, Freddie’s nonperforming assets almost doubled, rising to $115 billion from $62 billion.

  6. grim says:

    From Reuters:

    Trend of U.S. mortgages ‘underwater’ grows – Zillow

    A growing percentage of U.S. homeowners were saddled with “underwater mortgages” in the first quarter, accounting for almost one in four homes in a trend that poses a serious threat to the housing market’s recovery, real estate website Zillow.com said on Monday.

    U.S. home values also declined again in the first quarter, Zillow reported.

    Homeowners with “underwater” mortgages — where the amount owed on the mortgage exceeds the value of the home — are more prone to defaults and foreclosures.

    The percentage of American single-family homes with mortgages in negative equity rose to 23.3 percent in the first quarter from 21.4 percent in the fourth quarter, according to the Zillow Real Estate Market Reports.

    U.S. home values in the first quarter were down 3.8 percent year-over-year and down 1 percent quarter-over-quarter, to $183,700, according to the Zillow Home Value Index. It was the 13th consecutive quarter of year-over-year declines.

    Home values declined year-over-year in 106 of the 135 metropolitan areas tracked by Zillow.

  7. grim says:

    From the NY Daily News:

    Truman Capote’s 11-bedroom Brooklyn Heights mansion on the market for a record $18M

    Brooklyn’s most fabulous house, the 11-bedroom mansion where Truman Capote wrote his most famous books, can be yours for $18 million.

    The spectacular home at 70 Willow St. in Brooklyn Heights – on the market Monday for just the third time in 70 years – is likely to break sales records in the borough and become the most expensive townhouse in its history.

    The standing record for a Brooklyn house is just under $12 million, set at the dizzying height of the real estate boom.

    Realtors say the lavish, 18-room Willow St. home is expected to top that – crash or no crash. Already, brokers have lined up several showings for international buyers and well-heeled locals wanting a shot at the historic home.

  8. Final Doom says:

    Pump that EUR. FIll that nuclear bomb full of nails, shrapnel, radioactive waste and anthrax.

    As with all else, TPTB are now ensuring that the blowup of that Monopoly-money currency will be no less than a 10-megaton airburst.

    It’ll look purty next to Phony/Fraudy’s big bangs.

    Imagine: a currency supported by backdoor injections of another crippled fiat paper (USD), and backed by the full faith and credit of the biggest bunch of collectivist malingerers known to mankind.

    This is not going to end well.

  9. Simply Ravishing HEHEHE says:

    Huge short squeeze today, sideways trading for a while, slow fall back downwards.

  10. Nomad says:

    I have to disagree with Zillow in #6. I don’t think prices will bottom until middle of Q3 in 2012. Mild economic rebound we are in, if you can call it that will go away at the end of this year. 2nd half of the W to start then.

  11. Final Doom says:

    The slide toward oblivion has begun. Relax, lie back, and don’t fight it. Learn to love it.

  12. Final Doom says:

    I’ve got a new girlfriend (same as my old girlfriend), Precious.

    She’s purty.

  13. Sas3 says:


    Have any tips for loan mods? Friend has been unemployed — some ADD related disability, house value is well below what he bought for in ’05 or so. He was denied by BOA for a loan mod [seems to have had some change in APR to 40 yr 3.8% a couple of years ago].

    My initial suggestion was to threaten jingle mail and see how BOA reacts, but I doubt he can decisively act if BOA calls the bluff.


  14. Confused in NJ says:

    Interesting, the Stock Market is now exclusively a Government Market. Without Government money it tanks. So, every taxpayer is now indirectly playing the “Mother of All Ponzis on Mothers Day”. The coming crash will make the Great Depression look like a “Walk In The Park”.

  15. homeboken says:

    Sas 13 – step 1, tell friend to blank the june and july payments, then call again in 60 days.

  16. frank says:

    Buy a home now, before the guy with the far fingers buys it before you.

  17. Shore Guy says:

    We have seen, time and again, how well-meaning actions, end up hurting. It happens with addicted people, and it happens with the economy.

    When will we learn that people and institutions need to be allowed to hit bottom before they will become sufficiently motivated to change bad behavior? Society can help deal with the fallout of hitting bottom but, attempts to prevent people or institutions from suffering the earned fruits of theirnegative behavior simply encourages continued destructive behavior.

    I have no objection to the government helping folks who cannot pay their mortgage relocate to an apartment, and even paying a coiple months rent, eveen if the rent is higher than the cost of the mortgage they were paying (or not paying, as the case may be); this helpd them but does not put an artificial floor under the market.

    If Medicaid can “lookback” and recover funds transferred out of a person’s accounts for years after the funds were shifted to another person, then the USG should be able to do the same to executives who stripped wealth from companies and took it for themselves during the go-go years.

  18. renter says:

    People in the middle of this process are all about “saving my home” but they need to think about saving themselves…about long term survival. People will deplete savings, empty 401K etc in order to try and save a home. They should start with their income and the figure out how they can live on it. Losing the house and getting into an affordable rental might be the best thing they can do to improve their quality of life.

  19. Sas3 says:

    Shore #17

    The US will never act in a way that would alienate corporate donors. For example, look at the immigration law in AZ… Racism aside, it penalizes employees, and gives rights to 3rd party to sue cops. However, in case of employers hiring “illegals”, it puts an immense burden of proof [of whether the employer knew or not] on the 3rd party and makes them liable if things don’t go right. I am sure the dems have similar cozy deals with corporations.

  20. Sas3 says:

    homeboken #15, what is at risk if there is a 60 day non-payment? This guy has enough family support [they live nearby his parents, etc.], but still…


  21. Any good mortgage leads?

  22. Sas3 says:

    Ima. Doom’s guy is good. I got my mortgage from him.

  23. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Chi, remember you said that ‘closed minded’ investors deserved what they got when market crashed last week.

    They may or may not have. I’m not arguing your opinion on that subject.

    But similarly, the people who sold out of everything in sheer panic last week deserve what they get when this happens:

    S&P futures vs fair value: +45.30. Nasdaq futures vs fair value: +73.80

  24. JJ says:

    Confused in NJ says:

    I think this is my TBTF strategy back to life. I was buying on Thursday and I bought some stale price bonds this morning before the trader drank some coffee and updated his prices. BABBBBBBY We are printing money today. However, the Europeans have no stomach for man sized bail-outs and this might be short-lived. I am already wanting to know when they will bail out the banks. The Greek, Spain and Portugual Banks need bailouts now!!!!!! Short them then long on. God Belss Free Market Capitalism!!

    May 10, 2010 at 8:04 am
    Interesting, the Stock Market is now exclusively a Government Market. Without Government money it tanks. So, every taxpayer is now indirectly playing the “Mother of All Ponzis on Mothers Day”. The coming crash will make the Great Depression look like a “Walk In The Park”.

  25. Mr Hyde says:

    Doom 8

    Do i get a discount if i travel to europe, since i just helped bailout their banks?

    SG should demand a discount when he arrives in france since they have some of the greatest exposure.

  26. Painhrtz says:

    Ima used the same as SAS3

  27. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    bye the way, i took some risk out of my portfolio last week. Out of fear.

    Nothing extreme.

    but Im kicking myself in the teeth right now.

  28. JJ says:

    Veto, sometimes Pigs don’t get slaughtered.

    However, I am still kicking myself I missed the ETF all time buying opp when a few ETF High Yield Bond funds got slaughtered. The yields were amazing during that ten minute sell off!!! 100% a year for life could have been locked in.

    veto that – lawrence yun ‘the

    panda’, ‘next fall’ says:
    May 10, 2010 at 9:01 am
    bye the way, i took some risk out of my portfolio last week. Out of fear.

    Nothing extreme.

    but Im kicking myself in the teeth right now.

  29. Confused in NJ says:

    The problem with playing musical chairs in the current market is, even if you get a chair each time the music stops, this Government is making all your earning worthless, at the end of the game, anyway. You wind up with a Trillion Dollars in Gain, only to find out it’s Confederate Money.

  30. JJ says:

    LIMIT UP!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

  31. JJ says:

    S&P Market Commentary

    … Stock index futures soaring on Globex. European markets soaring after European Union agreed on a 750 billion euro ($955 billion) bailout plan to stanch sovereign debt crisis. ECB said it ready to buy euro-zone government, private bonds “to ensure depth and liquidity” in markets. Fed announced it would reopen swap lines with other central banks to make sure they had access to dollars. Euro soaring, dollar plunging. Greek borrowing costs plunged. Treasuries, gold futures plunging on the European deal. Oil futures sharply higher. SEC holding emergency meeting with exchanges.

