Riskiest Markets

From Atom:

Housing Markets Facing Greater Risk Of Downturns Clustered In California, New Jersey And Illinois

ATTOM, a leading curator of land, property, and real estate data, today released a Special Housing Risk Report spotlighting county-level housing markets around the United States that are more or less vulnerable to declines, based on home affordability, foreclosures, underwater mortgages and other measures in the third quarter of 2023. The report shows that California, New Jersey and Illinois have the highest concentrations of the most-at-risk markets in the country, with the biggest clusters in the New York City and Chicago areas, as well as central California. Less-vulnerable markets are spread mainly throughout the South, Midwest and Northeast.

The third-quarter patterns – derived from gaps in home affordability, underwater mortgages, foreclosures and unemployment – revealed that California, New Jersey and Illinois had 33 of the 50 counties considered most vulnerable to potential drop-offs. Those concentrations dwarfed other parts of the country at a time of mixed market trends when home prices and homeowner equity improved but home affordability and foreclosure activity worsened.

The metropolitan areas around Chicago, IL, and New York, NY, as well as central California, had 21 of the 50 U.S. counties considered most vulnerable in the third quarter of 2023 to housing market troubles (from among 578 counties with enough data to analyze).

The 50 most at-risk counties included three in New York City (Kings and Richmond counties, which cover Brooklyn and Staten Island, and Bronx County), six in the New York City suburbs (Bergen, Essex, Ocean, Passaic, Sussex and Union counties, all in New Jersey) and seven in the Chicago metropolitan area (Cook, De Kalb, Kane, Lake, McHenry and Will counties in Illinois, and Lake County in Indiana).

The five in central California were Fresno County, Madera County (outside Fresno), Merced County (outside Fresno); San Joaquin County (Stockton) and Stanislas County (Modesto).

Elsewhere, the top-50 list included three each in northern California, southern California and the Philadelphia, PA, metro area. They were Butte County (outside Sacramento), El Dorado County (outside Sacramento) and Humboldt County (Eureka) in northern California and Kern County (Bakersfield), Riverside County and San Bernardino County in southern California. Those in the Philadelphia area were Philadelphia County, Gloucester County, NJ, and Camden County, NJ.

This entry was posted in Demographics, Economics, Housing Bubble, New Jersey Real Estate. Bookmark the permalink.

80 Responses to Riskiest Markets

  1. Fast Eddie says:

    Ba Ba Booey!

  2. Fast Eddie says:

    I can see Ocean and Sussex Counties experiencing greater quaver but Union, Bergen, Passaic and Essex are the ‘highest and best’ champions. At worst, the four latter counties mentioned will be flat but no decline. Somewhere around 2030, you’ll see the 1st $million dollar cape in Saddle Brook/Fair Lawn/Elmwood Park and similar towns in other northern counties. Sussex County is rural and I can see why it’s always tough to gauge. As for Ocean County, it’s two hours worth of traffic north to civilization and can’t fathom why so many flock there. There’s one road, route 9, that will take you days to travel from one end of the county to the other. Route 37 looks like the Dollar Tree version of Route 17.

  3. Libturd says:

    “Route 37 looks like the Dollar Tree version of Route 17.”

    Now that’s funny!

  4. grim says:

    Bought a Tesla Y. Bad idea? Good idea?

    It appeals to my nerdiness … and I totaled my car last week, so there’s that. Give it up to Honda though, my son and I walked away from it with zero injuries, nada.

    Gotta say, interesting experience. There are no real sales people. Demo drive was totally solo, they unlocked the car and told me to go have fun. Even if you walk into the dealership to try to buy a car in person, you are still basically buying the car on your phone. I’m not sure you ever really need to talk to anyone to do it. I hate the stealerships, so I’m loving this process. Soup to nuts, buying the car on my phone took about 15 minutes, and that’s because I had to go find my wallet to get ID photos, and to the car to get insurance cards.

    Guess the consumer is still strong?

  5. Juice Box says:

    What a crappy GOP debate from a slate of horrible candidates. Republicans find someone else and fast! On behalf of the middle from both parties who make up 70% of the voters, either pick someone besides Trump and those who stood on the debate stage last night or lose. The choice is yours. Nobody from the middle is voting from Trump this time, he has been exposed as the charlatan and one trick monkey that he is. The middle who voted for him last time and in 2016 now know who he really is and it’s over.

