Sorry New York

From Fox News:

Wall Street’s hybrid work model likely to squeeze New York’s budget

Wall Street’s hybrid work week is here to stay and the economic implications on New York City and New York State’s budgets could prove to be devastating.

Some of Wall Street’s top financial firms are preparing for the implementation of a more permanent hybrid work week in the post-COVID era, where many employees can spend a couple of days working from home depending on the job, FOX Business has learned.

The rollout comes as New York City Mayor Adams calls for workers to get back to the office immediately because continued remote work is ultimately taking much-needed business away from the city.

But with remote work now fully embraced by the big banks, tax revenues in the city could fall dramatically; for the foreseeable future well paid brokers, bankers and salesmen will spend more time — and their disposable income — where they live in New Jersey, Connecticut and Westchester County, budget analysts concede.

If employees are only coming in a couple of days a week, renting a big office space in Manhattan doesn’t make much sense. In fact, investment management firm State Street recently announced it plans to close its two New York offices in order to transition to a hybrid work model.

“When you’re collecting a total of $5 billion a year in taxes from NJ and CT residents, losing even a small percentage to firms following State Street’s lead could ding (city and state budgets) by a few hundred million dollars,” said E.J. McMahon, Adjunct Fellow at the Manhattan Institute.

Morgan Stanley is taking a much softer approach than it did last summer when CEO James Gorman demanded New York employees get back to the office if they wanted to continue getting paid a New York salary.

JPMorgan is also preparing for more of its bankers to engage in a hybrid workweek as the summer approaches. An internal memo sent out last Friday said many JPMorgan employees were back in the office but did not specify whether that was on a full-time basis.

Wells Fargo says it’s encouraging employees to return to the office in mid-March and American Express will start inviting employees back to its Manhattan office March 1st under a hybrid work-from-home model.

This entry was posted in Demographics, Economics, Employment, New Jersey Real Estate. Bookmark the permalink.

82 Responses to Sorry New York

  1. Hold my beer says:


  2. leftwing says:

    LOL. I can state with a high level of confidence that as part of a [regular] perpetual audit of a certain WS firm the controlling jurisdiction used its audit powers to review entry ID activity of individuals at the Manhattan headquarters which had certain senior MDs from one of the wealthiest enclaves in the US jumping corporate entry turnstiles like low end subway fare evaders…

  3. leftwing says:

    Lib, when do I short oil?

    Need a one handle, I suppose…?

    Or do I tie it to a specific event, eg. should troops marching toward Kyiv?

  4. grim says:

    Could come up with multiple scenarios where Adams’ actions would trigger firms to leave NYC. Tax man wants his taxes.

  5. leftwing says:

    No One, possibly by you. Have a lot of friends down that way, including one I would hook you up with if I didn’t believe it would be like crossing beams in Ghostbusters….with all the macro dislocations no reason to jump into anything too quickly plus I want to be sensitive to a couple bigger family issues and make an intelligent decision…but I will be out of NJ shortly, taking the summer at a family summer house and have been working diligently to see where I want to land longer term thereafter…given my personal profile I have a wide degree of flexibility which can actually make a decision more difficult, not easier, lol…fairly certain in any case it will be south of the 37th parallel and near water….was looking at the popular town a couple hours south of you recently, will be there again shortly, not sure it’s my cup of tea…we’ll see…..been busy, lol.

  6. phoenix says:

    Police from the “nicer” country:

    appear to show several officers delighting in the brutality via a RCMP group chat. One message refers specifically to an incident in which a woman, who appeared to be using a mobility scooter (left), was trampled by mounted police in Ottawa, Ontario on Friday (right). ‘Just watched the horse video – that is awesome,’ the chat member allegedly wrote. ‘We should practice that manoeuvre.’ Meanwhile, one group participant wrote: ‘Time for the protesters to hear our jackboots on the ground,’ while another said: ‘Don’t kick all of them out until next weeks group gets our turn.

  7. The Great Pumpkin says:

    You have to wait till the ball is in the owners court, and not the workers. Why does everyone ignore this? At the end of the day, what is a more competitive advantage: a team working in a centralized location in person, or a team working some random schedule that is all over the place and half of the time not in person? I know who wins out when the labor market returns to normal.

