From the NYT:
The Labor Department releases its report on June job growth on Friday, and economists are crossing their fingers for some good news.
“Good news” is a relative term, of course.
In May, the nation’s employers added a measly 69,000 jobs, whereas a gain of 125,000 to 150,000 jobs is needed just to keep up with the growth in the working-age population before even touching the backlog of nearly 13 million unemployed Americans. The median forecast for June is that job growth ticked up slightly to 90,000 jobs, and that the unemployment rate stayed flat at 8.2 percent.
That 90,000 number is a relatively small fraction of the growth rate many economists had been expecting just a few months ago.
During the winter, the economy seemed to be picking up steam, as private companies took on more and more workers and the unemployment rate dropped precipitously. In January, for example, nonfarm payrolls grew by 275,000 jobs.But job growth slowed suddenly in March, April and May. That led some economists to wonder if the unseasonably warm winter, rather than a fundamentally healthier economy, had been the source of the temporary employment surge.
“The weather distortion should be finished now, so we should have a somewhat cleaner reading of what’s actually happening with payrolls,” said Andrew Tilton, a senior United States economist at Goldman Sachs.
The question is whether that cleaner reading is a sustainably higher one as well.
Foist!
The UE number is whatever TPTB want it to be. The only thing you can count on is that it’s a 100% falsification.
We’ve been in a depression since 2008, and the actual UE rate is probably north of 17%.
All else is propaganda.
I say keep the positive spin and propoganda coming. I find the constant barage of bad news and complaining exhausting. Economists measure consumer confidence for a reason. Human beings are fickle creatures and if the economy is ever to recover, we need to feel good about ourselves again.
” This great Nation will endure as it has endured, will revive and will prosper. So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is fear itself—nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance. In every dark hour of our national life a leadership of frankness and vigor has met with that understanding and support of the people themselves which is essential to victory. I am convinced that you will again give that support to leadership in these critical days.”
-FDR
Anecdotal on jobs: I asked the HR person how many resumes she received for the job I just secured and her response was 116 resumes. That’s 116 resumes for 1 role. I guess that’s an indicator of how well the Oblama economy is doing.
By the way, speaking of Oblammy, Bobby Jindal and Tim Pawlenty are shadowing every stop that the Annointed One is making on the campaign trail and blowing his rhetoric and bullsh1t to smithereens.
2-4 This too shall pass, funny I agree with you both to an extent. Brian yes the world will not end & I have serious doubt I will need a hard perimeter around my home. On the other hand there is going to be a lot of pain and the present data we are being handed is false. It is worse then what they are telling you, we are dancing very close to precipice which could push us to something akin to Meat’s dire predictions.
Brain I applaud your optimism and it is true it will be self for filling if we all go down the Meat road but the inverse is not as strong a case. If we all think it will be better soon it will, I think not. I am wary of the future.
Gary when do you start?
Jobs report ugly only 80k.
80K on the jobs, 8.2% UE.
No… we… can’t.
What a f*cking sham, get this guy out of office.
Mikeinwaiting,
I start on the 16th.
Gary “O” is up 9% in Ohio , without it Mitt loses.
Re-post as this one went in after hours yesterday.
Well here it is short sale offer accepted in under two months. At my offered price 19% below ask & just a hair over 1/3 of what the bank is holding on the mortgage. Happy days!
Mikeinwaiting [12],
I’m well aware of it. Mittens needs to: a) get angry and b) outline a definitive plan. I can’t understand how keeping the body on life support is gonna make people run to pull the lever for Oblammy in November. Then again, muppets are easily manipulated. When you dangle a carrot in front of them at the last minute, they get distracted and follow you.
So what does Bojangles say today on the Bus tour? Help is on the way ?
Gary:
80k new jobs will be revised to 70k in a month or two. We need at least 150k to break even and to get some jobs for college grads. This is a very weak jobs report.
THE EMPLOYMENT SITUATION — JUNE 2012
Nonfarm payroll employment continued to edge up in June (+80,000), and the
unemployment rate was unchanged at 8.2 percent, the U.S. Bureau of Labor
Statistics reported today. Professional and business services added jobs,
and employment in other major industries changed little over the month.
Household Survey Data
The number of unemployed persons (12.7 million) was essentially unchanged
in June, and the unemployment rate held at 8.2 percent. (See table A-1.)
Among the major worker groups, the unemployment rate for blacks (14.4 percent)
edged up over the month, while the rates for adult men (7.8 percent),
adult women (7.4 percent), teenagers (23.7 percent), whites (7.4 percent),
and Hispanics (11.0 percent) showed little or no change. The jobless rate
for Asians was 6.3 percent in June (not seasonally adjusted), little changed
from a year earlier. (See tables A-1, A-2, and A-3.)
In June, the number of long-term unemployed (those jobless for 27 weeks
and over) was essentially unchanged at 5.4 million. These individuals
accounted for 41.9 percent of the unemployed. (See table A-12.)
Both the civilian labor force participation rate and the employment-
population ratio were unchanged in June at 63.8 and 58.6 percent,
respectively. (See table A-1.)
The number of persons employed part time for economic reasons (sometimes
referred to as involuntary part-time workers) was essentially unchanged at
8.2 million. These individuals were working part time because their hours
had been cut back or because they were unable to find a full-time job.
(See table A-8.)
In June, 2.5 million persons were marginally attached to the labor force,
down from 2.7 million a year earlier. (These data are not seasonally
adjusted.) These individuals were not in the labor force, wanted and were
available for work, and had looked for a job sometime in the prior 12
months. They were not counted as unemployed because they had not searched
for work in the 4 weeks preceding the survey. (See table A-16.)
Among the marginally attached, there were 821,000 discouraged workers
in June, a decline of 161,000 from a year earlier. (These data are not
seasonally adjusted.) Discouraged workers are persons not currently
looking for work because they believe no jobs are available for them.
The remaining 1.7 million persons marginally attached to the labor
force in June had not searched for work in the 4 weeks preceding the
survey for reasons such as school attendance or family responsibilities.
(See table A-16.)
Establishment Survey Data
Total nonfarm payroll employment continued to edge up in June (+80,000).
In the second quarter, employment growth averaged 75,000 per month,
compared with an average monthly gain of 226,000 for the first quarter of
the year. Slower job growth in the second quarter occurred in most major
industries. (See table B-1.)
