In foreclosure? No worries, you’ve got time.

From the Wall Street Journal:

Banks Struggle To Seize Homes

It takes longer to foreclose on homes in New York than any other state—and it’s getting longer every month.

Two years ago, the state began requiring that banks and borrowers attend settlement conferences before a foreclosure takes place.

While the conferences are popular with borrowers and have succeeded in helping some families keep their homes, banks have been reluctant to participate. That, and recent revelations that some lenders have improperly submitted foreclosure documents, has prompted judges to take a harsher stance with lenders.

The foreclosure process typically begins after a borrower misses three consecutive monthly payments and ends once the lender repossesses the home or the borrower brings the loan current. Nationwide, there were 2.1 million mortgages in some stage of foreclosure as of October, according to research firm LPS Applied Analytics.

The average loan in foreclosure had been in default for 492 days as of October, up from 289 days at the end of 2005, according to LPS.

In New York and New Jersey—another state with consumer friendly laws—the waits are longer. The average loan in foreclosure had been in default for 604 days in New York and 544 days in New Jersey as of October.

“We try and help as many people as we can,” says New York Supreme Court Judge Michael Ajello. “We set up a conference and I try and persuade and cajole the banks to reduce the payments,” he says. But the banks, he adds, “are not very cooperative.”

This entry was posted in Foreclosures, Housing Bubble. Bookmark the permalink.

149 Responses to In foreclosure? No worries, you’ve got time.

  1. grim says:

    From the Star Ledger:

    N.J. grocer A&P files for bankruptcy

    The Great Atlantic & Pacific Tea Co., the centuries-old grocery store chain that operates 129 A&P, Pathmark, SuperFresh and Food Basics stores in New Jersey, filed for Chapter 11 bankruptcy protection today, succumbing to tough competition and a weak economy.

    The Montvale-based company said its stores will remain fully stocked and open with no interruption of business.

    Sam Martin, the company’s chief executive officer, said the filing was “difficult but necessary.”

    “(We) concluded that we could not complete our turnaround without availing ourselves of Chapter 11,” Martin said in a statement. “It will allow us to restructure our debt, reduce our structural costs and address our legacy issues.”

  2. Nomad says:

    1st? Good Morning

  3. grim says:

    From the Daily Journal:

    New era in fighting property tax hikes?

    The property tax revolt that ousted Gov. Jon S. Corzine last year took a revolutionary turn last week.

    The men left standing — Gov. Chris Christie, who last year defeated Corzine, and state Senate President Stephen M. Sweeney, who saw no support four years ago from Corzine when he called for cuts to public workers’ benefits — reached a deal on a key element of controlling local spending and property taxes.

    The agreement announced Thursday, which would control arbitrator awards for public employees, capped 10 months of accords. During that time, Christie and Sweeney put into place measures they expect will change patterns of public spending and public workers’ compensation.

    In the immediate future, however, property taxes still are likely to keep rising.
    Even with spending cuts and layoffs throughout the state’s municipalities and school districts, New Jersey’s highest-in-the-nation property tax average of $7,544 rose at the same rate this year as it did in 2009, the year before Christie took office.

    If a new tax cap of 2 percent increases is met in 2011 and in the coming years, the average property tax bill will hit $8,300 in 2015.

  4. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Forget the stock market watch treasuries. What’s a Fed Chairmen to do.
    “The only justifiable claim for a “recovery” in the US comes from stock prices being higher (thereby increasing household net worth). However, if he continues to engage in QE to do this he runs the risk of kicking off a bear market in bonds, which in turn would DESTROY the US economy AND bankrupt the country.”

  5. grim says:

    From the Press of Atlantic City:

    Shore Memorial Hospital lays off 31 nonunion workers, with 32 nurses getting layoff notices soon

    Shore Memorial Hospital officials said Friday that 43 nonunion employees had accepted buyouts but that 31 nonunion workers were laid off and 32 union nurses will receive layoff notices in the coming days.

    The reductions come after the hospital offered severance packages to 368 nonunion employees Dec. 1 in an attempt to eliminate about 90 positions. The hospital is reducing staff as a way to deal with declining admissions and Medicare payments, officials say.

    Of the 43 workers who accepted buyouts, 12 received early retirement packages. The laid-off workers were among those offered buyouts but who declined to accept.

    “The steps we are taking today, while painful, are necessary,” said Ron Johnson, Shore Memorial president and chief executive officer.

  6. grim says:

    From MarketWatch:

    More foreclosures, home-price drops on tap in 2011

    Brace yourself for another rough year in housing. The number of foreclosures is expected by many to increase in 2011 as more troubled mortgages work their way through the pipeline.

    Foreclosures may well peak next year, said Rick Sharga, a senior vice president for RealtyTrac, an online marketplace for foreclosure properties. The market is expected to tally about 1.2 million bank repossessions in 2010, up from 900,000 in 2009, he said. Read more about foreclosure filings in 2010’s third quarter.

    “We expect we will top both of those numbers in 2011,” he said.

    So what does all this mean for housing prices?

    A large number of houses on the market, along with high unemployment, will likely add up to continued depressed home prices in the year ahead in many markets, said Nichole Jordan, banking and securities industry practice leader for Grant Thornton, an accounting and business advisory firm.

    “It’s going to take several years to work through the excess inventory,” she said.

    Jordan and others are looking to 2012 for anything resembling a recovery in housing. Even then, it’s going to be a long journey to stabilization; it historically takes five to seven years for prices to stabilize after a deep correction, Jordan said.

    “Realistically, you’re not going to see home prices appreciate next year,” said Jason Kopcak, head of whole loans at financial-services firm Cantor Fitzgerald. In fact, many in the industry are expecting prices to fall another 10% next year on a national basis, he said. Sharga said the national decline could be around 5%. Some economists expect prices to remain flat.

    Next year “is going to be a wash, in terms of any meaningful recovery, and we’re looking toward 2012,” said Guy Cecala, publisher of Inside Mortgage Finance, during a conference call with reporters. And that’s assuming there are no other major problems or delays to contend with, he said.