  6. Fast Eddie says:

    Today is a day that will forever live in infamy.

  7. 3b says:

    Juice: Just stay home on election choice. That is the only choice in my opinion.

  8. 3b says:

    Fast: I wonder if they still teach that in the public schools?

  9. 3b says:

    Fast: 2030? Nah, when rates are cut next year, it’s blast off again, we will see 1000,000 by 2025. Great big beautiful delicious rate cuts coming next year. Is all over the financial news sources.

  10. Juice Box says:

    Lol!!!

    What is known as a Sheng nu in China a childless old cat lady becomes person of the year!

    I mean Time magazine even posed her with a CAT!!

    http://tiny.cc/arwgvz

  11. Fast Eddie says:

    Grim,

    Glad to read all is okay with you and your son.

  12. Libturd says:

    I finally figured out that Russian sounding song from Genesis.

    It’s called the Brazilian. Be warned. It’s catchy. Especially for an instrumental.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8gjI67KBbRg

    It actually reminds me a lot of Depeche Mode at many points in the tune. I probably haven’t heard this in at least thirty years.

  13. Jim says:

    grim says:
    December 7, 2023 at 7:51 am
    Bought a Tesla Y. Bad idea? Good idea?

    My son in law purchased a Tesla about a year and a half ago and loves it. He gets free charging where he works ( nice perk) , but he did put new tires on in June and paid $500 a tire plus the cost of installation. I will say this it is crazy fast, breakneck fast.

  14. Libturd says:

    On the Tesla Y.

    If I can spend 65K on a Mazda, then buying a 50K Tesla isn’t that extraordinary. Enjoy it. I learn something new nearly every time I drive my car. And I’m pretty tech savvy. For example, if you hold in the adaptive cruise control, it will automatically adjust to the current road speed limit. The time before that I drove it, was the first time I realized I had automatic brights. That’s some cool shit right there. And the brights in this car are like a flare. Stupid feature, the remote startup which works off of cellular, not bluetooth or WiFi. The cellular part is actually really smart. The fact you can’t adjust your climate settings remotely, not so smart. This morning, I got into an air-conditioned car.

    Enjoy the new ride brother and glad you are alright.

    Still proudly accident free, at fifty three. I have driven three cars to death too.

  15. 3b says:

    Grim: Glad you and your Son are OK.

  16. Juice Box says:

    Grim Glad to hear you and your son walked away unscathed.

    You had an electric before, if I remember you wired the garage with a NEMA outlet. Was it the 50 AMP version? 240 volt NEMA 14-50 outlet for Teslas. The Model Y has more space than the other Teslas and for anyone with a family it’s the best choice.

    I did see a sweet Model S Plaid recently, but the Model Y will still do a 12.7 sec quarter mile and zero to 60 in 4.4 seconds. Good enough for the Garden State Parkway toll booth dash on a summers day.

    Batttery pack is good for 1,500 charge cycles so even when you are done with the car it can still go for hundred of thousands of miles before it dies so it should hold it’s value in the used car market.

    Let us know what the insurance costs here in wonderful NJ.

  17. Fast Eddie says:

    Still proudly accident free…

    I’m accident free, too. Thank goodness all those pregnancy tests came back negative.

    Whew!

  18. Juice Box says:

    re: new tires on in June..

    They don’t break traction and burn rubber he must just be driving it hard.

    You can pimp my ride too..body kits and rims and tires etc, and even lots of cool interiors stuff like a $15 carbon fiber cell phone holder.

    https://pimpmyev.com/collections/model-y-accessories?page=3

  19. Libturd says:

    If you are pimping, then it’s gotta be Honda Racing.

  20. NJCoast says:

    King Crimson. All I remember from last working for them in 2017 was searching for Activia prune yogurt for Robert’s dressing room.

  21. No One says:

    NJCoast,
    Fripp probably is very disciplined about his bowel movements, like everything.

  22. Libturd says:

    I could only imagine. He’s the kind of dude that will live to be 100.

  23. Chicago says:

    Two month anniversary of FabMax’s gleeful silence. From River to Sea? Yeah you agree it is the Zionist’s fault for everything. You are a pig.

    One female survivor of the attack on a musical festival where hundreds of people were massacred described how a woman was raped during the atrocity.