Professional and business services added 47,000 jobs in June, with temporary
help services accounting for 25,000 of the increase. Employment also rose
in management and technical consulting services (+9,000) and in computer
systems design and related services (+7,000). Employment in professional
and business services has grown by 1.5 million since its most recent low
point in September 2009.
Employment in manufacturing continued to edge up in June (+11,000).
Growth in the second quarter averaged 10,000 per month, compared with
an average of 41,000 per month during the first quarter. In June,
employment increased in motor vehicles and parts (+7,000) and in
fabricated metal products (+5,000).
Employment continued to trend up in health care (+13,000) and wholesale
trade (+9,000) in June.
Employment in other major industries, including mining and logging,
construction, retail trade, transportation and warehousing, financial
activities, leisure and hospitality, and government, showed little or
no change.
The average workweek for all employees on private nonfarm payrolls
edged up by 0.1 hour to 34.5 hours in June. The manufacturing workweek
edged up by 0.1 hour to 40.7 hours, and factory overtime was 3.3 hours
for the fifth consecutive month. The average workweek for production and
nonsupervisory employees on private nonfarm payrolls edged up by 0.1
hour to 33.8 hours. (See tables B-2 and B-7.)
In June, average hourly earnings for all employees on private nonfarm
payrolls increased by 6 cents to $23.50. Over the year, average hourly
earnings have increased by 2.0 percent. In June, average hourly earnings
of private-sector production and nonsupervisory employees increased by
5 cents to $19.74. (See tables B-3 and B-8.)
The change in total nonfarm payroll employment for April was revised
from +77,000 to +68,000, and the change for May was revised from
+69,000 to +77,000.
____________
The Employment Situation for July is scheduled to be released on
Friday, August 3, 2012, at 8:30 a.m. (EDT).
[4] Brian – Analogous to the economics lesson that Nom gave me a couple weeks back “Assume a can opener…”:
Assume a Leader…
” This great Nation will endure as it has endured, will revive and will prosper. So, first of all, let me assert my firm belief that the only thing we have to fear is fear itself—nameless, unreasoning, unjustified terror which paralyzes needed efforts to convert retreat into advance. In every dark hour of our national life a leadership of frankness and vigor has met with that understanding and support of the people themselves which is essential to victory. I am convinced that you will again give that support to leadership in these critical days.”
-FDR
The “Market” is Open! The “Market” is Open!
I dont know why you guys are so gloom and doom. Long Beach, Hamptons, Jersey Shore, Packed, bars crowded rentals flying off shelf. Cars Companies are on track for best year in sales since 2007, check. Expedia and Tripadvisor stocks skyhigh as they are doing tons of vacation bookings check. Houses selling again check. Stocks and Bonds way way up in value over last 3 years check. People are flush with cash and have access to loans at cheap cheap rates check.
Unskilled people who got jobs in 2003-2008 paying way more than they were worth are out of luck. Sadly they are now tainted by unemployment still unskilled and now almost a decade older. Foolish people who leveraged themselves to max in real estate or stocks on margin from spring 2004 to spring 2008 are toast. Elderly people on a fixed income afraid to invest keeping money in savings accounts and cds at zero interest are toast. Yes a lot of folks are toast.
But majority of folks did not lose their jobs, kept plugging away in 401ks, bonds, and stocks these last four years have seen their net worth skyrocket and were able to refinance their mortgage down to next to nothing. These folks net worth between March 2009 and today is up 100%!!! These are the folks now spending. The folks who binged during 2000-2008 need a good decade to clean up their mess.
The folks who bought homes between 1992 and 2002, did not take cash out of home and have been plugging away in stocks and bonds each paycheck took advantage of two large crashes in stocks between April 2000 and April 2004 and July 2008 to July 2012 to build wealth. Scared folks who pulled out of markets at wrong time also got killed.
So normal hard working folks who did not buy homes at peak, did not cash out, did not lose job and kept plugging away in stocks each month even in the worst of times are now out spending. That is most likely 75% of population. .
Obama Admin shill Krueger on CNBC: “We have unacceptable unemployment in construction because we overbuilt housing so much a while back (read: Bush’s fault). We’re still trying to work our way through that excess.”
Any questions?
another one goes under contract in The ‘Fly…the hottest market in NNJ:
Est Cls Dt: 8/1/2012 UCD: 7/5/2012 DOM: 319
“The private sector is doing fine.”
– Barry Soetoro
seif – Hoboken holds that title 31 sold last week.
[20] JJ – 75%? I think that’s me, you, and 4 or 5 others on this board.
So normal hard working folks who did not buy homes at peak, did not cash out, did not lose job and kept plugging away in stocks each month even in the worst of times are now out spending. That is most likely 75% of population. .
meh
another one goes under contract in The ‘Fly…the hottest market in NNJ:
24 – on behalf of tenafly i concede to hoboken.
2012 Bergen County fun fact: 85% of recent Tenafly home buyers are Alpine and Closter home sellers. The other 15% have their bigger BC homes on the market or have converted them to rooming houses.
25,000 around D.C. still without power a week after the big storm. Meteorologists predict 106 for Saturday…
“Part of a neighbor’s tree fell on Epstein’s roof, so she did what anyone else would: She called her insurance company and a tree removal service, figuring that would resolve the problem.
“On Monday, a tree-removal company arrived, but a worker said the company couldn’t help because the tree was touching the power line. He suggested that Epstein call Pepco.
“On Tuesday, a contractor with Pepco came to assess the situation and determined that it should fall to the power company to fix.
“On Wednesday, a Pepco employee arrived and said the company could not remove the tree because it was on private property.”
See I am right, you just listed 75% of the posters on this board.
The Original NJ ExPat says:
July 6, 2012 at 9:50 am
[20] JJ – 75%? I think that’s me, you, and 4 or 5 others on this board.
So normal hard working folks who did not buy homes at peak, did not cash out, did not lose job and kept plugging away in stocks each month even in the worst of times are now out spending. That is most likely 75% of population. .
11 – Congrats, Gary. It sounds like your job search could rival the Odyssey.
Brian (4)-
FDR had a world war, plus the ability to initiate soci@lism, plus the ability to spin the fiat presses with little repercussions back then.