  7. Just another day in oblivion.

    Stop fighting it. You know you love it.

  8. House Whine says:

    6- This I don’t understand. Why are there declining admissions in a hospital? Doesn’t the aging population need medical care as it ages? How lean can a hospital go? This worries me.

  9. #9 – Why are there declining admissions in a hospital?

    Laid off and COBRA won’t cover what they need?

  10. Mike says:

    Number 9 Outsourced employees don’t get health care benefits

  11. #11 – good point, neither do (most) temps.

  12. Neanderthal Economist says:

    Shipped those hospital jobs to india

  13. Shore Guy says:

    The other day, talk turned to phones. I recently switched to am Android phone and, whilst it is taking some getting used to, I like it very much.

  14. Health insurance is for the rich. Everybody else can pound salt…then die.

  15. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [6] grim

    Meanwhile, Shore Memorial Hosp. picked up a boatload of tax-free bond financing to build a new surgical pavilion in order to convince people that their docs know what they are doing.

  16. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    OT Alert: U-G-L-Y, Jets, Jets, Jets.

    Man, that was one UGLY game to watch. Never saw a more pathetic offensive display by two teams at once. Seemed like neither side wanted to win. Cannot believe Santonio dropped that ball in the end zone. I saw that and was, like, “WHAT???”

    As I watched this Sanchez-led plane crash (only game on, and yes, pun intended), I actually started to feel a bit sorry for the Jets.

    Until this . . .

    Supposedly, there was a good game on TV in Chicago. Wish I coulda watched that instead. Now I have to bleach my eyes after watching that stinker.

  17. I’ve made the acquaintance of more than a few of these Masters of the Universe types since I’ve lived here (Ivy league, wealthy going in, even wealthier after years on WS). Appallingly, they don’t even realize they designed and built the doomsday machine that killed the economy. What really irks is that dropping $200 pp to eat in the bar at the Plucky or Natirar is chump change to them…and sending their 2-3 snot-nosed kids to Pingry or GSB at 30K a pop is virtually treated as a birthright. All these people should be put against a wall and shot for what they’ve done, yet the bank robbery continues, and more and more wealth and power concentrates in the hands of these retard barons.

    I nearly went ballistic this weekend when one of these guys suggested to me that I was shortchanging my kids by not sending them to private school. I asked him if he could kite me an interest-free loan of 160K or so (which could get my son through five years at Pingry). He looked at me like I had four heads, so I told him I was good for the money, provided I don’t have to start paying it back until the year after my son graduates college.

    That effectively ended the conversation.

  18. JJ says:

    Even if Holmes caught that TD pass that hit him in the chest, Jets did not deserve to win. Kailin Brunel, the back-up QBs daughter could have done a better job than Mark, His fumbles and moles on his face are both starting to wear me down.

    On a bright note couple of really hot JP Morgan traders were sitting next to me. Good to see to make it on wall street you need to be extremely bright or a 5:ft nine inch hot blonde with long hair who likes football.

  19. Same old Jets. Build you up, just to break your heart in the end.

    Watched my Magpies thrash Liverpool on the TIVO instead of witnessing the Jet debacle. They actually have so much talent, even Ashley can’t screw them up.

  20. Mike says:

    I rather go to a hospice house where you get the best one on one care, and than go to die at a hospital where you get completely ignored and there’s one nurse per floor while the aides let you lay in your urine for hours.

  21. I’d rather somebody just pump a .38 slug into the back of my head.

  22. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [17] redux

    Actually, I started to feel a bit sorry for Jets fans, and even then, only a few of them that I know and like. The rest can kiss where Rex Ryan wouldn’t.

  23. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [22] lamar,

    I would not be surprised if there were already some volunteers lined up. :-)

  24. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [20] lamar

    Started to watch what turned into a beatdown of West Ham by Man City, but since it was UK soccer, I got bored and changed the channel.

  25. Shore Guy says:

    The NN Times has an article about lending to those with poor credit. When I figure out how to cut and paste with this thing, I. Will post the URL.

  26. Shore Guy says:

    NY times

  27. Mike says:

    Lamar Number 22 They shoot horses don’t they?

  28. Shore Guy says:

    Actually, it is about credit in a broader sense:

    And I can’t copy the blasted URL.

  29. Shore Guy says:

    Old dogs and new tricks.

  30. Shore Guy says:

    Hey BC,

    The next time you see Bruce at a BC event, please ask him to stick a Christmas concert into my stocking.

  31. chicagofinance says:

    The end is nigh…..vive le France…
    French Police Hold Teenager, Hostages Are Free, Ministry Says
    Share Business ExchangeTwitterFacebook| Email | Print | A A A
    By Vidya Root

    Dec. 13 (Bloomberg) — A French teenager who held 20 nursery school children and their teacher hostage in Besancon, eastern France, for more than four hours today is now in police custody, the interior ministry said.

    Local police SWAT teams “succeeded in bringing to a close, very quickly and without casualties, the detention of 20 children, their teacher and a teacher’s aide,” the ministry said in an e-mailed statement.

    The 17-year-old-boy, who was “depressed and suicidal,” according to BFM TV, walked into the Charles-Fourier nursery school at 8:30 a.m. local time, armed with two 30 centimeter- long swords.

    He released eight of the children, aged between four and six years old, at about 9:45 a.m. and others during the morning. He also asked police for a “weapon to commit suicide,” according to national radio station France Info.

    After negotiations with police officers, the last five children and their teacher were released shortly before 1:00 p.m. and are now receiving counseling and psychiatric evaluation, BFM TV reported.

  32. JJ says:

    Speaking of Bruce, I used to be a Big Bruce Fan, well in High School in College anyhow. Well yesterday at Jets game I was suprised when Clarence Clemmons did the national anthem, the big man himself, think he also had the E Street Piano player with him He did a pretty good job on his sax.