    Just blows my mind that no one realizes that this is what the worker wants and not what the owner wants. The only reason the worker is getting what they want is because of the warped labor market we are in right now where the worker calls the shots.

    “As of now, most of the Street’s big banks including JPMorgan and Morgan Stanley are recommending employees return to the office, but do not have a strict back-to-work mandate in place, and officials concede many people will continue to work from home a couple of days a week.”

  8. 3b says:

    Pumps: You said this has no impact on your household, and yet here you are raging against WFH. Your hostility contradicts your statement that WFH has no impact on you.

    Also, you make some broad statements in your post that are based on nothing but your opinion which in turn is based on your hostility to WFH/ hybrid.

    There is no going back to the old days of most people in the office 5 days a week. I have been telling you that for months now.

  9. Libturd says:

    Oil is really not my thing Leftwing. I made some good dough hedging my PSE&G bill against NG prices, but that was when it was a dead obvious call with NG shooting up over $10 and reserves in bad shape due to an extraordinarily cold Spring followed by a record cold December.

    With oil, there are an awful lot of macro variables that I can think of right out of my head.

    Besides the obvious (Ukraine and Dem lead halt in fracking), there is still a lot of pent-up travel demand from the Pandemic. If it’s $93 now and the economy isn’t completely back on track yet, there is still upward pressure on pricing. Also, the car shortage is not helping things much either.

    If you were looking for an exact time, I would say the moment the coming recession is a sure thing. I’m fairly certain banks are going to struggle without the FED backing. I think this will increase borrowing costs quicker than most people realize. I also think this inflation, (mainly food, housing, auto) is going to cause a drop in personal spending. Not sure how it could not. Especially now that people can’t refinance their credit card debt with their homes anymore. So look for the slow down in discretionary spending through the Manufacturing PMI numbers which is already trending down significantly. Consumer confidence below maybe 98.5 too would be a sure sign. We are well on our way.

  10. The Great Pumpkin says:


    Answer the question, who wants hybrid? Workers or owners?

    Why even have hybrid if remote is the future? Why are they trying to meet the worker halfway in a labor market controlled by the worker at the moment?

    You don’t have to agree with my points, but acknowledge that I make some good points. Again, if you owned your own business, do you want a model that makes your business more complicated and less efficient? Maybe owners do really care about their workers wants and needs over their own business’s needs, but highly doubt it. Maybe I’m wrong, I’m trying to look at it with logic.

  11. phoenix says:

    Oil prices won’t affect you as much.

    Electric car, the same.

    Poor sucker driving to work, gonna pay more.

    Putin’s moves will affect the poor in America much more than the wealthy.

    More homeless in America’s future. Better get a plow to push them all to Tacoma. Or a front end loader and a few thousand tandems.

  12. Phoenix says:

    Every day we get closer to the Coffin Corner.

  13. The Great Pumpkin says:

    There it is…already complaining. They want that remote. Too bad it will be hard for the business to survive on that model and the owners know it.

    “-More than 80% of human resources executives say that hybrid is proving to be exhausting for employees, according to a TinyPulse survey report.

    -Workers said hybrid is more emotionally draining than fully remote and more taxing than full-time, office-based work.

    -Companies can help ease the stress by not dictating a hybrid schedule, but rather let employees and managers work it out together.”

  14. Fast Eddie says:

    Besides all the domestic and foreign issues going on, perhaps the biggest surprise is Canada doing its best North K0rea impersonation. Who woulda thunk it?

  15. phoenix says:

    No one cares about the workers, don’t you get it?

    You are just a commodity to be bought ,traded, and sold.

    Once you comprehend and accept that as fact, all will go smoother.

    Your “FREEdumb” loving country is not controlled by your voting, it’s controlled by corporations, the wealthy, and hedge funds. The Men in Blue are the Enforcers that don’t work for you either.

    Grab your ankles, take a deep breath, you are going to feel some pressure now…..

  16. 3b says:

    Question: My Mother in laws house is in an irrevocable trust, the house is being sold and the proceeds invested. Will there be capital gains tax on the proceeds after the sale of the house or when the trust is dissolved?

  17. Fast Eddie says:

    “Vladimir Putin doesn’t want me to be President. He doesn’t want me to be our nominee. If you’re wondering why — it’s because I’m the only person in this field who’s ever gone toe-to-toe with him.”