    “I remember how [one attacker] shifted her position, then passed her on to another person,” she recalled in the video testimony.

    “She was alive. … She was standing. … She was bleeding from her back. … She had a long hair, and he was pulling it. … She wasn’t dressed. … He cut her breast. He threw it on the road, and they played with it,” the woman recounted in the gruesome testimony.

  24. Hold my beer says:

    Got hit with a $3,700 emergency vet bill. Our old fat cat was acting sick and looked bad. Vet said no room in the schedule, take him to the animal er. I thought he had a urinary blockage or infection and would get a shot and fluid under the skin. Turns out he has congestive heart failure. He got lasix and an heart med and was put in an oxygen cage. Didn’t know such a thing existed and that it costs $48 an hour to be in one.

    Need to find a publicly traded small cap animal hospital chain.

  25. BRT says:

    Pet care and insurance has turned into the ultimate grift.

  26. No One says:

    Fripp rarely performed vocals. His most outstanding vocal contribution was from his first album, pre-King Crimson, where he injected a spoken-word story in between 5 songs. Here they are compiled as The Saga of Rodney Toady.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9kgPWxH1TmQ
    He was a very sad young man.
    From the album The Cheerful Insanity of Giles Giles and Fripp, which I’d describe as a hybrid of Monty Python and King Crimson

  27. Boomer Remover says:

    My pica cat loves to eat plastic and string, which I am told acts like a saw inside a cat’s intestines. I pay $30 per month so that I don’t have to decline a $10K surgery.

  28. No One says:

    Chi
    From Ayn Rand 50 years ago:
    “When you have civilized men fighting savages, you support the civilized men, no matter who they are. Israel is a mixed economy inclined toward socialism. But when it comes to the power of the mind—the development of industry in that wasted desert continent—versus savages who don’t want to use their minds, then if one cares about the future of civilization, don’t wait for the government to do something. Give whatever you can. This is the first time I’ve contributed to a public cause: helping Israel in an emergency.”

  29. leftwing says:

    Grim, good to hear you walked away unscathed. Let us know how the Tesla works out. I want a ‘local’ car and am almost there on buying one…I got some leasing offers that looked very reasonable, did you consider that option? For some reason back of my mind says if I get a good financial option leasing this car is one I would most likely look to have the option to hand back after a few years…

    Lib, up almost 10% on the pure shares of WBA in two days. This is just crazy…wrote a bunch of Jan 25C against most of the shares, take a little off the table that way. May take rest of shares off the table for some house money while letting the handful of LEAPs I purchased ride into next year, feel OK about this one longer term. Still pissed about JNJ but if she flashes me something sub-150 again I’ll start piling in.

    Juice, can’t agree more on the debate. So painful to watch. Even if you took the best traits and positions of all four of those candidates and rolled them into one that person would still leave a lot to be desired…WTF was up with DeSantis, was he drugged…Jesus dude, move your arms…and smile. Once even. Cannot believe it’s going to be DJT v Joe……

  30. Chicago says:

    Left: Definitely seeing once high flyers trading at/near 52 week lows, but still getting beaten. Not dogs, but other stuff. I think it is the perfect set-up. Big up market. Plenty of losers though. Stretched darlings, and people wanting to cash in chips (actually just lighten) without options.

  31. Chicago says:

    Definitely feels like some tax trading.

    I think the contrarian call might be to transcend your screens and gamble a little. I think everyone might be looking at the same things. You know better; just rambling

  32. Jim says:

    Juice Box says:
    December 7, 2023 at 8:54 am
    re: new tires on in June..

    They don’t break traction and burn rubber he must just be driving it hard.

    Driving it hard is an understatement. We went from zero to 100 twice, and he floored it at every light… needless to say I declined to drive it, but I did get whiplash. Son in law left everybody in the dust at all the lights.

  33. Phoenix says:

    Debate.

    Yeah, it looks like they went to the Republican school, waited till the day was over, and picked the dolts that were in detention to be the choices.

    Tesla. Nice car. A driving tape recorder. It’s a good choice if you have kids and want to monitor them. Tesla will also monitor them, and you, no extra charge.

    Grim. glad you are okay.

    Vets. Many being bought out by Mars veterinary. Private company that owns M&M’s as well. Don’t think you can buy stock in them. Just pay them well, and buy the prescription food from them where they have mostly cornered the market.

