From HousingWire:
20m Borrowers Could Be Underwater before 2012: Deutsche Bank
More than 14m borrowers were underwater as of Q110, owing more on a mortgage than the value of the underlying property.
But with a further 10.8% decline in house prices expected relative to Q409 levels, another 6m borrowers are likely fall into negative equity by the end of 2011, according to commentary today by Deutsche Bank.
It makes for 20m underwater borrowers total before 2012.
The presence of negative equity goes hand-in-hand with an increased likelihood of strategic default, as borrowers sometimes may not be willing to pay when the house has lost substantial amounts of value.
The firm noted that, even when strategic default makes economic sense, many borrowers resist on moral and social grounds, as well as from fear of legal consequences. The existence of recourse — when a lender is able to pursue a borrower’s other assets — also acts as a disincentive against strategic default.
…
“Walk away or strategic default from a house with negative equity makes economic sense, especially in locations that have less expensive rentals,” Deutsche Bank researchers said.“Many existing academic studies model homeowners’ default decision based on the theoretical hypothesis that a borrower would exercise a default when it is in-the-money, i.e., when the borrower’s house has negative equity. Therefore, a homeowner with negative equity would default even though they can still afford to make their mortgage payments.
“exercise a default when it is in-the-money”
What an absolutely wonderful description.
From Bloomberg:
Survey: Pa. job losses, bills caused foreclosures
Nearly every respondent in a survey of 500 Pennsylvanians whose homes went into foreclosure over the past year cited a lost job or unexpected medical bills as the reason for falling behind on mortgage payments.
The Pennsylvania Association of Realtors said Wednesday the survey it commissioned also revealed that most didn’t know about state and federal aid programs.
Fifty-seven percent cited job loss, while 47 percent blamed medical bills. Most said contacting their lender to work out an agreement didn’t help. Just 14 percent carried a subprime loan.
From the WSJ:
Foreclosure Buyer Gets Hudson Blue
A flashy residential building on the Hudson River that once commanded a $25 million asking price was quietly picked up by its mortgage holder at a Manhattan foreclosure auction on Wednesday when no other bids materialized.
CapitalSource Bank, which launched a foreclosure action more than two years ago, holds an $18.9 million lien on the condominium development, according to Propertyshark.com. CapitalSource director George Lora said the firm plans to find a new buyer for the property.
From the Washington Post:
The real lessons of declining homeownership
FOR YEARS, government policy has aimed at driving up the owner-occupied share of residential housing, on the theory that everyone should have a shot at putting down roots and building up wealth. But judging by the latest numbers, that dream is fading. The national homeownership rate fell from 67.2 percent in the first quarter of 2010 to 66.9 percent in the second quarter, according to the Census Bureau. To put it another way, the recession and its accompanying wave of foreclosures have wiped out the past decade’s worth of increases in homeownership. And there’s more trouble ahead. According to an estimate from J.P. Morgan analysts, for every house already on the market in the United States, there is another one in or near foreclosure. Some industry forecasts suggest that, by 2012, homeownership rates could retreat to levels last seen in 1960.
From the Philly Inquirer:
Christie’s Atlantic City plan would stop flow of money to rest of New Jersey
Projects meant to bolster struggling Newark, New Jersey’s largest city, have received millions of dollars from an unlikely source: the casinos 100 miles south.
Atlantic City gambling halls in recent years have chipped in $1.5 million to expand housing at Seton Hall Law School, $2.8 million to open a preschool in the North Ward, and $500,000 to add space at a nonprofit environmental and ecological center.
How the money got there has its origins in a political deal struck in the 1980s – a deal that Gov. Christie not only wants to undo, but whose unraveling would require the support of Democratic Assembly Speaker Sheila Oliver. Her home turf of Newark’s Essex County has received $27 million in all from the casinos.
Following the release of sweeping recommendations from a gaming report he commissioned, Christie last month called for allowing Atlantic City to keep all money from the Casino Reinvestment Development Authority, an agency created in 1984 to invest in economic development statewide using a 1.25 percent tax on gaming revenues.
Tosh,
If you haven’t seen these, you’ve got to. This is an amazing collection of photographs. How did I ever miss these? I need to buy the book.
http://blogs.denverpost.com/captured/2010/07/26/captured-america-in-color-from-1939-1943/
Some industry forecasts suggest that, by 2012, homeownership rates could retreat to levels last seen in 1960
That 2012 number keeps popping up lately, more & more.
grim (1)-
Too bad there’s not an options or futures market to match. I’d love to be able to place bets on a community’s (or even a single homeowner’s) chances of hitting the default button.
Talk about “in-the-money” calls!
20,000,000 homeowners underwater by 2012, actual unemployment at 15% to 20%, the largest tax increase in history set to take effect 1/1/11, 35,000,000 slated to go on a failing version of Medicad and the private sector shackled to a dungeon floor. Any questions?
Brother, can you spare a dime?
#6 – grim – Thanks for that! I love the FSA/OIW stuff. There are a few shots in there I don’t think I’ve ever seen before.
Also, slide #30 – ‘Oranges 1c & grapefruit 5c each’. Wow, the currency has lost just a bit of value over the years.
Gary, may be the recovery happens when many people give up hope. Undoing Dubya’s tax cuts will be a good, first step. (I support undoing Dubya’s tax cuts for all, but given the political climate, it will end up with 250k+, tough luck for Dubya and his clan — unintended effects).
“Brother, can you spare a dime?”
That was when we were a noble nation with a backbone and some common sense. Now it’s more like, “give me your f*cking money or I’ll blow your f*cking brains out.”
Lowlife Scousers deserve this one. Wonder if they’ll be serving shredded cardboard buns this year at Anfield Rd:
(EPSN)- Soccernet has had it confirmed from sources close to the Liverpool takeover bid that Kenny Huang is backed by the China Investment Corporation (CIC), an investment arm of the Chinese Government, which owns a stake in Canary Wharf.
Chairman Martin Broughton is hoping to complete a sale of the club before the end of the month with several interested parties having come forward. According to reports in several of Thursday morning’s newspapers, the rival offer from Syrian Yahya Kirdi will not be successful.
Current owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett were said to favour the interest from Kirdi as they would be able to walk away from Anfield with a profit.