  32. JJ says:

    Nice email just sent to trading desks this morning. Game on!!!!

    S&P Futures are up 46 and Dow futures up 364 preopen. Everyone Please be at your trading desks at the open and all IT Support people be available for support at the opening bell.

  33. chicagofinance says:

    JJ: for you….

    Reporter in Tiger disc slip

    Last Updated: 6:46 AM, May 10, 2010

    Posted: 3:21 AM, May 10, 2010

    The Golf Channel reporter who explained why Tiger Woods yesterday pulled out of a major tournament could use some lessons in anatomy.

    “[Woods] says he’s been playing with a bad neck for about a month and thinks it could be a bulging d- – k,” Win McMurry said on-air.

    What she meant to say is that the serial-cheater quit in the final round of The Players Championship in Florida because of a bulging disc in his upper back.

    The red-faced reporter quickly corrected her X-rated observation.

  34. All "H-Train" Hype says:


    You and your boyz better make me some real money today. This latest dose of herion ain’t gonna last too long and I need some more $$$ for my house down payment.

    You better not post too much today as I need you in there buying away!

  35. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “I’ve got a new girlfriend (same as my old girlfriend), Precious.”

    Doom, the lady is a tramp.

  36. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    33 – the first time ive ever heard of tiger pulling out.

  37. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Don’t fret Ladies.

    Bergabe has got this under control.

  38. Final Doom says:

    sastry (13)-

    Sounds like the switch to a 40 @ 3.8% WAS the loan mod.

    Your friend should stop paying. Every 30 days, he should call the bank and try to initiate a mod. If he’s employed, I don’t see why BAC wouldn’t at least send an application.

    If the mod goes nowhere, he should look to do a short sale, so that he can rehab his credit in about 24-36 mos. DIL or FK will kill his credit for much longer.

  39. Final Doom says:

    veets (37)-

    Under control? Har!

    We have basically brewed up financial ebola and spread it into the Eurozone via the re-opened backdoor swaps channel.

    Between Bergabe’s black dealings and Trichet’s utter stupidity, the mother of all worldwide financial collapses is now underway.

    Better find Precious.

  40. Final Doom says:

    And, don’t forget:

    FedCo now stands ready to inject financial ebola into practically every CB on the planet.

    Isn’t that a soothing thought?

    Limit up, indeed.

  41. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “the mother of all worldwide financial collapses is now underway”

    Sadly this is a possibility too.

  42. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:


    Only one thing left to do.

    buy the market.

  43. JJ says:

    nasdaq up 100!!!! Time to sell the market, the loads been shot.

  44. Final Doom says:

    Rally on, Garth:

    (Reuters) – Fannie Mae reported a net loss $13.1 billion on Monday and forecast weakness in the housing and mortgage markets to continue throughout 2010.

    Fannie Mae expects the level of multifamily defaults and serious delinquencies to increase further during 2010. The company also said there is uncertainty regarding future of business after conservatorship terminated and expect this uncertainty to continue.

  45. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [17] shore

    “If Medicaid can “lookback” and recover funds transferred out of a person’s accounts for years after the funds were shifted to another person, then the USG should be able to do the same to executives who stripped wealth from companies and took it for themselves during the go-go years.”

    There is already a mechanism for that, a clawback, and it acts pretty much as you assume, but it is largely a private function where the officers are accountable to shareholders (the USG only benefits via the tax code).

    To implement what you call for, a governmental form of clawback, raises some questions: First, who gets the clawback. Second, isn’t this further along the road to full s0cialism? Third, don’t you think that there will be a lot of externalities that result from such a decision that will either nullify the provision (requiring more s0cialism) or would cause companies to either relist overseas or put themselves up for sale to foreign buyers?

  46. Final Doom says:

    plume (45)-

    Shortly, it will matter not. We’ve now hopped the DeLorean back to the 16th century.

    “Europe has now followed the Fed in its all in move to prevent the disintegration of the euro and of Europe. As we expected, the EU was leaking various rumors to gauge market interest, and as speculated earlier, the final cost ended up being just short of one trillion. Here are the key summaries:

    -EU Crafts $962 billion show of force to halt crisis

    -Full blown monetization: ECB will buy public and private bonds

    -Fed reactivates swap lines with Bank of Canada, BOE, ECB, BOJ, and the SNB

    In other words, total and unprecedented monetary lunacy, as every cental bank, under the orchestration of the Federal Reserve, will throw money at the problem until it goes away, which it won’t. As we have long expected, Bernanke is now willing to sacrifice the dollar at any cost to prevent the euro unwind. This is nothing than a very short-term fix, whose half life will be shorter still than all previous ones.

    The race to the currency devaluation bottom is now in its final lap. And gold is the only alternative to the now imminent collapse of the fiat system: the world had a chance to take writedowns on losses, punish those who took risk and failed, and refused to do so. There is now no risk left, but it only means that eventually all the risk will come back and lead all capital markets to zero. The result will be the end of Keynesian economics as we know it. Do not trade in this broken market, do not hold your money in a bank as they are all now one hour away from a terminal bank run – buy and hold real, FASB mark-to-myth independent assets.”


  47. Patient Renter says:

    Clot / Grim & others

    Do you act as buyers agent ? / Any buyers Agent that you can recommend?

    I am looking for a property in East Brunswick (Middlesex co) and the last thing I need is an agent putting unnecessary pressure on me/wife to bid a higher.


  48. All "H-Train" Hype says:


    I love how 2 weeks ago the EU did not have the 100 billion to help Greece. Now majically, they come up with 1 trillion.

    Simple solution = print money.

    We have gone past the event horizon. There really is no turning back at this point. I used to think that we would be in OK shape by 2012. Now I think the Mayans were totally correct.

  49. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [45] shore

    You raise another point that I want to reiterate in my “look poor” strategy. The Medicaid lookback was increased a few years back from 3 to 5 years, and may go even further.

    Obamacare and SS means-testing will use similar look-backs in the future.

    This means that proper estate planning should be geared toward getting all of your assets out of your name, and putative control, at least 10 years before you expect to be eligible for any government assistance. Ideally, you should do some of this a couple of years before your first child heads to college.

    Note that this doesn’t necessarily involve “giving it away.” Judicious use of debt, the manner in which it is structured, and proper sheltering of the proceeds, may work almost as well.

  50. Mr Hyde says:


    Deadbeat Strategy of the day.

    Buy a house ASAP using a seller rebate to cover the FHFA downpayment. Make perhaps 1 house payment then stop paying the house note and any CC bills, promptly dump all the cash from those payments into Long AU, Long JPY and Short EUR. Make a house payment every 3 months to string the bank along as long as possible and let you positions grow.

  51. make money says:

    Euro is wiining the race to zero. watch Ben start up the helicopter in the coming months.

  52. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Doom, if nj is a recourse state, why would walking away from your mortgage ever make sense?

    (unless you were going into bk)

  53. Mr Hyde says:


    Nj is a nonrecourse state on 1st mortgages. 2nd’s and HELOC are recourse.

  54. Confused in NJ says:

    Seniors Told They Can’t Pray Before Meals
    Posted: 1:55 pm EDT May 8, 2010

    PORT WENTWORTH, Ga. — Preston Blackwelder proudly showed off a painting of his grandmother that had hung next to the front door of his Port Wentworth home.

    She was the woman who led him to God, Blackwelder said Friday.

    And with that firm religious footing, Blackwelder said it would be preposterous to stop praying before meals at Port Wentworth’s Ed Young Senior Citizens Center near Savannah because of a federal guideline.

    “She would say pray anyway,” Blackwelder said of his grandmother. “She’d say don’t listen.”

    But Senior Citizens Inc. officials said Friday the meals they are contracted by the city to provide to Ed Young visitors are mostly covered with federal money, which ushers in the burden of separating church and state.

    On Thursday, the usual open prayer before meals at the center was traded in for a moment of silence.

    The dilemma is being hashed out by the Port Wentworth city attorney, said Mayor Glenn “Pig” Jones.

