Stuck in ’06

From the NY Times:

Puzzling Over Home Prices

THE housing market in New Jersey has been on a little roll toward recovery — the number of sales has risen and the number of houses on the market has fallen for four straight months — even though activity cooled slightly in August for the country at large.

But what does that mean for home prices? A halt in the decline? Even, possibly, a start in the other direction?

“In some neighborhoods, I have to say yes, prices are starting to go up,” said Karen Eastman Bigos, a partner in the Towne Realty Group, based in Short Hills, one of the highest-priced markets in northern New Jersey.

On the other hand, she and others say, brokers continue to encounter sellers who are “stuck in 2006.” Some people hear news reports about the improvement in conditions nationally, and insist on pricing their homes at precrash levels, Ms. Bigos said.

Most recently, Jeffrey Otteau, the group’s president, announced his view that it will take until 2016 for prices to recover to their high point in 2006.

Over all, he added, it is “very difficult — and possibly too soon” to say whether prices have even stopped their decline.

For one thing, data on final sales prices are not available until sales close — usually two to six months after a contract is signed — so there is a lag time before conclusions can be drawn. For another, there is no tried-and-true analytical method for determining the direction prices are headed at a time of flux like this.

When pressed to consider what could be discerned from information now at hand, Mr. Otteau came up with this: The seasonal shift downward in prices that occurred from summer to fall was not as sharp as last year’s. This year, the downward shift from the second to third quarters was 7.4 percent; last year, it was 10.4 percent.

Mr. Otteau said his data suggested that “a ground is beginning to form in terms of prices,” and noted that the trend had occurred as government stimulus programs that were intended to stabilize the residential real estate market were taking effect.

No matter how good the numbers are in a particular community, however, realistic pricing is critical.

This entry was posted in Economics, Housing Bubble, New Jersey Real Estate. Bookmark the permalink.

107 Responses to Stuck in ’06

  1. grim says:


    NJ couple charged with theft from home sellers

    Prosecutors say a New Jersey couple and their real estate firm stole more than $600,000 from struggling homeowners.

    Joann Smith and Wayne Betha of Ewing and their Trenton-based property management firm were named in an indictment handed up Thursday by a state grand jury.

    Charges include money laundering, conspiracy and theft by deception.

    They stem from sales of 11 homes in Trenton, Ewing, Hamilton, Orange, Willingboro and Camden.

  2. grim says:

    Bank Failure #100 – Stonegate Bank, Fort Lauderdale, Florida, Assumes All of the Deposits of Partners Bank, Naples, Florida

    The FDIC estimates that the cost to the Deposit Insurance Fund (DIF) will be $28.6 million.

    Bank Failure #101 – Ameris Bank, Moultrie, Georgia, Assumes All of the Deposits of American United Bank, Lawrenceville, Georgia

    The FDIC estimates that the cost to the Deposit Insurance Fund (DIF) will be $44 million.

    Bank Failure #102 – Stonegate Bank, Fort Lauderdale, Florida, Assumes All of The Deposits of Hillcrest Bank Florida, Naples, Florida

    The FDIC estimates that the cost to the Deposit Insurance Fund (DIF) will be $45 million.

    Bank Failure #103 – First Federal Bank of Florida, Lake City, Florida, Assumes All of the Deposits of Flagship National Bank, Bradenton, Florida

    The FDIC estimates that the cost to the Deposit Insurance Fund (DIF) will be $59 million.

    Bank Failure #104 – Tri City National Bank, Oak Creek, Wisconsin, Assumes All of the Deposits of Bank of Elmwood, Racine, Wisconsin

    The FDIC estimates that the cost to the Deposit Insurance Fund (DIF) will be $101.1 million.

    Bank Failure #105 – Central Bank, Stillwater, Minnesota, Assumes All of the Deposits of Riverview Community Bank, Otsego, Minnesota

    The FDIC estimates that the cost to the Deposit Insurance Fund (DIF) will be $20 million.

    Bank Failure #106 – First Midwest Bank, Itasca, Illinois, Assumes All of the Deposits of First Dupage Bank, Westmont, Illinois

    The FDIC estimates that the cost to the Deposit Insurance Fund (DIF) will be $59 million.

  3. grim says:

    Busy BFF.

  4. grim says:

    From the Star Ledger:

    Sales of existing homes spiked 9.4% in September

    First-time buyers rushing to take advantage of a soon-to-expire tax credit helped push home resales in September to the largest monthly increase in a quarter century.

