Prices still falling in Morris

(grim’s note: Yes, the rate of decline may have slowed in from January to June, but that is largely due to the market being goosed by external subsidy, which no longer exists. Look for the rate of decline to accelerate into the Winter months.)

From the Daily Record:

Average price down again, but rate of decline slows

The averge sale price of a home in Morris County continued its three-year drop in the first six months of this year, but the decline eased to its slowest pace since early 2007, to only about one-half of a percent.

But while the slow movement of foreclosed and bank-owned homes is holding back the market overall, experts say, first-time buyers are still being attracted by the lower prices and low mortgage rates.

In the three years since January and March of 2007, when the average sale price was $557,835, the average fell by $87,229 — a 15.6 percent drop.

This year, the average price of the 2,050 homes sold between January and June was $470,606, according to sales records compiled by the Garden State Multiple Listing Service and supplied by Weichert Realtors of Morris Plains.

“This is a sloppy market,” said real estate attorney Robert Wianecki of Boonton.

The pipeline is jammed with foreclosures, bank-owned homes, and with prices dragged down by short sales, he said.

All those factors hold back the market, he said.

In the past three years, Wianecki said, the bad economy has increased the number of homes being offered through foreclosure, which has increased the number of bank-owned homes and short sales.

The Morris County Sheriff’s office has scheduled roughly 500 foreclosure sales through November, according to its website.

Foreclosures and bank-owned homes are like a clog in hose, Wianecki said. Until that inventory is reduced there will be no normal flow of real estate action. And with the county clerk’s office recording only 33 new single-family home lots in 2009, and only a couple hundred units of new multi-family housing, those existing homes with the bad loans will define the market until they are cleared out.

Wianecki said his office is seeing a steady number of buyers hoping to buy a foreclosure-listed home or one owned by a bank, but those are the toughest sales to unravel. Between second lein holders unwilling to take the reduced amount to settle their portion of the loan, or the effort to unwind the homeowners’ use of equity lines of credit, the negotations add time to the sales, slowing the process.

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64 Responses to Prices still falling in Morris

  1. grim says:

    From the Record:

    Bergen County homebuilder faces legal, financial challenges in housing market’s wake

    In fall 2008, a Saddle River chateau — on the market for almost $8 million — was chosen to host a designer showcase fund-raiser, where visitors pay to peek at a glamorous lifestyle.

    The house’s starring role put a spotlight on its builder, Scott Forbes, who had constructed mega-homes in some of Bergen County’s wealthiest towns.

    But Forbes’s fortunes would soon fall victim to the worst housing market since the Great Depression.

    Two years after being featured in the fund-raiser, the house — 20 Denison Drive East — is still for sale, now for under $6 million. And the 41-year-old Forbes finds himself in bankruptcy and dealing with a bad-check charge — a symbol of the housing bubble’s excess and ensuing financial turmoil.

    Forbes’ creditors say he owes them more than $11 million. Some creditors and former investors — subcontractors, lumber companies and members of the prominent Inganamort family — have filed lawsuits and criminal complaints. One creditor even tried to get Forbes to sell his Porsche to repay a debt.

    While a bankruptcy trustee may soon sell his Upper Saddle River home, Forbes’ creditors have seethed at seeing Forbes continue to live in the house, as well as in a house at the Jersey Shore, and drive expensive cars.

  2. grim says:

    From the Guardian UK:

    Jobless millions signal death of the American dream for many

    Richard Gaines is one of the best-known faces on Camden’s Haddon Avenue. It is a rough-and-tumble street, lined with cheap businesses and boarded-up houses, and is prey to drug gangs. Gaines, 50, runs a barbershop, a hair salon and a fitness business. He works hard and is committed to his community. But Haddon Avenue is not an easy place to make a living in the best of times. And these are far from the best of times.