    Tim Rutherford, Senior Citizens Inc. vice president, said some of his staff recently visited the center and noticed people praying shortly before lunch was served. Rutherford said his company provides meals like baked chicken, steak tips and rice and salads at a cost of about $6 a plate. Seniors taking the meals pay 55 cents and federal money foots the rest of the bill, Rutherford said.

    “We can’t scoff at their rules,” he said of federal authorities. “It’s a part of the operational guidelines.”

  55. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Hyde, nice thanks.
    Jusding from 50, i should have known you knew the answer to this.

  56. All "H-Train" Hype says:

    make money 51:

    Looks like there will not be a rate hike for the “forseeable future”.

    The race to oblivion continues unabated.

  57. Final Doom says:

    rent (47)-

    Pressure? What is pressuring you to want to get in your car, burn up gas, and look at a bunch of dank, cabbage-ass POS being offered by sellers who are more delusional than the seven faces of Eve? Then, once you’ve identified and contracted for your three-bedroom coffin for the rest of your hell-on-Earth life, what is pressuring you to sign up for the no-Vas, five-fingered procto-exam that will be dealt you by your friendly local mortgage broker?

    Pressure? You don’t want an agent to supply PRESSURE? What is the atomspheric pressure inside your head that’s causing that little “buy” bell to ring like some sort of s@distic metronome?

    Most buyers today need an agent to supply maximum pressure (somewhere along the lines of what J@ck B@uer is going to deliver to that Russian dirtball tonight) in order to even think about going along with the arse-reaming that is otherwise known as buying a home in this market.

    That’s just great, rent. Find some starving, dumb sap to waste time driving around with you for weekends on end, while at the same time telling you it’s all OK and it’s always “your choice”?

    Thanks. Your post is my final confirmation that this market is completely dysfunctional and what little propulsion that exists in it comes from the combined brain farts of both the delusional sellers and self-destructive buyers who choose to play it.

  58. Confused in NJ says:

    48.All “H-Train” Hype says:
    May 10, 2010 at 10:12 am

    I love how 2 weeks ago the EU did not have the 100 billion to help Greece. Now majically, they come up with 1 trillion.

    Simple solution = print money.

    We have gone past the event horizon. There really is no turning back at this point. I used to think that we would be in OK shape by 2012. Now I think the Mayans were totally correct

    The Mayans would try to remove Helicopter Ben’s Heart on their altar only to find out it’s already gone. No one in Washington is able to see their reflection in a mirror. They were born without Souls.

  59. Final Doom says:

    rent (47)-

    Get my e-mail from grim. I can refer you to some down-and-out lifer of an agent in E Brunswick.

  60. Juice Box says:

    Trichet caved, but still back peddles. I gather Bernake’s swap lines were are all that was needed.


  61. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Confused 54 now old folks can’t say a prayer before meal because of federal law. My lord this country is totally out of control. The end is nigh.

  62. Final Doom says:

    hyde (50)-

    I feel we will shortly be revisiting the EUR/JPY crossroads.

    And, the cross will resemble a figure-8 demolition derby.

  63. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    “The race to the currency devaluation bottom is now in its final lap.”

    Doom [46],

    Swap lines are burning up. Hard to believe that it took this long.

    I disagree with the above. Unless, that final lap is a marathon. It’s QE until infinity.

  64. Juice Box says:

    The smart money bought greek bonds.

  65. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:


    57 was poetic.

    macabre ie Poe, but poetry nonetheless.

    I nominate first three sentances for post of the year.

    It reminded me that it may never be a good time to buy, only a less bad time.

  66. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [50] Hyde

    Another tip for your deadbeat strategy:

    “In a decision reached just weeks after a contrary ruling by a Bankruptcy Court in Texas, a Bankruptcy Appellate Panel in the Eighth Circuit concludes that the plain language of Section 522(d)(12) allows for the exemption from a debtor’s bankruptcy estate of an inherited IRA. In re Nessa, 2010 WL 1407777 (8th Cir. BAP (Minn.))”.

    Got any elderly family members who are solvent that you trust?

  67. Libtard says:

    I told ya all they would print. I used the JJ strategy and my Telephonica is up 10.5% today.

  68. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [61] mike

    “now old folks can’t say a prayer before meal because of federal law.”

    Hope and Change, my friend, Hope and Change.

  69. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    My Greek brothers/sisters send their thanks to US taxpayers. Party on.

  70. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    This is all altruism to be sure.

    Sure it is.

    “ExxonMobil Chairman and CEO Rex Tillerson says President Barack Obama made the right call in putting a moratorium on new Gulf of Mexico oil leasing in the wake of the BP disaster.”

    Tillerson is not going to let a crisis go to waste. Less drilling in the GOM means less competition.

  71. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    Who would have thought that Jose Canseco was the only one telling the truth? In addition to this, who would have ever guessed that Robert Mugabe’s economic model would be the blueprint for Western economies?

  72. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:


    You’d be happy to know.

    I’m using todays dip as an opportuinity to acquire more ‘precious’.

    i want in on any bubble thats in its early stages.

  73. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Nom, i wonder how this will effect the russians. Werent they planning on drilling somewhere around there soon?

  74. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Nom 68 more like going to hell in a hand basket, unf**ken believable.

  75. Final Doom says:

    Wake up, drones. If you don’t hit the bid, you don’t get the house. The idiot seller does not care about the condition of the market, the fact that his house looks like Buffalo Bill’s, or that the MS-13 is beating up little girls on his corner.

    You want to spend this Summer “just looking”? Think you’re a “disciplined buyer” who “just won’t overpay”? Screw it. Take up macrame. It beats fouling the air with the exhaust of all the futile miles you will drive, all in the pursuit of absolutely nothing.

    Any seller insane or desperate enough to put a “for sale” sign in his yard these days needs to hit a number in order to move forward…and more times than not, that number is a complete fantasy. However, it is NOT a fantasy that your seller will allow his rank-ass dump to eat him alive and ruin him financially rather than sell it to you for a penny less than he “needs” to break himself even on the nightmare-in-the-guise-of-housing that he purchased at the highest peak of the biggest asset bubble in human history.

    If you absolutely MUST buy (which, IMO, is sorta like thinking you absolutely MUST contract gonhorre@)), only consider short sales, REO and other inventory that has some shot at actually being priced to market.

    Anything else? Well, don’t think that Clotpoll said it was OK to do.

  76. meter says:

    “If Medicaid can “lookback” and recover funds transferred out of a person’s accounts for years after the funds were shifted to another person, then the USG should be able to do the same to executives who stripped wealth from companies and took it for themselves during the go-go years.”

    Amen, brother. I would vote for anyone who would deliver on this – regardless of the rest of his/her platform. Killing grandmothers and babies would be okay as long as that promise were delivered.

    I’d even consider a Sarah Palin vote if she could make that happen.

  77. Final Doom says:

    I’d just settle for televised executions of rotten CEOs.

  78. Final Doom says:

    “Given the palpable stupidity that seems to grip all things EU, is it any wonder that the most obvious response to a biting fiscal crisis directly linked to overpaid state workers is rioting by overpaid state workers?

    Any attorney who crafted a partnership agreement for a client that did not include a clause providing for the removal of a bankrupt partner should carefully check to see their malpractice insurance is exactingly up to date. Apparently, no one quite thought to write such a clause into the millions of pages that collectively formed the legal evolution of the EU. This is what one might call a “bit of an oversight.” (If one is predisposed to dramatic understatement, that is).”


  79. 250K says:

    John Paulson says housing prices will be up 8%+ in 2011. (Source: CNBC)

  80. meter says:

    @45, Nom –

    Have you ever heard of a company actually implementing a clawback for a senior exec?

    I haven’t.

    When Dick Fuld is made to pay back some of his ill-gotten gains I’ll start having an iota of faith in this corporatocracy.

  81. Final Doom says:

    Anybody heard Buffett’s reaction to the Wells Notice Moody’s got today?

  82. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Renter, even if you dont use his services, you should pay doom for 47 and 75.

  83. Final Doom says:

    SEC threatening cease-and-desist action vs. Moody’s.

    Until somebody from Moody’s agrees to hire 10-11 SEC droids.

  84. Simply Ravishing HEHEHE says:

    This whole Europe thing doesn’t appear to be much of a market event other than the initial short squeeze. It will be interesting how much of those gains the markets hold throughout the week.

  85. Final Doom says:

    250K (79)-

    Think Paulson’s gonna be on the same side of the trade as you on that call?

