From Salon:
Chris Christie’s era of misrule in Jersey: The empty swamp mall and the canceled tunnel
While Gov. Chris Christie’s Bridgegate gambit rightfully helped kneecap his presidential run, it was his cancellation, in 2010, of a trans-Hudson rail tunnel that will have generational consequences not just for New Jersey but for the entire Northeast Corridor. And yet, even as he pulled the plug on the essential second Hudson tunnel, Christie was doubling down on trying to provide public support to complete a 2 million-square-foot mall in the Hackensack Meadowlands that had already lost over $1 billion in public pension funds and been pursued by three of his Democratic predecessors.
For years now, a two-million square-foot mall has been sitting in the Meadowlands and never opened, a kind of white-collar crime scene visible from space, but invisible to the locals at ground-level, because it has become just a part of the New Jersey Turnpike landscape. How it came to be built on state land is testimony to a culture of self-dealing and corruption that reaches all the way to Washington and back to the halcyon Clinton years. It involves names of prominent partisans on both sides of the aisle. Consider, it’s probably the only résumé item that Republican strategist Charlie Black, of Manafort & Stone fame, and the late Democratic governor of Texas, Ann Richards, have in common.
It is hard to imagine but the New York/New Jersey metro region hasn’t always been so dysfunctional when it came to infrastructure. In the 1920s and ‘30s, the region completed no less than four bridges linking New Jersey and New York – the Goethals, the Outerbridge Crossing, the Bayonne Bridge and the George Washington Bridge – all ahead of schedule and well below budget. Of course, that was thanks to the Port Authority of New York and New Jersey, which more recently has suffered so badly under Christie’s authoritarian reign.
In the 21st century, it seems we can’t get out of our own way, culminating in the last seven years of misrule under Christie. The physical deterioration of vital links, like the trans-Hudson rail tunnel between the two states, now haunts the public every day with chronic delays and a certain amount of personal risk every time they use the existing century-old Hudson rail tunnel.
…
Why do some projects get built, while others – perhaps more essential to our security and well-being – get sidelined and languish? Our political economy is all about choices – who makes them and why. Some construction is about the public interest. Other undertakings are driven by market forces. There are projects that are a combination of both. Sorting this out is critical when we talk about setting the ground rules for “public-private partnerships,” the au courant Trump-plan approach to funding municipal infrastructure in an age of political anxiety over incurring additional public debt.For decades, engineers have said that the region desperately needed a second trans-Hudson passenger-rail tunnel but it just couldn’t get off the ground. Meanwhile, just a couple of miles away in the Meadowlands, the state of New Jersey under Christie’s leadership continues to press ahead with a mega-mall public-private project on state land. The project has already failed twice, cost public pensions from several states nearly a billion dollars, and is expected to cost more than $5 billion.
Even now, the backers of the project have completed yet another round of bond issues worth more than $1 billion on behalf of the third private developer at the site, which they are marketing through the Public Finance Authority, based in Wisconsin. Neither the New Jersey Sports and Exposition Authority, upon whose land the project was sited, nor the local municipality where it is located, want to assume any financial liability for the performance of the “non-recourse” bonds being floated in their name to complete the project that was supposed to be open to the public a decade ago.
Except condos. From CurbedNY:
In Jersey City’s burgeoning Powerhouse Arts District, 242 new condos hit the market
It’s been a busy week for Jersey City’s thriving real estate scene. Yesterday, new details emerged on the 429-unit condo project, Park and Shore, which is set to launch sales in September, and today the Wall Street Journal has details on another condo. This new 28-story tower is being developed by Toll Brothers City Living (think Pierhouse in Brooklyn Heights) and will bring 242 apartments to Provost Square in Downtown Jersey City.
The development had a soft launch on July 5, and already sales activity is pretty brisk, a representative for Toll Brothers informed Curbed. Now, sales are officially underway, and apartments here start from the low $400,000 and go up to $1.3 million. Condos come in studios through three-bedroom variants with apartments ranging in size from 563 square feet to just over 1,300 square feet. The project was designed by HLW International, and is located within the Powerhouse Arts District.
10 Provost is part of a three-building development at the newly created Provost Square. The pedestrian plaza is located between Morgan and Bay Streets and includes cobblestone paths and seating. The Grove Street PATH station is right next to the square. As part of its three-building project, Toll Brothers first developed a rental building at Provost Square, the 417-unit The Morgan. A 550-seat theater is to follow after the condo project. Work on 10 Provost is expected to wrap sometime in the fall of 2018.
Though much of the new development transforming Jersey City and New Jersey’s Hudson River-fronting waterfront has been rentals, the Wall Street Journal reports that both 10 Provost and Park and Shore are an indication that a host of new condos are on their way to Jersey City.
Kennedy Jr. was dead on, esp his description of developer’s tactics.
““Opponents of the proposed mall claim it would not only decimate a recovering wildlife refuge, but also mar the region’s human landscape by creating traffic jams and urban sprawl,” Morley wrote. “One of the most prominent of these opponents, environmental litigator Robert F. Kennedy, Jr. – who was/is also one of Al Gore’s environmental advisers – says the mall would be nothing less than a “’national disaster.’”
He continued, “The mall’s developer, the Mills Corporation of Arlington, Virginia, not surprisingly, sees the matter rather differently. To Mills CEO Laurence C. Siegel – who happens to be a major contributor to Gore’s campaign – Meadowlands Mills will be a shopping and entertainment complex that will employ thousands and enthrall millions.”