CIC, which invests China’s cash reserves in foreign countries, is only willing to repay to debt to Royal Bank of Scotland and Barclays Capital, leaving the North American duo with no return on their investment. But they are believed to be at the top of Broughton’s list of interested parties.
Grim & Tosh,
Beautiful photos, I especially like #70.
Here’s more eye candy:
http://www.loc.gov/pictures/search/?c=100&sp=1&co=fsac&st=grid
#13 – That’s jersey lingo.
Sastry (12)-
Please further explain how a nation can tax itself into prosperity.
grim,
Those pictures are amazing… girls were girls and men were men. Everyone pulled their weight, didn’t need no welfare state… those were the days.
Must’ve sucked back then. No flatscreens, no IShit.
#15 – Ohhh, is that LOC viewer new? They used to have this ham-fisted gallery search that was annoying. Thanks for that.
mistah, we could use a man like Herbert Hoover again….
Doom,
The unnecessary tax cuts for the wealthy are the major contributors to the deficit. Add to that the elimination of Estate Tax.
Dubya claimed in his Y2K debates that since the government had a lot of extra money, we should give it back and went with his tax cuts (twice) despite economic slowdown, 9/11, and wars. Undoing those tax cuts is a positive step, at least for the long term.
In fact, if we didn’t have those tax cuts in the first place, things would have probably turned out to be better. Dubya was championing the unsustainable, “Buy a McMansion and a Hummer” (small business tax write offs for fancy SUVs – local Pizza Joint had a couple of Hummers for delivery).
S
The unnecessary tax cuts for the wealthy are the major contributors to the deficit.
Wow, what a powerhouse statement! And like… eating doughnuts makes you fat.
Goodbye, I’m going to work now, I have to pay my fair share to the underprivileged and less fortunate. Barry, Harry and Nancy told me so.
Recession must be over;
MARBELLA, Spain (AFP) – US First Lady Michelle Obama and her nine-year-old daughter Sasha arrived Wednesday on Spain’s Mediterranean coast for a vacation with friends at a luxury hotel where they have booked 60 rooms.
The pair and their entourage arrived at the Hotel Villa Padierna in the hills above the resort town of Marbella, a haunt for the rich and famous, aboard a cavalcade of vehicles. They had flown to Malaga on a US air force plane.
Dozens of photographers and reporters have staked out the entrance to the five-star hotel, where rates for a room run from 250 euros for a room to 5,000 euros (6,500 dollars) for a villa with 24-hour butler service and private pool and garden.
Initial jobless claims jump 19,000 to 479,000
http://www.marketwatch.com/story/initial-jobless-claims-jump-19000-to-479000-2010-08-05
re 24
It is good to be king.
The gubmint gave the wealthy a tax cut hoping that they will spend it,pass it on to the less fortunate,create busineses and jobs.What did they do? They hoard the money.pass it on among themselves and they got richer.The less fortunate have not seen their paycheck go up in 10 years and yet the number of millionaires during that time have multiplied by over 10 times.The number of billionaires during that time have trippled.GWB gave me a $800 stimulus check,he let the wealthy be able to refinance their $750k mortgages in their homes and still classified as conforming.Now they are saving thousands for the period of their mortgage and I have to thank him for giving me $800? With all the breaks they got already and still don’t want to spend it to stimulate the economy,redistribute it to the ones that will spend it and let the economy going again.
Satara, I also think idle money was also one of the major contributors in the run up of home prices. I used to watch in despair when house prices were jumping up 20% YoY during Duyba’s time. We were basically saving almost everything — and we were not getting closer to an affordable house and our goal was shifting downwards. Eventually when the “fundamentals of economy are strong” time came, we had some handy cash. However, the market could have easily stayed irrational much longer than we could have persisted. Some friends gave up and bought at the peak (though some waited and moved to TX!).
S
uh-oh
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-la-city-pensions-20100804,0,5060130.story
The cost of retirement benefits for Los Angeles city employees will grow by $800 million over the next five years, dramatically eroding the amount of money available for public services to taxpayers, according to a report issued Tuesday.
26.renter says:
August 5, 2010 at 8:46 am
re 24
It is good to be king
Or Ali Baba & his Forty Thieves.
29.Yikes says:
August 5, 2010 at 9:05 am
uh-oh
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-la-city-pensions-20100804,0,5060130.story
The cost of retirement benefits for Los Angeles city employees will grow by $800 million over the next five years, dramatically eroding the amount of money available for public services to taxpayers, according to a report issued Tuesday
Not to worry, 2012 is the Great Equalizer.
Mrs O needs 60 rooms for her entourage???? really???? that seems a bit excessive.
Why ask for a dime when you can have the government extract 30% or more of someone’s income, and have them transfer it to you? No it’s much better to take tens of thousands of dollars from the middle class “rich,” and then spit on them, and then tell them you’re going to come back for an extra 5% next year. And if they don’t like it, we’ll send the red guard to pay them a visit, and make their kids to denounce them as earth-plunderers and money hoarders. How dare they not eagerly sacrifice their wealth and life for the good of the collective? We’re all in this together, it’s for the children.
http://blogs.wsj.com/economics/2010/08/04/compensation-study-employers-pay-more-employees-make-less/?utm_source=feedburner&utm_medium=feed&utm_campaign=Feed%3A+wsj%2Feconomics%2Ffeed+%28WSJ.com%3A+Real+Time+Economics+Blog%29
Compensation Study: Employers make more, Employees make less
http://www.walletpop.com/blog/2010/08/04/what-foreclosures-in-your-hood-cost-you/
What foreclosures in your hood cost you
And one more….
Except for the expiring tax cuts,$250k and above are still the ones getting effected.Small business owners file their incomes through their businesses which gets alot of tax breaks and deductions.
http://www.boston.com/news/nation/washington/articles/2010/08/05/food_stamp_use_hit_record_408m_in_may/
Food stamp increase
How can a country tax itself rich?