    Cat eats string? Seen that, turns the intestine into a tightly squeezed accordion with a hundred holes in it. Horrible way for an animal to die. Don’t leave dental floss laying around either.

  34. Hold my beer says:

    I bought a few stocks over the last few weeks.

    Bought Ulta at $405. Texas Roadhouse at $108.
    A small regional bank called Hingham Institution Financial services at $162-$166
    And 2 spinoffs
    Vestis. For $17-$18 Used to be part of Aramark. It was their uniform services division
    And Worthington enterprises at $52. Used to be worthington industries but the company split into Worthington steel which makes steel mostly for the car industry and Worthington industries which makes steel framing, drop ceilings, owns Coleman and dewalt and a few other consumer brands you’ve probably heard of.

    And these aren’t recommendations. Just what I bought and am hoping to hold for years.

  35. Hold my beer says:

    I also bought lovesac at $18-$19.

    And not a recommendation. Just what I bought.

  36. 3b says:

    Hold: Why Vestis?

  37. No One says:

    Republican debate
    Vivek seems to be a Trump agent, focusing on attacking everyone else, while promoting unrealistic talking point promises of his own.
    All Crispy adds is the occasional attack on Trump, should be more widespread from people with a sense of decency, but they still mostly hope to either inherit his votes if he’s forced out of the running, or maybe get a job offer – but I doubt Trump would hire Christie, DeSantis or Haley in his imagined future admin.
    DeSantis is still low on charisma, so hard to see him rising a ton.
    WSJ is very supportive of Haley at this point, and a lot of moderate Republicans like her. Policywise she’s probably more George Bush Senior than Ronald Reagan. None of them are Reagan-like.
    I liked DeSantis’ praise of Calvin Coolidge, but no way would Coolidge have even gone culture warrior like DeSantis has. He was truly a laissez-faire guy. In any case, there’s no big grass roots popular vote asking for more Silent Cals right now, sadly, so it’s an odd marketing pitch from him.

  38. Phoenix says:

    This can help you predict the future.

    People took to TikTok this week to share themselves “aging” in real time using a filter called “time travel.” Set to a wistful Elvis Presley song, the effect shows the user’s face slowly getting older, complete with wrinkles and sun spots. The effect was released by an independent creator in October, and the app says it’s been shared 1.4 million times.

    But advancements in AI imaging are making the results more realistic, perhaps by using machine learning trained on young and old images of real faces. Board certified dermatologist Aleksandra Brown said the TikTok time travel filter is the most accurate she’s seen in guessing how a given face would age, including details like skin texture and muscle positions.

  39. Libturd says:

    Peoples be crazy about their pets. Don’t get me wrong, but after having multiple pets, you learn quickly that a new one is always a great replacement for the sadness of losing the old one.

    When we got our last dog, I told Gator we would have a sliding rate scale for all medicine. We would spend up to $1,000 in total max until he turned five. Then it was a sliding rate downwards $100 a year until the dog was 15 in which you would obviously be throwing any money into the trash to repair a pet at that point. We lucked out. Our doodle lived well past his life expectancy and had his first major medical issue late into age 13. Essentially, he became incontinent and I would wake up every morning to drippy shit all over the main floor of the house. We tried every home remedy to no avail. Of course the dog was as happy as a clam. So when the VET asked me what I thought of his quality of life, I said it’s absolutely fantastic. But mine was filled with nightmares of endless mopping and disinfecting that became a daily reality. She suggested doggy diapers and $1,500 in tests just to find out what it was. She couldn’t guarantee it would reveal anything and then the treatment could easily be double that. I felt horrible putting such a happy spry dog to sleep. But he was so skinny he looked like a holocaust dog. I hugged him and did the deed.

    This spending of $1,000s to heal pets, especially when they are in their later years is just silly. I mean, if you’ve got money to burn, sure. But I know a lot of people who have taken second mortgages out to give Barkley or Boots another nine months.

  40. Phoenix says:

    So much logic. Imagine if we did the same with humans. Probably wouldn’t be a housing shortage. And since humans kill each other over money every single day there is some sort of precedent for it as well. Just think of all of the houses that would come up on the market for sale.

    Libturd says:
    December 7, 2023 at 11:42 am
    Peoples be crazy about their pets. Don’t get me wrong, but after having multiple pets, you learn quickly that a new one is always a great replacement for the sadness of losing the old one.