    “John Paulson says housing prices will be up 8%+ in 2011.”

  86. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “the Wells Notice Moody’s got today”

    There is something ironic about this.

  87. Final Doom says:

    veets (82)-

    Just channeling my inner Gary.

  88. Final Doom says:

    I just thought about Gary inside me and threw up in my mouth a little.

  89. Simply Ravishing HEHEHE says:

    Manchurian Candidate Market

    “May 6th was an unequivocal act of domestic financial terrorism in America. A day that will live in infamy.

    To scare the lawmakers, themselves large owners of the very banks and stocks that they are supposed to be regulating, a financial Weapon of Mass Destruction was put to their head and they acquiesced.

    As the inventor of the continuous double-action, market-making technology (VST tech. US pat. no. 5950176) that is referenced 132 times by program trading and HFT patents since 1996, I can tell you that Goldman, JP Morgan and the gang simply pulled the ‘buys’ from their computer trading programs and manufactured a crash. And when the coast was clear, and it was clear the politicians were not going to vote for anything that would break up the ‘too big to fail’ banks; all the ’sells’ were pulled from the computers and the market roared back.

    This is a Manchurian Candidate market where program trading bots start the ball rolling in whatever direction Wall St. wants the market to go – and then hundreds of thousands of day-traders watching Cramer on CNBC jump on the momentum bandwagon and commit the crime for the Wall St. financial terrorists, who then say, ‘It wasn’t us, it was ‘the market!’”


  90. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    Veto [72],

    Good for you. Close your eyes and buy pullbacks.

    I don’t like the term “precious”. I prefer de facto.

    Forget Zombieism. Going forward it’s Zimbabweisation.

  91. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    He [84],

    V#agra will last longer than a Euro rally. Let the late shorts puke, allow the market to re-balance. Simply a great opportunity to short the crap paper at higher levels.

  92. Outofstater says:

    Do you guys buy gold coins online? If so, which sites?

  93. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [80] meter

    Obviously, private corporate action rarely, if ever, makes the papers.

    Here is one report on clawbacks in state econ. dev. arrangements:

    “Are Clawbacks Enforced?
    In a word, yes. Clawbacks are enforced, and increasingly so. While there are few reports of clawbacks being enforced during the 1990s, states are becoming more rigorous in their efforts to track performance and pursue repayment in cases where companies fall short. Here are just a few examples:
    • In August 2007, USA Today reported that, following an audit of its incentive programs, the State of New York sent letters to 3,000 companies that were found to have met less than 60 percent of what they promised. By January 2008 the Times Union reported 180 companies deemed not to have made progress toward their goals had been sent certified letters giving 10 days to explain shortfalls or face loss of Empire Zone certification.
    • In an article dated June 16, 2007, The Wall Street Journal reported that the State of Virginia “has collected about $11 million in repayments” since stepping up its audit program in 2002. The same article referenced new clawback provisions that had been put in place – and used – in New Jersey.
    • A report from the Office of the Governor in Texas on its Texas Enterprise Fund program indicates a total of approximately $300,000 has been recaptured from three companies since 2004.
    • Illinois’ Annual Report of Recaptures Provision (6/1/07) shows 24 efforts have been initiated since 2004 to reclaim incentives; 16 have been completed. . . . ”


    And this . . .

    SEC Brings First Sarbanes-Oxley “Claw back” Enforcement Action

    The SEC has brought its first enforcement action seeking to “claw back” incentive-based compensation from a former CEO not accused of wrongdoing. The SEC is seeking a court order directing the former CEO to pay back over $4 million in bonuses and stock sale proceeds that he received during the period for which his former employer’s financial statements were later restated. . . . . SEC v. Jenkins, No. CV 09-1510-PHX-JWS (D. Ariz. July 22, 209) (in original, should be 2009).

    And this from Warnaco’s financials:

    “In March 2007, the Compensation Committee reduced the annual incentive compensation awards for the fiscal year ended December 30, 2006 (‘‘Fiscal 2006’’) for Messrs. Gromek, Rutkowski and Tworecke in the amounts of $45,600, $22,440 and $51,744, respectively, based on the restatement of our fiscal 2005 financial results in September 2006.”

    And this is just a few minutes on Google. If I did a LEXIS search, I could probably find dozens.

    Further, I would not be surprised if there are clawback proceedings currently open against Fuld. They are unsexy claims and get buried in the noise of other litigation and the larger reasons for the clawback in the first place.

  94. make money says:


    I love it how everyone believes that Monetization will not cause inflation. Bergage and Trichet are genious man and we all need to close our eyes and trust them cause they have our best interest at heart.


    Key is not to sell until we’re aproching 1:1 ratio with DOW.

  95. make money says:

    Do you guys buy gold coins online? If so, which sites?

    Holler at Schiff.

  96. Sas3 says:

    Mikeinwaiting… Re Prayer.

    What’s your take on some guys saying an Islamic prayer aloud? I see “moment of silence” as a way of saying “pray as you deem fit, only silently”.

    Though, based on the article, most must be praying for the food to magically become edible!

  97. Mr Hyde says:


    Does europacific buy and hold the gold on their own locations, or how do they hold it?

  98. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Sas3 96 Whatever prayer floats your boat. I’m sure the Islamic versions are along the same lines as the Christian ones.
    The point is the government has no right to hold up food for elderly or any-other aid based on praying.

    “Though, based on the article, most must be praying for the food to magically become edible!”
    I see this as a binding moment for the 2 religions, both praying for some decent food.

  99. meter says:

    @93, Nom –

    Thanks. I’m not sure I agree with your notion that claims against Fuld and those of his ilk wouldn’t be sexy.

    TPTB could then use them as a surface salve for the massive unrest that is brewing. I, for one, would be a lot less angry if I saw nightly perp walks, or at the very least heard snippets about moneys retaken from Jimmy Cayne, Fuld, the families of Ken Lay, Madoff, Ebbers, etc.

    They should all be rendered penniless.

  100. make money says:



    These guys store shiny for free when you buy it there.

  101. meter says:

    @100 – make

    “These guys store shiny for free when you buy it there.”

    Sure they do. Good luck getting your hands on it if TSHTF.

    Investment firms never ever lie about the worth (or existence) of your holdings:


  102. Mr Hyde says:


    i just take veto’s advice and store it under my bed

  103. Juice Box says:

    Hyde- I believe what Europacific was pushing was an Australian warrant. ZAUWBA is the symbol they are structured as long-dated call warrants.


    You can trade this easier than physical.

  104. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [96] sas3

    Note that the organization cannot tell the diners that they can’t pray. No one, under color of state action, can tell you not to pray.

    However, an organized, or “led” prayer, or even an organized “moment of silence” has been determined to be an establishment of religion (no matter that the original intent was to prevent a single “state” religion, the Clause now extends to any activity deemed to be religious).

    The ‘endorsement’ argument goes to some seemingly riduculous extremes. If, for example, students in a public school, without any organization, permission, or prodding from school officials, spontaneously led a prayer in school, or at a game, the ACLU would sue if the school didn’t punish the students.

    While this has always been a battleground issue, it has taken a particularly nasty tone in recent years, as it goes beyond merely the intention of those on the left to drive any hint of religion from the public square (or sphere), but the establishment clause is being used increasingly by opponents of religious groups (invariably on the left) to attack religious groups or religion in general by expanding the public sphere.

    It is really an amazing development, and one that will form part of the subtext in the history of Civil War 2.0

  105. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [99] meter,

    It involves a lot of digging, but I think you will find that in many of these cases, and others, there have been suits to claw back monies from these actors.

    “They should all be rendered penniless.”

    Which begs the question, at what point do the gains become ill-gotten or do you seize all assets, even those not gained by fraud or just dumb bad luck?

    The price of unbridled populism is often high. When Antoine Lavoiser was tried and sentenced to death during the French Revolution, calls for the release of this august scientist were brushed aside by the judge, who said “France has no need for geniuses.” When you endorse mob rule, you get ruled by the mob.

    So, if you do impose rules that could bankrupt a senior officer in the event things go south, you may find that there are very few qualified takers unless the pay and D&O insurance is a whole helluva lot higher than it is currently.

    Or unless the company is beyond the jurisdiction of the USG.

  106. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [98] mike

    “The point is the government has no right to hold up food for elderly or any-other aid based on praying.”