Now? Soci@lism is exposed as no more than the death rattle of a dying society, and we are about to reap the whirlwind at the back end of idiotic credit expansion and relentless fiat printing.
All that’s left is to plan for oblivion. It is nigh.
gary (14)-
Bojangles wins, because he perfected the creation of a massive entitlement class that votes as instructed.
Time to get bullish on bread and circuses.
Formula to be prezident:
1. Suck up to banksters/massive corporations
2. Throw na@rcotic-spiked scraps to entitlement class
3. Talk populist line of BS, while making sure cronies/donors get greased
4. Wage 24/7 war vs. middle class. You need to throughly shake them down in order to make the whole scam work.
(14)
Gary,
Best of luck in the new job.
I consider you one of the muppets if you think Romney’s policies will be different than Obama’s.
joyce (36)-
No diff between Romney & Bojangles. Both tools, beholden to different masters.
Criticize Obama and his lackeys, and Congress, and courts… they deserve it.
Romney is no savior. He is receiving campaign contributions from the SAME sources as Obama did 4 years prior. They are the same.
More people signed up for food stamps than got a job this month. Food for thought, pun intended.
Gary or anyone know anything about getting a computer running super DOS to talk to Windows op. PC?
Gary,
1 of 116? You are even more special than the 1%.
mikey (39)-
And people still think change will come via the ballot box.
Reaching the tipping point on hunger may- in and of itself- trip everything straight into ultra-violence. Masses of underfed people tend to get real cranky.
Mike,
Ethernet?
Mikeinwaiting [40],
I know as much as you about home PCs. My experience is large scale frontend to backend connectivity and ensuring that data moves from point A to point B with numerous dependencies involved. Confused yet?
Shore yes. They do not recognize each other, cables changed.
Shore [41],
I made them an offer they couldn’t refuse. ;)
[42] Let them eat corn.
This is for a friends business. Junkyard , buy this Hollander system with ability to track parts all over world Bla Bla running super DOS now goes through PC with windows for inter face with all the other Hollander systems all over world to trade ,buy sell parts.
Meat 42 that is why they keep the food stamps going.
Gary 44 They both run & you can go on either (input into the DOS system) but no connectivity between systems.
New Improved Beer for President!
I need somebody to blame for all of my problems in life.
With all these unemployed people, I wish this could help to eliminate the word “bling” from the English vocabulary.
Wow Brian 51 laying down the gauntlet.
Mike (39),
Maybe its because of those new food stamp advertisements they’re running on the radio. Trying to get rid of the social stigma, and letting more people know that they’re eligible.
No point in pretending the US isn’t already a welfare state.
The economy created just 80,000 jobs in June, the Bureau of Labor Statistics reported Friday. But that same month, 85,000 workers left the workforce entirely to enroll in the Social Security Disability Insurance program, according to the Social Security Administration.
The disability ranks have outpaced job growth throughout President Obama’s economic recovery. While the economy has created 2.6 million jobs since June 2009, fully 3.1 million workers signed up for disability benefits.
http://news.investors.com/article/617233/201207060945/disability-climbs-faster-than-jobs-under-obama.htm
A. West 52 it’s a clouds to fish thing. Know a guy who spent $250 on fire works & now scrabbling to pay rent.
[55] Transfer payments you can believe in:
“The number of people with jobs is still nearly 5 million below its pre-recession peak.
The number of long-term unemployed — those out of work 27 weeks or more — is still 5.4 million — almost one million higher than when the recovery began three years ago, and almost twice the level it ever reached prior to Obama’s recovery.”
A.West 54 as the number keeps increasing it will be the norm, no stigma involved. This is how you make a population dependent then it is easy to take away their rights. The sheep will go willingly to slaughter.
Fast Eddie: 1) You lose all credibility when you start with that “Barry Soetoro” business. 2) Please explain exactly what Willard Romney’s plan for the economy is and how it will “create jobs” — not contract jobs, not minimum-wage jobs with no benefits, but the kind of permanent jobs that used to sustain the middle class. I’m serious. Please explain it to me.
http://leanforward.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2012/07/06/12598791-gov-romney-wanted-more-time-on-job-creation-too?lite
Gov. Romney wanted more time on job creation, too
While Mitt Romney continued to criticize President Obama’s job growth strategy, it seems when he was governor of Massachusetts, Romney wanted a little more breathing room on job creation, too.
American Bridge, a Democratic research group, unearthed a video (above) of Gov. Romney responding defensively to a reporter’s question in 2006 on lackluster job growth.
“If you are going to suggest to me that somehow the day I got elected, somehow jobs should immediately turn around, well that would be silly,” Romney said. “It takes a while to get things turned around. We were in a recession, we were losing jobs every month. We’ve turned around and since the turnaround we’ve added 50,000 jobs. That’s progress.”
Another flip-flop by Mittens.
And in case you think I’m just a leftist commie socialist income redistributor, here’s this from the right:
“Since Mitt Romney had a mediocre record of job creation as the governor of Massachussetts, he has touted his record of creating jobs at Bain Capital. He’s noted time and time again that he created 100,000 jobs at Bain and has presented this to voters as a core reason why they should vote for him. Additionally, part of the response to the incredibly effective ads featuring people who lost their jobs because of Bain has been, “Well sure, some people lost their jobs, but Mitt created a lot more jobs than he killed.”
“The problem with this is that there is no meaningful evidence other that Mitt Romney’s word that it’s so.
“The first indication the 100,000 jobs created number’s dodgy is that when Mitt ran against Ted Kennedy in 1994, 2/3 of the way through his tenure at Bain, he was only claiming in ads that he created 10k jobs. Now, he’s claiming a 10 fold increase up to 100,000 jobs. That’s enough to make you raise an eyebrow, but not ironclad that he’s fudging. However, there was a more serious indication of trouble: Romney, who could fairly be called the best prepared candidate of the election season, had no firm numbers to back up his 100,000 jobs-created claim. Of course, this is extremely suspicious. Here we have one of the biggest reasons voters are supposed to back Mitt Romney, but his campaign was presenting no real evidence to back it up.”
But you all go ahead thinking that making a vulture capitalist president is going to solve everything. Go ahead. I’ll just stand here and laugh at you and point derisively.
(59)
Jill,
What is Obama’s plan?