    When we got our last dog, I told Gator we would have a sliding rate scale for all medicine. We would spend up to $1,000 in total max until he turned five. Then it was a sliding rate downwards $100 a year until the dog was 15 in which you would obviously be throwing any money into the trash to repair a pet at that point. We lucked out. Our doodle lived well past his life expectancy and had his first major medical issue late into age 13. Essentially, he became incontinent and I would wake up every morning to drippy shit all over the main floor of the house. We tried every home remedy to no avail. Of course the dog was as happy as a clam. So when the VET asked me what I thought of his quality of life, I said it’s absolutely fantastic. But mine was filled with nightmares of endless mopping and disinfecting that became a daily reality. She suggested doggy diapers and $1,500 in tests just to find out what it was. She couldn’t guarantee it would reveal anything and then the treatment could easily be double that. I felt horrible putting such a happy spry dog to sleep. But he was so skinny he looked like a holocaust dog. I hugged him and did the deed.

    This spending of $1,000s to heal pets, especially when they are in their later years is just silly. I mean, if you’ve got money to burn, sure. But I know a lot of people who have taken second mortgages out to give Barkley or Boots another nine months.

  41. Libturd says:

    And I forgot to add. I almost flipped out when I was charged like $300 to put the dog to sleep and have him disposed of. I’m sure it’s much cheaper in states with more lenient gun laws.

  42. 3b says:

    Lib: I know people who have spent thousands on their pets, including one of my siblings. I had trouble understanding that, but have come to the conclusion that some people at least do it, because pets can be better than people.

  43. Libturd says:

    I like that justification, until your dog eats your $300 Italian dress shoes.

  44. Hold my beer says:

    3b

    It was poorly run as part of Aramark. The board and ceo are experts at route businesses. The board is full of former execs of successful route companies. the former president and coo of cintas, ceo chairman of advanced disposal services, ceo of brinks. CEO of Vestis was COO of terminix.

    Vestis didn’t have its drivers trying to cross-sell until new ceo took over in 2021. They had inefficient routes for the drivers too.

    New ceo has increased sales growth from 2% to 4% in 2 years while improving margins through cross selling and more efficient routes. Aramark made it pay a 1.5 billion dollar dividend as the price for the spin off. Vestis thinks it can pay off about half of that by 2026.

    Cintas stock has returned 25% a year for a decade for an 825% return. . If Vestis can keep improving it has a long runway to set and forget. I doubt it will match cintas stock performance but with the ceo and board guiding growth strategy has a chance to do nicely. Could also flop and be mediocre too.

    It’s also something that can’t get offshored. And has over 90% retention rate. Plus it’s less than 1% of their customers expenses so the customer most likely will look elsewhere in the budget to cut costs.

  45. TraitorJoe says:

    What good would studying Pearl Harbor do for the leftist education establishment?

    There’s no oppressed person subplot that they can use to advance their political agenda. The story of American capitalism out producing Japan 10-1 doesn’t interest them

    Neither does the duplicitous war monger nature of FDR. He was a democrat. The internment policy isn’t a good look either. That works open the door to the deep racist history of the DNC.

  46. leftwing says:

    chi, appreciate the thoughts…pissed at GOOG as well, saw it on CNBC the last two days under 130 at a 22x forward, made a mental note, and now because of some fucking video it’s up 5% today….

    Re: the last eighteen months/two years I was able to discern early that money was pretty hot, rolling in and out sectors and stocks not even in a rotation, just sloshing around. Fit my preferred strategies and skills well…fact is, even with November’s crazy gain you’re still slightly under water on the QQQ and SPY from two years ago…needed to be nimble…

    I’ll keep trading out of outsize winners, especially when they are measured in weeks or even days, until the market tells me to do something differently. But I do think we are nearing the corner where we leg up and break these ranges on the upside, soon.

    Valuation is a concern – which can be overcome – as is the wide expectation of a March cut. Don’t subscribe to the latter and the two in concert is what is holding me back now….