Well, rich people just take their money from exploiting the workers, then they fire the workers to make even more money, and then they pour it all into a swimming pool and swim around in it naked. In contrast, when the government takes all of that money, it very wisely invests it in extremely efficient infrastructure projects like sports arenas, long lasting road construction jobs, Alaskan bridges, while providing top quality mail, medical, and retirement welfare services, always providing service with a smile. The government also makes it possible for the most needy among us to enjoy life in front of a cable-equipped TV set, with an ample supply of subsidized fried corn and wheat products, as well as a lifetime supply of the subsequent diabetes treatments for the generously-sized family. Visionary urban “planners” are provided with dignified incomes as a reward for their ability to manage their happy citizens and deliver votes, while our state-appointed educators are granted special priveleges for transforming the minds of the next generation of compliant citizens. So it’s very clear that the transfer of all wealth into the state sector leads to greater incomes and happiness for all but a few reactionary running dogs of capitalism.
need a limo to the airport, any reccomendations?
Think about all the benefits that a employee have lost from 10 to 20 years ago.Used to be Pension plan that was replaced by a 401k that matches 100% for the first 6% contribution,replaced to 3% for the first 6% 0f contribution and employers don’t even match anymore.I used to pay $1 co pay for prescription $5 doctors visit on HMO and what is it now? I have worked 10 years for a company and still get 2 weeks vacation,salary increase is every 3 years and I have to ask for it and get 5% increase.So,what increase does employers really pay more now? The only thing comes to mind is the unsustainable health care and alot of us are against the change.Cost of products is being transfered to consumers.Taxes have been the lowest since the tax cuts.They are paying 15% – 20% tax .Big businesses are getting tax breaks from towns and communities.Ask ourselves are they really paying more?
If you are in Bergen Cty, All-Purpose Limo. 201-462-3222. A big pricey, but very, very reliable and good drivers. I found them in 2000 when I needed car service to take a relative to Sloan-Kettering. They were great — they stayed in the city and picked us up when we were ready, no waiting. That’s important when dealing with someone disabled from cancer. Been using them for airport service ever since.
http://seekingalpha.com/article/218782-pending-homes-sales-hit-new-record-low-when-will-the-deja-vu-be-over?source=dashboard_macro-view
Pending Home Sales Hit New Record Low
250K is not rich in the NYC or surburbs within 30 miles of midtown, It is barely scrapping by. Mr. O is not taxing individuals making over 250K at work, he is taxing household gross household income above 250K, a dual income household with some interest from cds and bonds and dividends are going to get wacked. Meanwhile they are mortgaged to the max. Will the bank knock 10% off their mortgage cause taxes go up 10%, I think not. They will cut back on dinners, new cars, vacations etc. The little business owners will get screwed. That 250K amount should be indexed by zip code. A guy making over 250K on one income in little rock ark, is rich, a nurse and cop couple with some interest income and a big mortgage in BC is not.
That should be “a bit pricey”.
Hot Air reporting Obama plans to order Fannie/Freddie to forgive negative equity in underwater mortgages to buy Nov elections.
http://hotair.com/archives/2010/08/05/is-obama-about-to-forgive-billions-in-mortgage-principal/
“A democracy … can only exist until the majority discovers it can vote itself largess out of the public treasury. After that, the majority always votes for the candidate promising the most benefits with the result the democracy collapses because of the loose fiscal policy ensuing, always to be followed by a dictatorship, then a monarchy.”
re: Bush tax cuts for the wealthy:
I seem to remember the bush tax cuts as something like “your marginal tax rate will decrease by 10% times marginal tax rate,
so if your marginal tax rate is 25%, it is now 22.5%
if your marginal tax rate is 40%, it is now 36%
when prople describe the Bush tax cuts as “for the wealthy”, are they referring to the fact that the higher brackets got the bigger break (albeit because they had a higher marginal rate to begin with)?
so to the extent that they let thet let all the cuts expire, everyone’s taxes go up yah?
I guess pitching it as “ending the cuts for the wealthy” is much more palatable.
jj – #43
I think O-Blame-a has no problem taxing the crap out of the coasts and he doesn’t really care that you need to make 250k+ to get by around NYC. Tough luck. Maybe you (not you personally) should take your wonderful skills and move to Detroit, or some place else where your after-tax income will give you a better lifestyle.
250,000 is hardly “barely scraping by”. It isn’t rich in the northeast but you aren’t worried about putting food on the table or shoes on your feet. You may gasp when the mcmansion heating bill arrives and have some trouble making sure your kids b-day party was better than the last one you went to but be serious.
250,000 is hardly “barely scraping by”.
It’s the top 2% of households.
That was when we were a noble nation with a backbone and some common sense.
And a 94% marginal rate. Can’t imagine them whining like people today.
Schabadoo
When the rate was 94% there were a lot more loop holes available to that bracket so they were rarely paying that much. On top of that 250K needs to be indexed, because 250K is not the same % of households Nationwide as it is by urban area or state or zipcode.
If i my household made what it currently does while living in Kentucky, then i would agree i was close to being wealthy. Anywhere in the northeast and the answer is NOT EVEN CLOSE!!!
west (33)-
Sad, but now it seems an enormous amount of people look to the gubmint to punish the “rich” and redistribute wealth in order to assauge the proletariat’s hurt feelings and sense of victimhood.
In tandem with assuming this power to make “fair” decisions, the gubmint is also charged with the responsibility for making such idiotic and draconian decisions that no person in his right mind will ever again show initiative, take a business risk or otherwise make any effort to accumulate capital.
This will work really well until we have killed all the golden geese, yet have 300 mm victims, crying for redress against the rich, who no longer exist.
Mr Hyde,
Kentucky has open borders.
West (38)-
And people wonder why I’ve armed myself to the teeth.
jj (43)-
Great idea…except it is intellingent and would not lead to the desired outcome, which is subjugation of every individual to the gubmint.
Buy a limo
39.Mr Hyde says:
August 5, 2010 at 9:52 am
need a limo to the airport, any reccomendations?
50
I did some time in Lexington, unless you are in the horse business having more teeth than tattoos is considered wealthy in Kentucky.
Lexington is actually a decent town when you are in your early 20’s, especially when Keeneland is open and UK is in session.
What if the approx. 43% of Americans who don’t pay federal income tax were not allowed to vote?
250K after federal taxes, double state taxes, SS taxes, property taxes, transportation cost, lunches and clothes for work, baby sitting cost, car insurance, health insurance, utilities, networking cost, professional development cost, not to mention student loan payments and morgage …how much is exactly left over?
Better is there anything left over? How about 401K,529 and other forms of saving planning for future?