    Shore Guy says:
    December 13, 2010 at 8:57 am

    Hey BC,

    The next time you see Bruce at a BC event, please ask him to stick a Christmas concert into my stocking.

  33. JJ says:

    Mark Sanchez had a pre-recorded Christmas greeting massage play at end of half time on big screens. Fans were so mad they boo’d Mark saying Merry Christmas.

  34. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [35] JJ

    Booing Sanchez, booing Santa Claus. Must be something about green that turns football fans into boobirds.

  35. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    Wife is home for the morning to watch the munchkin so I can get some work done. She has Burl Ives on in the background, playing “Silver and Gold.”

    Seems to me that old Burl’s definition of “worth” in the song has become trite and dated.

  36. J. says:

    It looked to me like Sanchise was throwing the ball OK, but it was Butterfinger Promotion day at the Stadium.

  37. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    SL [prior thread]

    I suggested a restraining order; when she violates it, you have the satisfaction of having her hauled before a judge. Seems that would make a far more effective wake-up call than interventions.

    My $0.02. Now back to work. As Jerry Jones’ tax guy said to us, Peace out, y’all.

  38. safe as houses says:

    I fell asleep watching the Jets game.

  39. JJ says:

    Sanchize was throwing ball well to the Dolphins. THANK GOD I sold my my Bills tickets the week Before they lost to Pats.

    Jets were playing there would be home play-off games to be able to sell remaining PSLs. Not a bad hook, buy PSL pay no season tickets in 2010 and get Play-off tickets you can scalp for way more than your PSL payment.

    Now it is buy crappy PSL seats, get no games in 2010, no play-offs and have tickets to an 2011 team with a shaky quarterback and people like Homes and Edwards unsigned and a strike looming. Good Luck with that Jets. PSLs are like Stubhub tickets, either buy way ahead of time or buy last minute.

    Even crazier Giants invited me to a Focus Group by a marketing firm to learn why so many waitlist members like myself did not buy a PSL, I told them you charge a lot more than Jets and you provided no fianancing, they told me no it can’t be that we are the Giants so we can charge more, most be another reason.

  40. Schrodinger's Cat says:


    30 centimeter- long swords

    That is an oxymoron if i have ever heard of one. Hell most short swords are longer then that. Short swords averaged about 24 inches or so and long swords averaged 36 – 40 inches (blade length). 30 centimeters is about 12 inches. That is a dagger at best and a common length for a bowie knife. Given the french history tou would think they would know a bit more about more about swords.

    He released eight of the children, aged between four and six years old, at about 9:45 a.m. and others during the morning. He also asked police for a “weapon to commit suicide,” according to national radio station France Info.

    If the kid didnt have cojones to try a little suppuku, they should have had a police sniper handy to help the poor kid out.

  41. When the Giants provide financing for PSLs, it will be another sign of the apocalypse.

    I genuinely, truly hope the NFL goes on strike. Forever.

  42. cat (42)-

    The concept of suicide by cop hasn’t reached France yet.

  43. Schrodinger's Cat says:

    33 chifi,

    Someone should show this to the french

  44. grim says:

    6 month high on the 10y yield this morning

  45. grim says:


    30 centimeter long (pause) swords


    30 centimeter (pause) long swords

    Also, it’s likely that the word “sword” was probably just a mistranslation or choppy engrish.

  46. Schrodinger's Cat says:
  47. Schrodinger's Cat says:

    30 centimeter bowie

    …Not a longsword!

  48. Schrodinger's Cat says:


    30 centimeter doesn’t qualify as a sword. historically short swords were 20+ inches.

    You are correct my reading comprehension was off, but calling a 30 cm blade a sword is sensationalism and inaccurate.

  49. JJ says:

    I thought it was when Giants blew through a 100K waiting list to sell season tickets and still had thousands to sell was already a sign of the apocalypse.

    March 2011 when Giants fan can finally sell PSLs will 10,000 UD EZ PSL seats all hit the market at once? You can’t see a damm thing up there, Giants were smart to sell them before stadium was built when the “it can’t be too high crowd” did not get to see them as Jets could not even get people to take them with no PSL.

    The Giants are SOBs, they offered me a few weeks ago a pair in Mezz A one seat from Club Seats, decent seats, I went did you offer them up to the people stuck in row 20 UD EZ so they could switch to better, seats, guy went nope the Giant fans who bought them own them no trading up. Bottom Line I don’t buy from a guy who told me I screwed my other customers but I won’t screw you. Giants are a better team on the field and have good fans, but they treat there fans like crap.

    Lamar Asperger says:
    December 13, 2010 at 9:47 am

    When the Giants provide financing for PSLs, it will be another sign of the apocalypse.

    I genuinely, truly hope the NFL goes on strike. Forever.

  50. Schrodinger's Cat says:

    he should have gone in with this:

  51. Anon E. Moose says:

    “We try and help as many people as we can,” says New York Supreme Court Judge Michael Ajello. “We set up a conference and I try and persuade and cajole the banks to reduce the payments,” he says. But the banks, he adds, “are not very cooperative.”

    So the Judge ‘cajoles’ the bank to lower the payment to something below what a fully-amortizing payment might have been priced 1995, 10 years before the deadbeat and their Neg-Am ARM moved in with nothing down. The bank’s alternative is a two-year wait to get the property. No wonder the deadbeats have no interest in selling at market price. The sooner the house sells, the worse off they are. I need to go throw up my breakfast.

  52. Anon E. Moose says:

    Shore [26];

    One is “strategic defaulters,” whose credit scores were damaged because they walked away from a home when its value dropped below what was owed on the mortgage. These borrowers made a bad bet on real estate but may otherwise be prudent risks because they make a good living.

    That’s the LAST person I want to lend to. A strategic defaulter is someone smart enough to walk away from a hopeless situation. As compared to a sheep that hangs on with their last breath, and hocks Granny’s coin collection to make a $50 payment towards their $5,000 mortgage. The latter is a person you can make some money off of. The former is great, until he isn’t*.

    * See, Clot.