    – Joe O’Biden

  18. Libturd says:

    That seems like a positive quote for Biden. You switch hitting Gary?

    By the way, have you all been following the Credit Suisse bank account owner leak? If you thought those secretive Swiss bank accounts were for tax evasion, think again. They are mostly held by those who participate in illegal criminal activity. Like sex traffickers, war criminals, etc. 90% of these accounts belonged to proven criminals. Though there were a number of politicians in there too, if you were wondering. They are criminals too, but as we all know already, will never be found guilty.

  19. Libturd says:

    $100 billion in 30,000 accounts.

  20. 3b says:

    Got my answer on the trust.

  21. Chicago says:

    Depends on the type of trust. Is your MIL alive? Is the trust designed so she can give the property away to others? Also, it is possible the basis is the FMV at the time the house was placed in the trust.

    However, it is very likely the answer is yes the transaction is subject to capital gains, for possible the entire taxable amount without exemptions, and worse, at the special tax table for trusts.

    Remember, the working assumption is the trusts are used by rich people, so they jump brackets on the first dollar of income.

    3b says:
    February 22, 2022 at 10:13 am
    Question: My Mother in laws house is in an irrevocable trust, the house is being sold and the proceeds invested. Will there be capital gains tax on the proceeds after the sale of the house or when the trust is dissolved?

  22. 3b says:

    Chgo: It is an irrevocable trust, Medicaid protected. The income generated from the trust will go to assist in caring for my MIL, who is in a memory care facility.

  23. leftwing says:

    “That seems like a positive quote for Biden. You switch hitting Gary?”

    Yeah, I think that was sarcasm…my biggest question wasn’t the [rhetorically] whether Gary has switched jerseys but more whether I should bust a gut laughing or not given the ridiculousness of the statement…

    If it was his senility speaking I would feel guilty, no reason to pick on feeble old man…if he were serious, well, it’s hilarious, the guy just lives in a world with a different color sky…..

    Because, you know, right now Putin is trembling in his boots. Because of Joe Biden. LOL.

  24. Fast Eddie says:

    That seems like a positive quote for Biden.

    Fruit salad Joe is gonna beat up Vlad like he did Corn Pop!

  25. Fast Eddie says:

    Per MSNBC:

    Why didn’t the Russian leader deploy troops into Ukraine during Trump’s term? Perhaps because Putin was so pleased with an American president who pursued goals in line with Moscow’s agenda.

    How’s that for some brilliant analysis and conclusion!

  26. Phoenix says:

    TULSI GABBARD: This is embarrassing. It’s hard to keep track of all of those jumbles of words. It’s clear she [Kamala Harris] was sent there to be the voice of the United States as a purely political calculation. She has no foreign policy background or understanding. She has no concept of the cost of war nor does she have the temperament necessary to be the voice of the United States on the global stage. It’s embarrassing to see this play out. She talked about deterrence and sanctions. How do you deter someone by punishing them before they do it? It’s simple. This is grade school understanding. If you say I’m going to punish you before you do something, wouldn’t a kid say, “Fine, I might as well as do it anyway.” This is not rocket science, Second, talking about incurring costs. Kamala Harris and Joe Biden have said we are going to incur a cost. They won’t pay the price. They are multi-millionaires. The power elite will not be negatively impacted. Who will pay the price? It’s hard-working Americans across the country and people around the world who are already paying the price and will continue to see things worsen.P

  27. leftwing says:

    “Fruit salad Joe is gonna beat up Vlad like he did Corn Pop!”

    He’s a dog faced pony soldier! I want a pushup contest!

  28. 3b says:

    Phoenix: I could have done a better job than Harris. Perhaps I should not be , but I am astounded that she is absolutely clueless in general, all around. You would think as an attorney and former state attorney she would at least be able to speak well and sound coherent. It’s embarrassing first Trump, no old Joe and clueless Kamala.

  29. Mike S says:

    The problem with hybrid is alternating between waking up at 5:30 when you need to go to work or 7 when you can work at home, I can never fall asleep early enough for the 5:30, and the 12 hour days (inc commute) just suck the life out of me now. I think I could like hybrid a lot more if it was once a week vs many days, or a set of days on a given month etc. I still have to live ‘close enough’ to commute but can’t really move further away either.