I have no mortgage, buy used cars, rarely take a vacation, never hire a baby sitter, don’t get take and do my own home repairs. In my opinion 250K is still scrapping by. IF you are saving for retirement, saving for several kids college education, weddings and want emergency cash and a plan B pile of cash if you get axed at 55 and are forced to retire early.
You need at least 500K a year, in NYC to afford a mortgage save for all the things I save for and live the highlife. I know several people who make better around 750K who say stuff like I could never afford a new car, yet I know kids making 50K a year running out and leasing a new car and getting a summer share.
Most 250K a year guys I know have a stay at home wife and three kids, that one check is split five ways after Uncle Sam takes 50% of it. Rich to me is like 5 million a year an up. Heck I know a guy in the bull market who got bought at at peak and in 2007 cleared 100 million in one year, he told me he feels like a middle class person, when asked why, he said I only did it one year, a real rich person would be pulling down 100 million every year. Now that is rich to him. To me his one time 100 million would be rich enough.
Doom, was the population subjugated when Clinton was in power? The new rates will be the same as what were during Clinton’s time. Discounting your exaggeration for effect, it still seems very far fetched. There is more danger from corporations indirectly taking over the country than some rude government employee at the DMV.
Renter, “what if the approx. 43% of Americans who don’t pay federal income tax were not allowed to vote?”. A lot of red state teabaggers will become ineligible to vote.
S
“Hot Air reporting Obama plans to order Fannie/Freddie to forgive negative equity in underwater mortgages to buy Nov elections.”
There’s buying votes, then there’s BUYING VOTES!!!
http://www.bloomberg.com/news/2010-08-05/squeezing-the-rich-is-poor-way-to-spur-growth-commentary-by-caroline-baum.html
Caroline Baum’s take on the issue: Squeezing the Rich is Poor Way to Spur Growth
“What we do know, empirically, is this: Over time, federal revenue as a share of gross domestic product has stayed fairly constant at 17.9 percent. That’s true if the top marginal tax rate is 91 percent (1950s) 50 percent (early 1980s) or 35 percent (2000s). Recessions are the one exception.”
sastry (60)-
The population has been pretty much subjugated since before Clinton was in office.
Corporations have not indirectly taken over the gubmint; the takeover has actually been direct. They have bought the legislative and executive branches (and the judicial, in states where judges run for office).
All US tax policy is fraudulent and illegal, as the gubmint itself is an illegal criminal racket.
One of the great brainwashing tricks the gubmint has pulled is inculcating the idea that a country can tax its way to prosperity.
It is much more likely that one can drink oneself sober, gamble his way into propriety or eat himself slim.
Just look at what high taxes have done for Europe.
jj: “IF you are saving for retirement”… Any 401k money is outside the 250k limit. And, with a small business type situation, you can really push the limit (45k each for self and spouse going taxfree to retirement; expenses — like the Pizza guy’s Hummer; “Business trips”), etc.
Many companies have deferred compensation, etc.
250k is quite a bit of money if one doesn’t have a mortgage. I think you are aiming for the “FU money,” (the amount of savings at which point you can say FU to the world and go on with a comfortable life), which will be a really large amount of money.
The “one time 100 million isn’t good enough” argument is crazy. How does one reconcile even with the argument that 250k is not enough (after IRAs, etc.) with crazy mobs are ready to crucify teachers getting 100k/year and those that rant about the “jobs that mexicans are stealing” ($10/hr? — 20k/yr)
S
More @ 62….
“If you want to get money out of politics, there’s only one way to do it. Take the tax code out of Congress’s hands.”
Off to work….half days for two weeks then the real deal…
Have a good day all.
Cindy, 67… We should have only public financing for elections. Even though some times guys that buy their way to power don’t have puppet masters to obey or a rabid base to please (e.g. Bloomberg and the NYC mosque controversy), removing money out of elections is an option worth exploring.
Mexicans are stealing jobs. Kids used to mow lawns, baby sit, work as bus boys, clean decks, paint, move furniture, etc. in HS and College and now they took those jobs.
Teachers at 100K are overpaid. 99% of teachers in my elementary are women, nearly all married to men with full time jobs. A 100K is a lot for a part time second income. According to the book Millionaire next door the number one occupation of a male millionaire’s wife is teacher. Nice
Why are you all talking about me as if I am not here?
this makes me want to puke:
http://blogs.reuters.com/drudge.html
It is actually very difficult to save for retirement. Like a lot of people I am done with my 401K match pretty quick as the amount you can put in is not much. 401Ks I have no tax benefit to put money in, only on gain, but amount is small, I don’t own a business, so I can’t use that loophole. My wife does not work so I can’t do a 401k for her or an IRA fro her. Basically $16,500 a year is all I can save for retirement where it is beneficial tax wise.
I am an excelent saver, what I don’t like is I put for instance 100K of my money at risk on a 20 year high yield bond paying 15%. If I wipe out Uncle Sam lets me write of 3k. If it is a winner, I get $300,000 in interest over life of bond and Uncle Sam takes $120K of my money. Even the mafia gives better rates.
Sas3 says:
August 5, 2010 at 12:03 pm
jj: “IF you are saving for retirement”… Any 401k money is outside the 250k limit. And, with a small business type situation, you can really push the limit (45k each for self and spouse going taxfree to retirement; expenses — like the Pizza guy’s Hummer; “Business trips”), etc.
Many companies have deferred compensation, etc.
250k is quite a bit of money if one doesn’t have a mortgage. I think you are aiming for the “FU money,” (the amount of savings at which point you can say FU to the world and go on with a comfortable life), which will be a really large amount of money.
The “one time 100 million isn’t good enough” argument is crazy. How does one reconcile even with the argument that 250k is not enough (after IRAs, etc.) with crazy mobs are ready to crucify teachers getting 100k/year and those that rant about the “jobs that mexicans are stealing” ($10/hr? — 20k/yr)
I was going to weigh in on the tax policy debate, but it is the same positions being pushed by the same people for years now.
Curious to see when the June 30 Section 6039G number comes out. Will more taxpayers decide that they don’t like being Obama’s whipping boys?
Dryvit Residential MD or Sprint MD: Is it EIFS?
I am interested in a house in Essex county, NJ. The house was built in 1949 and was remodeled in 2004. In 2004, it used Dryvit Residential MD or Sprint MD EIFS. I posted a question regarding EIFS, my understanding is that EIFS is troublesome.