Kennedy went on the record, calling out the swamp swap as a sham transaction that would further endanger the ecological integrity of the Meadowlands. “It’s an old developer’s trick. You claim you want to do something totally outrageous, and then you scale it back. You say, ‘I’m being reasonable here. I’m willing to compromise here.’ That is not a compromise in my view. To me, it’s like putting lipstick on a donkey.””
maybe could buy a couple and rent them?
Michael, wha u think?
“Now, sales are officially underway, and apartments here start from the low $400,000 and go up to $1.3 million. “
This article represents some good journalism. Love how the point out the irony of Christie saving us money on the tunnel project by canceling it, but then doubles down on this mall? Thanks, buddy! Thank you so much for chasing national republican attention by trying to paint yourself as fiscal conservative. That tunnel would be completed just about now and would have paid for itself, even with the cost overruns. Pure ignorance.
What you proved…..you are the poster boy for incompetence that has done nothing for the future of this state. Get the hell out of here already. This state economy could have been so much better already, and Murphy will prove it. You guys can hate on Murphy all you want, but I bet he does good by this state.
This State is nothing more than a VW beetle stuffed with clowns.
Good Monday morning, NJ.
Greetings from beautiful Casco Maine. Lots of tattoos and piercings up here. And lots of pot.
Caitlyn Jenner considering running for US Senate in CA vs Dianne Feinstein.
http://www.latimes.com/politics/essential/la-pol-ca-essential-politics-updates-caitlyn-jenner-may-run-for-u-s-senate-1500243172-htmlstory.html
Caitlyn Jenner, the Olympic gold medalist, reality show star and transgender activist, is weighing a run for the U.S. Senate representing California.
“I have considered it. I like the political side of it,” Jenner said in a radio interview with New York’s AM 970 that aired Sunday, adding that she planned to make a decision within the next six months or so.
“I gotta find out where I can do a better job,” she said. “Can I do a better job from the outside, kind of working the perimeter of the political scene, being open to talk to anybody? Or are you better off from the inside, and we are in the process of determining that.”
Jenner has been in the spotlight for decades – first as Bruce, an Olympic athlete and the long-suffering husband and father in the Kardashian reality television empire, and then as the activist who transitioned to Caitlyn in 2015, becoming one of the most famous transgender voices in the world.
The Malibu resident is a lifelong Republican. The next opportunity to run for Senate will be in 2018, when Democrat Dianne Feinstein is up for reelection. Feinstein, 84, has not yet said if she will run again. No prominent Republican candidate has publicly announced interest in the seat.
Jenner, 67, is a supporter of President Trump, which would likely be an issue in a state the president lost by more than 4 million votes. But Jenner has clashed with Trump over transgender bathroom policy, and has been working to make the Republican Party more inclusive to the LGBTQ community.
In the interview, she said she had plans to meet with Nikki Haley, the United States’ ambassador to the United Nations, to discuss the international ramifications for being involved with the LGBTQ community.
“I hope to change the perception of the Republican Party and make it the party of equality,” she said, adding that she believes the GOP would be unstoppable if it kept its small-government, fiscally conservative values while being more accepting of people who have not traditionally been part of the party.
Kennedy is just worried that they are going to find Jimmy Hoffa
RE Question for the group: What is going commission rate for selling a home in NJ?
Our home has been updated from top to bottom, inside and out and we’re fairly confident it will sell quickly since we’re being realistic about the list price. Given that, I have a hard time justifying paying 6% (split 50/50) for someone to list the house on the MLS and hosting an open house. We’ve looked into some of those discount brokers that will list on the MLS for a flat fee and then you pay a percentage to a buyer’s agent. Do these listings carry a stigma with them? Will agents really pass up showing a house because they might get a few thousand less?
Are there any non-discounted agents that would take a listing for 4-5% in total commissions? If so, how do you go about negotiating with them? Everyone we spoke with made it seem like 6% is set in stone.
Put a for sale sign in your front yard.
The only reason Christie won election in this solidly blue state is because the democrats turned the state into a basket-case with their over-spending ways. When taxpayers are spending $400,000 per classroom, there is no way this state can recover.
Thought about that, but being on a low-traffic street wouldn’t get us the exposure we need. Essentially, we just need to be on MLS and all the RE websites and the house will sell itself.
Pumpkin, that article is as much Fake News as it gets. E.G. The tunnel ended at a point where no connections could be made to other mass transit. It would also have been paid for by NJ funds exclusively (NY – not a dime) to the tune of about $10billion. Would you have sung a sweet song if they had to compensate by raising your income taxes, sales taxes and gas taxes even higher? It’s all too typical of bs reporting where they don’t mention the real outcomes of decisions. Just a negative play. And I’m no fan of this gov. He is an ahole, sorry. He did nothing. Look at the NJ supremes, abbott districting, Mt Laurel, etc. blah blah blah…….sick of these stories
I can’t see giving someone 6% either for doing close to nothing
Set up open house signs on cones with balloons attached
Pumps following up on Xolepa. In addition the majority of NJ taxpayers work in NJ and they would be forced to pay for a tunnel that would only benefit a minority
Who commute from NJ to NYC. It should have been paid for by the federal government.