  30. Libturd says:


    We had this conversation at work last week (I still go in once or twice a month). Some people wanted the two days out three days in and switch with their other teammates who would be three days out and two days in. The problem with this arrangement is you’ll never find childcare coverage that will be this flexible. So the one month in and one month out was floated. This was too met with lukewarm reception as it would be such a major lifestyle change to adjust to each month. So we looked at 3 months on, then three months off. The problem here becomes seasonal. Some people want to work from home the entire Summer. So I suggested splitting the Summer in two. May 15th to July 15th and then July 16th to September 15. Boom. That was the solution agreed to by most. It actually works quite well with the holidays too. Though, at some point, you want the opposite team getting the opposite holidays for fairness. So eventually, one team works 6 months straight in the office.

    Truth is, I think the future involves rotating Thursdays and Fridays and leaving it at that. Others will get Mondays and Tuesdays. Those with daycare issues will just take an occasional day off to work from home. Plus any bad weather days or around holidays will be across the board WFH days. This is how I see it eventually transitioning.

  31. 3b says:

    Lib: I agree. I would add for many I think hybrid may be a transition to full WFH, with a small amount of office space kept for use on occasion. NYC and other large cities need to adjust accordingly in my view.

  32. Libturd says:

    I know what Pumps is saying about bosses having a weak hand right now. But what he always chooses to ignore is the increase in productivity that has occurred in MOST businesses since the WFH transition took place. It’s not just my place of business. I speak with my friends who are ALL currently work from home and none of their companies suffered. Most actually improved. We’ve listed the reasons a million times, but someone who does not ride a train to work nor ever has to come in really early or stay really late would get it. A happy worker is a productive worker. A school teacher is focused on punching the clock. So no perspective is really possible.

  33. The Great Pumpkin says:

    If you guys really use critical thinking skills, show me a business that actually wants hybrid or WFH. They don’t. They are only doing this because of the current labor market. The minute we hit a recession and this tight labor market that has not existed in the past 100 years begins to loosen, you will see all this talk about what the employee wants get tossed in the garbage can.

    The only reason they are focused on the needs of the employees and trying to make them happy by letting them WFH are because they can’t replace them. That will change and so will listening to the demands of employees. I would bet hard on it. Remember human nature and how it works. Business owners are ruthless. Remember that. It’s just right now, they can’t be ruthless, they are at the mercy of the tight labor market.

  34. The Great Pumpkin says:

    First, their competition is in the same boat. They aren’t competing against in person businesses right now. Second, they had the govt throw how much money at businesses and the economy. How do we know that businesses wouldn’t be even more productive in person in this type of economic environment? How much of the production gains is due to tech innovation as opposed to human produced production?

    “MOST businesses since the WFH transition took place. It’s not just my place of business. I speak with my friends who are ALL currently work from home and none of their companies suffered. Most actually improved.”

  35. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Again, how long before they take it for granted and become sad again. Will try to find it, but WSJ did an article on this last week. About how the workers at home are becoming depressed and what not. When it’s all shiny and new, yea, the workers will prob going above and beyond to try and prove that WFH works. Problem is, they will stop doing this, or already have, when they start to take it for granted. How do you motivate a worker working from home to work harder? How? What are you going to constantly call them on zoom to motivate them? I just don’t see how this works long-term.

    “We’ve listed the reasons a million times, but someone who does not ride a train to work nor ever has to come in really early or stay really late would get it. A happy worker is a productive worker. A school teacher is focused on punching the clock. So no perspective is really possible.”

  36. 3b says:

    Pumps: Please give it a rest, you are a teacher , it does not impact you. You also said it does not impact your household. Your words don’t match up with your hostility and dismal of WFH/ hybrid. Those of us who are WFH/ hybrid would like to have an occasional discussion on the topic, ( specifically today as Grim posted an article on it) without you throwing a temper tantrum. If you claim the topic has no impact on you, then just scroll by the posts.

  37. The Great Pumpkin says:

    I bring up serious points that have nothing to do with myself, but questioning the trend. Why can’t I do that, 3B? What’s the big deal? Why don’t you address the issues I bring up?