Now, my agent (double-agent) provides me some materials to proof Dryvit Residential MD or Sprint MD is good. I would like to know
1) Any major issue with Dryvit Residential MD or Sprint MD? Is it a EIFS product?
2) For insurance, does insurance company treat Dryvit Residential MD or Sprint MD the same as EIFS? Is it difficult to purchase insurance for such house?
You insights would be highly appreciated.
I’m off work today. Just heard on Bloomberg that Obama denied for the 2nd time in two weeks that he will change any of the Fannie/Freddie rules. He only made a statement when his advisors told him that the rumor was influencing treasury rates.
Last I looked, we were at 2.89 0n the ten-year.
It’s EIFS.
Renter [43];
What if the approx. 43% of Americans who don’t pay federal income tax were not allowed to vote?
The masters in the Supreme Court have said a Poll Tax is racits, and therefore unconstitutional.
Putting that aside, I have a better idea: run it like a corporation (one share = one vote). Under my idea, every tax dollar buys you one vote. Want to cheat on your taxes? Maybe we’ll get around to tracking you down, but in the mean time on election day, the weight of your vote depends on your stake in the system.
Re [78];
Should have been Renter [57] – got “43” on the brain from your 43% cited.
Not Bottom Yet [75];
“You can get wood. You can get brick. You can even get stucco. Boy, can you get stucco.”
– Groucho Marx
Bottom,
The problem isnt the brand, but how they were installed. Much of the EIF installations were not done well/properly. If any moisture gets behind and EIFS system you have a mold farm and nice little source of rot that can easily spread from the initial site.
EIFS should be approached with much caution regardless fo who the manufacturer is.
Moose, you are thinking only in the accounting dimension. If those rules were in play historically, slavery would have been alive and well. Women wouldn’t have been able to vote. Life in general would look a lot like the rule of Arab Sheiks.
The objective of civilization should amount (at least in the long term) to much more than the game to decide who ends up with the most marbles or gold coins.
Poor Groucho, he moved to Great Neck Long Island mid career and used to perform at the Great Neck Playhouse a lot which was a big vaudeville stop and loved taking LIRR right to NYC which was walking distance from Broadway where he also did shows. Well Great Neck as we know from the Great Gastby book was booming in the roaring 20’s as everyone was making a fortune in the stock market, Groucho was a cheap SOB and could not take it. He on a recommendation of a few friends opened a brokerage account with a firm on Middle Neck Road, loved sitting there watching his money go through the roof day after day. He kept putting more money in and more money grew, then he got wiped out in crash. He did the “you bet your life shows” when he was already a pretty old guy as he was broke and need the money.
“You can get wood. You can get brick. You can even get stucco. Boy, can you get stucco.”
– Groucho Marx
Honorable Peter Cammarano gets two years in the can:
http://www.nj.com/hobokennow/index.ssf/2010/08/destitite_former_hoboken_mayor.html
Ricky 72 – I don’t understand how the administration thinks that forgiving negative equity for 15million homeowners will help. What about the other 80% of home-owners that are not underwater? What about the 38% of americans that don’t own their home? So you get 15million Americans that will follow you to the pits of hell and 285 million Americans that will be happy to get all of to the pits of hell as quickly as possible.
What am I missing?
sastry
How about some proportionality then? how about we all put into the system in equal proportions? 3% of a million is a heck of a lot more then 3% of 30K and yet both have contributed proportionally.
The at hand is that you have the many voting for redistribution of the money of the few. You want tax increases? increase for everyone across the board in equal proportion.
Where’s my free house? Why should I spend my own money on one when the gov’t is using it to buy one for everyone else? We’ve decide to spend our life savings on consumables. Met a 17 year old tonight by the name of Glengoyne.
Looking at the rates today and makes me think that Japan is a lock. Get ready for 1% 30yr fixed rate. Although Schiff told me last night that hyperinflation is a few years away I’m thinking that Japan is more likely scenerio.
Have fun with this interactive map of unemployment
http://cohort11.americanobserver.net/latoyaegwuekwe/multimediafinal.html
Hyde,
I am just talking about the undoing of W’s tax cuts. He cut taxes for the wealthy when the economy was tanking and put wars on credit card (one was a war of choice). I support undoing the mistake (or at least simply let things revert back to rates from a better time).
Taxes going up and down are not decided by elections. If things were are simple as non-tax paying people voting for higher taxes, then W wouldn’t have won in Y2K (he promised tax cuts — instead the media focused on how Gore was a liar even when W took credit for TX Patients Bill of Rights — which he vetoed!), and definitely not 2004 (gay baiting, swiftboating and rampant xenophobia).
The reason dems got into power was that W’s incompetence and corruption, not because suddenly some 52% population thought they can vote themselves paychecks from others’ money.
Hyde, the impact of a 3% drop in after-tax income for a rich person is not the same as the impact of a 3% drop in after-tax income for a poor person.
A CEO of a company my friend worked for was temporarily taking zero salary and used that as a justification for a massive pay cut for everyone (40% pay cut). He owned over 50% of the company and his back salary and bonus later on — while the lower end folks simply got fcut.
It is a testament to the power a few rich people hold on the country that in the time of ever increasing pace of wealth migration upwards, and historically low tax rates, we are even discussing about a mass of non-tax paying people taking over the country and voting themselves benefits.
Sas3 [82];
I see what you are saying: slave owners probably paid alot in taxes. But northern merchants paid taxes too, as did businesses in other free states that were at a competitive disadvantage due to the lack of slave labor. I don’t think its as slam dunk as you say.
What if ‘one tax dollar, one vote’ were limited to appropriations measures?
When three people are in a room and two agree to mug the third, its conspiracy and felony; when its 200 million of 300 million, its progressive taxation. It will only stop when teh t!t-suckers are no longer immune to the pocket pinch.
I was absolutely dirt poor with out a nickle in my pocket when George Bush took office, his tax cuts and pro-business style made me and millions of others millionaires. America is a great country. God Bless America and free market capitalism where a ditch digger can be the mayor of the town in a matter of years. Trouble is the folks in civil service, welfare and drug dealers now want them rolled back. They did not benefit from the pr0-work low tax environment. I will throw all my money into savings bonds, t-bills, munis, non dividend paying high growth stocks and real estate when taxes go up. Either tax free, somewhat tax free or defer my gaing till Barak is long gone and the republicans are back in charge.