    Of my new recent positions going to let my RSP ride, and I’ll let some of this WBA as well. RSP may get called away, the calls I wrote against it are ITM as of now. Still have both sets of SPY shorts, Dec22s and Jans, they are down today but breakeven…

  47. Fabius Maximus says:

    Chi,

    “gleeful silence”, you really are a sick individual.
    I have not engaged in the conversation IN HERE as for the most part I’m not going to add anything to the conversation. Juice covered most of my views. While you had a calm conversation with him, if I posted the same, you would just jump on your soapbox and start screaming Anti-Semite at me and I’m not going to give you that satisfaction.

    You want to know where I stand on this issue? Its with Donnie Deutsch. Not someone I usually agree with, but has managed to navigate and communicate the most nuanced conversation on this topic. Watch from 6:03 on although the whole interview is worth watching. https://twitter.com/DonnyDeutsch/status/1720228507379224644

    As for you, lately I’m wondering if you took a “23 and me” and it came up 1/32nd Sephardic, so you’re now getting down with the tribe. Must be good for business. Maybe I should start calling you “Doug the Head”

  48. Fabius Maximus says:

    Lib, that Russian Genesis is all Tony Banks.

    Anyone remember this one? How long to recognize who’s on the bike.
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Wa8Fukgt_iQ&t=766s

  49. leftwing says:

    Also, I know I mentioned this guy before, if you are visually oriented with your data there are few better at pulling salient macro data and putting it down in chart format.

    Can’t speak to any of his analysis or videos – never looked at either frankly – but often what he pulls and how he presents is a good centering influence on my investing.

    https://bilello.blog/2023/the-week-in-charts-12-3-23

    BRT, look at the final chart under point 4….she’s a fucking genius, no? LOL.

  50. The Great Pumpkin says:

    Does anyone think the market is basically in a bubble? I guess inflation is pushing it up some, but it looks like most things outside of biotech, are in a huge bubble. Not saying I am correct, just talking about the looks of it.

  51. Fabius Maximus says:

    Grim, sorry to hear about the accident. My buddy was in tears when he saw the remains of the minivan his wife walked away from with just scratches.

    Good luck with the Y. It was the only model I would have considered from Tesla. An interesting question is coming up about the CyberTruck. Who is doing bodywork repair after a crash. Will we see a lot of trucks totaled as it will be a Tesla repair only?

  52. leftwing says:

    “Got hit with a $3,700 emergency vet bill…Need to find a publicly traded small cap animal hospital chain.”

    Coming soon.

    Right now BC Partners, Warburg Pincus, and KKR thank you profusely for pumping the P/L before they make the offering.

  53. 3b says:

    Hold: Interesting, I thought Cintas pretty much had that market wrapped up, but with a well run competitor as you believe Vistis could be, there is positive upside there for the stock. Its a good story.

  54. Juice Box says:

    I don’t tick the tock….

    Pretty funny face aging filter anyway.. compilation on youtube, it does not remove hair from your head however.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OH0b3kBzR0A

  55. Juice Box says:

    Ahh loveable pets.

    Need a good laugh? They don’t make comedy like this anymore.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jX09Cesfxo8&t=1s

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HzgrVW2uZWE

  56. Hold my beer says:

    3b

    Cintas is the biggest. Vestis is second and the third one is Uni first or something like that. Together they only have about 25% of the market.

    Since the ceo has steadily improved Vestis over the last 2 years and the board actually understands the route business I felt it was worth the risk. If the board knew nothing about route businesses and there had been no improvements in sales and margins it might have made it to my watch list.

  57. leftwing says:

    VSTS is a nice little find HMB…need to shout those out on here before they run from 14 to 18+… :)

  58. Libturd says:

    Left. I love the week in charts.

    Though, the only chart you really need to see is

    https://photos.app.goo.gl/bYUeixnyfysmKL6v5

  59. leftwing says:

    “And I forgot to add. I almost flipped out when I was charged like $300 to put the dog to sleep and have him disposed of.”

    Three (?) family pets buried in my parent’s back yard. Two of natural causes, one with a .22 to back of head. Dug two holes myself, didn’t do the first, too small and the ground was starting to freeze.

    That help out on my geographic origin chi, lol?

    “WSJ is very supportive of Haley at this point, and a lot of moderate Republicans like her. Policywise she’s probably more George Bush Senior…”

    Probably spot-on as every time I hear her speak I don’t like her as she seems to be promoting regulation of something or action against someone (including international intervention)…typical neo-con….keep her out.

  60. BRT says:

    Lib, where’s your Biden growth line?