  53. moose (54)-

    All this was created by banks, Clowngress, the courts, a bunch of Ivy League morons who thought that lending to deadbeats was a great idea and the Community Redevelopment Act. All of you get what you deserve now.

    Screw you all.

  54. Yeah, it’s all the deadbeat borrowers’ faults. Punish the people who act in a predictable fashion when you hand them a bomb and a lighter. That will fix the problem.

  55. zieba says:


    The boss complemented the Cakebread Cellars bottle. Thanks!

  56. dan says:


    I went at Stubhub at 1pm yesterday and saw a lot of tickets for 20 to 25 dollars for the lower goal line sections. I dont know who the Jets gave the tickets away to but when you see a block of 14 tickets in a lower goal line section for $25, you know that some charity guy or military guy was looking to make a quick buck.

  57. Anon E. Moose says:

    Lamar [56];

    No, it’s both their faults. That’s why the best case scenario for the banks is getting back a property worth tens if not hundreds of thousands less than they loaned on it. Even that consolation prize is too much for you and the deadbeats to accept, isn’t it?

    Just keeps hanging everything you don’t like around my neck, no matter how illegitimate it is or tin-foil hat it sounds. Do you really think a corporate lackey of the banks like you a$$ume I am would be a cheerleader for the CRA?

  58. JJ says:

    Actually, one would think so, but there are a few people sitting near me who always sell their tickets who overpriced the Miami game going into the Pats game, then a huge blow-out Pats game combined with a nasty weather forecast that got worse after Jets shut down ability to donate tickets to charity feature on their website left people scrambling to dump tickets. The four seats to right of me sold for $395 each on Stubhub last month, the dope with the other four tickets was asking $695 each up to Pats blow out and saw a mad rapid decline in those seats hours before game, Saw four guys show up ten minutes late holding ticket fast downloads laughing how they got row one at game time for a song. There are lots and lots of scalpers, company seats and fairweather Jet fans that dump tickets at first sprinkle in forecast.

    Additionally, Jets sold blocks of UD seats to “ticket resellers” right before start of season. If you buy 100 or more seats in UD Jets lets you buy them with no pre-season and below face. Lots of those blocks in UD being dumped who knows how little those seats cost. Maybe he paid $40 bucks a ticket. Also Charities are allowed to re-sell tickets. Islanders for instance sells tickets directly to charity, (not a donation), they can dump seats to charities for 30-50 cents on the dollar and let charity re-sell for 60-90 cents on a dollar to make money. Very dirty business of unloading extra seats below face in a manner so season ticketholders don’t get mad.

    dan says:
    December 13, 2010 at 10:45 am


    I went at Stubhub at 1pm yesterday and saw a lot of tickets for 20 to 25 dollars for the lower goal line sections. I dont know who the Jets gave the tickets away to but when you see a block of 14 tickets in a lower goal line section for $25, you know that some charity guy or military guy was looking to make a quick buck.

  59. chicagofinance says:

    Perfect lead-in to this……anyone interested please contact me….

    55.Lamar Asperger says:
    December 13, 2010 at 10:26 am
    moose (54)- All this was created by banks, Clowngress, the courts, a bunch of Ivy League morons who thought that lending to deadbeats was a great idea and the Community Redevelopment Act. All of you get what you deserve now.
    Screw you all.

  60. chicagofinance says:

    It says $249, but I can secure for $89….

  61. JJ says:

    $89 bucks when all you need to know is buy low sell high

  62. SG says:

    Battle Forming Over Mortgage Availability

    A behind-the-scenes battle is forming over a provision to the sweeping bank-overhaul law that will affect mortgage availability.

    At issue is a provision in the sweeping Dodd-Frank Act that requires banks to have “skin in the game” by retaining some of the risk of loans they package and sell.

    The goal of the measure is to eliminate a problem leading to the financial crisis where lenders packaged and sold subprime mortgages they knew would fail. Lawmakers drafting the legislation also included a measure that would exempt certain mortgages from the risk retention rule if their loans met certain high underwriting standards.

    However, reaching an agreement on what the criteria will be for these high-standard loans dubbed “Qualified Residential Mortgages” is expected to be difficult and, depending on how regulators rule, a huge slice of the mortgage market could be exempted from risk retention–or only a small piece of the market.

    That could have a major impact on what kinds mortgages are available, and for what price. Mortgage rates are currently near historic lows but mortgage activity is near decade depths.

    Ernest Patrikis, a partner at White & Case LLP in New York, said regulators must balance how conservative they want underwriting standards to be against how much lending they want to see. What they decide will have a major impact on the kinds of interest rates borrowers with different capabilities will receive.

    Big banks are seeking some sort of significant down payment, perhaps as much as a 30% stake by borrowers, arguing that it means homeowners have some skin in the game and would be less likely to abandon the mortgage.

    Kathleen Day, spokeswoman at the Center for Responsible Lending in Washington, said having a high down-payment requirement for the QRM, in the realm of 30% money down, would limit a lot of responsible lending.

  63. NJGator says:

    Is this 5? 6? I’ve lost count? But so glad that I stuck with crack in the Bullock drug pool. I’m thinking we get lucky 7 before year end!

    MPD Arrest Mission Street Crack Dealer
    This just in from the Montclair Police’s Deputy Chief Todd Conforti:

    As a result of an ongoing narcotics investigation, warrants were issued against Brandon Brown for the distribution of crack on Mission Street and the surrounding area. On 12/11/10, Brown was observed retrieving items from the siding of a house on Mission Street. He was then seen turning over small items in exchange for money to individuals who would walk up to him. As police arrived to conduct a closer look, Brown had left the area. During the course of the investigation, 40 small bags of crack, with an estimated street value of $400, were seized from under the siding of the house where Brown was seen retrieving items.

    On 12/12/10 at approximately 3:55 pm, Brown was arrested after being observed on Mission Street. Brown, 23, of Montclair, was charged with possession and distribution of a controlled dangerous substance, distribution of a controlled dangerous substance within 1000’ of Charles H. Bullock School and distribution of a controlled dangerous substance within 500’ of public housing (10 Pine Street). Brown was released on a $5,000 bail.