All I see is him continuing the failures of the past, only bigger and faster.
willard the RAT
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Joyce #61:
I think what we have in this country is a systematic effort by billionaires and corporations to eliminate the middle class. The middle class is a pesky lot, always wanting admission to the club. The billionaire/corporate axis has been very successful over the last 30 years at directing people’s attention to those lower on the economic ladder and saying “See? HE’S the reason you’re moving down” — while they’re taking the last two bucks out of your back pocket.
I’m not sure any “plan” that Obama might have would even work, since the corporations and billionaires who thanks to the Roberts court can now buy elections have made it clear that they want one of their own (whether it’s Mittens or a last-minute pinch-hitter like Jeb Bush) in the White House and in control of Congress. And they’ll manipulate whatever the have to — jobs, financial markets — to make sure that happens. Add to that mass disenfranchisement in the swing states of Ohio, Pennsylvania and Florida, and I think this election is already over.
I suspect that when Mittens is installed in the White House, the corporations will loosen their pursestrings just enough to lull the morons into thinking things are getting better, but the “job growth” will still be only in contract and low-wage service jobs. The middle class is over, and the best we can do is hope that we die before things get too bad. Because once people wake up to the oligarchy they live in, it’s going to get ugly.
(Jill,Eddie)
Off with your heads. Take that banter talk elsewhere. You are boring me with the nanna nanna nanna stuff. This is a respected Real Estate forum. Nothing more. Nothing less.
Now, for more important stuff. I received a letter from a Florida realtor several weeks ago. It seems they are looking for vacant, buildable land again. Like the one I bought 18 months ago at a fifth of the prior buyers price and 60% off price in 1999.
Anyone know what’s going on? My guess is as good as yours.
Oops, I forgot. This is a respected NJ real estate forum. Well, what the hey. I’ll give it a shot.
MIW – #68 (yesterday)
I’m a long time reader and only post on the rare occasion (I changed my handle once a long time ago). The short sale you’re involved with seems like a very steep discount and I view a great deal like that as a coup. Congrats, again.
I’ve been noticing a break in sentiment/confidence on this board regarding the timing of the bottom and an accelerated interest in home buying. Over the past couple of years regular posters to the board have made purchases: Still Looking bought, Stu bought (another), Grim bought, Veto is buying, JJ is bidding on investment property, 3b is looking to move (albeit forced), and a number of others who came to thank the board and share their experiences. The sentiment has swung positive, perhaps haltingly and begrudgingly, but the trend is toward purchasing.
I’ve been renting, looking and I continue to look. Schumpeter/Clot/Meat often says, “Where you sit is where you stand,” and some of the buyers seem to believe they have timed it correctly (especially Veto) but I feel that the jury is still out. I keep in mind that each individual (poster) has a separate set of circumstances and that my board observations are based on anecdotes and the sample size is small (and skewed).
It comes down to price (+ carrying costs of ownership). A good deal in a flat or declining market provides some margin to the buyer relative to the overall market. I took notice of your “lowball” offer and the huge haircut that the mortgagee has agreed to. Can you reveal a little more about your rationale for coming in at the price you did and how much back and forth took place throughout the negotiation?
While I’m here and dropping names I will give a shout out to Gary who’s vigor, perseverance and diligence should be commended. Congratulations and best of luck in your new position – your new employers have chosen wisely.
Mikeinwaiting says:
July 5, 2012 at 7:05 pm
Grey Matters do not have date set yet, do I know you a different handle perhaps. I put in a cash offer it is in Sussex County. Mortgage held by Beneficial which is in receivership.
Jill 60/64 per your post Romney had a “mediocre ” record, sure beats the piss poor one we have now.
They are all crooks I just prefer the Mitt brand of crook this time and it has nothing to do with “O” having a just slightly better tan than me.
“I’m not sure any “plan” that Obama might have would even work”
” The middle class is over, and the best we can do is hope that we die before things get too bad. Because once people wake up to the oligarchy they live in, it’s going to get ugly.”
Agree on both so lets get it over with & go with Mitt.
We need more of the same.
brain (51)-
Look in the mirror. I’m not your problem…I’m the symptom.
Hey I have a mortgage question. The bungalow by beach I am bidding Quicken Loans told me I cant use it as a vacation home as it is too close to my house. I told them it was 8 miles away. I then said how far is a vacation home, he was like you know an hour away, our underwriters wont approve. I then said that makes no sense. I was like I own my primary outright, I live 8 miles from beach, this house is right on beach, why cant I have a vacation home on beach.
Turns out he is claiming a vacation home has to be a set distance from primary. I never heard of such a thing, then he was like I will quote you investment property rates, and I am like for now I am not even renting it, even if I do it would be for a few weeks at peak of summer. It is not an investment property.
Is he giving me a bunch of BS< I know a few hasedic jews I used to work with who have condo/coops in Brookyn who have a bungalow by far rockaway, the vacation home is like 6 miles from primary, they have to be able to get back for sabath and primary is an apt so they want the house. Are they making it up? Does a vacation home have to be a certain distance from primary.
The middle class is given a choice, become rich or become poor. It is very hard to stay middle class. If one goes back to school and invests properly he is rich. If one is middle class and loses job he becomes poor.
Joyce #61:
I think what we have in this country is a systematic effort by billionaires and corporations to eliminate the middle class. The middle class is a pesky lot, always wanting admission to the club. The
[70] Tell them you want to buy it as your primary residence. What can they say?
(64)
Jill,
It seems we agree on a lot. I think this has been happening for a lot longer than 30 years. So why do you cheer for the Blue team? The Republicans disguise their fascist big gov as being for “freedom and limited govt” while the Democrats disguise their fascist big gov as being for “helping the poor and disenfranchised” … they use different means toward the same end.
What happened to the anti-war movement in this country? It’s still there but at a fraction of its size. What happened to the disdain for the police-state unlawful surveillance tactics that are taking place? Almost non-existent.
Please don’t say things like Obama might have a plan. He’s is part of the system that is the problem. How can you not see that?
(67)
MIW,
That’s some pretty weak logic.
(72)
He doesn’t need any help, he’s a genius.
