Thanksgiving Open Discussion

Happy Thanksgiving everyone!


This is the time and place to post observations about your local areas, comments on news stories or the New Jersey housing market, open house reports, etc. If you have any questions you wanted to ask earlier in the week but never posted them up, let’s have them. Also a good place to post suggestions, requests for information, criticism, and praise.

For readers that have never commented, there is a link at the top of each message that is typically labeled “[#] Comments“. Go ahead and give that a click, you might be missing out on a world of information you didn’t know about. While you are there, introduce yourselves to everyone.

For new readers that have only read the messages displayed on the main page, take a look through the archives, a substantial amount of information has been put online in the past year. The archives can be accessed by using the links found in the menus on the right hand side of the page.

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47 Responses to Thanksgiving Open Discussion

  1. stan says:


    Much to be thankful for, such as first poster!

  2. Still_Renting says:

    HAPPY THANKSGIVING! Grim thanks for the advice and information throughout the year and thanks to all of you who contribute too.

  3. Simon says:


    I’m thankful I’ve embraced the oblivion.

  4. simon (3)-

    Good for you. It’s here.

    Drink up, gang. Just about go time.

  5. When a weekly Sarah Palin shriekfest in the wilderness becomes a hit show, it’s a pretty good sign that we are becoming enveloped in the mist of doom.

  6. NJCoast says:

    Happy Thanksgiving.

    I’ll be thinking of JJ when I see the creamed onions.

  7. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Happy Thanksgiving!
    March of the Wooden Soldiers 9 am channel 11, a Turkey day classic.

  8. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Clot get cooking, I would imagine with your cooking skills you are on the hook.
    No big deal I’m sure, I don’t get in a bunch till it is over 200. Fifteen or so a walk in the park.

  9. Fast Eddie says:

    I’m thankful that I still have some faith in people for coming to their senses and putting an end to this experiment:

  10. Dissident HEHEHE says:

    The Coming Property Tax Cliff Means More Bad News for Municipal Finances

    Look at those graphs and be thankful you aren’t a municipal employee.

  11. Uncollapsed feline wave form says:


    from last night. I’m not giving anyone a pass fisa and the patriot ack are abhorrent. Bush should have been impeached and or charged with war crimes by any reasonable population. Both parties are 2 heads of the same snake and have both committed multiple acts that should rise to treason.

    Happy thanksgiving all !!!

  12. safe as houses says:

    I’m thankful for JJ’s stories.

  13. Mikeinwaiting says:

    Northeast Housing Delinquency Data: Housing Crisis Isn’t Over Yet Although many have called an end to the housing crisis two times over, we still have a way to go. New delinquency data from the rich northeast states stands as another testament to a housing market in crisis. It is sometimes hard to believe just how much the housing market was blown out of proportion.

    Late mortgage payments jumped sharply in several northeastern states during the third quarter. The rate of borrowers who were 60 days or more past due on their home loans jumped sharply in New York, New Jersey, Maine, Connecticut and Delaware for the three months ended Sept. 30 compared with the year-ago period, according to TransUnion. Pennsylvania, Vermont, Rhode Island, Maryland and New Hampshire also saw higher delinquency in the quarter, but the increases were not as substantial.How are home prices going to rise in these markets if unemployment is still high and nearly every forecast on the market is for tepid job growth in 2011. What about incomes? One can find a job, but will they earn more or less what they earned on their previous job? Over the last 10 years ending 2009, incomes are down.

    The northeast has been resilient with its highly educated population, diversified economy, and hub to the nation’s biggest banks. The lowest cost housing in the U.S. remains in the South, with average prices around $149,500. If you assume that the average household income for the south remains at 2009 levels of $45,615, then home prices are around 3-times income there, bringing prices in line with 1970s levels. But in the northeast, we see a different story. Median household income in 2009 was $53,073 while average home prices are currently around $239,200, or around 4.5-times median incomes. They were around 6-times in 2008, so they have come down. Not enough. I think there is more bad news coming for mortgage lenders because there is room for northeast real estate prices to fall further. Here are two reasons why:

    1. Lackluster employment and income.

    The job market remains very poor and we will shortly see the expiration of 99 weeks of unemployment for many and a huge increase in mortgage foreclosures and bankruptcy filings. The surprise will be how fast real estate prices fall and get inline with what has happened in other parts of the country.

    The northeast housing market has been resilient but it is going to crack under the weight of continuing deteriorating economic fundamentals. The US Department of Agriculture further states that food stamp usage is up 17% nationally from a year ago. But it’s above average in many rich northeast states; most notably Connecticut and New Jersey.

    1. Connecticut up 25.5 % (359,487)

    3. New Jersey up 26.6 % (677,167)

    4. New Hampshire up 23.2 % (109,967)

    5. Rhode Island up 27.8 % (148,529)

  14. ReadngtnDude says:

    I think that the later chart undermines the article’s argument. The property tax revenues did not keep up with the increase in housing prices from 1997 to 2005. This means the down-side is not really a cliff, just a very long slide to the right. Property taxes will likely continue flat to down going right since the re-assessments and sales are slow to flow into the system. It would be interesting to the the chart back to about 1982 to see how the 80s run-up affected revenues to see if my argument has historical basis.