    Actually, the government can, and apparently does, withold payment if the food is provided in conjunction with an expression of religion.

    I know this sounds absurd, and believe me, I agree that it is. While there used to be common sense agreement on what constitutes “endorsement of religion” that topic has become a battleground in the culture war, particularly when it comes to christian demoninations and expressions. There used to be a neutral zone, but there isn’t one anymore.

    So expect more of this in the future.

  107. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “i just take veto’s advice and store it under my bed”

    hyde, only do this if you have a deep moat around your home.

    and a pitbull wearing kevlar sweater in the back yard.

  108. Shore Guy says:


    I understand the basic issues and pitfalls. It just seems that a strong argument can be made that much of the salaries paid and of the bonuses granted constitute ill-gottrn gains and should be returned to non-insider/officer shareholders.

    I would be inclined to go a step further and do like in the S&L crisis and make sure more than a few of the miscreants spend time in state prisons for grand larceny — federal lockups would tend to be too comfortable.

  109. meter says:

    @105, Nom –

    I liken the definition of ‘ill-gotten’ to the Supreme Court Justice Potter Stewart quote about knowing it when we see it.

    The line between ineptitude and the pillaging of the company for one’s own gains isn’t that fine, IMO.

    I’m not talking about mob rule, btw, nor should the government have to get involved. The boards of these companies and shareholders ought to be doing it. The problem with this is oftentimes board members are themselves high-ranking officers in other companies and won’t support clawbacks as part of the corporate culture.

    So, let me put the question back to you if I may: Do you think nothing ought to be done, or are you in favor of some sort of mechanism to recover spoils (and if so, what)?

  110. Shore Guy says:

    Will work, and others of whom may be interested:


    Spring Beer Festival – May 14

  111. Sas3 says:

    Nom #104

    I like O’s approach on this: “If you ban a national day of prayer, and there is enough flexibility to commemorate it via an executive decision, I will do it”. It is a reasonable medium for someone like me that drifts freely between multiple religions, atheism, and agnosticism. In contrast, W was a bit too “Jesus or die” type, and some dems are too Chinese style anti-religion.

  112. chicagofinance says:

    Wasn’t that the name of the U2 tour in the 1990’s?

    Mr Wantanapolous says:
    May 10, 2010 at 11:05 am
    Going forward it’s Zimbabweisation.

  113. chicagofinance says:

    Correct me if you disagree….the new Supreme Court nominee looks like a more macho version of Mark Teixeira…..

  114. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [109] meter

    Do you think nothing ought to be done, or are you in favor of some sort of mechanism to recover spoils (and if so, what)?

    I am comfortable with a market-driven approach, which is the current model. Clawback provisions are becoming common in pay packages, not just performance based ones.

    That said, it is not unreasonable to say that exec comp is a significant enough matter that it requires shareholder approval. In the end, that probably doesn’t change much.

    As for the USG, if you legislate claw-backs, you simply shift the burden. CEO candidates are going to want more comp, or front-end loaded comp, or earn-out rights that are exempt from clawback. They will also structure their lives to make them judgment-proof—the assets will be offshore or heavily encumbered here, leaving nothing for the USG to seize. One can hold a CEO in contempt, but only if the CEO has the power to repatriate assets (which he won’t). And if you legislate around that, look for CEOs to insist on moving HQs overseas, or suddenly taking a “vacation” abroad if TSHTF.

  115. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [111] sas3

    “In contrast, W was a bit too “Jesus or die” type, and some dems are too Chinese style anti-religion.”

    With respect to W, I gather that this is a taste issue you have with him. I am not aware of any attempts by him to officially endorse christianity.

  116. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [113] chifi

    Ugly women need representation on the court too!

  117. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [108] shore

    “I would be inclined to go a step further and do like in the S&L crisis and make sure more than a few of the miscreants spend time in state prisons for grand larceny . . .”

    Larceny is an intent crime. Stupidity isn’t (yet), so there would have to be an actual crime (and ex post facto doesn’t work).

    There were crimes uncovered in the S+L crisis. I interned on the DoJ-FDIC Bank Fraud Task Force, and got to see the mechanics of said prosecutions up real close, and I worked on compliance with the regulations that came out of that time. This time around, you have to look harder to find the crime, or even allege that one occurred. Was it a crime for GS to sell Abacus while disclaming the sh1t out of it and betting the other way? We’ll see.

  118. Painhrtz says:

    Nom she isn’t just hopelessly unattractive she looks like she could be the lead at a feminist anti men rally. Apparently she is not uber liberal, but that remains to be seen. At this point I don’t trust Obama to select a town dog catcher.

  119. Ben says:

    “Do you guys buy gold coins online? If so, which sites?

    Holler at Schiff.”

    I’m a Europac client but I still buy metals from Apmex.

  120. JJ says:

    She deserves the job, with a face like that she spent many a night bent over a desk with her legal briefs around her ankles getting so jammed full of legal knowledge it was leaking down her legs. She is around 50 and man that is a good 25 years of earning it the hard way. It is so much easier for the pretty girls.

    Painhrtz says:
    May 10, 2010 at 1:02 pm
    Nom she isn’t just hopelessly unattractive she looks like she could be the lead at a feminist anti men rally. Apparently she is not uber liberal, but that remains to be seen. At this point I don’t trust Obama to select a town dog catcher.

  121. Final Doom says:

    plume (116)-

    Well now they are. And, disproportionately so. It’s gonna be like a female version of Larry, Curly and Moe.

    “Ugly women need representation on the court too!”

  122. Final Doom says:

    In the above scenario, Ginsburg would be Moe.

  123. make money says:


    I visited my shiny back in ’08. It was all there. When/if SHTF I trust tem better then the gubmint here. You obviously don’t have to.

  124. Libtard says:


    You are right about Bush on religion. He might have had personal conversations with Jesus, but he never pushed his savior’s agenda on the public. This was one of the reasons I voted him over Gore in 2000. I did not vote for him in 2004.

    Today I realize that it doesn’t matter who you vote for. Better to concentrate your valuable time on researching other topics, such as American Idol and how to gain the biggest bang for the buck through moral hazard.

  125. Final Doom says:

    I expect the Gold Confisc@tion Act to be reinstated at some point soon.

  126. chicagofinance says:

    Graduated 5 years ahead of me at my high school. Suffice it to say that I didn’t swoon with a puppy love crush in 8th grade….

    NJGator says:
    May 10, 2010 at 1:00 pm

  127. chicagofinance says:

    scratch that…she graduated before I showed up (1977)….

    chicagofinance says:
    May 10, 2010 at 1:34 pm
    Graduated 5 years ahead of me at my high school. Suffice it to say that I didn’t swoon with a puppy love crush in 8th grade….

  128. Nicholas says:

    Because maybe it makes you feel better that it is happening somewhere else?

    Bowie MD, 20715

    Average Sold Price For lisings on the MRIS website.

    April 2006 – $384,549
    April 2007 – $386,484
    April 2008 – $345,994
    April 2009 – $279,559
    April 2010 – $252,367

    Yep, thats a 34.7% drop from the market top in 2007.

    I’m glad that the 8,000$/6,500$ tax credit has expired. Now housing will resume its regularly scheduled drop of 34,000$ per year instead of the 26,000$ drop we saw last year.

  129. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:

    With Greece bailed out now is the most dangerous time of all. Where will Soros and the horsemen appear next.

    Starting a pool.

    Ill go with the UK. Particularly vulnerable with a hung parliament.

  130. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    would love to see what your wives look like…

  131. Confused in NJ says:

    The Stock Market is putting in new circuit breakers that generate Buy Orders for the Federal Reserve, for every Sell Order > $100. This should minimize any downdrafts in the future. The Federal Reserve is constructing a new Money Printer in lower Manhattan to support this function.

  132. meter says:

    @124, Make –

    That’s good that you actually did that. Would help me sleep a bit better at night if I were in your position.

    However, I trust neither the US govt nor anyone else to hold my assets, especially in a crisis event. Would you feel comfortable getting on a plane with $100k (I presume a lot more) in gold?

    I’d be more than a little worried about going through US customs, and even more afraid going through customs in a more lawless country.

    Feel free to respond with snark about the lawlessness here in the US of A – you’ll get no argument from me – but my point remains: how on earth are you going to transport it and redeem it?

  133. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:



    Schiff uses the Perth Mint. No way in hell should you store that stuff anywhere else.