Sterling Grey Matters 66, know your handle vaguely thought you might have been someone I knew board wise from the past. Now as to my deal, that was what I was willing to pay if not , goodbye. Go in like that & you might get lucky (this was my first try since selling 06). No big research project running comps knew what I wanted to spend & keep looking till something nice came up on GSMLS. Another offer 9% higher than ask was presented I’m told, it was rejected due to the strength of my cash on hand.
As far as some old time board bears like myself buying, most (not Veto) think it is still going south but at a rate we are willing to pull the trigger on. The numbers were better to buy this than rent by a wide margin (renting 3x plus what it will cost to own with tax & ins). I look at the money I spent renting in light of declines in price. I have come out ahead even with 6 years renting after the sale of my primary .
Reduce the age of adulthood to 16. Guns, Liquor, run for office, get a job, get an apartment, all of it – just give all the grown up options and vices to 16 year olds and watch the economy boom. You’ll also see a lot old people get off their collective duffs when they see the kids taking over business and government.
Joyce 73 you want logic ask JJ. LOL
No seriously it was more tough in cheek I do prefer Mitt but think they both su*k. When Jill posted the Dem propaganda I figured I’d play, most likely mess with a rethug propaganda post also. Do not like these ideolog post, the Kool-Aid is poured at both tables.Most here know I lean right but I ain’t buying it hook line & sinker by a long shot.
Didn’t sense the sarcasm, sorry.
Meat 69 Brian the glove has been picked up. ” gentlemen prepare to defend yourselves”
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YlOxiwGLAkY
leftist 76 but they can not even make change.
J 78 No biggy.
Only reason I’m voting for Mittens is because Obama has already proven he’s full of sh*t and when presented with the option to do the pragmatic thing that might be right for the country he doesn’t. I’m hoping mittens can bring the deficit at least a little bit under control so we don’t look like greece. Maybe Mitt wil do the right thing after he is elected because we know obama won’t and doesn’t seem to understand capitalism at all.
Sure…I don’t understand capitalism:
http://www.businessinsider.com/corporate-profits-just-hit-an-all-time-high-wages-just-hit-an-all-time-low-2012-6
#83: I rest my case.
As for why I’m still on the blue team, it’s because as weak and feckless and craven as they are, I still think they can do less damage than the red team. Yes, I’d rather see poor people able to eat, even if it means people like Willard Rmoney (or even me) have to kick in a dollar or two more a year in taxes. I’d rather see women have self-determination instead of having the government decide that as soon as an egg is fertilized (even though up to half of all fertilized eggs don’t implant) she ceases to be a human being and becomes nothing but a vessel. I’d rather see contraception be recognized as part of women’s health care. I’d rather see reasonable regulation so that kids don’t die from E coli-tainted hamburgers or elderly people poisoned from salmonella-tainted salads. I’d rather see even a rocky path towards new energy sources instead of waiting to see what happens when the planet’s average temperature rises another six degrees. We’re already approaching a new dust bowl in the midwest…imagine when the increased price of corn syrup causes food prices to skyrocket — and it’s coming. I still think public education, even when flawed, is better for fostering opportunities for those not born into a rich, connected family than not having it. But mostly, I think that “I Got Mine And F**k you” is not a viable model for a nation. And that’s where Willard will send us at a rapid clip. Except that the joke will be on us, because he’s got his already and f**k US.
That’s why.
O
You sure don’t. Wake me up when we have capitalism or anything close to it?
jcer – deficit? You have to be joking. Forget the election for one second and remember time is running out for the automatic budget reductions to defense and domestic spending that will kick in January 1. The sitting Congress has to get together and pass a trillion in budget cuts otherwise budgets next year go kaboom, how is Congress going to do that no matter who gets elected? The two sides are so polarized that they are now fighting over the best spots to put out the deck chairs when the iceberg already slashed open a gaping hole the hull of the ship.
Time has already passed for any kind of sanity in DC. There is a great reset coming, AG may be building chicken coops and Meat may be calling for the 16th century, but I am more hopeful that we pull an Argentina and we get to spend the next five years rebuilding.
Jill,
The system for the past several decades is setup to transfer wealth upwards. It’s working as planned.
You believe, “I’d rather see women have self-determination instead of having the government decide…” and I agree. You don’t want others to force their views upon you, correct?
Why doesn’t it work both ways? I don’t want the ‘forced charity’ forced on me either. But because others (maybe you?) think it’s more noble to do it this way, then it’s OK to force it?
Why can’t we change your sentence about women and self-determination (regarding their bodies & abortion) to include ALL individuals having self-determination regarding their persons and ALL their property?
If you reject the use of force, coercion, and aggression (unless in self-defence) all of these issues can be resolved in my opinion.
[80] MiW – As Judge Smails said, “Well, the world needs ditch diggers too.”
leftist 76 but they can not even make change.
I just want to vote myself rich.
Just my 2 cents but…
Things will not get that bad to revert to a 16th century like era. The reason being is that there is simply too much wealth, technology, and knowledge in the world to allow that to happen. Im no genius but I could build an AC generator and make light bulbs, and that’s just me. Maybe the 18th century at worst, but that’s it.
Even if you take the harshest view that the rich want to subjugate and rule us, a worthless stupid class doesn’t help them at all. Someone needs to provide them power, provide protection, make their fancy gadgets and jewelry, provide health care, do the manual labor to construct massive buildings, etc. Maybe not a college degree, but an ability to critically think and get things done. There is no way to have a high technology upper class without a competent lower class to at least serve as cannon fodder for their whims.
A competent lower class would be capable of bettering its own conditions, maybe slowely, but it would happen.
It might not be a grand existence, but even a rich ruling class would not want a worthless underclass. A breeding pit for disease, famine, plague, or revolution ALL impact them.
(Note, this only true until they have Space Ships. Once the rich can leave or at least not live among us, all bets are off!)
Again, just my 2 cents! I try not to attribute malicious intent where stupidly fits just as well.
[84] Jill – I’m pro-aborted-fetus-disposal too. You go girl!
I’d rather see women have self-determination instead of having the government decide that as soon as an egg is fertilized (even though up to half of all fertilized eggs don’t implant) she ceases to be a human being and becomes nothing but a vessel.
Obama put the oil back under the ocean where it belongs. Or thereabouts, anyway.
[84] How do republicans not understand that the “We’re Taking Yours Away And F**k you” model is the *only* viable, sustainable, and green solution. Racists.