I am just talking about the undoing of W’s tax cuts. He cut taxes for the wealthy when the economy was tanking and put wars on credit card (one was a war of choice). I support undoing the mistake (or at least simply let things revert back to rates from a better time).
bottom (75)-
Too technical a question for me to answer. However, much of the EIFS problems don’t stem from the product…they stem from improper installation.
stu (76)-
Did he give his pals time to front-run the announcement?
“Just heard on Bloomberg that Obama denied for the 2nd time in two weeks that he will change any of the Fannie/Freddie rules. He only made a statement when his advisors told him that the rumor was influencing treasury rates.”
HE (84)-
It should’ve been a public execution. He got off easy.
Most likely!
Free federal money for NJ schools.
schools.http://www.northjersey.com/news/education/education_news/99958379_Ridgewood_schools_receive_federal_grant_for_history_education.html
Ridgewood, Linden, West Orange, Camden, Allamuchy (?), Ewing, and Bridgeton will receive $500,000 to nearly a million each to help their teachers learn US history.
sastry (91)-
We don’t tax poor people neraly enough. They should pay more.
stater (98)-
This is what you get when you hire the ignorant to teach the ignorant.
Rats. Sorry for the messed up link.
http://www.northjersey.com/news/education/education_news/99958379_Ridgewood_schools_receive_federal_grant_for_history_education.html
#100 Yeah, it would be funny if it weren’t so pathetic and costly. And how often do you see Ridgewood mentioned with Linden and Camden in the same article?
Re: Rumors of Fannie/Freddie negative equity jubilee;
I almost forgot the clip that just keeps on giving:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=P36x8rTb3jI
Who tipped her off?
jj #93,
W’s tenure was like a lottery scheme — the lucky ones (flipping houses, having cushy contractor jobs, stock investments, being at the right place at the right time) made it big. However, that becomes very 3rd world. Do you think a ditch digger with no contacts will have the same chance of becomin a mayor than one that is well connected?
The overall standard of living was going down the drain since W took office. Initially it was inflation, then low employment.
Michael Krieger, on a roll again:
“First of all I think it’s insane for anyone to have gold within a bank. The entire purpose of gold is to escape the banking system once it becomes so big, complex and fraudulent that there is no place to go but collapse upon its ponzi scheme structure. I smell a rat in this BIS deal. People are not going to be happy when they try to redeem their paper gold. I can’t tell you how many people I know that are selling GLD (HSBC is the custodian!!) and buying physical. Of great significance is also the fact that on every orchestrated comex plunge physical buying accelerates. As an example, the U.S. Mint reported selling only 85,000 coins in the first twenty one days of July but then sold 57,000 in the last seven days of the month. This sort of behavior is what will limit the downside. There are enough smart people with lots of money that see the current system for the fraud that it is and are getting out while physical gold is still available.”
http://www.zerohedge.com/article/guest-post-russia-bans-grain-exports-end-game-trade-begins
More fun Krieger (this is a WS guy, not some internet wacko):
“What is happening at the moment on the world stage is that essentially the governments of all major countries on planet earth are on the verge of collapse one way or the other. While there are certainly many differences between the governments of China, Russia and the United States for example, there is one huge similarity. They are all highly bureaucratic centrally planned economies. What is so interesting about the present time is that we are witnessing the end of the current monetary and financial system that has dominated the world since 1971. This will also invariably mean that we are about to witness dramatic political and social change in virtually every country on earth. The very elite in the United States know this which is why they are using their puppets in D.C. to pass laws that will put the citizens into a neo-feudalistic debt slavery so that they will not revolt once it becomes clear to all that the politicians are a bunch of crooks and scoundrels that have sold them out entirely. On a positive note, I think a critical mass has already been achieved in the U.S. and I think D.C. will collapse under its own weight. As I wrote to a small group of friends earlier this week as relates to the fact that a sheriff there stated “Our Own Government Has Become Our Enemy.”:
It doesn’t matter what you think about the AZ law. It is merely a microcosm for a bigger battle being waged between states rights and the gulag federal government. The second American revolution HAS begun and it started in Arizona (I thought it might be Texas). Either way, what I expect to happen in the months ahead is more and more people are going to STOP obeying federal laws and ultimately states will also simply not obey. This is not necessarily what I am endorsing I am just telling you where I think this is headed. This will put the Federal government into a corner where they will need to respond. The stock market is being used as a government weapon to make people think things are ok when there is a massive tempest brewing that will wipe away the entire structure. Either way, the revolution will not be televised. Commerce will increasingly move to a black market model (l have heard big discounts are being offered in Greece if you pay in cash and that will be here too).”
Sas – everyone seems to classify W’s tax cut as for the wealthy. Well, wouldn’t any tax cut favor the wealthy since they pay most of the taxes in the first place?
ricky_nu: Many tax rebates favor the middle to low percentiles (e.g. making work pay thing from Obama; personal deductions; etc. — at least as a fraction of savings). Increasing threshold for welfare or food stamps favors the bottom percentiles. On the other hand, elimination of estate tax, taxes on dividends, etc., will favor the top percentiles. So, depending on the mix of ingredients, different tax cuts are different.
Sastry:
How much of my income does your interpretation of “civilization” allow me to keep?
I don’t want to hear about Bush did this or Reagan that.
How much of my life’s work do you presume to allow me to keep for myself?
Do I get to keep half? If so, there’s no more room for you to take.
But I think I know your code of morality: as long as someone else proclaims their need, you will say that they have a moral right to take my wealth. In other words, no individual man owns his own wealth or life, but lives only to serve the needs of others, human sacrifices upon the altar of society.
Sorry for putting words in your mouth, dipstick. I’ll keep my words out of your mouth when you and your friends take your hands out of my pockets.
A West
As sastry once explained to me, your success is not your own, you were onyl able to achieve your personal success as it may be due to the effort of those around you, hence they have a natural right to a portion of your success.
although that raises an interesting question. Consider the inverse, If everyone is partially responsible for my success they they should also be responsable for my failures.
#110 Hyde
“If everyone is partially responsible for my success they they should also be responsable for my failures.”
Does that translate to privatize the profits and socialize the losses?
If fatty & fruity mortgage holders get bailed out it would suggest the ultimate admission of guilt that gov’t fckd up.