  134. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:


    Let me clarify. Dont store it anywhere that you cant defend with an arsenal.

  135. DL says:

    Time to pack it in. RE has recovered.

    “Housing Prices to Rise 3-5% This Year: John Paulson.”


  136. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:

    “Euro bailout will lead to currency collapse. Gold acting as a currency not a commodity. Its been money for 5000 years and always will be.”

    Ron Paul 5/10/10.


  137. NJGator says:

    Barbara 131 – Exactly! Next thing you know, this is going to devolve into a discussion of Betty white’s “muffin”.


  138. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    hehe I saw that Saturday – Betty + filthy inuendo = comedy

  139. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:

    HOUSTON—A man was killed and his family members beaten after three suspects barged into a north Houston home Saturday afternoon, police said.

    Investigators said one of the suspects pretended to be a census worker to gain entry into the house, located in the 400 block of Truman.

    Family members said the victim’s son opened the door for the suspects, believing they were with the census.

    Larry Johnson Jr., the nephew of the victim, said the suspects tied up and beat his cousin and aunt after barging into to the home.

    Johnson said his uncle, Reginald “Pete” Haynes, walked in on the crime and was ambushed.

    “They tied him up and stabbed him and tried to submerge him in water,” Johnson said.

  140. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [125] libtard

    “Better to concentrate your valuable time on researching other topics, such as American Idol and how to gain the biggest bang for the buck through moral hazard.”

    So true. But I draw the line at American Idol (feh!)

  141. A.West says:

    Elena Kagan,
    After seeing her picture on top of a news article, I kept reading looking for the part where they would comment on this being the first transgender supreme court justice. “She” looks more masculine than Souter.

  142. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [119] pain

    “Apparently she is not uber liberal, but that remains to be seen.”

    Trust me. She is uber-liberal. I have been informally vetting SCOTUS candidates since the Reagan Admin. (first term), and you are gonna hear more about her in the future as newsies look past her written record, which is sparse.

    Google Kagan and s0cialism and see what you get. Just as with Obama, it runs in the family (her brother and his father).

  143. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [142] West

    ““She” looks more masculine than Souter.”

    She is.

  144. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:



    Thats a real beefcake dollface Obama selected. Hope she stays in the courtroom I cant afford to replace any mirrors.

  145. sas says:

    I heart cadmium.

    gotta love “Made in China”


  146. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    Re: Kagan

    This is gonna come back to haunt her:

    “In a 1995 review of Stephen Carter’s book on confirmation hearings, “Confirmation Messes, Old and New,” Kagan criticized senators for failing to ask, and nominees for refusing to answer, questions about their views on specific issues. Senators ought to dig deeply, she contended, asking straightforward questions about both the nominee’s judicial philosophy and her substantive views on constitutional issues: “The critical inquiry as to any individual similarly concerns the votes she would cast, the perspective she would add (or augment), and the direction in which she would move the institution” (934). Nominees could be asked about their views on particular issues that the Court regularly faces, such as “privacy rights, free speech, race and gender discrimination, and so forth” (936). On this view, a nominee ought to refrain only from expressing a “settled intent” to vote a particular way on a particular case that might come before her.”

  147. Juice Box says:

    SNL should bring back Jon Lovitz this week to play Kagan in a skit.

  148. A.West says:

    After reading this I’m ready to conclude that Kagan is a beautiful woman and perfect supreme court justice.
    I wonder if she and Justice Thomas will build much rapport.

  149. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    rip her to shreds


    you bitches are starting to sound jealous.

  150. NJGator says:

    N.J. Democrats to propose tax hike on those making more than $1M

    TRENTON –Top Democratic lawmakers today proposed raising taxes on so-called true millionaires — those making more than $1 million a year — to pay for restored senior property tax rebates and prescription drug benefits.

    Democratic legislators, led during a Statehouse news conference by Senate President Stephen Sweeney (D-Gloucester) and Assembly Speaker Sheila Oliver (D-Essex), said the tax increase would apply to about 16,000 New Jersey residents.

    “When the governor talks about shared sacrifice I think we all get it, and we all agree,” said Sweeney. “But shared sacrifice means 100 percent of us share in the sacrifice, not 99 percent.”

    The plan challenged Republican Gov. Chris Christie’s pledge against raising taxes in the budget for the fiscal year that starts in July. Christie has argued that a repeat of last year’s income tax surcharge — which affected those with incomes over $400,000 — would hurt small business owners and slow economic growth.

    Christie immediately rejected the Democrats’ proposal, accusing them of trying to “pander” to senior citizens with a one-year fix that will harm the state’s broader economy. He repeated his vow to veto any tax increase, and characterized the dispute as a “philosophical difference” between himself and foes who want a bigger government.

    The governor questioned how lawmakers proposed to raise the same amount of revenue from 16,000 taxpayers that had previously been raised from 63,000 people.

    “It’s a cute idea, but their math doesn’t work,” Christie said.


  151. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    “When the governor talks about shared sacrifice I think we all get it, and we all agree,” said Sweeney. “But shared sacrifice means 100 percent of us share in the sacrifice, not 99 percent.”

    riiight, cause that 1% is really going to take care of this whole budget crisis.
    Red meat.

  152. chicagofinance says:

    Barbara “just wait till fall” Believer says:
    May 10, 2010 at 1:39 pm
    would love to see what your wives look like…


  153. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [149] A. West.

    Not the sort of site I would expect you to visit.

    Their spin notwithstanding, they slipped up when they printed this excerpt from Kagan’s thesis:

    “She called the story of the s0cialist movement’s demise “a sad but also a chastening one for those who, more than half a century after s0cialism’s decline, still wish to change America … In unity lies their only hope.”

    They say the historian does not endorse the history, but describing the demise of american s0cialism as “sad” and endorsing a prescription for their future goes beyond mere historical recounting.

    For my money, her past as a student and as Dean at HLS tell me what I need to know: That she is no centrist, but every bit to the left as her friend and colleague from the liberal elite ivory tower.

  154. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    “Gold acting as a currency not a commodity. Its been money for 5000 years and always will be.”

    Al, what does this Rue Paul know about economics anyway?

    He/she is half right. Gold is acting as an alternative to weakening global economies.

    I still dont think gold is currency, although many people continue to swear by that. Its just semantics i guess but in order for something to be a currency, it has to be deemed a currency by law and people who make the laws. If not, then its just a black market store of value. No different than a dime bag with a long shelf life in that regard. Ask yourself, what kind of currency would gold make when the us govt pegs its value at 300/oz, illegalizes it and punishes anyone who hoardes more than $1,000 worth? Not a very good one.

    The real currency for 5,000 years is WORK. Productive, meaningful, work. It can be creative art work, science, mathematical work, construction work, whatever.

    The US dollar is not failing because a lack of gold. Its falling because of us and our economy. We are losing our industry and productivity and edge to the 3rd world. That is why we are over-using debt as a crutch and the dollar is getting smacked.

    Fiat money works great when the underlying economy is productive and healthy.

    oh no. i hope this doesnt get everyone all worked up and throwing daggers at me. Whether its a currency or not, i think its going to continue to rise in value under these worsening conditions.

  155. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [148] Juice

    “SNL should bring back Jon Lovitz this week to play Kagan in a skit.”

    Good one. Now I have to explain my uproarious laughter to the partner next door.

  156. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    The NJ Gold, Clawback, Kagan, and Real Estate Report.

  157. JJ says:

    Since I am carrying 99% you the people this site can you at least buy me a bottle of tyenol or name a baby after me.

    Barbara “just wait till fall” Believer says:
    May 10, 2010 at 2:28 pm
    “When the governor talks about shared sacrifice I think we all get it, and we all agree,” said Sweeney. “But shared sacrifice means 100 percent of us share in the sacrifice, not 99 percent.”

    riiight, cause that 1% is really going to take care of this whole budget crisis.
    Red meat.

  158. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:

    “On Friday, the U.S. Mint said sales of the most popular American Eagle one-ounce gold coins totaled 41,500 ounces so far in the first week of May, compared to 60,500 ounces in the entire month of April.”

    In December of 2009 American Eagles were unobtainable from the mint.

  159. Orion says:

    Trichets’ bazooka is way larger than Paulsons’.

  160. NJGator says:

    Standoff flares between Sweeney and Christie over millionaires’ tax, and gov’s toolkit


  161. Final Doom says:

    al (140)-

    Is this what’s meant by the term, “Texas waterboarding”?