“since we’re being realistic about the list price”
Sure you are….
What how fast your house sells if you offer 7% commission.
First Time – Willing to share any details about your home? I’m in the market and I am willing to work without a broker. If you are willing, send me some info and any pics. Perhaps we can find lightening in a bottle.
homebuyer2017nj AT gmail
Taco Bell (clot Edition):
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ikGY1Szlq0I
Maybe it’s my own inexperience talking, but IMO homes that don’t sell quickly are overpriced. Those that do are priced correctly– it’s as simple as that. I think internet marketing, printing brochures, and holding open houses add very little (if any) value to the transaction. Get the home out there to potential buyers (and their agents) on the MLS and RE websites and the rest will take care of itself.
JB – even if we read the market incorrectly, I’d have no problem adjusting the price accordingly. Heck, if i could get 15% more I’d give a realtor 10% but it doesn’t work that way. The market will always determine the appropriate price.
From a buyer’s perspective, I’m looking for a home that fits my family’s needs and fits our budget. I don’t care who the listing agent is, what brokerage they work for, or whether they have glossy color printouts at the open house. Maybe I’m an exception to the rule, but I sure hope not.
FirstTime – Send me some details, I am in the market to buy and would love to complete a deal that saves us all some $, with a suitable tip to our host of course.
https://www.wsj.com/articles/the-new-hot-office-market-central-new-jersey-1500123600
Xolepa, my problem has always been that he has done nothing to boost this state’s economy. There should be 3 or 4 tunnels being worked on as we speak. There should be giant pedestrian bridge, scratch that, a couple of giant pedestrian bridges across the river. How much does a pedestrian bridge cost? How much can of couple of those help with congestion? I’m sick and tired of nothing creative getting done with nj’s location. If I was governor, this state would be flush with cash after my two terms were over. Fatman has done absolutely nothing. Makes me sick. At least try, but he hasn’t even tried.
Also, I think that article is based on some pretty good journalism, I wouldn’t exactly call that fake news, but that’s just my opinion. The amount of research to put that article together is impressive. The article had a nice flow, and backed its position with evidence. Hard to call that fake news, but it’s a matter of opinion.
Fatboy did get some federal money from that. He took it and spent it on road projects (I think the bridge replacement). He should have put that money in an invested fund that could only go towards a “new” tunnel or bridge.
I also agree it’s time the federal govt invest in this area instead of sucking it dry. The entire country benefits from the economic activity in this area, therefore, they should stop sucking us dry for a couple of years and let us invest in our infrastructure. After that, they can go back to sucking us dry, but give us a break for god’s sake.
3b says:
July 17, 2017 at 12:11 pm
Pumps following up on Xolepa. In addition the majority of NJ taxpayers work in NJ and they would be forced to pay for a tunnel that would only benefit a minority
Who commute from NJ to NYC. It should have been paid for by the federal government.
here should be giant pedestrian bridge, scratch that, a couple of giant pedestrian bridges across the river. How much does a pedestrian bridge cost?
Are you for real? Did you ever consider what this would take?
Let’s say we build one in Hoboken where the river is the narrowest. There would be at least 10-15 floors of steps to climb, probably higher to accommodate the ship traffic underneath. Then a mile walk across a the river. Great, so you’ve been walking for 20-30 minutes, now you are in the no mans land that is the West Side.
You have said some really dumb Sh!t here in your history but this is easily the dumbest. Please let me know where you see a pedestrian bridge starting/ending (what town), would there be parking for people to walk this bridge?
It’s probably better for NJ for NYC to become more inaccessible than ever. Plenty of businesses have been happy to leave NYC for NJ because it’s just cheaper and easier to operate out of. Let it keep happening.
Want a tunnel built…we should hire the Swiss. NJ and NY along with Amtrak have proven time and time again they do not have the ability to successfully complete a project like a Hudson river tunnel. Christie was right to kill the tunnel and if I recall Xanadu or what ever they are calling it was well underway before he became governor, and a failed project. Something needed to be done with it and there aren’t too many options. I remember when the RFP went out the company my dad worked for made a proposal, his comment was the government was demanding different than a mall or shopping center complex and that there was literally no market for what they were trying to create and it likely could become a white elephant. Traditional retail was what the developers wanted and an exception from the Bergen blue laws, if they got that it was a slam dunk and the state could have gotten a lot of money for the development rights. Being on the edge of hudson and essex counties it was a disadvantage to be in Bergen but a shopping mall with the Tunnel proximity, close to Giants Stadium could have competed with the Garden State Plaza, which is some of the most productive retail around(sales vs. rents per sq ft).
Christie is an absolute boob but we can’t hang Xanadu on him and killing the tunnel was the prudent thing to do NJ couldn’t afford the deal Corzine made.
The problem is small minded people like pumpkin actually think the government can do “things”. With our system of government the government is complementary, it doesn’t produce, it can only support. The problem in NJ is one of competitiveness, yes we have a good location, good demographics, etc but the tax and regulatory environment is so bad here, coupled with failing infrastructure we don’t know how to fix in the most densely populated place in the US makes this a challenging environment. People/Businesses are attracted to the lowest risk option, NJ is the boom bust market(you can make a project that is crazy profitable or your can wind up with Xanadu and you are at the mercy of the inept politicians who run the state and it’s not just the governor).