    Just how badly the great recession has struck this fragile New Jersey city, which is currently the poorest in America, was recently spelled out to Gaines. In happier times – whatever that might mean for a city as destitute as Camden – local businesses on Haddon Avenue could at least rely on a bit of trade from those who made their money on the street.

    Young men bought flashy clothes and got sharp haircuts and always paid in cash. But no longer. The economy is now so bad in Camden that even the criminals are struggling and going short. “Even the guys who got money from illegal means really don’t want to spend it,” Gaines said.

  3. grim says:


    From the APP:

    New Jersey lottery sales set record

    The slumping economy seemingly hasn’t stopped lottery players in New Jersey who want to cash in on their dreams.

    Recently released data shows the state lottery set a new record for ticket sales — $2.6 billion — in the fiscal year that ended June 30, The Press of Atlantic City reported Saturday.

  4. grim says:

    Bringing this discussion over from the last thread.

    I didn’t bother taking the LSAT I’d scheduled earlier this year. Even though I collect degrees as sport, I decided that this one wasn’t worth bagging. Although I might go for it in the future, if tuition falls off enough to make it worthwhile. No worries, I have no interest in any kind of legal career, just a general interest in the law itself.

    From the Star Ledger:

    Facing bleak job prospects, student loans, N.J. law school grads wonder if it was worth it

    The angry rants first surfaced last summer on an anonymous New Jersey blog.

    Law school is a “scam,” the blogger wrote. Administrators are greedy “charlatans” who could not care less about education, and students are but “hapless lemmings” who have been tricked into paying a fortune to enter “America’s most overrated, miserable and saturated industry.”

    Within months, the blog was drawing up to 5,000 unique readers a day, many of whom praised the anonymous writer — known only as Law is 4 Losers — as a hero for exposing the lies they say they, too, were fed about secure jobs and generous incomes.

    The blogger is Scott Bullock, a 2005 Seton Hall University School of Law graduate who agreed to reveal his identity to The Star-Ledger for this article. Yet Bullock, whose outrage stems from graduating with more than $100,000 of debt but meager job prospects, says he is merely tapping into a groundswell of resentment against the nation’s law schools.

    As they enter the worst job market in decades, many young would-be lawyers are turning on their alma maters, blaming their quandary on high tuition, lax accreditation standards and misleading job placement figures. Unless students graduate from schools like Harvard or Yale, they “might as well be busing tables,” Bullock said.

  5. grim says:

    Apparently, angry rant blogs are hot in Jersey.

  6. grim says:

    From Crains:

    Upstart roils Stuy Town battle

    If all goes according to plan, next Thursday a new partnership led by hedge fund honcho William Ackman will buy Manhattan’s largest housing complex—the 110-building Stuyvesant Town/ Peter Cooper Village—paying as little as $45 million in a foreclosure auction. Incredible as such a scenario may seem, real estate experts say that it—or something like it—could well come to pass.

    In a surprising development, Mr. Ackman announced last week that his hedge fund, Pershing Square Capital Management, had been tapped by Winthrop Realty Trust, one of Stuy Town’s creditors, to help it take control of the 80-acre complex. Acting in concert, the duo quietly paid $45 million—15 cents on the dollar—to scoop up a $300 million mezzanine loan, a key slice of the complex’s debt that stands between the owner’s equity and the first mortgage.

    Mr. Ackman also scheduled an auction for Aug. 25, when he plans to foreclose on the property and take control of Stuy Town. If he succeeds, he intends to assume the complex’s nearly $4.5 billion in debts and quickly begin a voluntary, noneviction co-op conversion on the rental property to generate cash to pay off its loans.