    “’They tied him up and stabbed him and tried to submerge him in water’, Johnson said.”

  162. Final Doom says:

    west (142)-

    I bet she could kick the crap out of Souter, too.

  163. Final Doom says:

    Goddam Texans can’t torture anybody without going overboard and damn near killing them.

  164. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Nice presentation on the reasons why this housing recovery will fall flat on its face.


  165. Final Doom says:

    plume (154)-

    Why should anyone wonder about Kagan for a second?

    The Chosen One has shown from day one that he intends to fill every open appointed position with the biggest bubblehead liberal collectivist phony available.

  166. safe as houses says:

    #153 chifi

    You married Barbara Corcoran? :)

  167. Jim says:

    Must agree that Kagan is so ugly she couldn’t sneak up on a glass of water. My bigger concern is that she is far left, s0cialist elite type that will further destroy America.

  168. Final Doom says:

    Jim (170)-

    By the time she takes her seat on the SCOTUS, we’ll have done ourselves in.

    Much like the Pirates with Ralph Kiner, we don’t need her in order to fail.

  169. Final Doom says:

    Come to think of it, Ralph Kiner is the person Kagan really resembles.

  170. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Hope You Enjoyed the Housing Recovery … Because It’s History, Says Suttmeier

    Since the recovery in house prices began last summer, homeowners and real-estate agents have embraced what many believe is a return to normalcy (forever rising prices).

    In Wall Street-fueled markets like New York City, properties are once again getting multiple bids, and optimists are chattering about a quick return to old highs. If the trend continues, friends, neighbors, and real-estate agents will no doubt soon start repeating the adage that helped inflate the housing bubble in the first place: Real-estate is always a great investment.

    But the trend won’t continue, says Richard Suttmeier, strategist at ValuEngine.com.

    The temporary increase in prices has been driven by government efforts to prop up the housing market, Suttmeier says, and those measures have come to an end. A new wave of foreclosures is hitting the market. Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac have become black holes into which taxpayers must shovel endless billions just to keep the mortgage engine running. Most importantly, as measured by the Case-Shiller index, housing prices are still way too high.

    In most major house-price indexes, prices have already begun to roll over and head back down. Suttmeier thinks this trend will continue. In fact, he thinks prices could fall another 25% nationwide.

  171. Final Doom says:

    Anybody else here think Barry O’s schtick is more suited to Showtime at the Apollo?

  172. Final Doom says:

    Suttmeier should’ve added that we should all just lie back and enjoy it.

    He doesn’t feel the oblivion yet.

  173. Final Doom says:

    I bet Barry O does a mean Fred Sanford imitation.

  174. Final Doom says:

    I keep getting the feeling that this presidency is what would’ve been this season’s episodes had the West Wing not gotten cancelled.

  175. Final Doom says:

    Don’t know how Aaron Sorkin would’ve handled the endless war thing, though.

  176. All "H-Train" Hype says:


    All I know is that I watched the Sunday politico talk shows and that Eric Holder looks and talks like a guy that has absolutely no idea what he is doing. I mean what if he was replaced by Mr. Potato Head? How much more has Holder done vs. a toy potato that has replacement eyes, noses, mouths and ears?

    All joking aside I was really shocked about how clueless he really was. He looked like a guy just happy to be in the job and not to rock any boats until he leaves.

  177. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    I just think he’s dumb, which is what I think you’re getting at.

  178. Wag says:

    So glad I am working from home today… Clot is on fire. Raucous laughter not appreciated at the office. Showtime at the Appolo…. hehehehe

  179. NJGator says:

    For those of you who would like to be politically balanced in your superficial political nitpicking, here’s a right winger from Michigan with hair way too big for her head.

    I also think she may have taken one too many shots of the botox.


  180. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [179] h-train

    Holder is en fuego compared to Gordon Liu. He was nominated by Obama for the 9th Circuit yet he struck me as one of Kagan’s less experienced students. One of the GOP Senators was interrogating him, and absolutely took him to school. Liu was stammering, backpedaling, and evading the questions so inadroitly that it was embarrassing to watch. I thought to myself “my god, they nominated this idiot? He must be a true believer.”

  181. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    gator, that is an odd photo. Looks like someone photoshopped the facial features onto another head.

  182. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [182] gator

    My god, I thought that kind of hairstyle was extinct.

    Someone should clue her in. Afro look not good for someone of your complexion and features.

    OTOH, disagree re botox. She looks young because she is young. No evidence of botox tightening or wrinkle filling.

  183. Rusty Trombone says:

    170. Right Jim. The GOP well they simply outdid themselves didn’t they?

  184. Rusty Trombone says:

    Chicks with enormous heads are the besssssssssssst. For beating with sticks.

  185. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [177] doom

    “I keep getting the feeling that this presidency is what would’ve been this season’s episodes had the West Wing not gotten cancelled.”

    Huh? Sheen’s President Bartlet was much more conservative, and the staff much less condescending than the current occupants of 1600 Penna. Ave.

  186. safeashouses says:

    #182 Gator,

    She’s got the Welcome Back Kotter hairstyle down pat. Or she wants the curtains to match the carpet.

  187. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [168] doom

    “The Chosen One has shown from day one that he intends to fill every open appointed position with the biggest bubblehead liberal collectivist phony available.”

    You want a laugh or two? Watch some of Gordon Liu’s Senate testimony.

    As if the 9th Circuit wasn’t looney enough.

  188. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [163] doom

    “I bet she could kick the crap out of Souter, too.”

    My 7YO can kick the crap out of Souter.

  189. NJGator says:

    Nom 185 – I don’t think she hits the botox because she looks young. I know she uses it because of how stiff/paralyzed half her face looks.

    She’s no Jocelyn Wildenstein yet, but just give her a few more years.


  190. Comrade Nom Deplume says:


    Obama nominated Goodwin Liu, not Gordon Liu (the actor). Damn senility.

  191. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Dow 8500 Before 11,500: Sell the Surge, Suttmeier Says

    … the danger is far from over, says Richard Suttmeier, chief market strategist at ValuEngine.com, who notes the Dow lost in eight days almost all of the roughly 1400 points it gained in the 10 weeks from Feb. 8 to April 26.

    Such a rapid decline is “telling you the fundamentals do not support higher stock prices,” he says. “Over the long run, the fundamentals and the technicals favor lower stock prices.”

    How much lower? Repeating his warning from March 10, Suttmeier believes the Dow is fairly valued at 8500 and believes we’ll see that level before we see Dow 11,500.

  192. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    Proof, if any was needed, that Goodwin Liu would set aside decades of precedent in the area of education, namely by overruling Mecklenburg.


    His supporters will tell you he never says he wants to overrule Mecklenburg, but when he says that NCLB is a failure because it doesn’t force suburban schools to take voucher kids from inner cities, that tells me what is in his heart.

  193. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [192] gator

    Damn. So how much did she win in court for her surgeon’s malpractice?

  194. Sas3 says:

    Gator #182,

    Shh… all conservative women are hot! Even Barbara Bush!


  195. Sas3 says:

    Nom and others… re Christianity in politics:

    Some politico-pr0n from huffpost:

    Sarah Palin joined Fox News’s Bill O’Reilly recently to condemn the critics of the National Day of Prayer, saying that the Judeo-Christian belief was the basis for American law and should continue to be used as a guiding force for creating future legislation.


  196. NJGator says:

    Nom 192 – That’s the result of about $4M worth of plastic surgery and sadly I think the woman is pleased with the results.

    Just google “Bride of Wildenstein” or “Lion Queen of New York”.

    She is the ex-wife of one of the wealthiest art dealers in the world. I think he ex got a judicial ruling in their divorce that he will not be responsible for any future elective surgeries.

  197. Rusty Trombone says:

    Buh Bye Moody’s.

  198. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [197-98] sas3

    “all conservative women are hot!”

    Yeesh, that’s a stretch. They are clearly hotter than liberal women though.

    “the Judeo-Christian belief was the basis for American law”

    Undisputably true, and in fact the basis for law throughout the western world. Now, whether or not you want to keep these ideals, that’s up to you as a voter.

    Aside from those promoting sharia, non-judeo-christians largely have no issue with the construct of western legal systems, nor do they have misgivings about their judeo-christian orgins.

