Housing tight in a post-Sandy NJ

From the WSJ:

Landlords Offer Homes to Displaced

Private landlords in New York City have offered to provide several thousand vacant units to house people displaced by the superstorm Sandy, according to people familiar with the matter.

It is just one of the solutions being rapidly concocted as both New York and New Jersey rush to tackle the most daunting task of Sandy’s aftermath: housing tens of thousands of newly homeless people, in a region with few apartments and little empty land.

Government officials, nonprofit organizations and academics have floated myriad solutions—from parking a cruise ship in New York Harbor to housing people temporarily in abandoned subway stations. More realistically, officials are cobbling together a plan consisting of vacant apartments and rental houses, government-issued housing units and even a defunct military barracks in New Jersey. They also expect that some displaced people will find shelter with friends and family.

“The 1% [in Manhattan] vacancy is one thing. Another is we’re land-constrained. We are in a housing emergency as we are every year. It’s an emergency situation on top of an existing emergency housing situation,” said Corinne Packard, a professor who teaches post-catastrophe reconstruction at New York University’s Schack Institute of Real Estate.

Ms. Packard said she isn’t concerned the city won’t be able to come up with enough housing for everyone, but time won’t be on its side.

“The question is how long will people have to live in this tenuous, temporary situation?” she said.

Mayor Michael Bloomberg has publicly speculated that as many as 40,000 people could be displaced by Sandy. He has since revised that estimate to fewer than 10,000, but estimates of the region’s newly homeless remained unclear Thursday.

The Federal Emergency Management Agency said Thursday that more than 96,000 applicants are eligible for housing money—about 63,000 in New York and almost 33,000 in New Jersey. Some of those have been approved for assistance with paying for hotels, while others have received payments for longer term repairs to their homes or help with short-term rental units.

In New Jersey, real estate groups and hotels have identified more than 5,000 units that could be made available, said Lisa Ryan, a spokeswoman for the state Department of Community Affairs.

The New Jersey Association of Realtors has sent listings of homes to FEMA that could be rented on a temporary basis, including vacant summer homes. But a lack of rental supply may require people to move outside their immediate vicinity, said Jarrod Grasso, the association’s CEO. “It’s an inconvenience but at least it’s a roof over their heads,” Mr. Grasso said about those searching for apartments.

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155 Responses to Housing tight in a post-Sandy NJ

  1. grim says:

    From HousingWire:

    RE/MAX: Home prices rise while inventory declines in October

    For the ninth month in a row home prices continued to rise, according to RE/MAX National Housing report.

    The median home price, at $158,900, increased 2.1% from the previous year. Closed transactions also increased 17.8% from last year and 5.4% from last month.

    As a result of rising home prices, there was a steady decline in inventory.

    The number of homes for sale in October decreased 28.9% from a year prior and also fell 6.3% from the previous month. Month-to-month inventories have now fallen for the past 28 months in a row.

    Of the 52 metros surveyed this month, 48 areas, or 92%, saw higher sales then a year ago.

    “As we enter the fourth quarter, 2012 is looking like the turn-around year for housing, with significant increases in sales and prices,” said CEO Margaret Kelly of RE/MAX.

    She added: “However, we recognize that this recovery is still fragile and dependent on more reasonable lending and regulation. If qualified buyers can obtain mortgages and more inventory comes to market, this recovery could become even stronger next spring.”

  2. Ernest Money says:

    As I personally learned the hard way, any statements coming from Re/Max are pathological lies.

  3. Mike says:

    Good Morning New Jersey

  4. 30 year realtor says:

    Just had a very interesting multiple offer situation on a house in Paramus. Listed 11/8 for $389,000. By 11/13 there were 7 offers. Did a blind highest and best with all offers. The best offer after the highest & best was still more than $20,000 below the asking price.

    Small house on approximately 85 x 100 lot. Average condition overall. Two bedrooms, one bath and no garage.

  5. 3B Buying says:

    #4 30: @ bed 1 bath in Paramus at 369 to the seller. I think they would be foolish not to take it.

  6. 3B Buying says:

    18,500 workers go on strike at Hostess, cripple the company, and the comapny closes down.


  7. chicagofinance says:

    Best comment in that article on the attached thread…

    Gerhard Lueschen
    19 minutes ago Who would have thunk that the first thing to go after Obama’s re-election was the indestructible Twinkie.

  8. Painhrtz - 42 says:

    3B f*ck them the unions killed the company so let them join the handout line. In this instance I don’t blame the owner going all Galt on them. they have been in trouble for some time though thanks to a healthier populace. guess Tallahasee is going to have to look for chocodiles during the zombie apocaplypse instead.

  9. chicagofinance says:

    Funny I saw on CNBC a couple of talking heads arguing about who has leverage in the fiscal cliff infantile pissing match. The interesting thing is that it is up to O-man to initiate things and move the process along. He is the President. The rest of them are a bunch of TSA agents at the airport checkpoint. I don’t know whether O-man gets it. The fortunate thing now is that O-man’s “legacy” is one the line…..the rest of these people will fade into history. People would have completely forgotten Gingrich if he hadn’t re-emerged as a candidate this past year.

  10. chicagofinance says:

    We will see whether O-Man lives up to clot’s 2008 pronouncement of Bush in blackface. Because he shares that irritating opinion that compromise means that you change your preference so it agrees with what he wants.

  11. 3B Buying says:

    #7 Chgo: ANd what will all the people who like fried twinkies do now!!

  12. Brian says:

    There’s going to be a run on twinkies at the quickie mart. Better get yours now or be priced out forever.

  13. Brian says:

    Seriously though, I’m sure they will sell those brands like Wonder Bread and twinkie etc. to some other firm who will continue to make them.

  14. 3B Buying says:

    #8 Loss of an iconic brand though. Wonder Bread Twinkies, Hostess Cupcakes. I kneow they were in trouble, not sure if it was because the healthier thing. People looking larger than ever out there!

  15. 3B Buying says:

    #13 Brian: At least some of them I guess. But at the end of the day those 18,500 workers are out of work. WIll the company that buys Wonder Bread lets say, hire some of those workers, or simply use their existing work force?