  38. 3b says:

    Lib: Bosses did in the beginning have a weaker hand , but it’s changing now as many see it it works, and Bosses especially boomers say like Dimon and Gorman don’t like change and the perceived lack of control. That I believe is changing. And, they too see the impact on the bottom line of dumping or down sizing office space and all the ancillary costs that go with it. The genie is out of the bottle, there is no going back for most to the old 5 days in the office routine. The boomers in the top positions will be gone at some point and with them a large part of the opposition to WFH/ hybrid.

  39. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Here is the article. Creating a sad generation of screen watchers. What did expat use to call these people that looked at a screen all day out of touch with the world around them?

    “Shannon Chin went from working and learning remotely in college to working two jobs remotely while staying with family in the Toronto area. She didn’t meet her colleagues face to face at one of those jobs, in user experience, until December—nearly a year and a half after signing on. In fact, she hadn’t seen their faces at all.

    “We had had cameras off for meetings, so I didn’t even know what they looked like,” the 22-year-old says.

    As for her colleagues at her other job, in social media: “I’ve never met anyone before. Not a single person,” she says.

    A growing cohort of young employees have never worked from an office. They graduated during the pandemic or landed jobs just as offices began to shut down. And many of them—especially Generation Z—imagine they may never work in an office, as remote work becomes the default for many businesses.

    In general, they are OK with that: Many of them like being remote and want to be able to work that way. But there are drawbacks. Surveys show that young remote workers also feel unmoored and anxious. And researchers argue that the young workers may harm their personal and professional lives in the future by missing office work and the traditional experiences that prior generations took for granted: learning from older colleagues, schmoozing with bosses, settling into the rhythms of an office workday—or even just being face to face with others. It is new territory, and the experience is likely to shape these workers in lasting ways.”

  40. The Great Pumpkin says:

    How can you have a company where people have never even met each other? How can this survive long-term?

  41. 3b says:

    Pumps: I have addressed those issues with you countless times and you with a complete lack of self awareness tell me I am wrong and you with zero experience are right. I am
    Just not going to waste the time and effort yet again with you to have a rational discussion on the topic because of your innate hostility to WFH/ hybrid for reasons only know to you , or at least that’s what we are supposed to believe as you have repeatedly told me my suspicion on your hostility are incorrect.

  42. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Fair enough, 3b. Just ignore my posts if you don’t want to address them. I think I bring up valid points, but you don’t even give it the time of day. It’s all personal attacks; you are a teacher and know nothing about this. Okay then. We will see what happens when the labor market is no longer so tight. Maybe it stays, but I’m betting on human nature, business owners being cut throat and taking every advantage they can in the spirit of competition.

    Just one question if you can answer. If you are so for workers, why do you hate unions?

  43. chicagofinance says:

    The End Is Nigh (leftwing & stu Edition):

  44. chicagofinance says:

    Why was the house placed in the trust before it was sold, or was the FMV basis on placement used for the sale? Or you could have used a different type of trust….. I hope the $$$ involved are negligible regardless. Best wishes for your MIL.

    3b says:
    February 22, 2022 at 11:23 am
    Chgo: It is an irrevocable trust, Medicaid protected. The income generated from the trust will go to assist in caring for my MIL, who is in a memory care facility.

  45. Fast Eddie says:

    If you’re China, are you looking towards Taiwan right now?

  46. Fast Eddie says:

    Are the Russians vaccinated and wearing their face diapers during the invasion?

  47. chicagofinance says:

    I said this last week.

    Fast Eddie says:
    February 22, 2022 at 2:20 pm
    If you’re China, are you looking towards Taiwan right now?

  48. chicagofinance says:

    At least ARKK didn’t hit a fresh 52 week low today….

  49. 3b says:

    Chgo: It was placed in the trust for two reasons, the 5 year look back
    And concern one family was divorcing and the soon to be ex spouse would make a claim on the house;( the divorce is being finalized now ) This was done over 5 years ago. Medicare can’t touch the house but it’s required that the house be either rented at fair market value and the monies after taxes/ maintenance be used to go towards my MIL s care, or the house be sold and the investment income be used to go towards her care. She has other monies and a long term care plan that’s good for 3 years.

    She went into assisted living in December, and now the house has to be sold etc. My MIL is doing well there and is happy, so it’s a relief to my wife. Hoping to have house on the market by April 1.

  50. The Great Pumpkin says:

    This market is insane right now. Destroying traders. Wild swings.