  199. veto that - lawrence yun 'the panda', 'next fall' says:

    Germany’s stock market was up 10% today.
    That’s a sign of apocolypse.

  200. Sas3 says:


    I find issue with “… should continue to be used as a guiding force for creating future legislation” part. Bambi, or her Fox overlords, will push for a literal interpretation of Bible if they can get away with it.

    The limits of traditional religious viewpoints are being tested, and will continue to be tested substantially. We will soon hit a point where machines may become more intelligent/powerful than humans, cloning/designer genes, various lifestyles be accepted as “valid” if not “normal”.

  201. Anon E. Moose says:

    Thoughs on Kagan:

    Knowing how well the “O” regime has vetted its past nominees, there’s got to be a time bomb in her past somewhere – if it blows spectacularly we can look to an old guard moderate nominee in her place.

    Buzzy’s not in good health – even if limited to one term, or if it becomes undeniably apparent that “O” will be one and done, she could easily step down preemptively to insure a D names her replacement – giving “O” three nominees in one term after about a decade and a half of remarkable stability on the court. A 2012 nomination would(should) be brutial.

  202. Ben says:

    “The real currency for 5,000 years is WORK. Productive, meaningful, work. It can be creative art work, science, mathematical work, construction work, whatever.”

    Actually, currency was the invention used to store the excess production you achieved as an individual. Fiat money is an invention used to siphon off your hard earned work into someone else’s hand without you knowing.

  203. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [203] sas3

    Should and will are different things.

    Further, should judeo-christian philosophy be rejected out of hand, especially when it forms the basis for our system of laws? It’s easy to conform “thou shalt not kill” to humanist/secular values. A tougher task is informing private property rights, and there are some that suggest private property is inconsistent with judeo-christian thought (it isn’t, but even within christianity, there is a schism).

    Further, there are those who don’t adhere to judeo-christian thought who are forced to follow judeo-christian precepts under the guise of our “secular” law. For example, if I don’t believe in giving to the poor (assuming that there is a religion that so believes, or just assume atheist), which is clearly a judeo-christian belief, why am I forced to do so through my taxes? An inflammatory example, but I think it illustrates the point.

    You would argue that this is not a belief grounded in religion, but one that is a tenet of any civilization, a humanist/secular value, if you will. But what informs those humanist/secular values?

    Palin and others insist that we continue to use as a guidestar the same belief system on which our laws our based. They can insist it—it’s their right. But your concern is misplaced in a democracy. After all, your side won, so you get to decide how the laws should be, right? And if my side wins, they get to decide, right?

    Now, you will argue that the rights of the minority should be preserved. For the minority to have rights, however, there must be agreement that certain spheres of our society must be free of government interference, or that the terms of government interference are agreed upon. Further, to have any meaning, these spheres, and the rules regarding them, must be immutable, lest they become meaningless. This is the essence of constitutional protections, among others.

    So now, you are concerned that there will be no DMZ, that a future moral majority will legislate away your previous “rights” and entitlements. It is a legitimate concern.

    So why aren’t the similar concerns of those on the right equally legitimate?

    Until we resolve that, you are right to be concerned. If there was a political Vix, it would be off the chart these days.

  204. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [2-3] sas3

    I wouldn’t worry. Christians don’t agree on interpreting the bible.

  205. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:


    I could take all of Soro’s money and couldnt bye a pretty face for Medusa Kagan.

    Some officials are better off in a zoo.

  206. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    207. Nom
    the only Christians that matter, Evangelical fundies, do mostly agree. That is where the core of the Moral Majority, Tea Party right stand. Mainline protestant thought is becoming a rare find within the contemporary political debate.
    Sas is correct, while they play masterful PR in the form of pretending to support the thought and coming to the defense of America’s forefathers, (tapping into the uniformed folksy mythology that the average American identifies with the founding fathers), the goal is towards Dominionism.

  207. Rusty Trombone says:

    Insightful Ben…the rest of you mouthbreathers are bringing the collective IQ down here.

  208. Ben's Mom says:

    stop flattering yourself, Ben.

  209. The Zune concentrates on being a Portable Media Player. Not a web browser. Not a game machine. Maybe in the future it’ll do even better in those areas, but for now it’s a fantastic way to organize and listen to your music and videos, and is without peer in that regard. The iPod’s strengths are its web browsing and apps. If those sound more compelling, perhaps it is your best choice.

  210. Final Doom says:

    rusty (210)-

    This, from a guy whose handle is an acronym for butt piracy.

    “…the rest of you mouthbreathers are bringing the collective IQ down here.”

  211. Fabius Maximus says:

    I see your still throwing Jefferson under the bus. I’ll keep an eye out for a “Jefferson was a G0D-Dammed L1beral!” T-shirt for you.

    I caught sight of “With respect to W” while surfing” and thought what a great example of an Oxymoron. In light of today’s SCOTUS news, I’ll just say Harriet Miers and leave it at that.

    As for W and putting God in policy, he for the most part didn’t need to do anything; he had the likes of Kentucky displaying the 10 commandments to do the heavy lifting for him. But off the top of my head I’ll give you stem cell research, family planning for A1DS prevention in Africa and of course this little gem.

    “What we are going to do in the second term is to make sure that the grant money is available for faith communities to bid on, to make sure these faith-based offices are staffed and open. But the key thing is, is that we do have the capacity to allow faith programs to access enormous sums of social service money, which I think is important.”
    –George W. Bush, January 11, 2005

  212. Deb says:

    @mafia wars item guide (#212): i don’t think ipods can surf the web and run apps…am I missing something?

  213. Cindy says:


    Just more support for the “prices need to fall more” idea.

    Loved this: “There’s no end in sight to the stupidity of government actions to stop prices from falling.”

  214. veto that - Lawrence Yun 'The Panda', 'Next Fall', 'Debt Shock' says:

    “Fiat money is an invention used to siphon off your hard earned work into someone else’s hand without you knowing.”

    Ben, Sounds like you are criticising debt money issued through a central bank, and which the people pay interest on (inflation).
    Thats not necessarily the same thing.
    Fiat is just referring to whats backing it.

  215. veto that - Lawrence Yun 'The Panda', 'Next Fall', 'Debt Shock' says:

    “There’s no end in sight to the stupidity of government actions to stop prices from falling.”

    Cindy, it really stinks that the gov is not willing to collapse without taking us with them.

  216. willwork4beer says:

    110. Shore

    Thanks for the tip.


    Spring Beer Festival – May 14

  217. veto that - Lawrence Yun 'The Panda', 'Next Fall', 'Debt Shock' says:

    i finally got a chance to re-read Doom’s classic rants today. (57 & 75)
    They are way better the second time around. If thats even possible. Oh and do yourself a favor and google his reference to ‘MS 13’. Priceless.

    “Wake up, drones. If you don’t hit the bid, you don’t get the house. The idiot seller does not care about the condition of the market, the fact that his house looks like Buffalo Bill’s, or that the MS-13 is beating up little girls on his corner.”

  218. veto that - Lawrence Yun 'The Panda', 'Next Fall', 'Debt Shock' says:

    Whatever you do.
    Dont google his reference to Buffalo Bill’s house.

    You will keel over from laughter so hard that all the oxygen will be cut off from your lungs for at least a minute or more. Its not fun. Really. Dont do it.

  219. Cindy says:

    217 – Veto Did you read it?

    When the prices have fallen here, new owners take over the properties. With the reduced wages we can expect for years to come, prices must fall if we expect folks to buy the houses.

  220. Cindy says:


    Here’s an example of the mess they have created in the LA area. Who is going to pay $500,000 for a 900 sq. ft. place. They have to bring home $130,000 a month. Do you think they will choose this Culver City beauty?

  221. Al "Fat Thumbery" Gore says:

    Mexican knocks American flag down. Fight ensues. Civil war in the making.


  222. Final Doom says:

    Slice off SoCal right below Santa Barbara and give it back to the fcuking Mexicans. Let it bleed them dry for a few decades.

  223. Final Doom says:

    Toss in NM, AZ and West Texas while we’re at it.

    Friggin’ Sam Houston and Davy Crockett died for nothing. Most of the former Mexican territories in the US have been a festering pile of poverty and debt for centuries.

  224. Final Doom says:

    …and a breeding ground for hantavirus.

  225. Barbara "just wait till fall" Believer says:

    Tex Mex wasn’t bad before Chi Chis

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