    Sales of existing homes spiked 9.4 percent last month to a seasonally adjusted rate of 5.57 million, the National Association of Realtors said yesterday.

    The rate of growth in the Northeast was about half the national average, but still showed a healthy 4.4 percent increase over August’s sales, according to the data.

    “I think that the first time home buyers tax credit has definitely aided to boost this market,” said Jarrod Grasso, executive vice president of the New Jersey Association of Realtors. “Who would want to ever turn down $8,000?”

    He said lower home prices have also contributed to what appears to be the beginning of a recovery in the housing market.

    The median price of a house in the Northeast was $234,700, down 7 percent from a year ago.

    In the Northeast, roughly 950,000 homes were sold last month, which is more than 11 percent more than the number sold in the same period last year, the association said.

    Maintaining that pace, however, could be be a problem if the incentive — enacted in February as part of the economic stimulus package — is not renewed or expanded by Congress, officials say.

  5. grim says:

    From Barry Ritholtz at TBP:

    Existing Home Sales FALL in September 2009

    Existing Home Sales fell 5.4% last month, despite the nonsense you have read elsewhere.

    NAR continues to bullshit America with their garbage data and spin, month after month, with few people calling them on it. Well, I’ve had it up to here with their garbage:.

    No, home sales did not rebound — that was purely the result of SEASONAL ADJUSTMENTS

    As you can see on the NON SEASONALLY adjusted chart below, from August to September (Red Bar) Sales actually dropped. In prior years — 2005, 2006, 2007, and 2008 — there was always a big fall from August to September.

    This year, the fall was more modest.

    Why was this year so different? We have ZIRP (which will eventually go up) and a large 1st time buyers tax credit that is scheduled to expire. Hence, the unusual September activity that dos not reflect the traditional drop off.

    Mark Hanson notes that on a NSA basis, Existing Home Sales actually dropped 5.2% — this was the second straight monthly drop on an NSA basis.

  6. Schumpeter says:

    Grim, can you believe this assclown Jared Grosso speaks for you and me?

    We’re in a goddam second Great Depression, unemployment is probably close to 20%, all we manufacture is debt and currency buggering, NJ has become a complete Soviet welfare state…and this dolt wants to talk about the beginnings of a recovery?

    I got your recovery, Jared…right here. Please explain to me, however, how a borrower of mine, with a 25% DP, 775 FICO and a secure job paying close to 200K has to go to THREE LENDERS to get a simple 30 yr. conventional fixed mortgage. At the point where he went from lender #2 to lender #3, the seller served him with Time is of the Essence and was fully prepared to go after his DP (close to 125K) as liquidated damages. And no, there was no ticking time bomb in my client’s credit history: lender #3 was Investors’ Savings Bank, and the portfolioed the loan after a ONE-DAY underwriting period. That’s a bulletproof borrower.

    Does that sound like “recovery” to you, Jared? Or, will you call that an “outlier” or an “anomaly”?

    Well, it isn’t, buttface. I go through this on almost every deal I do, good borrower or bad.

    How the hell do you have a housing recovery when the lending industry is dead man walking?

    I await someone’s brilliant answer to this.

  7. Schumpeter says:

    I’m mad as hell, and I’m not gonna take it anymore. Anybody who wants to blow sunshine had better find somebody else’s ass to fill.

  8. freedy says:

    well , i’m glad someone else see’s
    NJ as a complete welfare state, has been for many years.

    alot of people are mad.

  9. Schumpeter says:

    Oh…it’s also a null argument to claim that FHA and the 8K tax credit are leading to any kind of recovery. Giving away money and extending zero-down credit to deadbeats is not economically sustainable; therefore, they do not lead to recovery.

  10. gary says:

    “I think that the first time home buyers tax credit has definitely aided to boost this market,” said Jarrod Grasso, executive vice president of the New Jersey Association of Realtors. “Who would want to ever turn down $8,000?”

    LOL! Assh0le!

  11. lostinny says:

    Much to our dismay, we’re going to have to sign another year lease. We can’t find a decent place that will either take our dog or allow enough room for all our stuff at a reasonable price. So we’ll have to pay a small increase and stay here where no one puts their dogs on leashes so they can all charge at my dog. Where we have a mentally ill garbage picker living downstairs who may be hoarding cats as evidenced by the unbearable smell. Oh lucky us. How many times does maintenance and management have to be called before calling animal control is justified?

  12. crossroads says:

    schumpter #9

    they’re just pulling in the last of the greater fools who felt they missed out. most people don’t know where to find info on housing and depend on realtors

  13. gary says:

    Can anyone tell me what “Arip removed” means on a listing?