  7. grim says:

    From Luxist:

    $220 Million London Penthouse Now World’s Most Expensive

    A six-bedroom penthouse at London’s posh One Hyde Park development (above) has just sold for a record-breaking £140 million, or about $220 million, making it the most expensive piece of residential real estate in the world (in terms of current listings and sales). The massive deal eclipses the paltry $150 million asking price for The Manor, Candy Spelling’s monstrous mansion in Holmby Hills, California, previous holder of the World’s Most Expensive title. While the identity of the buyer remains a closely-guarded secret, speculation is centering on oligarchs and oil sheikhs, the London Telegraph reports. The palatial penthouse stretches across two floors and boasts bullet-proof windows, a panic room and stunning views across the Serpentine lake in Hyde Park.

    The new owners will also have access to 24-hour room service from the neighboring Mandarin Oriental hotel, spas, squash courts a private wine-tasting facility and protection from security guards who are former members of the SAS, the UK’s elite special forces unit.

  8. Confused in NJ says:

    Bullet Proof windows is a definate plus.

  9. Nomad says:

    So if a home is in foreclosure and there is a second lein (mtg) on it – the primary mtg itself is typically non- recourse (correct?) and is the second mtg typically a recourse loan how does the mess get unwound?

    Can the primary mtg holder be willing to take a haircut and get rid of the home but be held up by the secondary mtg holder trying to liquidate the homeonwers other assets (car etc) to recoup what they are owed? Also, if the secondary mtg holder does make the homeowner liquidate other assets, does the primary mtg holder get first crack at the $$.

    In the above situation, is the delay the back & fourth that takes place between the primary and secondary mtg holders?

  10. yo'me says:

    From what I gather from what I read here,2nd mortgages are always recourse and this can withhold a short sale and can garnished future income.With homes being underwater,there was an article posted a few weeks ago about 2nd mortgages being able to be converted to non-secured loans in a bankruptcy.Doom have mention about Refinancing a home makes the home a recourse automatically.The guru’s can enlighten us more.

  11. yo'me says:

    When will this 5% of Americans that have benefitted from the good times open their wallet?

  12. grim says:

    So if a home is in foreclosure and there is a second lein (mtg) on it – the primary mtg itself is typically non- recourse (correct?) and is the second mtg typically a recourse loan how does the mess get unwound?

    Purchase money mortgages are typically non-recourse. If that initial purchase mortgage mortgage was refinanced, it will typically flip to recourse. HEL, HELOC are typically always recourse, but this isn’t a rule. You can have multiple lien situations where both are recourse.

    Junior lien holders are in first loss position. In foreclosure they’ll all lose if the market value is below the outstanding mortgage amount of the primary. They are the mezzanine tranches of this CDO.

    How to unravel? Some deals offer some cash to the juniors, (legally or otherwise).

    Some juniors realize they have little chance of recovery in foreclosure or otherwise, and deficiency is a costly process when the borrower has few assets, so they go away (but many still retain their right to recourse).

    Can the primary mtg holder be willing to take a haircut and get rid of the home but be held up by the secondary mtg holder trying to liquidate the homeonwers other assets (car etc) to recoup what they are owed? Also, if the secondary mtg holder does make the homeowner liquidate other assets, does the primary mtg holder get first crack at the $$.

    Can the juniors hold up a deal? Absolutely, this is very frequently the case with multiple lien short sales. But held up forcing a owner to liquidate assets? I’ve never heard or seen of this actually happening in residential. Maybe if a junior is a commercial/business loan or a judgment or something of the sort (As in post #1 above). This isn’t at all frequent.

    In the above situation, is the delay the back & fourth that takes place between the primary and secondary mtg holders?

    In my experience, each additional lien holder adds some multiple of complexity to the deal. A two lien deal is more than 2x the time and complication of a single.

    That said, I’m working on a 3 lien deal right now.

  13. grim says:

    Worth noting that short sales or deed in lieu done through HAFA (the government program) require the outstanding liens to release owners from deficiency liabilities.

  14. grim says:

    Investors (as well as resident attorneys and quants) who may have missed out on the opportunities afforded by the first NJVF, or those who didn’t miss out, but are interested in new opportunities, are invited to discuss ideas in this space.