  51. Libturd says:

    Chi: Been discussing that ref punch for a couple of days now. Kid was definitely a POS. You could tell when he turned into the linesman rather than away from him after being checked. Not surprised he threw a punch.

    He probably played his last game of organized hockey. Even if another league accepts him, he’ll be marked by the refs making it impossible for him to get a fair shake going forwards.

  52. 3b says:

    Pumps: As I said I have addressed your points numerous times before, and it’s the same thing over and over for months and it’s always the same. I never said the fact you were a teacher in and of itself means you don’t know. I said as a teacher you simply don’t have any experience to draw from, in commenting on why it does or does not work . But, like a spoiled child you lash out and double down and accuse me of hating unions and all the rest. It’s always the same with you.

  53. leftwing says:

    chi, thanks on that one. Way too many players spurred on by way too many adults thinking their player is going to the NHL and don’t have the emotional maturity to deal with the slightest issue…

    3b/lib…can’t believe I’m diving into this wfh conversation….IMO generalities are difficult as jobs, duties, professions all vary….broadest first cut I would suggest for analysis is cost center (support) vs. revenue generation.

    I can’t see any reason for cost centers to be in the office. Legal, HR, finance, etc are all functions that are well defined and internal facing. I don’t need to see in-house counsel to get legal signoff on a commitment letter. Actually, as I think about it, I can’t recall ever really sitting down face-to-face with in-house counsel while they were in the building over literally hundreds 0f times I’ve used them. Don’t need to be in the room together. Ditto HR, financial reporting functions, etc.

    Revenue generation roles are trickier. From a purely individual perspective many senior revenue generators don’t need to be in the office and for the most part aren’t…senior salespeople at many organizations never have had a permanent desk. For me, a dividing line is the type of company – services v. product, and then further how differentiated each service/product is and how important knowledge transfer – training and culture – is for the firm…..

    In the case of a product, of significant size, entrenched in the client, in a concentrated industry, with a long replacement cycle, and nominal support needed on the sale from others in the firm…yeah, WFH. Good example might be CT systems. Siemens isn’t going to lose Northwell as an account because the sales guy is calling from his home office. Nor will it impact Siemens in the future if that senior employee is not available to others in Siemens face-to-face daily, if at all.

    Contrast that with an M&A banker or securities lawyer…I would argue nearly every measure is opposite. As a service the exact person – not the machine – matters, client switching costs are low, the number of ‘sales’ each cycle by that person is high, each ‘sale’ is unique to the specific client, significant and senior support from others in the company is required, and for firm continuity collaboration laterally and down is key.

    It really is case-by-case for me with the total acknowledgement that many roles do not – and never real needed to be – in the office full time, if at all.

  54. Libturd says:

    I’ve always been on a performance plan.
    20 years of WFO = 2% or less raises since 2003.
    1 year of WFH = 2% raise and first bonus ever (a good one too).
    2 year of WFH = 3% raise and another bonus (a good one, but not as good as year one since the bar was moved to impossible and yet we still achieved it).

    Pumps. Please just shut the fukc up already.

    My company is not paying bonuses to get us to return to the office.

    Please just stop. You are talking about something you are 100% clueless about. Like investing in pink sheet stocks which is the bona fide realm of the sucker.

  55. 3b says:

    Left: You are exactly right and it’s because you can actually speak from experience, and are familiar with corporate America, and how it works from small offices to large complex corporations. It is as you note a case by case , function by function analysis. I try to avoid the WFH/ hybrid topic and only commented as Grim posted an article on the subject.

  56. Ex says:

    Wife doesn’t think she ever want to return to an office.
    She lives wfh and her last review “far exceeded” expectations.
    I’m happy for her! That and travel moratorium means she’s
    been around a lot more.

  57. The Great Pumpkin says:

    How did your wife gain experience? Yes, it’s good for her, but totally f’ks the coming generations.

    They are going to be lonely, that’s for sure, if they are stuck alone in their apartments in their 20’s and early 30’s. Not even knowing who they work with. No relationships whatsoever.

    Ex says:
    February 22, 2022 at 4:28 pm
    Wife doesn’t think she ever want to return to an office.
    She lives wfh and her last review “far exceeded” expectations.
    I’m happy for her! That and travel moratorium means she’s
    been around a lot more.