  14. Kettle1 says:

    More data on stealth pain

    Small and medium sized businesses are getting beat down by customer delaying payment.

    How the F can you have recovery or green shoots when small and medium businesses have to fight to get paid for work done?

  15. morpheus says:

    215 at previous thread:

    Thank you. We try to eat and drink well at our house. Whenever we throw a party, our guests never go home hungry.

    However, my apartment is such a hovel(sic): cheap rent so I can save up for a house.

  16. morpheus says:

    F**King Newscorp, plans to charge next year for access to Pisses me off.

    screw you murdoch, go back to Australia you bastard!

  17. Outofstater says:

    #11 Lost – Call animal control now, just to say you have a concern. Or, call the police and ask them to do a “welfare check” on your neighbor. Just say that you’re concerned about him and you’d like someone to check to see if he’s okay. Don’t call 911, just call the main number and ask to speak to the desk sergeant of your precinct. Explain the situation and see what he says.

  18. Kettle1 says:


    charging for hulu is a very bad idea. How many people will just say F it and go back to torrents for all their shows? Probably enough to impact their revenue stream.

  19. safeashouses says:

    #13 Gary,

    My guess for Arip = A-hole reside in peace


    Attorney Review In Progress.

    Pure guesses on my part.

    Need coffee.

  20. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [11] lost

    Sell your stuff. Really, if you are storing it and not using it, are you even going to pay to move it?

    Less stuff, more able to find a place.

    As for poochie, if you can leave him wiht someone for awhile, and you think you can pull this off, then you can move somewhere, then later call the LL and tell him that a close family member has fallen very ill and cannot take care of poochie, and you are the only one who can, and will it be all right if he stays with us until family member recovers? Naturally, you offer to leave extra deposit and pay for damages. Only a truly heartless bastard of a LL will say no.

  21. Outofstater says:

    Arip – As in, “I’m a gonna arip you a new one?”

  22. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [20] safe

    Mmmmmm. Coffee.

    Kona is nice this morning (thanks to Stu and Gator)

  23. Comrade Nom Deplume says:

    [3] grim


    Soooo last thread, but I see you found a later closure.

  24. safeashouses says:

    #23 nom,

    you are a lucky man. I’m down to wild blueberry. Need to order some more online.

  25. Morpheus says:

    much to my shame, I must admit I have never tried Kona coffee. I bow my head in shame!

    drinking columbian today. Has a sweet flavor to it.

    how goes your homebrewing adventures? Did the kegging last nite and bottled an additional six pack.

  26. Morpheus says:

    more importantly:

    November 3, 2009: after waiting for 24 years, “V” is being remade into a new series on ABC.

    I am stoked! The series probably won’t last, but still I am excited.

  27. lostinny says:

    18 OOS

    I know management sent a letter. He must have cleaned up one day because the smell wasn’t as bad for a little while. But within days it got bad again. I think I will go the way of animal control. I am also calling management again. This guy is just so disgusting. If the inside of his apartment looks anything like the way it smells or looks the way his car looks, it’s only a matter of time before it becomes infested with something.

  28. NJGator says:

    Nom 23 – glad you are enjoying the Kona. It’s hard to go back afterwards. Even Captain Cheapo willingly mail orders it from the Big Island now.

    FYI – for the Indian Cuisine afficionados here Mehndi gets 2 very big thumbs up! Fantastic and well worth the expense. We will be going back.

  29. lostinny says:

    21 Nom

    I’ve thought about all that and gotten rid of all we can. Thanks much for the advice though. These are small places with 1 closet for the whole apartment. We can’t leave her with anyone for an extended time. Unfortunately, with some of what we’ve seen, our apartment itself, aside from being small isn’t too bad. It’s what’s around us right now that sucks.

  30. 3b says:

    Yeash, sure the economy is in the crapper, unemployment over 10%, and NJ is falling apart, but there are clowns out there talking about house prices recovering. Yeah sure !!

  31. NJGator says:

    Lost – how big of a place are you looking for? And in what towns?

  32. willwork4beer says:


    How much for the six pack? Belgian Tripel – Yum!

    Just picked up a new (to me) Ommegang. Adoration Winter Ale. 10% and I can’t wait try it. Probably tomorrow.

  33. lostinny says:

    32 Gator

    We decided to stay in SI until our dog passes on. We’re in very small place now- just under 500 sq. ft. so obviously, anything bigger then that is great.