109 and 110 Amen, brothers.
Clot,
Think of the Bush Tax cuts this way.
If you don’t let them expire, they cost 1.8 Trillion over the next 10 years. While you can bang on all day about fairness an who shoud pay what and the government is spending too much. If the tax cuts had not gone in the first place, we would be in a lot better shape. If you think they should be renewed, where do you get the 1.8T from to poay for them.
Here is a simple action plan. Let the cuts expire, and use any increse in revenue to pay down the defecit.
Now, I’m headed off to vacation and research work in China and Indonesia.
A. West, none of my comments were addressed to you. The discussion was on (a) reversing W’s tax cuts, (b) how those rates aren’t some new, unprecedented “tyranny”, (c) looting by a new majority of voters that suddenly turned up to vote for tax increases for rich, and (d) the whole meaningless fight over a bigger share of a smaller pie, when the alternative of a smaller share of a bigger pie is beneficial to all.
You seem to point out way too frequently that you make some magical amount way more than others. Compensating for something?
loss
http://www.philly.com/inquirer/columnists/michael_klein/20100805_Inqlings__Chef_Puck_to_cater_at_Kimmel.html
Iverson finally connects
Two-time 76er Allen Iverson and his estranged wife, Tawanna, finally sold their Villanova mansion after three years, according to Main Line real estate sources who peg the tab at $2.6 million. In 2002, the couple paid $5 million for the five-bedroom on four acres. In July 2007, they listed it for $6.3 million. The mortgage satisfaction, but not the sale, has hit Montgomery County records.
West (109)-
Keep it up!
Sadly, the only thing that will ultimately keep the gubmint’s hand out of your pocket is hot lead, dispensed by cold steel.
gluteus (114)-
The gubmint is a big, fat addict on a money-eating binge that will not end until everything in its path is laid waste. Any “extra” money that might have been there had GWB’s tax cut not been enacted would have been jammed up the addict’s nose and would now be long-gone…BECAUSE ADDICTS CANNOT CONTROL THEMSELVES AND ALWAYS DO THE WRONG THING.
The only way to truly fix the current mess is to rehab the gubmint by slashing its scope, slashing its functions, firing countless useless employees and cutting off the supply of money that allows it to feed its addiction and coddle its enablers.
Doom, so the guys that got rich on the backs of hardworking Americans over the generations that also paid large taxes suddenly decide that now is the time that they should not pay any taxes? Guys that got TARP money complaining that govt shouldn’t tax their bonuses? You do not see an irony?
#109 A West,
You can keep it all after you pay tax on tax.
Why are you pushing Reagan and Bush/Bush to the side, bring them back front and center. A lot of today’s situation goes straight back to them. You say why should those who have made it have to pay more to those below, well the short answer is that it was made for the most part on the back of the deficit spending of the past 30 years. To pay for supply side and trickle down economics Ronnie tripled the debt and both Bushes doubled it.
So not only do those lower down never get to see the benefits of higher incomes and the supposed rising tide, they get left with a bigger share of the deficit bill.
Doom, 119: We had surpluses toward the end of Clinton’s second term, and the boogeyman of the finance guys was that Social Security was going to die “soon” — and of course the Y2K. You blame the government too much — most of the corruption occurred during W’s rule, when it was a “patriotic thing to support the president”.
sastry (120)-
You need to spend more time hating the gubmint (and those who have co-opted it) rather than those who have become successful. The horror of our current economy is that it is a zero-sum game, and a rigged one at that. People who achieve real success and create wealth do not do it at the expense of others.
The only problem is, insane programs of taxation do not differentiate between the robber baron and the entrepreneur. Therefore, the entire system should be abolished, along with the corrupt gubmint that perpetuates it.
Fabius, slow down or A. West will try to mock your income.
#119 Clot
No I think of it more of a Pinata that the greedy big kids keep beating and taking more of their fair share of the candy. They will not let the smaller kids near it and will keep beating it until it either breaks, parents or a bigger kids comes along and stops them and shares the candy or the smaller kids group together and kick the sh1t out of them.
A happy day for conservatives, as the Court moves to the right.
Nice to see it in simple terms.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_debt_by_U.S._presidential_terms
I’m out of this argument. The bleeding heart contingent keeps trying to make this a Dumbocrat/Rethuglican battle.
Wake up, guys. They’re BOTH your enemy. People who hold elective office (and most of the paper-pushers behind them) are stone-cold criminals.
The two parties- and the game show announcers they help get elected president- are the scum of the Earth. There is no diff among Reagan, Bush, Clinton, whoever…they are all pretty much Satan personified.
110: Yes, think bailouts.
although that raises an interesting question. Consider the inverse, If everyone is partially responsible for my success they they should also be responsable for my failures.
#128 Clot
This is not the bleeding heart contingent making it a D/R battle. For me this is the moderate middle standing up and saying that the BS streaming from the right is wrong. Look at the real causes and you will be able to work out the real solutions. The woes of today is not down to welfare nation and the rich feeling overtaxed, just like the housing crash was not fault of Sub prime on its own.
If you are leaving the argument, it will be nice to get a break from the one trick solution of “burn the MoFo down”. If it was a realistic solution, it might have merit.
Doom, it is not a question of hating something and I definitely think that the economy is NOT a zero-sum game. Despite the prevalent xenophobia and bigotry, I think brighter days are ahead.* Of course, it is ironic to hear lessons on “keeping rightfully earned money” morality from TARP people — almost as bad as Kerry’s Yacht housed in Rhode Island, but the rhetoric is a bit silly.
* Of course, if SHTF, Plan B is to abandon all illiquid assets in US as a lost gamble and bolt to India, where I will get to see a lot more “let them eat cake” type people.
Nom, Would you like to build a nompound in India?
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/05/business/global/05legal.html?src=me&ref=general
Outsourcing to India Draws Western Lawyers
128 – Amen. Democratic or Republican – they both have their own ways of getting your money.
56. Nonsense. You’ll find more attractive women with great teeth in Lexington than anywhere around here. Including many of the bars in NYC.
gluteus (130)-
Burn the mf’er down is a very realistic solution. History is replete with such instances.
spyder (133)-
We have a gang of crooks intent on looting and enslaving us all, and most of us just want to point at some group allegedly receiving favorable attention.
The enemy are banksters and politicos. Kill or be killed.