  16. Brian says:

    15 –
    I don’t know if I’m reading this right but the article about it on cnnmoney says that of the 18500 employees, the bakers union represents 5000 people. So, does that mean that it was a minority of employees who have effectively closed the company taking the other 13500 with them?

  17. Peace, Love, Dope says:

    Unions killed the company? This is the free market capitalist system…some survive and some don’t. The company wasn’t nimble enough to adjust to the market.

  18. 30 year realtor says:

    The interesting thing about the Paramus multiple offer situation is none of the offers was withing 5% of the asking price. None of the buyer’s increased their initial offer. An investor paid more than any of the buyers who intended to occupy the property.

  19. grim says:

    Did a blind highest and best with all offers. The best offer after the highest & best was still more than $20,000 below the asking price.

    If anything, this is a perfect example of the dynamic caused by both a lack of real inventory, and a base of buyers that will clamor for any scraps that hit the street. See this all the time now. Put up a good listing on a Friday, do no-shows until the open house (the next week), and hold the first OH on the next Sunday. You’ll have a crowd that’ll remind you of 2005.

  20. freedy says:


    Another wonderful Union leader locked up . Just a really great guy with his hand
    in the members pocket ,but hey its NJ

  21. Peace, Love, Dope says:

    get ’em while you can:


  22. grim says:

    13 – Grupo Bimbo?

  23. Anon E. Moose says:

    30-yr [18];

    The interesting thing about the Paramus multiple offer situation is none of the offers was withing 5% of the asking price. None of the buyer’s increased their initial offer.

    Tells me the last sucker is finally out of the market.

  24. Peace, Love, Dope says:

    I vaguely recall a class trip to the Hostess factory in grade school. I wanna say it was in East Brunswick area. Lib would probably know.

  25. grim says:

    From the Star Ledger:

    N.J. unemployment rate dips to 9.7 percent, but state loses more than 11K jobs

    New Jersey’s unemployment rate inched down to 9.7 percent in October, but the state shed 11,700 jobs — the largest monthly loss this year, according to data released by the state Labor Department today.

    A leading indicator of economic health, the jobless rate declined for the second straight month in October, coming off its 35-year high of 9.9 percent in August. Meanwhile, the U.S. unemployment rate rose 0.1 percentage point last month, to 7.9 percent, but unlike New Jersey the country gained 171,000 jobs.

    “Overall, New Jersey experienced job loss in October, but the long-term trend and broader picture of job creation remain positive,” said Kevin Roberts, a spokesman for Gov. Chris Christie. “We’ve now added 73,600 private-sector jobs since February 2010, the first full month Governor Christie was in office.”

  26. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [17] peace,

    I can already hear the union narrative, it was private equity not us. If those guys weren’t so greedy, we’d still have jobs. And maybe they wouldn’t have lost their investment. Greedy bankers!

  27. 3B Buying says:

    #19 grim: If the potential buyers are not even bidding at or above the asking price, how do you see that as a positive for the seller?

  28. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    It occurs to me that if Hostess went under a few decades ago, Harvey Milk might still be alive. Greedy bankers, its their fault that he died.

  29. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [16] Brian,

    That’s not an insignificant portion. Especially since it represents the actual production staff. It isn’t like the custodians went on strike. And here in Philly, other unions were honoring it.

    There was a pretty good interview on CNBC with one of the turnaround guys who said their union rules were insane, but also blamed management, which he described as “awful”. Said there wad enough blame to go around. He also said that PE wasn’t the issue, that the PE guys were more than patient and will likely lose their entire investment.

  30. 30 year realtor says:

    Moose #23 – I could argue strongly that the builder who made the top offer is a sucker. Even if he builds off the existing foundation, the 3000 square foot house he will build will cost him at least $300,000 to build. Add into the equation commission on the sale, soft costs and debt service. Anticipated value of the new construction home is between $750 – $800,000. Do the math. When you add it all up it equals SUCKER.

    For a buyer intending to live in the property the purchase price represents market value.

  31. Peace, Love, Dope says:

    that is your narrative…don’t start whining about capitalism now. some win, some lose.

  32. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    But the important question is this: With no more twinkies and ho-hos, does this mean Christie will lose weight? Or does he switch to Tasty-cakes?

  33. grim says:

    What we need to do here is set up a good bakery and a bad bakery, and use the bad bakery to effectively ring-fence the stale goods, saving the good bakery.

  34. Mike says:

    Flashback…. Ah the days of finding a Twinkie in your lunch box

  35. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [31] seif,

    That is my prediction of what the unions will say. Amd I fully endorse the right of a union to kill a company to make its point.

    Of course, it’s a poor parasite that kills its host(ess).

  36. grim says:

    C’mon guys, zeitgeist, how is anyone not surprised that Hostess made it this far? Didn’t they file for bankruptcy almost a year ago?

    Wonderbread? Twinkies?

    In the new world of Whole Foods free-range organic, vegan, gluten-free baking, there is no room for them.

    Mike – You really think you’ll find a Twinkie in Graydon’s lunch box?

  37. Peace, Love, Dope says:

    you guys really can’t stand Graydon…who is Graydon through no fault of his own.

  38. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [12] Brian,

    Maybe I get my daughter to invest in gold bars (made of sponge cake). She can hawk them at school for a healthy (pun) profit!

  39. Peace, Love, Dope says:

    35 – Please…it is now “Peace” “Love” or “Dope”…or The Peace/Love Dope, if you prefer.

  40. grim says:

    I think you can get an organic vegan twinkie at Dean and Deluca for six bucks.

  41. Jason says:

    As people are waiting for AAA to tow their government motors car to the shop made on their bamaphone, maybe they’ll have something to munch…bama-twinkies

  42. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [39] dope,

    Even tho I don’t feel any of the three fit well, I have to go with dope.

  43. 3B Buying says:

    #30 30 Year: SPeaking of Paramus and builders, I assume you have seen that absolute monstrosity being built across from Essiles Nursery (I believe), close to the Fashion Center Mall. It looks like a monstrous catering hall. Who will buy that!!

  44. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    Thanks for the update 30y! New Jersey and you…Perfect together.