    Move over Eisman (or hire me).

  15. Final Doom says:

    grim (5)-

    TPTB better hope it stops at rants.

    Me? I got an itchy trigger finger.

  16. Final Doom says:

    nomad/you (9, 10)-

    You guys are mostly right. In reality, about all a second lienholder can do is refuse to step aside and allow a first to foreclose (this happened a fair amount at the beginning of this housing collapse). Legally and practically, there are now incentives for seconds to yield to firsts and allow foreclosures to move along.

    Seconds are typically recourse, but they often negotiate away their right to collect deficiencies in the process. Even when they retain the right, they rarely exercise it, as the borrowers usually come out of foreclosure in pretty bad shape. Hard to get money out of people who don’t have any and who can exercise the BK option if collection attempts get too aggressive. More commonly, lenders sell the deficient notes at discount to bill collectors.

    So far, I have never seen a lender attempt to obtain or enforce a deficiency judgment in NJ. I also have yet to know of a bill collector trying to obtain payment on a discounted deficient note.

  17. soak the rich says:

    The problem with law school is that, for many if not most, it is based on the dream of getting into big law and making the standard 140k with 50k signing bonus. Unfortunately, >90% of grads do not make it to the biglaw.
    The rest compete for 50-60k jobs. There are practically no jobs in ~90-100k category.
    Corporate law depts do not hire law grads.

  18. Final Doom says:

    grim (14)-

    I know of three potential deals in my area that could actually be negotiated in a way that makes sense (and offers a decent potential profit) for an investor.

  19. Final Doom says:

    I will also hire anyone just out of law school (or any recently-unemployed lawyer) for the purpose of doing short sales. The money is decent, it’s not rocket science, you work your own hours and you get to fcuk banks.

  20. Outofstater says:

    Hey, looky what socialism provides across the pond! Kinda brings a whole new meaning to “bread and circuses.”

  21. Final Doom says:

    After I posted #16, I went over to Mish. What a coincidence!

    “Utah Loan Servicing is a debt collector that buys home equity loans from lenders. Clark Terry, the chief executive, says he does not pay more than $500 for a loan, regardless of how big it is.”

  22. Final Doom says:

    stater (20)-

    You have to love a country that recognizes the untapped potential of sex workers and monetizes their unique skills.

  23. still_looking says:

    OT All-Hype,

    Happy Birthday little brother!


  24. still_looking says:

    Doom, 22

    Coming (no pun intended) to a large city near you… Just think of all the folks in Newark, Paterson, Camden (voters) could be employed if sex is now considered a constitutional right.

    More stimulus! (pun intended…) money to spend.

    Joe sixpack taxpayer would now be paying for every disabled person to have sex.


  25. soak the rich says:

    I can picture the meeting where Newark community activists and pols decide which people will be given free s-x vouchers and free v-aqra.

  26. Juice Box says:

    re: Corp law

    We just had an intern leave a week early. I gather to go on vacation and party it up before school starts again. These kids are clueless, there is a huge law bubble with over 1 million lawyers in this country and some want to risk the potential of a bad reference by leaving early and slacking off as well.

  27. Juice Box says:


    GTG with buddies last night, cab driver from PATH said he had not had a fare in 1/2 hour, most people were walking or taking train said it was very slow most of summer.

    Also recession specials found in NYC last night

    1) $10 pitchers of beer
    2) Glenlivet on the rocks $5
    3)flirty girls looking for free drinks from old men FREE

  28. Juice Box says:

    re: Stytown

    I believe many were surprised that Fannie and Freddie stepped in to push the original deal cobbled toghether by Lehman and Wachovia when no regular CMBS investors wanted to touch it. They hold approx 1/2 of the senior debt around 1.5 billion. Calpers and Calsters and other state run pension funds hold another billion.

    Anyone care to guess how much of a hair cut for taxpayers on this one.