I think that “I Got Mine And F**k you” is not a viable model for a nation.
I thought players didn’t bother with mortgages. Write a check, enjoy the beach.
I suggested that then they want a lease I rented my primary or show it is for sale. I then said so if I own 3,000 homes all paid for and I want a mortgage to buy a vacation home for my 3,001 home I would be high risk. He said yes.
leftist commie socialist income redistributor says:
July 6, 2012 at 12:20 pm
[70] Tell them you want to buy it as your primary residence. What can they say?
I want the tax write off in case I rent it. If I pay cash I would be renting it for 20K a year and my expenses would only be 6K and I would have 14K income. I end up in a higher tax bracket. If it was just a summer place would do cash if bank gave me a discount.
Statler Waldorf says:
July 6, 2012 at 2:08 pm
I thought players didn’t bother with mortgages. Write a check, enjoy the beach.
[95] rbjj – Tell them you’ve had enough of your mouthy wife bossing you around, telling you you can’t buy any RE and to push more buttons at work so she can buy more shoes. You’re splitting up and want to be near the kids, She’s keeping the house.
ccording to the Douglas Elliman Long Island Report written by Jonathan Miller, a total of roughly 110,000 residential homes were sold in the two counties of Nassau and Suffolk during the years 2004-2008. In October 2010, the New York State Department of Banking issued a preliminary report entitled “90-Day Pre-Foreclosure Notice Report.” Citing data from Home Mortgage Disclosure Act (HMDA) figures, it showed that a total of 270,656 mortgages were originated in Suffolk in these five years and a total of 190,395 for Nassau.
How could that be possible? This confused me for awhile. Then I finally realized that most of the mortgages from the Banking Department report were second liens and refinanced loans.
During the bubble years when prices were rapidly rising, Long Island homeowners took advantage of this by pulling cash out of their “piggy-bank” houses. Some refinanced their first mortgages, but many others took out home equity lines of credit (HELOC) which the banks were only too willing to offer. Many homeowners refinanced their first mortgages more than once and some refinanced their HELOC again to pull additional cash from their soaring equity.
These homeowners are probably regretting their decision now. It is not an exaggeration to estimate that at least 95% of those who either did a “cash-out” refinance or took out a HELOC are now “underwater.” It could even be higher. The value of their property is less than the outstanding balance on their mortgage(s). Many are so far underwater that they have opted to “walk away” from their mortgage while remaining in the property. The risk is low since the word is out that the banks are in no hurry to foreclose.
Read more: http://www.minyanville.com/businessmarkets/articles/housing-market-housing-bubble-housing-market/12/9/2011/id/37986#ixzz1zrqmezRf
I have not traded since Monday as I am building up cash, it is killing me. I want to push those buttons.
Obviously you have never been divorced, why would I want to be near the kids. Nice little pied a tier in city, trophy GF and I visit the kids once a month and show up with a gift or two. They love Daddy and hate Mom as Daddy just gives gifts and Mommy just makes them to all the work.
leftist commie socialist income redistributor says:
July 6, 2012 at 2:12 pm
[95] rbjj – Tell them you’ve had enough of your mouthy wife bossing you around, telling you you can’t buy any RE and to push more buttons at work so she can buy more shoes. You’re splitting up and want to be near the kids, She’s keeping the house.
Jill [59];
Please explain exactly what Willard Romney’s plan for the economy is and how it will “create jobs”
Repealling Obamacare removes a $9,000 per year, per worker tax on hiring. Do you need me to connect the dots?
[99] rbjj – My mom told my Dad he could have a mistress any time he wanted. The only catch was she wanted to be put up in a nice condo and he could move the mistress into the house with us 5 kids. They’ve been married over 53 years and my Mom never got her condo.
Joyce – it is time for us to break up. Turns out my friends were right…it just ain’t working out. It is not you, it is me. I am going away for the weekend. Please have your stuff out and be gone by the time I get back Sunday night.
[102] This guy I know won $3 million in the lottery, lucky bastard. He calls his wife up from work, where he found out, all excited. She can’t believe the news, he says he’s coming home early, right after he quits his job with no notice and that she should start packing right away. She’s jumping up and down with excitement and asks my friend if she should pack for a warm climate or a cold climate. He answers, “I don’t give a damn, I just don’t want you there when I get home.”
My Mom was always a piece of work. In October 1965 we moved into our new house, a brand new 4BR 2.5bath CH colonial. It still wasn’t finished when they moved in, and my Mom was pissed. On top of that, literally the day after moving in, my dad went on a business trip to California and left her in an unfinished house with a 5 year old, 3 year old, and a newborn. My Mom had a phone installed and got an unlisted number. My Dad was screaming at the 411 operator from California every day because she wouldn’t give my Dad the number. He’s screaming, “It’s my damn house!”. My Mom didn’t talk to him until he came home a week later.
re: Jobs – I have mentioned the burgeoning rolls of SSDI in the past it is the new welfare.
The economy created just 80,000 jobs in June, the Bureau of Labor Statistics reported Friday. But that same month, 85,000 workers left the workforce entirely to enroll in the Social Security Disability Insurance program, according to the Social Security Administration.
http://news.investors.com/article/617233/201207060945/disability-climbs-faster-than-jobs-under-obama.htm
(102)
I know I don’t fit in with Amerika anymore.
(100)
Moose,
I will bet you any amount of money that even if Romney is elected (with or without a Republican congress), Obamacare will remain. Not only that, he will not issue waivers.
After all, he did sign Romney care. He did go on the cable news channels touting the mandate when he was pushing for it in his state. The idea for it first made rounds coming from a Republican think tank.
Romeny = Obama … A = A
POTUS in most administrations can only do one thing that affects our lives. Appoint SCOTUS justices. If somebody was in a coma for the last 4 years and woke up today and looked around, would it be obvious who won the election? Of course not. Same dung, different administration.
re: # 98 – Yes the great housing arbitrage. I read an article today stating the banks have about $300 Billion in HELOC 2nd loan exposure from the 2003-2008 bubble period. It is probably three times that amount since that $300 Billion was only 1 quarter of housing ATM withdrawals during the bubble.
JJ, if you buy a beach house, are we all invited for a GTG?