  58. 3b says:

    Pumps: Say good night , you have had your WFH rant for the day.

  59. The Great Pumpkin says:


    So how do you train new employees without in-person at your company?

    And your job is obviously an autonomous job that really doesn’t have to deal with people or much collaboration…correct? More like an IT guy, right?

  60. The Great Pumpkin says:

    3b can’t handle conversation. So easily triggered. Like wtf? What is your attachment to this subject that you take it so personal and start attacking me?

  61. 3b says:

    Pumps: Rich coming from you.

  62. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Too many people out there like this. They will not tolerate WFH for years on years.

    “I am SO sick of remote working. I cannot wait for a job that values in-person work, collaboration, and creativity. Can’t wait for the feeling of being truly engaged, in a room with other smart people, working together to solve problems & make better work. WFH sucks.

    WFH reduces everyone to nothing more than task completers, silo’d into their own homes crossing things off a to do list. There’s no opportunity, no growth. If you’re just a ‘task completer’ and don’t want a career it’s fine, but if you have any ambition, it sucks.

    I also find WFH to be incredibly boring. Very tedious. Just starring at people on a computer screen all day feels about as passive to me as zoning out watching TV. It’s just not the same as being around humans, engaged in solving problems and just having spontaneous conversation.”

  63. The Great Pumpkin says:

    The response to her tweet sums up the positions on this blog. Most of you already built your career and life.

    “I’ve liked it – I work w/w teams on multiple continents so we’re already remote. No commuting, dry cleaning, or cafeterias! I’m also 4 months from retirement so it’s a totally different part of the cycle – I remember wanting to be onsite when I benefitted from it.”

  64. 3b says:

    Pumps: Please enjoy your evening spend time with your family, not searching the web to find anti WFH article. Need I remind you in your own words WFH has no impact on you or your family.

  65. BRT says:

    Pumps is that chick who pushes your buttons for 3 hours straight and when you finally crack and shout, they look at you like you are unhinged.

  66. Ex says:

    Interesting question pumps. She worked her ass off and now at 50-something is either a star or has a target on the back !!!

    Corp life is untenured. No sitting back in a job for life my man.

  67. The Great Pumpkin says:


    I’m sure your wife kills it. You don’t live on the cali coast for no reason. You guys doing well in life.

    Listen, if you guys like WFH, don’t take my posts personal. I just think this is a trend people are calling way too early. Like their call of the death of suburbs. Is the future really working at home alone staring at a screen all day? Or if in a relationship or married, how does that relationship last being around each other 24/7 with no separation of home work life? Some people need a break from each other no matter how much they love each other. Esp if work is stressful, will kill the relationship as you both unleash work anger at each other.

    I don’t know why the topic interests me so much, but it does. I love contrarian takes in case you haven’t noticed. This is a contrarian take that I think I’m absolutely right about. Time will tell.

  68. BRT says:

    CDC now states

    an 8-week interval may be optimal for some people ages 12 years and older, especially for males ages 12–39 years

    oh gee…not like anyone who read data didn’t know this…other than the idiots crafting policy to force males in that age range to get their 2nd dose 2 weeks after the 1st. Anyone with a shred of intelligence would realize the health authorities have lost all credibility.

  69. 3b says:

    Pumps: In your comment at 6:07 you state that there are too many people out there like this , and then the Tweet. So, you just added that line because that’s you want to believe. However, it has no basis in fact, just what you want it to be.

  70. The Great Pumpkin says:


    I promise you. Not everyone wants to have a job where they wfh.

    It’s bad for your health. You don’t move around as much. It’s groundhog day every day. And if you suffer from a substance abuse: free pass to get f’ed up 24/7. Go look at the drinking sales #s.

    Don’t tell me I have no clue…i WFH for almost 2 years. That period was not good for my overall health.