    The argument supporting the article is surely that the base rates have continued to go up as the rates fell. The real question is how long can the rates hold even steady in this environment? If they start to slide, then cliff is starting to look pretty steep.

    In my neck of the woods, the rates are holding steady……

  15. chicagofinance says:

    Happy Thanksgiving…..only 45 minutes to alcohol…go Jets.

  16. Confused In NJ says:

    Obama asks country to help make tomorrow better

    WASHINGTON – Saying America has a history of doing what it takes to make a better tomorrow, President Barack Obama is calling on a country climbing out of its worst economic slump in decades to summon that spirit again this holiday season.

    “This is not the hardest Thanksgiving America has ever faced. But as long as many members of our American family are hurting, we’ve got to look out for one another,” Obama said in his weekly radio and Internet address, released for Thanksgiving.

    “As long as many of our sons and daughters and husbands and wives are at war, we’ve got to support their mission and honor their service,” Obama added. “And as long as many of our friends and neighbors are looking for work, we’ve got to do everything we can to accelerate this recovery and keep our economy moving forward.”

    In the weekly Republican message, Georgia Rep.-elect Austin Scott characterized the 85-member incoming freshman class as a “new breed of leaders for a new majority and a new Congress” and said they stand ready to turn around the country.

    The GOP won control of the House in elections earlier this month and will take over in January.

    “As much as we have to be thankful for, too many Georgians and too many Americans have been out of work for far too long,” Scott said. “Our new Republican majority is ready to focus on creating jobs and putting a stop to the runaway spending in Washington, D.C.”

    Mindful of the new political reality taking shape in Washington, a new order in which Democrats no longer will rule both the White House and Congress, Obama wove another call for bipartisanship into his holiday message.

    He said one political party won’t be able to solve all the country’s problems.

    “We’ve got to do it as one people,” the president said. “And in the coming weeks and months, I hope that we can work together, Democrats and Republicans and independents alike, to make progress on these and other issues.” He cited jobs and economic recovery among the issues.

    Obama is to meet at the White House on Tuesday with congressional leaders from both parties, a session originally announced for Nov. 18 but was delayed a week and a half after Republicans said they couldn’t accommodate the president.

    Obama was spending Thanksgiving at the White House with family and friends.

    “How about the Country asks Obama & Congress to stop making tomorrow Worse!”

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  18. BM says:


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  19. mike (8)-

    All I had to do was the veg for 19 this year. I can do that while dropping a deuce.

  20. Biggest challenge was not to grind my MIL’s leftover Xan@x into the brussels sprouts.

  21. Shit. The Jets are playing today?

    Need more whiskey.

  22. Got 5 Champions League games on the TIVO. Whew.

    Bayern v. Roma will kick us off!

  23. cobbler says:

    I’ve spent the first 2 weeks of November in China visiting a bunch of my company’s suppliers’ plants. This is the third time I am on about the same route: first was in 1999, then in early 2006. The change I saw both at the plants and almost everywhere else is palpable and close to unbelievable. We drove a total of about 1,500 miles on the Autobahn-quality roads (tolls are biting, though, for an average Chinese car owner). We rode a high-speed train that covered in 1.5 hrs the distance it took us 6 hrs by car on my last trip (I took a photo of 356 km/h reading on a speed indicator in the railcar). I hiked around Beijing for 5 hrs on my day off without my shirt collar going black. The first thing our hosts showed us when we came to the factories were the new waste treatment plants which are on par or better than we’ve got here; ditto for the production floors. I saw almost no one wearing the ugly blue “Mao suits” which in 1999 had been the attire of probably 50% of the people in the street. Finally, an average pedestrian in the street had been visibly happy; I never saw so many smiles before.
    Generally, I like it when the people get rewarded for their hard work. What I don’t like is to what extent this major improvement in the quality of life I’ve seen is the result of a zero sum game played by our corporations and Chinese government, on one side, against the American middle class, on the other. This is the game we can’t win – thus it had to be stopped before our losses become irreversible and intolerable; social stability here (despite clot’s alternating calls for oblivion and rebellion) is not less valuable than it is in China where the government uses the threat of instability to justify most anything. And I can’t see anything besides strong industrial policy and high tariffs that could stop the game. The longer we wait for someone to come and blow the whistle, the worse off we will be when it happens.

    Happy Thanksgiving!

  24. jamil says:

    23: it is amazing what capitalism can achieve. Maybe we should give it a try in the US too?

  25. jamil says:

    So it begins:
    Calls for Britain to leave the EU. They are not in Euro or Schengen so there isn’t much point in that anyway (other than providing a lot of high-paying government jobs for former politicians).

    “THE Daily Express today becomes the first national newspaper to call for Britain to leave the European Union. ”

  26. Essex says:

    NJ RE….embrace your inner malcontent. Shhhhhrrrriiiiieeeeeek.