    Property was sold for 5.4 Billion and may now only be worth 1.5 Billion.

    Gonna be a looong walk home.

  29. still_looking says:

    I’m off to go study soon so this is your brief public service message.

    (I’m not endorsing any ophthalmologists)

    Get an eye exam. For real. At least one ophthalmologist or optometrist exam every two years. They don’t just check your eyes. Your eyes may reveal other potentially dangerous diseases from the rest of your body.

    Folks with no other symptoms of diabetes, high blood pressure, elevated cholesterol, stroke, thyroid problems and some of the rare, freaky diseases as well may start by having changes in their vision and eye exam.

    This is a link to an astonishing wealth of assistance in eye care.

    No excuses. Like my dad always tells me, “You only got one set of eyes…take care of them.”

    For the home DIY-er, sports enthusiasts and daredevils…. please, use eye protection. Eye patches are not sex.y and popping out your prosthetic eye at dinner and dropping it into your date’s drink is a guaranteed date-ender.


  30. Final Doom says:

    sl (24)-

    We already do. Take a look at how many municipal unions have Vi@gra on their pharma programs.

    “Joe sixpack taxpayer would now be paying for every disabled person to have sex.”

  31. grim says:

    One of my parents tenants was a nurse during Ww2. I swear she could diagnose you by looking at your eyes and tongue.

  32. House Whine says:

    29- Further to what you posted re eye exams- Please do not swim in any body of water, even a backyard pool, wearing your contact lenses. If you have to wear your CL’s at least wear goggles over them. Do you really want to risk getting an acanthamoeaba (a parasite) in your eye? It’s not only extremely painful, but potentially blinding as well. This is especially true if you tend to overuse your CL’s wearing time, which many young people do. One of the diseases that can be detected is MS- looking at the condition of your optic nerve.

  33. Final Doom says:

    I wish eye parasites on Frank.

  34. Confused in NJ says:

    I worked with a girl from Morristown, who went blind on her honeymoon swimming in the Bahama,s from a parasite in the water. With treatment, got her sight back six months later.

  35. Final Doom says:


    I think I hit a nerve at Baristanet. They don’t care to discuss your town’s dire financial straits, so they started calling me stupid and anti-Semitic.

    You really have to get out of there.

  36. jamil says:

    Sweet justice, some would say.

    “[Illegal immigrant] Man charged in crash that killed nun was getting legal aid from Catholic Charities”
    “Carlos A. Martinelly Montano was being represented in deportation proceedings by Catholic Charities in the Diocese of Arlington when he allegedly struck and killed a Benedictine sister and wounded two other Richmond-based nuns in Prince William County while driving drunk this month.
    Martinelly Montano is facing charges of driving under the influence for the third time in five years, a felony, and involuntary manslaughter. He is being held without bond.”
    “[cbs:] As a result of at least one of these offenses, Montano was turned over to Immigration and Customs Enforcement and was expected to be deported; however, the Department of Homeland Security released Montano in 2008 pending a review of his case.”

  37. dim says:

    Speaking of charities – think a case can be made for considering the portion of one’s taxes going to the bank & homeowner bailouts as charitable contributions? Probably a small percentage overall but still…

  38. Sas3 says:

    Doom, you are anti-everything :)

  39. Outofstater says:

    #38 Nope, he just has a bias against stupid people who make lousy decisions to the detriment of most of us. Can’t say I blame him.

  40. Final Doom says:

    sastry (38)-

    Actually, I’m only anti- things that are stupid and degenerate. It is the fault of this country that it has become full of stupidity and degeneracy.

  41. Final Doom says:

    Sorry if I’ve interrupted anyone’s reading of Maxine Waters’ autobiography.