  64. ny-to-pa says:

    jersey cops enjoying steroids … NJ taxpayers footing the bill.

    what a joke

  65. Mike says:

    Number 64 and the outcome is less m_rtgages means l_wer h_me prices lets see do I want to buy a vowel or solve the puzzle now.

  66. chicagofinance says:

    65.NJGator says:
    December 13, 2010 at 11:41 am
    Is this 5? 6? I’ve lost count? But so glad that I stuck with crack in the Bullock drug pool. I’m thinking we get lucky 7 before year end!

    MPD Arrest Mission Street Crack Dealer
    This just in from the Montclair Police’s Deputy Chief Todd Conforti:

    SING IT…..

  67. NJGator says:

    Chifi – Do I let crack ride in the pool or should I switch back to heroin? Tough call.

  68. chicagofinance says:

    SING IT for Monklair! It’s for the children….

    Dealers keep dealin’
    Thieves keep thievin’
    Whores keep whorin’
    Junkies keep scorin’
    Trade is on the meat rack
    Strip joints full of hunchbacks
    Bitches keep bitchin’
    Clap keeps itchin’

    Ain’t no use in prayin’
    That’s the way it’s stayin’, baby
    Johnny ain’t so crazy
    He’s always got a line for the ladies

    Get your rocks off
    Get your rocks off, honey
    Shake it now now
    Get’em off downtown
    Get your rocks off
    Get you rocks off, honey
    Shake it now now
    Get’em off downtown

    Creeps keep crawlin’
    Drunks keep fallin’
    Teasers keep teasein’
    Holy joes are preachin’
    Cops keep bustin’
    Hustlers keep hustlin’
    Death keeps knockin’
    Souls are up for auction

  69. Schrodinger's Cat says:

    So we now have mixed rulings on the constitutionality of Obamacare. legal beagles, what are the implications here? Anything interesting or more hurry up and wait for a supreme court ruling? Any guesses as to a potential supreme court ruling given the sitting judges?

    RICHMOND, Va. (AP) — A federal judge in Virginia has declared the Obama administration’s new health care law unconstitutional.

    U.S. District Judge Henry Hudson is the first judge to rule against the law, which has been upheld by two others in Virginia
    and Michigan.

    Virginia Attorney General Ken Cuccinelli’s lawsuit challenged the health care law’s requirement that citizens buy health insurance or pay a penalty starting in 2014. The case challenged the federal government’s constitutional authority to impose the requirement.

    Other lawsuits are pending, including one filed by 20 states in a Florida court. Virginia is not part of that lawsuit.

  70. NJGator says:

    Federal Judge in VA declares Obamacare unconstitutional

    A federal judge in Virginia ruled Monday that the individual mandate contained in the health care law passed by Congress and signed by President Barack Obama this year is unconstitutional.

    Judge Henry E. Hudson found in favor of Virginia Attorney General Ken Cuccinelli, who brought this suit separately from the other state attorney generals suing the federal government over the law.

    Cuccinelli argued that the Affordable Care Act conflicts with the Virginia Health Care Freedom Act, which was passed by the state in anticipation of the passage of the federal law.

    As TPM reported, because Democrats left out a “severability clause” when writing the Affordable Care Act, plaintiffs had requested the entire law be scrapped.

  71. Shore Guy says:

    I doubt SC0TUS will take it until a few circuit courts have,and, likely, not until after there is a conflict between them.

  72. Shore Guy says:

    District ct. Rulings don’t matter to the Sup. Ct.

  73. Schrodinger's Cat says:


    I love the supporting rulings that say it’s constitutional based on the commerce clause! So apparently by breathing i am engaging in interstate commerce?

  74. Schrodinger's Cat says:


    Can Obamacare be enforced while there are conflicting rulings standing?

  75. Shore Guy says:

    Try and be a business and NOT engage in interstate commerce. Who is your ISP? Your bank? Your suppliers or thosewho make what your suppliers sell you? Ship anything out of state?

    Just try NOT engaging in interstate commerce.

  76. Schrodinger's Cat says:

    RE 66

    For members of the Jersey City Police Department alone, Colao wrote 235 growth hormone prescriptions in a 13-month period, according to legal filings related to the brutality suit.
    The public cost of just those prescriptions, based on an average price of $1,100 per month, runs to nearly $260,000.

    …..New Jersey’s residents were billed $300,000 for steroids and growth hormone a group of Trenton police officers bought over the internet from a Florida dentist, state officials confirmed.
    The dentist pleaded guilty to federal drug charges. The officers were investigated but not prosecuted. Three were later promoted…..

    ……Apparently, many of Ramundo’s former colleagues feel the same way. He said law enforcement officers from “all over” Passaic County use steroids and growth hormone, mainly obtained from doctors and wellness clinics

    We allow these clowns to run around with guns??? So how about the cops/firefighters be forced to payback the state for those drugs? One can dream cant they?

  77. Shore Guy says:

    Yes, everywhere except the area under jurisdiction of a particular court.

  78. 30 year realtor says:

    #78 – How about we throw the f*cking cops in jail? Why do they get a free pass? I have always felt that cops, judges and prosecutors caught breaking the law should receive double the standard sentence!

  79. Shore Guy says:


    The PRM is at least consistent on its hostility to small businesses.

  80. Schrodinger's Cat says:

    30 yr

    cops, judges and prosecutors caught breaking the law should receive double the standard sentence!

    Not a bad idea. But first lets just try to enforce the existing law. I love how the prosecutor refused to bring charges when if this was you or I we would promptly be in jail.

  81. Schrodinger's Cat says:


    it might be safer for everyone to ban the police from carrying firearms and requiring all adults to own a firearm.

  82. moose (59)-

    Yep. It was a justification for revving up the sausage grinder. It also acted as great cover for the banksters who knowingly created MBS made of pure shit, simply for the purpose of reaping massive bonuses in the short-term.