    Our dog is old now for her breed and there are constant issues with her. We do not want to start all over again with a new vet that doesn’t know her nor do I have to figure out if I trust. Sounds crazy but honestly, we didn’t have any more luck when we were looking in NJ. The one complex we found in near DH’s job that took dogs wouldn’t take her breed. :)

  34. Shore Guy says:

    From the NYT:


    Published: October 24, 2009
    The concrete pedestrian ramps at the brand-new $1.5 billion city-subsidized Yankee Stadium have been troubled by cracks, and the team is seeking to determine whether the problems were caused by the installation, the design, the concrete or other factors, according to several people briefed on the problems.
    The ramps were built by a company accused of having links to the mob, and the concrete mix was designed and tested by a company under indictment on charges that it failed to perform some tests and falsified the results of others. But it is unclear whether work performed by either firm contributed to the deteriorating conditions of the ramp


  35. 3b says:

    #27 One of my favorites.

  36. PGC says:

    #6 Clot

    It all comes down to spin. The NAR nees a real expert in the marketing dept.

  37. Kettle1 says:

    LOL quote of the day:

    “We’re the government, we can’t run out of money!” – Shiela Bear

  38. MAR says:

    #6 I have the answer, bring back the MOB!!

  39. d2b says:

    Problem with the concrete in the stadium is it’s filled with redsox jerseys.

  40. gary says:

    It was a glorious time. Wiseguys were all over the place. It was before Apalachin and before Crazy Joey decided to take on a boss and start a war.

  41. gary says:

    He couldn’t have been more than twenty-four or twenty-five at the time, but he was already a legend. He’d walk in the door and everybody who worked the room went wild. He’d give the doorman a hundred just for opening the door. He shoved hundreds in the pockets of the dealers and who ran the games. The bartender got a hundred just for keeping the ice cubes cold.

  42. MAR says:

    gary I was kidding, but it was a good answer. However I dont have fond memories of that, I do have fond memories of Utica NY, and syrians playing Hearts. Everyone was flat broke but they were happy!

  43. sas says:

    “bank failures”

    its a misnomer, cause its not a failure.
    Its an effort of mass financial consolidation & to steal marketshare.

    wait till they get ahold of your pension funds.

    argentina here we come!

  44. Kettle1 says:


    Who did this guy piss off????

    Police are investigating after a British nuclear energy expert involved in negotiations with Iran over its nuclear programme fell 40 metres to his death from a UN building in Vienna.

  45. Kettle1 says:


    look at some of these banks, 30-40-50% losses. I agree with the people with the right connections trying to consolidate, but many of these banks really are failed.

  46. lisoosh says:

    #27 – Elizabeth Mitchel rocks. I have all sorts of love for Juliet on Lost.

    My place sucks too, although I will be getting a new bathroom courtesy of the LL and my beer collection isn’t bad thanks to Supersaver and Buy Rite.

  47. lisoosh says:

    lost – shame. Our complex takes dogs, rooms are big, plenty of closets and the townhouses are available in both 1 and 2 bedroom. The 1 beds have fireplaces too.
    Of course, this is in Jersey adn the NY commute isn’t the greatest…

  48. Barbara says:

    21 Comrade

    “Only a truly heartless bastard of a LL will say no.”

    if by heartless you mean a LL who knows that’s the oldest trick in the book and has shelled out the hassle, dollars and hours that come with a years worth of cat,dog,ferret piss removal and disinfection, then yeah I’m heartless.

  49. lostinny says:

    48 lisoosh

    I know I shouldn’t ask but I am. Where is your complex?

  50. lisoosh says:

    Interesting. Both in the UK and US there have been statements and articles from bankers defending their compensation packages.

    The justifications appear to be really pi$$ing people off, more than if they just kept their mouths shut.

    Unbelievably tone deaf.

  51. lisoosh says:

    Somerset, between New Brunswick and Princeton. Probably not the greatest location.

    Good vet nearby too.

  52. lisoosh says:

    Also take any breed, we had a Dogo/Amstaff mix (scary looking fighting dog type, but he was a sweetie), not a problem. People leash too although you do get the sneaky ones who don’t pick up.

  53. lostinny says:

    52 Lisoosh

    I wish it were possible but that commute would suck the life out of me every day. Jesus I need a change of career, like now. Something that doesn’t force me to work in some part of NYC.

  54. lisoosh says:

    lost – I know. I’ve had the commute issue loom large now, am interviewing for positions in the city and seriously considering dropping out because I think it would just be a nightmare. Especially with young kids.