  27. reinvestor101 says:

    >>I saw almost no one wearing the ugly blue “Mao suits” which in 1999 had been the attire of probably 50% of the people in the street. Finally, an average pedestrian in the street had been visibly happy; I never saw so many smiles before.<<

    Those commies are smiling and laughing at us! If my ass is sitting over here being glum, I damn sure don't want to hear about commies being happy. That's not supposed to be because they have a damn centrally planned economy that wasn't supposed to work dammit. Tell you what, this stunt that North Korea pulled off the other day is reason enough for us to send a damn missile up Beijing's ass. I want to see those damn autobahns and trains reduced to damn rubble and I don't want to wait five damn years to see it. I want to see that right the hell now.

    I was relaxing after my damn meal and now I'm upset. Don't ever post anything about these damn commies on a holiday.

  28. Shore Guy says:

    “I’ll be thinking of JJ when I see the creamed onions.”

    Ewwwwwwwwwwwwwww. Scratch that dish off the list forever.

  29. Fcuk the Chinese. Bunch of goddamned fascists who have no souls, no faith, no ideas, no imagination and have no problem enslaving their own or committing genocide to make a buck. We entered the ultimate Faustian bargain when we began selling them our debt, exporting all our worst ideas to them and turning a blind eye to their utter disregard for human life or freedom.

    We will end up burning in hell and paying multiple societal damages for regarding them as anything other than billions of hostile mongrel half-humans. They will end up owning us, and we will end up with landfills full of toxic, festering Chinese trinkets in return.

  30. It is a sign of our own degeneracy as a society and as a nation that college-age kids in China- raised under a totalitarian, slavedriver machine-state- immediately recognize the utter corruption and stupidity of people like Eraserhead and laugh in his face within minutes of encountering him.

    The Chinese are utterly corrupt and subhuman…and innately know that we are even worse.

  31. Watch a bunch of stupid, old Eurotrash take a righteous verbal asswhipping:

    Nigel Farage for the Nobel Prize!!!!

  32. I’ve watched #31 a couple of times now, and I think it’s the best, most succinct and forceful political speech I’ve seen in ages.

    Anybody agree/disagree?

  33. Dan says:


    The speech was beautiful.

  34. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    Too bad Nigel didn’t pick up the phone when God called Hammerin Hank regarding AIG and GS. Counter Party? Stick it up your arse!

  35. Mr Wantanapolous says:

    How about a debate between Nigel and The Bernank?

  36. Libtard says:

    J-E-T-S Jets Jets Jets.

  37. Essex says:

    31. amazing. really strong stuff.

  38. Essex says:

    Some guy from Glasgow bought my strat, or so it seemed. He then waited to pay and later bitched about shipping fee and I told him to f/off. I suppose I will keep it. No more sales to europe they don’t seem to want to pay shipping.

  39. Essex says:

    How can it be black friday? My accounts are in the red.

  40. Confused In NJ says:

    Sophisticated drug tunnel found in San Diego

    Thu Nov 25, 11:14 pm ET
    SAN DIEGO – U.S. authorities on Thursday found a sophisticated tunnel used to smuggle drugs between Mexico and San Diego, the second such discovery in the region in less than a month.

    The half-mile passage runs from a residence in Tijuana to a warehouse in San Diego’s Otay Mesa area, the San Diego Tunnel Task Force said in a statement.

    Federal border patrol, drug enforcement, immigration, and customs enforcement agents in the task force arrested several suspects and seized an undetermined amount of marijuana in a tractor-trailer on U.S. soil, the statement said.

    The statement said authorities believed more marijuana was being stored inside the tunnel. Agents were working with the Mexican military on the investigation.

    Officials said they will release further details of the probe Friday afternoon.

    Earlier this month, federal agents made one of the largest marijuana seizures in the United States when they confiscated 20 tons of marijuana they said was smuggled into the country through another tunnel connecting warehouses on either side of California’s border with Mexico. Mexican authorities seized more than four tons of pot from the warehouse south of the border.

    The secret passageway ran the length of six football fields and had lighting, ventilation and a rail system to send loads of illegal drugs from Mexico into California.

  41. NJCoast says:

    I’ll be spending today with these lovely boys. I can’t wait. The end IS nigh.

  42. reinvestor101 says:

    >>How can it be black friday? My accounts are in the red.<<

    If I had my damn Heloc and my credit cards, I could enjoy this damn day. I lost both of them when my damn lines were cut. It's this sort of damn thing that makes me want to go out and string up the first damn real estate terrorist I can get my hands on.

  43. Essex says:

    44. They were doing you a favor! Cash is king. Yo.

  44. toomuchchange says:

    #23 Cobbler —

    Thanks for the observations and insights.

    Future generations of Chinese may well regret the meteoric rise of China. In 25-50 years many of the bills will come in for that, e.g., extreme and reckless environmental pollution and the resulting disease and early deaths, etc.

    I sure agree with you final words. We have look out and change our ways soon or we’ll be lost before we know it.

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