    Great to have “the law forced us to make these loans” as an excuse when the whole house of cards collapsed.

    But then you knew that, didn’t you, lackey? Or did you miss out on that bonus gravy train, too?

    “Do you really think a corporate lackey of the banks like you a$$ume I am would be a cheerleader for the CRA?”

  83. chi (61)-

    I am also offering the “one day university of Clotpoll”. Admission is you bring all the Knob Creek I need to get hammered off my ass, and I drive you around to look at worthless, foreclosing RE and the food stamp-clipping human detritus that occupies it.

    If you are lucky and catch me in a holiday mood, we can go shoot guns at the end.

  84. 30 year realtor says:

    Cat, ever take steroids? When my sciatica flares up doc puts me on steroids. Start getting a little aggressive after a few doses.

    I wanna know who thought steroids and firearms are a good combination?

  85. NJGator says:

    Clot 85 – How do I register?

  86. Schrodinger's Cat says:


    we test highschool kids for steroids before they are allowed to play sports, but its not a problem for cops? Apparently insurance fraud isnt an issue either.

  87. chicagofinance says:

    Word to the wise……review your 401(k) NOW….not in January….NOTE: not a call to move/remove assets; just recognize that there is more than one way to skin a cat…..

    Bill Gross’ PIMCO Total Return PTTRX, the largest taxable-bond fund in the country with $256 billion in assets, saw redemptions of $1.9 billion in November according to preliminary Morningstar fund flow data. This was the fund’s first month of net outflows in two years.

    PIMCO Total Return wasn’t alone. The Morningstar Intermediate-Term Bond Category, the category with the largest amount of inflows this year with more than $74 billion, had $154 million in outflows in November. Like PIMCO Total Return, this was the category’s first month of net outflows in two years.

    Gross said earlier this year that “bonds have seen their best days,” and investors may be finally taking Gross’ proclamation to heart. The rise in bond yields in recent weeks has led to sharp declines in bond funds. The 10-year Treasury note’s yield increased to 2.81% from 2.63% in November.

    PIMCO Total Return lost 1.5% in November alone, its worst month since September 2008. The Barclays Capital U.S. Aggregate Bond Index declined 0.57% in November.

  88. JJ says:

    BTW when you look at total return fund it will appear to have a much bigger drop in December of share price as it is paying out a distribution year end that does that.

  89. jamil says:

    Re ObamaCare unconstitutional

    So now we can start the Impeach Obama bandwagon.

    Of course, Shore Guys of the world do not see anything wrong in raping the Constitution as long as it done by marxist.

    Thank god we don’t have extrajudicial killings of US citizens without a trial, continuing Guantanamo, air raiding civilian villages in Afghanistan and warrantless spying of US citizens. Right Shore?

  90. grim says:

    86 – Corticosteroids are very different from anabolic.

  91. gator (88)-

    Submit your non-refundable deposit of 1/2 gallon of Knob Creek. We’ll get back to you shortly after.

  92. grim (93)-

    Yeah, but a few days on corticosteroids will turn you into one grumpy SOB. I had to take some a few years ago, and whoa!

  93. NJGator says:

    I used to take corticosteriods on a pretty regular basis for asthma flare-ups in college. Nasty stuff. My roommates used to refer to them as the “Supreme B*tch Woman P*lls”.

    Also used to be give hydr*codone on a frequent basis to help me sleep when the coughing got bad from asthmatic bronchitis. Physician at the student health care center one day told me “If you have any friends that are dr*g add*cts, I would appreciate it if you do not let them know that you have such ready access to this stuff.” Apparently m*th add*cts liked to burn it to get high.

  94. Jamil says:

    I taste almonds

  95. NJGator says:

    Send your parents a tech support care package…

  96. safe as houses says:

    #95 Lamar

    “Yeah, but a few days on corticosteroids will turn you into one grumpy SOB. I had to take some a few years ago, and whoa!”

    Did anyone really notice a difference? LOL

  97. Succubus says:

    I think s_l just needs a good night sleep.

  98. JJ says:


    I love that word and what it is named after.

  99. Confused In NJ says:

    Bernanke’s bold QE2 finally explained — with burgers and fries

    By Paul McDonnold Paul Mcdonnold – Mon Dec 13, 11:14 am ET
    Dallas, Texas – I am standing in line at the Burger Barn, wondering what the effect of the Federal Reserve’s plan to pump $600 billion into the US economy will be (an economics education makes one do strange things). The move, dubbed quantitative easing 2, or QE2, aims to spur economic recovery. Can it really do that? What is so special about all those dollars compared to the five I hold in my hand?

    To get an idea, I imagine the future path of the money I am about to hand to the cashier.

    The course of my cashThe first place it goes is into the Barn’s cash register. From there it is counted into a snug zippered pouch and taken to the local branch of the First Huge Bank for deposit into the Barn’s checking account.

    Five Guys Burgers: Are they on your list of Top 5 burgers?

    Here something strange happens. The five-dollar bill that was in my pocket is pigeonholed into a teller drawer. It waits to be handed out to some random customer and taken back into the swirl of physical currency. But as I see it, my five dollars is still in the checking account of the Burger Barn. It has simply lost its physical body, gone virtual. It now exists as pulses across an electronic network, and as an idea. That idea resides not only in Burger Barn’s checking account, but also as an asset in the balance sheet of the First Huge Bank, Inc., where it piles up with other people’s ideas of deposits to form a huge mountain of virtual cash.

    Some of that cash might be from QE2. When the Federal Reserve buys government bonds in a program like QE2, it pays for them with newly created money that goes into the account of the US Treasury. The money is then available to the US government to pay its many expenses, from road construction to Medicare bills to, perhaps, the salary of a Marine private who deposits his paycheck in the First Huge Bank.

    Let’s say First Huge passes mine and the Marine’s QE2 dollars, along with many others, to Mega-Multinational Corporation in the form of a short-term commercial loan.