  55. lostinny says:

    53 Lisoosh
    They put disposal cans with bags all around here. It was great for a while. Then people started to go and take all the bags and maintenance doesn’t replace them often. So once they run out, people just let their dogs poop everywhere.

    But you know, I knew what I was getting into with this breed. It’s a decision I have to live with. Maybe I should buy a big old house and open a doggy daycare.

  56. lostinny says:

    55 Lisoosh

    Agreed. It’s a terrible thing when your hours at work combined with the commute home give you a whole hour to spend with your kids before they go to sleep.

  57. Shore Guy says:

    Live to work vs. work to live.

  58. sas says:

    ” but many of these banks really are failed.”

    agreed. but, a little trick. when you want to take something down, you need an insider whom u dictate what to do. i.e run it into the ground. makes them look bad, and the consolidator like a hero.

    create the problem, offer fix.


  59. sas says:

    not to say there are legit failures, cause for sure, there always will be that.

    but, at the same time, one always had to keep their eyes open for trickery.

    cause the financial war is on…

  60. sas says:

    remember my story I told you about when I worked for an automotive company as outside contractor? Similar situation.

    off to get an expresso….later gater

  61. Dissident HEHEHE says:

    Well the Fix is in for Corzine in Hudson County. Mailed in my application for a mail from home ballot. Got rejection letter claiming my signature did not match the one on file. Bunch of crooks.

  62. lisoosh says:

    lostinny says:
    October 24, 2009 at 1:19 pm

    “55 Lisoosh

    Agreed. It’s a terrible thing when your hours at work combined with the commute home give you a whole hour to spend with your kids before they go to sleep.”

    Yup. My other problem is getting them up at 6 and dropping them off at 7am in order to be at work on time. Pretty exhausting at an age which requires 11 hours of sleep at night.

  63. lisoosh says:

    Then there’s what to do on teacher training days, minimum session days and all the assorted holidays they give kids and teachers but not the rest of us.

    And spending the weekend cooking something reasonably healthy for the week, doing laundry, cleaning and trying to fit in the obligatory birthday parties, soccer games and music lessons.

  64. leftwing says:


    Utica? What’s your connection?

  65. james says:

    Create the problem then present the solution. World government sound good? Americans today are a far cry from the people that made this country great. Take care of me because I cant take care of myself.

  66. Shore Guy says:

    Utica, NY? Good place for Bosnian food. Great train station too.

  67. safeashouses says:


    I picked up Wolaver’s certified organic Ben Gleason’s White Ale this week (it was on sale for $7.50 a six). Very interesting white ale with orange peel and coriander.

    This dollar rout is driving me to domestics. Need to find American versions of German and Belgium brews.

  68. Shore Guy says:

    From the BBC. I wonder if anyone considered using it for “official use”?

    Police in the US state of Minnesota are planning to auction off a specially modified and motorised lounge chair whose owner crashed it while drunk.
    Dennis LeRoy Anderson, 62, pleaded guilty last Monday to driving the La-Z-Boy while drunk in August last year.
    The chair was impounded after he smashed into a parked car as he returned from a bar in Proctor.
    The chair comes with a stereo, nitrous oxide booster, parachute and a “hell yeah it’s fast” sticker.
    Local police chief Walter Wobig told Agence France-Presse news agency the chair would be posted on eBay next week with no reserve price.
    Minnesota police can auction off vehicles seized in drink-drive cases or keep them for official use.

  69. Shore Guy says:

    Despite the very wide beaches, one must think twice before buying a vacation home in Saudi Arabia:

    I am pretty sure that 60 lashes would land one in the hospital. Surely, 1,000 is tantamount to a death sentence.

  70. willwork4beer says:

    68 safe

    We’re definitely on the same page. The problem is the micros have gone up in price as well. For the Belgians, I really like Ommegang from Cooperstown. Less expensive than the imports and very authentic. North Coast’s Brother Thelonious is a great Belgian Abbey Ale that stacks up well against the best of the style.

    Lots of German styles out there, too. I liked Sierra Nevada’s Kellerweis a whole lot this past summer.

    I try to visit a few different stores, know my prices and keep my eyes peeled for sales. I’ve also gone back to switching to the cheaper stuff for extended sessions. For me, that’s Yeungling, which I think is a decent beer considering the price (16+/case-loose bottles). Saranac is also relatively inexpensive and has a bunch of great styles. I really like the Black Forest and the Pale Pale Ale (yes, two Pales there).

    I think I need to follow Morph’s example and start brewing my own. My SIL gave me one of those little brewing kits to try out. I know its cheesy, but I figure I have to start somewhere. Maybe someday I’ll be able to brew something decent, with practice and a little luck.