128.Final Doom says:
August 5, 2010 at 5:00 pm
I’m out of this argument. The bleeding heart contingent keeps trying to make this a Dumbocrat/Rethuglican battle.
Wake up, guys. They’re BOTH your enemy. People who hold elective office (and most of the paper-pushers behind them) are stone-cold criminals.
The two parties- and the game show announcers they help get elected president- are the scum of the Earth. There is no diff among Reagan, Bush, Clinton, whoever…they are all pretty much Satan personified.
True enough. Clinton, Bush & Obama are classic non American Globalists. The influx of illegals grew steadily worse under each, and the outflux of Real jobs grew steadily worse under each, as America deteriorated steadily worse under each. The last President who didn’t speak Psychobabble was DDE. The only Presidents after him that accomplished anything of value was Nixon ending the Kennedy/Johnson VietNam War and Regan getting the Soviets to finally blink, although Afghanistan was a final nail in their coffin. Other then that you had a lot of reconstituted B.S for special interests.
Way cool heatmap of misery:
http://hosted.ap.org/specials/interactives/_national/stress_index/
Seven Reasons Not to Send Your Kids to College
Imagine a retirement where you could have an extra $1million to $3 million in the bank with basically no effort. Now imagine telling your kids that you aren’t going to send them to college. And, you go on, you want them to immediately start a business or get to work as soon as they finish high school.
These are difficult things to imagine because we’ve been so scammed by the “career industry” that tells us we need college degrees in order to succeed in life, regardless of how much money we spend for those degrees or what we actually do with our lives during the four to eight years it takes us to get those degrees.
But in my view, the entire college degree industry is a scam, a self-perpetuating Ponzi scheme that needs to stop right now.
Here Are Seven Reasons to Say “No College” to Your Kids:
1. More than 60% of people entering college take more than four years to graduate. So whatever you think your kids are going to cost you to go to college, add 20% to 100%.
2. The cost of the average college tuition has gone up nine-fold since 1976 versus seven-fold for health care and three-fold for inflation.
3. The differential in lifetime income between a college graduate and a non-college graduate over a 45 year career is approximately $800,000 (read on).
4. If I put that $200,000 that I would’ve spent per child to cover tuition costs, living expenses, books, etc. into bonds yielding just 3% (any muni bonds) and let it compound for 49 years (adding back in the 4 years of college), I get $851,000. So my kids can avoid college and still end up with the same amount in the worst case.
snip
http://www.dailyfinance.com/story/investing/seven-reasons-not-to-send-your-kids-to-college/19572537/
Lexington? Lexington, KY? Even that is not enough to make up for the general dumpiness of the place.
Anyone hear whether Colin is supposed to hit NJ?
Doom,
What all these maps seem to sho wis that the “flyover states” that end up the butt of so many jokes seem to be doing better then most of the nation
142: Little infrastructure. Few jobs. Fewer people. Mankind near the natural balance with the environment. From the political perspective – nothing much to exploit – except the whole Electoral College issue.
There is a reason it’s a fly-over.
#135 Clot
This is not 1700’s France and I’m sure you will not be one leading a charge.
Actually thinking about it, the only way that could happen would be if the right wing PAC’s started hirng illegals to do the heavy lifting for them. If there are disturbances, check their wallets. There may not be green cards or DL’s but there could be 10K Western Union receipts. Whats the odds there are some that have considered it?
Interesting quote from Czech republic;
Some people have the vocabulary to sum up things in a way you can understand them. This quote came from the Czech Republic. Someone over there has it figured out.
“The danger to America is not Barack Obama but a citizenry capable of entrusting a man like him with the Presidency. It will be far easier to limit and undo the follies of an Obama presidency than to restore the necessary common sense and good judgment to a depraved electorate willing to have such a man for their president. The problem is much deeper and far more serious than Mr. Obama, who is a mere symptom of what ails America. Blaming the prince of the fools should not blind anyone to the vast confederacy of fools that made him their prince. The Republic can survive a Barack Obama, who is, after all, merely a fool. It is less likely to survive a multitude of fools such as those who made him their president.”
Interesting quote from Czech republic
About as tired as it was back in the wintertime.
Did they miss the untraveled Chauncey Gardner stumbling over his mother tongue for eight years while his dad’s fixers pillaged the country?
‘Hey here’s two wars and a depression, have fun!’
Sas3 (22):
RIGHT ON!
Gary (23):
Yep, absolutely. I am trim, but I am terrified of popping. When I go to the Dunkin Donuts I see folks who look like the go there to buy a half dozen a couple of times a day when I go maybe once a month, if that. Special treat for me, but, I agree with you… a lot of Americuns think they need a pony.
It’s over, folks. We can’t have the tax and spend plus the no taxes for the rich land of leisure anymore. We’re dead. Luckily the rest of the world is just as bad. So… let’s bring ourselves back into sensible government: cut spending and raise taxes, not the other away around. Once we have got a healthy surplus to pay our city, state, and nationwide debts down then we can talk about where we should have fun. You want games without frontiers in Kakrapistan? Raccoons on Mars? Cat toenail insurance? SURE! Let’s entertain all those thoughts once we are on the way to solvency, right?
Agreed? Who’s stopping us? Only the losers, I’d say.
128, he who shall be nameless.
Hmm… How’d we ever agree on anything? Well I agree with you 100% there, and I’d rather have you as my enemy than either of those craphole parties.
And for a bunch of others… if you think you’re making $250,000 and barely scarping by in the greater NYC area, then you are beyond hope. I make $100k less than that, am happy with my job, support my wife and kids, big screen TV, beamer, AND have $250,000 for a down payment. But hey, some people gotta have the Hummer, Hooker, and Iron Wolf Stove, right?
Did they miss the untraveled Chauncey Gardner stumbling over his mother tongue for eight years while his dad’s fixers pillaged the country?
I preferred “Dave” to “Chance The Gardner”. He recognized Jobs were number 1.
Erin go Bust. Hardly an American to be found in county Clare in August.
Going to be a long walk home for many here in Ireland.
“The Republic can survive a Barack Obama, who is, after all, merely a fool. It is less likely to survive a multitude of fools such as those who made him their president.”
Common sense is a beautiful thing.
Keep posting stuff like this i really like it
Striking Blog! I liked your piece of writing, esp. its title.