    Just had a very interesting multiple offer situation on a house in Paramus. Listed 11/8 for $389,000. By 11/13 there were 7 offers. Did a blind highest and best with all offers. The best offer after the highest & best was still more than $20,000 below the asking price.

    Small house on approximately 85 x 100 lot. Average condition overall. Two bedrooms, one bath and no garage.

  45. Peace, Love, Dope says:

    Stuff like this bodes well for Dems in coming elections. Get rid of that cat Jindal…he is starting to make too much sense for the right.

    Jason says:
    November 16, 2012 at 9:12 am
    As people are waiting for AAA to tow their government motors car to the shop made on their bamaphone, maybe they’ll have something to munch…bama-twinkies

  46. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [41]. Jason,

    I’m going to look to see if anyone started a petition for Obama to take over Hostess. And if not, I’m starting one. Bomma-twinkies for everyone!

  47. grim says:

    Shocked! From the Record:

    Paramus-based union leaders arrested on embezzlement charges

    Richard “Buzzy” Dressel — a prominent and influential North Jersey labor leader who served on the boards of the Hackensack University Medical Center Foundation and Bergen Community College — was arrested Thursday on charges of conspiring to steer more than $350,000 in union funds to his wife.

    Dressel, 63, of Montvale, the business manager and principal officer of Local 164 of the International Brotherhood of Electrical Workers, was arrested along with John M. DeBouter, 55, of Oakland, the local’s president, after a two-year investigation by the U.S. Department of Labor.

    An eight-count indictment charged the two officials with conspiring to embezzle funds from the Paramus-based local, which represents about 2,900 electrical workers in Bergen, Hudson and Essex counties, and its Joint Apprentice Training Fund, for the benefit of Kathleen Libonati, Dressel’s second wife, and, indirectly, for Dressel himself.

    Dressel, who has led the local since 1999, was once on a short list to lead the Bergen County Democratic Organization. He and DeBouter appeared in wrist and ankle shackles during a brief hearing before U.S. Magistrate Judge Cathy L. Waldor in Newark on Thursday afternoon. The judge ordered their release on $150,000 bail.

  48. Mike says:

    40 Archie Bunker would be rolling in his grave

  49. yome says:

    Louisiana Governor Bobby Jindal rejected the remarks as “absolutely wrong,” and said the “fundamental takeaway” for Republicans from the election should be: “We need two messages to get out loudly and clearly: One, we are fighting for 100 percent of the voters, and secondly, our policies benefit every American who wants to pursue the American dream — period. No exceptions.”


  50. Ragnar says:

    Grupo Bimbo earlier declined to buy Hostess because of the unionized pension liabilities associated with the business. I’m guessing someone like them will buy the brands, and make the twinkies in Mexico, no union/pension strings attached.

  51. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    I’ve examined a lot of the breadcrumbs that JJ has dropped over the years here on the site. My best guess is that he lives in East Rockaway, which is literally still in the sh!t:


  52. Anon E. Moose says:

    FHA must be concerned that it is being too conservative in its lending standards by loaning a 450 FICO 10x their income with -1.5% down. So they’ve decided to bend over and give deadbeats who stiffed their last house lender another chance to stick it to them again.

    FHA gives those who defaulted on homes another chance

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  54. Anon E. Moose says:

    Ragnar [50];

    Its typically cheaper on the BK courthouse steps.

    If housing had worked the same way it would have normalized much faster than it has.

  55. stan says:

    Jj does not live on far rockaway. He commuted on the huntington line, which is why he knows so much about hicksville and the demographics there. I narrowed it down to either plainview, syosset or the wild card of laurel hollow…….. Definetly town of oyster bay.
    The towns are considered very nice with good schools. The towns have a mixed housing stock, which is why he has a paid off cape. They used to have some blue collar workers, but not much anymore as people flee the east meadows and hicksvilles to get to the “better” towns. As nassau county’s demographic become more Asian and Indian.

    He works downtown, and many buildings are still not opened, so as we all know he only posts from work, so he is likely at a temporary space, and omce back in his corner office, he will start posting.

  56. All Hype - Mr. Oil, Mr. Gas, Mr. Coal says:

    Peace (24):

    The old Hostess bakery was on Tices Lane in East Brunswick. A lot of South River old timers used to work there prior to the closure.

  57. Peace, Love, Dope says:

    I remember the trips well…getting free twinkies at the end. It is where I started to understand the appeal of a kenyan european colonial socialist lifestyle.

  58. Happy Renter says:

    “Hostess Brands Inc. said Friday it filed a motion with U.S. Bankruptcy Court to close its business and sell its assets after a strike by its workers. “Hostess Brands will move promptly to lay off most of its 18,500-member workforce and focus on selling its assets to the highest bidders,” the Irving, Texas, maker of Twinkies and Wonder Bread said. Hostess said one of its largest unions, the Bakery, Confectionery, Tobacco Workers and Grain Millers International Union, initiated a nationwide strike that “crippled the company’s ability to produce and deliver products at multiple facilities.”

    When will Reality learn that it must bend to union will? Does Reality not know that folks need a little more money in their pockets? We need to find a way to tax Reality. After all, if it weren’t for that teacher or that bridge, where would Reality be today?

    Consider yourself warned, Reality; we are coming after you just as soon as we take care of those millionaires and billionaires.

  59. Anon E. Moose says:

    Stan [55];

    My guess would have been a town adjacent to E. Rockaway, still suffering badly.

  60. x-everything says:

    Lot’s of people here have been waiting for this ball to drop…here we go

    FHA exhausts reserves

    NEW YORK (CNNMoney) — The Federal Housing Administration has exhausted its reserves, forcing it to institute another round of measures to shore up its finances.

    The government agency’s capital cushion plummeted to -$16.3 billion at the end of fiscal 2012, according to a study prepared annually by an independent actuary. FHA is scheduled to present the assessment, along with its annual report to Congress, on Friday.


  61. Fast Eddie says:

    Seriously, what are those 18,500 Hostess workers going to do now? What are the vast majority of that workforce who were union members going to do? What point were they trying to make by holding out? Now, they have no benefits, no perks, nothing. Do they realize that they’re no going to have to find alternate jobs at $10.50 per hour with no benefits?