  61. Phoenix says:

    Biden forgives $5 billion more in student loans for over 80,000 borrowers. Who qualified?

  62. 3b says:

    Phoenix: Where do I send the bills for my kids college tuitions that we paid 100 percent.

  63. Phoenix says:

    23andMe to Hacked Users: We Won’t See You in Court
    The company that lost your biodata is now trying to avoid a class-action lawsuit with its updated terms of service.

  64. leftwing says:

    “Biden forgives $5 billion more in student loans for over 80,000 borrowers. Who qualified?”

    A bunch of kids who aren’t mine who seem to be a getting a $60k discount each….

    “Where do I send the bills for my kids college tuitions that we paid 100 percent.”

    Right behind you. LMK where the line forms.

    Fuckers.

  65. Hold my beer says:

    Leftwing

    Thanks. Take a look at Worthington enterprises. Symbol WOR. It focuses on niche areas it can be the biggest or one of the biggest players in. They’re looking to improve ebitda margins from 20 up to 24% and increase sales 6-8% a year through a combo of organic growth, new products and acquisitions. The ceo owns 1.3% of the company and the founding family owns 35% so the company can focus on long term growth and not quarterly numbers. Plus when the company was Worthington industries before it split into 2 companies it bought back 29% of its shares over the last 10 years. Also has very low debt for a company in its industries. Since it no longer has a cyclical steel business it has a better chance to improve. And it’s going to buy most of its steel from its sister company Worthington steel which reduces its supply chain issues.

  66. Hold my beer says:

    Worthington just didn’t spinoff on December 1st

  67. Hold my beer says:

    Just did the spinoff on December 1st

  68. leftwing says:

    Another nice one…like the liquidity, margins (Wave is downright Rx like), and valuation. Earnings on 12/20 won’t be current period surprises yet although broad parameters for LT out there more may come out given TTM results are flat to a little off…with the one week runup here as well (10%) I’ll wait into earnings see if I can get it a bit cheaper. Good find.

    What, you have spinoffs bookmarked? LOL.

  69. 3b says:

    Happy Hanukkah to all our Jewish posters. Enjoy this festive holiday.

  70. Hold my beer says:

    lol. Found them through my Substack feed.

    I watched Worthington enterprises investor presentation the other day. It’s over 2 hours long but worth it. They own lots of consumer brands we’ve all heard of.

  71. chicagofinance says:

    You are such an Anti-Semite.

    What a non-committal/non-answer! Of course you will not answer, because you cannot be seen condemining anything in writing. You won’t have it. You are posting content from The View for a “nuanced conversation”!? That’s even beneath your sickening standards. I assume it is intended to be insulting, including the focused discussion of Cornell.

    Your craven obfuscation is clearly inspired by your intellectual idols: Liz Magill, Claudine Gay and Sally Kornbluth.

    Fabius Maximus says:
    December 7, 2023 at 12:25 pm
    Chi,

    “gleeful silence”, you really are a sick individual.
    I have not engaged in the conversation IN HERE as for the most part I’m not going to add anything to the conversation. Juice covered most of my views. While you had a calm conversation with him, if I posted the same, you would just jump on your soapbox and start screaming Anti-Semite at me and I’m not going to give you that satisfaction.

    You want to know where I stand on this issue? Its with Donnie Deutsch. Not someone I usually agree with, but has managed to navigate and communicate the most Anti-Semite on this topic. Watch from 6:03 on although the whole interview is worth watching. https://twitter.com/DonnyDeutsch/status/1720228507379224644

  72. Juice Box says:

    I’d knock your teeth out you anti-dentite bastard…

    https://www.bing.com/videos/riverview/relatedvideo?q=anti+dentite

  73. Juice Box says:

    Get rich or die trying.

    Google just announced Gemini, its most powerful suite of AI models yet, and the company has already been accused of lying about its performance.

    An op-ed from Bloomberg claims Google misrepresented the power of Gemini in a recent video. Google aired an impressive “what the quack” hands-on video during its announcement earlier this week, and columnist Parmy Olson says it seemed remarkably capable in the video — perhaps too capable.