  71. MAR says:

    Mar is aka Marilyn, thank you for asking my connection with Utica, is my Dad grew up there. His whole family is from there. They never left. My Dad is the only one to get out of Utica and make it big. When I was young We would go up there and see Sito , grandma in Syrian. They would all play cards, and eat great Syrian food home cooked. It bring back nice memories for me. Some of the family is still there the younger generations, but most dead. It was a different time, families were close all lived close and in huge 3 family houses.

  72. MAR says:

    Mar is aka Marilyn, thank you for asking my connection with Utica, is my Dad grew up there. His whole family is from there. They never left. My Dad is the only one to get out of Utica and make it big. When I was young We would go up there and see Sito , grandma in Syrian. They would all play cards, and eat great Syrian food home cooked. It bring back nice memories for me. Some of the family is still there the younger generations, but most dead. It was a different time, families were close all lived close and in huge 3 family houses.

  73. morpheus says:

    will work for beer:

    I must warn you: with homebrewing do not expect your beer to taste exactly like the commercial beer that you buy. As I have found out over the years, temperature control of fermentation is key. The temperature of my fermentation is based on room temperature and tends to fluctuate. However, I do not wish to spend the bucks on a fermentation chamber.

    That being said, you can make decent beer when you homebrew. It certainly will be fresh. There is also a certain satisfication you experience when drinking your own homebrew. When I drink it, I am always looking at the beer with a critical eye to see if I can improve CO2 levels, clarity, color, ect. It is an obsession.

    Yes, you will save money by brewing your own. But don’t lose sight over the fact that is fun. Also, when you mention that brew your own beer, people just want to talk to you about it. Much more people find that interesting than a discussion about my profession.

    Thanks for the info on the belgian tripel. Never tried one before, but always wanted to brew one because of the potential for high ABV.

  74. morpheus says:

    will work for beer:

    If you want to brew, remember sanitation is the key. If you want help in brewing your first batch, ask me for my E-Mail address and I can walk you through your first batch. If you want, I can guide you in person when you brew your first batch (this assumes that my boss does not stick me with another trial on short notice. I also assume you live in North Jersey)

    If the kit you have is not a “Mr. Beer” kit but is one of those bucket and malt extract kits, you can make a decent beer with that. You can make even better beer with a non-hopped malt extract kit and hop pellets/plugs/leaves.

    You can get a lot of advice on-line. I recommend seaching under google for “brewing KB”,–that will give you a helpful brewing forum. Also, there is the Jersey Association of Homebrewers website that is very helpful.

    As you can see, I rather talk about this subject than the law!

  75. PGC says:


    I might take you up on that. I have some big 5Gal tubs with spigots and Sodium bisulphate. So a trip to Corrados might get me started.

  76. sas says:

    I watched the CBS Sunday morning show with that fruitcake, washed up, non-journalist Charles Osgood. The whole show was about obesity.

    man alive, are we all that fat?

    I have a great stimulus plan. Lets make more sidewalks and give tax incentives to lose weight and go for a walk.

    put down the damn hashbrowns, put on a pair of sweats, and go for a walk… for Pete’s sake!


  77. sas says:

    which, the piss poor CBS shows fails to connect dots.

    get rid of govt subsidized corn.

    that will change your wastline real quick.


  78. willwork4beer says:


    Thanks for all the advice. My kit is indeed of the Mr Beer variety. Is there any point to using it? Or should I just go out and get the bucket and extract variety? I would feel a little bad since it was a gift but when the homebrew shows up, my SIL doesn’t have to know where it came from. I don’t want to waste my time brewing beer that doesn’t have a chance to be any good.

  79. sas says:

    speaking of food:

    “Bill giving FDA new powers to oversee food supply has wide support”,0,514104.story

    remember my posts from way back when, i think there is a major effort to consolidate the food supply, along with other sectors, but food is by far a very powerful thing to control.

    Consolidation to funnel money to very few people, stick many people with the bill & taxes, and a major way to control people & policy (both nationally & globally).

    yes, there is always a need for some regulations so we don’t have snake salesmen, but look for the overshoot.

    remember what happened to Haiti? and the California garlic farmers? or the Gulf Shrimping boats?


  80. safeashouses says:

    #71 beer,

    Thanks for the list.

  81. Morpheus says:

    will work for beer:

    I have heard on other forums that the quality of the kits that mr. beer uses is not too good.

    I would go with a bucket or carboy kit with malt extract.