Speaking of Bergen County “blue laws”. What’s their excuse for this tyranny? Not that I have the slightest desire to ever visit the traffic-congested county to shop, but it’s not the 1600s any more.
Here’s an article that covers the topic irritatingly. Sounds like Bergen county people just want to let everyone know how special they are.
http://www.newyorker.com/business/currency/americas-last-ban-sunday-shopping
Bike paths across the Hudson. Connected all the way to Camden.
Fatman’s biggest failure is that after shutting down the tunnel, he had zero interest in innovating in infrastructure. He didn’t even need an original thought – he could have borrowed privatization/private investment ideas from the Cato institute or the Manhattan Institute, and try some experimentation. The status quo has been failing for decades, but he showed zero interest in the topic.
The state has declared itself a monopoly provider of transportation infrastructure, but then neglects to provide it, and certainly not based on supply/demand. Rather than taxpayer funded, NJ should move to user-funded. It’s inevitable anyway if the unicorn riders eventually move everyone to electric vehicles, when the gas tax is paying for most of the roads.
Ever hear of elevators? People like you are the reason nothing ever gets done. I guarantee if you had a couple of pedestrian bridges, they would become heavily used. Omg, I can’t walk 1 mile across a scenic bridge. God forbid I get off my a$$ and walk a little. You are the idiot for being so negative and close minded.
Jcer, don’t act like a gov is not responsible for the direction of the economy. When you are a lame duck governor traveling the country in hopes of becoming president, then yes, you have no impact. If you are indeed doing your job, you have a direct impact on the economy of the state with the budget you sign. It’s your job to get funds to where you think they would help grow the economy. Fat man decided to give handouts to businesses instead of taking that money and investing in our infrastructure and schools. I can’t even think about him anymore because it just enrages me that he did absolutely nothing to increase our economic capacity by investing in infrastructure and education. Guy should step down.
So how many people fit in your elevator? How long is a trip from top to bottom? This is going to be a very heavily congested elevator ride. For someone in Hoboken that is used to getting on a ferry and commuting across town for 8 minutes then riding on a private, heated or A/Cd bus across town – I am going to trade that commute for a 20-30 minute walk across the river. Then when I get there, what do I do? Have to hail a cab of course, at a cost of at least 5-10 bucks. So I trade my $8 ferry commute for an $8 walk.
No one would use this for commuting. It may get used on weekends or by tourists. But I promise you, You are the idiot.
McGreevey was governor when Xanadu was first started and broke ground. Then Codey the Corzine. That boob Gov Christie did not come into the picture until 2010 long after it failed twice.
Did anyone forget about that other failed Meadowlands project EnCap Golf? 785 acres development for housing projects and a golf course. $300 million in state funding before it was scrapped in 2007.
Just set up the footbridge like Ponte Vecchio in Florence, build retail and residential property on the bridge and it will pay for itself. Call it the world’s longest and tallest shopping mall. While they’re at it put an auto lane and a high speed rail or hyperloop tube on it.
Those vast majority of those 400,000 meat popsicles commuting from NJ to NYC every day don’t live anywhere near the Hudson River to walk anywhere across any bridge. Most of them commute by bus and car.
The Future is more Buses or “Bus Platooning” via Automated self driving tech.
Here is a heat map on page 11 figure 3.
http://www.panynj.gov/about/pdf/Trans-Hudson_Commuting_Capacity_Study-Summary_Report_9-21-16.pdf
Zeppelins are the answer. lighter than air transit.
Yes Juice most people close enough to walk are probably already taking a ferry. Fixing the commuter rail and buses is priority 1. Commuter rail is a joke in NY Metro, even the Metro North which is the undisputed “best” commuter rail into Manhattan doesn’t have the best record. Compared even to London our commuter rail is bad forget about continental Europe(Even in the south, commuter rail in and out of Rome is better than what we have in NYC), they have 100 mph commuter rail ours is only that fast if the conductor falls asleep on the controls.
Pumpkin, in NJ infrastructure is not so much the problem. We have a big network of roads and rail(It obviously needs repair and maintenance) but as opposed to many other places it already exists. The issue is that the market we are in is too expensive for manufacturing, and we have a competitiveness issue, outside of the areas immediately adjacent to NYC/Phila we are not Manhattan or Philadelphia, we are close but not quite those cities(NJ has no cachet). There are structural issues with the economy in NJ, the only way NJ wins is by taking jobs from NYC and Philadelphia, to do so there must be a sound economic case(there isn’t)
As much as it sounds like pure shite, I do have to admit that a sitting President is often in Bedminster and the media reports it as “horse country” “bucolic” “farmland” “US Open Golf” etc……. it makes a difference…..I’m sure most of the world is thinking “really? No F Way!”
JCer says:
July 17, 2017 at 5:18 pm
(NJ has no cachet).
Med School (clot Edition):
http://nypost.com/2017/07/17/inside-a-med-school-deans-secret-life-of-drugs-and-hookers/
ChiFi when are you in DC? At a Bethesda happy hour right now spending Uncle Sams money.
Re: the Spunky Hudson Pedestrian Bridge
Hey guys, please let me in the club. I know there is a virtual velvet rope somewhere where everyone is having the dialogue that used to exist on this blog. I know this address is just a front to keep the idiot occupied while everyone else is at another IP with real conversations, insights, and discussion.