  71. Libturd says:


    I know you will ignore this but, you CAN collaborate and train new hires online. As a matter of fact, by training new hires remotely, it forces one to document much of what might have only been committed to memory formerly and ripe to have been forgotten or not transferred to the hiree if the training occurred in person. There is nearly NOTHING today that can’t be done online that was formerly done in person. You are a teacher. You last worked with the latest technology when you were in college. This is a big problem with public schools today. I know because I witness the teaching of archaic and obsolete curriculum every day. See, you wouldn’t know how to collaborate remotely Pumps because your job never depended on it. I have to put out fires with clients regularly. Clients who reside all over the planet. Again, this is something you are not familiar with. Yet you claim your opinion is the only one to matter. And no, I don’t work in IT. I manage a team of Premedia Specialists in America and have a dotted line to two teams which I trained in India. I am also a workflow automation specialist. Much of what I do in regards to the latter title enables people to do remotely what they used to think they had to go to the office for.

    FYI, before the Pandemic, we had reduced the number of conference rooms our company had from around twenty to three. This had nothing to do with WFH. This had everything to do with the massive amount of time that was wasted making people from all over the tri-state area come into our offices to collaborate. This function was replaced by our creation of online collaboration portals that not just made it possible to not meet in person, but it actually improved the collaboration for the same reason training is working better remotely than in person. It forces everyone to document their portion. No more shooting from the hip. And everything is recorded for easy review. In the past, you had to rely on your memory way too much. Your memory is not searchable either. In the past, you had to individually train each person. Know you create a program once and it is reviewed by as many trainees as necessary.

    You will stubbornly ignore this and everything else everyone keeps telling you because you are as dense as Iridium.

    One more example. Try conversing with someone in Hyderabad verbally. Then try conversing with that same person in Teams or Zoom. Let me know which method is more productive.

    You see, you are completely wrong here for most professions.

  72. Ex says:

    WFH: Sure there are pro’s and Con’s but she likes it.

    Fact is that yes you “never leave the office” and she logs more hours now than she did before. I am sure that her personal productivity is through the roof.

    I am nearly at a point where I try like hell not to take anything personally.

  73. Ex says:

    Me? I am very close to being ready to retire. F-Ck it. I just want to have my own time.
    I have been out here for almost five years. 3 of those years I was on “sabbatical” & it was awesome.

  74. Ex says:

    I worked all year masked. It’s been interesting. Not ideal. But an experience nevertheless. I got paid as I mentioned well under scale. But when did wfh it was also an experience. It was great to work and I frankly need to. The tax man came calling with a really nasty surprise ….. but hey the home is worth a mil now. They tell me.

  75. Ex says:

    7:46 the whole nature of meetings has really taken a crazy leap/
    I know that when my wife presents online they’ll be a chat and two phones going. People whispering and conferring like they probably wouldn’t have before. Things evolve and change. The kids will be better at these things than we are. We are dinosaurs. They’ll work in completely different ways than we do. Their skills might be completely different. I notice that face-to-face isn’t everyone’s best suit.

  76. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Hey, maybe I’m totally wrong.

    You have to admit though, older generations are monetizing the sh!t out of future generations at the expense of their health. They are trying to substitute human interactions which are driven by chemicals, for electronic data driven interactions. Maybe it’s a benefit to humans, and I’m totally wrong barking up the wrong tree. We will see.

    Older I get, the more grateful I am for getting to live as a kid through the 80s and 90s. Special times. Just totally different from today.

  77. Ex says:

    US home prices saw their biggest increase in at least 34 years in 2021
    Home prices surged 18.8 percent last year, according to data released Tuesday
    Mass migration to the South, Southwest and Mountain West drove increases
    Home prices in Phoenix rose the most at 32.5%, and in Tampa they jumped 29.4%
    San Diego, Las Vegas, Denver and Los Angeles also saw strong increases
    People moving out of the Northeast bid prices up amid limited supply

  78. Ex says:

    And here I am watching a show about a rehab on a lake home in flyover country.

  79. 3b says:

    Pumps: You don’t know WFH from a corporate perspective, don’t deflect.

  80. PumpkinFace says:

    You have to admit though, older generations are monetizing the sh!t out of future generations at the expense of their health.

    So, it’s not okay to take advantage of the next generation… except when it is with you cheering it on

  81. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Boomers from the Northeast..

    “People moving out of the Northeast bid prices up amid limited supply”

  82. The Great Pumpkin says:

    It is what it is..

    PumpkinFace says:
    February 22, 2022 at 9:28 pm
    You have to admit though, older generations are monetizing the sh!t out of future generations at the expense of their health.

    So, it’s not okay to take advantage of the next generation… except when it is with you cheering it on

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