    My dollars may be destined for ShanghaiAt this point Federal Reserve Chairman Ben Bernanke rubs his hands together expectantly. This is where policy rubber meets the road. The hope is that Mega-Multinational will build new offices, stores, and factories in the US, hiring workers to staff them and helping bring down the unemployment rate. And with some of the money, something like that may happen. But the economy today is global. Dollar bills, especially the virtual kind, can travel the planet like the Star Trek crew, beaming into and out of wherever the action is deemed to be.

    With annual economic growth rates as high as our unemployment rates, China has plenty of action. So Mega-Multinational may well decide that the best investment is to send my five dollars along with the Marine private’s QE2 money across the sea to construct a new office park in Shanghai. Very quickly, my cash for a burger has been converted into Chinese currency, entering one of the fastest-growing economies on the planet.

    The destination of my five dollars may disappoint Mr. Bernanke and others who’d like to see greater activity right here in America. But it reveals an important truth about economic performance: sustainable growth springs from enterprise that’s fueled by savings – not a faster currency printing press.

    QE2 can’t make Americans work – or save – moreChina’s growth is built on bottom-up productivity – not top-down bond buying. The Chinese people are thrifty and hard working. Released from the yoke of true communism a generation ago, they are extraordinarily entrepreneurial. They seem to have figured out that the alchemy for success is an unusual mixture of boldness and humility – the boldness to imagine the future and the humility to work and sacrifice to achieve it.

    Back in the US, we are impatient. We seek comfort. We consume instead of save, buy rather than build. Our forebears did the heavy lifting to put our economy on top of the world. Can’t we just reap the rewards – a great job for life, a big house filled with the latest entertainment devices, three cars in the garage? Can’t QE2 just give us that?

    RELATED: Instead of stimulus, do nothing – seriously

    It can’t, because by itself the $600 billion it represents is, like my five dollars, insubstantial and ghostlike.

    Now if QE2 money inspires American business leaders to take a chance on expanding operations and hiring new people, it might lower unemployment. If it inspires discouraged workers to go out and pound the pavement for available jobs, it might increase the goods and services our economy produces. On the other hand, if it inspires us to spend more time arguing about ideology and blaming policies for our predicament, QE2 will merely increase our debt and push our economy further out of balance.

    In the end, our economic success is less about our policies and more about ourselves. And that is something to be glad about. Now where’s my burger?

    Paul McDonnold is the author of “The Economics of Ego Surplus,” a novel of economic terrorism. He has taught economics courses at the University of North Texas, the University of Delaware, and North Lake College in Irving, Texas.

  100. JJ says:

    Five Guys burger good, just opened a new location in New Jersey, but what was the rest of the mumbo jumbo in 103 about

  101. Confused In NJ says: as houses says:
    December 13, 2010 at 3:32 pm
    #95 Lamar

    “Yeah, but a few days on corticosteroids will turn you into one grumpy SOB. I had to take some a few years ago, and whoa!”

    Did anyone really notice a difference? LOL

    Biggest problem I have seen with drugs like Prendisone is it destroys the bone supporting your teeth.

  102. Barbara says:

    Re: Baristanet clip

    third comment quips about “The War On Siding.” I’m curious, what are they referring too?

  103. Barbara says:

    I was on a steroid for TWO DAYS after a surgery to keep swelling down and it was not good. Never again.

  104. Ben says:

    Still wondering where all the gold bashers of earlier this year went. They conveniently dropped of the face of the cliff. Meanwhile, they are fence sitting waiting for home prices to decline while their down payment sitting in a CD gets eroded.

  105. JJ says:

    I still hate Gold. Other than Mr. T, Indians and people with memories of wheelbarrows of money after wwII being used to buy a loaf of bread it has few fans.

  106. NJGator says:

    Barbara – just snark because they found the drugs hidden there. And of course anything but clapboard is an abomination!

  107. Juice Box says:

    re: 111 – We are turning Japanese. Over the last few years, temporary employees have gone from being a rarity in Japan to accounting for one-third of the workforce of 67 million.

  108. BlindJust says:

    Make that 7 … I hope it bodes as well as the others …

    BlindJust says:
    November 26, 2010 at 1:12 pm
    Indeed. I’ve had 6 different managers in 2 years. Most were given notice mid December. However, all found consulting positions within 3-6 mos. One even recently received a ft offer.

  109. BlindJust says:


  110. Neanderthal Economist says:

    Let’s get real here. What is the possibility that the new qe does not pump up stocks and housing to new heights? At this point its all about investing in inflation, not hedging against it.

  111. Shore Guy says:

    What happens to a nation’s collective psyche when millions of once-productive people remain out of work for months or even years? What happens when unemployed husbands resign themselves to relying on a wife’s income, when unemployed wives feel trapped at home, when twenty- and thirtysomethings calculate that they’d rather live off their parents than face a cut-throat job market, when middle-aged men and women stop searching for jobs after realizing they’re hopelessly lost in a haze of rapid-fire technological change? The pre-holiday bickering over tax cuts and extending unemployment benefits is drowning out a December government number so frightening it should concentrate the minds of every posturing political leader in Washington: 9.8% unemployment. That is staggering, up from when the recession ended 18 months ago, and comes despite signs of recovery in retail, rea estate, and corporate profits Especially troubling is that long-term unemployment continues to mount. “It is unprecedented in post–World War II U.S. history to have 3% of the labor force unemployed for over a year,” Narayana Kocherlakota, president of the Federal Reserve Bank of Minneapolis, said in a recent speech. “If history is any guide, this year-plus unemployment rate will only revert to pre-recession levels after several years.” Add to that mix this perplexing fact: While there aren’t nearly enough jobs, there are more of them — a lot more. Since the month after the recession ended, the number of available jobs has surged 44%, according to the Labor Department. Job vacancies are nowhere near pre-recession levels (according to the Conference Board, there are still 10.4 million more unemployed workers than advertised vacancies). Still, there are as many as three million jobs going unfilled.