Why have I been exiled here to the fake storefront with the Spunk? Please let me in the real blog, I promise I’ll behave. Please. I simply can’t take the stupidity anymore.
First, I didn’t suggest that pedestrian bridges were the answer to the tunnels. Why everyone is acting like I did, I’m not really sure. I simply stated that there should be multiple pedestrian crossings. Why aren’t there? You are telling me that they wouldn’t be used? You can’t ride your bike over it? It would give people a free means of getting into the city, and you guys jump down my throat from your almighty throne. Have a drink, go for a run, just stop being such a-holes. Life is much more enjoyable when you are nice to people. No one likes a jerk, they even hate themselves.
jcer, screw manufacturing, it’s going to be taken over by automation. We should be focusing on investing in education systems that act as investments in the high skilled worker of tomorrow. You grow an industry to support the education so that they go hand and hand. You then have the huge research and development of all types of industry coming out of jersey. You need the link to start with elementary, to high school, to higher ed, and then finish with the industry in place to give jobs that support the high cost of living in nj. There is no reason why we have not done this in nj. Build super colleges in ghetto locations that would otherwise be a good location if not for who occupies it. We need turn to these state colleges into elite level specialized higher learning institutions. Invest to recruit the best of the best to begin working on research and development in their specified fields. Each college becomes an economic incubator/economic hub to build the industry and local economy around. Nj can be something special….
When I say to invest in the best of the best….I mean you have high school and college professors that are conducting authentic research with the students learning through the researchers mistakes. Students are in the lab, taking notes, brain storming, seeing the tools of the industry, becoming total experts in said industry. I’m sure the students would contribute to new ideas being formed since their virgin mind still looks at the world with an open mind. So the education system basically becomes a direct training system for these industries. Could be a beautiful thing.
Its always nice to walk over the Brooklyn Bridge. Grimaldis on one side and Jeremy’s on the other.
The GWB gets enough foot and Bike traffic to make it viable. Move the start point to the Park and Ride at the Wehawken terminal by the ferry, or down to Liberty State park.
google.com – #888888pppqoqwwwwz
CC seems to be the adult in the room.
http://www.politico.com/states/new-jersey/story/2017/07/17/christie-on-trump-jr-meeting-none-of-its-positive-113434
@MaxBoot
Six months in and Trump can’t pass a single major piece of legislation.
What is he going to do to distract the “deplorables”?
Scary thought!
@brianklaas
Republicans control the
House,
Senate,
White House.
Washington is more broken than ever.
No major legislation passed.
Scandal after scandal.
https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2017-07-17/big-oil-sees-salvation-in-gas-but-what-if-it-s-the-wrong-bet
Pumpkin the issue is not one of “investing” in education, people do not want to work here. NJ is largely middle class both in population and character, it is a bedroom community with some upper class areas. Our previous strengths in everything from telecom research to chemicals to medical to even movie studios had everything to do with proximity to NYC(in the olden days the financiers liked to see what their investments were up to) and a competitive advantage. NJ’s new biggest export is Amazon warehouses and data centers, all automated but they largely need the proximity, it is easier to serve the NYC metro area from close proximity. NYC jobs are largely related to finance and the front office bankers and traders want their offices in the city and the banks themselves used to send jobs to NJ but in an effort to save money are passing us over and sending jobs to SLC, Dallas, NC…places cheaper than NJ. That is why our economy is hurting in NJ, educating a bunch of people so they can go take jobs in Cali or Mass isn’t going to change that. The middle class jobs come with management and everything else which brings some high earners. Fix the cost of living issues, make the environment conducive for R&D work and you’ll get the jobs and all of the economic activity that comes with it. Want to see missed opportunity…Jersey City should have tried to build tech hub…Google should have an east coast development campus over by the hoboken border instead of ugly apartments. Jersey is too busy chasing banks and insurance companies throwing money at them instead of trying to get the tech companies in, they could get campuses like they have in silicon valley and workers want to live in Manhattan. Convince companies to put an R&D presence here if we want to be a tech hub.
Nom, Steam, and I drank pitchers of beer in Boston on Frideay. It was great. We spent all of 10 seconds talking about Pumpkin and what a disgrace he is to conversation.
Front page article in the Times this morning on housing crisis in California. Apparently high housing costs will negatively impact the state’s economy. Well that’s no surprise to me at least. Average cost of a house is 500k twice the national average. A nurse making 180k a year is commuting 80 miles each way to her job in San Francisco. Just a synopsis of the article etc
google.com – #000999uuquuqyshshshx
Real estate listings are nothing more than bait to lure customers to a specific brokerage so they can sell them any home, not specifically the listed home. That’s just gravy and free marketing. 6% pays for the hundreds and hundreds of hours agents waste with people who never complete transactions including noncommittal buyers and unreasonable sellers who overprice their homes. 4% is what you should pay but you should have absolutely no problem finding a regular brokerage to do it for 5% if you price it right, allow open houses so the agent can lure customers, etc.
BTW, there are a ton of “real” agencies that offer 2.5 to the agent who brings in the buyer and keep 3.5 for themselves. I’d wager there are more 2.5 payouts than 3.0 in the MLS–it’s at least 50/50. Yes that is written in the contract though I doubt most people appreciate the implications of this or question it when they sign.