  42. Final Doom says:

    “America resembles a 40 year old aging baseball icon with two bad knees, a pot belly, receding hairline and delusions that he is still the ball player he was at 24. He doesn’t realize that his skills are shot, as he flails at curveballs in the dirt thrown by 21 year old kids. The rest of the league knows he is washed up, but he refuses to accept reality. America isn’t even running on fumes at this point. It is running on delusions. Politicians think they have saved the country from a Depression by adding $3 trillion to the National Debt and allowing Wall Street banks to pretend they are solvent. Americans have been deluded by the ruling oligarchs that a $700 billion bank bailout, an $800 billion pork filled stimulus plan, the Federal Reserve buying $1.2 trillion of toxic mortgages, and the Treasury forcing taxpayers to pick up a $400 billion tab for Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac’s bad loans has actually solved a problem created by too much debt.

    The American herd has gone mad. A few people have regained their senses, but the vast majority still exhibits the behavior of sheep being led to slaughter. The ruling oligarchs have utter contempt for the average American, but they fear the masses. In order to retain their power and wealth, they gladly hand out two years of unemployment payments, food stamps, and welfare payments to keep the masses sedated. The working middle class foots the bill. Corruption abounds and is sustained by the passage of more laws and regulations. The sociopathic powers that control the levers of power in this country need to be brought to justice if this country has any chance at survival. The den of vipers and thieves have trampled on the Constitution, speculated with the country’s funds, risked blowing up the financial system, committed fraud on a massive scale, and continue to rape and pillage the American citizens. Vincible ignorance by the American people is no longer a legitimate excuse. The criminals on Wall Street and Washington DC must be routed out and Americans must awaken from their delusional state before it is too late. I weep for the liberty of my country.”

  43. Simply Ravishing HEHEHE says:

    Afghanistan Says Finds 1.8 Billion Barrel Oilfield

    Afghanistan said on Sunday it had discovered an oilfield with an estimated 1.8 billion barrels in the north of the war-ravaged country, where U.S. and other foreign forces are trying to tame a Taliban-led insurgency.

    The discovery of the basin between northern Balkh and Shiberghan provinces was made after a survey conducted by Afghan and international geologists, said Jawad Omar, a spokesman for the ministry of mines.

    I guess we won’t be leaving there any time soon.

  44. Yikes says:

    Juice Box says:
    August 15, 2010 at 8:13 pm

    Beantown beat down

    1) Why would you get out of the car?
    2) The guy did some damage with the bat, that’s for sure.
    3) He’s lucky he got out of there, otherwise, he’s a dead man, for sure.

    There is nothing I like about that filthy city of Boston.

  45. Juice Box says:

    Yikes warm weather brings out the crazies. Just last night there were a few punks following people around my neighborhood looking for trouble. I will be glad when winter comes as the dregs retreat back under their rocks.

  46. still_looking says:

    Doom, 41

    Amen brother!


  47. SG says:

    Your House Might Be Underwater for Years: Commentary by Michael Carliner

    Now we’re seeing the opposite mindset. If a potential buyer believes that housing prices may fall more, then mortgage rates of 4.5 percent won’t attract home buyers. Rates could even drop to zero and it might not outweigh consumers’ negative perceptions.

    Household expectations of future U.S. home price appreciation aren’t directly measured, and are probably based on recent experience.

    If expectations reflect changes in home prices over the last three years, for example, consumers seem to anticipate annual house price declines of 3.7 percent to 10.4 percent, depending on which of the various house price indexes is used.

    This pessimism is heightened by increased uncertainty, because home ownership typically ties up a high portion of an individual’s assets. Diversification isn’t likely to offset the risk associated with home ownership.

    The reality is that the real estate market won’t fully recover until builders and consumers start believing once again that housing is a relatively safe investment with reasonable returns, and that will take some time.

  48. SG says:

    Sam Zell Seeks Bigger Slice of Manhattan

    The company, whose chairman is veteran real-estate mogul Sam Zell, is one of a number of investors that is planning to bid on a development site at 133-135 Greenwich St. during a bankruptcy auction scheduled for Wednesday, people familiar with the matter said. The minimum bid starts at $14.5 million.