Jill [84];
I’d rather see poor people able to eat, even if it means people like Willard Rmoney (or even me) have to kick in a dollar or two more a year in taxes.
But that’s hardly what leftists are about. If you wanted to give a dollar or two to feed someone you can. But that’s impotent and you know it. What people who elevate leaders like his O-ness or Madame “Are you serious?” Pelosi into office really want is a thug army to steal money from other people to feed the hungry, so they can feel good about themselves for having elected the thugs and thus ‘done something’.
Except that the joke will be on us, because he’s got his already and f**k US.
Then why do you think he’s running for president? If you believe (like most leftists do) that corporate money floods exclusively to the right and TV advertising will overwhelm the resistance of the common voter and bring them into line, that a money advantage for the republicans will be what seals Obama’s fate (not the broken and failed promises, or the lies, or the unpopular legislation, of the miseable failure to create conditions conducive to economic growth); there are lots of people in this country would could fund several presidential campaigns out of pocket and put themselves in office if that is all it took. Why bother and not just decamp to Singapore with Saverin?
(110)
Moose,
Do you think people run for office to help other people, the average person, and not themselves/their friends?
Wow, I always thought it was because they were sociopaths.
joyce [106];
Unlike leftists and their O worship, the right is not a cult of personality. If it were, Harriet Meyers would be sitting on the court in Alito’s seat. No way Romney could veto an Obamacare repeal that passes in Congress.
joyce [111];
Then why you think that characteristic is exclusively on the right? I could say the same about Obama, couldn’t I? (Of course I couldn’t. That would be racist…)
Let me take out double homeowners insurance, you guys trash it at wild party and I put in insurance claim fix it up and sell it for double!! We could do this every year.
scribe says:
July 6, 2012 at 3:14 pm
JJ, if you buy a beach house, are we all invited for a GTG?
Neither the red’s nor blue’s are interested in putting an end to corporate crime:
http://market-ticker.org/akcs-www?post=208243
(113)
Moose,
When did I say it was exclusive to one side? Of course, you can say that about Obama. I have and I will continue to do so.
(112)
The right is not a cult of personality?… umm, Reagan anyone?
And Romney will not veto an Obamacare repeal, because Congress will not pass it.
Republican Bigotry Hate Fear Lies and Distortion facebook page.
http://www.facebook.com/RBHFLAD
Without access to this page, I wouldn’t have any access to really, really true information.
I don’t know why the Democrat Unprejudiced Love Safety Truth and Clean Amplifier Sound page is currently down, but that’s always a nice read too.
reposting for those who ignored me the first time and will likely ignore this one too…
specifically….
“The United States has the distinction of levying the highest corporate income tax rate in the world, bringing with it serious consequences for capital formation, corporate mergers, international competitiveness, research and development, and job creation.”
ALSO NOTE THE SH!TBAG IN THE WHITE HOUSE WHO KNOWS THIS ONE DAMNED WELL…..sitting on his a%% being a do nothing….
“The panelists spent a large part of the presentation explaining the issue of repatriation of foreign-earned profits by US-based multinationals. These companies have accumulated an estimated $1.2 trillion in offshore earnings that have not been brought into the country because the companies face an effective tax rate of 35 percent, Donnelly said. They won’t repatriate those earnings until the tax law is changed or Congress declares another one-time tax holiday, as it did in 2004.”
ROMNEY WILL DO THIS…….HE CAN BE THE BIGGEST GOOFY EVIL XENOPHOBE AND THIS WILL HELP 1000% MORE THAN ANY OF THE CRAP IN THE LAST 3 YEARS.
The US tax system is fundamentally broken and needs an overhaul, three corporate tax experts agreed at a breakout session during the 60th Annual Chicago Booth Management Conference, held May 11 at Gleacher Center.
That’s bad enough for starters, but the news gets worse. There is little interest or political motivation in Washington DC to take on such a mammoth task as rationalizing the tax code, the speakers said.
“We would take the tax system of any other country over the tax system we have,” said David Lewis, chief tax executive at Eli Lilly & Co. in Indianapolis. “It is broken, not achieving its objective, and—more importantly—it is seriously preventing growth in the US economy.”
Merle Erickson, professor of accounting, who moderated the session on US corporate tax policy, opened by highlighting the staggering fiscal pressures that soon will confront the country if the current rate of deficit spending is not reined in. The panelists’ discussion began with their unanimous belief that the need for increased revenue can be met only if the tax code becomes fairer, more balanced, easier to administer, and less punitive toward cross-border economic activity.
Jeff Maydew, a partner at Baker & McKenzie LLC in Chicago, said that as a matter of international comparison, the complexity and inscrutability of the US tax system is in a separate league; only India and Brazil are as bad.
The United States has the distinction of levying the highest corporate income tax rate in the world, bringing with it serious consequences for capital formation, corporate mergers, international competitiveness, research and development, and job creation. In 1981, the US rate was roughly comparable to that of its trading partners in the Organisation for Economic Co-operation and Development (OECD). Since 1988, the average OECD corporate income tax rate (not including that in the United States) dropped 19 percent, while the US federal rate increased 1 percent, according to Maydew.
The US tax system was put in place 50 years ago, during the Kennedy administration, said Rod Donnelly, a partner with Morgan Lewis in Palo Alto, California. Compromises in Congress introduced a multitude of complications that have not been properly updated since. “The corporate tax rate is too high, it prevents the free flow of capital, and it inhibits US international corporations competing with their foreign counterparts,” Donnelly said.
The panelists spent a large part of the presentation explaining the issue of repatriation of foreign-earned profits by US-based multinationals. These companies have accumulated an estimated $1.2 trillion in offshore earnings that have not been brought into the country because the companies face an effective tax rate of 35 percent, Donnelly said. They won’t repatriate those earnings until the tax law is changed or Congress declares another one-time tax holiday, as it did in 2004.
Bypassing the issues of fairness, equity, and political preference that have dogged this issue as it pertains to individual taxpayers and small business, the panelists described in technical terms how the current situation distorts business decision making in the United States and abroad. It’s especially harmful to spending on research and development, which can easily be sent offshore, with deleterious consequences for future US employment, they said.
The economy’s inability to create enough new jobs may be due in no small part to the perverse incentives in the tax system, the group suggested. Maydew said he sees “tremendous disincentives to having any intellectual property sitting in the US.”