  62. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    [55] stan – Case for JJ living on the South Shore:

    1.) Commutes from the South Shore
    JJ’s B.S says:
    October 26, 2012 at 4:35 pm

    I drove to Valley Stream Long Island and got on the train. That for awhile as far east the trains could go on the south shore. No prob.

    If that was not working would have just took sunrise or merrick down a few miles made a right and parked at Jamaica where you had all the LIRR trains and subway running. Or I could have just drove to work.

    2.) No beach bungalows on the North Shore and East Rockaway is 8 miles from parts of Long Beach that are on the ocean:
    raging bull jj says:
    July 6, 2012 at 12:17 pm

    Hey I have a mortgage question. The bungalow by beach I am bidding Quicken Loans told me I cant use it as a vacation home as it is too close to my house. I told them it was 8 miles away.

    3.) No place flat enough on the North Shore to ride jet skis in the street 1/4 mile from the beach
    JJ’s B.S says:
    October 26, 2012 at 12:23 pm

    around 1/4 mile. People were jetsking around two blocks from my house when Irene hit. I did my sidewalks and driveway around five years ago and sloped it away from house. Come Irene water went up to second step of house and stopped.

    I may have to move my BMW again to dry land. Damm thing is so low to ground I dont want salt water in engine.

    Libtard at home says:
    October 26, 2012 at 12:09 pm

    JJ…how far off the sound are you? My gut tells me the storm is gonna cross the middle of LI. Good chance your grill is going to float away.

    4.) Mentions nearby Island Park all the time, even takes his wife there for a midweek birthday dinner. He wouldn’t take Lawson unless he was coming from East Rockaway or thereabouts. Uses local slangs for Rockville Centre and his own town
    John says:
    September 18, 2008 at 3:36 pm

    It is on Lawson Blvd in Oceanside, busy road as it connects East Rock and RVC with Island Park and Long Beach. I am actually going to Jordans Lobster farm tonight as it is my wifes Bday and I am driving by so I will get the number tonight

    5.) More Island Park and how great the schools are in the area.
    John says:
    July 13, 2009 at 1:20 pm

    why the heck would a painter from LI move there? LI still has Levitown and Island Park, two blue collar communities that are rock solid with good schools and cheap homes. The guy is a painter, can’t he buy an estate sale that needs painting and paint it for nothing?

    6.) Drives by the Island Park bars enough to know when they open and how full they are.
    JJ says:
    April 30, 2012 at 11:41 am

    BTW Pops/Paddy McGees in Island Park and all the summer places opened up in last week or two and already the crowds are coming. Economy cant be that bad. I was down in Long Beach on Saturday.

  63. x-everything says:

    FHA to ask for bailout

  64. All Hype - Mr. Oil, Mr. Gas, Mr. Coal says:

    Eddie (62):
    If I had a Hostess delivery route I would be really pissed right now. Those are not union jobs, those are independent owners who just got hosed over. They had to buy into those routes and now they lost everything. The union really just screwed a whole lotta hard working people.

  65. yome says:

    Is Grover Norquist really going to let John Boehner get away with this?

    Boehner, the Republican speaker of the U.S. House, thinks he has found a way out of the corner Norquist has put him in. Norquist is the conservative gadfly and chief enforcer of the no-tax pledge, which requires all signers to swear on Ronald Reagan’s grave never — never ever — to vote for a tax increase.

    Boehner, who along with practically everyone else in his party has signed the pledge, has lately been careful to say that what he opposes is a “tax-rate increase.” But you can raise a fellow’s taxes quite a bit without touching his tax rate.

    Your tax rate is just the percentage of the last dollar you earn that goes for taxes. But your bottom-line tax bill is affected by many other things: not just deductions and exclusions (known as “loopholes” when you don’t approve of them), but also by tax brackets and rates below the top. By the end of the presidential campaign, even Republican nominee Mitt Romney was talking about phasing out deductions as incomes rise, or limiting how many dollars of deductions someone can take.

    In short, there’s more than one way to skin a fat cat. Theoretically, you can reverse-engineer a tax code raising almost any amount of money you want — and with almost any distribution of the burden you want — without touching the top tax rate. Politically, of course, it might not be so easy.

    None of this changes the fact that it’s possible to make the tax code more progressive without raising rates. Or that Boehner is begging for a deal that could be labeled tax reform, not a tax increase. Close the loopholes, enjoy the revenue, and keep the top rate steady. Or, what the heck, close some more loopholes, lower the top tax rate, and still have enough to throw at the national debt. Maybe even start a new program or two.

    On top of everything, this would even be good tax policy. Loopholes complicate the tax code and create perverse incentives in the economy.

    So why isn’t President Barack Obama seizing the deal and declaring victory before Norquist wakes up? Why is he insisting on a tax-rate increase for high-income people? That’s not a rhetorical question. We really don’t get it.

    The best we can come up with is that the president’s position is tactical, not on the merits. He might think, with some justification, that House Republicans won’t necessarily follow their speaker. And with all the tax cuts expiring in a matter of weeks, his position is only going to get stronger: If everyone’s taxes go up on Jan. 1, more than just Norquist will be unhappy.

    We don’t believe, as Obama’s critics do, that the president wants a tax increase simply to soak the rich. We believe he wants a tax increase to raise the money needed to run the government, and to do so as fairly and efficiently as possible.

    At least, we want to believe that. Norquist reiterated his humble brag this week about how he has no power to release members of Congress from their promise. “The pledge is to the American people,” he said. Which makes the task all the more urgent: Mr. President, cut a deal with Boehner before the Norquist monster fully awakes.

  66. Anon E. Moose says:

    Re: Hostess/Twinkies

    This means the unions won, right? They beat The Man into submission?

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  68. Libtard in Union says:

    Yes, the Hostess Factory was in East Brunswick (Tices Lane) if I recall correctly. It was located across the street from the Drive In and directly behind Two Guys. My mom used to go there and buy the red-striped stuff (within a day of expiration) for like a dime a snack pack and then would freeze them. Dad used to love those pies. I loved the Snowballs. The Yankee Doodles were popular too. You could walk out there with bags of diabetes for like $3.