Having said that, there is definitely an advantage to working with a known agency. Despite the bullish!t about agents having ethical obligations to work for their clients, they are not obligated to show or bring up any specific house for sale to their client. Otherwise they’d have to show homes that offered a penny in compensation. Your house will carry a stigma even with a 2.5 or 3 payout to selling agent because you’re not playing the game. Now if your house is under 1 mill in on a quiet street in Short Hills that’s another story.
“Maybe it’s my own inexperience talking, but IMO homes that don’t sell quickly are overpriced. Those that do are priced correctly– it’s as simple as that. I think internet marketing, printing brochures, and holding open houses add very little (if any) value to the transaction. Get the home out there to potential buyers (and their agents) on the MLS and RE websites and the rest will take care of itself.”
9:39 … OK I’ll bite — we paid about 2x what we paid for our first house in Jersey and got 2x the house. Pool, big yard with mountain views, 2600 sq ft but the monthly outlay is LESS than in NJ on our 1700 sq ft home in Essex Co.
The crisis is certainly an issue for people who want to live really well, but who can’t afford it. But all things being equal, wouldn’t you rather pay one mortgage? One to the bank and not another one to the Tax man?!
“Everyone we spoke with made it seem like 6% is set in stone.”
I hope you let someone else negotiate car buying for you.
“I find the current home pricing situation in Los Angeles vulgar and immoral. My wife and I are both professionals (teacher and nurse), and if we were in the market to buy a home, the starting price would be $1 million. The message those prices send is very clear. We want you to teach our children, and to take care of our loved ones. But when your shift ends, please return to YOUR side of town.”
Since when are teachers and nurses expecting to live like people will high paying jobs?
Since when are teachers and nurses expecting to live like people will high paying jobs?
Teacher’s aren’t supposed to live like millionaires but they should be able to afford a single family home within half hour of where they work. Quite frankly, with the amount of money flying through California, they need to make it a priority to raise their salaries. The pay rates for teachers in that area are not sufficient to be anywhere within an hour of there and I wouldn’t be surprised if their school quality diminishes as they leave their profession.
It’s no different here. We pay teachers in North Jersey a lot more than teachers in south jersey for good reason. I think the idea of a teacher being able to live in the heart of LA or San Fran is a pipe dream. Kinda like a teacher in NJ being able to live in Alpine. It’s not going to happen. They should however be able to afford a modest place somewhere else in Bergen County.
yes ex-jersey,essex county nj is the one place where your mortgage payment is much likely less than your property tax bill! My escrow is $800 more than my principal and interest payment.
Ottoman the commish also depends on the house price, the more expensive home the more room in the commission. On a cheaper home brokers won’t want to move off 6% but on a 3-4m home 4.5% is very doable, if it is priced right.
Huge Bitcoin price swing today. I remember back when it was $20. Pretty crazy. Thought about buying one for $20 for “nostalgia”. Then it spiked to $100 and I said “no” to myself.
Its ironic to me that the liberal states like California and their cities claim to care about the little people as well as the poor and minorities and refugees etc. But they just don’t want to live with them. They gentrify areas and then drive out the very same people who they claim to care about. Our resident pumps claims to care about the poor and the blue collar working class yet would rather be surrounded by what he perceives to be the sophisticated white collar professional class.
I’m not sure about ‘wanting’ to live with them is an accurate representation, but it may speak to the stratified society we live in. Oh, and my electric bill (thanks to Solar) was $1.16 this month. Central Air…..cranked.
Look California is a bit off the charts in terms of location. We are really out here. Once you are here and think you lob about 10 IQ points right off the top. But how about that Weather!?
On average, in terms of DNA sequence, each human is 99.5% similar to any other human….
How can you fix the cost of living issues when high earners are responsible? Rich people drive up the cost of living based on competitive fundamentals of capitalism, it’s as simple as that.
You claim Nj is middle class, which I do not agree with for a second. It’s consistently one of the richest states in the rankings. It has how many counties in the top 10? Majority of counties are considered some of the richest in the country based on earnings.
Where else in the country can you drive for 45 min straight through town after town of mostly 1 million dollar homes? Just look at our coastline for god sake, only place middle class can afford are ac and seaside. I’ve been to lots of areas in the country, they might have bigger pockets of ultra rich areas like Alpine, but nowhere can you find so many millionaires (meaning town after town after town) than in nj.
“Fix the cost of living issues”
12:31…..you have a point. In fact in your area you have Banker Money…..which as most people know can pretty much smother other people’s dollars.
Uh as far as being genetically close sure, but the devil is in the details. High achievers (or those with money) mostly won’t want to share services, i.e. schools with people who do not care or respect the schools.
As close as we might appear, there are those from every ‘class’ who are gifted. They have abilities that can better society. Other less talented can easily be a drain on the place.
Just think your kid can share space with a criminal. (some more diverse schools) or she can be with some completely messed-up rich kid. You decide.
On average, in terms of DNA sequence, each human is 99.5% similar to any other human….
That’s because we need it to be because we all need same genetic codes flowing through us to code for those specific proteins. If they were different, our body wouldn’t work. It’s that .5% that determine entirely who we are and how different we are.
“On average, in terms of DNA sequence, each human is 99.5% similar to any other human….”
Yes, but as both Left and Right agree, the 1% makes all the difference lol.
“You claim Nj is middle class, which I do not agree with for a second. It’s consistently one of the richest states in the rankings….Where else in the country can you drive for 45 min straight through town after town of mostly 1 million dollar homes?”