For Eli Lilly to remain an independent company, Lewis said, it has to be able to compete with Novartis, based in Switzerland, and he worries that Novartis will enjoy a tax advantage in the future. “This is a very serious issue for our country. If you take away our ability to arrange our affairs in a tax-efficient manner, we will be unable to compete with companies in countries with efficient tax systems.” -Duncan Moore
Bottom line, even in a system run by selfish and merciless devils, the rising tide of jobs will lift all boats……
Obama kills Ohio diner owner, film at 11:00.
http://m.nydailynews.com/1.1109208
Shore 120 at least Chris Matthews of Softball for Dems tingles were not life threatening.
All kidding aside sad for the Family.
Chi Fi 118 we know, Ok maybe not Jill.
Ridiculous.
Meh. Bojangles has been killing us slowly for four years.
Jill #64 and #84 YES! I agree!
If we ever meet, I’ll make sure to buy you a miller high life. You and I probably don’t come down differently on most political issues.
And go easy on Obama. He’s probably a decent guy, just a crappy leader.
What we need right now is a great leader, not a nice guy.
New Improved Beer says:
July 6, 2012 at 12:05 pm
brain (51)-
Look in the mirror. I’m not your problem…I’m the symptom.
[126] Brain – ding! ding! ding! Winner. I said this while he was running in 2008. Best, perhaps most intelligent, politician I’ve ever seen but I knew he would have nothing in the leadership department when he got to the top rung of the ladder. He’s spent his entire life, brilliantly, positioning himself to jump up several levels every 2 years. Now he’s stuck in a 4 year gig with no more rungs to climb and no place to go by cleverly voting “present”. At least he’s setting a personal best for holding a single job.
We need somebody who will move us to do something different, drastically change our thinking *and* our actions *and* our involvement. I don’t see that candidate on the horizon yet.
And go easy on Obama. He’s probably a decent guy, just a crappy leader.
What we need right now is a great leader, not a nice guy.
#112: No cult of personality? Are you joking? What do you call the deification of Saint Ronnie? Or the blind faith in GWB until it was clear that everything he touched turned to s#!+?
You’re cut off for tonight, Jill. Thanks for playing our game.
Nice job Jill,
Let me pick up the late shift.
Gary,
Seriously, congrats on the job. You were told that a full time gig was not a unicorn and you proved it. It was not like the old days were you could shoot fish in a barrel, but cream rises to the top. You fought hard and got the brass ring. now hold on to it.
Now speaking off that brass ring, you are now in a job that is in Mitts Sweet Spot.
Before you pull the lever in November, have a read of this.
http://blogs.cio.com/beth_bacheldor/staples_turns_out_an_it_outsourcing_option_for_small_businesses
Staples should be the poster child for the Romney campaign, but there is so much under the covers, that I think they realise they have to bury it.
#33 Clot,
No, like any good bookie will tell you, O wins because he has no opposition.
I’m going with a long shot here. I think the Romey headwinds are too great hear. I think there has to be serious discussions going on to get him off the ticket. I would not be suprised to hear Mill pull a Guliani and bail on the race. Better that that face the humiliation of defeat. I expect that Ann will take a turn for the worse and Mitt has to take some time to be with her. As he cannot commit to the campaignn full time he will step aside.
TPaw 2012!
#100 Moose
“Repealling Obamacare removes a $9,000 per year, per worker tax on hiring. Do you need me to connect the dots?”
Complete BS. As the onus for the penalty/tax is still on the individual, there is still no requirement for the employer to offer health insurance.
If the employer offers coverage today there is no change. If the company needs to up its comp package to retain or hire staff that is a different discussion.
Um, yeah..don’t post anymore.
Just wanna say thanks to the Central Jersey folks from Edison who came down here to MD with poles on the truck and got our power back on in the MD ag reserve.
After two days of 98 degrees in house no power no wireless no internet hot flashes at 5 am 14 miles to next cell tower wet sheets rotting chicken in fridge no food in town cats stretched on backs paws pointing tongues hanging out sides of mouths, 10-year-old dragging bags of rotting food to curb…
and driving all over for hours searching for non-existent ice….
I passed your trucks pulling into town on Sunday afternoon and the word “SAVED” crossed my retinas.
Power was back on in 3 hours.
#118 Chi
Calling POTUS a “SH!TBAG” that is a new low for you.
Let’s continue the discussion we started on that article.
“…..he is sending the next wave of leading technology companies out of the country…”
Can you qualify this? The last time I looked Google (one of those big leading tech companies) was paying a 2% tax rate. CNBC yesterday was cheerleading LA as the new Silicon Valley South. We had posts in her last week with Hoboken as a cheaper tech start up place than NYC with the same level of connectivity. So how exactly is O sending tech out of the country?
“They won’t repatriate those earnings until the tax law is changed or Congress declares another one-time tax holiday, as it did in 2004.”
ROMNEY WILL DO THIS…….HE CAN BE THE BIGGEST GOOFY EVIL XENOPHOBE AND THIS WILL HELP 1000% MORE THAN ANY OF THE CRAP IN THE LAST 3 YEARS.”
I had this argument repeatedly with Eddie Ray over the last 5 years. The deferred Earning loophole should be closed. This argument that the admin should drop the rate to 5% to allow revenue to flow back should be framed as follows. A company has no incentive to repatriate earnings under the current tax code, they can defer earnings in perpetuity, they only have to repatriate if they are really stuck for cash. Otherwise, let if float on the international tax free band wagon. If the Admin drops the rate to 5% is saying that we are stuck for the revenue and we need to generate ASAP.
Companies today realize that getting this cash back stateside will cost them and they are doing it. In come back down to realizing that they can make better use of it back home.
I am the first person in her to say the tax code needs some serious reform, but the likes of a 999 plan or a flat tax will do more harm and hurt the country.
When O first came to office,he wanted to reach on the other side.He compromised on everything.The platform he campaigned for that got him in office mostly did not happen except for the pull out from Iraq and Obcare.Look at the policy running the country now and during GWB.Any changes? The right are promising to repeal exactly what they stood for
Even Obcare is from Rmneys play book.This is a Red guy dress in Blue.The only thing I like about him, he still have some policies that benefits the common person.