  112. Neanderthal Economist says:

    Shore. How many jobless have invested in nintendo wii at some point over the last 52 weeks?

  113. Shore Guy says:

    Truely an investment in their future. Our household , on the other hand, has never purchased a video game.

  114. Neanderthal Economist says:

    I bought ps2. Didn’t leave my house for two weeks straight. Returned it out of fear. Just think what 99 weeks of that does to the brain.

  115. BlindJust says:

    Plenty of people wait for the “right” job. One could argue that they should just take any. However, since future employers often gauge offers based on prior salary/rate, this may not be the prudent approach.

  116. BlindJust says:

    If you’re out of work for 2 years, that’s also plenty of time to earn another degree. The state may even pick up some or all of the tab.

  117. Ben says:

    “I still hate Gold. Other than Mr. T, Indians and people with memories of wheelbarrows of money after wwII being used to buy a loaf of bread it has few fans.”

    Well then, may I suggest gold or silver stocks. Or does 500% in the past 2 years not impress you either?

  118. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Blind 123 They pay, I am.
    Blind 122 Just don’t list them & believe me I have had some bad ones. Been touring Europe sounds nice or went to (insert foreign country) for a year to live with family to rediscover my heritage. That’s a killer! P.S. better know the lingo. Must be great to be of British stock.

    Giants Kicking A**.

  119. Yikes says:

    ahhh, New York. Note the apt square footage

    “In my opinion, if you don’t have a bartender at your party, you’re a loser,” said Dustin Terry, who lives a floor below Ms. Argiro and said his job was to get models and Saudi royalty into hot clubs. “The bartender brings class and sophistication.”

  120. Neanderthal Economist says:

    “Plenty of people wait for the “right” job. One could argue that they should just take any.”

    why take a job that pays less than sitting on couch playing Wii?
    Plus with fully reimbursed classes at ebay university, its the full college experience from your living room.

  121. Fabius Maximus says:

    #71 Cat

    Did his law degree cover the concept of recuse?

    Henry E. Hudson, the federal judge in Virginia who just ruled health care reform unconstitutional, owns between $15,000 and $50,000 in a GOP political consulting firm that worked against health care reform. You don’t say!

  122. Fabius Maximus says:

    #90 ChiFi

    Pulled the trigger today to sweep 2/3rds of my bond fund into stable value. My company 401 does not have that many options. At this point I’m frozen, no options look good.

  123. ben (124)-

    Leave him to rot. Pretty soon, there will only be victims and survivors.

  124. Barbara says:

    re that Brooklyn party….shes redunk but I have a lot of friends in that scene…and I see the Brooklyn model of local DIY as the “new economy.” We went there in the early 90s recession but things went too go-go with the easy lending. My friends seem to actually enjoy themselves and the area where they live. Things to do, people to meet, places to take your kids and all of it non corporate, DIY small entrepreneur type businesses. The cheaper the rent gets, the more of this we will see imo.

  125. Fabius Maximus says:

    #118 Shore,

    And the #1 priority for the GOP is the repeal of Healthcare reform. With most of the provisions not even kicking in to 2014, it’s still top of the agenda.

    I have trouble understanding that

  126. Insurance is for the rich. Healthcare benefits are a pipedream of the little people.

    The poor in America are poor because God hates them.

  127. Your arms too short to box with God.

    Use the poor, then kill them.

  128. Barbara says:

    *cue Prosperity Gospel here*

  129. Shore Guy says:


    The problem with the healthcare law is not the quest to provide care to everyone. The issue lies in NOT PAYING FOR IT BY CUTTING SPENDING. This is yet another example of congress saying “dont worry about the extra cost, it will pay for itself in savings.” It has yet to ever happen and this will not be an exception.

  130. Barbara says:

    Where are the random Goodwill and Salvation Army stores popping up, occupying vacant retail? That was all over NJ in the early 90s…..Sat garage sales were like an weekly event. Auctions everywhere in old, dead malls……

  131. jamil says:

    133 dems spent one year with oc, and did not pass a budget or do anything to get economy growing, but apparently thats fine by you.

    Obamacare cost trillions, and is one reason why employers avoid hiring at any cost. We have recession until it has been repealed.

  132. Barb (136)-

    You’d think bunkum like that would’ve died after Elmer Gantry was published. Yet, we get the modern version of it in Joel Osteen and this Rick Warren douchebag who Bojangles decided he needed to dry-hump. No wonder most English teachers in the US have no desire to actually teach kids to read, or to want to read.

    Then again, none of this matters, since we live in a nation full of illiterate pinheads.

  133. Barbara says:

    141. Lamar
    My husband (BF at the time) and I used to collect “prayer cloths” from Rev Ike. Good times. We were broke assed despite. Our faith was weak. Joel Osteen has scary veneers. I digress.

  134. Torquemada says:

    #130 Fabius Maximus

    You don’t say? I just pulled the trigger tonight to sweep my munis into a savings account. I made $1,500 tax-free no $100,000 since June. A pittance on that amount of cash—not keeping up with (real) inflation and hardly a return—but pretty much the best I could’ve done. Still, the risk is unacceptable for that little money.

  135. Fabius Maximus says:

    #137 Shore,

    We are getting and extension of the Bush tax cuts and a 35% Estate tax and you bring up that healthcare reform may not pay for itself. We can argue the CBO numbers and if picking up the bottom end will be offset by savings. But its 3-4 years out and there are more pressing items on the agenda,such as, the 9.8% unemployment rate. At this point Healthcare Reform should be way down the prioity list.

  136. Fabius Maximus says:

    #139 Jamil

    Are you huffing Glue?

  137. chicagofinance says:

    Barb: vomiters unite….Cliff Lee to Philly! ???? ! :(

  138. Barbara says:

    u r so jelz! He rejected 50 mil! Yankee whiners crying about getting a taste of their own medicine. Har. Yankees will have to drown their sorrows in coke and hookers, (because they care about the fans!)…same as it ever was.

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