  69. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    Political heads just gave presser. No real movement. There was a bounce but I don’t think this is gonna help the market. Both sides dug in.

  70. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [62] fast eddie,

    What does UE pay in in NJ? $600 a week, isn’t it? That’s equivalent to $15 per hour for sitting on your duff, and the post-tax equivalent is even better than working unless you make north of $20 per hour.

    If I’m a low-paid Hostess worker, I’m not too aggreived. Depending on what they do with their time, they may have bettered their situation.

  71. Fast Eddie says:


    What happens when their unemplyment payments end? You still have to make a living. How are they going to find any job with similar perks as the previous one?

  72. Libtard in Union says:

    I remember Hostess workers being on strike a lot when I was a kid. I also recall them being in an out of bankruptcy in my childhood. It’s always those pensions.

    As for Twinkees and Wonder Bread, Bimbo will probably buy it, but for much less now in the Hostess fire sale.

  73. stan says:

    Ex pat, if its a 1/4 mile off the sound, than it is laurel hollow.

    He is bidding on long beach properties. Beach bungalows. He doesn’t commute south shore. That was a story about a storm or some bs.

    He lives north shore, there is only one sound my man. North shore, probably laurel hollow, cold spring harbor school district, but for some reason I have a feeling he is in the syosset school district

  74. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [58] dope,

    I always took you for a democratic socialist, not a euro or African style socialist.

  75. Libtard in Union says:

    On JJ,

    I would agree that he must be South Shore. I started my life in Merrick and the dude is always talking about Freeport, Rock Center, Valley Stream, Long Beach. I also have relatives on the North Shore. They never frequent these same towns that JJ mentions. If they did, they dare not mention it.

  76. Libtard in Union says:

    JJ probably lives in Bethpage! LOL

  77. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [72] eddie,

    If they were that farsighted, would they be manual laborers at a hostess plant?

    Seriously, I think you know the answer to that. Business wants QE-infinity, they’ll want UE-infinity.

    I wonder how many will suddenly discover a disability?

  78. Fabius Maximus says:

    #43 3b

    I kept meanig to post pictures of that place. I love the Astronomy dome over the garage. With all the light polution around them, they will see Jack Sh1t.

  79. Fast Eddie says:

    Nom [78],

    I have to alter my way of thinking, I’m too conditioned. I keep associating “success” and “reward” with “hard work” and “achievment”.

  80. Fast Eddie says:

    A Florida restaurateur who operates roughly 40 Denny’s locations and five Hurricane Grill & Wings franchises in Florida, Virginia and Georgia intends to add a 5 percent surcharge to customers’ bills to offset costs from ObamaCare beginning in January 2014 when the Affordable Care Act is fully implemented.


  81. Fabius Maximus says:

    I could give JJ a call at work, but I’m not sure he would appreciate a call from out of the blue from someone who just knows him from a blog.

  82. Anon E. Moose says:

    JJ posted once about a Fannie Mae REO near his house that was around the corner from “Wild by Nature” organic supermarket. That is on Long Beach Road in Oceanside.

  83. Anon E. Moose says:

    Con’t [83];


    Another mystery is home path homes. I have one near my house right by a very busy street. But would make a good rental as right next to diner/wild by nature and great restaurant. When I called I was told there is a 3.5% rebate at closing if it is owner occupied and the person takes a mortgage. I then say how much for cash? Do I get a discount. Told Homepath not looking for cash buyers and no discount. Meanwhile house is sitting empty now for 10 months. Days of RTC no financing they just sold them quick. House is so cheap I could sell a few stocks and pay for it. Don’t even care much about inspection etc. Houses can’t sell quick cause of short sales and banks dragging it out.

  84. 3B Buying says:

    #81 Fast: Lots of retailers are cutting full time employees to part time so they don’t have to pay any benefits.

  85. 3B Buying says:

    #79 Fab: I have seen some ugly Mc Man’s built in some really abd locations, but this one has to be the absolute worst. Not to mention it’s is also right near the entrance to the GSP.

    So to recap, it is butt ugly, on a busy street across from a nursery, diner, and mall, and close by to the GSP

  86. Essex says:

    81. He is saving lives just by detering people from eating his crappy food. See it’s working.

  87. Brian says:

    Speaking of cutbacks…relative of mine was laid off recently….if anyone spots 401k plan administration jobs….let me know.

  88. stan says:

    Wild by nature is in huntington.

    Jj is on the north shore

  89. yome says:

    Companies cutting workers hours to avoid offering health care dont offer health care in the first place. No?

  90. Zack says:

    Does Obamacare reduce my healthcare premium that I am paying of $1000/month for entire family? If so, I don’t mind a 5% surcharge on food items. If my insurenace premiums go down, that I like Obamacare

    Fast Eddie says:

    November 16, 2012 at 12:20 pm

    A Florida restaurateur who operates roughly 40 Denny’s locations and five Hurricane Grill & Wings franchises in Florida, Virginia and Georgia intends to add a 5 percent surcharge to customers’ bills to offset costs from ObamaCare beginning in January 2014 when the Affordable Care Act is fully implemented.

  91. Libtard in Union says:

    “Companies cutting workers hours to avoid offering health care dont offer health care in the first place. No?”

    Was thinking the same thing.

  92. Someone essentially assist to make severely articles I would state. This is the very first time I frequented your website page and up to now? I amazed with the research you made to make this particular publish incredible. Fantastic activity!

  93. Fast Eddie says:


    “Companies cutting workers hours to avoid offering health care dont offer health care in the first place. No?”

    So, part time workers under 30 hours are exempt? What I mean is, does an employer have to pay the $2000 per employee/per year tax on workers under 30 hours?

  94. Libtard in Union says:

    Problem with Ocare is that it doesn’t do enough to lower insurance costs. Not without going single payer. Remember who holds the reigns here. United Healthcare, Aetna, Blue Cross, etc. What Ocare essentially did, is provide insurance to those who didn’t have it and to those with preexisting conditions. Sure there will be a bit of savings when Jesus and Lupe go to the clinic instead of the hospital for treatment, but will that be enough???