Thar’s milionaires in them thar hills!! Pumps, I won’t pick on you any longer. I never realized how insecure you were and how your identity is so wrapped up in a neediness to be ‘better’ than someone else. You are not the village idiot, just…sad.
“Just think your kid can share space with a criminal. (some more diverse schools) or she can be with some completely messed-up rich kid. You decide.”
Criminal has better blow but charges, rich kid buys ajax for everyone. You decide.
First time seller ….take the shot (pictures) and list the house in Zillow….I’ve done it twice and it works .I’ve also rented out homes as well …https://www.zillow.com/homes/for_sale/
I know man these are truly the last days of Rome. as much as i miss the place it was probably the right time to bail. did i mention my power bill was $1.16.
so the school here is a ‘9’ rated HS and apparently the state average per pupil expenditure is $12k…. the town I’m in now has pension woes like most CA towns but they are spending $9k per student.
as much as i miss the place it was probably the right time to bail
Regrets? Every other place seems so nice until you live there and realize it rather… sucks.
“Caitlyn Jenner considering running for US Senate in CA vs Dianne Feinstein.”
Best news I’ve heard all day
“Nom, Steam, and I drank pitchers of beer in Boston on Frideay. It was great. We spent all of 10 seconds talking about Pumpkin and what a disgrace he is to conversation.”
and no time spent on our closet commies, footrest, puzzy moana, and gluteus.
2:24…bit wistful – NYC perhaps and a NE vibe. c’est la vie.
pumps you do realize your so called million dollar houses are middle class houses elsewhere and the vast majority are owned by people who paid middle class prices for them. Just because you have one sector making over sized incomes distorting the marketplace does not make the people living in these places rich. I’m sorry Wayne, NJ is not “rich”, there are some upper middle class neighborhoods but it is not “rich”. Alpine, Short Hills, Far Hills, Bedminster, Essex Fells, those places are rich….the vast majority of NJ is not. The tax state and bankrupt gov of NJ are a problem you don’t want to admit. At the end of the day if a company can save 20% on a salary by moving the Job to Dallas they will. If I need to pay massive property taxes, income taxes, tolls, etc, I need extra salary to pay for those things and cannot make the same wage as an employee in Dallas(forget about housing prices NJ house prices are not terrible right now but still more than Dallas).
Where else in the country can you drive for 45 min straight through town after town of mostly 1 million dollar homes? Just look at our coastline for god sake
Jcer,
I think he’s talking about the time it takes to drive the 2.1 miles through Loch Arbour, Allenhurst, and Deal because they ticket anything over 10mph.
$1,500,000.00 house is Wall Street middle class.
9/26/12
@realDonaldTrump
Obama’s complaints about Republicans stopping his agenda are BS since he had full control for two years.
He can never take responsibility.
Jcer, you are usually on point, but you are off with your negative analysis on the future of the nj economy and with your description of nj as not bring “rich,” which is crazy talk. I’m not stating this because I live in Wayne or I live in Nj, I’m just stating what the data says.
First, let’s not get this twisted, upper middle class is RICH. You are making more than 80% of the people out there, how is that not rich? It’s not 1% money, but it’s very well off, to say otherwise is just crazy.
Don’t be one of those people making 300k a year who consider themselves poor because they compare themselves to gates instead of the 90% of the population that makes less than them. Upper middle class is rich, esp in this type of environment with extreme income inequality.
“Wayne, NJ is not “rich”, there are some upper middle class neighborhoods but it is not “rich”. Alpine, Short Hills, Far Hills, Bedminster, Essex Fells, those places are rich….the vast majority of NJ is not. “
Want to elaborate more on these towns. The towns you claim below as “rich” are the 1%ers. They are beyond rich and look how many towns you listed right there in such a small area. How many more can be added to that list? You think you can find other places like this in our country? Cali coastline is the only thing that comes close.
Wayne, to the majority of the country, is upper middle class and considered well off. Not 1% rich, but upper middle class rich. Do you know how many 1 income households are in this town?
They could easily put their wife to work, but choose to have a stay at home wife. Why do you think Wayne is one of the few towns left with no full day kindergarten? They know they can get away with it with the amount of stay at home mothers. If this town was filled with all working mothers, that vote would have passed.
Try going to a similar town that shares similar costs to penetrate the town. How many single income households will you find? In a day and age where most families have to have two incomes to support this kind of lifestyle, you can’t call Wayne a middle class town. Does it have lower class areas, sure, but the majority of the town is not lower class, it’s upper middle class. If they are not upper middle class, how do they afford this lifestyle?
Listen, you can start in englewood cliffs, head north, than west, than south, than east, and back north again, or go down south along the coast, and never step foot through an area that is less than upper middle class. I think that’s pretty damn crazy. How can you say that NJ is not rich?
“Wayne, NJ is not “rich”, there are some upper middle class neighborhoods but it is not “rich”. Alpine, Short Hills, Far Hills, Bedminster, Essex Fells, those places are rich….the vast majority of NJ is not. “
*then (don’t need to hear the grammar police give me their two cents because I don’t proofread)
Pumps – glad to hear you made it to the finish line. Good dog.
First, let’s not get this twisted, upper middle class is RICH. You are making more than 80% of the people out there, how is that not rich? It’s not 1% money, but it’s very well off, to say otherwise is just crazy.