    For a good first beer kit, I am partial to williams brewing in California. You can find a receipe on-line and just buy malt-extract. Corrados was rather expensive with regards to the malt extract when I bought many years ago.

    BTW: use a liquid yeast. You will get much better result. I really like Wyeast liquid yeast, but Corrado’s only has white labs.

    Since I buy grain in bulk, I use corrado’s for my hops, specialty grains and yeast. They are a little high, but it balances out when you take shipping into account. Especially when you try to recycle yeast.

  82. db says:

    Boo-ya ! what recession ! … Real estate history made in Boston’s Back Bay, masterminded by real estate guru Louise M. Sunshine

    Real estate history was made last Saturday in Boston’s Back Bay when up to $20 million of luxury homes in the same building were sold in less than an hour. Never before in the United States had an auction for multiple condominiums in one building with minimum bids starting near $1.075 million fetched final prices averaging more than $1.35 million.

    Read more:

  83. Seneca says:

    Westfield. On Fire. Just sayin.

  84. db says:

    Coming to the Jersey shore …After five hours of calling out a drumbeat of “no bid” for properties listed in an auction book as thick as a city phone directory, the energy of the county auctioneer began to flag.

    “OK,” he said. “We only have 300 more pages to go.”

  85. Old Stan says:

    WW4B: I have been enjoying Ommegang’s Hennepin, but it is pricey at 7+ per 750ml. Do you have any new suggestions to try?

  86. Sean says:

    Recession what Recession?

    Property taxes will increase about $300 for the typical homeowner in northeastern New Jersey over the coming year, despite a recession that has crimped the ability of taxpayers to foot the bill.

    Statements going out this fall reflect roughly 4 percent increases in tax levies in Bergen and Passaic counties, boosting the median residential tax to $8,744 in Bergen and $7,755 in Passaic, according to an analysis of new tax data by The Record.

    Those bills, for the 2009-10 tax year, increased by $327 in Bergen and $272 in Passaic, the analysis found.

    The cost of running town and county governments and school systems now consumes roughly $1 in every $11 of the typical Bergen County family’s income and $1 of every $9 in Passaic — according to a calculation based on Census Bureau data.

  87. Sean says:

    two additional quotes from #88 – This is worse than the crap the NAR spews.

    The increases “are within reason,” said Frank Belluscio, spokesman for the New Jersey School Boards Association. The typical North Jersey school-levy increase of slightly less than 4 percent “is an improvement over what we’ve seen in recent years.”

    From the municipal side, where levy increases generally ran from 4 percent to 6 percent, “local governments are doing a pretty good job in keeping increases as low as they can, given the harsh realities of what’s happening,” said William Dressel, executive director of the New Jersey State League of Municipalities. “If they are coming in at 6 percent or less, they must be doing their job,” he said.

  88. grim says:

    Superb, so in 2020 average property taxes in Northern NJ are going to be up near $15k.

  89. Shore Guy says:


    And for proximity to NY, every dollar will be well spent. Living in an area full of successful people costs.

  90. grim says:

    From the WSJ:

    Capmark Seeks Chapter 11

    One of the nation’s largest commercial-real-estate lenders filed for bankruptcy protection in Delaware, the latest sign that problems in that market are far from over.

    Capmark Financial Group Inc. has been one of the biggest lenders to the nation’s investors and developers of office towers, strip malls, hotels and other commercial properties. An independent firm that formerly was the commercial lending unit of GMAC LLC, a financing affiliate of General Motors Co., it had been in financial straits for months.

    A bankruptcy filing, which had been expected since the company’s own warning in September, won’t necessarily send shock waves through the sector. The legal maneuver is likely to enable the company to buy time to restructure its debt so that it won’t need to sell off its billions of dollars in assets quickly, according to legal experts.

  91. grim says:

    And for proximity to NY, every dollar will be well spent.

  92. NJGator says:

    Grim 90 – The average tax bill in Montclair hit $15k this year.

    The Gator family is looking at their 2nd annual tax decrease due to our assessment challenges. We are now paying a bargain $12,800.

  93. Shore Guy says:

    Recession Will Be ‘Full-Blown Depression’: Strategist

    This global recession will turn into a “full-blown depression,” Nicu Harajchi, CEO of N1 Asset Management, said Friday, adding that global stimulus hasn’t come down to Main Street.

    Wall Street is making money, while consumers aren’t, Harajchi told CNBC.

    “We have seen the G20 coming out with cross border capital injections of $5 trillion this year… But a lot of this money hasn’t really come down to Main Street,” he said.