  95. yome says:

    We get our healthcare coverage from my wife’s work through Barnabas system.She contributes $67 every two weeks.We can go to any Doctor or hospital it is covered.Her contribution is going up to $93 every 2 weeks starting next year.We can only go to Doctors affiliated with Barnabas and can only go to Barnabas Hospitals except in an emergency.The same coverage we have today will cost $135 every two weeks.Almost double of what we are paying today. HEALTH CARE COST IS THE PROBLEM.There is no reason to double our contribution.

  96. Libtard in Union says:

    Fast Eddie,

    Because someone has to pay it. Would you rather we just add it to the rich guy’s tab?

    I told you the failure of Obamacare will put a Repub in the white house in 2016. Without single payer, health care costs just go up and up and up.

  97. Fast Eddie says:

    yome [96],

    Figure out how to rob the system (legally, of course) another way. I’m finding new and creative ways to get things from the local, state and fed level. It could be something as small as taking mulch from the municipal depot. One way or another, get something in the form of a pony like everyone else.

  98. Fast Eddie says:


    “Would you rather we just add it to the rich guy’s tab?”

    I don’t give a flying f*ck. As long as I don’t have to pay for it, I could care less who picks up the tab.

  99. Libtard in Union says:

    Also, Darden claims 3/4’s of their staff are already part time. Not as big of an impact as one would expect. A company that reduces hours will probably spend more dealing with employee churn. Training is expensive.

  100. Libtard in Union says:


    Most towns offer free recycling bins, leaf bags, etc. They don’t usually advertise it too much.

  101. Painhrtz - 42 says:

    Yome said hosppital bills 400 bucks for tylenol to cover administrative costs then it is not the healthcare it is the costs associated to provide it’s administration. You are going to see more concierge service doctors who operate within defined costs and an eventual shortage of primary care providers. Not just because of O care but becasue the regualtory morass of insurance companies and government intervention is frustrating them to no end.

  102. Fast Eddie says:

    As a result of rising home prices, there was a steady decline in inventory.

    Tell me what’s wrong with that statement.

  103. yome says:

    By Gini Dietrich

    I’m having a hard time with some of my fellow business leaders right now.

    Earlier this month, Heritage Hospitality CEO Matt DeRose sent an email to his 600 employees stating that if Obama won a second term, he would lay off or position most of his team for part-time employment. He stated, “Increasing expenses brought on by recent regulations, taxes, and the stagnant economy” were driving his decision.

    On Nov. 12, Papa John’s Pizza CEO John Schnatter said on a segment of “The Ed Show” on MSNBC, “Obamacare is so costly, my employees will pay the price” stating most full-time employees would only be able to work 30 hours a week so the company could avoid paying benefits or a penalty.

    He estimates Obamacare will cost the company an additional $5 million to $8 million annually.

    What’s more, Mr. Schnatter said the additional health care costs could be passed to customers, at a price of 10 to 14 cents per pizza. But an even bigger slap in the face is Papa John’s is giving away 2 million pizzas during the NFL season which, if you’re wondering, is the equivalent of $24 million to $32 million in retail price or likely half of that in cost. Regardless, giving away $12 million in pizzas is OK, apparently, but paying for your employees’ health insurance is not.

    And now the CEO of Aetna has said the same: When Obamacare takes effect, the company will find a way to cut costs by laying off employees or taking away some of their hours.

    How Much Does it Cost?

    What’s more, for organizations with fewer than 50 employees, health insurance reform doesn’t affect you.

    But, for those with more than 50 employees, beginning in 2014, you must offer health insurance to all of your team members or pay a $2,000 fine per person (excluding the first 30) and offer it to no one. That means all of your employees are without health insurance (including you!) and must go to state health plan exchanges to buy insurance.

    Say, for instance, you have 51 employees and you decided not to offer health care benefits. You exclude the first 30 and pay $2,000 per person. Your penalty is $42,000.

    I did some quick math on the benefits we provide our employees. We pay approximately $6,000 per year, per employee for health insurance. Employees pay a portion — approximately $3,000 per year.

    So, taking the same example as above, for 51 employees, we would pay $306,000 for health insurance benefits.

    If we decided not to offer health insurance, we would save $264,000.

    And, for our employees to get state-issued health insurance, unless they make more than $150,000, they will pay less than they do now.

    Morale Killer

    But the bigger issue I’m having is how this behavior has likely affected morale at these companies.

    First of all, Obamacare doesn’t take effect until 2014. Yes, more than one year from now. The first open enrollment doesn’t begin until September 2013.

    All these business leaders are doing is scaring their employees about whether or not they’re going to have a job. They’re killing morale. They’re creating a hostile work environment.

    It will be a full year of people wondering whether or not they have jobs. Not to mention what it could do to the economy and our unemployment rate.

    How motivated would you be to go to work if you knew you might have to cut your hours and go without benefits, or worse, lose your job entirely?

    I wonder what Jim Collins, Jack Welch or Ken Blanchard would say about that?

    Read more: http://www.chicagobusiness.com/article/20121116/BLOGS06/121119860/anti-obamacare-ceos-when-job-creators-become-morale-killers#ixzz2CPe8zHKX
    Stay on top of Chicago business with our free daily e-newsletters

  104. The Original NJ ExPat says:

    [83] & [84] Good catch Moose. Wild by Nature, the diner is Mitchell’s, and the restaurant is Mio Posto, all along 300 feet of Long Beach Road in Oceanside.

  105. 3B Buying says:

    #90 Yome: Don’t know, just what I am being told by people I know in retail. They are cutting hourly full time store employees to part time, then hiring part time employees to make up the hours.

  106. NJGator says:

    The homebirthing mom without power from the Montklair Watercooler now has a name…


  107. Anon E. Moose says:

    Eddie [99];

    I don’t give a flying f*ck. As long as I don’t have to pay for it, I could care less who picks up the tab.

    And now, my young apprentice, your conversion to the dark side is complete…

  108. Peace, Love, Dope says:

    “when Jesus and Lupe go to the clinic ”

    what about when Mike, John, Pete or Tim go to the clinic?