    A spokesman for Chicago-based Equity Residential declined comment.

    The site was purchased in 2007 for $45 million by a subsidiary of Ofek International Real Estate, an Israeli company that was forced to seek bankruptcy protection in the wake of the real-estate downturn and the death of its chief executive and chairman, Elie Berdugo.

    The auction will provide some insight into how far values have declined for Manhattan development sites. Ofek paid about $288 per developable square foot for the site, which currently could support a 156,000-square-foot mixed-use building. If the site goes for the minimum bid, the buyer would be paying about $92 per square foot. But investors could bid more at the auction or Minneapolis-based U.S. Bancorp, which holds a $39 million mortgage on the site, could decide to reject the bids and hold on to the property.

  49. SG says:

    China Passes Japan as Second-Largest Economy

    The recognition came early Monday, when Tokyo said that Japan’s economy was valued at about $1.28 trillion in the second quarter, slightly below China’s $1.33 trillion. Japan’s economy grew 0.4 percent in the quarter, Tokyo said, substantially less than forecast. That weakness suggests that China’s economy will race past Japan’s for the full year.

    Experts say unseating Japan — and in recent years passing Germany, France and Great Britain — underscores China’s growing clout and bolsters forecasts that China will pass the United States as the world’s biggest economy as early as 2030. America’s gross domestic product was about $14 trillion in 2009

  50. still_looking says:

    Barbara, 50


    Thanks! I needed that…. My dad built a dog house for our mutt that was bigger and better appointed than that shack.


  51. New in NJ says:

    SL –
    Yeah, but did it sit on a palatial 0.22 acres? ;-)

  52. Pat says:

    That was so crappy looking.

    That is all I have to say.

    I am now going to make a cake that looks like that house.

  53. Libtard says:

    Nice find Barb

  54. a mad as hell reinvestor101 says:

    >> Barbara says:
    August 15, 2010 at 9:59 pm


    That is a damn nice house and has a damn good price on it. Hell that price leaves enough damn room to flip and make some damn money.

    The only problem is that the stinking bank has reduced by damn line because of all the damn slackers who can't keep a damn job and don't want to pay their damn mortgages. I lay all of this crap at the feet of the filthy real estate terrorists and radicals who began undermining the damn real estate market in 2005.

  55. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Nice for 300 maybe. I’ll get you a 2 ac with 3600 sq ft & you can sleep with the windows open w/ lower taxes. One catch it is in Vernon.

  56. Barbara says:


    I wouldn’t pay 150k for that, unless I could turn it around for 300k ;P

  57. Mikeinwaiting says:

    By the way can wait no longer buddy wants to try & sell this place . Do not want to move & rent again. Have time but want to be out before winter Anyone want a nice LARGE home, to rich for my blood but from what some of you folks have been looking at it is a gimme. He will hold the paper, great guy reasonable price for sure.
    Barb 58 guess I was being kind, tragic personality flaw. I’m in the hunt at 150 w/ 5k taxes & I may do better. USDA loan no $ down nothing at risk. Taking the gov put.

  58. still_looking says:

    56, Re….

    Aw… honey! You’re home! (smoochy smoochy)


  59. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Now still don’t get him going. This should be fun re you awake?

  60. Barbara says:

    can you live in the Philadelphia, south jersey area? You could do well in Collingswood for that money.

  61. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Barb no, but can do fine up here in Vernon for that. I expect some real bad times in our future here in the good old USA so going as low as I can & still get a decent place. Less is better not more in my mind. It will most likely be the dreaded bi-level but I can live with that. It’s shelter nothing more nothing less that is the paradigm for the wise.

  62. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    “Doom, you are anti-everything :)”

    HMMMN. I think you may be clueless. If you are invested in an asset class that is rising from the bottom left to the upper right, you are not anti. Suggestion, define, what’s anti.

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