    The six-minute video shows off Gemini’s multimodal capabilities (spoken conversational prompts combined with image recognition, for example). Gemini seemingly recognizes images quickly — even for connect-the-dots pictures — responds within seconds, and tracks a wad of paper in a cup and ball game in real-time. Sure, humans can do all of that, but this is an AI able to recognize and predict what will happen next.
    But click the video description on YouTube, and Google has an important disclaimer:

    “For the purposes of this demo, latency has been reduced, and Gemini outputs have been shortened for brevity.”

    That’s what Olson takes umbrage with. According to her Bloomberg piece, Google admitted when asked for comment that the video demo didn’t happen in real time with spoken prompts but instead used still image frames from raw footage and then wrote out text prompts to which Gemini to responded. “That’s quite different from what Google seemed to be suggesting: that a person could have a smooth voice conversation with Gemini as it watched and responded in real-time to the world around it,” Olson writes.

    https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/other/google-just-launched-a-new-ai-and-has-already-admitted-at-least-one-demo-wasn-t-real/ar-AA1lazQD

  74. Juice Box says:

    BTW – For both Chi and Fab……

    My Opinion? You really want to hear it? Well here it is…

    It’s going to get ugly here at home. There is a good chance of attacks like what is happening in the EU and the far eastern countries now like the Philippines and other places are feeling it now.

    It sucks… but just remember it is just another indoctrinated generation doing this damage. The people that did 9/11 are ghosts….. The source of the current indoctrination?

    There is no stomach here NOW to do what will eventually need to be done. That can change quickly. Make sure your sons prepared. Just ask the grandparents it was seriously a draft lottery during Vietnam.

  75. Juice Box says:

    And one more thing to both of you.. Chi and Fab.

    You are better.

    You are smarter.

    Start acting it. If we don’t civilization is dammed.

  76. Juice Box says:

    Queue the pardon abuse choice or re-election?

    Imagine being a parent who has to choose pollical ambition over his child.

    Well here we are…

    New 56-page indictment for Hunter…..

  77. Fabius Maximus says:

    Juice you are correct, the attacks on the innocents are going to continue. More synagogues will be attacked and people stabbed in the street.

    This will be fueled by third parties with their own agendas. The evangelicals want that access to Jerusalem for the Rapture. The far right are always happy when two groups they hate go after each other. Russia and China will also stoke the fires. You want to educate the kids, start with banning TikTok, that is where a lot of the disinformation is coming from.

    The Irish model is really the only real way forward. Both sides will have to come together for a solution that works for all. I think we are beyond a two state solution and need to look at a three state solution. Let Israel work out a deal with the Palestinian Authority for peace in the West Bank, that demonstrates that peace can be achieved. Show the Palestinians in Gaza that they need to move away from Hamas terrorists and they can gain peace. For that to happen, Bibi has to go and Israel move away from the right wing stance they have had for the past 20 odd years. It seems we only get close to a peace deal when Labor is in power.

    Another nuanced piece that’s worth a read. https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/07/opinions/harvard-penn-mit-college-presidents-on-antisemitism-genocide-perry/index.html

    There are no simplistic answers here.

    Chi, I have no idea who those “intellectual idols” you allege I follow are, nor do I care. Keep projecting.

  78. Fabius Maximus says:

    So Hunter is being charged with payroll fraud. Isn’t that what Allen Weisselberg was charged with among other things.

    As will all the all the other cases, let due process happen and we’ll see what the verdicts are.

    Is the salted laptop in scope for this one?

  79. Phoenix says:

    If you don’t like Jewish people you are Anti-semitic.

    I don’t like the Catholic religion. What does that make me?

  80. Phoenix says:

    You want to educate the kids, start with banning TikTok, that is where a lot of the disinformation is coming from.

    This is a crock of crap, and just plain Anti-Chinese.

    TikTok is no worse a platform than Facecrap, Xcrement, or Instasuck.

    My kid spends time there, so I observe it. Plenty of great things on TikTok.
    Like any other platform, some good, some bad. If you ban that one, then ban them all.

    Oh, wait, that’s banning free speech.

    First Amendment free speech. Positive or negative, free speech must continue in America.

    Then there are the women complaining about books in the schools, turning kids somehow by reading a book.

    One thing I know for sure, I was in kindergarten and I had the hots for a blond girl in my class. Ain’t no book anyone has ever published gonna make me look at a guy’s azz and get turned on, that’s for damned sure. So I have to wonder if people are just born that way- book or no book, I believe you swing the way you do right out of the starting gate.

    So be it.

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