  109. Anon E. Moose says:

    Stan [89];

    Jj is on the north shore

    That’s probably where his wife wanted JJ to buy her a trophy house, but with all of JJ’s talk about $8k in taxes and low key, blue collar neighborhood and lifestyle, I’m betting on O’side.

    In all seriousness, I kind of miss the guy. Wish he could just get to a library or something to say he’s OK.

  110. yome says:

    I second that

    “In all seriousness, I kind of miss the guy. Wish he could just get to a library or something to say he’s OK.”

  111. Painhrtz - 42 says:

    So gator what was the future subject of psychoanalysis mom’s name?

  112. Painhrtz - 42 says:

    yep she looks exactly how I expected her too. wonder if she stinks of patchouli?

  113. Anon E. Moose says:

    yo [104];

    Regardless, giving away $12 million in pizzas is OK, apparently, but paying for your employees’ health insurance is not.

    Written by a true ivory-tower socialist. Was “Gini” wearing her red beret and “Che” T-shirt as she pounded that one out on the keyboard?

    The ‘free’ pizzas are a promotional expense. The promotion campaign would be a miserable failure if it did not net 5-10x that amount in increased revenues.

    What’s the corresponding return on investment buying your pizza-delivery kid a Obamacare cadillac health insurance plan to pay for his birth control, his abortions, and his sex reassignment surgery?

    And now the CEO of Aetna has said the same: When Obamacare takes effect, the company will find a way to cut costs by laying off employees or taking away some of their hours.

    That is a health insurer talking. They have a significant adantage in that they could provide their employees coverage at “cost of Goods” without any profit margin markup. That they are doing it should be a screaming red flag.

    My prediction – identity fraud will proliferate. You will be shocked at the numer of family memebers living at the same address who will work for the same employer. Joe can’t work more than 29 hours a week, but Joe and his twin brother Jim can bang out 58. People will find a way to ignore stupid laws.

  114. chicagofinance says:

    A person so hopelessly lost in the weeds that they actually are foolish enough to expose themselves…..utterly tone deaf…..

    NJGator says:
    November 16, 2012 at 2:06 pm
    The homebirthing mom without power from the Montklair Watercooler now has a name…

  115. Peace, Love, Dope says:

    “A person so hopelessly lost in the weeds that they actually are foolish enough to expose themselves…..utterly tone deaf…..”

    does this refer to the author of 115?

  116. Fast Eddie says:

    Moose [108],

    Amen. Let someone else tow the line. I’m lining up at the trough, munching out and then suck1ng some t1t to wash it down. Let the new age Obamanation neophytes figure out how to pay for it all.

  117. yome says:

    #114 Moose

    If the article is accurate,what the author is saying,common sense tells you,if you offer health care to your employees,it is cheaper to pay the $2000 penalty above the 30 employees than paying $6000 per employee in coverage. What she is saying is, what are this companies complaining about?

    I believe the companies that are complaining are the ones dont offer coverage in the first place. Come 2014 they either have to hire part time only or pay the penalty.

    I believe this is where it is going.Everybody will be in a state pool and employer will be paying the penalty.It makes more business sense for them

  118. Libtard in Union says:

    “what about when Mike, John, Pete or Tim go to the clinic?”

    Yeah, the poor white kids get to go to.

  119. Comrade Nom Deplume Just Back from Newark says:

    Apparently, store shelves are clearing out of twinkies, ding-dongs, etc.

    I think I know what is coming.


  120. Fast Eddie says:

    “Everybody will be in a state pool…”

    The United Soviet States of America. Gives you a chill up the leg, doesn’t it?

  121. stan says:

    110- moose

    Agreed about jj, he brings a lot to the table, both in humor and insights.

    I’ll have to look for it,in but he confirmed he was the area I referenced. I’ll look for it. I grew up near there, he isn’t on the south shore .

    Also, wild by nature, and diners galore in huntington

  122. yome says:

    America’s biggest retailer may be in for an unexpectedly painful holiday season. Protesting low wages, spiking health care premiums, and alleged retaliation from management, Wal-Mart Stores (WMT) workers have started to walk off the job this week. First, on Wednesday, about a dozen workers in Wal-Mart’s distribution warehouses in Southern California walked out, followed the next day by 30 more from six stores in the Seattle area.


  123. Anon E. Moose says:

    yo [118];

    What she is saying is, what are this companies complaining about?

    Well, first of all the fact that she thinks marketing spending is equivalent with labor expense spending indicates a gross lack of business acumen.

    The companies that are paying more than that on health care may get a ‘discount’ by dropping coverage in favor of paying the penalty, but these companies know that doing so will earn the emnity of their entire staff for doing so. They also know that the price to avoid such a mutiny (by continuing to purchase coverage) will be going up, both because the Obamacare minimum coverage mandates will make coverage more expensive today, and it will drive prices even higher going forward (just like it did in 2011 and 2012).

    But the business really complaining are those that have built their business model around getting the job done with low cost, low skill labor. The cost of that labor is going up under Obamacare, and the ways to avoid it hurt the workers themselves — cutting staff or cutting hours.

    The businessees that get under my skin are the ones like Target, who supported Obamacare. They did so because WalMart was beating them — able to get by with lower labor costs — either through low cost coverage or no coverage. So Target was in favor of Obamacare because it sandbagged the competition who was beating them. Classic rent-seeking.

  124. Comrade Nom Deplume Just Back from Newark says:

    And we won’t be able to do this anymore.


    The final line makes it for me. It occurs to me often when reading some things here or on FB.

  125. Theo says:

    That’s funny, that why I like companies like Target. My mother in law works the minimum hours at Target to get benefits. While the medical is not as good as my coverage, it covered her two montnh hospital stay last year when she had a pulmonary embolism.

  126. Comrade Nom Deplume Just Back from Newark says:

    [125] moose,

    One thing in their favor however is that rising labor costs (and that is what this is, another input of labor costs) creates a barrier to entry. Thus, anyone trying to compete on the same model has to match their costs and economies of scale or die.

    The only real way to keep those costs down is to lower the percentage of eligible employees. That may be easier to do if unemployment remains persistently high (in real terms, not U3 fantasy) because you can have an army of part-timers and the lack of other options would make turnover less likely. If Nevada has something on the order of 18% U6 unemployment, putting a facility there would mean plenty of surplus labor and better retention.