Yeah I love NJ. Tax assessment arrived today. I just broke 13 grand a year so Whooo Hoo! I feel special like I am not middle class anymore.
It’s for the children right? Please tell me Pumps it for the children right? Please!!!!
Pumps when my town was just a nice town with good schools most of the moms were stay at home . And my kids are only in their early to mid 20s so not that long ago. Now that we are prestigious supposedly with supposedly one of the best school systems in the county and state although our high school rankings have dropped we have lost most of our stay at home moms. Oh and by the way stay at home mom does not always equal wealth many make the sacrifice even if they shouldn’t. You just make so many stupid simplistic statements.
Pumps you can zig zag through and around throes areas and see poor or low income towns. Do you even know this state!!
Pumps what is this great future for NJ s economy?? And facts please not your usual babble.
And pay attention to the last paragraph, exactly as I stated.
“Wayne is a larger medium-sized town located in the state of New Jersey. With a population of 55,210 people and 11 constituent neighborhoods, Wayne is the 21st largest community in New Jersey.
Housing costs in Wayne are among some of the highest in the nation, although real estate prices here don’t compare to real estate prices in the most expensive communities in New Jersey.
Wayne is a decidedly white-collar town, with fully 88.73% of the workforce employed in white-collar jobs, well above the national average. Overall, Wayne is a town of professionals, sales and office workers, and managers. There are especially a lot of people living in Wayne who work in management occupations (15.03%), office and administrative support (13.51%), and sales jobs (13.36%).
Also of interest is that Wayne has more people living here who work in computers and math than 95% of the places in the US.
Although the majority of commuting trips in the town are by private automobile, Wayne is somewhat unusual for a town of its size for having a substantial number of people who use public transportation. For a lot of people, the bus helps to get to and from their jobs every morning, which benefits everyone in the Wayne area by reducing both traffic and air pollution.
Wayne is one of the most well-educated cities in the nation. 49.99% of adults in Wayne have at least a bachelor’s degree. Compare that to the average community in America, which has just 21.84% with a bachelor’s degree or higher.
The per capita income in Wayne in 2010 was $45,713, which is upper middle income relative to New Jersey, and wealthy relative to the rest of the US. This equates to an annual income of $182,852 for a family of four.””
https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/nj/wayne
Tell me again that Wayne is some middle of the Road Town comparable to the rest of America…..to the rest of America, wayne is wealthy. You people just don’t get it. 88% white collar occupation rate and we write it off because it’s not on Essex Fells level (homes with paintings on the wall worth more than the house). That’s how distorted Nj citizens are. They have no idea how wealthy we really are. We start calling places like Wayne as regular folk, your middle class, when they are far from it.
My point was and has always been, that you can drive for a very long time and not hit anything but upper class living if you want to.
Yes, there are poor people, who do you think cuts the lawn, and cooks the food of the upper class? Someone has to service them.
3b says:
July 18, 2017 at 8:09 pm
Pumps you can zig zag through and around throes areas and see poor or low income towns. Do you even know this state!!
My town has all of the stats you cite for Wayne what is your point? Wayne is just a ho hum middle of the road town like mine . You just like many in my town like to think they are more they are not. They are just like lots of suburban towns throughout the country. It’s not special it’s not prestigious. No one is going to say ohhh you live in Wayne.
Pumps they are there to service the wealthy ? You think that is all the people in those towns do. What a doof us.
I think it becomes a tech hub. Place is far too educated to not be taken advantage of. Throw in its proximity to NYC, and it will attract the forces necessary to bring it all together. It’s inevitable in my mind. It doesn’t take much to put it all together, you already have some of the brightest minds in the country in our high schools. The ingredients are there, so it’s only a matter of time.
3b says:
July 18, 2017 at 8:11 pm
Pumps what is this great future for NJ s economy?? And facts please not your usual babble.
It was a generalization, sure, but what do you think the majority of poor workers do? They work in low pay service industry jobs.
3b says:
July 18, 2017 at 9:26 pm
Pumps they are there to service the wealthy ? You think that is all the people in those towns do. What a doof us.
Are you ignorant? Go live somewhere else, so you see exactly how Bergen county is much different than most of the suburbs in America. You act like I make this stuff up, go read the income stats. Most of northeast nj is prestigious compared to the rest of America, wtf do you think it costs so much to live here for? ? Because it sucks? You are lost.
3b says:
July 18, 2017 at 9:25 pm
My town has all of the stats you cite for Wayne what is your point? Wayne is just a ho hum middle of the road town like mine . You just like many in my town like to think they are more they are not. They are just like lots of suburban towns throughout the country. It’s not special it’s not prestigious. No one is going to say ohhh you live in Wayne.
Pumps wayne is not Bergen county. Is that your problem? It’s expensive here for a lot of reasons prestigious is way down on the list.
Pumps has never left Passaic County. Wayne is his Alpine.
Pumps you can zig zag through and around throes areas and see poor or low income towns. Do you even know this state!!
Wayne, such a diverse town. From rubbing shoulders with the RHYONJ, to the Dueling Banjos of Hoffman Grove!
Merci d’être ce que tu es, et ne change pas surtout.
Well my town is rich ….and blows away Wayne…. https://www.neighborhoodscout.com/nj/little-silver