    “When it comes down to corporate America, corporate Europe or even in Asia, in Japan, we are not seeing Main Street making any money,” he said. “Consumers are losing their jobs. They are struggling with their mortgages, with their credit. And we are just seeing this continuing.”

    The $5 trillion injection is “monetary expansion,” according to Harajchi. “At some point, which we believe to be 2010/11, some of the central banks are going to recall some of that money and that will turn from monetary expansion to monetary contraction.”

    He also said he doesn’t see the corporates or the public “being able to pay back that debt.”

    “We see 2010 becoming a much more risky year than 2009,” he said.


  94. Shore Guy says:

    “We are now paying a bargain $12,800.”


    I am sooooo embarassed for you two. Admitting that you are seeking to cheap out and leave the burden of providing city government to your neighbors. There is no shame in admitting that one can not afford to live there. (Tongue planted firmly in cheek).

  95. NJGator says:

    Shore 96 – We’re going to get run out of town anyway. Stu put up our Elect the School Board yard sign today. So apparently we are just a bunch of right-wing reactionary child haters. Might as well go out with a bang.

  96. NJGator says:

    Apologies if this has already been posted:

    Fair Game
    If Lenders Say ‘The Dog Ate Your Mortgage’

    FOR decades, when troubled homeowners and banks battled over delinquent mortgages, it wasn’t a contest. Homes went into foreclosure, and lenders took control of the property.

    On top of that, courts rubber-stamped the array of foreclosure charges that lenders heaped onto borrowers and took banks at their word when the lenders said they owned the mortgage notes underlying troubled properties.

    In other words, with lenders in the driver’s seat, borrowers were run over, more often than not. Of course, errant borrowers hardly deserve sympathy from bankers or anyone else, and banks are well within their rights to try to protect their financial interests.

    But if our current financial crisis has taught us anything, it is that many borrowers entered into mortgage agreements without a clear understanding of the debt they were incurring. And banks often lacked a clear understanding of whether all those borrowers could really repay their loans.

    Even so, banks and borrowers still do battle over foreclosures on an unlevel playing field that exists in far too many courtrooms. But some judges are starting to scrutinize the rules-don’t-matter methods used by lenders and their lawyers in the recent foreclosure wave. On occasion, lenders are even getting slapped around a bit.

    One surprising smackdown occurred on Oct. 9 in federal bankruptcy court in the Southern District of New York. Ruling that a lender, PHH Mortgage, hadn’t proved its claim to a delinquent borrower’s home in White Plains, Judge Robert D. Drain wiped out a $461,263 mortgage debt on the property. That’s right: the mortgage debt disappeared, via a court order.

    So the ruling may put a new dynamic in play in the foreclosure mess: If the lender can’t come forward with proof of ownership, and judges don’t look kindly on that, then borrowers may have a stronger hand to play in court and, apparently, may even be able to stay in their homes mortgage-free.

    The reason that notes have gone missing is the huge mass of mortgage securitizations that occurred during the housing boom. Securitizations allowed for large pools of bank loans to be bundled and sold to legions of investors, but some of the nuts and bolts of the mortgage game — notes, for example — were never adequately tracked or recorded during the boom. In some cases, that means nobody truly knows who owns what.

  97. willwork4beer says:

    87 Old Stan

    I can’t think of anything like Hennepin that you’ll find any cheaper. But you might want to try the rest of Ommegang’s offerings if you like Hennepin and you’re looking for something new.

    That said, try shopping around. Hennepin, Rare Vos and Witte were going for $5.99/750ml at Glendale Liquors in Lawrence Twp (Mercer County) today. And check the price on the four packs. I routinely see them for 7-8 bucks for almost double the volume of the 750ml bottle.

    Also, Hennepin will mature a bit in the bottle, so if buying by the case is cheaper, you might want to try that.

  98. willwork4beer says:

    83 Morpheus

    Thanks again for your help. I’ll check out williams online. I think that would be a good place for me to start.

    BTW – the Ommegang Adoration is spicy and complex. Very interesting stuff.

  99. Sean says:

    re: #98 – njgator – Bookkeeping is such a bore, especially when there are billions to be made shoveling the same loans over and over into multiple SIVs and CDOs like coal into the Titanic’s boilers.

  100. Essex says:

    Go Yankees.

  101. Shore Guy says:

    Three outs to go.

  102. Shore Guy says:

    Two outs to go.

  103. Shore Guy says:

    Oh, boy! Three little strikes between the Yankees and the 40th trip to the WS.

  104. Shore Guy says:

    Do I hear Don Meredith singing?

Comments are closed.