    There are downsides, however, as this story on a Mercer report shows.

    “Employers planning to change their workplace strategy so that fewer employees are eligible must keep in mind that employee performance and productivity can be affected by moving workers from full-time to part-time status, said John Derse, senior partner at Mercer.

    Stefan Gaertner, principal at Mercer, said he and Derse studied the productivity loss of a company that reduced its full-time staff and found that although it “saved” $5 million in compensation and benefits by increasing part-time employment, it lost $30 million in productivity. According to Gaertner, “This is a cautionary tale.”

  127. Comrade Nom Deplume Just Back from Newark says:

    Just for discussion, here is what Mercer found with respect to the part time issue:

    “. . . Mercer asked employers that do not currently offer coverage to employees working 30 or more hours a week about their likely response to PPACA’s requirements.

    51% said they plan to change their workplace strategy so that fewer employees work 30 or more hours a week;
    27% said they plan to offer a lower-cost plan for newly eligible hourly employees;
    24% said they plan to make all employees eligible for the full-time employee plans;
    17% said they will offer the full-time employee plans to some, but not all, newly eligible employees;
    8% said they will pay the shared responsibility penalty; and
    only 3% said they will terminate medical coverage for all employees after the insurance exchanges become available.”


    As with tax planning, so very much depends on the individual, or in this case, the business. What works for one employer won’t work for another.

  128. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [109] dope

    Did Matthew, Mark, Luke, and John go to the clinic?

  129. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [118] yome,

    If everyone is in the state pool, you have de facto single payer. That makes the entire medical complex a government contractor. While it will lead to two-tier medicine, it would not result in acute shortages however,

    But if we have a three-tier world with concierge, private insurance, and state pool, any guess as to which group will have to wait for appointments and procedures, and have a limited supply of less experienced docs available to it?

  130. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    Not the exact same topic but the same analysis applies to health care.


  131. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [17] dope,

    The union apparently doesn’t agree with you. It’s the greedy bankers fault.


  132. McDullard says:

    Stu and others…

    What is a good place to start shopping for health insurance? I am paying a little bit under $1900/mo for COBRA coverage for family.


  133. Happy Renter says:

    [125] “But the business really complaining are those that have built their business model around getting the job done with low cost, low skill labor. The cost of that labor is going up under Obamacare, and the ways to avoid it hurt the workers themselves — cutting staff or cutting hours.”

    And include jacking up prices too (which will also hurt the low-paid labor). And should go down nicely with the dollar devaluation already in-progress.

    Good times, straight ahead.

  134. McDullard says:

    Seems like there may be something more to the narrative than “selfish meanie unionized employees voted to lose jobs and pensions in a bad economy…”

    “While the company was demanding major concessions from union workers (wage and benefit cuts amounting to 27- 32% overall), the top ten executives of the company rewarded themselves with compensation increases, with one executive receiving a 300 percent increase.”

    I think most of us can agree that a reasonable model is somewhere between the DMV and FoxConn.

  135. chicagofinance says:

    If no one in your family has a chronic illness or consistent need for a doctor, then consider a HDHP, and limp along until you find an opportunity for group coverage.

    McDullard says:
    November 16, 2012 at 4:49 pm
    Stu and others…
    What is a good place to start shopping for health insurance? I am paying a little bit under $1900/mo for COBRA coverage for family.

  136. chicagofinance says:

    DE or NJ?

    Comrade Nom Deplume Just Back from Newark

  137. yome says:


    For some American workers, picking the right health insurance is becoming more like hunting for the perfect business suit: It takes some shopping around to find a good fit and avoid sticker shock.

    In a major shift in employer-sponsored health insurance coverage, companies such as Sears Holdings Corp. and Darden Restaurants Inc. are giving employees a fixed amount of money and allowing them to choose their own coverage based on their individual needs.

    The approach, called defined contribution health insurance, contrasts to the decades-old practice by most U.S. employers of offering workers a one-size-fits-all plan with benefits they may not want. It also means American workers who have grown accustomed to having their benefits chosen for them could wind up with bigger bills and inadequate coverage if they don’t choose wisely.


  138. McDullard says:

    Chifi, thanks…

    What would be the risks with HDHPs? Infant in the house and one prescription [self, ADHD, probably optional], will max out the deduction. What is a price range I should look at for $4k deductible? I am seeing stuff around 1200 or so… I may move to a full time position if things go well, so should be prepared to write the deductible off?

  139. Libtard at home says:

    Can’t help you all with the insurance thing. After college and before I landed my first job with health insurance, I used to take a 1 credit college course (phys ed) to maintain the $100 per year campus clinic access. They changed the rules shortly after to where you needed 9 credits. The gig was good while it lasted. Haven’t been unemployed a day since. Actually, I haven’t been unemployed since I was about 7 years old.

  140. NJGator says:

    Toms River repair bill: $35 million

    TOMS RIVER — The township might have lost 20 percent of it property tax base when superstorm Sandy tore through its beachfront resort enclaves, and a $35-million bond issue approved by the Township Council on Friday is just a first step toward repairs, Mayor Thomas F. Kelaher said.

    Of 2,500 houses in Ortley Beach, less than 60 are thought to have escaped damage, according to a map prepared by engineers. Virtually all 7,000 houses on the Barnegat peninsula suffered some degree of flood damage and the Ortley beachfront was destroyed, said township Engineer Robert Chankalian.

    “One of the saddest things I’ve seen is people who brought a suitcase…and when they come back here the suitcase is still empty, because their house is gone,” Kelaher said today at a news conference in the Fischer Boulevard parking lot where school buses shuttle homeowners out to look at their properties.


  141. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [139] chi

    NJ. I was surprised to see not a lot of damage, but even in western NJ, gas prices are higher than in PA.

    Also learned that two trees from my old backyard went down, taking out the neighbors fence. These are huge trees so the fact that they didn’t land on anyone’s house is fortuitous.

  142. scribe says:

    I’m impressed that so many people remember so much detail about JJ’s posts. I just remember the more — mmmm — colorful anecdotes.

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